Fargo
Topic Author
Posts: 707
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:00 am

San Antonio Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 14, 2019 10:00 pm

SAT is an airport that rarely gets talked about here, often getting overshadowed by in-state rivals DFW, IAH and AUS. I thought I'd start a thread to discuss all things SAT.

I'll start with a few lingering questions I have.

A. What can realistically be expected as far as air service growth at SAT?

B. Related to the above, is TATL service a no-go for the foreseeable future?

C. What do you think of the ongoing expansion proposals? For some info, see the following article

https://www.expressnews.com/business/local/article/A-San-Antonio-airport-expansion-could-require-200-13349694.php
 
jplatts
Posts: 2454
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: San Antonio Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 14, 2019 10:28 pm

Fargo wrote:
A. What can realistically be expected as far as air service growth at SAT?


The lack of SAT-BOS, SAT-RDU, and SAT-SMF nonstop service are three of the biggest holes out of SAT, and WN could add nonstop service to BOS, RDU, and SMF out of SAT.

DL could bring back SAT-CVG nonstop service and add SAT-BOS, SAT-RDU, and SAT-SEA nonstop service. While SAT-BOS and SAT-SEA would require mainline, DL could use A220's on SAT-BOS and SAT-SEA nonstop routes.

B6 adding SAT-BOS nonstop service is a possibility if DL or WN doesn't add SAT-BOS nonstop service. B6 adding SAT-FLL and/or SAT-JFK nonstop service are also possibilities if B6 adds service to SAT.
 
FlyingSicilian
Posts: 1610
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2009 7:53 pm

Re: San Antonio Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 14, 2019 10:44 pm

Maybe a one-off seasonal TATL could happen but SAT bleeds to AUS and IAH for many TATL flights via driving and connecting.

SAT also has competition from the USAF in daily full Space A flights that carry several hundred worldwide, who then are not using SAT. Does not sound like much but it can add up.

That said, the growth jplatts noted domestically is certainly possible and probably IMO.
“Without seeing Sicily it is impossible to understand Italy.Sicily is the key of everything.”-Goethe "Journey to Italy"
 
Fargo
Topic Author
Posts: 707
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:00 am

Re: San Antonio Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 14, 2019 11:12 pm

jplatts wrote:
Fargo wrote:
A. What can realistically be expected as far as air service growth at SAT?


The lack of SAT-BOS, SAT-RDU, and SAT-SMF nonstop service are three of the biggest holes out of SAT, and WN could add nonstop service to BOS, RDU, and SMF out of SAT.

DL could bring back SAT-CVG nonstop service and add SAT-BOS, SAT-RDU, and SAT-SEA nonstop service. While SAT-BOS and SAT-SEA would require mainline, DL could use A220's on SAT-BOS and SAT-SEA nonstop routes.

B6 adding SAT-BOS nonstop service is a possibility if DL or WN doesn't add SAT-BOS nonstop service. B6 adding SAT-FLL and/or SAT-JFK nonstop service are also possibilities if B6 adds service to SAT.


My guess is WN will be the one to add most of the service you suggested. Honestly, I'm genuinely surprised WN isn't bigger at SAT.

I would also think NK entering the market is a strong possibility as well.
 
picarus
Posts: 325
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2000 6:51 am

Re: San Antonio Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 14, 2019 11:16 pm

I'm still bumming from AC withdrawal of service to YYZ--the most convenient option from SAT to central and eastern Canada. As someone who travels for leisure to Quebec a couple of time per year, I'llmiss the sheer simplicity of arriving at my final destination of YOW or YUL as a domestic pax. That said, SA is a tough market for international (other than Mexico) IMHO because the demographics don't support it. We blew our chance at Canada, I highly doubt any European carrier will take the risk.
 
Fargo
Topic Author
Posts: 707
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:00 am

Re: San Antonio Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 14, 2019 11:17 pm

FlyingSicilian wrote:
Maybe a one-off seasonal TATL could happen but SAT bleeds to AUS and IAH for many TATL flights via driving and connecting.


I agree AUS is making things difficult for SAT to land new flights (TATL or otherwise).

If the LCC TATL operators weren't so unstable, I'd say an airline like DY would be a good fit for SAT, but I don't expect it anytime soon.
 
Fargo
Topic Author
Posts: 707
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:00 am

Re: San Antonio Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 14, 2019 11:18 pm

picarus wrote:
I'm still bumming from AC withdrawal of service to YYZ--the most convenient option from SAT to central and eastern Canada. As someone who travels for leisure to Quebec a couple of time per year, I'llmiss the sheer simplicity of arriving at my final destination of YOW or YUL as a domestic pax. That said, SA is a tough market for international (other than Mexico) IMHO because the demographics don't support it. We blew our chance at Canada, I highly doubt any European carrier will take the risk.


What happened here? How could AC not make SAT-YYZ work?
 
notdownnlocked
Posts: 980
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2000 1:45 pm

Re: San Antonio Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 14, 2019 11:38 pm

jplatts wrote:
Fargo wrote:
A. What can realistically be expected as far as air service growth at SAT?


The lack of SAT-BOS, SAT-RDU, and SAT-SMF nonstop service are three of the biggest holes out of SAT, and WN could add nonstop service to BOS, RDU, and SMF out of SAT.

DL could bring back SAT-CVG nonstop service and add SAT-BOS, SAT-RDU, and SAT-SEA nonstop service. While SAT-BOS and SAT-SEA would require mainline, DL could use A220's on SAT-BOS and SAT-SEA nonstop routes.

