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Blimpie
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Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Mon Feb 12, 2018 11:34 am

A question was recently brought up by a reporter at work after a Southwest plane skidded of the runway at BWI last week, when cabin crew instructed deplaning pax to leave behind all carry-ons during a deplaning event. Pax were reported to be quite irate, and it was reported many refused to obey this instruction.

I understand in a severe event such as an emergency landing, crash landing or risk of immediate destruction of the aircraft of this instruction, but this event did not appear to be a potential disastrous event. The plane skidded, remained on the taxiway. there was no structure failure of the aircraft, nor was there any indication of smoke or fire. The reports in front of me do not indicate whether passengers deplaned via airstairs or slide.

While, I can understand the risks and dangers involved if passengers alighted by the slide as to not take their hand luggage with them, but if the airstairs were used, I'm not sure why pax would have been instructed not to take their carry-ons with them. I am aware of the 90 second regulations to evec in an emergency, however, I am unsure that this event would fall under said conditions.

My question is, in a non-critical or no-threat-to-life evacuation situation, what is the procedure for passengers to recover their personal processions after exiting the aircraft? This lack of general knowledge among the flying populous goes a long way in understanding their refusal to leave carry-ons in the overhead and under-seat areas during an unplanned deplaning event.

A lot of carry-on items I see routinely do not exactly have luggage tags on them, including purchases past security (like hat giant box of booze and chocolate, or that gift for Aunt Hilda that pax bring on to the plane in that shopping bag do not exactly have luggage tags on them.



PS: To note, this is not to argue the safety merits of passengers trying to leave during an emergency with their hand luggage as that's a dead horse that has been spoken to in great lengths in quite a few other threads, but rather what is the recovery process after an event.

MODS: While I already performed a search that came up blank on the topic, feel free to remove if there is one. Search function is still useless on this software.
Now get the hell off of my lawn your dang kids!
 
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zeke
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:36 pm

Should not be touched unless it has been released.

49 CFR 830.10 - Preservation of aircraft wreckage, mail, cargo, and records.

§ 830.10 Preservation of aircraft wreckage, mail, cargo, and records.

(a) The operator of an aircraft involved in an accident or incident for which notification must be given is responsible for preserving to the extent possible any aircraft wreckage, cargo, and mail aboard the aircraft, and all records, including all recording mediums of flight, maintenance, and voice recorders, pertaining to the operation and maintenance of the aircraft and to the airmen until the Board takes custody thereof or a release is granted pursuant to § 831.12(b) of this chapter.

(b) Prior to the time the Board or its authorized representative takes custody of aircraft wreckage, mail, or cargo, such wreckage, mail, or cargo may not be disturbed or moved except to the extent necessary:

(1) To remove persons injured or trapped;

(2) To protect the wreckage from further damage; or

(3) To protect the public from injury.

(c) Where it is necessary to move aircraft wreckage, mail or cargo, sketches, descriptive notes, and photographs shall be made, if possible, of the original positions and condition of the wreckage and any significant impact marks.

(d) The operator of an aircraft involved in an accident or incident shall retain all records, reports, internal documents, and memoranda dealing with the accident or incident, until authorized by the Board to the contrary.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
RamblinMan
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:09 pm

Big rollaboard, sure, I can understand why it is dangerous on the slides. But my laptop bag, which contains necessary medication in addition to valuable electronics...zero chance I'm getting off without it. And quoting rules that say I can't get it back until the investigators are done (who knows how long that will be) makes me even more adamant about that.
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:57 pm

Always cared my passport and meds ON MY PERSON. Never been thru an evacuation, but anything I need, I need it nearby and not subject to some careless idiot grabbing the wrong bag from the overhead. Yes, this happened to a F/A of mine and never got it back, despite oodles of identification.

I can only hope I’m ahead of you on the slide and you don’t give me a concussion with your selfishness.

GF
 
kalvado
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Mon Feb 12, 2018 9:41 pm

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
I can only hope I’m ahead of you on the slide and you don’t give me a concussion with your selfishness.

GF

A small detail: we're talking about a flight where there were no slides deployed and passengers were deplaned by airstairs.
https://twitter.com/mrfarleyjr/status/9 ... 86/photo/1
 
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Blimpie
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Mon Feb 12, 2018 11:50 pm

kalvado wrote:
GalaxyFlyer wrote:
I can only hope I’m ahead of you on the slide and you don’t give me a concussion with your selfishness.

GF

A small detail: we're talking about a flight where there were no slides deployed and passengers were deplaned by airstairs.
https://twitter.com/mrfarleyjr/status/9 ... 86/photo/1


Correct, this was the incident that I was referring to. I understand not trying to go down a slide with a 22" roller, but rather alighting via airstairs in an event where there is no risk of life or limb. This was the incident that I am curious about. And, even in said event, how would carry-ons be repatriated with their owner.
Now get the hell off of my lawn your dang kids!
 
PhilBy
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:13 pm

History roughly says: Not a hope in hell of getting any luggage back after an incident. Its cheaper for the airlines to pay the minimum legally required cover than to pay staff to work out who the luggage belongs to and to return the luggage to its owners.
 
georgiaame
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:01 pm

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Always cared my passport and meds ON MY PERSON.
GF


Brilliant advice! This from the guy who won't take his shoes off until we reach a safe altitude, lest I have to walk through burning jet fuel. My airline behavior has just changed, as of my next flight, and thank you. 45 years of flying, I've never thought of this.
"Trust, but verify!" An old Russian proverb, quoted often by a modern American hero
 
nws2002
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:09 pm

PhilBy wrote:
History roughly says: Not a hope in hell of getting any luggage back after an incident. Its cheaper for the airlines to pay the minimum legally required cover than to pay staff to work out who the luggage belongs to and to return the luggage to its owners.


That's not true. US Airways cleaned and returned items to passengers after US1459.
 
kalvado
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:58 pm

PhilBy wrote:
History roughly says: Not a hope in hell of getting any luggage back after an incident. Its cheaper for the airlines to pay the minimum legally required cover than to pay staff to work out who the luggage belongs to and to return the luggage to its owners.

A and B really have to upgrade their slides to safely accommodate rollaboards.
 
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ro1960
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:22 pm

RamblinMan wrote:
Big rollaboard, sure, I can understand why it is dangerous on the slides. But my laptop bag, which contains necessary medication in addition to valuable electronics...zero chance I'm getting off without it. And quoting rules that say I can't get it back until the investigators are done (who knows how long that will be) makes me even more adamant about that.


About your laptop I suggest you devise a sensible backup strategy and leave it behind. In case of not recovering it, you'd be able to restore the data from a backup. Plus there are far more chances something bad happens to it outside an airplane (stolen, dropped, etc..). So the backup will certainly be useful.

As for essentials, I always carry a small bag with an over the shoulder strap and it never leaves me during the flight. It that has my ID, my phone + charger, my home keys and any medication I'd be needing. Everything else is not all that important.
You may like my airport photos:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/aeroports
 
RamblinMan
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Wed Feb 14, 2018 3:51 am

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Always cared my passport and meds ON MY PERSON. Never been thru an evacuation, but anything I need, I need it nearby and not subject to some careless idiot grabbing the wrong bag from the overhead. Yes, this happened to a F/A of mine and never got it back, despite oodles of identification.

I can only hope I’m ahead of you on the slide and you don’t give me a concussion with your selfishness.

GF


Good for you, I don't care to sit for hours on end with that much crap in my pockets. I'm 5'10 on a good day and 150lb soaking wet so trust me you've got much bigger problems to worry about getting injured on a slide than me and my tiny briefcase.
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Thu Feb 15, 2018 2:37 am

Passport and couple days of my BP med isn’t a burden and I’ve loads of 15 hour flights. The other advantage, I know exactly where my passport is; I can “inventory” myself at security or immigration. I’ve had passengers, in bizjets, forget their documents despite multiple warnings.

Not to mention blocking the exit during the evacuation for others. Have you done actual evac training, land and sea in a trainer? Do you think you can go down the slide in a fire with your bag? Take a look at the EK fire or the OZ SFO crash.

GF
 
kalvado
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Thu Feb 15, 2018 12:11 pm

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Passport and couple days of my BP med isn’t a burden and I’ve loads of 15 hour flights. The other advantage, I know exactly where my passport is; I can “inventory” myself at security or immigration. I’ve had passengers, in bizjets, forget their documents despite multiple warnings.

Not to mention blocking the exit during the evacuation for others. Have you done actual evac training, land and sea in a trainer? Do you think you can go down the slide in a fire with your bag? Take a look at the EK fire or the OZ SFO crash.

