TTailedTiger
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:45 am

aemoreira1981 wrote:
nine4nine wrote:
seabosdca wrote:
Why would AS want to merge with B6 and inherit all the issues you are describing? AS is still digesting the VX merger and has plenty of opportunities for organic growth on the West Coast. The most attractive merger partner for AS would be HA, not B6.

I think B6's future plans should be to the East Coast as AS is to the West Coast. Keep going after NYC business, beef up Florida, look for more Eastern focus cities, and fly to national destinations with the idea of cementing the East Coast customer base further in place. In short, try to rattle the cages of AA and DL in those markets the way AS is trying to do to WN in California.


Agreed. AS has butchered the VX product which actually made a nice relaxed flying experience. They’ve dumped or cut back substantially many of the VX routes and incorporated the boring lackluster cabin offerings.

IF a marriage between AS and B6 were to ever transpire let’s hope the B6 name and service would be the overpowering factors. Nobody thinks Alaska when flying east-west or Caribbean and vice versa.


I honestly believe that an AS-B6 merger would have B6 being the acquiring entity as well. It would also give B6 access to the West Coast network of AS and also give it a place at airports where it has no presence now, like DFW. The major question would be what to do with the ex-VX Airbus fleet, as those are CFM frames as opposed to B6's IAE frames (also, VX was mostly leased while B6 is mostly owned or financed). Such an acquisition could also give B6 the incentive to add more BCS3s or BCS1s, especially for regional ops. The question is if a regional partner would be added to JFK operations (currently, B6 is all mainline). Why I see B6 buying AS more than AS buying B6 is because B6 has more valuable assets, such as more landing slots at slot-restricted JFK and LGA and being a future landlord of other airlines at JFK, along with a lot of amortized Airbus planes.

Would the value of B6's slots and aircraft, with the Airbus fleet mostly owned or financed, be worth more than the airline's market cap?


What in the world makes you think that a sickly Jetblue would have the money or the talent to acquire Alaska Airlines which is a healthy company with competent management that has been around since 1932? I needed a good laugh today.
 
nine4nine
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:54 am

TTailedTiger wrote:
aemoreira1981 wrote:
nine4nine wrote:

Agreed. AS has butchered the VX product which actually made a nice relaxed flying experience. They’ve dumped or cut back substantially many of the VX routes and incorporated the boring lackluster cabin offerings.

IF a marriage between AS and B6 were to ever transpire let’s hope the B6 name and service would be the overpowering factors. Nobody thinks Alaska when flying east-west or Caribbean and vice versa.


I honestly believe that an AS-B6 merger would have B6 being the acquiring entity as well. It would also give B6 access to the West Coast network of AS and also give it a place at airports where it has no presence now, like DFW. The major question would be what to do with the ex-VX Airbus fleet, as those are CFM frames as opposed to B6's IAE frames (also, VX was mostly leased while B6 is mostly owned or financed). Such an acquisition could also give B6 the incentive to add more BCS3s or BCS1s, especially for regional ops. The question is if a regional partner would be added to JFK operations (currently, B6 is all mainline). Why I see B6 buying AS more than AS buying B6 is because B6 has more valuable assets, such as more landing slots at slot-restricted JFK and LGA and being a future landlord of other airlines at JFK, along with a lot of amortized Airbus planes.

Would the value of B6's slots and aircraft, with the Airbus fleet mostly owned or financed, be worth more than the airline's market cap?


What in the world makes you think that a sickly Jetblue would have the money or the talent to acquire Alaska Airlines which is a healthy company with competent management that has been around since 1932? I needed a good laugh today.



Ummm how about a strong very reputable CO that was merged with a sickly fledgling UA???

Maybe if you were the type who actually read what someone posted rather than dissecting a few words and coming to conclusions I never said B6 would buy AS. What I said was if AS and B6 were to be married by a merge or a buy that the B6 name would hopefully be the name of the carrier. Who is gonna fly or even think of searching or booking on some carrier from NY to Lima on a carrier named after a state in the arctic with some dumb looking Eskimo on the tail?

Anyways we’re talkimg about something that has a small probability of happening somits a moot point.
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TTailedTiger
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:57 am

nine4nine wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
aemoreira1981 wrote:

I honestly believe that an AS-B6 merger would have B6 being the acquiring entity as well. It would also give B6 access to the West Coast network of AS and also give it a place at airports where it has no presence now, like DFW. The major question would be what to do with the ex-VX Airbus fleet, as those are CFM frames as opposed to B6's IAE frames (also, VX was mostly leased while B6 is mostly owned or financed). Such an acquisition could also give B6 the incentive to add more BCS3s or BCS1s, especially for regional ops. The question is if a regional partner would be added to JFK operations (currently, B6 is all mainline). Why I see B6 buying AS more than AS buying B6 is because B6 has more valuable assets, such as more landing slots at slot-restricted JFK and LGA and being a future landlord of other airlines at JFK, along with a lot of amortized Airbus planes.

Would the value of B6's slots and aircraft, with the Airbus fleet mostly owned or financed, be worth more than the airline's market cap?


What in the world makes you think that a sickly Jetblue would have the money or the talent to acquire Alaska Airlines which is a healthy company with competent management that has been around since 1932? I needed a good laugh today.



Ummm how about a strong very reputable CO that was merged with a sickly fledgling UA???

Maybe if you were the type who actually read what someone posted rather than dissecting a few words and coming to conclusions I never said B6 would buy AS. What I said was if AS and B6 were to be married by a merge or a buy that the B6 name would hopefully be the name of the carrier. Who is gonna fly or even think of searching or booking on some carrier from NY to Lima on a carrier named after a state in the arctic with some dumb looking Eskimo on the tail?

Anyways we’re talkimg about something that has a small probability of happening somits a moot point.


I wasn't talking to you. I was referencing aemoreia1981. Surely you could have figured that out.
 
nine4nine
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:58 am

TTailedTiger wrote:
nine4nine wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:

What in the world makes you think that a sickly Jetblue would have the money or the talent to acquire Alaska Airlines which is a healthy company with competent management that has been around since 1932? I needed a good laugh today.



