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aerolimani
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Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:49 pm

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1368245

In the above thread about how the USA might be considering forbidding inbound international passengers from using electronic check-in, user ACCS300 wrote:

I can't believe how many of my Canadian friends are choosing to avoid travel, especially air, to the USA. Everyone I know is spending their travel dollars in Europe or Mexico, not that there's any great fear but just the chance of being made to feel uncomfortable or intimidated, on what is otherwise supposed to be an enjoyable experience, is a huge turnoff for many of us here in Canada.


I personally feel the same way. The possibility of an unpleasant border experience is a strong demotivator for me. I will go for work, or for an important event with friends/family. Otherwise, for my own leisure, I am not going. I also avoid transiting through the USA.

I'm curious to hear from other non-US citizens. Do you feel that the DHS, TSA, and CBP have caused you to reconsider your leisure travel plans, or do you feel that nothing has changed for you?
 
AtomicGarden
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Fri Jul 14, 2017 12:31 am

My father and sister renewed their visas this year, no extra hassle (just the usual). My gf traveled this year and the whole experience was very normal. Even with the ever-annoying US customs and immigration shenanigans and possibility of an electronics ban (avoided by the Argentinian govt. thank god) I'm still planning on flying again.

I thought I wouldn't fly this year, but it's very unlikely I'll have to face problems when entering the USA.
 
Kent350787
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Fri Jul 14, 2017 8:20 am

We are returning in October for a family wedding in BOS. Without this, the USA wouldn't have been our first travel option (and we plan on spending most of the trip in Canada anyway). We enjoyed the east coast last year, but it was at the end of 44's term.

However, as a very WASP family, I don't expect any border issues.
 
dc9northwest
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Fri Jul 14, 2017 2:02 pm

Well, I'm an American citizen and have family here. But I just returned to the US and the citizens, residents and esta line was very long. 55 minutes and that's with cutting in line so I could catch my flight, which I could still do unlike... most people there apparently.

ATL F

Would avoid the US otherwise if there was a laptop ban. Also, wouldn't connect internationally in the US
 
opethfan
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Fri Jul 14, 2017 4:08 pm

I've been once by car and once by air recently. CBP are just as disinterested and have caused me no issue.
 
ChrisKen
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Fri Jul 14, 2017 4:28 pm

It's certainly made significant moves down the list of potential travel destinations.
 
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aerolimani
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Fri Jul 14, 2017 5:20 pm

dc9northwest wrote:
Well, I'm an American citizen and have family here. But I just returned to the US and the citizens, residents and esta line was very long. 55 minutes and that's with cutting in line so I could catch my flight, which I could still do unlike... most people there apparently.

It's interesting to hear that US citizens also can have less than stellar experiences. I am Canadian, and I don't much like our agents either.

My #1 issue is the borderline (pun intended) invasive questions, but my #2 complaint is the lineups. I've stood for over 90 minutes, on hard tile floor, waiting at pre-check in YYC. I've missed connections because of long waits in the USA. At least where/when I've been, there's been no separate lineup for connecting passengers versus those arriving at their final destination.

As to the invasive questions, they usually have to do with medical history. I truly have no idea why they ask. While I understand the "right" of the CBP agent to ask, that doesn't change the fact that I strongly dislike answering. I feel that some things should be only between my doctor, my wife, and myself. Putting aside any hypotheticals, for me this is a very real discouragement to visiting. I have never had these questions from any other country.

Has anybody else had invasive questions re their medical history?
 
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jnev3289
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Fri Jul 14, 2017 7:29 pm

Global Entry/NEXUS are your friends. $99 for 5 years of avoiding this "hassle" is small potatoes
 
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aerolimani
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Fri Jul 14, 2017 8:48 pm

jnev3289 wrote:
Global Entry/NEXUS are your friends. $99 for 5 years of avoiding this "hassle" is small potatoes

Worth it for a regular traveler, yes. I'm thinking more of people whose travel is mostly leisure.

Anecdotally, I've heard from lots of my Canadian friends that they are skipping the USA when making vacation plans. For short trips, they're choosing Mexico and the Caribbean. In the past, these same friends would have been more likely to choose somewhere like San Francisco or Las Vegas. I am curious to hear from others, who I don't know personally. So far, on a.net, you've mostly been ambivalent, and feel unaffected. Of course, I expect a.net might also be populated by people who fly more often than average.
 
Chemist
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Fri Jul 14, 2017 11:10 pm

I'm a US citizen. But frankly, if I were not and I were hearing the things coming out of USA these days, I would not be picking the US as a travel destination until I had exhausted a lot of other choices.
 
Georgetown
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Sat Jul 15, 2017 7:20 am

I dunno. In general we're a pretty friendly lot, and the odds of any real issue at the border aren't much worse than anywhere else. But, hey, it's your choice not to come to the US. Lots of other beautiful places on the planet, and if you ever change your mind, we'll still be here - generally with a cold beer and a smile waiting for you.
Let's go Hoyas!
 
ogre727
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Sat Jul 15, 2017 7:35 am

Yes, we are avoiding the US. Even if my twin brother lives there.
I am between the devil and the deep blue sea
 
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aerorobnz
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Sat Jul 15, 2017 7:47 am

It makes no difference to me. I will return, potentially even this year, I have always allowed for extra time when arriving into the USA, and where possible I overnight. I'm white and english speaking so provided I leave my politics at the border I will be fine. And yes it is perverse that I have to say that as a reason I can still travel there.
Flown to 126 Airports in 47 Countries on 80 Operators. Visited 56 Countries and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
bunumuring
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Sun Jul 16, 2017 12:50 am

Hey guys,
I am planning one trip to the US next year to cash in my Virgin Australia Velocity FFP before anything can happen to them or VA stop transpacific flights ...
It will be a long long long desired trip purely to Seattle to the Boeing factory - #1 on my bucket list. Taking my kids with me. Possibly doing a side trip to visit some distant relatives in the South...
Apart from that, I have absolutely NO desire to travel for leisure to the US. So many other parts of the world attract me more. The well-aired difficulties of crossing US borders makes the US even less attractive to me. Plus stories I hear that make me less likely to want to travel there, for example from a close business colleague I work with daily who was in Times Square when the man deliberately ran down pedestrians there recently... (mind you, that happened in Melbourne three months ago when I was within a couple of kilometres of the place that it happened!)
Interestingly, I have noticed a much greater advertising push here in Australia for the US as a tourist destination. Obviously tourism must be hurting.
I know so many people who have dropped the US, and especially Hawaii, from their leisure travel plans. I know of two families who are travelling to Disneyland between now and the end of the year and another three families that switched their plans from Disneyland to holidays in Japan (skiing instead), Paris (for EuroDisney) or Hong Kong (for the anaemic HK Disneyland) instead because of their perceived fears about flying to the US and terrorist threats. I know of two couples who were planning to fly to Hawaii together and changed their plans to the Cook Islands instead (huge advertising push here at the moment for Raratonga flights from Sydney on Air New Zealand) specifically because the last time they flew their a year ago they hated the hassle of border control and now they say it would be even worse. I personally found Hawaii inferior to just about any tropical island / destination I have been too - even Far North Queensland I felt was better - and have no desire to return there.
One day I would like to go to Washington DC, NYC, the Grand Canyon. Victorville, Mojave Desert and maybe some other places that appeal to me. But the desire to go to them has certainly deeply declined with all the perceived difficulties of entering the US. I have some distant relatives too who live in the US... and even their persistent invitations to visit and enjoy their hospitality aren't appealing enough to make me want to fly Sydney-Dallas on the big red roo...
On the other side, credit must go to the US Government for protecting it's borders so effectively but what a price the US has had to pay.
Cheers
Bunumuring
I just wanna live while I'm alive!
 
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mercure1
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Sun Jul 16, 2017 4:09 am

I don't think simply placing one's head in the sand and avoiding the US really does much except make you potentially miss out on experiences which you can have in the US.

We are living in the world that has increased security and political issues so nations adjust. Its always been a process of jumping through one hoop or the other to enter various nations including the US anyhow, so personally, I don't have an issue with rumored new proposals.

Ultimately I would rather travel to the US before visiting many dozen other nations.
 
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aerolimani
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Sun Jul 16, 2017 5:13 am

mercure1 wrote:
I don't think simply placing one's head in the sand and avoiding the US really does much except make you potentially miss out on experiences which you can have in the US.

We are living in the world that has increased security and political issues so nations adjust. Its always been a process of jumping through one hoop or the other to enter various nations including the US anyhow, so personally, I don't have an issue with rumored new proposals.

Ultimately I would rather travel to the US before visiting many dozen other nations.

As a middle-aged Canadian, it's like I used to have a good neighbour, and there was no fence between our yards. There was just a line, defined only by the lawnmower. One day a fence went up, then a hedge was planted. Then came guard dogs and an electrified fence. I wouldn't say I'm so much head-in-the-sand, but rather I'm feeling like my formerly friendly neighbour is now treating me like an enemy. I realize my response is emotional. For better or worse, we humans are emotional creatures, and I know I am not alone.

BTW, I just came back from a trip to Alaska. In this case, I went for family reasons. The trip was overall fantastic, and Glacier Bay National Park was incredible! But, lining up for nearly 2-hours to see the US CBP agent, and the unnecessarily invasive questions, definitely tainted experience.
 
Kent350787
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Sun Jul 16, 2017 7:37 am

aerolimani wrote:
mercure1 wrote:
BTW, I just came back from a trip to Alaska. In this case, I went for family reasons. The trip was overall fantastic, and Glacier Bay National Park was incredible! But, lining up for nearly 2-hours to see the US CBP agent, and the unnecessarily invasive questions, definitely tainted experience.


This is interesting. We entered the USA via JFK last December and had no more issues than we've had in any other country - possibly easier than a couple of SIngapore-Malaysia land crossings have been. We're entering via BOS on our next trip, but looping via road into Quebec and then back into the USA from Ontario. I hope the experience isn't too bad.
 
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SRQKEF
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Sun Jul 16, 2017 10:39 am

bunumuring wrote:
Hey guys,
Plus stories I hear that make me less likely to want to travel there, for example from a close business colleague I work with daily who was in Times Square when the man deliberately ran down pedestrians there recently...


That one was a heavily intoxicated driver, nothing deliberate opposed to the recent attacks in London.
Nothing compares to taking off in an empty 757 with full thrust!
 
csavel
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Sun Jul 16, 2017 3:37 pm

if I were not from the US, and especially if I were not white, no freakin; way would I come to the US. Why the hell would I go to a place where I am officially not really welcome?
I am from New York so I don't really see any overt Trumpite xenophobia, but it still affects me tangentially. Know a lot of people who depend on tourism and foreign tourism is already taking a hit. You'll find New Yorkers don't discriminate and give f**ing attitude to everyone, so come to NYC, just don't stand on the f**ing sidewalk and gawk. Tryin' to get to work here!!! Damn tourists!!!
I may be ugly. I may be an American. But don't call me an ugly American.
 
Whywhyjay
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Re: Are you choosing not to travel to the USA?

Sun Jul 16, 2017 5:15 pm

I also avoid transiting through the USA, and very rarely go there for leisure. It is often far cheaper to transit through a US hub (SEA, SFO, or LAX) travelling to Europe, the South Pacific, or Asia from my home. I will pay the premium to go through YVR or another Canadian hub. While I have never personally had a problem at the US border, I don't see the benefit in transiting through yet another border crossing and the potential stress and delays that could bring on, particularly a country known to suddenly change it's entry and security laws, throwing it's system into turmoil. Also as I travel with a DSLR camera, I definitely don't want to find myself on the wrong side of some sudden electronics ban.
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