GF

I guess you never traveled with really valuable and irreplaceable items and never faced more involved travel arrangement that just presenting a passport.
However, we're in tech-ops, and question is about operational issues with luggage left behind, as well as consequences for operations.
I think the message being sent by WN event is pretty clear - your belongings is your headache, you snooze - you loose. That is exactly why slide upgrade for rollaboard handling is essential.
Another approach here would be having luggage concerns closer to the top of operation issues - below any emergency management, for sure - but above "No way - bus would need an extra trip to terminal!"
Of course, wording of current law is such that it is difficult to do.. Slide upgrade may be an easier one.
 
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Starlionblue
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Thu Feb 15, 2018 12:43 pm

What irreplaceable items are you travelling with? Are they worth somebody's life? Would you have people die because you had to save your laptop? My life, the lives of my kids, and the lives of my fellow passengers and crew, are not replaceable. Are you carrying the Ark of the Covenant in your carry-on? Is it worth sacrificing a life for?

Just leave your bag on board, or I will be one of the guys pushing past you and saving my own life while you try to save your "irreplaceable" stuff and succumb to smoke inhalation.

kalvado wrote:
PhilBy wrote:
History roughly says: Not a hope in hell of getting any luggage back after an incident. Its cheaper for the airlines to pay the minimum legally required cover than to pay staff to work out who the luggage belongs to and to return the luggage to its owners.

A and B really have to upgrade their slides to safely accommodate rollaboards.


It's not the slide that is the big problem for rollaboards, It's the people grabbing their bags and crowding the aisles with them before they get to the slides. Once you're at a door, you'll get out one way or another. Getting to the door is the bottleneck.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
kalvado
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Thu Feb 15, 2018 1:06 pm

Starlionblue wrote:
What irreplaceable items are you travelling with? Are they worth somebody's life? Would you have people die because you had to save your laptop? My life, the lives of my kids, and the lives of my fellow passengers and crew, are not replaceable. Are you carrying the Ark of the Covenant in your carry-on? Is it worth sacrificing a life for?

Upgrading slides for a once in a blue moon event is not going to happen. Just leave your bag on board, or I will be one of the guys pushing past you and saving my own life while you try to save your "irreplaceable" stuff and succumb to smoke inhalation.

That is exactly what I mean when I say
kalvado wrote:
Another approach here would be having luggage concerns closer to the top of operation issues - below any emergency management, for sure

We're talking about a situation when there was nothing remotely close to life threatening situation. Deboarding via airstairs, which is an SOP in many other cases.

And at the end of the day this is about business ethics. You heard about a boy who cried "wolf"? Here you go. If you invoke a life safety argument when there is nothing close to a danger - who would trust an airline when they say "life safety" next time?
 
SAAFNAV
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Thu Feb 15, 2018 1:10 pm

RamblinMan wrote:
Big rollaboard, sure, I can understand why it is dangerous on the slides. But my laptop bag, which contains necessary medication in addition to valuable electronics...zero chance I'm getting off without it. And quoting rules that say I can't get it back until the investigators are done (who knows how long that will be) makes me even more adamant about that.


Yes, you are the archetype of today's problem: Yes, I can see the speed limit, but you know what? I _really_ am a good driver, so it doesn't pertain to me. I can see a red light, but since I'm in a hurry, _I_ can speed through. Anybody else doing it would be cussed out, but since you are the one doing it, it must be fine.

If your wife dies during a botched evacuation because someone blocked her, or damaged the slide with a bag, I'm pretty sure you would be the one to sue.
But since you are the one evacuating with your laptopbag, it must be pretty OK for you to do it.

Get a small shoulder bag that you can put on just before you land, and you won't need to think about grabbing anything else before evacuation.
Unless of course your personal comfort is more important than any one else's life.

I'm pretty sure you've never been in slide drill. It gets chaos-y very quickly, even in the best of controlled circumstances.
L-382 Loadmaster; ex C-130B Navigator
 
RamblinMan
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:03 pm

SAAFNAV wrote:
Yes, you are the archetype of today's problem: Yes, I can see the speed limit, but you know what? I _really_ am a good driver, so it doesn't pertain to me. I can see a red light, but since I'm in a hurry, _I_ can speed through. Anybody else doing it would be cussed out, but since you are the one doing it, it must be fine.

Get a small shoulder bag that you can put on just before you land, and you won't need to think about grabbing anything else before evacuation.
Unless of course your personal comfort is more important than any one else's life.

I'm pretty sure you've never been in slide drill. It gets chaos-y very quickly, even in the best of controlled circumstances.


LOL so your "small shoulder bag" is ok but I'm the "archetype of today's problem?" Even though you have absolutely zero idea of the size bag I'm talking about?? On a site constantly filled with hypocritical remarks, you just managed to raise the bar sir. Well done.