Ummm how about a strong very reputable CO that was merged with a sickly fledgling UA???

Maybe if you were the type who actually read what someone posted rather than dissecting a few words and coming to conclusions I never said B6 would buy AS. What I said was if AS and B6 were to be married by a merge or a buy that the B6 name would hopefully be the name of the carrier. Who is gonna fly or even think of searching or booking on some carrier from NY to Lima on a carrier named after a state in the arctic with some dumb looking Eskimo on the tail?

Anyways we’re talkimg about something that has a small probability of happening somits a moot point.


I wasn't talking to you. I was referencing aemoreia1981. Surely you could have figured that out.



Ahhh gotcha. My bad. I apologize. I didn’t quite read it correctly.

I picked the wrong day to quit sniffing glue...
Last edited by nine4nine on Wed Jan 09, 2019 4:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
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nine4nine
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 4:08 am

trueblew wrote:
nine4nine wrote:
I posted this on another B6 thread but find it appropriate here as well.

Wow whiners out in full effect. We get it. Management at B6 has issues starting from the top. AA has the same issues with Doug Parker. It happens.

But your attitudes and moral have a huge effect on your operations wether you see it or not. You can’t blame the issues solely on management but on yourselves as well. You are part of the problem. If you have a chip on your shoulder with your employer you may not see it, but guaranteed it is shown in your demeanor around your customers or in your work performance. Rather than bitch and moan, why don’t you take pride in your company, be a standout and better yourselves and have a positive attitude. If that’s passed through the rest of the employees you can help tip the scales to a more favorable outlook for B6 and offset what management lacks.

You all have a job, benefits, and health insurance. Take a look at those less fortunate and out looking for jobs and wondering how to pay the next rent payment or grocery tab. If you don’t change your attitudes you may well be joining them soon.

And before any of you blast me, I’ve been in the industry. I’ve been laid off both pre911 and post911 from airlines and lost everything I’ve owned in my life both times. My first lay-off, both my employees and myself saw the writing on the wall and our morale was in the toilet and we didn’t give a shit at that point and that sped things faster to demise. Be grateful for what you have, find ways to make the work situation better, because if you don’t, tomorrow may not have something to offer you.


Johanna, is that you? Yes, B6 employees should make up for management failures, profit sharing cuts, and a hostile work environment with more smiles and a great attitude!!! Just thrilled to have a job in the era of record low unemployment!



Then quit your job tomorrow. Nobody is putting a gun to your head and forcing you to wake up in the morning put on your blues and show up to work on time. Find somewhere else where you will be treated non hostile. Having a job is not a right it’s a privilege. I hear AA and UA are hiring you might be much happier over there.
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crescent
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 4:47 am

Does anyone have a sense where ASM growth after this year comes from? I don't mean beyond 4-7 years, because that is obvious (overseas) but I don't see where they expand profitability in the U.S. 5% ASM growth or more in 2020-2021. More Florida to points south? JFK/BOS/LGB are tapped out. Or are they just upgauging everything out of the E190s?
 
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seabosdca
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:00 am

aemoreira1981 wrote:
I honestly believe that an AS-B6 merger would have B6 being the acquiring entity as well.


AS (and, I expect, its shareholders) would have to be dragged kicking and screaming into a transaction like that, especially under current B6 management.
 
dampfnudel
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:17 am

flyguy84 wrote:
I feel JetBlue is setting itself up for an acquisition. I don't believe its going to be with Alaska.

Which one would be more likely in your opinion, DL or UA?
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CobaltScar
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:24 am

nine4nine wrote:
As someone who flies B6 VERY regularly for business and helps pay your paycheck the attitude and lack of energy, enthusiasm, and culture that made B6 a legendary name is very apparent from check in to in flight service. Granted it’s not bad by any means but it’s very noticeable. Once you lose that, anyone can offer you a drink a snack and a personal seatback TV. My point is attitude and work ethic should not be compromised because of disgust or annoyance with management. You are the front line, the face of the company that the public interacts with. The people who take the heat and anger from the public for inept management decisions. But if the employees show they are miserable,unhappy coupled with poor management the days of B6 will become few.


If that is true, then the responsibility and blame has to rest in managements lap. They are the ones managing the airline and its people after all.

Art at ISP wrote:
When I got back to JFK, I realized that the airplane was turning around to fly to the DR at 2:30AM (of course delayed). The snow the day before in NY had delayed the aircraft significantly and the schedule did not allow any RON time to make up for the delay--I tracked the same aircraft, and it did not get back on schedule for three days past my flight, meaning it was 4-5 hours late consistently for 4-5 days!! It makes little sense to do that.


Look into how often those JFK to DR redeyes are late for a real eye opener. Kind of reminds me of Emirates using only certain aircraft for its Africa or India routes. You are right, their is no slack in the system.

sonicruiser wrote:
because they're not big enough to be the first choice I think of when flying out of MCO. That's a problem because if I don't immediately think of B6 flying out of one of their major hubs, imagine how obscure they are outside their hubs in random east coast cities, let alone out west. Meanwhile, when I have to fly out west, I immediately think of AS because they fly multiple frequencies to SEA as well as SFO and SAN all nonstop from MCO despite AS being an airline which prides itself on the west coast. B6 has a major problem on its hands when a west coast airline has better name recognition in a B6 hub than B6.



Well if you are wanting to go out west from MCO, then sure forget about B6. But they have a huge east coast and Caribbean operation out of MCO. I think they are the third largest airline at MCO and are 2nd in number of destinations. Soon will have the best terminal space too and with that will grow to a solid 2nd place overall at the airport.
Last edited by CobaltScar on Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:49 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
crescent
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:26 am

AS shareholders would be quite happy to be dragged in for a fat premium on the stock, esp. if it happens with margins improved with the promised synergies of the VX merger. AS is already having problems expanding organically and profitably in CA; once the integration with VX has squeezed every profit dollar out, where does AS go? Their only serious choices are to assault WN more systematically in the various secondary CA routes (not smart) and to build up SLC- neither seem appealing. They can't buy HA (would monopolize all the secondary CA airports to HI).
 
isp2
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:27 am

There are many Monday Morning QB’s on this thread.

I was in B6 Airport Management for nearly 15 years in two of their major focus cities so I will tell it like it is:

When they let Neeleman go in 2007 that took away so much of the pride we all had in our home grown airline. The man has his faults for sure, but he went on Letterman to plea for his job with the airline he founded - and instead Barger won out. Ask any JetBlue founder their opinion of both Neeleman and Barger, and they won’t hesitate to tell you.

People initially looked at Barger and thought of him as a JetBlue equal to Neeleman after he replaced him. While it is true he was there from day one as well, the tenure of Barger single handedly led to the mess JetBlue has become in 2019.

Barger replaced much of Neeleman’s team with many ex-Delta management castoffs - the same people that drove Delta into bankruptcy well before they became the most respected legacy in the US. While JetBlue was saddled with former Delta Leadership at it’s airport hubs, in inflight, in SYSOPS, in Corp Com, in Supply Chain - seemingly everywhere - their Chief Leader (Barger) sensed how miserable his employees were. In his final years, Barger would only fly CO/UA out of EWR to attend corporate events because he wouldn’t want to interact with B6 Crewmembers.

Not only did the Crewmembers feel the disconnect, but so did Wall Street. The stock price sat between $4 and $7 for years, and finally he was shown the door.

In the worst of all case scenarios - the BOD - many of whom have been there since day once and also need a significant overhaul - promoted incompetent people like Joanna Gherety to the very top. In the last 5 years we have seen 2, and soon 3 unions come on property.

Someone on the BOD or ELT should have had the balls to say something 10 years ago. Instead you now how “Dave Barger Blvd” outside of their training center in MCO, “Dave Barger Auditorium” within their training center, no mention or Neeleman anywhere, and a bafoon Brit toying with London service every few months who hasn’t a clue on how to run an airline. His COO is a former labor lawyer, and there is not a single happy employee working for the airline that has the worst metrics of all the US big carriers - including Spirit, Frontier, etc.

This will one day be taught in college classes on how to destroy and break morale amongst ranks 101.

Shame on JetBlue.
 
crescent
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:28 am

dampfnudel wrote:
flyguy84 wrote:
I feel JetBlue is setting itself up for an acquisition. I don't believe its going to be with Alaska.

Which one would be more likely in your opinion, DL or UA?


Neither- it would be AA. DL or UA would have serious antitrust problems in the NYC market (and SEA with DL). B6 has essentially gained much of its share from AA/US in JFK/LGA and BOS; AA would simply be buying it back.
 
dampfnudel
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:38 am

crescent wrote:
dampfnudel wrote:
flyguy84 wrote:
I feel JetBlue is setting itself up for an acquisition. I don't believe its going to be with Alaska.

Which one would be more likely in your opinion, DL or UA?


Neither- it would be AA. DL or UA would have serious antitrust problems in the NYC market (and SEA with DL). B6 has essentially gained much of its share from AA/US in JFK/LGA and BOS; AA would simply be buying it back.

You’re probably right. Acquiring B6 would pretty much turn JFK into ATL for DL and that wouldn’t fly with the government. As for UA, this would mark a big return to JFK, but again this would probably be too much dominance by one airline when you consider EWR and the increased capacity at JFK when terminal 6 is completed. AA may also get some amount of scrutiny as well.
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Jouhou
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:45 am

As someone from the Boston area any talk about B6 merging with anyone makes me cringe. That would be catastrophic for the quality of service out of BOS.

Please airline gods, no.
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:58 am

evank516 wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
A few years ago I was the biggest B6 fanboy ever, as they got me back into my love of flying. Once I took my first flight with them December 2007 I was hooked. For the few years after the fact, I flew nothing but B6. I praised them online and went after anyone who talked negative about them. Then I started to open my eyes a few years ago. I noticed how after the original management left, things started to go downhill. A "culture change" started to appear as well. They are no longer the cute little NYC hometown airline that people put up with the abysmal on time performance because of how well B6 was, they are now a mess. Employees who worked for peanuts because they loved the culture are now unionized and unhappy, customers are leaving, they are maintaining the "enhanced service" marketing but now charge large amounts of money for checked bags, change fees, seats etc.

I myself haven't been on a B6 flight in 2 years. Something needs to happen, whether it is a merger or complete overhaul on what type of airline it is. It won't and can't work with how it is operating and managed right now.


The closure of DAB ended any chance of me ever flying them again, at least if I have anything to say about it.


Same.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
 
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VS4ever
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 6:00 am

crescent wrote:
Does anyone have a sense where ASM growth after this year comes from? I don't mean beyond 4-7 years, because that is obvious (overseas) but I don't see where they expand profitability in the U.S. 5% ASM growth or more in 2020-2021. More Florida to points south? JFK/BOS/LGB are tapped out. Or are they just upgauging everything out of the E190s?


BOS isn't tapped out yet. they have some 50+ departures a day space to go, even by their own metrics from 150 to 200, but if you do the math, they could possibly go all the way to 230 if they wanted to. B6 will be getting more gate space with the clearance of AS and SY from C40-C42, 2 new Gates once the B-C Connector is built and the extra gate is built in the main part of C. While BOS's growth potential maybe lower than other stations (say MCO or FLL for example), to say its tapped out is incorrect.

Now what they do with these extra departures will be telling. Europe.. sure but that won't provide big growth in terms of # of flights, increased Caribbean flying, definitely as capacity is still somewhat down compared to prior to the hurricane in 17, although with the situation in SJU, it's never all going to come back, but there's space for sure. Then it comes down to, do they a) add more domestic stations, there have been a number in the various network thread posts discussed or b) Double down on existing stations, increase frequency instead. or c) Merge with AS (i'm just kidding with that one).

