What are the most popular international routes by United?

SFO - HKG, SFO - LHR, EWR - LHR, just to name a few.

believeinflight wrote:

What are the most popular international routes by United?

Popular is subjective and busiest can be hard to pinpoint as most airlines don’t publish load factors to my knowledge. Additionally, different routes are busier at different times of the year. It would be interesting to know what flights have the highest load factors year around.

A good way to tell absent public LF data would be to look for lanes/routes with multiple daily flights, flights being upgauged to larger aircraft or flights using the largest aircraft available from the start/ (announcement of service).

There are some exceptions to this depending on available aircraft and aircraft performance and specific market forces. For example, EWR-LHR has more than 2 daily flights but are generally operated by smaller aircraft as frequency is more important than overall capacity. Additionally, SFO/LAX-SYD are important flights that were technically downgauged from a capacity perspective but done for the sake of aircraft performance, now operated by a more capable aircraft
(77E->789)

Additional example is busy UA International Routes:
SFO-PVG 2x daily
EWR-TLV 2x daily
SFO-NRT/HKG were some of the first upgauged to the 77W
SFO-TLV started as a 788 upguaged to the -9

77H

None of those flights can compare to IAH-MEX and some other short to medium haul routes.

Today EWR-LHR has a total of 5 flights, 3 767-400s and 2 767-300s. That’s a total of 1134 seats, nothing trans-oceanic comes close to that kind of lift per day. In comparison, a route with double daily 777-300s would have 734 seats per day.

Airlines0613 wrote:

None of those flights can compare to IAH-MEX and some other short to medium haul routes.

Yesterday, IAH-MEX had 7 mainline flights. If they were all flown with 737-800s with the slimline seats that would be a total of
1162, 28 seats more than EWR-LHR, however it is flown with a mix of 737s and A319s.

jetskipper wrote:

Airlines0613 wrote:

None of those flights can compare to IAH-MEX and some other short to medium haul routes.

Yesterday, IAH-MEX had 7 mainline flights. If they were all flown with 737-800s with the slimline seats that would be a total of
1162, 28 seats more than EWR-LHR, however it is flown with a mix of 737s and A319s.

It depends on how one define "busiest". In terms of frequency, UA has 7 mainline flights on IAH-MEX. ORD-YYZ also get quite busy depending on season (It's up to ~7/day after next week, although 3 of those flights are on RJ).

IAH-MEX is mostly A319, though, and it's ~950 seats/day each way. EWR-LHR, with 5x 763/764 (I saw 3x 763 and 2x 764 on a random day next week) is ~1100 seats. There's IAH-CUN with up to 5 daily flights during high season. For example, next week it's 5x 739, which is ~900 seats daily, on that route.

SFO-LHR is 2x 777, which is ~650-700 seats. SFO-HKG itself may be a busy route, but UA only operates 1 77W per day on that route, while CX has something like 19 flights/week (sometimes up to 3 daily), all on 77W or 359, on that route. Same thing can be said for SFO-TPE (BR dominates with 18 flights/week, all 77W).

zakuivcustom wrote:

jetskipper wrote:

Airlines0613 wrote:

None of those flights can compare to IAH-MEX and some other short to medium haul routes.

Yesterday, IAH-MEX had 7 mainline flights. If they were all flown with 737-800s with the slimline seats that would be a total of
1162, 28 seats more than EWR-LHR, however it is flown with a mix of 737s and A319s.

It depends on how one define "busiest". In terms of frequency, UA has 7 mainline flights on IAH-MEX. ORD-YYZ also get quite busy depending on season (It's up to ~7/day after next week, although 3 of those flights are on RJ).

IAH-MEX is mostly A319, though, and it's ~950 seats/day each way. EWR-LHR, with 5x 763/764 (I saw 3x 763 and 2x 764 on a random day next week) is ~1100 seats. There's IAH-CUN with up to 5 daily flights during high season. For example, next week it's 5x 739, which is ~900 seats daily, on that route.

SFO-LHR is 2x 777, which is ~650-700 seats. SFO-HKG itself may be a busy route, but UA only operates 1 77W per day on that route, while CX has something like 19 flights/week (sometimes up to 3 daily), all on 77W or 359, on that route. Same thing can be said for SFO-TPE (BR dominates with 18 flights/week, all 77W).

People have mentioned IAH-MEX, but no one yet has brought up IAH-CUN. Looking ahead to 6/18 (a Monday) for example:

IAH-MEX: 3x 320, 1x 73G, 3x 738 (1074 seats)
IAH-CUN: 3x 738, 4x 739 (1214 seats)

On the same day, EWR-LHR will have 1151 seats (1x 3-class 763 + 4x 764s)

Can anyone top IAH-CUN? If EWR-LHR doesn't top it, I'm doubtful anything else will.

zakuivcustom wrote:

jetskipper wrote:

Airlines0613 wrote:

None of those flights can compare to IAH-MEX and some other short to medium haul routes.

Yesterday, IAH-MEX had 7 mainline flights. If they were all flown with 737-800s with the slimline seats that would be a total of
1162, 28 seats more than EWR-LHR, however it is flown with a mix of 737s and A319s.

It depends on how one define "busiest". In terms of frequency, UA has 7 mainline flights on IAH-MEX. ORD-YYZ also get quite busy depending on season (It's up to ~7/day after next week, although 3 of those flights are on RJ).

IAH-MEX is mostly A319, though, and it's ~950 seats/day each way. EWR-LHR, with 5x 763/764 (I saw 3x 763 and 2x 764 on a random day next week) is ~1100 seats. There's IAH-CUN with up to 5 daily flights during high season. For example, next week it's 5x 739, which is ~900 seats daily, on that route.

SFO-LHR is 2x 777, which is ~650-700 seats. SFO-HKG itself may be a busy route, but UA only operates 1 77W per day on that route, while CX has something like 19 flights/week (sometimes up to 3 daily), all on 77W or 359, on that route. Same thing can be said for SFO-TPE (BR dominates with 18 flights/week, all 77W).

IAH-MEX tends to be 5x 738, 1x 737, and 1x A319 totaling to ~1,100 daily seats. During peak season, all flights are 738 or 5x 738, 1x A320, and 1x 737. Occasionally all flights can be 738.

Never noticed how much capacity IAH-CUN has. Summer days have 6x 739 and 3x 738, a total of ~1,600 daily seats from UA alone. Occasionally NK sends an A320 with and additional 180, totaling to ~1,800 seats.
What always seems to amaze me is how much capacity there is between Houston and Mexico City.
At peak travel:
UA - 5x 738, 1x A320, and 1x 737
WN - 4x 737
AM - 3x E190
4O - 2x A320
Total: ~2,300 daily seats.

zakuivcustom wrote:

jetskipper wrote:

Airlines0613 wrote:

None of those flights can compare to IAH-MEX and some other short to medium haul routes.

Yesterday, IAH-MEX had 7 mainline flights. If they were all flown with 737-800s with the slimline seats that would be a total of
1162, 28 seats more than EWR-LHR, however it is flown with a mix of 737s and A319s.

It depends on how one define "busiest". In terms of frequency, UA has 7 mainline flights on IAH-MEX. ORD-YYZ also get quite busy depending on season (It's up to ~7/day after next week, although 3 of those flights are on RJ).

IAH-MEX is mostly A319, though, and it's ~950 seats/day each way. EWR-LHR, with 5x 763/764 (I saw 3x 763 and 2x 764 on a random day next week) is ~1100 seats. There's IAH-CUN with up to 5 daily flights during high season. For example, next week it's 5x 739, which is ~900 seats daily, on that route.

SFO-LHR is 2x 777, which is ~650-700 seats. SFO-HKG itself may be a busy route, but UA only operates 1 77W per day on that route, while CX has something like 19 flights/week (sometimes up to 3 daily), all on 77W or 359, on that route. Same thing can be said for SFO-TPE (BR dominates with 18 flights/week, all 77W).

For those comparing lanes like IAH-MEX, ORD-YYZ and even EWR-LHR to TPAC flights, I think it is important to factor in aircraft utilization. ORD-YYZ, and IAH-MEX are sub-2 hr flights. Throwing extra capacity on narrowbody aircraft on turns for a 2 hour flight isn’t the same thing as dedicating as many 4 widebody frames on a TPAC route.

Going double daily on a long haul flight is a major investment if it wasn’t an important “busy” market.

For EWR-LHR, there may be 5 flights a day but what are the LFs? I’ve heard over and over again that LFs are pretty low on some of these flights but UA maintains this schedule because frequency is important to this market and UA needs to use their LHR slots.

77H

Absent any specific data about load factors, the best proxy would probably be seats.

Joint Ventures also complicate things, because those airlines are jointly planning their routes and fleet choices. Some of those hub-hub routes will have a lot of JV capacity...

What the heck does "popular" mean?

Are you looking for routes with most frequencies, seats, total pax, most local pax????

Local pax is very telling, A UA pax from MCI can get to LHR via ORD IAD and EWR. Choice due to times, fares, equipment can determine the route.

janders wrote:

What the heck does "popular" mean?

Are you looking for routes with most frequencies, seats, total pax, most local pax????

Good question. After all, some of the flights are seasonal.....and some have different frequencies, too.

Here are my guesses, based on what I hear from UA employees.

(1) More LHR and FRA flights, from various parts of the system.
(2) SIN trips and ORD-HKG are frequently on weight restrictions.
(3) EWR-ATH averages something like a 97% load factor(summer only service).
(4) All the TLV trips and SFO-HKG seem to have high load factors all year round.
(5) EWR-GVA has a high load factor, but that's because there is no more IAD-GVA.
(6) Brazil and Australia trips have high load factors in the Winter.

blockski wrote:

Joint Ventures also complicate things, because those airlines are jointly planning their routes and fleet choices. Some of those hub-hub routes will have a lot of JV capacity...

True. ORD-FRA has 1266 seats if you include both UA and LH. That surpasses IAH-CUN.

Freshside3 wrote:

(5) EWR-GVA has a high load factor, but that's because there is no more IAD-GVA.

That's not true. IAD-GVA still operates daily on the 763.

FSDan wrote:

Freshside3 wrote:

(5) EWR-GVA has a high load factor, but that's because there is no more IAD-GVA.

That's not true. IAD-GVA still operates daily on the 763.

Last time I was looking for that flight, it wouldn't come up in availability, and no seats on the EWR-GVA available on the days I wanted to fly. Did they do some kind of seasonal schedule adjustment, then??? It was in the winter, which may have something to do with it.

880dc8707 wrote:

Local pax is very telling, A UA pax from MCI can get to LHR via ORD IAD and EWR. Choice due to times, fares, equipment can determine the route.

Don't forget can get to LHR from MCI via DEN, IAH and if really needed too and price was right SFO!!

Airlines0613 wrote:

Never noticed how much capacity IAH-CUN has. Summer days have 6x 739 and 3x 738, a total of ~1,600 daily seats from UA alone. Occasionally NK sends an A320 with and additional 180, totaling to ~1,800 seats.
What always seems to amaze me is how much capacity there is between Houston and Mexico City.
At peak travel:
UA - 5x 738, 1x A320, and 1x 737
WN - 4x 737
AM - 3x E190
4O - 2x A320
Total: ~2,300 daily seats.

Southwest also flies HOU-CUN and HOU-MEX multiple times a day. Interjet also flies IAH-MEX twice a day. The demand is unreal

FSDan wrote:

blockski wrote:

Joint Ventures also complicate things, because those airlines are jointly planning their routes and fleet choices. Some of those hub-hub routes will have a lot of JV capacity...

True. ORD-FRA has 1266 seats if you include both UA and LH. That surpasses IAH-CUN.

You can’t include other airlines, only UA. Even so, IAH-MEX would be higher based on seats available.

FSDan wrote:

blockski wrote:

Joint Ventures also complicate things, because those airlines are jointly planning their routes and fleet choices. Some of those hub-hub routes will have a lot of JV capacity...

True. ORD-FRA has 1266 seats if you include both UA and LH. That surpasses IAH-CUN.

IAD-FRA has similar capacity, depending on the day. In the summer, there are some days where UA is 2x 777 and LH is 1x 748 and 1x 744.

FSDan wrote:

zakuivcustom wrote:

jetskipper wrote:

Yesterday, IAH-MEX had 7 mainline flights. If they were all flown with 737-800s with the slimline seats that would be a total of
1162, 28 seats more than EWR-LHR, however it is flown with a mix of 737s and A319s.

It depends on how one define "busiest". In terms of frequency, UA has 7 mainline flights on IAH-MEX. ORD-YYZ also get quite busy depending on season (It's up to ~7/day after next week, although 3 of those flights are on RJ).

IAH-MEX is mostly A319, though, and it's ~950 seats/day each way. EWR-LHR, with 5x 763/764 (I saw 3x 763 and 2x 764 on a random day next week) is ~1100 seats. There's IAH-CUN with up to 5 daily flights during high season. For example, next week it's 5x 739, which is ~900 seats daily, on that route.

SFO-LHR is 2x 777, which is ~650-700 seats. SFO-HKG itself may be a busy route, but UA only operates 1 77W per day on that route, while CX has something like 19 flights/week (sometimes up to 3 daily), all on 77W or 359, on that route. Same thing can be said for SFO-TPE (BR dominates with 18 flights/week, all 77W).

People have mentioned IAH-MEX, but no one yet has brought up IAH-CUN. Looking ahead to 6/18 (a Monday) for example:

IAH-MEX: 3x 320, 1x 73G, 3x 738 (1074 seats)
IAH-CUN: 3x 738, 4x 739 (1214 seats)

On the same day, EWR-LHR will have 1151 seats (1x 3-class 763 + 4x 764s)

Can anyone top IAH-CUN? If EWR-LHR doesn't top it, I'm doubtful anything else will.

I think ORD-CUN on Saturdays during spring break may be the biggest. On some of those days, they were running 5-6 738/9s and a 777. That was probably topping 1,300 seats on those days.

gwrudolph wrote:

FSDan wrote:

zakuivcustom wrote:

It depends on how one define "busiest". In terms of frequency, UA has 7 mainline flights on IAH-MEX. ORD-YYZ also get quite busy depending on season (It's up to ~7/day after next week, although 3 of those flights are on RJ).

IAH-MEX is mostly A319, though, and it's ~950 seats/day each way. EWR-LHR, with 5x 763/764 (I saw 3x 763 and 2x 764 on a random day next week) is ~1100 seats. There's IAH-CUN with up to 5 daily flights during high season. For example, next week it's 5x 739, which is ~900 seats daily, on that route.

SFO-LHR is 2x 777, which is ~650-700 seats. SFO-HKG itself may be a busy route, but UA only operates 1 77W per day on that route, while CX has something like 19 flights/week (sometimes up to 3 daily), all on 77W or 359, on that route. Same thing can be said for SFO-TPE (BR dominates with 18 flights/week, all 77W).

People have mentioned IAH-MEX, but no one yet has brought up IAH-CUN. Looking ahead to 6/18 (a Monday) for example:

IAH-MEX: 3x 320, 1x 73G, 3x 738 (1074 seats)
IAH-CUN: 3x 738, 4x 739 (1214 seats)

On the same day, EWR-LHR will have 1151 seats (1x 3-class 763 + 4x 764s)

Can anyone top IAH-CUN? If EWR-LHR doesn't top it, I'm doubtful anything else will.

I think ORD-CUN on Saturdays during spring break may be the biggest. On some of those days, they were running 5-6 738/9s and a 777. That was probably topping 1,300 seats on those days.

Umm...except on the same day (I used March 17, for example), there are 6x 739 along with 3x 738 on IAH-CUN, and 3x 738 (~500 seats) definitely carry more people than a single 777 (Largest = 364 seats).

Thanks for correcting me. I must have missed where you originally quoted UA had 12x IAH-CUN per day. Forgive my oversight.

They do have an incredible operation in CUN on peak season Saturdays with more than 40 combined flights each way