greenair727
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UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 9:51 pm

Stepping back a few years ago, CO was the best US airline out there---newest fleet, sound books, and, very importantly, a work ethic and outlook that treated people decently. They were smart and human. And any public/customer gaffes were smartly contained. In the last few years, on UA I've experienced COUNTLESS silly things UA has done on my flights--even little things like putting all the pillows in the overheads in the back of the plane so there is almost no overhead space, so the economy plus folks have more space---and perhaps to force a few economy people to pay $---on the plane---to move up. From my experience, and from the stories I've read, UA is clearly the most clueless and inappropriate US carrier. On routes/schedules when I can, I always avoid them and fly another carrier---even if the price is a little higher. That said, I truly miss the days of CO. Any precedent or possibility of a UA-CO breakup? I know its against the trend of larger and larger companies....

(I realize I may be attacked by the UA loyalists here!)
Last edited by greenair727 on Mon Apr 10, 2017 9:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
panam330
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 9:56 pm

Uh, no. The company is merged, and there is no way to "separate" it and revive a dead airline. People need to get over this already.
 
32andBelow
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 9:58 pm

I've flown on a dozen UA flights with nothing bad to say.
 
aviationjunky
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 10:10 pm

Once a merger is completed, they technically can't separate. They signed legal documentation that UA absorbed CO, so CO is a dead airline. The only way to revive it is to start a completely new company with the same name. Much like Eastern just tried and failed at. It's incredibly hard to start an airline, especially when you have the direct competition of ULCCs, LCCs, and the US3. There is no way it will happen, it's entirely too expensive.

However, I did prefer CO over any airline when it was around. They were always so nice and their planes were also always to clean. I haven't flown UA post merger, but I'm sure it can't be nearly as bad as you're making it out to be. If you don't like the way UA flies, take DL or AA, or even try WN.
LAS is Life
 
deltal1011man
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 10:15 pm

greenair727 wrote:
Stepping back a few years ago, CO was the best US airline out there---newest fleet, sound books, and, very importantly, a work ethic and outlook that treated people decently. They were smart and human. And any public/customer gaffes were smartly contained. In the last few years, on UA I've experienced COUNTLESS silly things UA has done on my flights--even little things like putting all the pillows in the overheads in the back of the plane so there is almost no overhead space, so the economy plus folks have more space---and perhaps to force a few economy people to pay $---on the plane---to move up. From my experience, and from the stories I've read, UA is clearly the most clueless and inappropriate US carrier. On routes/schedules when I can, I always avoid them and fly another carrier---even if the price is a little higher. That said, I truly miss the days of CO. Any precedent or possibility of a UA-CO breakup? I know its against the trend of larger and larger companies....

(I realize I may be attacked by the UA loyalists here!)


:roll: :roll:
Its been 7 years. Move on already.

Oh and PS, a lot of UA's problems are thanks to garbage water management from the exCO crew. :banghead: :banghead:
I don't understand why this site even has moderators anymore.
 
downdata
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 10:32 pm

You cant go back in time. And yes like you said, just fly another carrier.
 
airzona11
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 10:52 pm

greenair727 wrote:
Stepping back a few years ago, CO was the best US airline out there---newest fleet, sound books, and, very importantly, a work ethic and outlook that treated people decently.


Too much romance, the combined CO/UA is also much larger than CO was, so I think the comparisons are sensationalized vs UA.

I think you are describing WN, they are the only airline that "a few years ago" comes anywhere close to that description.

CO before the merger made the "virtual alliance" with UA by joining Star Alliance, they were the ones looking for a date to the ball. I am not certain, but weren't they decreasing their fleet size heading into the merger? Not that right sizing is a bad thing, but mainline was not growing. The other elephant in the room was Express Jet, which was a massive, massive part of CO Network. They weren't in a position to compete moving forward and thus the 'merger.'

If what you state is true, CO would still be flying, but it was a merger so I guess they are.
 
deltaflyertoo
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 10:54 pm

The irony of this post and the way things are at United is that it was CO management that took the reigns of United (i.e. Smisek).....not the other way around..yet everyone acts like it was the other way around...I agree CO had a good thing going...but it was though Smisek didn't see it (or agree?) and decided to degrade the new combined airline?

That said-and it hasn't been mentioned here recently-to ME personally the biggest egregious act was ripping channel 9 out, the ife on the Airbuses as well as whatever IFE the new CO 737s were coming with at the time and making the product no different than that of SW but charging more.
 
IPFreely
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:03 pm

greenair727 wrote:
From my experience, and from the stories I've read, UA is clearly the most clueless and inappropriate US carrier. On routes/schedules when I can, I always avoid them and fly another carrier---even if the price is a little higher.


So you don't like the way United stores pillows in the overhead bin AND you've heard other bad things? And they're an inappropriate US carrier??? The horror of it all. I completely agree with the other posters -- you should definitely avoid United and fly another airline. In your particular case I highly recommend Delta.
 
102IAHexpress
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:04 pm

panam330 wrote:
Uh, no. The company is merged, and there is no way to "separate" it and revive a dead airline. People need to get over this already.


Uh, yes. Legal "separations" are done all the time. The opposite of a merger and acquisition is a corporate divestiture.
 
aviationjunky
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:19 pm

102IAHexpress wrote:
panam330 wrote:
Uh, no. The company is merged, and there is no way to "separate" it and revive a dead airline. People need to get over this already.


Uh, yes. Legal "separations" are done all the time. The opposite of a merger and acquisition is a corporate divestiture.


Typically a divestiture happens within the first 12-24 months of a merging company. It's been far too long and CO wouldn't survive if it had to be separated from UA at this point. The industry has moved on, and there isn't a need for CO at this point.
LAS is Life
 
102IAHexpress
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:38 pm

Typically a divestiture happens within the first 12-24 months of a merging company. It's been far too long and CO wouldn't survive if it had to be separated from UA at this point. The industry has moved on, and there isn't a need for CO at this point.[/quote]

Not sure where you're getting the first 12-24 months data?

Anyways, the current chief of United previously was the COO of CSX. CSX (a transportation company) has made many big divestitures in its history. If a divestiture makes business sense it will be done, regardless of the industry.
 
SFOtoORD
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:40 pm

Yes, because of that pillow storage blunder we should split them in half back to their original form of Varney Air Lines and Varney Speed Lines. People Express can then be divested as the new TED.
 
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Polot
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:45 pm

Divestitures are often done on segments of the business that differ and are not fully integrated with the core operations. For example one of CSX's divestures was its shipping division (Sealand) to Maersk, which was obviously a distinctly different operation from their core rail division.

Divesting a completely merged airline is a different beast.
 
cschleic
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:01 am

A long time ago.... Pan Am sold its Pacific division to United, including a bunch of planes. American bought South America routes from Eastern. But that was about route authority, which had a distinct value. Route authorities aren't the same now, if they exist at all in a deregulated environment. These days, it's more akin to buying or selling landing slots, which have a distinct value. Spinning off an entire airline probably doesn't have much value considering the trend towards consolidation and competitive pressures on smaller carriers. It would have to bulk up on all sorts of operational areas that would be supported by its existing revenue base, which doesn't sound like a money making proposition.
 
NichCage
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:05 am

Would CO have been doing well if it did not merge with UA? What caused CO to merge with UA?
 
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kgaiflyer
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:10 am

a lot of UA's problems are thanks to garbage water management from the exCO crew.

'Lest we forget'.
 
LifetimeGS
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:13 am

CO would be bankrupt IMHO. They used the $1B in cash on hand at UA and the merger to clean up its balance sheet at the time. Had they survived the cash flow problem coming up they would be a great airline making some of the changes for the good that DL does for the industry today.

I wish the merger never happened. If US merged with UA that would have left AA and CO and I really doubt that merger would have been approved. Leave passengers and smaller cities better served.

I believe there will be another round of mergers in the future saving UA from extinction. Much like PA, TW, Sears (once the largest retailer), ect UA will self destruct. I'm sure I'll be flamed for the above the statement but I'll check back in ten years or so.
Last edited by LifetimeGS on Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
727LOVER
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:15 am

aviationjunky wrote:
. Much like Eastern just tried and failed at. I.


Did I miss something?
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
727LOVER
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:18 am

[quote="greenair727"]CO was the best US airline out there[quote]

YOUR opinion

D E B A T A B L E
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
dcajet
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:21 am

What is with these counterfactual history scenarios? But just to humor the OP, if CO were to be separated from UA, it wouldn't last very long as a stand alone airline. The US airline industry has changed dramatically since 2010. CO would be looking for a shotgun wedding partner right away, or it'd disappear in a short period of time. The same scenario CO was facing in 2010 would come back to haunt its newly found single life: it simply was too small to compete effectively with DL and AA, etc.

And lets remind the OP that the management that supposedly could do no wrong at the helm of CO is the same that did everything wrong at the new United.
"Unattended children will be given espresso and a free kitten"
 
jetblueguy22
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:26 am

People like to bring up PR disasters, but forget that even 10 years ago, these types of things wouldnt spread like they do now. Twitter, facebook, and a camera on every phone changed everything.

But no, they can't be split. It's not as simple as saying this was CO's size and hubs before and this is what their fleet was, so this is the new version. People need to learn to move on.
Look at sweatpants guy. This is a 90 million dollar aircraft, not a Tallahassee strip club
 
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Boeing778X
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:27 am

UA was, and is, a trash airline, and even with the abundance of CO management, it is still mediocre, at best. I've met several more ex-CO employees still active and it really is a damn shame they have to work with that carrier. CO was an exceptional airline, and their business plan should be a topic of discussion for airlines everywhere.

Smisek and Tilton destroyed their respected airlines, Smisek especially, as he was a.) Dumb enough to go along with Tilton, and b.) A terrible CEO by every stretch. When you merge a great airline with a terrible airline, you get...a TERRIBLE airline. UA can never dream to be a fraction of what CO was.

Now, someday, I hope someone successfully resurrects CO, much like Eastern, but until then, come fly with us at AA :)
United Airlines: $#!ttin' On Everyone Since 1931
 
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11725Flyer
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:31 am

greenair727 wrote:
That said, I truly miss the days of CO. Any precedent or possibility of a UA-CO breakup? I know its against the trend of larger and larger companies....

(I realize I may be attacked by the UA loyalists here!)


It has nothing to do with UA loyalists. The entity is called United Airlines. There's no going back. Ever. I'm surprised you even posted this.
 
EssentialBusDC
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:38 am

Boeing778X wrote:
UA was, and is, a trash airline, and even with the abundance of CO management, it is still mediocre, at best. I've met several more ex-CO employees still active and it really is a damn shame they have to work with that carrier. CO was an exceptional airline, and their business plan should be a topic of discussion for airlines everywhere.

Smisek and Tilton destroyed their respected airlines, Smisek especially, as he was a.) Dumb enough to go along with Tilton, and b.) A terrible CEO by every stretch. When you merge a great airline with a terrible airline, you get...a TERRIBLE airline. UA can never dream to be a fraction of what CO was.

Now, someday, I hope someone successfully resurrects CO, much like Eastern, but until then, come fly with us at AA :)



I hope you are in Colorado cause that is some good stuff you are smoking.
 
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EA CO AS
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:25 am

102IAHexpress wrote:
panam330 wrote:
Uh, no. The company is merged, and there is no way to "separate" it and revive a dead airline. People need to get over this already.


Uh, yes. Legal "separations" are done all the time. The opposite of a merger and acquisition is a corporate divestiture.


Except they'd need two separate operating certificates, as the CO cert was the surviving one, meaning legacy UA would need to apply for and receive their own AND have their equipment, processes, etc. transferred to it.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
rta
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:32 am

UA is finally starting to get its act together, after a long merger. If there was any time to question the merger, its definitely not now when things are (operationally) at its smoothest.
 
stlgph
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:34 am

So someone is really suggesting United would split with itself to form its own, biggest competitor.

My god you people are brilliant. Keep 'em coming.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
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Boeing778X
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:51 am

EssentialBusDC wrote:
Boeing778X wrote:
UA was, and is, a trash airline, and even with the abundance of CO management, it is still mediocre, at best. I've met several more ex-CO employees still active and it really is a damn shame they have to work with that carrier. CO was an exceptional airline, and their business plan should be a topic of discussion for airlines everywhere.

Smisek and Tilton destroyed their respected airlines, Smisek especially, as he was a.) Dumb enough to go along with Tilton, and b.) A terrible CEO by every stretch. When you merge a great airline with a terrible airline, you get...a TERRIBLE airline. UA can never dream to be a fraction of what CO was.

Now, someday, I hope someone successfully resurrects CO, much like Eastern, but until then, come fly with us at AA :)



I hope you are in Colorado cause that is some good stuff you are smoking.


Sorry sweetie, you are quite wrong. Though Denver is nice though ;)

Sorry you don't like my opinion.
United Airlines: $#!ttin' On Everyone Since 1931
 
Max Q
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 6:07 am

LifetimeGS wrote:
CO would be bankrupt IMHO. They used the $1B in cash on hand at UA and the merger to clean up its balance sheet at the time. Had they survived the cash flow problem coming up they would be a great airline making some of the changes for the good that DL does for the industry today.

I wish the merger never happened. If US merged with UA that would have left AA and CO and I really doubt that merger would have been approved. Leave passengers and smaller cities better served.

I believe there will be another round of mergers in the future saving UA from extinction. Much like PA, TW, Sears (once the largest retailer), ect UA will self destruct. I'm sure I'll be flamed for the above the statement but I'll check back in ten years or so.



What total BS, Continental was in far better shape than UAL by any standard, in fact it was UA that had enormous debts coming due soon, the merger saved UA, CAL could
have continued just fine.


Should have kept Continental as the name too !
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
 
VC10er
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 9:33 am

At Continental's peak, when they were considered by many to be "the best US airline out there", I would actually never, ever chose CO for long haul flights. I basically flew 5 airlines for business when I had a "global" position at my old job. In the 10 to 12 years I racked up about 250,000 "BIS" miles a year UA, CO, LX, RG and LH were mostly it for me, with occasional treats on Singapore.
I remember it all very well, flying was my life, and I knew each airline intimately. Yes, the service was great, the aircraft was always spotless, the atmosphere on board was comforting and I recall having a number of remarkably good meals but where CO always fell FAR behind were there BF seats which IMHO were the MOST UNCOMFORTABLE of any airline, even VARIG had better seats. This was during the era where the standard in Business Class was a recliner chair (bed's only in true First Class). So all the good stuff I listed above about CO meant nothing if you were in agony with back pain and tossing and turning unable to sleep (and those angled seats with the baby carriage canopy were a joke). Those BF seats (while attractive) barely reclined, had the worst of any foot rest and bad cushioning. Oddly, ironically, UNITED had the BEST recliner of all. The service was good enough and they treated their premium pax well. Then UA was first in the USA to install bed seats in Business, not perfect ones to be sure, but they were better than everyone else's recliners for a short time. United was not nearly as good on other measures for sure...but when you finally landed in Sao Paulo or Hong Kong, you could at least walk off standing straight up vs CO where you walked off feeling like Quasimodo! AND they were often more expensive. So, from a purely business flier perspective, I would avoid CO at all cost. With Polaris coming I hope they finally become an entirely NEW airline and better than their respective historic permutations and NOT spit apart.
I prefer flying over the vacation itself! I go on business trips just so I can fly!
 
AA737-823
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 9:49 am

There's a lot of rose colored glasses going around here, and I say that as a CO loyalist, gold elite, blah blah.
Frankly, Continental's golden days were BEHIND them, even at the time of the merger. And yeah, United was a pretty crappy airline. Junk planes. Obsolete everything.
But much friendlier crews.
Continental was certainly very well run, under GORDON. The next two bozos started the unraveling from the get-go.
Smisek would have ruined Continental, regardless of whether it merged with United, just as he ruined United.
To no one's surprise.
I stuck with post-merger United until this year. After another SFO December debacle, more staffing/crewing issues, and the refusal of arrogant ex-Cons to be even remotely polite to passengers, I've started booking away from UA.
You can only abuse me and my time with your poor planning so many times, before I say ENOUGH!
 
102IAHexpress
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:52 pm

11725Flyer wrote:

It has nothing to do with UA loyalists. The entity is called United Airlines. There's no going back. Ever. I'm surprised you even posted this.


I am seeing some UA loyalist defense here. No, the entity is called United Continental Holdings, Inc. Going back may happen. I'm surprised you even posted this.



Bottom line, United could have had an aircraft loss that day and suffered less PR damage than how they handled this. The Chinese media is flipping out because the passenger was Asian. This disaster is the most viewed story in all the major newspapers. Even Congress may look into this. To say nothing of the fact that the stock price is taking a hit. The United brand may never recover. Divestiture may not be the best option right now but re-branding should be on the table. If I were on the United Continental board I would look into a plan that would Re-brand the airline Continental Airlines.
 
Cubsrule
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:27 pm

AA737-823 wrote:
There's a lot of rose colored glasses going around here, and I say that as a CO loyalist, gold elite, blah blah.
Frankly, Continental's golden days were BEHIND them, even at the time of the merger. And yeah, United was a pretty crappy airline. Junk planes. Obsolete everything.
But much friendlier crews.
Continental was certainly very well run, under GORDON. The next two bozos started the unraveling from the get-go.
Smisek would have ruined Continental, regardless of whether it merged with United, just as he ruined United.
To no one's surprise.
I stuck with post-merger United until this year. After another SFO December debacle, more staffing/crewing issues, and the refusal of arrogant ex-Cons to be even remotely polite to passengers, I've started booking away from UA.
You can only abuse me and my time with your poor planning so many times, before I say ENOUGH!


I don't know. UA stopped being my carrier of choice after the summer of 2000, but over the years I have flown them from time to time for schedule reasons. I feel like they have turned the corner lately. We now get SFO Airbus crews at my station, most of whom are fantastic, and if they can get Polaris right they will have a very competitive hard product. I don't feel like UA is there yet, but from my vantage point they are a lot closer than they were 2 or 3 years ago.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
VC10er
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:46 pm

Tylenol recovered, AA received after the JFK crash, all the BAD banks did after 2008, UA will recover if Oscar does the right thing now. I don't know who their PR firm is, but if they are good, they will turn it around in time.

If the stock slips more, then there will be a buying frenzy because UA is not going to go out of business over this. The news cycle will last a bit longer and then something else will consume the airwaves and internet.
I prefer flying over the vacation itself! I go on business trips just so I can fly!
 
masseybrown
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 3:22 pm

There is sporadic talk of a AF/KL breakup; but that might be easier done, since they have never integrated to the extent that UA and CO have. I keep hoping Larry Kellner will write a tell-all book about the pre-merger days. His position had been no merger unless we start seeing significant losses to newly merged DL/NW in the NYC market - I think they started seeing those losses and the Board dumped him in a panic.

Realistically, though, it would be just as hard to take UA and CO apart as it was to put them together. It's not going to happen.
 
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Polot
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 4:12 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
Except they'd need two separate operating certificates, as the CO cert was the surviving one, meaning legacy UA would need to apply for and receive their own AND have their equipment, processes, etc. transferred to it.

While a new operating certificate is required it doesn't have to be legacy UA that needs to be transferred to it. United Continental Holdings can put the unwanted assets on the new certificate, give them the rights to the Continental name and brand, and send it on its merry way while continuing to use CO's old certificate for UA's flights.

"Legacy" CO or UA is just giving history of where the asset is originally from. Everything is UCH's and they can do what they want with them no matter who they were originally acquired from.
 
aviationjunky
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 5:58 pm

727LOVER wrote:
aviationjunky wrote:
. Much like Eastern just tried and failed at. I.


Did I miss something?


Apparently. Eastern Airlines was purchased by Texas Air, and was liquidated. The airline tried to start up again in 2015, but failed and now they are closing as well.
LAS is Life
 
panam330
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 6:10 pm

102IAHexpress wrote:
panam330 wrote:
Uh, no. The company is merged, and there is no way to "separate" it and revive a dead airline. People need to get over this already.


Uh, yes. Legal "separations" are done all the time. The opposite of a merger and acquisition is a corporate divestiture.

I know it can be done, thanks. And has that ever been done for an airline, seven years later, with all of the fleet and labor integrations that have been done? Didn't think so. But you can go ahead and insist. Next time, try it without the snark.
 
102IAHexpress
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 7:00 pm

panam330 wrote:
102IAHexpress wrote:
panam330 wrote:
Uh, no. The company is merged, and there is no way to "separate" it and revive a dead airline. People need to get over this already.


Uh, yes. Legal "separations" are done all the time. The opposite of a merger and acquisition is a corporate divestiture.

I know it can be done, thanks. And has that ever been done for an airline, seven years later, with all of the fleet and labor integrations that have been done? Didn't think so. But you can go ahead and insist. Next time, try it without the snark.


Actually, you didn't think it could be done, that's why you said "there is no way to separate it"... your words not mine. Regarding airline divestitures; AMR corp and US Airways Group did a divestiture after their merger. It's not that complicated. Next time if you're not prepared to take it then don't dish it out to other forum posters.
 
penguins
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 9:13 pm

102IAHexpress wrote:
11725Flyer wrote:
The United brand may never recover. Divestiture may not be the best option right now but re-branding should be on the table. If I were on the United Continental board I would look into a plan that would Re-brand the airline Continental Airlines.


If UA can recover from 9/11, they can certainly recover from this debacle. Rebranding is completely absurd.
 
102IAHexpress
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 9:52 pm

penguins wrote:
102IAHexpress wrote:
11725Flyer wrote:
The United brand may never recover. Divestiture may not be the best option right now but re-branding should be on the table. If I were on the United Continental board I would look into a plan that would Re-brand the airline Continental Airlines.


If UA can recover from 9/11, they can certainly recover from this debacle. Rebranding is completely absurd.


Self inflicted wounds like this debacle and foreign terrorists outside of United's control are apple and oranges. After 9/11 nobody associated the United brand as being unsafe. Further, rebranding is not wildly inappropriate in this case but instead very logical. Rebrandings have occurred in the airline industry in the past. ValueJet became AirTran is one successful example. Also, this is not just social media backlash; traditional media is up in arms, Congress wants investigations, the President weighed-in, heck even the Chinese media has flipped out. This is a total disaster.
 
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11725Flyer
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Tue Apr 11, 2017 10:42 pm

penguins wrote:
102IAHexpress wrote:
11725Flyer wrote:
The United brand may never recover. Divestiture may not be the best option right now but re-branding should be on the table. If I were on the United Continental board I would look into a plan that would Re-brand the airline Continental Airlines.


If UA can recover from 9/11, they can certainly recover from this debacle. Rebranding is completely absurd.


For the record, this is not my quote. Someone used the quote system incorrectly and it got attached to me. I'm on record as saying as saying the opposite. Here's what I originally posted:

"It has nothing to do with UA loyalists. The entity is called United Airlines. There's no going back. Ever. I'm surprised you even posted this."
 
b6sea
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Wed Apr 12, 2017 2:50 am

VC10er wrote:
Tylenol recovered, AA received after the JFK crash, all the BAD banks did after 2008, UA will recover if Oscar does the right thing now. I don't know who their PR firm is, but if they are good, they will turn it around in time.

If the stock slips more, then there will be a buying frenzy because UA is not going to go out of business over this. The news cycle will last a bit longer and then something else will consume the airwaves and internet.


Their PR firm is Edelman, I believe.
 
Max Q
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Wed Apr 12, 2017 5:49 am

What happened to that passenger was a disgrace, fact is the cops should not have been called, it should have been handled by a supervisor.


Cops basically have two modes, instructions followed or violence to force instruction, you can't expect anything else from many of these idiots.
The cop in question should be fired and face charges for assault but I guarantee you nothing will happen to him and he'll probably do it again.


However this will all be forgotten in a few days, in a couple of weeks most of the travelling public won't remember this incident at all, let alone
the airline.
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
 
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Polot
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:04 pm

102IAHexpress wrote:
panam330 wrote:
102IAHexpress wrote:

Uh, yes. Legal "separations" are done all the time. The opposite of a merger and acquisition is a corporate divestiture.

I know it can be done, thanks. And has that ever been done for an airline, seven years later, with all of the fleet and labor integrations that have been done? Didn't think so. But you can go ahead and insist. Next time, try it without the snark.


Actually, you didn't think it could be done, that's why you said "there is no way to separate it"... your words not mine. Regarding airline divestitures; AMR corp and US Airways Group did a divestiture after their merger. It's not that complicated. Next time if you're not prepared to take it then don't dish it out to other forum posters.

All of AA/US's divestitures were done before they merged as a condition of getting merge approval.
 
Airstud
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Thu Apr 13, 2017 6:47 am

aviationjunky wrote:
I haven't flown UA post merger, but I'm sure it can't be nearly as bad as you're making it out to be.


Can. Is.
Pancakes are delicious.
 
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767333ER
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Fri Apr 14, 2017 5:15 am

Max Q wrote:
LifetimeGS wrote:
CO would be bankrupt IMHO. They used the $1B in cash on hand at UA and the merger to clean up its balance sheet at the time. Had they survived the cash flow problem coming up they would be a great airline making some of the changes for the good that DL does for the industry today.

I wish the merger never happened. If US merged with UA that would have left AA and CO and I really doubt that merger would have been approved. Leave passengers and smaller cities better served.

I believe there will be another round of mergers in the future saving UA from extinction. Much like PA, TW, Sears (once the largest retailer), ect UA will self destruct. I'm sure I'll be flamed for the above the statement but I'll check back in ten years or so.



What total BS, Continental was in far better shape than UAL by any standard, in fact it was UA that had enormous debts coming due soon, the merger saved UA, CAL could
have continued just fine.


Should have kept Continental as the name too !

I get that you miss the old days at CO and that's fine, I would too in your position, but if CO was in great shape before the merger, why merge? IIRC Jeff Smisek Chairman and CEO of CO at the time, I paraphrase, said that CO needed to merge with UA. I don't pretend to know why myself but something had to not be working right. Also remeber that it was CO's management that took the reigns after the merger and it was them that replaced the newer UA computer system with the slower, and outdated CO one (just an example).

Oh and keeping the CO name probably would have been a mistake regardless of the better brand associated with the name at the time as it wasn't as recognized world wide.
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Airstud
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Fri Apr 14, 2017 9:54 am

Wasn't the reason for the UA-CO merger that they wanted to compete with Northwelta?
Pancakes are delicious.
 
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ZyreaxPlayz
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Re: UA-CO breakup

Wed Apr 19, 2017 4:30 pm

aviationjunky wrote:
727LOVER wrote:
aviationjunky wrote:
. Much like Eastern just tried and failed at. I.


Did I miss something?


Apparently. Eastern Airlines was purchased by Texas Air, and was liquidated. The airline tried to start up again in 2015, but failed and now they are closing as well.

Woah! Where did you find this? Nothing on their website says that. There is talk of it, but it's still not set in stone! Pretty early to be saying shizzle like that, eh.

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