Either way, just like DL did a couple of weeks ago, by upping their game post WN move to Terminal B, B6 will be able to do the same around September/October when they get the extra space from the move rounds. DL has made the first move, it's up to B6 now to counter, the questions are, will they, with which equipment and where will they go? There's 13 321's arriving this year, which will probably free up a bunch of the 320's to do some of this additional flying, so unless the insiders on this thread know different and I defer to their knowledge over mine. BOS is not tapped out...yet.
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 6:02 am

isp2 wrote:
There are many Monday Morning QB’s on this thread.

I was in B6 Airport Management for nearly 15 years in two of their major focus cities so I will tell it like it is:

When they let Neeleman go in 2007 that took away so much of the pride we all had in our home grown airline. The man has his faults for sure, but he went on Letterman to plea for his job with the airline he founded - and instead Barger won out. Ask any JetBlue founder their opinion of both Neeleman and Barger, and they won’t hesitate to tell you.

People initially looked at Barger and thought of him as a JetBlue equal to Neeleman after he replaced him. While it is true he was there from day one as well, the tenure of Barger single handedly led to the mess JetBlue has become in 2019.

Barger replaced much of Neeleman’s team with many ex-Delta management castoffs - the same people that drove Delta into bankruptcy well before they became the most respected legacy in the US. While JetBlue was saddled with former Delta Leadership at it’s airport hubs, in inflight, in SYSOPS, in Corp Com, in Supply Chain - seemingly everywhere - their Chief Leader (Barger) sensed how miserable his employees were. In his final years, Barger would only fly CO/UA out of EWR to attend corporate events because he wouldn’t want to interact with B6 Crewmembers.

Not only did the Crewmembers feel the disconnect, but so did Wall Street. The stock price sat between $4 and $7 for years, and finally he was shown the door.

In the worst of all case scenarios - the BOD - many of whom have been there since day once and also need a significant overhaul - promoted incompetent people like Joanna Gherety to the very top. In the last 5 years we have seen 2, and soon 3 unions come on property.

Someone on the BOD or ELT should have had the balls to say something 10 years ago. Instead you now how “Dave Barger Blvd” outside of their training center in MCO, “Dave Barger Auditorium” within their training center, no mention or Neeleman anywhere, and a bafoon Brit toying with London service every few months who hasn’t a clue on how to run an airline. His COO is a former labor lawyer, and there is not a single happy employee working for the airline that has the worst metrics of all the US big carriers - including Spirit, Frontier, etc.

This will one day be taught in college classes on how to destroy and break morale amongst ranks 101.

Shame on JetBlue.


Thank you for your honest and eye opening post.

As a customer/non-employee I didn't realize how bad things got overtime to what it is right now.

What could've been the greatest US airline to fly with/work for is now a jumbled mess that is barely hanging on.

Shame on JetBlue indeed.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
 
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Jouhou
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 6:10 am

You know, just to lighten up the mood here, maybe "Moxy" will just end up being Neeleman acquiring JetBlue, combining the A220 orders, and re-branding it all completely.
 
MSPNWA
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 6:11 am

Looks like the monthly B6 sucks propoganda thread. They don't have a management problem. They have a "problem" of where they fly and how much they offer customers. B6 is too premium.


jfklganyc wrote:
Facts! Thank u!


Misleading, but yeah, facts.
 
nine4nine
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 6:47 am

Jouhou wrote:
You know, just to lighten up the mood here, maybe "Moxy" will just end up being Neeleman acquiring JetBlue, combining the A220 orders, and re-branding it all completely.



LOL. You know the same thought crossed my mind today. When you look up the definition of Moxie/Moxy it defines as Aggresiveness, Courage, and Nerve. When I read that I thought could project Moxy basically be a Trojan horse for a private buyback of jetBlue and incorporation of his new vision by putting Neeleman back in the drivers seat of his baby and reinventing the wheel at B6?

It’s a fun what if scenario to think about.
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FlyingElvii
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 7:25 am

fastmover wrote:
Since it seemed like the network thread was going this way, I wanted to start one to talk about our JetBlue and what has happened.

This isn’t just a management bash fest it’s more about how the company is being run these days.

A few years ago there were no unions now there are two and active drives are in place for other workgroups. The west coast strategy is pretty much dead after the LGB customs fail and the VA merger fail. The JD power award is long gone. We still don’t have any type of guidance from management abut the direction of the company. The stock continues to trail other airlines and on time is close to the bottom. Is this all sustainable and is this the new reality of JetBlue?

You cannot fly the majority of your trips in the Northeast, and not expect horrible on-times, especially after the summer we just had. JFK and LGA are delay creators almost daily, through no fault of JB’s.
 
FlyingElvii
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 7:32 am

fastmover wrote:
nine4nine wrote:
I posted this on another B6 thread but find it appropriate here as well.

Wow whiners out in full effect. We get it. Management at B6 has issues starting from the top. AA has the same issues with Doug Parker. It happens.

But your attitudes and moral have a huge effect on your operations wether you see it or not. You can’t blame the issues solely on management but on yourselves as well. You are part of the problem. If you have a chip on your shoulder with your employer you may not see it, but guaranteed it is shown in your demeanor around your customers or in your work performance. Rather than bitch and moan, why don’t you take pride in your company, be a standout and better yourselves and have a positive attitude. If that’s passed through the rest of the employees you can help tip the scales to a more favorable outlook for B6 and offset what management lacks.

You all have a job, benefits, and health insurance. Take a look at those less fortunate and out looking for jobs and wondering how to pay the next rent payment or grocery tab. If you don’t change your attitudes you may well be joining them soon.

And before any of you blast me, I’ve been in the industry. I’ve been laid off both pre911 and post911 from airlines and lost everything I’ve owned in my life both times. My first lay-off, both my employees and myself saw the writing on the wall and our morale was in the toilet and we didn’t give a shit at that point and that sped things faster to demise. Be grateful for what you have, find ways to make the work situation better, because if you don’t, tomorrow may not have something to offer you.




Yeah way to start out. Maybe you should be in management here. You just discount everything and call us whiners. Actually the vast majority of the employees are what is holding this company together. You don’t work here so you don’t see it. Again you don’t see us talking about making more money it’s about the current operations at jetblue and if that can be sustained. But sure we are just whiners. It’s the pride issue that you are confused about. I do have pride in my company but I grow tired of apologizing everyday because jetblue refuses to overblock flights and does 27 min turns with crew swaps, because we want max utilization. Great but don’t pretend you care about on time. Management doesn’t have to stand there as people get off and say can’t you guys ever be on time. How about walking through the terminal on Christmas having a passengers ask if you could fly them home because their flight is delayed 5 hours due to lack of pilots? The company won’t staff properly. It happened look at twitter look at our on time. How does one have pride in that? I am far from a whiner I love my company but I know we can’t keep going like this.

Want to be on time? Don’t go to New York, Boston, PHL, or DCA. Oops, that just happens to be where all of the people with money want to go! Even Terterboro is maxxed out now, on most days.
No good options for New York, and any that could be are at least 30 years off.
 
isp2
Posts: 48
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 8:48 am

Super80Fan wrote:
isp2 wrote:
There are many Monday Morning QB’s on this thread.

I was in B6 Airport Management for nearly 15 years in two of their major focus cities so I will tell it like it is:

When they let Neeleman go in 2007 that took away so much of the pride we all had in our home grown airline. The man has his faults for sure, but he went on Letterman to plea for his job with the airline he founded - and instead Barger won out. Ask any JetBlue founder their opinion of both Neeleman and Barger, and they won’t hesitate to tell you.

People initially looked at Barger and thought of him as a JetBlue equal to Neeleman after he replaced him. While it is true he was there from day one as well, the tenure of Barger single handedly led to the mess JetBlue has become in 2019.

Barger replaced much of Neeleman’s team with many ex-Delta management castoffs - the same people that drove Delta into bankruptcy well before they became the most respected legacy in the US. While JetBlue was saddled with former Delta Leadership at it’s airport hubs, in inflight, in SYSOPS, in Corp Com, in Supply Chain - seemingly everywhere - their Chief Leader (Barger) sensed how miserable his employees were. In his final years, Barger would only fly CO/UA out of EWR to attend corporate events because he wouldn’t want to interact with B6 Crewmembers.

Not only did the Crewmembers feel the disconnect, but so did Wall Street. The stock price sat between $4 and $7 for years, and finally he was shown the door.

In the worst of all case scenarios - the BOD - many of whom have been there since day once and also need a significant overhaul - promoted incompetent people like Joanna Gherety to the very top. In the last 5 years we have seen 2, and soon 3 unions come on property.

Someone on the BOD or ELT should have had the balls to say something 10 years ago. Instead you now how “Dave Barger Blvd” outside of their training center in MCO, “Dave Barger Auditorium” within their training center, no mention or Neeleman anywhere, and a bafoon Brit toying with London service every few months who hasn’t a clue on how to run an airline. His COO is a former labor lawyer, and there is not a single happy employee working for the airline that has the worst metrics of all the US big carriers - including Spirit, Frontier, etc.

This will one day be taught in college classes on how to destroy and break morale amongst ranks 101.

Shame on JetBlue.


Thank you for your honest and eye opening post.

As a customer/non-employee I didn't realize how bad things got overtime to what it is right now.

What could've been the greatest US airline to fly with/work for is now a jumbled mess that is barely hanging on.

Shame on JetBlue indeed.


I’m a retiree. I have zero stake in the game. And I’ve hated what they have become.
 
santi319
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 9:45 am

nine4nine wrote:
LOL. You know the same thought crossed my mind today. When you look up the definition of Moxie/Moxy it defines as Aggresiveness, Courage, and Nerve. When I read that I thought could project Moxy basically be a Trojan horse for a private buyback of jetBlue and incorporation of his new vision by putting Neeleman back in the drivers seat of his baby and reinventing the wheel at B6?

It’s a fun what if scenario to think about.

Moxy sounds like a drag queen..

I just came here to see if the “Europe is imminent “ comment posted yet?
 
CLTDAL
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 11:30 am

Having worked for the airline for over a decade, there are many problems facing B6.

*Identity crisis- make up your mind. Be a Legacy or be an ULCC. They claim they are in the "sweet spot"....what the heck is that???
* Identifying with above statement: They want to "sort of" make a Legacy feel with MINT....but keep costs throughout the airline that of a LCC. WILL NOT HAPPEN. Either go BIG or GO HOME.
* Fleet is a mess. All coach and EMS seating.....MINT......considering a basic economy seat/price??? Why not just have a small Business Class fleetwide??? Customers will pay for it. They want MINT from BOS-PHL and BOS-PBI.....C,mon B6!! Wouldn't this make it EASIER to manage the operation?????
* Unions are coming on property for the main reason that the employees deserve better work rules and pay. We worked hard. We cleaned planes. We put up with entitled customers and the "smoke and mirrors" for too long. It was time. Sorry B6, but your decisions and inability to initiate and rollout new programs to cut cost did not work and STILL arent working. Consider "OTP" On Time Performance......honestly, our performance was better before that program was even started. Mess.
* Just be an airline. Why all this dabble in Tech ventures.....vacations subsidaries....foreign airline tie-ups??? Just get some lounges and join an alliance. Why make things so difficult???
*Focus. I was at work doing what I had to do.....I dont need another "cartoon" filled email describing how we are going to do this....and that.....and this. Get out there and watch the operation. Look at whats going on and then send an email out about what you saw and what needs to be fixed immediately. The airline cant run from you sitting at the desk and bickering amongst eachother about why the FA's want a union and what snack needs to be added......especially when most of your flights are late.....loyalty is down and morale is sinking. Stock is looking abysmal too. $16 bucks? Again: Identity problem. Spirit stock is near $50 and so is Alaska. They know who thy are in the industry.
* There are just 2 types of airlines- ULCC and Legacy. There is no room and no survival for a "hybrid" 3rd. It just isn't working and will not allow B6 to survive alone.
* 2 choices here: Overhaul and become an ULCC or Overhaul and become a Legacy.
 
stlgph
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 12:34 pm

MSPNWA wrote:
Looks like the monthly B6 sucks propoganda thread. They don't have a management problem. They have a "problem" of where they fly and how much they offer customers. B6 is too premium.



Uh........................................
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 1:01 pm

MSPNWA wrote:
Looks like the monthly B6 sucks propoganda thread. They don't have a management problem. They have a "problem" of where they fly and how much they offer customers. B6 is too premium.


jfklganyc wrote:
Facts! Thank u!


Misleading, but yeah, facts.



Explain why it is misleading.

In 2019, I will call out every post I read with statements like this.

Put up your info that shows his facts are misleading or delete your post.
 
IPFreely
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 1:25 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
Explain why it is misleading.

In 2019, I will call out every post I read with statements like this.

Put up your info that shows his facts are misleading or delete your post.


The "facts" are comparing on time performance of Delta mainline only, American mainline only, and JetBlue. Since JetBlue operates all of their own flights and doesn't have underperforming regional airlines to hide behind, it's misleading. Adding in Delta Connection and American Eagle shows the difference between the airlines is negligible, and considering it is data for one month only, the difference is non-existent. Airlines, most notably Delta, like to tout stats claiming how great they are. But Delta being #1 (mainline only) is no consolation to passengers on Delta Connection flights that were delayed and cancelled to protect the mainline results.
 
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enilria
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:00 pm

LawnDart wrote:
It is also indicative that jetBlue's operational performance is, in fact, "really their fault". And that management needs to start managing...

Still no. It's GEOGRAPHY.

Let's call the problem airports these: BOS, LGA, JFK, EWR, DCA, and PHL.

Here's what % of each carrier's flights operate at these airports:
UA 21.1%
DL 22.6%
AA 27.9%
B6 69.7%

So, not only are you at an airport that is impacted by Northeast flow problems, but if you are on JetBlue there is basically a 69% chance your plane is coming from another airport that is impacted, and virtually a 100% chance it was at an impacted airport before that. There's just no way to absorb cascading delays like that unless half the fleet are spares. The other carriers are 3x more likely to be coming from an unaffected airport and if you go two flights back they are still only about 35% likely. Do you understand the math of it?

So what you are really saying is that if the FAA can't fix the Northeast air traffic problem that JetBlue should merge, because there is no way for them to fix it without shoveling money at it for airplanes to sit around all day as spares while there competitors don't need to.
 
flyby519
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:40 pm

isp2 wrote:
I was in B6 Airport Management for nearly 15 years in two of their major focus cities so I will tell it like it is:

When they let Neeleman go in 2007 that took away so much of the pride we all had in our home grown airline.


This sentiment is echoed by many I talk to who have been here since the early days. Neeleman was before my time, but he has certainly left a mark on the employees. They all are aware of his faults, but have a certain twinkle in their eye when the idea of a 'Neeleman return' is brought up.

I suspect Robin will be gone soon after the Europe/fleet review is officially over, maybe late 2019. Joanna will replace him as the CEO. We continue on the downward spiral for another 2-3 years. A merger with AS will be orchestrated and the new CEO of the merged company will be David Neeleman. He has the ability to excite and energize, and both AS/B6 will be in sore need of it by then. There will be rapid growth, likely international long-haul, and truly become a challenger to the legacies.

The subtext will be that Neeleman returns to his baby just like Steve Jobs returned to Apple.
 
AA94
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:43 pm

enilria wrote:
LawnDart wrote:
It is also indicative that jetBlue's operational performance is, in fact, "really their fault". And that management needs to start managing...

Still no. It's GEOGRAPHY.

Let's call the problem airports these: BOS, LGA, JFK, EWR, DCA, and PHL.

Here's what % of each carrier's flights operate at these airports:
UA 21.1%
DL 22.6%
AA 27.9%
B6 69.7%

So, not only are you at an airport that is impacted by Northeast flow problems, but if you are on JetBlue there is basically a 69% chance your plane is coming from another airport that is impacted, and virtually a 100% chance it was at an impacted airport before that. There's just no way to absorb cascading delays like that unless half the fleet are spares. The other carriers are 3x more likely to be coming from an unaffected airport and if you go two flights back they are still only about 35% likely. Do you understand the math of it?

So what you are really saying is that if the FAA can't fix the Northeast air traffic problem that JetBlue should merge, because there is no way for them to fix it without shoveling money at it for airplanes to sit around all day as spares while there competitors don't need to.


THIS. Of course there are processes JetBlue could implement to incrementally improve OTP, but fundamentally the landscape will always be the same. I too would love to run an airline with 30 A320 spares, but it's just not realistic.
 
fastmover
Topic Author
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:47 pm

MSPNWA wrote:
Looks like the monthly B6 sucks propoganda thread. They don't have a management problem. They have a "problem" of where they fly and how much they offer customers. B6 is too premium.


jfklganyc wrote:
Facts! Thank u!


Misleading, but yeah, facts.




Yes and who exactly makes those decisions? Starts with an M
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:38 pm

Besides the relatively small shrinking of Long Beach,and expansion of MINT what has current management done differently? They seem to be running the same strategy as B6 has forever. Little has changed really.

I think B6 really blew it by not developing AUS. Its kind of not too late, though not as good as it was. Delta has not really launched any O&D routes. B6 probably doesn't need to fight DL in more cities though. They already compete alot in NYC, BOS, SLC, LA

What could new management do differently BESIDES a merger. I am not really sure i have a good answer besides AUS (which i admit its late)
 
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smithbs
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:54 pm

I hear the theory of AS and B6 merging all the time on a.net. My question is: what appetite does AS have for another - even bigger - merger after working on swallowing VX? It has been a process for AS to absorb VX financially and operationally, and I'm not sure if it has left a good taste in their mouth or wanting to say "I want more." Can anyone speak to AS's appetite for another hook-up?
 
CobaltScar
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:57 pm

Nothing, there is nothing really left to be done that is not already in the work. Strengthen the existing focus cities, all of which except JFK have plenty of room to grow. After that its merge to take advantage of economies of scale and co-oped a competitor at the same time. Two birds with one stone.

B6 does have a VERY lucrative array of airport assets that will be plug and play ready for whoever acquires them.

I'm getting more and more onboard the Neeleman train and thinking he really is positioning himself to acquire B6 back and cement them together in close relationship with Azul/TAP. With those widebodies we are talking a global carrier overnight, with slots and infrustructure in the most popular North American cities ready to go. This Neeleman backed airline Empire would buy out Alaska (and maybe HA) for the finishing move.
 
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usdcaguy
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 4:28 pm

My experience with B6 has been that they have great staff but that they simply do not hustle. A flight will be late, and you will not see them focusing on getting people seated and the plane pushed back. While much of that may be waiting for bags, things feel sloppy, including the interiors of the plane where any number of video monitors may not work. Should a flight cancel, there often will not be another for hours or even until the next day since they don't have agreements with other carriers. B6 needs to figure out what value they're giving customers and deliver on it. If they are not offering an especially low fare, they need to be delivering on-time performance and stellar service. Otherwise, they aren't giving the market any reason to fly them.

In terms of their future, who knows. If everything works out, I would think they would benefit from a hub at AUS, but other carriers already have a substantial foothold there. Beefing up their hub at FLL, flying Transatlantic and into smaller markets with smaller aircraft might be opportunities but over the long run, they'll need a merger partner if they really want to grow.
 
Galvan316
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 4:39 pm

All these points of view make me a new customer of B6 (Flying ORD-FLL) in May not necessarily nervous, but a little bit concerned.

I am in no way an expert in airline operations, or anything but just as your average Joe Public Flyer, Im concerned.

My wife and I are very loyal AA customers, but due to our schedule will be taking B6 in May, stories and summaries like those that I am reading make me cringe
ORD and MDW is where youll find Me!
 
fastmover
Topic Author
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 4:55 pm

Galvan316 wrote:
All these points of view make me a new customer of B6 (Flying ORD-FLL) in May not necessarily nervous, but a little bit concerned.

I am in no way an expert in airline operations, or anything but just as your average Joe Public Flyer, Im concerned.

My wife and I are very loyal AA customers, but due to our schedule will be taking B6 in May, stories and summaries like those that I am reading make me cringe



You will be just fine. The only problem with ORD is we have 1 gate with many flights. If AA pushes back a wide body we have to wait. Again this is more about the top guys not the employees. I think everyone still likes JetBlue they just worry about it’s current direction. It’s like being married and telling your spouse hey you need to pay attention to the relationship and they are like everything is fine. You can’t keep going like that.
 
CobaltScar
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:02 pm

Im certain you will still be treated better and with more kindness on a B6 flight than on any other airline with possible exception of WN. Despite what some may say, B6 employees still do have pride in their airline and do their best to smile and make passengers feel welcome and safe.

But that is what many are trying to say. B6 is only special for one last reason: Customer Service by front line employees. And those employees that are the last thing making B6 special, feel let down by the higher ups.
 
Blueknows
Posts: 54
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:03 pm

Ok please stop saying hub. Jetblue has focus cities. Being an employee I know B6 is not in the business of connecting customers. So get this Midwest expansion and big hub in AUS stuff outta your head. They promoted Joanne G because of her lawyer background. They want to have one in the room when a merger is being rolled out. Yah our right about the Robin leaving. At B6 we’ve been see that writing on the wall for awhile. B6 will start shifting more point to point when our new terminal is opened in MCO. That’s when you’ll see B6 drop jfk-northeast flights and do directs to MCO. They need to make room for Jfk Europe flights. Also the JFK terminal expansion will bring more international airlines into T5 terminal. We need to stick to what works and just change back to 1 fleet type. What has led to our demise is the two aircraft system.
 
Blueknows
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:05 pm

B6 is the last Us airline to have the e190. All other airlines have dumped the 190 so fast make your head spin. The 190 is a piece of s$&!
 
cledaybuck
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:19 pm

enilria wrote:
LawnDart wrote:
It is also indicative that jetBlue's operational performance is, in fact, "really their fault". And that management needs to start managing...

Still no. It's GEOGRAPHY.

Let's call the problem airports these: BOS, LGA, JFK, EWR, DCA, and PHL.

Here's what % of each carrier's flights operate at these airports:
UA 21.1%
DL 22.6%
AA 27.9%
B6 69.7%

So, not only are you at an airport that is impacted by Northeast flow problems, but if you are on JetBlue there is basically a 69% chance your plane is coming from another airport that is impacted, and virtually a 100% chance it was at an impacted airport before that. There's just no way to absorb cascading delays like that unless half the fleet are spares. The other carriers are 3x more likely to be coming from an unaffected airport and if you go two flights back they are still only about 35% likely. Do you understand the math of it?

So what you are really saying is that if the FAA can't fix the Northeast air traffic problem that JetBlue should merge, because there is no way for them to fix it without shoveling money at it for airplanes to sit around all day as spares while there competitors don't need to.

I think you also have to include SFO as a problem airport.
 
MSPNWA
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:32 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
Explain why it is misleading.

In 2019, I will call out every post I read with statements like this.

Put up your info that shows his facts are misleading or delete your post.


It's already been explained to you by others.

How about you explain to us why they're not misleading since we know they give us an incomplete picture.

fastmover wrote:
Yes and who exactly makes those decisions? Starts with an M


1) They can't simply pack up and move an entire airline (unless you prefer the immediate bankruptcy and liquidation).
2) They also can't control outside macro influences (competitors, ATC, airport authorities, etc.). They can fight, but they can't control.
 
sonicruiser
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:43 pm

B6 needs to do one of two things:

1. It needs explosive growth (ie. AS)
2. It needs larger planes (ie. WS)
 
stlgph
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:47 pm

sonicruiser wrote:
B6 needs to do one of two things:

1. It needs explosive growth (ie. AS)
2. It needs larger planes (ie. WS)


Yes, a massive expansion will definitely solve all the problems. Send your resume today.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
stlgph
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:49 pm

MSPNWA wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:
Explain why it is misleading.

In 2019, I will call out every post I read with statements like this.

Put up your info that shows his facts are misleading or delete your post.


It's already been explained to you by others.

How about you explain to us why they're not misleading since we know they give us an incomplete picture.

fastmover wrote:
Yes and who exactly makes those decisions? Starts with an M


1) They can't simply pack up and move an entire airline (unless you prefer the immediate bankruptcy and liquidation).
2) They also can't control outside macro influences (competitors, ATC, airport authorities, etc.). They can fight, but they can't control.



That's just it. Stop making excuses. JetBlue signed up to an airline in the northeast. They knew what they were getting into. So - what are they doing to work around it?

It's called *m*anaging.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
nine4nine
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 6:06 pm

B6 needs a decent sized west coast focus city to offset the northeast issues of flow and weather. Most west coast airports are maxed out unfortunately.

Could B6 trade all of its slots at LGA to say AA, DL or even UA for gates at LAX and just focus entirely on JFK for its sole NYC operation. I know the LGA slots are extremely sought after and with the perimeter rule in place it really limits B6 on focusing on its bread and butter- International and Transcons. That way they can free up frames and get a foothold in the west while having both NYC area ops at mostly JFK and some with EWR?

Just some creative thinking......
717 727 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 742 748 752 753 762 763 772 773 DC9 MD80/88/90 DC10 319 320 321 332 333 CS100 CRJ200 Q400 E175 E190 ERJ145 EMB120
 
stlgph
Posts: 10818
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:19 pm

Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 6:09 pm

You think *ANY* airline will trade off *ANY* gates at LAX?

Oh man....this place never fails.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
flyby519
Posts: 1356
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2007 3:31 am

Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 6:12 pm

nine4nine wrote:
B6 needs a decent sized west coast focus city to offset the northeast issues of flow and weather. Most west coast airports are maxed out unfortunately.

Could B6 trade all of its slots at LGA to say AA, DL or even UA for gates at LAX and just focus entirely on JFK for its sole NYC operation. I know the LGA slots are extremely sought after and with the perimeter rule in place it really limits B6 on focusing on its bread and butter- International and Transcons. That way they can free up frames and get a foothold in the west while having both NYC area ops at mostly JFK and some with EWR?

Just some creative thinking......



Even if they could get say half a dozen gates in LAX they would be a tiny player in the west coast short haul market and would get crushed by WN, AS, UA, AA, DL, etc.

I like the rumor of giving the entire LGB operation (terminal, slots) to WN in exchange for a few gates in LAX (and/or SFO) so B6 can expand Mint transcons. Realistically, LGB wants short haul daylight flights from LGB and WN is a better carrier to provide that vs B6. Additionally, B6 just wants to grow transcons, which isn't something WN focuses on at all. It would be in WN's interest to help B6 expand Mint transcons in order to put more pressure on AS (WN's closest competitor for short haul intra-west flying).
 
LawnDart
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Re: JetBlue does it need to be saved from its management?

Wed Jan 09, 2019 6:21 pm

enilria wrote:
LawnDart wrote:
It is also indicative that jetBlue's operational performance is, in fact, "really their fault". And that management needs to start managing...


Do you understand the math of it?


I was the manager of Operational Performance at one of the "Big Three". I have a passing knowledge of math...

IPFreely wrote:
The "facts" are comparing on time performance of Delta mainline only, American mainline only, and JetBlue. Since JetBlue operates all of their own flights and doesn't have underperforming regional airlines to hide behind, it's misleading. Adding in Delta Connection and American Eagle shows the difference between the airlines is negligible, and considering it is data for one month only, the difference is non-existent. Airlines, most notably Delta, like to tout stats claiming how great they are. But Delta being #1 (mainline only) is no consolation to passengers on Delta Connection flights that were delayed and cancelled to protect the mainline results.


I completely agree that there is no consolation to passengers for poor on-time performance. So, in deference to them and you, the following statistics include what are called "Branded Codeshare Partners" by the Air Travel Consumer Report.

JFK YTD ended Oct, 2018 (this involved a lot of math (see above)(weighted averages), so I hope the two of you appreciate it.)

AA 21028 flights @ 74.5
DL 47897 flgiths @ 78.4
B6 36051 flights @ 70.9

If we look at YTD System:
AA 77.1 Rank: 7 out of 10
DL 83.1 Rank: 3
B6 70.6 Rank: 9 (out of 10)

and just for comparison (again, System YTD)

AS 83.2 Rank: 2 (impressive considering SEA / SFO / LAX / Trans Con)
NK 80.6 Rank: 4 (also impressive based on their efforts to improve)
F9 68.8 Rank: 10

The fact of the matter is, all airlines need to take into account things like geography, weather, high-density rules airports, ATC, staffing, turn times, block time reliability and on and on, when planning to operate a system of flights to the best of their ability and to the benefit of their customers (see NK).

At one point, DL was among the most unreliable airlines in the industry measured by on-time performance and completion factor. Their management team made the decision to stop being sh!tty, and they implemented a plan and followed through with it. Kudos to the entire team at Delta!

MSPNWA wrote:
Misleading, but yeah, facts.


Lies...damn lies...statistics...

I can parse the data from today thru forever, and you guys can reply "Yeah, but Gorsuch", so I'm not really sure what else I can do. Besides, my brain hurts from doing all this math and my pencil is now a stub, so...bye.

Keeping in mind the environment they operate in (their choice) and the effort they are willing to apply to the problem (their choice) for the sake of their customers and employees (their choice), it would appear jetBlue management needs to start managing.

Their choice.

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