And yes, I routinely exceed the speed limit because those really are set to the lowest common denominator and I really am an excellent driver. Everybody thinks that...my CDL with a spotless record backs me up. (And no I'm not talking about speeding in trucks, I tend to drive large vehicles at or below the limit.)
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Thu Feb 15, 2018 5:00 pm

No, no; the ONLY things going to the emergency exits is YOU, no bags of ANY size. If it’s not on your person, it stays behind. Other people shouldn’t be put at risk because your selfish opinion is your laptop is irreplaceable—get a back up hard drive and leave it home.

In the AF, crews used to have this problem. Emergency with leaking fluids, fire cover standing by and guys taking their pro gear with them. Finally, threats of Article 15s put an end to that.

So, as a CDL driver, your laptop is worth my life? Get a pocket and a life. My spotless 48-year career as pilot talking here. By the way, the question remains unanswered have you been thru evac training to justify your position?

GF
 
kalvado
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Thu Feb 15, 2018 6:10 pm

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
No, no; the ONLY things going to the emergency exits is YOU, no bags of ANY size. If it’s not on your person, it stays behind. Other people shouldn’t be put at risk because your selfish opinion is your laptop is irreplaceable—get a back up hard drive and leave it home.

A big question here - is what is an emergency? If slides are deployed and every second counts - sure, run for your life and don't hold others.
It is NOT what we're discussing, though. Procedure wise, disembarking from aircraft outside of designated area is an emergency - but is it really? My impression is that in case of WN906 whoever was in charge of deboarding abused their emergency powers.
Next interesting question is how stuff is treated after emergency is over. If aircraft is burnt to a pile of ashes - question is moot. But in many cases things are still intact after emergency is over - fire extinguished, fuel leak contained, aircraft stabilized. Is it too much to ask that airline should return property to passengers on a timely basis?
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:56 pm

Its an emergency whenever the captain or the fire scene commander says it is an emergency. Not your call, not mine except when being the captain. Any investigation will begin with “how much did the incident plane weigh”; baggage may be germane. It’s pretty clear cut in NTSB 49 Part 830 quoted above by Zeke.

Do you have a reference as to “abuse of authority”? Departing the prepared surface is pretty much always an incident that will be investigated and incurs 830 regulation.

This may disturb your tender feelings but an airplane, private or Commercial, is not a democracy; you don’t get to act as if it is your car at the store.

The real issue here is why commercial flight is so safe. More people are killed on any given day on the US streets than in the last 16 years on US carriers. The reason is the tested procedures used in Aviation.

GF
 
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zeke
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Thu Feb 15, 2018 8:07 pm

kalvado wrote:

It is NOT what we're discussing, though. Procedure wise, disembarking from aircraft outside of designated area is an emergency - but is it really? My impression is that in case of WN906 whoever was in charge of deboarding abused their emergency powers.


Precautionary disembarkation is performed with the crew at the ready to escalate it to a full evacuation.

Delaying a precautionary disembarkation with the extra time to remove hand luggage could be the difference between all people walking off the stairs and others needing to use slides and the associated injuries.

The priority is to get everyone safe, then get the aircraft safe, then to get the passengers and their luggage on the way.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
kalvado
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:30 pm

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
This may disturb your tender feelings but an airplane, private or Commercial, is not a democracy; you don’t get to act as if it is your car at the store.

Do you see that dark thing in the sky? This is Dr. Dao shadow hanging over your head...


GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Its an emergency whenever the captain or the fire scene commander says it is an emergency. Not your call, not mine except when being the captain. Any investigation will begin with “how much did the incident plane weigh”; baggage may be germane. It’s pretty clear cut in NTSB 49 Part 830 quoted above by Zeke

Interestingly enough, as of today 2/15/2018 incident in question is not even reported to FAA. That is 7 days after the incident. Did NTSB regulations even kicked in?

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
The real issue here is why commercial flight is so safe. More people are killed on any given day on the US streets than in the last 16 years on US carriers. The reason is the tested procedures used in Aviation.

