vsflyer747400
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:26 pm

VS at best have flown LGW-MCO 3x with 744, and that's not daily even in the peak.
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dtremit
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:41 pm

jumbojet wrote:
Boof wrote:
AusBT are reporting on this event this evening (here in Australia) that it will be flights to London with a Mint 2.0 that is all single seat Thomson Vantage Solo's.

Link: https://www.ausbt.com.au/jetblue-new-yo ... ource=hero

Interesting that they have this as a scoop!


1-1 is nice for the solo passenger but sucks for those traveling together. This will be a monumental failure of the highest degree. Widebodies will absolutely be essential to cater to the business traveler in this market and to couples flying together that want to fly business class.


Vantage Solo is a herringbone arrangement -- it looks like there's a retractable privacy panel between the seats so you could converse pretty easily with the person next to you.

I suspect the privacy for business travelers will be more of a plus than the negatives for leisure travelers.
 
Arion640
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:47 pm

flymco753 wrote:
OA940 wrote:
VCy wrote:

LHR - MCO is one of the top unserved UK-US pairs, right? If this happens it will be great!


And yet Virgin flies 5 daily 747s to MCO from LGW. LHR isn't the only airport in London, and in some cases LGW can be better for pax. Anyway the A321LR can't make LON-MCO non-stop without significant restrictions so this is all fictional talk.
LHR is MCO's largest unserved market, and it's primarily business passengers who will use it being closer to downtown London. I don't see this being a B6 thing. Most definitely a DL/VS kind of deal. Also, at peak it's 2x to LGW, 2x to MAN, and 1 each to BFS and GLA. Slow time is generally 1x LGW and 2x MAN depending on the day.


Can’t see too many business passengers using a LHR-MCO service to be honest. There’s just more valuable places to use the slots too.
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seansasLCY
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:52 pm

Arion640 wrote:
flymco753 wrote:
OA940 wrote:

And yet Virgin flies 5 daily 747s to MCO from LGW. LHR isn't the only airport in London, and in some cases LGW can be better for pax. Anyway the A321LR can't make LON-MCO non-stop without significant restrictions so this is all fictional talk.
LHR is MCO's largest unserved market, and it's primarily business passengers who will use it being closer to downtown London. I don't see this being a B6 thing. Most definitely a DL/VS kind of deal. Also, at peak it's 2x to LGW, 2x to MAN, and 1 each to BFS and GLA. Slow time is generally 1x LGW and 2x MAN depending on the day.


Can’t see too many business passengers using a LHR-MCO service to be honest. There’s just more valuable places to use the slots too.


US services are booming. If BA will operate LHR-Charleston then MCO can survive.
 
Boof
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:52 pm

SwissCanuck wrote:
Boof wrote:
AusBT are reporting on this event this evening (here in Australia) that it will be flights to London with a Mint 2.0 that is all single seat Thomson Vantage Solo's.

Link: https://www.ausbt.com.au/jetblue-new-yo ... ource=hero

Interesting that they have this as a scoop!


With a name like David Flynn, a bit of trouble with The English. "The mid-2020" "helped the JetBlue"

Nice scoop though !


Yeah the article appears rushed, this is a habit that all media tend to have these days - rushed and therefore not checked. David used to post on here but disappeared from the forums a while ago. Either way, good scoop.

What I find interesting is that the Vantage Solo's would take up the same space as the Vantage seats currently in use. 16x Mint 2.0 seats take the same real estate as the current Mint config.
Bring back Virgin Blue!
 
cledaybuck
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:56 pm

seansasLCY wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
flymco753 wrote:
LHR is MCO's largest unserved market, and it's primarily business passengers who will use it being closer to downtown London. I don't see this being a B6 thing. Most definitely a DL/VS kind of deal. Also, at peak it's 2x to LGW, 2x to MAN, and 1 each to BFS and GLA. Slow time is generally 1x LGW and 2x MAN depending on the day.


Can’t see too many business passengers using a LHR-MCO service to be honest. There’s just more valuable places to use the slots too.


US services are booming. If BA will operate LHR-Charleston then MCO can survive.

