UALFAson
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UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 5:27 am

As noted in the Chicago Business Journal article's headline, "United Airlines launches non-union ground operations subsidiary United Ground Express."

Apparently their version of Delta Global Services.

Lower pay than mainline employees but supposedly similar travel privileges. No word yet on which cities it will operate at, except the recently announced AZO and that it won't be at any hubs.


http://www.bizjournals.com/chicago/n...es-non-union-ground.html?ana=yahoo
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32andBelow
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 5:43 am

Well if they are going to copy DGS travel benefits, the DGS ones are very good.
 
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jetblastdubai
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 5:59 am

Quoting UALFAson (Thread starter):
No word yet on which cities it will operate at, except the recently announced AZO and that it won't be at any hubs.

"The new subsidiary will provide customer service, station operations and ramp and cargo service at select second- and third-tier airports throughout United's domestic route system."

It seems that UGS could end up at almost any 'non-hub' station in the domestic network. Not sure exactly what a 2nd or 3rd "tier" station is but it could potentially be most places outside of a hub. My guess would be the larger, non-hubs like BOS, LGA, LAS, DCA might be spared.

"One thing that apparently isn't in the cards at UGE, at least at this moment, are labor unions, who are the backbone of United's mainline operations. At times, unions have been a source of friction— and a costly one — with United management"

Hate to see the workforce split up like this but after all the grief and bad blood between labor and management at most airlines in recent memory, it's probably inevitable that airlines would gravitate away from a union workforce, when able, simply to insulate themselves from the threat of work slowdowns, strikes or other expensive labor actions. Taking the ground services function 'in house', yet as a separate entity, allows for some consistency and quality control.
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northwestEWR
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 6:02 am

This should come as no surprise. United has been pouring money into DGS and Envoy for years. Might as well outsource it to yourself if you're going to outsource anyway.

Quoting 32andBelow (Reply 1):

Well if they are going to copy DGS travel benefits, the DGS ones are very good.


I don't know if I'd call them very good. They're better than nothing, more akin to the regional airlines' policies.
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ericm2031
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 7:18 am

This has been planned for some time but was accelerated with Envoy pulling out of ground handling for non-AAG flights. This will hopefully bring some more consistency between the large stations and the small stations. With so many different vendors ground handling, there is a lot of inconsistency in everything from uniforms to policies being followed.
 
N353SK
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 12:35 pm

Quoting ericm2031 (Reply 4):
This will hopefully bring some more consistency between the large stations and the small stations. W

These UGE outfist are going to employ the same people who are laid off from DGS and Envoy when they lose their United contracts. The only difference will be that they will make less money and therefore be less inclined to do a good job.
 
T5towbar
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:49 pm

Quoting 32andBelow (Reply 1):
Well if they are going to copy DGS travel benefits, the DGS ones are very good.

In order to attract people, flight benefits will be offered. Probably the same as DGS and Envoy.

Quoting jetblastdubai (Reply 2):
"The new subsidiary will provide customer service, station operations and ramp and cargo service at select second- and third-tier airports throughout United's domestic route system."

It was definitely going to happen. WE all knew it was coming. The debacle last winter in DEN was the last straw.
Plus you can keep the money "in house" so to speak, instead of giving it to your direct competitors (DL and AA).
And also keep some sort of quality control, since it is not consistent among different vendors.

Quoting jetblastdubai (Reply 2):
It seems that UGS could end up at almost any 'non-hub' station in the domestic network. Not sure exactly what a 2nd or 3rd "tier" station is but it could potentially be most places outside of a hub. My guess would be the larger, non-hubs like BOS, LGA, LAS, DCA might be spared.

