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Eindhoven
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Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 2:36 pm

EIN is in a very strategic location in the middle of the AMS-BRU-DUS triangle.

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Three major hubs about equally nearby, you would think every airline in the world would want to fly there and serve three destinations at once. No other airport in the region is as central as EIN.

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RTM is too far from DUS. MST is too far from AMS. NRN and LEY are too far from BRU.

But despite it's strategic location the only flights at EIN are LCC and holiday flights. No legacy airline at all serves EIN. Instead they serve the three major hubs at the outskirts of the region. Why do they not consolidate those three flights at AMS, BRU and DUS into one at EIN?
 
paullam
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 2:40 pm

Eindhoven wrote:
EIN is in a very strategic location in the middle of the AMS-BRU-DUS triangle.

Three major hubs about equally nearby...


You answered your own question. There are already quite a few big airports around which serve the area pretty well. That combined with low O&D traffic answers your question.
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Eindhoven
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 2:42 pm

Yes but they are on the outskirts of the region. EIN is in the center.
 
stlgph
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 2:45 pm

You're talking about three different countries here.

This one isn't that hard to figure out.
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paullam
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 2:46 pm

Eindhoven wrote:
Yes but they are on the outskirts of the region. EIN is in the center.


That’s true but DUS, BRU and AMS are well established and developed airports. Additionally they’re well connected so they work as hubs. We all know that AMS is a huge Skyteam hub whereas BRU and to a lesser extent DUS is a Star Alliance hub.

BRU, AMS and DUS also have enough O&D traffic which EIN just can’t offer.
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Eindhoven
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 2:46 pm

Here are the images that don't work in the first post.

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As you see EIN is in the center and all the other airports are around it.
 
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Eindhoven
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 2:48 pm

stlgph wrote:
You're talking about three different countries here.

This one isn't that hard to figure out.


Countries don't mean much here, we have open borders. Just like in America you drive from one state to another in Europe you drive from one country to another.
 
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Francoflier
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 3:02 pm

Why would anyone want to fly to a city that's 1 to 1.5 hours drive from where they're going when they can easily book one of the multitude of flights that can get them straight to where they want to go in an already extremely competitive market?

:confused:
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stlgph
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 3:21 pm

Eindhoven wrote:
stlgph wrote:
You're talking about three different countries here.

This one isn't that hard to figure out.


Countries don't mean much here, we have open borders. Just like in America you drive from one state to another in Europe you drive from one country to another.



And that's where you are entirely wrong.

You could list a 1,000 reasons why this would never work based on the fact that it's three different countries alone.

Please don't really sit here and tell me I have to explain this to you....I mean....*come* *ON*.
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paullam
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 3:23 pm

stlgph wrote:
Eindhoven wrote:
stlgph wrote:
You're talking about three different countries here.

This one isn't that hard to figure out.


Countries don't mean much here, we have open borders. Just like in America you drive from one state to another in Europe you drive from one country to another.



And that's where you are entirely wrong.

You could list a 1,000 reasons why this would never work based on the fact that it's three different countries alone.

Please don't really sit here and tell me I have to explain this to you....I mean....*come* *ON*.


I’d actually be interested in hearing what you say about that. There are a couple of airports that serve cross-border regions. BSL or GIB come to mind.
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zakuivcustom
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 3:41 pm

Eindhoven wrote:
But despite it's strategic location the only flights at EIN are LCC and holiday flights. No legacy airline at all serves EIN. Instead they serve the three major hubs at the outskirts of the region. Why do they not consolidate those three flights at AMS, BRU and DUS into one at EIN?


B/c airlines, given the chance, always want to fly to the airport that's closest to center of actions (Population, economy, etc.)? Why in the world would anyone drive (or ride the train) 1-1.5 hrs when there's an airport that's much larger in their backyard?

Ok, people would, but you would need to lower fares to attract pax to drive that far. And the results? LCCs (Ryanair/Transavia), Vacation Airlines (TUI Fly), etc., which is exactly what you're seeing in EIN right now.

Seriously, what's with a.net and their obsession with mega airports (Which EIN is not even one, it has what? A single runway? Unless you pull a chunhimlai and build another 5 parallel runways, have 6 terminals at EIN, etc.) that somehow people are going to just used? What's next? All airlines should just fly into TTN to capture all traffic to Philly and NYC? (Although I believed somebody already have a thread on that topic). Oh, and since Birmingham (BHX) is only 66mi from LHR and around 90mi from MAN, airlines should have just fly to BHX instead of paying a huge sum of money for any LHR slots. I mean, it can capture traffic to both London and Manchester afterall.

There are many other examples, i.e. Flying to WUX to capture all traffic to the whole YRD, flying to CLD or SNA and call that "Middle between LA and San Diego" (Or just build a new airport and shut down LAX and SAN).
 
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 8:00 pm

I think you're looking at this the wrong way. The size of BRU, AMS and DUS nearby actually detracts from pax numbers at EIN rather than adding to its potential, as people in Eindhoven might look for direct flights from the larger airports instead, while much fewer people in the larger cities think of looking at flights from EIN instead of the larger, much closer airport.
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MartijnNL
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 10:16 pm

PatrickZ80 wrote:
Certainly Amsterdam has a very high percentage of transfer traffic, Eindhoven has zero. It's 100% O&D. I don't have the exact numbers, but I think the number of O&D passengers at Amsterdam isn't that much higher than at Eindhoven.

In 2017 Amsterdam had 37% transfer traffic, which I wouldn't call a very high percentage. The remaining 63% was O&D traffic, which converts to more than 43 million passengers. The total number of O&D passengers at Amsterdam was more than seven times greater than the total passenger count of Eindhoven.

http://trafficreview2017.schiphol.tangelo.nl/passengers
 
cofannyc
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 10:43 pm

Being in the centre of the AMS-BRU-DUS triangle makes it the exact opposite of a strategic location given the size and depth of service of the other airports. People in the middle have 3 airports for travel to on periphery (and clearly they already do) and no one is going to stop serving AMS/BRU/DUS to consolidate at EIN just because it's in the middle.
 
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TWA772LR
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 11:24 pm

Eindhoven wrote:
Yes but they are on the outskirts of the region. EIN is in the center.

With all due respect, BRU, AMS, and DUS are at the center of their regions, thus more yielding and each have significant legacy and LCC presence.

Slightly OT, I believe CO (or UA) looked in to serving Rotterdam nonstop from EWR with a 757.
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blandy62
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Thu Dec 27, 2018 12:04 am

Same reason as why LIL is not more used. Too close to major sirports
 
bfitzflyer
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Sat Dec 29, 2018 1:26 am

If Philips headquarters were still in Eindhoven I could see some possibilities but now no chance.
 
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FlightMode
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Sat Dec 29, 2018 6:38 am

paullam wrote:
I’d actually be interested in hearing what you say about that. There are a couple of airports that serve cross-border regions. BSL or GIB come to mind.


Airlines that are from the EU single aviation market might be able to operate from/to any airport within the EU but that freedom does not extend to all airlines from countries outside the EU. Many airlines are limited by bilateral agreements restricting where they can fly into. They would wish to access the primary access points in those countries, rather than secondary points in a third country unless there is no alternative.
 
jubaexpress
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Thu Jan 03, 2019 11:49 pm

Have you ever tried to use public transport from Brussels to Eindhoven or from Eindhoven to Dusseldorf. It's rubbish and time consuming. EIN could justify a feeder route to maybe MUC/FRA/LHR but with direct trains to Schiphol station its a risk. The KLM bus will mop up some more. Yes there are open borders but it doesn't change poor connectivity.
 
devron
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Fri Jan 04, 2019 8:50 am

EIN did grow the part years, it will grow more imho, just don't expect the need for one more hub. There are no trains going to the airport (and the bus station that was under contraction needed to be demolished), it is still being used by the Dutch airforce. Not the best conditions for inter regional growth
 
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FlyRow
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:49 pm

devron wrote:
EIN did grow the part years, it will grow more imho, just don't expect the need for one more hub. There are no trains going to the airport (and the bus station that was under contraction needed to be demolished), it is still being used by the Dutch airforce. Not the best conditions for inter regional growth


Needed to be demolished is a nice way of saying it collapsed bigtime. It is however nearly finished and will ease the bus (10x/h) to the railway station. And while public transport links are bad, it's smack bang in the middle of motorways from North to south and east to west so connectivity isn't really that bad. A train station is often quoted as the next thing, however the railway line is to far away from the terminal and would require another bus/transport link, not easing the travel process compared to the frequent and luxury busses (WiFi, powerpoints, luggage sace) to the main railway station.

What EIN will see in the near future is a parallel taxiway on the terminal side, HSE on the runway. However the "luchtvaartbesluit"(aviation agenda) is a very hot topic in the Netherlands at the moment with Schiphol and Lelystad causing a lot of rumblins. The slot limit of EIN is also artificial, just like Schiphol and Rotterdam.
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jubaexpress
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:34 am

If EIN grows its because Eindhoven grows and develops not because it becomes a hub for the region. Eindhoven and southern NL/Limburg residents will continue to pick between the big cities to depart from and not the other way around. Dusseldorf has little to do with Brussels etc. Eindhoven has no strategic position at all.
 
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FlyRow
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Re: Why don't airlines make use of the strategic location of EIN?

Sun Jan 06, 2019 8:34 pm

TWA772LR wrote:
Eindhoven wrote:
Yes but they are on the outskirts of the region. EIN is in the center.

With all due respect, BRU, AMS, and DUS are at the center of their regions, thus more yielding and each have significant legacy and LCC presence.

Slightly OT, I believe CO (or UA) looked in to serving Rotterdam nonstop from EWR with a 757.


No they didn't look at rtm at all. Unsourced and unfounded rumor posted on a Dutch forum.
Poster couldn't post anything except: I think they Will
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