B6 adding SAT-BOS nonstop service is a possibility if DL or WN doesn't add SAT-BOS nonstop service. B6 adding SAT-FLL and/or SAT-JFK nonstop service are also
possibilities if B6 adds service to SAT.


jplatts wrote:
Fargo wrote:
A. What can realistically be expected as far as air service growth at SAT?


The lack of SAT-BOS, SAT-RDU, and SAT-SMF nonstop service are three of the biggest holes out of SAT, and WN could add nonstop service to BOS, RDU, and SMF out of SAT.

DL could bring back SAT-CVG nonstop service and add SAT-BOS, SAT-RDU, and SAT-SEA nonstop service. While SAT-BOS and SAT-SEA would require mainline, DL could use A220's on SAT-BOS and SAT-SEA nonstop routes.

B6 adding SAT-BOS nonstop service is a possibility if DL or WN doesn't add SAT-BOS nonstop service. B6 adding SAT-FLL and/or SAT-JFK nonstop service are also possibilities if B6 adds service to SAT.



Is it possible to say nonstop service twice in a single sentence. Yes it is. Now let’s see if we can say nonstop service three times in a single sentence. About 99.999 percent of users here have the ability to infer that if WN is going to fly SAT-AUS or SAT-DAL it is understood to be nonstop. No need to type SAT-AUS nonstop service and SAT-DAL nonstop service. We know who the post author is without reading the name. It is a long and difficult read.
 
B1168
Posts: 469
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2018 10:26 pm

Re: San Antonio Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 14, 2019 11:38 pm

Fargo wrote:
FlyingSicilian wrote:
Maybe a one-off seasonal TATL could happen but SAT bleeds to AUS and IAH for many TATL flights via driving and connecting.


I agree AUS is making things difficult for SAT to land new flights (TATL or otherwise).

If the LCC TATL operators weren't so unstable, I'd say an airline like DY would be a good fit for SAT, but I don't expect it anytime soon.


Yes, until DY or other similar airlines get plane smaller than 788 capable of such flights, there is pretty much no incentive to fly TATL to SAT.
 
User avatar
flyingclrs727
Posts: 2295
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:44 am

Re: San Antonio Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed May 15, 2019 12:01 am

FlyingSicilian wrote:
Maybe a one-off seasonal TATL could happen but SAT bleeds to AUS and IAH for many TATL flights via driving and connecting.

SAT also has competition from the USAF in daily full Space A flights that carry several hundred worldwide, who then are not using SAT. Does not sound like much but it can add up.

That said, the growth jplatts noted domestically is certainly possible and probably IMO.



Doesn't SAT have a rather short runway for a transatlantic flights? Anyway by driving just 70 miles on I-35, one can already catch transatlantic flights.
 
sprxUSA
Posts: 187
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2004 5:17 am

Re: San Antonio Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed May 15, 2019 12:01 am

Having lived in San Antonio for two years and wieked at SAT, here is what I think. Even though they beat it like a dead horse as beingvthe "7th largest city in the US", no one cares. Being big doesn't equate to worthwhile new air service that they seem to think they deserve. Area can barely make the Mexico flights work, so IMO never will a TATL flight depart from SAT. Even NK couldn't make SAT a go few years ago. What they have is adequate for what the local populace requires. Plus with airport hemned in, 8000 foot runways make a TATL that much more difficult, esp on a hit Texas summer day. Best thing about working there was seeing some of the intl diverts from DFW when wx went to pot.
Gem State Airlines..."we have a gem of an airline"
 
picarus
Posts: 325
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2000 6:51 am

Re: San Antonio Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed May 15, 2019 12:04 am

Fargo wrote:
picarus wrote:
I'm still bumming from AC withdrawal of service to YYZ--the most convenient option from SAT to central and eastern Canada. As someone who travels for leisure to Quebec a couple of time per year, I'llmiss the sheer simplicity of arriving at my final destination of YOW or YUL as a domestic pax. That said, SA is a tough market for international (other than Mexico) IMHO because the demographics don't support it. We blew our chance at Canada, I highly doubt any European carrier will take the risk.


What happened here? How could AC not make SAT-YYZ work?


I don’t have any insight into the financials, but I honestly don’t blame AC. It was a valiant attempt to open the market up, but after two years and a schedule change I’m guessing enough people simply didn’t take advantage of it. Use it or lose it. Glad we had it while we did.
 
Fargo
Topic Author
Posts: 707
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:00 am

Re: San Antonio Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed May 15, 2019 12:26 am

picarus wrote:
Fargo wrote:
picarus wrote:
I'm still bumming from AC withdrawal of service to YYZ--the most convenient option from SAT to central and eastern Canada. As someone who travels for leisure to Quebec a couple of time per year, I'llmiss the sheer simplicity of arriving at my final destination of YOW or YUL as a domestic pax. That said, SA is a tough market for international (other than Mexico) IMHO because the demographics don't support it. We blew our chance at Canada, I highly doubt any European carrier will take the risk.


What happened here? How could AC not make SAT-YYZ work?


I don’t have any insight into the financials, but I honestly don’t blame AC. It was a valiant attempt to open the market up, but after two years and a schedule change I’m guessing enough people simply didn’t take advantage of it. Use it or lose it. Glad we had it while we did.


You'd think in a city the size of SAT, even though it isn't as big of a business market as AUS, there'd be enough business ties to Toronto to make a flight work. I guess not. Definitely doesn't bode well for TATL chances.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos