catiii
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Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Thu Oct 15, 2015 11:52 pm

I suppose you say every airline that Bombardier approaches is "in talks" but this was pretty specific: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...alks-on-cseries-order-from-jetblue

Not sure this makes sense given the 190 fleet, and the fact that JetBlue leadership in the past has admitted the teething pains of being a launch or early customer of an aircraft type are a little more complex then they need...
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 12:05 am

JetBlue has over 100 Airbus and Embraer airplanes on order, I can't see this possibly going anywhere anytime soon. Of all the blue chip North American airlines out there, I don't the B6 is gonna be the one to swoop in and save the CSeries.
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rotating14
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 12:09 am

Mmmmm I don't know about this one. Jet Blue is heavily invested in the A320 and the A321 CEO and NEO programs, along with the Embraer jets. Introducing a new model has been done before but unless Jet Blue expressed prior interest in the C Series, I don't see it happening.

Same with Air Canada.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 12:11 am

After the E190, I expect B6 to be more cautious.

Talks? Sure, but no order for 18 months at a minimum.

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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 12:17 am

B6 will not purchase the CSeries. Any purchase by anyone is too risky.
Why endure the nightmare and congestion of LAX when BUR, LGB, ONT & SNA is so much easier to fly in and out of. Same with OAK & SJC when it comes to SFO.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 1:23 am

It makes sense to of course entertain the thought, but more than anything else, I suspect this is just a public way to put pressure on Embraer for a more thorough launch to the next-gen E-jets and perhaps a better price.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 1:32 am

In general, I like the Bloomberg article ... we are beginning to hear more of such selling pitch news lately (how many posts currently on A.net discussing similar topic?!!) … it looks like when the going got tough on Bombardier, their marketing team is on the going … probably with aircraft hard data in their hands they are becoming more confident in their approach to customers to present their case
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 1:42 am

"I'm gonna make him an offer he can't refuse"

BBD is clearly showing signs of strains. Seeking capital, turning down Chinese offers, Canadian government concern.

While unclear on all the details if they were hyper aggressive they could probably work something out. Would B6 dump the E190 if BBD offered to take them off their hands and carry the burden of finding another home for them? Crazier things have happened.

BBD clearly needs a big win to leverage other clients that. The biggest concern is that there is no carrier crowing about a great deal and until they are in service no one to crow that they are great to operate.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 1:43 am

Going back to my previous comment, here's the quote by Dave Barger about the 190s: http://aviationweek.com/commercial-a...blue-ceo-laments-embraer-190-costs
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 1:48 am

Quoting DC10LOVER (Reply 4):
Any purchase by anyone is too risky.

There is always the right price. How low is Bombardier offering it?
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:02 am

Quoting incitatus (Reply 9):

I don't think they can offer them a price that would make them commit to the C series. B6 is aware that they were in talks with other OEM's because they can't do it on their own. Like with the 787 being late and having battery issues, it was all Boeing and they took care of it and carriers stuck with them, some not all. But this is a desperate attempt to ring up sales based on the economic pressures they're facing, not on the merits of aircraft itself, which are few and far between.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:05 am

the c-series can do every route in the B6 system, so it can in turn make B6 more flexible



Quoting rotating14 (Reply 2):
Mmmmm I don't know about this one. Jet Blue is heavily invested in the A320 and the A321 CEO and NEO programs, along with the Embraer jets. Introducing a new model has been done before but unless Jet Blue expressed prior interest in the C Series, I don't see it happening.

Same with Air Canada.

I wouldn't lump AC into that statement. AC is dumping their A319/320/321 fleet for the 737MAX
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:28 am

JetBlue is a plum customer in that they aren't terribly big, but they are so hot with the media (their main talent). It would be a substantial PR win for BBD to place Cseries with JetBlue. Even 20-30 aircraft would get huge media attention and praise (assuming it is a good plane).
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:32 am

Quoting flyingcat (Reply 7):
Would B6 dump the E190 if BBD offered to take them off their hands and carry the burden of finding another home for them? Crazier things have happened.

Ok, so what about this: UA picks up the E190's from B6, facilitated by BBD in some fashion, with B6 taking an equal number of CSeries planes. This would get UA the 100-seater they desire without a lot of CAPEX, similar to DL with the 717's. B6 could get out from under an aircraft that they aren't perhaps thrilled with while at the same time retaining something a bit smaller than the A320/A321 they have.

