musman9853
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Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:35 pm

So if Boeing decides to go ahead with the MOM/NMA, which carriers do you think would buy them? How many, and to what destinations? Curious what you guys think.
 
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reidar76
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Re: Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:56 pm

Carriers with large fleets of 757-300 and 767 will be MOM/NMA launch customers. In others words, United and Delta. American has opted to replace the 767 on an one-on-one basis with the 787-8. Very few other airlines still operate a significant number of 757/767.

Discussed in Flight Global today: https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... ac-449338/

The MOM/NMA may not be an good replacement for early versions of A330 operated by Asian carriers, due to the suggested low cargo volume in Boeing MOM/NMA design (no LD3 containers).
 
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PatrickZ80
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Re: Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 4:01 pm

Norwegian has already expressed interest for TATL routes to smaller destinations. For example they said Washington DC would be too small for a 787 and too far for a 737, but could very well be served on a MOM.
 
MIflyer12
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Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 4:20 pm

reidar76 wrote:
Carriers with large fleets of 757-300 and 767 will be MOM/NMA launch customers. In others words, United and Delta.


Every carrier who used 752s to the limits of their range, across an economic number of frames, will be candidates, too.
 
StTim
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Re: Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 4:37 pm

I thought we had already established on here:

1. Almost every airline will be beating a path to Boeings door to hand over deposits to order the plane

BUT

2. Despite this Boeing are still struggling to make the business case work.


The reality is - talk is cheap so at the moment many airlines are interested. When a firm configuration is reached from a sales perspective and real money for guaranteed performance is required then it might not be the case.

Remember the market is sort of squeezed from the bottom by the A321 in it's various guises (and I suspect Boeing are factoring in an A322) and from the top by the more capable frames then the airline needs to be confident of the niche will fully employ the frame. They may choose to abuse a larger frame occasionally than have an MoM, or use a slightly less capable one which is useable on all sorts of routes effectively.

This is not an easy gap to fill with a real plane.
 
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BlueSky1976
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Re: Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 4:44 pm

This one is easy: American, Delta, United, Norwegian = a given. FlyDubai (Emirates???), British Airways, Lufthansa Group, QANTAS, Icelandair = very likely. Maybe some charter outfit like TUI Group may be among the first to fly, too.
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Bricktop
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Re: Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 5:02 pm

StTim wrote:
I thought we had already established on here:

1. Almost every airline will be beating a path to Boeings door to hand over deposits to order the plane

BUT

2. Despite this Boeing are still struggling to make the business case work.


The reality is - talk is cheap so at the moment many airlines are interested. When a firm configuration is reached from a sales perspective and real money for guaranteed performance is required then it might not be the case.

Remember the market is sort of squeezed from the bottom by the A321 in it's various guises (and I suspect Boeing are factoring in an A322) and from the top by the more capable frames then the airline needs to be confident of the niche will fully employ the frame. They may choose to abuse a larger frame occasionally than have an MoM, or use a slightly less capable one which is useable on all sorts of routes effectively.

This is not an easy gap to fill with a real plane.

Well said. There is a gap, but I remain unconvinced that the market is that big and can be met cost effectively by any OEM.
 
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reidar76
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Re: Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 5:05 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
reidar76 wrote:
Carriers with large fleets of 757-300 and 767 will be MOM/NMA launch customers. In others words, United and Delta.


Every carrier who used 752s to the limits of their range, across an economic number of frames, will be candidates, too.


Maybe, but it looks like Boeing is positioning the MOM/NMA above this size category in order to avoid direct competition with the A321neo/LR. The 757-200 is near identical to the A321 in internal cabin dimensions, and therefore also in passenger capacity given same class distribution and seating density. On the other hand, carriers may not opt for an replacement aircraft of the same size, but may want to increase capacity to gain market share, or lower capacity in order to improve yields.
 
Arion640
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Re: Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 5:11 pm

I can see this thread is about to name every airline under the sun.

Realistically i'll say: US3, Qantas. Potentially IAG but not sure BA can find use for more than a handful so they may not bother. I imagine TUI will take some along with Icelandair.
319 320 321 333 346 359 388 733 738 744 752 753 763 772 77E 773 77W 788 789 E145 E175 E195 RJ85 F70 DH8C DH8D AT75.

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Aptivaboy
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Re: Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 5:33 pm

For sure, United. They were the airline reportedly most interested in the early MOM presentation they saw last year. They also have decent sized 757 and 767 fleets that will be in need of replacement relatively soon. Remember how they asked Boeing if passenger 767s could be ordered recently? Unless Airbus somehow swoops in Corleone style with an offer that United simply can't refuse on price grounds, United will almost certainly be an early MOM customer, if not THE launch customer.
 
bzcat
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Re: Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 6:08 pm

A lot airlines that flies mixed A321 and A333 equipment, or mixed 757 and 767 equipment on high frequency mid haul routes will be interested in MoM.

So basically every major airlines in Asia and North America.
 
VSMUT
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Re: Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:58 pm

PatrickZ80 wrote:
Norwegian has already expressed interest for TATL routes to smaller destinations. For example they said Washington DC would be too small for a 787 and too far for a 737, but could very well be served on a MOM.


Which is why they ordered 30 A321LRs.
 
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keesje
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Re: Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 8:26 pm

MoM customers are airlines that have the requirement and enough time / limited competition to wait for 7-10 years for availability of a substantial fleet. If you need to move within 2-4 years, e.g. because of competitive reasons, you have to go elsewhere. Maybe United can wait for 7 years, maybe not.
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lugie
Posts: 594
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Re: Potential MOM Customers

Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:19 pm

Lufthansa has stated they would be interested in a potential MoM plane, since it would for example enable them to fly into secondary US cities
(Never explicitly mentioned by LH (!!!) but I'm thinking markets like BNA, RDU, potentially PIT or CVG).

Out of FRA these flights would be outside of the realistic range of an A321LR.
Q400 E175 CRJ9 CRJX A319 A320 A321 A332 A333 B733 B738 B788
X3 LH 4U TP US YX SN EI FR LA YW IB CM
FRA STR HAM TXL ACE BRU BLL DUB MAN MAD OPO LIS FNC AMS PHL RDU LGA CLT SJO PTY

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