Can we stop talking about MCO-LHR? B6 isn't going to serve it, as they don't have the plane to do it.
 
impilot
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 1:00 pm

jumbojet wrote:
Boof wrote:
AusBT are reporting on this event this evening (here in Australia) that it will be flights to London with a Mint 2.0 that is all single seat Thomson Vantage Solo's.

Link: https://www.ausbt.com.au/jetblue-new-yo ... ource=hero

Interesting that they have this as a scoop!


1-1 is nice for the solo passenger but sucks for those traveling together. This will be a monumental failure of the highest degree. Widebodies will absolutely be essential to cater to the business traveler in this market and to couples flying together that want to fly business class.

Monumental failure of the highest degree. Lol. You’re such a drama queen.
 
impilot
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 1:01 pm

cledaybuck wrote:
seansasLCY wrote:
Arion640 wrote:

Can’t see too many business passengers using a LHR-MCO service to be honest. There’s just more valuable places to use the slots too.


US services are booming. If BA will operate LHR-Charleston then MCO can survive.

Can we stop talking about MCO-LHR? B6 isn't going to serve it, as they don't have the plane to do it.


And even if they did they still wouldn’t do it.
 
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flymco753
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 1:39 pm

cledaybuck wrote:
seansasLCY wrote:
Arion640 wrote:

Can’t see too many business passengers using a LHR-MCO service to be honest. There’s just more valuable places to use the slots too.


US services are booming. If BA will operate LHR-Charleston then MCO can survive.

Can we stop talking about MCO-LHR? B6 isn't going to serve it, as they don't have the plane to do it.
What we should be talking about RE MCO is when South America is more accessible with the A321XLR.
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Blueknows
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 1:41 pm

On my plane on my way
 
CobaltScar
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:15 pm

I really hope the announcement is more than just london but the whole stable of NW europe cities. We all already knew london.
 
lowfareair
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:15 pm

jumbojet wrote:
Boof wrote:
AusBT are reporting on this event this evening (here in Australia) that it will be flights to London with a Mint 2.0 that is all single seat Thomson Vantage Solo's.

Link: https://www.ausbt.com.au/jetblue-new-yo ... ource=hero

Interesting that they have this as a scoop!


1-1 is nice for the solo passenger but sucks for those traveling together. This will be a monumental failure of the highest degree. Widebodies will absolutely be essential to cater to the business traveler in this market and to couples flying together that want to fly business class.


In fairness, anything JetBlue does is 'a monumental failure of the highest degree' to you.
 
EvanWSFO
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:19 pm

vsflyer747400 wrote:
VS at best have flown LGW-MCO 3x with 744, and that's not daily even in the peak.


I suspect he may be including the MAN and Scotland flights, if they are still there. I've seen four 744's at MCO, one was a MAN flight.
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SoCalFlyer
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:33 pm

It’s my understanding there will be 4 European cities within the next few years, and they want to go up to 15. This is coming from the horses mouth btw.
 
B764er
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:47 pm

Ok JetBlue, today it is April 10th. We are waiting for the announcement ......
 
lostsound
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:50 pm

B764er wrote:
Ok JetBlue, today it is April 10th. We are waiting for the announcement ......


OG post says doors open at 3pm EST so we got a couple hours yet.
 
eagles94
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:51 pm

nine4nine wrote:
TheLunchbox wrote:
impilot wrote:

If it's legit why would they use the old JetBlue logo? Big oversight?


throwback to the original logo to say "hey, look where we came from"?



Or the Thomas Cook tie up is real as the font for them is gray as is the tail. Maybe B6 reverting back to gray/blue as a blended carrier?


Interesting idea.....
 
vsflyer747400
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:53 pm

EvanWSFO wrote:
vsflyer747400 wrote:
VS at best have flown LGW-MCO 3x with 744, and that's not daily even in the peak.


I suspect he may be including the MAN and Scotland flights, if they are still there. I've seen four 744's at MCO, one was a MAN flight.


He did specifically say LGW but I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. In peak at any one time there can be up to 6 VS 744's at MCO (3 x LGW, 2 x MAN and 1 BFS/GLA), saw a picture of it somewhere - an impressive sight.
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Super80Fan
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:53 pm

Is the surprise Neeleman is coming back?
RIP McDonnell Douglas
 
WeatherPilot
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:58 pm

vsflyer747400 wrote:
EvanWSFO wrote:
vsflyer747400 wrote:
VS at best have flown LGW-MCO 3x with 744, and that's not daily even in the peak.


I suspect he may be including the MAN and Scotland flights, if they are still there. I've seen four 744's at MCO, one was a MAN flight.


He did specifically say LGW but I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. In peak at any one time there can be up to 6 VS 744's at MCO (3 x LGW, 2 x MAN and 1 BFS/GLA), saw a picture of it somewhere - an impressive sight.


This one?

Image
 
airbazar
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 3:15 pm

SoCalFlyer wrote:
It’s my understanding there will be 4 European cities within the next few years, and they want to go up to 15. This is coming from the horses mouth btw.

From BOS: LON, PAR, MUC, AMS are no brainers, IMO. FCO in Summer too. MUC, AMS, FCO have no competition whatsoever.
 
User001
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 3:23 pm

airbazar wrote:
SoCalFlyer wrote:
It’s my understanding there will be 4 European cities within the next few years, and they want to go up to 15. This is coming from the horses mouth btw.

From BOS: LON, PAR, MUC, AMS are no brainers, IMO. FCO in Summer too. MUC, AMS, FCO have no competition whatsoever.


MUC/AMS and FCO all have flights to BOS?
 
steady eddie
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 3:25 pm

airbazar wrote:
SoCalFlyer wrote:
It’s my understanding there will be 4 European cities within the next few years, and they want to go up to 15. This is coming from the horses mouth btw.

From BOS: LON, PAR, MUC, AMS are no brainers, IMO. FCO in Summer too. MUC, AMS, FCO have no competition whatsoever.


shame its not from New York - I'd shout back at you "Everyones talking about - Pop Muzik"

I guess you need to be a certain age...


good luck to jetBlue
 
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flymco753
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 3:26 pm

WeatherPilot wrote:
vsflyer747400 wrote:
EvanWSFO wrote:

I suspect he may be including the MAN and Scotland flights, if they are still there. I've seen four 744's at MCO, one was a MAN flight.


He did specifically say LGW but I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. In peak at any one time there can be up to 6 VS 744's at MCO (3 x LGW, 2 x MAN and 1 BFS/GLA), saw a picture of it somewhere - an impressive sight.


This one?

Image
I remember that day quite vividly. Curious now to see how many pictures I took on my phone.
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pitbosflyer
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 3:31 pm

User001 wrote:
airbazar wrote:
SoCalFlyer wrote:
It’s my understanding there will be 4 European cities within the next few years, and they want to go up to 15. This is coming from the horses mouth btw.

From BOS: LON, PAR, MUC, AMS are no brainers, IMO. FCO in Summer too. MUC, AMS, FCO have no competition whatsoever.


MUC/AMS and FCO all have flights to BOS?


I too am confused by this airbazar. DL/KLM is now up to 3 flights a day to AMS from BOS. LH flies daily to MUC and AZ to FCO (with DY also serving it seasonally). I don't think "no competition whatsoever" is the correct phrase to describe the situation.
 
lavalampluva
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 3:42 pm

Seems like B6 is hinting at TATL flights. But IMO there are a lot of under-served markets in the U.S.
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MIflyer12
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 4:13 pm

lavalampluva wrote:
Seems like B6 is hinting at TATL flights. But IMO there are a lot of under-served markets in the U.S.


What U.S. destinations within the range of LON by a 321LR are underserved? How many of those U.S. airports are served by B6 today?

If you think there are so many underserved markets I would invite you to study the last five years of route failures by Norwegian, Icelandic and WOW.
 
Lewton
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 4:15 pm

Do you expect them to order additional A321LR or convert some of the existing A321neo?
 
impilot
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 4:16 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
lavalampluva wrote:
Seems like B6 is hinting at TATL flights. But IMO there are a lot of under-served markets in the U.S.


What U.S. destinations within the range of LON by a 321LR are underserved? How many of those U.S. airports are served by B6 today?

If you think there are so many underserved markets I would invite you to study the last five years of route failures by Norwegian, Icelandic and WOW.

Pretty sure he’s talking domestically underserved markets within the US. Not from London.
 
impilot
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 4:19 pm

Lewton wrote:
Do you expect them to order additional A321LR or convert some of the existing A321neo?

Convert. They’ve said as much in the past publicly. Their order book is always changing though so they could add, but I don’t think they can grow that much faster. They have 85 NEOs and 60 A220s on order in the next 5 years.
 
33lspotter
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 4:21 pm

pitbosflyer wrote:
User001 wrote:
airbazar wrote:
From BOS: LON, PAR, MUC, AMS are no brainers, IMO. FCO in Summer too. MUC, AMS, FCO have no competition whatsoever.


MUC/AMS and FCO all have flights to BOS?


I too am confused by this airbazar. DL/KLM is now up to 3 flights a day to AMS from BOS. LH flies daily to MUC and AZ to FCO (with DY also serving it seasonally). I don't think "no competition whatsoever" is the correct phrase to describe the situation.


I read it as him saying that the carriers operating those routes have no competition on them whatsoever. That would have been correct prior to this spring but with DY starting FCO last month it is no longer the case (KL is part of a JV with Delta et al). MUC is still uncompetitive IMO and fares were relatively high last I checked (around $800-$1,000 round trip). Too lazy to look again but still LH has no comeptition in BOS-MUC.
 
klm617
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 4:35 pm

lavalampluva wrote:
Seems like B6 is hinting at TATL flights. But IMO there are a lot of under-served markets in the U.S.



I agree and DTW-MCO should be a given for B6
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
Brickell305
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 4:51 pm

lavalampluva wrote:
Seems like B6 is hinting at TATL flights. But IMO there are a lot of under-served markets in the U.S.

Agree wholeheartedly. There are several domestic holes I see in FLL (Houston, Dallas, Charlotte, Seattle among others). And while I’m aware that these are generally hubs for competitors, if B6 wants to be a leader in So. Fla they are eventually going to have to start flying into those rivals’ hubs.
 
tphuang
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:12 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
lavalampluva wrote:
Seems like B6 is hinting at TATL flights. But IMO there are a lot of under-served markets in the U.S.

Agree wholeheartedly. There are several domestic holes I see in FLL (Houston, Dallas, Charlotte, Seattle among others). And while I’m aware that these are generally hubs for competitors, if B6 wants to be a leader in So. Fla they are eventually going to have to start flying into those rivals’ hubs.

there are a whole host of places they can add domestically, but B6 is fundamentally an airline that has to serve international locations due to where it's primary hubs are at. There has to be a balance of new domestic locations to serve. And at this point, London is the far and away the biggest hole in their network out of JFK/BOS. And at some point, they can also add FLL-LHR if they opt for XLR. Having more complete network out of NYC/BOS will result in more ff, more corporate travel and more credit card users.
 
Leftseatpusher
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:25 pm

jumbojet wrote:
Boof wrote:
AusBT are reporting on this event this evening (here in Australia) that it will be flights to London with a Mint 2.0 that is all single seat Thomson Vantage Solo's.

Link: https://www.ausbt.com.au/jetblue-new-yo ... ource=hero

Interesting that they have this as a scoop!


1-1 is nice for the solo passenger but sucks for those traveling together. This will be a monumental failure of the highest degree. Widebodies will absolutely be essential to cater to the business traveler in this market and to couples flying together that want to fly business class.


B6 must have a lot of monumental failures since DL has to mimic every move they make.
 
winginit
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:26 pm

As if we need any more evidence that the announcement is a London one, their official twitter account just used the UK spelling of 'colour'.

Image
 
33lspotter
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:27 pm

winginit wrote:
As if we need any more evidence that the announcement is a London one, their official twitter account just used the UK spelling of 'colour'.

Image


And "apologise"!
 
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flymco753
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:28 pm

klm617 wrote:
lavalampluva wrote:
Seems like B6 is hinting at TATL flights. But IMO there are a lot of under-served markets in the U.S.



I agree and DTW-MCO should be a given for B6
There's a difference between them doing it because it's given and because it's natural. This add would be natural.
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
lowfareair
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:28 pm

winginit wrote:
As if we need any more evidence that the announcement is a London one, their official twitter account just used the UK spelling of 'colour'.

Image


...and favorite, and apologize. :)
 
winginit
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:31 pm

lowfareair wrote:
winginit wrote:
As if we need any more evidence that the announcement is a London one, their official twitter account just used the UK spelling of 'colour'.

Image


...and favorite, and apologize. :)


Completely missed both of those. Indeed!
 
mattyfitzg
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:31 pm

winginit wrote:
As if we need any more evidence that the announcement is a London one, their official twitter account just used the CORRECT spelling of 'colour'.

Image



Fixed that for you ;)
 
ScottB
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:31 pm

winginit wrote:
As if we need any more evidence that the announcement is a London one, their official twitter account [url=https://twitter.com/JetBlue/status/1116023209881563137?s=20]just used the UK spelling of 'colour'


Of course, that's also the Canadian spelling, as well as the Bermudian, Caymanian, Belizean, Trinidadian, Jamaican, etc.

It would have been more impressive if they had manoeuvred to use "manoeuvre." :)
Last edited by ScottB on Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:32 pm

Anyone think they will mention the 10 Long Beach slots returned in the meeting? They may just want to stay all positive.
 
x1234
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:36 pm

I find it interesting that JetBlue will fly to London before Toronto, Montreal or Vancouver. I heard JetBlue says airport fees in Canada are too high yet they will fly to London where they are even higher!? I pray for a Canadian expansion after this announcement!
 
impilot
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:42 pm

slcdeltarumd11 wrote:
Anyone think they will mention the 10 Long Beach slots returned in the meeting? They may just want to stay all positive.

I don't think it will affect their flights/crew base/anything else, as the slots weren't being used. So I doubt it's even worth mentioning.
 
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CarbonFibre
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:46 pm

lowfareair wrote:
winginit wrote:
As if we need any more evidence that the announcement is a London one, their official twitter account just used the UK spelling of 'colour'.

Image


...and favorite, and apologize. :)


The correct way.
 
LMFNINJA
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 6:06 pm

winginit wrote:
As if we need any more evidence that the announcement is a London one, their official twitter account just used the UK spelling of 'colour'.

Image


And the UK spelling of apologise ( no zed/zee) lol.
Last edited by LMFNINJA on Wed Apr 10, 2019 6:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
LMFNINJA
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 6:08 pm

LMFNINJA wrote:
winginit wrote:
As if we need any more evidence that the announcement is a London one, their official twitter account just used the UK spelling of 'colour'.

Image


And the UK spelling of apologise ( no zed/zee) lol.
 
airbazar
Posts: 9432
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 6:10 pm

pitbosflyer wrote:
User001 wrote:
airbazar wrote:
From BOS: LON, PAR, MUC, AMS are no brainers, IMO. FCO in Summer too. MUC, AMS, FCO have no competition whatsoever.


MUC/AMS and FCO all have flights to BOS?


I too am confused by this airbazar. DL/KLM is now up to 3 flights a day to AMS from BOS. LH flies daily to MUC and AZ to FCO (with DY also serving it seasonally). I don't think "no competition whatsoever" is the correct phrase to describe the situation.


1 airline per route is the definition of no competition, is it not?
1 airline on BOS-AMS. DL and KLM are the same airline due to the JV.
Only AZ on BOS-FCO,
Only LH flies BOS-MUC.
I'll give you the seasonal on DY to FCO.
 
LMFNINJA
Posts: 99
Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2017 5:11 pm

Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 6:13 pm

x1234 wrote:
I find it interesting that JetBlue will fly to London before Toronto, Montreal or Vancouver. I heard JetBlue says airport fees in Canada are too high yet they will fly to London where they are even higher!? I pray for a Canadian expansion after this announcement!


I would like them to fly to YYZ but I have a feeling that if they do the only service will be to BOS and JFK.

I would definitely fly them if they went to LAS, LAX or FLL from YYZ but I doubt that they can compete with AC who rules these markets.

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