"One thing that apparently isn't in the cards at UGE, at least at this moment, are labor unions, who are the backbone of United's mainline operations. At times, unions have been a source of friction— and a costly one — with United management"

These are "Tier 2 and 3" (the recently outsourced stations) that this will probably take effect. They can't encroach on our contract. They would be only doing Express work in a split operated protected hub. My best bet is that UGS would probably be taking over Express in DEN (taking over from Simplicity) and IAD (probably taking over from Swissport). Don't know if SkyWest will keep the work in SFO and LAX.
ORD; IAH; and EWR is protected and will keep the Express work thru '18. No split ops in those three hubs. Plus 23 other stations are protected, including the ones who took the cuts, which will do all their work.

Quoting jetblastdubai (Reply 2):
Hate to see the workforce split up like this but after all the grief and bad blood between labor and management at most airlines in recent memory, it's probably inevitable that airlines would gravitate away from a union workforce, when able, simply to insulate themselves from the threat of work slowdowns, strikes or other expensive labor actions. Taking the ground services function 'in house', yet as a separate entity, allows for some consistency and quality control.

You can't get around labor laws. Thank people like Lorenzo and their ilk. That's why there are still unions in this business. (AA and WN are unionized) Everything is not all Labor's fault. Bad management has played a large role in this as well, as history has showed us time and time again.

A company gets the Union that they deserve.............
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jetblastdubai
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 3:08 pm

Quoting T5towbar (Reply 6):
Thank people like Lorenzo and their ilk

You could probably add Capt. Rick Dubinsky to your list of people that didn't do much to help labor/management relations.

It could be an entire generation before the bad blood between certain groups disappears. Union vs. management, UA-AFA vs. CO-AFA, US-ALPA vs. HP-ALPA, The United 527 vs. 432, the A-scalers vs. the B-scalers etc.
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maxamuus
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 3:09 pm

Quoting T5towbar (Reply 6):
A company gets the Union that they deserve.............

The company also largely sets the tone for the relationship with the union.

If United showed 1/3 of the amount of time and effort that they spend outsourcing jobs, forcing work groups to take pay cuts (at a time when the company is making record profits), setting up subsidiaries (only to force workers to do the exact same job for half the pay and next to no benefits) perhaps they wouldn't have such contentious relations with their work force.

Working for United is akin to being in a abusive relationship. Is it any wonder their unions are disgruntled, they only reflect the attitudes of their members.

United has made it very clear, they are focused on one thing and one thing only. Share holder return and their own greed.
 
777ord
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 3:55 pm

Quoting maxamuus (Reply 8):
United has made it very clear, they are focused on one thing and one thing only. Share holder return and their own greed.

But at the same time, the work force who "take this punishment" don't just say ENOUGH and go somewhere else. But I digress..
 
UA444
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 3:57 pm

Quoting jetblastdubai (Reply 7):
You could probably add Capt. Rick Dubinsky to your list of people that didn't do much to help labor/management relations.

Who's that?
 
deltaffindfw
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:03 pm

Quoting ericm2031 (Reply 4):
This has been planned for some time but was accelerated with Envoy pulling out of ground handling for non-AAG flights.

Is this true? I thought Envoy was a very successful ground handling company (outside of DFW Terminal B). Why would they not want the extra revenue?
 
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Polot
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:40 pm

Quoting UA444 (Reply 10):
Who's that?

He was a UA captain who was the ALPA head at UA up until their bankruptcy in 2002, and lead the push for UA to be employee owned. His attitude towards management was controversial to say the least, and did little to foster a healthy relationship between the two groups.
 
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TWA772LR
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:43 pm

I've worked for two vendors and they are just horrible to work for. There are good ones out there, but their low turnover keeps people from getting hired on.

Envoy, DGS, and now UGE are a godsend for young kids like me looking for a job that has the allure of flight benefits and maybe even a future career with the airline itself.
When wasn't America great?


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jetblue1965
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:49 pm

Quoting jetblastdubai (Reply 2):


Hate to see the workforce split up like this but after all the grief and bad blood between labor and management at most airlines in recent memory, it's probably inevitable that airlines would gravitate away from a union workforce, when able, simply to insulate themselves from the threat of work slowdowns, strikes or other expensive labor actions. Taking the ground services function 'in house', yet as a separate entity, allows for some consistency and quality control.

Anything to loosen the union strangle, A++
 
UA444
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 5:02 pm

Quoting polot (Reply 12):

Ah, the "dont kill the golden goose, just choke it" guy. He did a lot to create UA's problems after 9/11.
 
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jetblastdubai
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 5:22 pm

http://archives.californiaaviation.org/airport/msg26532.html

If you have plenty of time, this is a pretty well-written, article on United's labor/management turbulent past and how the great 'divide' started...and then festered. It is critical of both management and ALPA and digs pretty deep into many issues that have plagued their relationship over the years. Some of the most interesting reading you will find on UA condensed into a 4-part series of articles.

I don't know much about the co-authors from the Denver Post so I can't vouch for their degree of bias but a lot of the information is in line with information I knew, first-hand, as events were happening. You can judge for yourself.
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N1120A
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 6:43 pm

Quoting northwestEWR (Reply 3):
This should come as no surprise. United has been pouring money into DGS and Envoy for years. Might as well outsource it to yourself if you're going to outsource anyway.

It also makes sense due to the outright incompetence of various outsourced stations.

Quoting deltaffindfw (Reply 11):
s this true? I thought Envoy was a very successful ground handling company (outside of DFW Terminal B). Why would they not want the extra revenue?

The airline is much larger and Envoy folks can replace other Eagle/USX handling. They likely don't want to go out on a hiring spree. They will be especially stretched thin if they start outsourcing mainline stations.
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ThePinnacleKid
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 7:02 pm

United can't even finish their merger of employee groups... The IT department can't even keep computers running... The product continues to deteriorate... They have a horrible Mgmt vs Employee work environment.. and a [email protected]# approach to how they handle all the "new" rollouts for the customer....

WHAT could they possibly think makes them think they are capable of starting a new company?
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canyonblue17
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 7:26 pm

I assume we are looking at a company that will employ thousands of people doing roughly the same job at numerous locations. Sounds like if I were a union rep I would be drawing up plans immediately. Is there anything to stop that from happening?
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N1120A
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:09 pm

Quoting canyonblue17 (Reply 19):
Is there anything to stop that from happening?

UA's union contract with the IAM only protects the 25 largest stations. They have already either outsourced or taken pay concessions from the rest of the stations.
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Rdh3e
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:34 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 20):
UA's union contract with the IAM only protects the 25 largest stations. They have already either outsourced or taken pay concessions from the rest of the stations.

He's saying what stops a Union from organizing this new company.
 
canyonblue17
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:54 pm

Quoting RDH3E (Reply 21):
He's saying what stops a Union from organizing this new company

  
negative ghostrider the pattern is full
 
iad51fl
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 9:03 pm

It's time for the usual changeover... once an outsourced company has employees making 3-5yr wages.. it's time to get a new company and reset most of those wages back to 1st year wages....but the new company gains all the knowledgeable employees at a new hires rate as most of the employees take jobs with the new handler. It's a never ending cycle.

The race to the bottom.

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Flighty
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 9:12 pm

Legally, the employer is always UAL and the employees should sue for their rightful seniority. Whether a middleman is in the way is not legally important. The company just wants you to believe that.
 
OB1504
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 11:02 pm

Quoting TWA772LR (Reply 13):
I've worked for two vendors and they are just horrible to work for. There are good ones out there, but their low turnover keeps people from getting hired on.

Envoy, DGS, and now UGE are a godsend for young kids like me looking for a job that has the allure of flight benefits and maybe even a future career with the airline itself.

   I work for a vendor right now with turnover at an all-time high, but it's given me the experience necessary to have a shot at getting hired by a major airline.

Quoting N1120A (Reply 17):
The airline is much larger and Envoy folks can replace other Eagle/USX handling. They likely don't want to go out on a hiring spree. They will be especially stretched thin if they start outsourcing mainline stations.

I doubt AA will outsource any mainline stations anytime soon. Rumor has it the new agent contact will actually insource some previously outsourced operations, particularly at hubs.

Quoting Flighty (Reply 24):
Legally, the employer is always UAL and the employees should sue for their rightful seniority. Whether a middleman is in the way is not legally important. The company just wants you to believe that.

UA will probably transition currently-outsourced stations to UGE. Those employees are not currently UA employees and would have no reason to claim seniority.

Even Envoy staff who transition to AA lose seniority.
 
N1120A
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 11:12 pm

Quoting OB1504 (Reply 25):
I doubt AA will outsource any mainline stations anytime soon. Rumor has it the new agent contact will actually insource some previously outsourced operations, particularly at hubs.

Are AA's agents even union?

Quoting RDH3E (Reply 21):

He's saying what stops a Union from organizing this new company.

Nothing. They may or may not.
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mtnwest1979
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Tue Aug 11, 2015 11:15 pm

Quoting OB1504 (Reply 25):
I work for a vendor right now with turnover at an all-time high, but it's given me the experience necessary to have a shot at getting hired by a major airline.

At least until all airlines are outsourcing all positions lol.
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IPFreely
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Wed Aug 12, 2015 12:19 am

Quoting 777ord (Reply 9):
But at the same time, the work force who "take this punishment" don't just say ENOUGH and go somewhere else. But I digress..

Victim mentality. It's widespread in the unions at United. As much as they whine and complain about being abused and how much better other employers are, they never leave. They just stay and whine. Actions speak louder than words.
 
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malaysia
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Wed Aug 12, 2015 12:26 am

Quoting 32andBelow (Reply 1):
Well if they are going to copy DGS travel benefits, the DGS ones are very good

Piedmont travel benefits are better (same seniority as mainline and all OAL benefits) I do not recall DGS frontline having OAL benefits vs. DGS management unless it has changed.
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strfyr51
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Wed Aug 12, 2015 2:54 am

Quoting maxamuus (Reply 8):
Working for United is akin to being in a abusive relationship. Is it any wonder their unions are disgruntled, they only reflect the attitudes of their members.

What a LOAD of Bunk!!
I'm In my 33rd year at United and in all my years I've never been abused or "Put upon"..
Buttwipe Managers have never prospered and sooner or later we've gotten RID of them Either by "Hook or Crook"
I was a supervisor for 15 years and ALWAYS made it a point to take care of the Hands that took care of me.
My Crews were outstanding and we "Handled" Business. I do admit to working my Lead Mechanics pretty hard.
I held them accountable for the Critical work needed and if they slacked and didn't follow up on the work in progress?
I had NO problem in making their lives "miserable".
So for the most part I had Excellent lead mechanics and my Crews were always well run.
I can't say it was always "roses", but since I would not accept "slackers". I rarely got any and I NEVER lost a grievance about it to the Union about it either.. I din't know where this guy works but I would LOVE to know. I cannot say all the Maintenance crews were run as well as mine Nor can I say all the stations were rin as well as SFOMM was during My tenure.
But I worked with some Damn fine mechanics and Men and Women to whom I'm glad to have known and respected.
 
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northwestEWR
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Wed Aug 12, 2015 4:03 am

Quoting Malaysia (Reply 29):

Quoting 32andBelow (Reply 1):
Well if they are going to copy DGS travel benefits, the DGS ones are very good

Piedmont travel benefits are better (same seniority as mainline and all OAL benefits) I do not recall DGS frontline having OAL benefits vs. DGS management unless it has changed.

They do get OAL benefits via ZED fare after a year of employment. It's essentially the same as mainline except we get it after 6 months.

DGS travels at S3C on Delta which can be pretty brutal. That's just above a buddy pass and is the same as OAL employees.
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ThePinnacleKid
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Wed Aug 12, 2015 8:48 pm

Quoting strfyr51 (Reply 30):
What a LOAD of Bunk!!
I'm In my 33rd year at United and in all my years I've never been abused or "Put upon"..
Buttwipe Managers have never prospered and sooner or later we've gotten RID of them Either by "Hook or Crook"
I was a supervisor for 15 years and ALWAYS made it a point to take care of the Hands that took care of me.
My Crews were outstanding and we "Handled" Business. I do admit to working my Lead Mechanics pretty hard.
I held them accountable for the Critical work needed and if they slacked and didn't follow up on the work in progress?
I had NO problem in making their lives "miserable".
So for the most part I had Excellent lead mechanics and my Crews were always well run.
I can't say it was always "roses", but since I would not accept "slackers". I rarely got any and I NEVER lost a grievance about it to the Union about it either.. I din't know where this guy works but I would LOVE to know. I cannot say all the Maintenance crews were run as well as mine Nor can I say all the stations were rin as well as SFOMM was during My tenure.
But I worked with some Damn fine mechanics and Men and Women to whom I'm glad to have known and respected.

He's dead on... United is currently running the worst airline in the US of the big 3... you, if you are how you described, are an example of everything against the grain that is the new UA. You wouldn't catch me dead working for them... I have had to endure their policies far too long and couldn't be happier that I finally moved to a different division at my regional and represent a totally new mainline partner... I can't believe how different the two carriers are... Pure night and day... it was enough I deleted my app for mainline united... I will NEVER fly representing that horrid company. I do my best to make sure everyone I know also avoid flying them and giving them money... They don't value their employees or customers; they've just managed to become "too big to fail"... the US would be better without them though.... DL and AA are in totally different leagues compared to UA.
"Sonny, did we land? or were we shot down?"
 
IPFreely
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Wed Aug 12, 2015 11:08 pm

Quoting ThePinnacleKid (Reply 32):
it was enough I deleted my app for mainline united

That will show them.
 
strfyr51
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:48 am

Quoting ThePinnacleKid (Reply 32):
He's dead on... United is currently running the worst airline in the US of the big 3... you, if you are how you described, are an example of everything against the grain that is the new UA. You wouldn't catch me dead working for them... I have had to endure their policies far too long and couldn't be happier that I finally moved to a different division at my regional and represent a totally new mainline partner... I can't believe how different the two carriers are... Pure night and day... it was enough I deleted my app for mainline united... I will NEVER fly representing that horrid company. I do my best to make sure everyone I know also avoid flying them and giving them money... They don't value their employees or customers; they've just managed to become "too big to fail"... the US would be better without them though.... DL and AA are in totally different leagues compared to UA.


LOOK!
There very Well are problems with the Integration of the 2 airlines. S-CO has some VERY different operating philosophies than the old United and it worked for THEM. I DO admit we're different. VERY Different !! I don't know what was done to you but !!
I don't think it was all THAT!! Especially since I do not believe you worked FOR United.. You might have worked With somebody From United and that's a completely different Story. Especially if you're former UAX. Because that's where all the "Wannabe" management types are. Beacause the crap they tell You UAX types?? Wouldn't get to the BATHROOM at UAL.
 
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northwestEWR
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Thu Aug 13, 2015 7:40 pm

Quoting strfyr51 (Reply 34):

Strfyr51: I mean no disrespect but your posts are unreadable. Please format them. It's clear you have something interesting to contribute but I end up skipping over because they hurt my eyes.
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bohica
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Thu Aug 13, 2015 8:24 pm

Did UA think about the name for 5 seconds? United Ground Express can easily be confused with United Express which we all know are regional partners flying on behalf of UA. When I first saw the topic I thought United Ground Express was some sort of bus service being operated for United, operating to locations too close for air operations. A name like United Ground Services would be better.
 
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Polot
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Thu Aug 13, 2015 8:28 pm

Quoting bohica (Reply 36):
Did UA think about the name for 5 seconds? United Ground Express can easily be confused with United Express which we all know are regional partners flying on behalf of UA. When I first saw the topic I thought United Ground Express was some sort of bus service being operated for United, operating to locations too close for air operations. A name like United Ground Services would be better.

It really doesn't matter all that much. UA's customers will have little interaction with the name, and half of them will be on a UA Express flight anyways.
 
N1120A
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Thu Aug 13, 2015 8:28 pm

Quoting bohica (Reply 36):
Did UA think about the name for 5 seconds? United Ground Express can easily be confused with United Express which we all know are regional partners flying on behalf of UA.

I actually like the name
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
ThePinnacleKid
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Thu Aug 13, 2015 8:45 pm

Quoting IPFreely (Reply 33):

It's not about hurting them.. it's about being happy in my career... United is not a place I ever want my name associated with.

Quoting strfyr51 (Reply 34):
I DO admit we're different. VERY Different !! I don't know what was done to you but !!
I don't think it was all THAT!! Especially since I do not believe you worked FOR United..

Nope.. never worked directly for UA... Thank God! I have been in the CO/UA system though for almost 9 years and have seen the pre merger carriers, the merging process, and the carrier they morphed to (at this point). They are absolutely horrid. I have also worked for AA and DL prior to CO/UA.. and work now in one of those (AA/DL) operation... they are a VAST improvement over the UA world... it's not a knock against the employees at UA.. it's just a statement of my feelings on how they treat their employees.. their contract carriers.. their subcontractors... their customers... UA honestly doesn't deserve to be a top 3 carrier. They're absolutely pathetic.
"Sonny, did we land? or were we shot down?"
 
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RyanairGuru
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Thu Aug 13, 2015 8:56 pm

Quoting bohica (Reply 36):

Funny you should mention the bus, that was my first thought when I first saw the name a couple of days ago. It sounds like what they would call the bus from EWR-ABE.

As an aside, I'm surprised this took so long to reach Anet. I first read about it on Monday, but wasn't sure whether to believe it as their was no word on here.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
Rdh3e
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RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Thu Aug 13, 2015 9:16 pm

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 40):
As an aside, I'm surprised this took so long to reach Anet. I first read about it on Monday, but wasn't sure whether to believe it as their was no word on here.

There was a thread, but you know how the mods are. They deleted it with no explanation provided.
 
T5towbar
Posts: 444
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 2:06 am

RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Thu Aug 13, 2015 9:24 pm

Quoting maxamuus (Reply 8):
Working for United is akin to being in a abusive relationship. Is it any wonder their unions are disgruntled, they only reflect the attitudes of their members.

I disagree wholeheartedly with that statement.
We are trying our very best to make this enterprise work. People from all sides are working as one to make this work. I want to make this work, and many of us are working their hardest. Much of it without the support of management. Many of us looked at this merger like something better was coming for all and we could be a powerhouse of a airline. All of this could have been executed more properly by management by getting on top of the labor issue in the early stages of the merger. They knew it was going to be contentious and toxic with two different cultures in the mix. And some of the questionable decisions that happened during that timeframe.

It's about LEADERSHIP. They gave up on the first game plan, and went to another one. Executives coming and going...... That in itself is telling. Like Herb from WN said (I think Gordon said it as well): Take care of your employees first; which in turn will take care of your passengers; which will take care of the stakeholders. But this is the new business where shareholders come first. Even before the passengers who pays the freight. And everyone is is an inconvenience.

Quoting polot (Reply 37):
It really doesn't matter all that much. UA's customers will have little interaction with the name, and half of them will be on a UA Express flight anyways.

So true........

Quoting IPFreely (Reply 28):
Victim mentality. It's widespread in the unions at United. As much as they whine and complain about being abused and how much better other employers are, they never leave. They just stay and whine. Actions speak louder than words.