It'll be interesting to see how this all hashes out (if it leads to anything at all).

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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:34 am

Quoting Flighty (Reply 12):
JetBlue is a plum customer in that they aren't terribly big, but they are so hot with the media (their main talent). It would be a substantial PR win for BBD to place Cseries with JetBlue. Even 20-30 aircraft would get huge media attention and praise (assuming it is a good plane).

Agreed, in my opinion B6 needs to ween itself off of Embraer. For an airline that wants to be cutting edge and dare I say 'hip', the Cseries are next gen in comfort for the passenger of the 100+ size. It would also open up several under served connections where the legacy carriers have more recently abandoned. Hell, B6 could even think about flying to Canada for the first time, on a Canadian plane!

GO BBD and B6!
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:45 am

Quoting flyDTW1992 (Reply 1):
JetBlue has over 100 Airbus and Embraer airplanes on order, I can't see this possibly going anywhere anytime soon. Of all the blue chip North American airlines out there, I don't the B6 is gonna be the one to swoop in and save the CSeries.

I don't think you will ever see another Embraer delivery to B6.

Quoting incitatus (Reply 9):

There is always the right price. How low is Bombardier offering it?

Bingo. Why not. People bought the last year of Oldsmobile and Mercury. They may be giving away planes that can replace 190s come the late 2010s. With the right price, you deal with the trials of being a launch customer or early customer.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:49 am

I don't know about this. I agree with many about the true interest of B6 to switch without some massive incentive to do so.

The one thing that is in the back of my mind and i just checked on airfleets.net, B6 has some of the very early E190 builds, the first one N178JB (MSN 4) was delivered in 2004, they have 3 more (179/183/184) MSN's 6,7 &8 that have just turned 10 and another 3 that turn 10 before the end of the year MSN's 9,11 and 14.

So for an airline that has prided itself in the past on having a young fleet (and still does for the most part), maybe with some of these and the other 16 that turn 10 in 2016, which means over 1/3 of their 190 fleet is over 10 by the end of next year. perhaps they might be a little more interested than we might think.

I will believe it when i see it, but there is certainly something to at least perk the interest even if it doesn't come to much in the immediate future.

[Edited 2015-10-15 19:52:52]
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:50 am

i can see it, its just the order B6 has still for the E190. the CS100 has a nice range, definitely a plus. and the teething would probably be out of the way by the time the orders came on in a couple of years. B6 tried to enter smaller markets with the E190 but so far its been a struggle. The long routes are what they need, get up more frequency with the CSeries vs a A320 on the route. Would love to see this 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:03 am

There see to be a lot of rumors about regarding airlines being in talks to buy the C Series. I think that Bombardier is probably spreading the rumors, trying to project an image of more carriers being interested in the aircraft than there are in reality. I wish Bombardier the best with the C Series, but the next year or two are going to be very tough for them.
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:07 am

As a side note, not too many people know that BBD flew Neeleman up to Mirabel to check out the CRJ900 when B6 were evaluating the 100-seat options for the fleet.
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:13 am

Quoting cyow (Reply 14):
Agreed, in my opinion B6 needs to ween itself off of Embraer.

Personally, I don't understand exactly why? The new E2 is a pretty good match in most respects to the CSeries, but will likely cost less and have a better chance of remarketing later based on the current model's sales success. Don't get me wrong - I would love to see the CSeries take off (so to speak) but I don't see exactly why jetBlue would not be able to go for the E2? Just because their early experience with the E190 wasn't positive, the fact is that there have been scores and scores of orders for that model lineup since, proving it's broad market acceptance. Not so with the CSeries to date.

Quoting cyow (Reply 14):
For an airline that wants to be cutting edge and dare I say 'hip', the Cseries are next gen in comfort for the passenger of the 100+ size

I believe it's also $Millions more and as-yet-unproven in the market. If jetBlue didn't like being an early customer of the E190, why would they want to be an early customer of the CSeries?

Just my thoughts - not attacking you for your opinion.

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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 4:06 am

Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 20):
Personally, I don't understand exactly why? The new E2 is a pretty good match in most respects to the CSeries

The bigger Ejets have much shorter range.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 4:21 am

Quoting Thomaas (Reply 21):
The bigger Ejets have much shorter range.

