ConcordeAlpha
Topic Author
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Dec 12, 2015 2:51 am

Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Fri Oct 06, 2017 5:16 am

Hi all,

Recently I have purchased the new 747-400 from PMDG to use in my simulator P3D. I have spent the last few days studying the aicraft, and one thing that interested me the most was when to apply fuel when starting the engines. I have heard you first have to turn on the ignition switches, and then straight after doing so, you apply fuel. Is this correct?

Thanks in advance.
 
RetiredWeasel
Posts: 500
Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2014 8:16 pm

Re: Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Fri Oct 06, 2017 5:38 am

First you pull out the start switches of the engines you want to start. This opens the start valve and the engine bleed valve. You wait till the N2 reaches it's max rotation (min of 15%) then position the fuel control switch to "run". This supplies the fuel. Monitor the engine instruments until they are stabilized. This procedure assumes you're using the APU for start air. The start switches automatically pop back in when 50% N2 is reached. Hope this helps.

And I didn't draw on my memory, but actually looked it up because in my old age 200 procedures sometimes blend in with the 400 procedures.
 
User avatar
77west
Posts: 850
Joined: Sat Jun 13, 2009 11:52 am

Re: Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:19 am

It depends if fitted with autostart or not. It is all in the provided manuals... with the product you bought...
77West - AW109S - BE90 - JS31 - B1900 - Q300 - ATR72 - DC9-30 - MD80 - B733 - A320 - B738 - A300-B4 - B773 - B77W
 
User avatar
CARST
Posts: 1124
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2006 11:00 pm

Re: Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:06 am

Download my PMDG 747-400 checklist, it will teach you the whole process:

http://carstenrau.de/flight-simulator-checklists/

It's more of a flow procedure, than a checklist, but it will help you from a cold & dark cockpit via engine start, flight computer programming, etc and through the whole flight.
 
User avatar
SaveFerris
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 5:42 am

Re: Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:19 pm

77west wrote:
It depends if fitted with autostart or not. It is all in the provided manuals... with the product you bought...


This is correct, not sure how accurate the flight sim version is but in the real airplane the Autostart is selected on or off via a switch on the overhead panel. Unless it is deferred we use Autostart as it easier as well as protects against most start malfunctions. If using Autostart you simply pull the Start Valve selector out and then move the Fuel Cutoff to Run, the computer does the rest. With Autostart off you will get a line on the N2 indicator on the lower EICAS which indicates the minimum N2 at which you should introduce fuel. In this case you pull the Start Valve and wait until N2 reaches said line (or preferably max dry motoring N2) and then move the Fuel Cutoff selector to Run. Hopefully this helps!
 
RetiredWeasel
Posts: 500
Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2014 8:16 pm

Re: Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:33 pm

SaveFerris wrote:
77west wrote:
It depends if fitted with autostart or not. It is all in the provided manuals... with the product you bought...


This is correct, not sure how accurate the flight sim version is but in the real airplane the Autostart is selected on or off via a switch on the overhead panel. Unless it is deferred we use Autostart as it easier as well as protects against most start malfunctions. If using Autostart you simply pull the Start Valve selector out and then move the Fuel Cutoff to Run, the computer does the rest. With Autostart off you will get a line on the N2 indicator on the lower EICAS which indicates the minimum N2 at which you should introduce fuel. In this case you pull the Start Valve and wait until N2 reaches said line (or preferably max dry motoring N2) and then move the Fuel Cutoff selector to Run. Hopefully this helps!


Silly me. I was using the procedure we used for years at the red tails and presumably the couple of remaining 400s at Delta. I don't remember any autostart feature in those birds and it isn't in the manual but maybe I missed something. I don't know anything about the computer flight sims.
 
Lpbri
Posts: 24
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:18 pm

Re: Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Fri Oct 06, 2017 2:35 pm

I don't think on a 747-400 you can start 2 at a time.
 