When you robbed the pensions of many who want to leave and can't, well......... What's needed is to spend some of that money on substantial out packages, and don't be chinchy on them. The stuff that was offered (except the flight attendant offer) was pathetic.
I'm not complaining or crying. I love and enjoy my job. But coming to work every day is getting tougher with nothing but bad news and negativity coming from above. That's why morale is low right now.

Quoting bohica (Reply 36):
Did UA think about the name for 5 seconds? United Ground Express can easily be confused with United Express which we all know are regional partners flying on behalf of UA. When I first saw the topic I thought United Ground Express was some sort of bus service being operated for United, operating to locations too close for air operations. A name like United Ground Services would be better

It sounds right for the new operation. The logo is funny looking though......
A comment from an Ex CON: Work Hard.....Fly Standby!
 
COSPN
Posts: 1719
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2001 6:33 am

RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Thu Aug 13, 2015 10:50 pm

How can a vendor get zed fares ?? I thought ZED fares are for OAL employees only....

Thanks for cutting my pay and flushing it down the toilet with this UGE... Starting AZO in December for Min Wages .. ??

United need to restore full Pay to the current employees.. before trying to be Delta .. Whats next for UA private Jets ?? A Oil refinery in PHL ??
 
N1120A
Posts: 26485
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Thu Aug 13, 2015 11:16 pm

Quoting COSPN (Reply 43):
How can a vendor get zed fares ?? I thought ZED fares are for OAL employees only....

The vendor is technically part of an airline.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
Rdh3e
Posts: 3483
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:09 pm

RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Thu Aug 13, 2015 11:18 pm

Quoting COSPN (Reply 43):
United need to restore full Pay to the current employees..

I'm not trying to be harsh here, but this is the new base pay. "Full pay" from the past is a pipe-dream. I know you're very invested in getting the outstations fair treatment because I see you post about it often, but it's just not in the cards.

Ultimately pay is determined by value, and having highly trained, highly skilled people earning good money at all of the outstations is not a positive value proposition. For 99% of passengers going through the outstations those skills are duplicated in the app, other channels of self help like the website, or through the res hotline. More complicated problems usually don't arise until their journey has begun, in which case a CSR at the hub can handle it.

The most value can be derived from skilled agents at the hubs and through the reservations hotline, not at outstations that won't use the full skills of the individuals who are being paid to maintain those skills without using them.

Also, I understand it's not without hardship, but every UA employee has been offered a position at another station if they want to stay with the company.
 
COSPN
Posts: 1719
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2001 6:33 am

RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Fri Aug 14, 2015 8:47 am

"Skilled "'Hub agents ?? Low paid dummies in the line stations . This attitude is why UA is way behind Delta and American.. Really sad  
 
flyDTW1992
Posts: 1051
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2015 1:04 am

RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Fri Aug 14, 2015 9:06 am

Quoting COSPN (Reply 46):
"Skilled "'Hub agents ?? Low paid dummies in the line stations . This attitude is why UA is way behind Delta and American.. Really sad  

Not sure how it really differs any from AA's Eagle agents or Delta's DGS agents when it comes down to it.
Now you're flying smart
 
COSPN
Posts: 1719
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2001 6:33 am

RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Fri Aug 14, 2015 10:09 am

Mainline DL employees here and a lounge... they get about 80 % of the valued biz traffic .. Leftovers to UA and AA .. Biz pax have more options at a line station .. Mr Businessman in EWR will be on UA .. The line stations is where DL
And WN are doing great.. AA and UA are picking up the scraps ..
 
codc10
Posts: 2439
Joined: Sat Jul 08, 2000 7:18 am

RE: UA To Launch United Ground Express

Fri Aug 14, 2015 12:05 pm

Quoting COSPN (Reply 48):

Are they all full-time DL mainline? Or part-time, DGS and Ready Reserve? DL can get away with that kind of flexibility with a non-union workforce.... Not a knock on organized labor, just certain things do not fly in a union shop that would elsewhere.

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