E190-E2 is shooting for a 2800nmi range. CS100 is 3100. Not a huge difference there for domestic/North America ops.
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 4:24 am

Quoting Thomaas (Reply 21):
The bigger Ejets have much shorter range.

A few hundred miles, I believe. Worth retraining pilots and paying millions more? Maybe, but it doesn't seem that clear cut to me for an operator with 60 current generation Ejets in service.

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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 5:20 am

Quoting Flighty (Reply 12):
they are so hot with the media (their main talent

Well that and winning customer satisfaction awards...

Quoting cyow (Reply 14):
airline that wants to be cutting edge and dare I say 'hip', the Cseries are next gen in comfort for the passenger of the 100+ size.

So you're saying that in order for JetBlue to be "hip," they need to buy an airplane that nearly every other customer in the world is running in the opposite direction from?
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 6:12 am

Quoting Flighty (Reply 12):
they are so hot with the media (their main talent). It would be a substantial PR win for BBD to place Cseries with JetBlue. Even 20-30 aircraft would get huge media attention and praise (assuming it is a good plane).

What is that really worth though?

No airline buys planes based on what/how the media talks about them.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 6:27 am

Quoting LAX772LR (Reply 25):
What is that really worth though?

No airline buys planes based on what/how the media talks about them.

You are basically right of course, but thought it might help the Cseries get credibility. Being known as a fine product to the passenger (Boeing's 787 strategy in part) may be a little silly, but BBD needs help and the CSeries looks like a passenger friendly beast.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 1:08 pm

Quoting flyDTW1992 (Reply 22):

Quoting Thomaas (Reply 21):
The bigger Ejets have much shorter range.

E190-E2 is shooting for a 2800nmi range. CS100 is 3100. Not a huge difference there for domestic/North America ops.

Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 23):

A few hundred miles, I believe. Worth retraining pilots and paying millions more? Maybe, but it doesn't seem that clear cut to me for an operator with 60 current generation Ejets in service.

EIS is 2018 & 2019 for the E195 E2. With 85 and 95 on order respectively, I don't think they'd be available before 2019-2020 at the earliest.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 1:20 pm

Quoting rotating14 (Reply 10):
But this is a desperate attempt to ring up sales based on the economic pressures they're facing, not on the merits of aircraft itself, which are few and far between.

"not on the merits of the aircraft itself, which are few and far between"

Can you expand on your thoughts there please?
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 1:54 pm

Quoting catiii (Reply 24):
So you're saying that in order for JetBlue to be "hip," they need to buy an airplane that nearly every other customer in the world is running in the opposite direction from?

Let's face it, whats out there at the moment in terms of 100+ pax aircraft is not comparable. I get the impression that for the pax experience, the Cseries would be equivalent a change as going from the 767 to 787. The Cseries is next level and frankly North American carriers could use the 'hip' change because the customer service experience certainly isn't exactly stellar, even for B6.

My point is, sometimes airliners need to be bold and lead the way. This could be B6's opportunity...
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 1:56 pm

Quoting catiii (Thread starter):
Not sure this makes sense given the 190 fleet, and the fact that JetBlue leadership in the past has admitted the teething pains of being a launch or early customer of an aircraft type are a little more complex then they need...

When fuel was high B6 was not a fan of the E190. I think that has now evolved, but they consider it a developmental aircraft and I don't see them taking a net increase in that size class. I think B6 would listen to this pitch if BBD takes the E190s at close to 1:1, but that would be very difficult and expensive for BBD. Reselling them cuts into their C Series business. I think the industry has also gotten the impression that BBD will say anything about the performance of the C Series in order to desperately sell it, so there is a lot of skepticism about its supposedly fantastic economics until it is truly in the wild.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:19 pm

Quoting cyow (Reply 29):
the impression that for the pax experience, the Cseries would be equivalent a change as going from the 767 to 787. The Cseries is next level and frankly North American carriers could use the 'hip' change because the customer service experience certainly isn't exactly stellar, even for B6.
Quoting cyow (Reply 29):
My point is, sometimes airliners need to be bold and lead the way. This could be B6's opportunity...

You presuppose a lot here, namely that the C-Series is a good airplane. The marketplace says otherwise. Being "bold" doesn't mean doubling down on an airframe that, again, nearly everyone is running from.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:29 pm

Quoting catiii (Reply 31):
You presuppose a lot here, namely that the C-Series is a good airplane. The marketplace says otherwise. Being "bold" doesn't mean doubling down on an airframe that, again, nearly everyone is running from.

I presuppose that the CSeries is a good plane based on some of these facts:
http://commercialaircraft.bombardier.com/en/cseries.html

Take a look and familiarize yourself. And the fact that the 'marketplace says otherwise' could have to do a lot with the weight of Boeing, Airbus, and Embraer.
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:35 pm

Quoting cyow (Reply 32):
I presuppose that the CSeries is a good plane based on some of these facts:

While I agree that the C-series is actually a great plane, just unfortunately saddled with being from a not necessarily great company when it comes to competitiveness/salesmanship and in a questionable market position, I wouldn't use BBD marketing material to support that statement.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:39 pm

Quoting cyow (Reply 32):
I presuppose that the CSeries is a good plane based on some of these facts:
http://commercialaircraft.bombardier.com/en/cseries.html

Based on a release put out by the manufacturer of the airplane? What do you expect them to say?
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:46 pm

Quoting Amiga500 (Reply 28):
Can you expand on your thoughts there please?

I can. Airbus and Boeing sell their respective aircraft on what it can do and what problems they can solve for their customers. Boeing and Airbus both accomplish this based on what their aircraft can do. The C Series is not a bad aircraft and it has sales, just not enough. Bombardier was knocking on the door of other OEM's so that they can take a majority stake in the program and bail it out. Now fast forward to today, you now have them trying to selll to a crowd of customers that it probably would not have pitched to before but now have to because their neck is close to the buzz saw. Their stock price is below 2.00 for a company with a market cap of over $3 billion. Not good. Their not selling the aircraft on what it can do and how it will help the bottom line of airlines, only that all the airlines know that they're hungry for sales and a phone call from BBD is imminent.


In the hypothetical event that B6 buys the C-Series, do you think that B6 or anyone for that matter could trust the program to be on time and up to spec??
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:56 pm

Saw this in Av W eek this morning. Certainly would not want to be a part of that debacle if I was looking to buy airliners.

http://aviationweek.com/commercial-a...2=b9216f545a0943f09c952b42f155ba70
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:59 pm

This shouldn't happen. The E190 now has better reliability numbers than the A320 for B6. Plus, you're talking about a different cockpit, training pilots, purchasing simulators or paying for simulator time, buying spare parts and many more expensive complexities. Talks are fine but, if anything, talks give leverage to better deals in talks with other manufacturers.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 4:07 pm

Quoting thesilverbirds (Reply 37):
This shouldn't happen. The E190 now has better reliability numbers than the A320 for B6. Plus, you're talking about a different cockpit, training pilots, purchasing simulators or paying for simulator time, buying spare parts and many more expensive complexities. Talks are fine but, if anything, talks give leverage to better deals in talks with other manufacturers.

Doesn't the CSeries have a lot of commonality with the A320 ?
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 4:10 pm

Could be used as leverage to get a deal on future E-190 orders.
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 4:10 pm

Quoting thesilverbirds (Reply 37):
The E190 now has better reliability numbers than the A320 for B6

Anecdotal at best. But of all my flights that go tech, they're my 190 turns. I hate working the 190's, they're rubbish planes. Not sure where you get your numbers but we have far fewer 320 issues than 190 ones.
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 4:31 pm

http://www.embraercommercialaviation.com/Pages/Ejets-190-E2.aspx

Personally, I don't think there is enough space in the market at this exact point and, the BBD C is too far behind the curve...

The E2 seemingly addresses most of the original E-Jet issues and is already being operated in the fleets of most global carriers... I feel Embraer sealed the fate of BBD Commercial when they went with a new design post EMB-145 for the 70 seat + market.. vs BBD deciding to stretch, stretch, and stretch the CRJ frame.
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 4:40 pm

Quoting planemaker (Reply 19):
As a side note, not too many people know that BBD flew Neeleman up to Mirabel to check out the CRJ900 when B6 were evaluating the 100-seat options for the fleet.

Good thing he missed out on that.

Reality check with both these statements:

Quoting thesilverbirds (Reply 37):
This shouldn't happen. The E190 now has better reliability numbers than the A320 for B6.

In theory, yes. But it costs B6 a lot more $$ to get the 190 to 320 level reliability. Long term parts just aren't as long term as they are supposed to be. So replacing them at shorter intervals keeps the 190 reliable, but at a cost.

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 40):
but we have far fewer 320 issues than 190 ones.

Anecdotal. The 190 reliability has matched the 320 or even surpassed. See above. You're just unlucky  
 
ytz
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 5:08 pm

Setting aside the obvious scepticism, I'd argue that the CSeries would be a great fit for B6 in the long run. It would allow them to have a substantially better 100 seater offering. And they could deploy a potential CS500 as a somewhat A320 replacement, while moving all their Airbus orders to the 321/321N. They'd also get potential savings from operating a lighter MTOW aircraft instead of the 320.

But again, why the CS over the E2?
 
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 5:27 pm

Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 20):
Personally, I don't understand exactly why? The new E2 is a pretty good match in most respects to the CSeries, but will likely cost less and have a better chance of remarketing later based on the current model's sales success. Don't get me wrong - I would love to see the CSeries take off (so to speak) but I don't see exactly why jetBlue would not be able to go for the E2?

I agree with this in general (see my last comment). My caveat would be that the CSeries offers much more amenities to the passenger. And this is something that JetBlue has built its brand on. The large luggage bins would certainly be handy for a more short-haul oriented aircraft where fewer pax are likely to check luggage. The fact that 80% of seats are window or aisle, while slightly worse than the E-Jets, is definitely better than the A320s.

Sizing wise, the CS100 would allow them to have a 100-seater aircraft that offers more pitch in Y (33-34 instead of 32) and offer more Y+ seats, while still saying as close to 100 seats as possible. They'd need the E2-195 to do this, which wouldn't be as compeittive. This could be a factor given that the E-190 today has the lowest proportion of Y+ seats. A properly sized CS500 would also help them keep amenities and get below 150 seats again (while still responsive to Wall St demands to make their aircraft more profitable), while simultaneously letting them use 321s for high density routes.

Now, it's a question about how all this lines up with respect to the costs associated with each competing platform.

Quoting planemaker (Reply 19):
As a side note, not too many people know that BBD flew Neeleman up to Mirabel to check out the CRJ900 when B6 were evaluating the 100-seat options for the fleet.

What's your point? The CRJ900 would never have been a 100-seater in B6 config. I doubt even the CRJ1000 would have made it. The E-190 was simply right-sized for B6 at that moment.
 
ytz
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 5:33 pm

Quoting catiii (Reply 31):
You presuppose a lot here

So do you.

Quoting catiii (Reply 31):
The marketplace says otherwise.

The marketplace isn't saying the airplane is bad. There's been near universal praise for the aircraft itself. Not so much about Bombardier's management of the program, its marketing and its pricing. The marketplace is not criticising the airplane so much as the vendor and the price being demanded.
 
planemaker
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 5:37 pm

Quoting YTZ (Reply 44):
What's your point?

It is exactly what I said.  
Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. - A. Einstein
 
catiii
Topic Author
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 6:00 pm

Quoting YTZ (Reply 45):
The marketplace isn't saying the airplane is bad.

Right, they just aren't buying it, which is the only thing that matters in the marketplace.
 
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Cyow
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 6:47 pm

Quoting catiii (Reply 47):
Right, they just aren't buying it, which is the only thing that matters in the marketplace.

Again, going back to the opponents: Boeing, Airbus, Embraer. Seems like they want to keep BBD out of the party because they realize how much of a threat the Cs really is. Does anyone on here remember the Avro Arrow? Just so happened that jet-fighter had P&W engines as well!
"Broadsword calling Danny Boy"
 
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ODwyerPW
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RE: Bloomberg: Bombardier Talks W/ JetBlue On C Series

Fri Oct 16, 2015 7:23 pm

At 135pax how much more efficient is a CS300 than say an A319NEO (nominal 145pax) or 7MAX (nominal 143pax) ?
How much better is it supposed to be than the 195E2 (132pax)?

Is the purchase price just too high?
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