GF

I love such arguments.. Reminds me of an old experiment: http://www.wisdompills.com/2014/05/28/t ... -a-ladder/
A group of scientists placed five monkeys in a cage, and in the middle, a ladder with bananas on top.
Every time a monkey went up the ladder, the scientists soaked the rest of the monkeys with cold water.
After a while, every time a monkey would start up the ladder, the others would pull it down and beat it up.
After a time, no monkey would dare try climbing the ladder, no matter how great the temptation.
The scientists then decided to replace one of the monkeys. The first thing this new monkey did was start to climb the ladder. Immediately, the others pulled him down and beat him up. After several beatings, the new monkey learned never to go up the ladder, even though there was no evident reason not to, aside from the beatings.
The second monkey was substituted and the same occurred. The first monkey participated in the beating of the second monkey. A third monkey was changed and the same was repeated. The fourth monkey was changed, resulting in the same, before the fifth was finally replaced as well.
What was left was a group of five monkeys that – without ever having received a cold shower – continued to beat up any monkey who attempted to climb the ladder.

If it was possible to ask the monkeys why they beat up on all those who attempted to climb the ladder, their most likely answer would be “I don’t know. It’s just how things are done around here.”
Does that sound at all familiar?

(I didn't add last phrase, it was there to begin with!)
 
kalvado
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:39 pm

zeke wrote:
kalvado wrote:

It is NOT what we're discussing, though. Procedure wise, disembarking from aircraft outside of designated area is an emergency - but is it really? My impression is that in case of WN906 whoever was in charge of deboarding abused their emergency powers.


Precautionary disembarkation is performed with the crew at the ready to escalate it to a full evacuation.

Delaying a precautionary disembarkation with the extra time to remove hand luggage could be the difference between all people walking off the stairs and others needing to use slides and the associated injuries.

The priority is to get everyone safe, then get the aircraft safe, then to get the passengers and their luggage on the way.

Makes some sense. How much discretion captain/rescue commander has in this case? Looking at the photos, aircraft is perfectly stable and any further movement appears very unlikely..
A somewhat similar Westjet (yes, I know, different jurisdiction etc) event shows peoplw with bags and little concern from those around..
https://shawglobalnews.files.wordpress. ... ther_2.jpg
 
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zeke
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Fri Feb 16, 2018 3:57 am

I could not make any sort of assessment of the situation based off a single photo.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
kalvado
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Fri Feb 16, 2018 1:11 pm

zeke wrote:
I could not make any sort of assessment of the situation based off a single photo.

a video on this page shows what is going on - main gear on proper pavement, nose gear on "shoulder" with chokes, people get off the plane with little rush.
https://www.abc15.com/news/national/sou ... off-runway
But I would really prefer to go to original scope of question: how much discretion is there for such a situation? In general, I assume emergency assumes _lost_ of discretion. Or this is more on a SOP level - unplanned disembark _is_ treated by the book, no options?
 
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zeke
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Sat Feb 17, 2018 10:52 am

That video does not show what is going on....that is like saying the camera view on a jet tells you what is going on during takeoff or landing.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
frmrCapCadet
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Sat Feb 17, 2018 3:09 pm

So is it OK to take a medium/small messenger bag if there is an emergency evacuation. Most of us would tend to do so, or should we be traveling with pants, shirts, vests with oversized pockets.
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
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Blimpie
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Sat Feb 17, 2018 8:32 pm

Again as OP, not talking about a slide deployment, crashes, and life-threatening events, but egress via air stairs.
Now get the hell off of my lawn your dang kids!
 
CosmicCruiser
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Sat Feb 17, 2018 10:25 pm

frmrCapCadet wrote:
So is it OK to take a medium/small messenger bag if there is an emergency evacuation. Most of us would tend to do so, or should we be traveling with pants, shirts, vests with oversized pockets.

No, you are expected to evacuate the jet as fast as possible without taking anything with you. You can say all the reasons behind why you would or should but the rules are you take nothing.if you've never slid down a slide you may be surprised it isn't gentile and you get to the ground fast. any bag or case could hurt someone. I can tell you a funny (now) little story of a cargo jet that had the right main gear collapse and came to a stop in the dirt on the grass. no injuries. The a/c was obviously tilted to the right. The slide on the right side was close to a little fire and the slide on the left was blowing in the wind so the crew decided to go out the cockpit windows via the ropes. There were a couple of crewmembers jumpseating so while the front end crew was getting the windows open and ropes out they started throwing their luggage out the door to the ground. A passerby in an auto videoed what was going on and the FAA got it. They were furious at the crew throwing the luggage out even though they were just waiting to exit. So say what you will about doing this or that and just see what happens.
 
FGITD
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:39 am

Blimpie wrote:
Again as OP, not talking about a slide deployment, crashes, and life-threatening events, but egress via air stairs.



important detail many are missing...


Plane on fire, slides deployed....you get yourself off ASAP and leave everything behind.