RetiredWeasel
Posts: 500
Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2014 8:16 pm

Re: Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:23 pm

Lpbri wrote:
I don't think on a 747-400 you can start 2 at a time.

Normally you would. And normally at my ex airline you would start 3 and 4 at the same time then 1 and 2.
 
Tristarsteve
Posts: 3425
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 11:04 pm

Re: Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:26 pm

I don't remember any autostart feature in those birds and it isn't in the manual but maybe I missed something. I don't know anything about the computer flight sims.


On the B744 Autostart was a customer option, but most aircraft had it fitted.

We once had a delivery flight at LHR en route to somewhere East of us. A new crew took over the flight. They had been trained by Boeing on a simulator with Autostart. They used the autostart procedure. This aircraft was not fitted with autostart ,and they managed to hot start two engines, which we then replaced for them.
 
thepinkmachine
Posts: 206
Joined: Tue Apr 28, 2015 4:43 pm

Re: Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:33 pm

Tristarsteve wrote:
I don't remember any autostart feature in those birds and it isn't in the manual but maybe I missed something. I don't know anything about the computer flight sims.


On the B744 Autostart was a customer option, but most aircraft had it fitted.

We once had a delivery flight at LHR en route to somewhere East of us. A new crew took over the flight. They had been trained by Boeing on a simulator with Autostart. They used the autostart procedure. This aircraft was not fitted with autostart ,and they managed to hot start two engines, which we then replaced for them.



Wow! An expensive mistake!
 
User avatar
SaveFerris
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 5:42 am

Re: Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:05 pm

RetiredWeasel wrote:
Lpbri wrote:
I don't think on a 747-400 you can start 2 at a time.

Normally you would. And normally at my ex airline you would start 3 and 4 at the same time then 1 and 2.


Yup...the only time we start one at a time is an air cart or a crossbleed start. Otherwise the APU has more than enough bleed air pressure to start two at once.
 
User avatar
77west
Posts: 850
Joined: Sat Jun 13, 2009 11:52 am

Re: Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Tue Oct 10, 2017 3:29 am

The start order may also be influenced by whether the AUX HYD pumps are fitted to 1 and 4, or only 4. (Yet another of the 747s customer options) But typically at least 4 seems to always be started first, by itself or with one of the others if on a decent air source (APU)
77West - AW109S - BE90 - JS31 - B1900 - Q300 - ATR72 - DC9-30 - MD80 - B733 - A320 - B738 - A300-B4 - B773 - B77W
 
Sancho99504
Posts: 387
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2005 2:44 pm

Re: Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Sun Oct 15, 2017 6:03 am

SaveFerris wrote:
RetiredWeasel wrote:
Lpbri wrote:
I don't think on a 747-400 you can start 2 at a time.

Normally you would. And normally at my ex airline you would start 3 and 4 at the same time then 1 and 2.


Yup...the only time we start one at a time is an air cart or a crossbleed start. Otherwise the APU has more than enough bleed air pressure to start two at once.


When I worked with CI cargo at ORD, they would start one at a time, 1 thru 4. CV would start 3&4 then 2&1, PO & GT would do something weird like 2&4 then 1&3. JL and KZ started one at a time as well.
kill 'em all and let God sort 'em out-USMC
 
BoeingGuy
Posts: 4465
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:01 pm

Re: Boeing 747-400 Start Up Procedure

Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:38 am

SaveFerris wrote:
RetiredWeasel wrote:
Lpbri wrote:
I don't think on a 747-400 you can start 2 at a time.

Normally you would. And normally at my ex airline you would start 3 and 4 at the same time then 1 and 2.


Yup...the only time we start one at a time is an air cart or a crossbleed start. Otherwise the APU has more than enough bleed air pressure to start two at once.


You’re only permitted to start two at a time if you have autostart. Can’t speak for what you guys really do, but that’s Boeing guidance IIRC.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: UltimateDelta, UTAFrench and 3 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos