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enilria
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TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 2:38 pm

I don’t see how this is possible technically, but the millimeter wave machine “can’t read black hairstyles”. What reading is there? Isn’t it just looking for metal or something? Is it identifying your organs? Why does it need to “read hairstyles”? This sounds very odd.

—-The futuristic full-body scanners that have become standard at airports across the United States are prone to false alarms for hairstyles popular among women of color.

—-The TSA would not say if it had ever found a weapon in a passenger’s hair. Its website says: “You’d be surprised what can be hidden in hair. The most notable things we’re looking for in hair are explosives and improvised explosives device components.”

What a joke...security theater.

https://www.propublica.org/article/tsa- ... s-might-be
 
planecane
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 2:57 pm

Yes, the TSA is a joke and is mostly putting on security theatre but to try and make scanner alarms into a racist thing is beyond ridiculous. I'm a white male and have had countless pat downs due to false alarms. I don't "feel singled out" because of it. I just laugh at how it happens so often.
 
musman9853
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 2:57 pm

as a muslim guy, i always can't wait for those random searches!
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HBJZA
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:02 pm

musman9853 wrote:
as a muslim guy, i always can't wait for those random searches!

What do you mean? As I understand muslim is not an ethnicity!
 
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sudenmorsian
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:09 pm

HBJZA wrote:
musman9853 wrote:
as a muslim guy, i always can't wait for those random searches!

What do you mean? As I understand muslim is not an ethnicity!

It’s a good thing you caught that otherwise no one would know what they meant
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ual763
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:10 pm

I’m sure someone on here will try equating this statement to racism, but anyways a lot of the elaborate hairdos that are traditionally seen as of African descent, have to be held up somehow. People’s hair doesn’t just sit like that. There are a LOT of pins and other accessories holding all of that hair up. It’s no wonder the machine flags it.
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Cubsrule
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:14 pm

enilria wrote:
I don’t see how this is possible technically, but the millimeter wave machine “can’t read black hairstyles”. What reading is there? Isn’t it just looking for metal or something? Is it identifying your organs? Why does it need to “read hairstyles”? This sounds very odd.


As the article points out, it’s not an issue of “black hairstyles” per se. The scanners struggle with large quantities of dense hair. Based on the typical ways folks wear their hair, black women are overrepresented in that group. But plenty of white women, and presumably some men, have trouble too.
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Jetty
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:16 pm

enilria wrote:
I don’t see how this is possible technically, but the millimeter wave machine “can’t read black hairstyles”. What reading is there? Isn’t it just looking for metal or something? Is it identifying your organs? Why does it need to “read hairstyles”? This sounds very odd.

It can read ‘black hairstyles’, but more black woman wear a wig and those hairstyles are different in that they are more voluminous. Both make it easier to hide an object. Thus extra screening is warranted. Not racism, just rational behavior explainable by objective race-neutral criteria.
 
ME720
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:21 pm

musman9853 wrote:
as a muslim guy, i always can't wait for those random searches!


OH yes I can confirm from my own experiences. Racist to the bone, or metal. I have been 8 times to the US and every single time random check.. wish I had that luck with the lottery, I would have been a
Billionaire by now. Random my A_ _ .
 
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kordcj
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:31 pm

I have TSA precheck and I get flagged going thru the regular metal detectors for a “random” enhanced screening over 50% of the time. If I have a full on beard, it’s 100% of the time. I fly every week, and I’m convinced someone triggers that random screening alarm on the detectors.
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airbazar
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:35 pm

ME720 wrote:
musman9853 wrote:
as a muslim guy, i always can't wait for those random searches!


OH yes I can confirm from my own experiences. Racist to the bone, or metal. I have been 8 times to the US and every single time random check.. wish I had that luck with the lottery, I would have been a
Billionaire by now. Random my A_ _ .


It's not random because it's not supposed to be (despite what they may say). "Random" is a waste of money and everyone knows it. That's true whether we're securing an airport or a computer. But if you think you're being singled out because of your religion I think you're wrong. I'd guess your country of origin or name might have a lot more to do with it.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:40 pm

ME720 wrote:
musman9853 wrote:
as a muslim guy, i always can't wait for those random searches!


OH yes I can confirm from my own experiences. Racist to the bone, or metal. I have been 8 times to the US and every single time random check.. wish I had that luck with the lottery, I would have been a
Billionaire by now. Random my A_ _ .

I get pulled aside for many random checks too. A very disproportionate share so the statistics match. Meh.. It doesn't take much time. My dog likes the extra attention.

The only time I saw the TSA discriminate was their random check of a female college volleyball team. But hey, I wanted to spend time with those ladies!

Lightsaber
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Jetty
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 4:36 pm

kordcj wrote:
I have TSA precheck and I get flagged going thru the regular metal detectors for a “random” enhanced screening over 50% of the time. If I have a full on beard, it’s 100% of the time. I fly every week, and I’m convinced someone triggers that random screening alarm on the detectors.

Makes complete sense: your full beard allows the hiding of objects thus more reason for an enhanced screaning just as with the black woman in this article.
 
danman132x
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 4:48 pm

As an xray tech, I can confirm these hairstyles, long thick dread like structures and nests on top of the head obscure the image quite a bit. If they cause artifacts on the image, I can guarantee these millimeter waves don't penetrate deep into the hair and stuff could easily be hidden inside. There are also numerous clips holding them in place most of the time.
 
MalevTU134
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 4:54 pm

danman132x wrote:
As an xray tech, I can confirm these hairstyles, long thick dread like structures and nests on top of the head obscure the image quite a bit. If they cause artifacts on the image, I can guarantee these millimeter waves don't penetrate deep into the hair and stuff could easily be hidden inside. There are also numerous clips holding them in place most of the time.

Do body piercings increase your probability to get extra screened as well?
 
WayexTDI
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 5:02 pm

The millimetric wave scanner detect drastic changes in density; I've been flagged a few times for wearing a backpack over a cotton shirt, the back of my shirt was full of sweat and showed weird on the scanner.

As others have said, certain hairstyles (especially with fake or added hair, or with hair tightly braided together) will send the same signal. Live with it, change hair style or don't take the plane; it's that simple. And, honestly, "living with it" is not that complicated...
 
anshabhi
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 5:09 pm

danman132x wrote:
As an xray tech, I can confirm these hairstyles, long thick dread like structures and nests on top of the head obscure the image quite a bit. If they cause artifacts on the image, I can guarantee these millimeter waves don't penetrate deep into the hair and stuff could easily be hidden inside. There are also numerous clips holding them in place most of the time.

What about Sikhs who wear Turbans? The machines would be going crazy after them!!
 
Adipocere
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 5:11 pm

If mmwave cant penetrate dense hair or clothing why not just give the monitoring agent a targeted gun shooting a slightly longer wavelength radiation to get through the barrier? Nothing can be said and will be quieter experience for the traveler too.
 
77H
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 5:27 pm

To add to this, some hair styles are not just done up with pins but with hair products. I have been patted down numerous time after arriving to checkpoints sweaty from running to catch a flight. I cut it close more often than I should. The machines have “flagged” my under arms, back, collar due to moisture. Would stand to reason that hair styles using large amount of hair products would get flagged too.

While not a contemporary hair style any longer, think of Michael Jackson’s Jerry Curl. Hell, he had so many hair products in his hair it caught fire.

77H
 
ual763
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 5:28 pm

Adipocere wrote:
If mmwave cant penetrate dense hair or clothing why not just give the monitoring agent a targeted gun shooting a slightly longer wavelength radiation to get through the barrier? Nothing can be said and will be quieter experience for the traveler too.


Because then it would lose it's ability to pick up something abnormal, rendering the machine useless. I'm not an expert on radiation, however, so maybe I'm wrong.
From flying to the NOTAM office
 
Boomj
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 5:52 pm

Millimeter wave technology uses sound waves to detect anomalies, not radiation.

The systems are measuring the moisture coming off human skin and running it through a series of algorithms. The algorithms are tuned to know people generally wear pants in the winter, wedding rings, etc and adjust the moisture reading accordingly. You’ll also notice they select male or female as the algorithms are different for each sex. These algorithms are not perfect but constantly improve.
 
tsbooker
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 5:55 pm

Couple of thoughts here.
- Given the opportunity, racism, among any race, can and will be brought up whenever convenient.
- The TSA (Thousands Standing Around) is a total and complete joke. While the generalization certainly does not apply to all employees, many of these minimally paid, uneducated people, stand around wearing their dumb badges and think they are ruling the airport if not the world.
- I have literally gone through TSA screening twice on the same day, carrying the exact same items, and one time walked right through while the second time received secondary screening of my personal belongings.
- Most importantly, as others have stated before, the TSA is a dog and pony show. As statistics show, if a bad person tries enough times, they will manage to get whatever they want past TSA. It is just a fact, and maybe not to be entirely blamed on TSA, but no security system is 100% effective.

And yes, I thoroughly and completely hate the TSA. Government waste at its finest.
 
musman9853
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 5:59 pm

lightsaber wrote:
ME720 wrote:
musman9853 wrote:
as a muslim guy, i always can't wait for those random searches!


OH yes I can confirm from my own experiences. Racist to the bone, or metal. I have been 8 times to the US and every single time random check.. wish I had that luck with the lottery, I would have been a
Billionaire by now. Random my A_ _ .

I get pulled aside for many random checks too. A very disproportionate share so the statistics match. Meh.. It doesn't take much time. My dog likes the extra attention.

The only time I saw the TSA discriminate was their random check of a female college volleyball team. But hey, I wanted to spend time with those ladies!

Lightsaber


the really dumb part of all this is that i have clear and global entry so i pretty much dont have to worry about that now. so if youre a threat just apying a few hundred can basically exempt you from a ton of security
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gustywinds
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 7:38 pm

So the alternative to security screening is no screening of passengers at all? Is that what some of you are proposing? I think people love to bash the TSA but screening must happen most everywhere you fly around the world. It seems the complainers rarely offer an alternative solution to the need for screening.
 
mham001
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 7:49 pm

tsbooker wrote:
As statistics show, if a bad person tries enough times, they will manage to get whatever they want past TSA. It is just a fact, and maybe not to be entirely blamed on TSA, but no security system is 100% effective.


I'd be asking why a person who tries enough times to get something through was still free to keep trying.
 
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stl07
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 8:20 pm

Jetty wrote:
kordcj wrote:
I have TSA precheck and I get flagged going thru the regular metal detectors for a “random” enhanced screening over 50% of the time. If I have a full on beard, it’s 100% of the time. I fly every week, and I’m convinced someone triggers that random screening alarm on the detectors.

Makes complete sense: your full beard allows the hiding of objects thus more reason for an enhanced screaning just as with the black woman in this article.

Stop trying to rationalize everything. Both you and I know why he is getting a "random check"
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DL747400
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 9:37 pm

stl07 wrote:
Stop trying to rationalize everything. Both you and I know why he is getting a "random check"


Thank you! Glad someone finally said what everyone else was thinking. :checkmark:
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kingcavalier
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 9:38 pm

I know I’d rather get on a plane that has been screened that to get on one that hasn’t. I’ve never had an issue with the TSA and think they do a pretty good job with everything that’s asked. I get more frustrated when I get behind passengers who don’t know what they’re doing. The liquid ban has been in place since 2006 and people still leave water bottles in their carry-on bag.

I think as we get farther away from 9/11 people forget why we do what we do now to get on a plane. We’ve had airport security since the early 70’s. This article provides a good timeline of what has happened since then -

https://www.thrillist.com/amphtml/trave ... of-the-tsa

Some call it security theater but I find some level of comfort in knowing checked bags underneath my plane have been screened for explosives and that thousands of weapons are confiscated at checkpoints.

https://amp.usatoday.com/amp/2799757002
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Judge1310
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 10:26 pm

Whew chile...the people are *triggered* lol
I love how some folks who have *nothing* to do with certain topics get triggered when such topics are raised. As if *everything* has something to do with them. From the scheduling practises of FAs to how certain hair styles *may* set off alarms...
 
speedbird52
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 10:48 pm

airbazar wrote:
ME720 wrote:
musman9853 wrote:
as a muslim guy, i always can't wait for those random searches!


OH yes I can confirm from my own experiences. Racist to the bone, or metal. I have been 8 times to the US and every single time random check.. wish I had that luck with the lottery, I would have been a
Billionaire by now. Random my A_ _ .


It's not random because it's not supposed to be (despite what they may say). "Random" is a waste of money and everyone knows it. That's true whether we're securing an airport or a computer. But if you think you're being singled out because of your religion I think you're wrong. I'd guess your country of origin or name might have a lot more to do with it.

Right, and generally that name is an indication of his religion.
 
TMccrury
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sat Apr 20, 2019 11:09 pm

I don't usually get pulled for stuff on me, however, they generally do a secondary screen of my carry on due to various mic's and things I travel with for my job. Back last year though, I got pulled for a full secondary because I set off the detector for GSR. As it turns out, I had worked in the yard the day prior and spilled a little gasoline on my shoes and despite a shower and good scrubbing of my hands there was residue. That was interesting. They kept asking me about weapons etc.
 
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Jouhou
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:36 am

WayexTDI wrote:
The millimetric wave scanner detect drastic changes in density; I've been flagged a few times for wearing a backpack over a cotton shirt, the back of my shirt was full of sweat and showed weird on the scanner.

As others have said, certain hairstyles (especially with fake or added hair, or with hair tightly braided together) will send the same signal. Live with it, change hair style or don't take the plane; it's that simple. And, honestly, "living with it" is not that complicated...


I dunno, airport security and increasing discomfort on planes has made me stop flying unless I absolutely have to.

Many of us are not "living with it". When has this enhanced security actually prevented something bad from happening? Never?
 
WayexTDI
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 1:02 am

Jouhou wrote:
WayexTDI wrote:
The millimetric wave scanner detect drastic changes in density; I've been flagged a few times for wearing a backpack over a cotton shirt, the back of my shirt was full of sweat and showed weird on the scanner.

As others have said, certain hairstyles (especially with fake or added hair, or with hair tightly braided together) will send the same signal. Live with it, change hair style or don't take the plane; it's that simple. And, honestly, "living with it" is not that complicated...


I dunno, airport security and increasing discomfort on planes has made me stop flying unless I absolutely have to.

Many of us are not "living with it". When has this enhanced security actually prevented something bad from happening? Never?

I do not necessarily agree with the "rules" of TSA checks (which, weirdly, are not 100% the same throughout the US... but that's another story); but, if you feel they are unnecessary, why don't you write to your elected official? People keep complaining about how much a waste of money the TSA is, but they do nothing: they do not contact their elected official (which is representing them), they do not go to vote, etc.

As far as discomfort on planes, it's been beaten to death on here and rightfully so: the vast majority of passengers have voted with their wallet to get cheaper fares, and chose cheap tighter seats vs more expensive more comfortable seats. That's why airlines like Spirit have been "allowed" (by the market itself) to exist.

You might be the exception to the rule; unfortunately, for most, it's easier to whine and complain instead of doing something.
 
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kitplane01
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:03 am

planecane wrote:
Yes, the TSA is a joke and is mostly putting on security theatre but to try and make scanner alarms into a racist thing is beyond ridiculous. I'm a white male and have had countless pat downs due to false alarms. I don't "feel singled out" because of it. I just laugh at how it happens so often.


So you've been checked. But if other people are getting checked more because of their race .... that's at least an interesting thing to enquirer about. But the "white men also get sometimes checked" is not a logical argument.

And I don't see how you can know if it happens to you more or less frequently that other groups unless you've spent a serious amount of time with a clip board gathering statistical data, and put that data through analysis to compute likelihoods and error bars.
 
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kitplane01
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:06 am

Adipocere wrote:
If mmwave cant penetrate dense hair or clothing why not just give the monitoring agent a targeted gun shooting a slightly longer wavelength radiation to get through the barrier? Nothing can be said and will be quieter experience for the traveler too.


Just guessing but

- The emitters and receivers are tuned to one frequency. The ability to vary frequency would cost more $$$
- Higher frequencies reveal more detail, but penetrate less. Probably a "slightly longer frequency" would not help. And a much longer frequency ... There is a trade-off.
- The devices have been medically cleared for one frequency, and not others.
 
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kitplane01
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:07 am

Boomj wrote:
Millimeter wave technology uses sound waves to detect anomalies, not radiation.


Because "millimeter waves" are a radio wave, and not a sound wave. They don't use sound at all. Seriously.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millimeter_wave_scanner
 
planecane
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:15 am

kitplane01 wrote:
planecane wrote:
Yes, the TSA is a joke and is mostly putting on security theatre but to try and make scanner alarms into a racist thing is beyond ridiculous. I'm a white male and have had countless pat downs due to false alarms. I don't "feel singled out" because of it. I just laugh at how it happens so often.


So you've been checked. But if other people are getting checked more because of their race .... that's at least an interesting thing to enquirer about. But the "white men also get sometimes checked" is not a logical argument.

And I don't see how you can know if it happens to you more or less frequently that other groups unless you've spent a serious amount of time with a clip board gathering statistical data, and put that data through analysis to compute likelihoods and error bars.

Before I had precheck I would get a pat down after a body scan about half the time. I never had anything on me or in my pocket.

Last year, with precheck, I went through a period where I got the random beep 75% of the time over 9 or 10 round trips.

I can say without taking data that I've personally been screened more than average.
 
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kitplane01
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:20 am

planecane wrote:
kitplane01 wrote:
planecane wrote:
Yes, the TSA is a joke and is mostly putting on security theatre but to try and make scanner alarms into a racist thing is beyond ridiculous. I'm a white male and have had countless pat downs due to false alarms. I don't "feel singled out" because of it. I just laugh at how it happens so often.


So you've been checked. But if other people are getting checked more because of their race .... that's at least an interesting thing to enquirer about. But the "white men also get sometimes checked" is not a logical argument.

And I don't see how you can know if it happens to you more or less frequently that other groups unless you've spent a serious amount of time with a clip board gathering statistical data, and put that data through analysis to compute likelihoods and error bars.

Before I had precheck I would get a pat down after a body scan about half the time. I never had anything on me or in my pocket.

Last year, with precheck, I went through a period where I got the random beep 75% of the time over 9 or 10 round trips.

I can say without taking data that I've personally been screened more than average.


But that doesn't reply to the claim. The claim was not "no white man gets screened a lot". Maybe something about you triggers the TSA (and if so I'm sorry). It was about the average white man, and the average black woman. Really, what you wrote is not evidence for or against the original claim.
 
robsaw
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:35 am

planecane wrote:
Yes, the TSA is a joke and is mostly putting on security theatre but to try and make scanner alarms into a racist thing is beyond ridiculous. I'm a white male and have had countless pat downs due to false alarms. I don't "feel singled out" because of it. I just laugh at how it happens so often.


A black woman makes an observation that she is subject to enhanced screening at a rate that seems to be unreasonably frequent. Given no other extenuating factors, assuming a racist motivation isn't illogical even if it is based upon errors in assumption.

The article confirms, that the technology is in fact subject to over-identifying black women for extra screening because their hair density and typical hair styles have a higher probability of raising false alarms.

As the article states, the technology is effectively biased and thus it isn't unfair to characterize it is "racist" in a rather impersonal and purely accidental manner.

As a "white male" neither your nor I likely have any personal experience to qualify personal anecdotes and their relevance to being singled-out on the basis of race.
 
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spinkid
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:27 am

I'm not sure who wins the award in this thread for being singled out more than anyone else. You should all think about the fact you fly very often. That increases your chances of getting searched right there.

As for the original topic. As several have mentioned, it makes complete sense. African and African American hairstyles are very different from other races. Hopefully everyone is aware of the rule of never touching a black woman's hair, even asking is rude. That being said, thicker braids, wigs, added extensions can obscure the scanner. A better way of combating this problem is educating people.
Posters that explain the process, targeting that specific audience in advance. That way, when women of color arrive at the airport they can choose to style their hair differently for a flight, or prepare for an extra search.

If TSA engaged with people humanely instead of barking orders they would get much more cooperation.
 
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Veigar
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 4:08 am

LAX and ATL have the dumbest security. False alarm pat always with something near my crotch, making for very awkward pat downs..

At LAS the guy didn't even make me take my shoes off.

DFW on the other hand was hilarious.... guy was talking about how amazing his gun was to the TSA dude and they were both having a laugh.
 
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RWA380
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 11:07 am

lightsaber wrote:
ME720 wrote:
musman9853 wrote:
as a muslim guy, i always can't wait for those random searches!


OH yes I can confirm from my own experiences. Racist to the bone, or metal. I have been 8 times to the US and every single time random check.. wish I had that luck with the lottery, I would have been a
Billionaire by now. Random my A_ _ .

I get pulled aside for many random checks too. A very disproportionate share so the statistics match. Meh.. It doesn't take much time. My dog likes the extra attention.

The only time I saw the TSA discriminate was their random check of a female college volleyball team. But hey, I wanted to spend time with those ladies!

Lightsaber


I've seen & been involved in a couple of scenarios where, I & every male that was HWP, white, black didn't matter. We were all directed by female TSA officers to an extemely effeminate male who proceeded to touch things, not meant for public handling. I have never had a pat down like this from TSA quite, shall I say thourough, as one could be & remain clothed.

This was at LIH & I sat there putting my shoes & belt on & noticed, almost all the women go right through, but almost every single decent looking male was patted down by the same guy. There were other male TSA screeners available, just an observation from one queer guy, who knows what he was watching.

One of my cousins married an East Indian gentleman who is dark skinned & he flies for Intel, he constantly is randomly selected for searches, it's truly amazing how he's tagged 100% of the time.
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Ziyulu
Posts: 468
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Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 11:39 am

Does anyone else think TSA Pre-Check is a big scam? After security, you are co-mingled with the rest of the passengers. So one person can try to bring explosives and hand them off to someone else.
 
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enilria
Topic Author
Posts: 9201
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 7:15 pm

Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 11:58 am

robsaw wrote:
planecane wrote:
Yes, the TSA is a joke and is mostly putting on security theatre but to try and make scanner alarms into a racist thing is beyond ridiculous. I'm a white male and have had countless pat downs due to false alarms. I don't "feel singled out" because of it. I just laugh at how it happens so often.


A black woman makes an observation that she is subject to enhanced screening at a rate that seems to be unreasonably frequent. Given no other extenuating factors, assuming a racist motivation isn't illogical even if it is based upon errors in assumption.

The real irony is that I'm not aware of a single terrorist incident involving a black woman. Anybody know of any? I'm talking terrorism, not arguing with agents/FAs over something.
 
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OA940
Posts: 1689
Joined: Fri May 20, 2016 6:18 am

Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:36 pm

I guess it really is American then :duck:
A350/CSeries = bae
 
Jetty
Posts: 784
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2015 12:27 pm

Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:59 pm

enilria wrote:
The real irony is that I'm not aware of a single terrorist incident involving a black woman. Anybody know of any? I'm talking terrorism, not arguing with agents/FAs over something.

The Black Liberation Army had several woman that were involved in terrorist incidents on US soil. Then there are black US woman that have joined The Islamic State. JoAnne Deborah Byron and Hoda Muthana i.e. If you’re looking for recent terrorists acting on US soil I don’t known any either, but that doesn’t surprise since their aren’t that many terrorist incidents in the US and woman in general are far less likely to be involved in any kind of extreme antisocial behavior.
 
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enilria
Topic Author
Posts: 9201
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 7:15 pm

Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 1:20 pm

Jetty wrote:
enilria wrote:
The real irony is that I'm not aware of a single terrorist incident involving a black woman. Anybody know of any? I'm talking terrorism, not arguing with agents/FAs over something.

The Black Liberation Army had several woman that were involved in terrorist incidents on US soil. Then there are black US woman that have joined The Islamic State. JoAnne Deborah Byron and Hoda Muthana i.e. If you’re looking for recent terrorists acting on US soil I don’t known any either, but that doesn’t surprise since their aren’t that many terrorist incidents in the US and woman in general are far less likely to be involved in any kind of extreme antisocial behavior.

And probably none in aviation.

You know there was that article a few years ago about TSA, where they revealed that a "Code Yellow" meant there was an attractive blonde girl that they had targeted for pat down. They denied it. I have seen in the last 2 years where they say "Code Yellow" and do just that. So it's not hard to imagine gender and ethnic profiling.
 
Pyrex
Posts: 4548
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2005 7:24 am

Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:05 pm

I honestly cannot recall the last time when I flew and the TSA staff was not at least 50% African-American, so I have a hard time believing there world be any sort of institutional racism going on with this.
Read this very carefully, I shall write this only once!
 
Jetty
Posts: 784
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2015 12:27 pm

Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:33 pm

enilria wrote:
Jetty wrote:
enilria wrote:
The real irony is that I'm not aware of a single terrorist incident involving a black woman. Anybody know of any? I'm talking terrorism, not arguing with agents/FAs over something.

The Black Liberation Army had several woman that were involved in terrorist incidents on US soil. Then there are black US woman that have joined The Islamic State. JoAnne Deborah Byron and Hoda Muthana i.e. If you’re looking for recent terrorists acting on US soil I don’t known any either, but that doesn’t surprise since their aren’t that many terrorist incidents in the US and woman in general are far less likely to be involved in any kind of extreme antisocial behavior.

And probably none in aviation.

True, but if that is the criterium it isn’t notable that black woman stand out as it applies to any definable group except Muslim males.
 
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kitplane01
Posts: 1249
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 5:58 am

Re: TSA Scanning Machines Flagging Too Many Black Women

Sun Apr 21, 2019 5:25 pm

Pyrex wrote:
I honestly cannot recall the last time when I flew and the TSA staff was not at least 50% African-American, so I have a hard time believing there world be any sort of institutional racism going on with this.


I think this is significant thread drift.

The thread started with a claim that the machines had a harder time with black hair styles over white hair styles. It wasn't really about staffing.

BTW, if "code yellow" is a thing I'd fire people.

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