Plane slid on taxiway and is being deplaned by air stairs...why not grab your bag? Guarantee it would take at least 30 minutes to get the stairs attached anyway.
 
SAAFNAV
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:13 am

FGITD wrote:
Blimpie wrote:
Again as OP, not talking about a slide deployment, crashes, and life-threatening events, but egress via air stairs.



important detail many are missing...


Plane on fire, slides deployed....you get yourself off ASAP and leave everything behind.

Plane slid on taxiway and is being deplaned by air stairs...why not grab your bag? Guarantee it would take at least 30 minutes to get the stairs attached anyway.


Important detail that you are missing:

If the crew tells you to get ready for rapid disembarkation, you leave everything behind. During the time, everyone is monitoring for anything might happen, and will escalate it into a evacuation.
If the crew tells you that it is in order to take bags with you, then sure.
Rapid disembarkation are used when the imminent risk is assessed to be high enough to get out of the plane, but the added risk of injury caused by evacuation is not (yet) deemed necessary.
L-382 Loadmaster; ex C-130B Navigator
 
FGITD
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:18 am

SAAFNAV wrote:
FGITD wrote:
Blimpie wrote:
Again as OP, not talking about a slide deployment, crashes, and life-threatening events, but egress via air stairs.



important detail many are missing...


Plane on fire, slides deployed....you get yourself off ASAP and leave everything behind.

Plane slid on taxiway and is being deplaned by air stairs...why not grab your bag? Guarantee it would take at least 30 minutes to get the stairs attached anyway.


Important detail that you are missing:

If the crew tells you to get ready for rapid disembarkation, you leave everything behind. During the time, everyone is monitoring for anything might happen, and will escalate it into a evacuation.
If the crew tells you that it is in order to take bags with you, then sure.
Rapid disembarkation are used when the imminent risk is assessed to be high enough to get out of the plane, but the added risk of injury caused by evacuation is not (yet) deemed necessary.


Good point.

In that case, I'll spend the time waiting for the stairs to arrive by going through my bag and getting my necessities out and into my pockets.

Though in reality I usually heed the same advice as others in this thread. If I need it, it stays on my person.
 
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zeke
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Sun Feb 18, 2018 6:29 am

FGITD wrote:
Plane slid on taxiway and is being deplaned by air stairs...why not grab your bag? Guarantee it would take at least 30 minutes to get the stairs attached anyway.


What regulation states it will take 30 minutes to get stairs attached ?
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
FGITD
Posts: 312
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Sun Feb 18, 2018 7:15 am

zeke wrote:
FGITD wrote:
Plane slid on taxiway and is being deplaned by air stairs...why not grab your bag? Guarantee it would take at least 30 minutes to get the stairs attached anyway.


What regulation states it will take 30 minutes to get stairs attached ?


The reality of airport operations.

Granted in an emergency it is of course rushed and given priority, and usually the airport rescue will have their own stairs on, but it'll still take a few minutes.
 
CosmicCruiser
Posts: 2250
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Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Sun Feb 18, 2018 12:34 pm

FGITD wrote:
zeke wrote:
FGITD wrote:
Plane slid on taxiway and is being deplaned by air stairs...why not grab your bag? Guarantee it would take at least 30 minutes to get the stairs attached anyway.


What regulation states it will take 30 minutes to get stairs attached ?


The reality of airport operations.

Granted in an emergency it is of course rushed and given priority, and usually the airport rescue will have their own stairs on, but it'll still take a few minutes.


If it is an emergency they won't wait for air stairs.
 
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zeke
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Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 1:42 pm

Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Sun Feb 18, 2018 2:30 pm

CosmicCruiser wrote:
If it is an emergency they won't wait for air stairs.


That has little to do with it, it can be an emergency and still safer for the passengers to remain within the aircraft, eg QF32.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
CosmicCruiser
Posts: 2250
Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2005 3:01 am

Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:23 pm

Of course someone will find the exception so for the record GENERALLY. Ok, now if you go back and check that flight had a very, very rare set of circumstances. They decided against the emrg evac because they had an engine they couldn't shut down, leaking fuel and hot brakes. The F/A were standing by for an immediate evac if necessary. The fire dept had to flame out the eng.
 
rlwynn
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Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2000 3:35 am

Re: Recovery of Hand Luggage After Emergency Evac

Sun Feb 18, 2018 6:03 pm

In the winter I always take my jacket and stuff it under the seat by my feet. That I am not leaving.
I can drive faster than you

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