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kanban
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 12, 2017 12:18 am

looks like the plane was stripped and cleaned for paint and schedule changes forced a change in the paint shop, so they wrapped it to prevent contamination and having to re-clean
. no the paper is not water proof and the next rain is two weeks off.
 
CX747
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:33 am

What do we see the future holding for the 747-8F line? At this time, Air Bridge, UPS and Qatar are the only orders. Does the line continue to live on and see another day through small 2-3 aircraft orders over the next few years? Also, why at this time did Qatar buy 747-8Fs when it already had 777Fs?
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flyingclrs727
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 12, 2017 4:55 am

CX747 wrote:
What do we see the future holding for the 747-8F line? At this time, Air Bridge, UPS and Qatar are the only orders. Does the line continue to live on and see another day through small 2-3 aircraft orders over the next few years? Also, why at this time did Qatar buy 747-8Fs when it already had 777Fs?


Maybe they wanted to have the front cargo door capability.
 
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LoganTheBogan
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 12, 2017 5:34 am

As much as I dislike the 747 (yes I know, throw all the hate at me), it's kinda sad to see it hanging by a thread. Unfortunately I guess all aircraft have their use by date.
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747classic
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 12, 2017 6:16 am

According several sources : the wrapped up UPS 747-8F, N607UP, LN1542 was rolled into Paint hangar 45-04 for a media event later this week
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 12, 2017 9:40 am

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Revelation
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 12, 2017 9:50 am

747classic wrote:
According several sources : the wrapped up UPS 747-8F, N607UP, LN1542 was rolled into Paint hangar 45-04 for a media event later this week


It's pretty appropriate to deliver a UPS bird in a plain brown wrapper! :biggrin:

It'd be interesting to know how much such a "media event" is costing UPS.

And were are the odds of having enough rain-free days in KPAE to have stored it outside for at least a little while?

In any case it will be stunning. I can picture myself getting a die-cast model of it.
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AeroTyke
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 12, 2017 10:30 am

It looks far too thick to be paper. To my eyes it looks more like large pieces of blanket. I doubt that Boeing would risk the very unpredictable Seattle weather by wrapping it in brown paper, even if they only planned to have it outside for a short while. One random rain shower rolling in would've wreaked havoc on this if it is paper.

And what's with the dark grey and light green (?) on the tail? Grey isn't an UPS color and the light green is something that can be seen on the tail panels of other unpainted 747s so I'm not convinced it's actually painted underneath all that. The grey has a distinct military look to it too...

Also, why would you bother wrapping the wings and horizonal stab if it's only wrapped to hide a new customer livery? Wrapping those makes no sense at all as neither of those would have any customer paint schemes on them.

Is there any confirmation that this is a UPS frame or is it another case of the IR 777 where someone started a rumor and everyone reposted it as fact? It's clearly a freighter model from the outline but I note that Cawby has not made any mention of the frame details and the UPS bit only seems to have started in his comments section from someone concluding it's for UPS simply because the color of the paper is brown. 2+2 = 5?

Ln 1542 isn't msn 63784 either!
 
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 12, 2017 3:59 pm

I'd guess the clear triangle is the underside of the wrapping, and that the unwrapping will begin from there…
"When I find out I was wrong, I change my mind. What do you do?" -attributed to John Maynard Keynes
 
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AeroTyke
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 12, 2017 4:07 pm

Chris Edwards has posted it's confirmed for UPS and there will be a media event later this week :

https://twitter.com/AeroimagesChris/status/884985695533707264

I find it odd that there has not been any mention of this on UPS's media twitter feed which historically they have never been shy of using for unveiling events such as this. As there are many UPS employees on these forums, have any of you seen this media event mentioned on your company intranet?
 
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Stitch
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 12, 2017 4:28 pm

AeroTyke wrote:
And what's with the dark grey and light green (?) on the tail? Grey isn't an UPS color and the light green is something that can be seen on the tail panels of other unpainted 747s so I'm not convinced it's actually painted underneath all that. The grey has a distinct military look to it too...

Also, why would you bother wrapping the wings and horizonal stab if it's only wrapped to hide a new customer livery? Wrapping those makes no sense at all as neither of those would have any customer paint schemes on them.


Well maybe she's going to be painted in her new livery while in the hangar and the brown paper wrapping is just part of that - a "before" and "after".
 
mffoda
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 12, 2017 5:56 pm

747classic wrote:
According several sources : the wrapped up UPS 747-8F, N607UP, LN1542 was rolled into Paint hangar 45-04 for a media event later this week


Remember who called it first...

mffoda wrote:
Clearly UPS... What can brown do for you! :biggrin:
harder than woodpecker lips...
 
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seabosdca
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:26 pm

So the remaining three Transaero orders have been officially cancelled.

This leaves Boeing with three white tail 747-8 passenger frames: LN 1435 (the test frame not taken up by Lufthansa), LN 1519 (Transaero #1), and LN 1523 (Transaero #2). Boeing has admitted that new 747-8 passenger sales are unlikely. It seems to me like the only options are to sell the white tails to one of the three existing operators at a fire-sale price or to find additional BBJ customers. Neither is an appealing option; the existing operators have passed up many opportunities to order more, while one used 747-8 BBJ is already on the market and has had no takers for a long time.

Meanwhile, something like $400M of inventory just sits on Boeing's books.
 
Sooner787
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:36 pm

Perhaps the 3 748-8I white tails will become the new AF1's ?
 
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juliuswong
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:37 pm

seabosdca wrote:
So the remaining three Transaero orders have been officially cancelled.

This leaves Boeing with three white tail 747-8 passenger frames: LN 1435 (the test frame not taken up by Lufthansa), LN 1519 (Transaero #1), and LN 1523 (Transaero #2). Boeing has admitted that new 747-8 passenger sales are unlikely. It seems to me like the only options are to sell the white tails to one of the three existing operators at a fire-sale price or to find additional BBJ customers. Neither is an appealing option; the existing operators have passed up many opportunities to order more, while one used 747-8 BBJ is already on the market and has had no takers for a long time.

Meanwhile, something like $400M of inventory just sits on Boeing's books.

May I know how different are these three frames compared to those of current operators? Anyone has any information?
Also there are two B747-8BBJ which were not taken up by their original owners: One for Saudi Royal Family member who passed away before delivery and one for UAE Amiri Flight which did not take delivery. Are these two different again from each other? Possible to be converted to AF1? Are they stored as "empty shell" with basic interior? Appreciate any reply. Thank you.
 
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Stitch
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:46 pm

Sooner787 wrote:
Perhaps the 3 748-8I white tails will become the new AF1's ?


L/N 1495 - the NTU UAE BBJ - has been purchased by Qatar Amiri Flight per rumors.


juliuswong wrote:
May I know how different are these three frames compared to those of current operators? Anyone has any information?


L/N 1435 would have been built to LH spec, but all the mods done to it for testing mean it would be a one-off in terms of maintenance, which is why LH doesn't want it (at least at whatever price Boeing is offering). Boeing may eventually get desperate enough to fire-sale it to LH, but I tend to think they'll just part it out themselves as it will probably be worth more money.

As for the BBJs, L/N 1446 for the Saudis at least started cabin fitting, which probably makes it less-attractive to a third-party as they would be paying for someone else's probably very expensive design (considering the wealth of the original buyer). Boeing was paid for delivery so it's not their problem if it never finds a home.

I expect Boeing is actively shopping the two TransAero NTUs to other buyers (including probably Korean and Air China), but again, the frames would still be worth a fair bit as spares so that would set a floor on how cheap Boeing is willing to let them go for and is likely dampening the appeal to both current 747-8 operators and 747-400 charter operators who might be interested in them. They could end up as leased birds to charter operators, however.



The VC-25 and E-4 fleets are too specialized so they will need to be new-build frames (and the E-4 replacements will likely not be 747s and more likely 767s using the 767-2C/KC-46A platform).
 
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:27 pm

I could see one end up as the new GE test bed if no other customers pop up.
 
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AeroTyke
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:39 pm

AeroTyke wrote:
Chris Edwards has posted it's confirmed for UPS and there will be a media event later this week :

https://twitter.com/AeroimagesChris/status/884985695533707264

I find it odd that there has not been any mention of this on UPS's media twitter feed which historically they have never been shy of using for unveiling events such as this. As there are many UPS employees on these forums, have any of you seen this media event mentioned on your company intranet?


Looks like another case of IR 777 to me.

I contacted UPS via their twitter and asked about this alleged "media event".

Image
 
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Slug71
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:43 pm

Sooner787 wrote:
Perhaps the 3 748-8I white tails will become the new AF1's ?



Been discussed before. I even said the same not too long ago. Because of all the custom additions etc, the USAF pretty much requires the builds to be new. These would have to be very cheap to make all the rework worthwhile if it can even be done.
 
Geoff1947
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:52 pm

Stitch wrote:
Sooner787 wrote:
Perhaps the 3 748-8I white tails will become the new AF1's ?


L/N 1495 - the NTU UAE BBJ - has been purchased by Qatar Amiri Flight per rumors.

That was a fourth white tail.
 
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tacobell101
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Fri Jul 14, 2017 7:45 am

Well UPS posted this on their twitter

"A #UPS7478F wrapped up like a package during painting. A gift that will keep giving … 60,000 global customers at a time!"

https://twitter.com/UPSAirlines/status/ ... 6501185537

I guess its for UPS?
 
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KarelXWB
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Fri Jul 14, 2017 2:35 pm

AeroTyke wrote:
AeroTyke wrote:
Chris Edwards has posted it's confirmed for UPS and there will be a media event later this week :

https://twitter.com/AeroimagesChris/status/884985695533707264

I find it odd that there has not been any mention of this on UPS's media twitter feed which historically they have never been shy of using for unveiling events such as this. As there are many UPS employees on these forums, have any of you seen this media event mentioned on your company intranet?


Looks like another case of IR 777 to me.

I contacted UPS via their twitter and asked about this alleged "media event".

Image


If there's no media event, what's the point of wrapping up the aircraft?

At least Twitter confirms that the aircraft is indeed a 747-8F for UPS:

Image
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AeroTyke
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Fri Jul 14, 2017 5:10 pm

Ask UPS or Boeing.
 
ILNFlyer
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Fri Jul 14, 2017 5:13 pm

How many -8f does UPS have on order?
 
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Stitch
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Fri Jul 14, 2017 6:29 pm

Look at it this way - if UPS has a media event planned, would they want to blow it by saying so so some fellow on the Internet asking via Twitter?

Also, it's possible the person answering had no clue as it might not have been disseminated to all staff internally at the time.
 
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Stitch
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Fri Jul 14, 2017 6:30 pm

ILNFlyer wrote:
How many -8f does UPS have on order?


14, though some have already been built (NTUs for other freighter customers).
 
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flyingclrs727
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Fri Jul 14, 2017 7:08 pm

Slug71 wrote:
Sooner787 wrote:
Perhaps the 3 748-8I white tails will become the new AF1's ?



Been discussed before. I even said the same not too long ago. Because of all the custom additions etc, the USAF pretty much requires the builds to be new. These would have to be very cheap to make all the rework worthwhile if it can even be done.


Doesn't the work also have to have to occur under the supervision of the DOD to prevent sabotage? I was under the impression that that is why there is a separate line for the P-8. I doubt that the white tail 747-8I's would be approved based on security considerations.
 
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VirginFlyer
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Fri Jul 14, 2017 8:21 pm

flyingclrs727 wrote:
Slug71 wrote:
Sooner787 wrote:
Perhaps the 3 748-8I white tails will become the new AF1's ?



Been discussed before. I even said the same not too long ago. Because of all the custom additions etc, the USAF pretty much requires the builds to be new. These would have to be very cheap to make all the rework worthwhile if it can even be done.


Doesn't the work also have to have to occur under the supervision of the DOD to prevent sabotage? I was under the impression that that is why there is a separate line for the P-8. I doubt that the white tail 747-8I's would be approved based on security considerations.

The separate line for the P-8 is not about sabotage, but to comply with the requirements of the International Traffic in Arms Regulations (ITAR) (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internati ... egulations )

I'm not sure if presidential transport aircraft would fall under the provisions of ITAR.

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AeroTyke
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Fri Jul 14, 2017 11:57 pm

Stitch wrote:
Look at it this way - if UPS has a media event planned, would they want to blow it by saying so so some fellow on the Internet asking via Twitter?

Also, it's possible the person answering had no clue as it might not have been disseminated to all staff internally at the time.


Well Chris it's 5pm. Please post a link to the media event that self-appointed experts claimed would be happening by the end of the week. I look forward to seeing what it was about. Thanks. :)
 
N837MH
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Tue Jul 18, 2017 12:57 pm

HL7644 is delivery at July 31st. Also, Arrive at August 1st. Flight Number is KAL028D, Route is KPAE-RKSI. Thank you.
 
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metalinyoni
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Tue Jul 18, 2017 1:55 pm

Could the three white tails be the first 747-8 BCF's? Or is it cheaper to build the freighters from scratch?
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flyingclrs727
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Tue Jul 18, 2017 2:57 pm

metalinyoni wrote:
Could the three white tails be the first 747-8 BCF's? Or is it cheaper to build the freighters from scratch?


Considering what a flop the 747-400 BCF program was, it's quite possible there will never be a BCF program for the 747-8I.
 
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:06 pm

 
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ER757
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:15 pm

sadiqutp wrote:

Looks like a revised Livery - will be interesting to see the rest of the aircraft to see what other elements may have gotten a tweak
 
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Stitch
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:17 pm

The current UPS livery looks awesome on a 747 airframe, IMO, so I hope it did not change too much.
 
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DABYT
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:31 pm

sadiqutp wrote:


What part of the Fuselage is that? I don't understand what part of the aircraft is shown in the picture. On the current livery i don't see any UPS logo except the big one on the vertical stabilizer. Is it the nose we see in the picture?
 
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flyingclrs727
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:41 pm

Momo1435 wrote:
I could see one end up as the new GE test bed if no other customers pop up.


Perhaps the one that LH refused to take.
 
dennys
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:45 pm

Sorry : NO hope for a 747-8i AIR FORCE ONE ?
 
Sooner787
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:55 pm

DABYT wrote:
sadiqutp wrote:


What part of the Fuselage is that? I don't understand what part of the aircraft is shown in the picture. On the current livery i don't see any UPS logo except the big one on the vertical stabilizer. Is it the nose we see in the picture?


That's the base of the moving nose door.

I've seen several freight airlines put logos there, including Cargolux :)
 
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Stitch
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:59 pm

dennys wrote:
Sorry : NO hope for a 747-8i AIR FORCE ONE ?


The 747-8 Intercontinental has already been selected as the base frame for the next AF1.
 
HOOB747
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:21 pm

Stitch, do you know if the new AF1 will be the passenger or freighter upper deck configuration?
I love dem planes....
 
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Stitch
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:23 pm

HOOB747 wrote:
Stitch, do you know if the new AF1 will be the passenger or freighter upper deck configuration?


It will be the passenger model.
 
Virginblue4
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:45 pm

This is the image used by Boeing when UPS placed their order. So it looks like the logo will be on the nose.

http://www.boeing.com/resources/boeingd ... 60x600.jpg
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DABYT
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:47 pm

Sooner787 wrote:
DABYT wrote:
sadiqutp wrote:


What part of the Fuselage is that? I don't understand what part of the aircraft is shown in the picture. On the current livery i don't see any UPS logo except the big one on the vertical stabilizer. Is it the nose we see in the picture?


That's the base of the moving nose door.

I've seen several freight airlines put logos there, including Cargolux :)


Yes, thanks, you're right. Meanwhile i've checked some pictures of the UPS fleet in service and some have the logo on the nose door, some don't.
 
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maortega15
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 11:05 pm

Just curious if AF1 will/should get a new livery.
 
Ammad
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Wed Jul 19, 2017 11:27 pm

Boeing's 747 jumbo passenger plane is on the way out
It sure looks that way for the original jumbo jetliner. Once the largest passenger plane on Earth, the 747 has defined the company more than any other.
Boeing (BA) earlier this month flew a 747-8 Intercontinental back to the company's base in Washington state from a paint shop in Portland. It was wearing the colors of Korean Air Lines and it is extremely likely that it is the last passenger 747 to ever be built.
http://money.cnn.com/2017/07/19/news/co ... o-jetliner
 
rmp1kxk
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Thu Jul 20, 2017 1:46 am

DABYT wrote:
Sooner787 wrote:
DABYT wrote:

What part of the Fuselage is that? I don't understand what part of the aircraft is shown in the picture. On the current livery i don't see any UPS logo except the big one on the vertical stabilizer. Is it the nose we see in the picture?


That's the base of the moving nose door.

I've seen several freight airlines put logos there, including Cargolux :)


Yes, thanks, you're right. Meanwhile i've checked some pictures of the UPS fleet in service and some have the logo on the nose door, some don't.


The livery will be the same one that is currently being applied to all aircraft, just Worldwide Services on the side and the UPS logo on the tail solid yellow. The only planes in the fleet that have a nose logo like the picture above has are the 11 744F's. The 2 744BCF's do not have it. The reason for this logo is for when the nose is open and you loading special shipments like pandas or whales, you can get a nice picture with the logo in it. The 748's will all get the nose logo as well since the nose door opens.

Here is a picture of the livery on N572UP, what will be painted on the 748's
Image

And what the shield looks like with the door open, see how it can be good promotion placement.
Image
 
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KarelXWB
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Thu Jul 20, 2017 3:56 pm

What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
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kanban
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:23 pm

Boeing sales page today (7/20) shows two new sales for 747s.... customer unidentified.
 
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Stitch
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Re: Official 747-8 Flight Tracking/Production Part 18

Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:26 pm

kanban wrote:
Boeing sales page today (7/20) shows two new sales for 747s.... customer unidentified.


Bloomberg(?) said Qatar Cargo was going to order/operate two 747-8F so these may be it.

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