Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR
audidudi wrote:Three more movements (courtesy of skyliner-aviation.de):
Boeing 767-323 25450 495 N381AN American Airlines ferried 31 March 2019 JFK-ROW for storage
Boeing 767-323 27449 564 N389AA Cargo Aircraft Management ferried 01 April 2019 ROW-MZJ prior freighter conversion
Boeing 767-304 28039 610 I-AIGJ Airitaly Meridiana cs, ferried 01-02 April 2019 LDE-MXP-TLV, for freighter conversion** prior delivery to? ex N769NA
NG263 wrote:Possible candidate for a future life with UPS is JA611J of JAL. According to planespotters.net it has been withdrawn from use in August 2018. Sister ships JA604J, JA605J & JA609J have already been converted for UPS.
hkcanadaexpat wrote:NG263 wrote:Possible candidate for a future life with UPS is JA611J of JAL. According to planespotters.net it has been withdrawn from use in August 2018. Sister ships JA604J, JA605J & JA609J have already been converted for UPS.
It will need to be "rebuilt" first. Last few pictures from HND saw it being used as spares for other aircraft.
1989worstyear wrote:Is JAL retiring their 763 fleet?
TzvikaPick wrote:El Al is selling used 767-300ER to a foreign airline
https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-el-a ... 1001282185
That might be 4x-eak, AFAIK the only 767 owned by ElAl and not leased.
747classic wrote:According the latest Boeing Orders& Deliveries page four (4) 767-300F aircraft are ordered by an unidentified customer at Feb 22th 2019.
Any thoughts about the customer ?
na wrote:747classic wrote:According the latest Boeing Orders& Deliveries page four (4) 767-300F aircraft are ordered by an unidentified customer at Feb 22th 2019.
Any thoughts about the customer ?
The 767-300(F) is late 80s/early 90s technology equivalent to a 744F. How come the 767 is still somewhat competitive that someone wants to buy them new? Is it only that the 767 (and 757) sized aircraft niche is a market completely forgotten by the manufacturers for two decades?
747classic wrote:According the latest Boeing Orders& Deliveries page four (4) 767-300F aircraft are ordered by an unidentified customer at Feb 22th 2019.
Any thoughts about the customer ?
na wrote:747classic wrote:According the latest Boeing Orders& Deliveries page four (4) 767-300F aircraft are ordered by an unidentified customer at Feb 22th 2019.
Any thoughts about the customer ?
The 767-300(F) is late 80s/early 90s technology equivalent to a 744F. How come the 767 is still somewhat competitive that someone wants to buy them new? Is it only that the 767 (and 757) sized aircraft niche is a market completely forgotten by the manufacturers for two decades?
na wrote:The 767-300(F) is late 80s/early 90s technology equivalent to a 744F. How come the 767 is still somewhat competitive that someone wants to buy them new?
audidudi wrote:747classic wrote:According the latest Boeing Orders& Deliveries page four (4) 767-300F aircraft are ordered by an unidentified customer at Feb 22th 2019.
Any thoughts about the customer ?
FedEx or UPS?
747classic wrote:According the latest Boeing Orders& Deliveries page four (4) 767-300F aircraft are ordered by an unidentified customer at Feb 22th 2019.
Any thoughts about the customer ?
audidudi wrote:An ex-DL B763ER, N1501P, is now on the move after it's retirement from DL's fleet, and will become a freighter. I wonder why it was retired in the first place if it wasn't ready to be scrapped? (info from skyliner-aviation.de).
Boeing 767-3P6 24983 334 N409AZ Cargo Aircraft Management delivery 30 April 2019 SBD-ILN, old N-reg prior freighter conversion ex-N1501P
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N1501P
1989worstyear wrote:All of the 763's are being replaced by A332's and A339's as they come online.
There probably won't be any left in 5 years - same goes with the whole 752 fleet.
747classic wrote:The first "new" UPS 767-300F since 2013 after paint (and still without winglets?)
747classic wrote:The current UPS 767 (and 757) fleet is also upgraded to the same Rockwell Collins Large Display System (LDS)
A total of 62 UPS 767-300's will be (are already) upgraded.
Elshad wrote:Are new build 767s now being fitted with LCDs at the factory? I saw a video of one being built a only a few years ago and it was still being fitted with CRTs.
7BOEING7 wrote:Elshad wrote:Are new build 767s now being fitted with LCDs at the factory? I saw a video of one being built a only a few years ago and it was still being fitted with CRTs.
They’re doing the certification (see above) because this is the first one. The certification done for refit on 767’s in the fleet doesn’t apply to new builds.
wjcandee wrote:747classic wrote:The current UPS 767 (and 757) fleet is also upgraded to the same Rockwell Collins Large Display System (LDS)
A total of 62 UPS 767-300's will be (are already) upgraded.
The 767s are being done at ILN. I think they're currently on the second one.
The 757s are being done somewhere else.
lightsaber wrote:7BOEING7 wrote:Elshad wrote:Are new build 767s now being fitted with LCDs at the factory? I saw a video of one being built a only a few years ago and it was still being fitted with CRTs.
They’re doing the certification (see above) because this is the first one. The certification done for refit on 767’s in the fleet doesn’t apply to new builds.
A refit certification is a superset of what is required from the factory. Once certified, these will be factory delivered.
Lightsaber
jagraham wrote:lightsaber wrote:7BOEING7 wrote:
They’re doing the certification (see above) because this is the first one. The certification done for refit on 767’s in the fleet doesn’t apply to new builds.
A refit certification is a superset of what is required from the factory. Once certified, these will be factory delivered.
Lightsaber
The KC46s have a new flightdeck from Rockwell Collins
https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news ... it-details
wjcandee wrote:jagraham wrote:lightsaber wrote:A refit certification is a superset of what is required from the factory. Once certified, these will be factory delivered.
Lightsaber
The KC46s have a new flightdeck from Rockwell Collins
https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news ... it-details
Very different from the retrofit Collins display being installed at UPS and elsewhere.
TzvikaPick wrote:El Al is selling used 767-300ER to a foreign airline
https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-el-a ... 1001282185
That might be 4x-eak, AFAIK the only 767 owned by ElAl and not leased.
jagraham wrote:Understood. But there is a new certified flightdeck already. Why didn't UPS and the others adapt it? For that matter, why didn't Boeing offer it on the 763s once they got it done for the KC46?
aemoreira1981 wrote:TzvikaPick wrote:El Al is selling used 767-300ER to a foreign airline
https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-el-a ... 1001282185
That might be 4x-eak, AFAIK the only 767 owned by ElAl and not leased.
The one they owned was 4X-EAP, which is an 8-door frame. That was sold to the co-owner of Eastern Airlines (2D). It has different engines from the RR-powered 2D fleet, but I would not be surprised to see this end up in Eastern colors unless used as a parts frame to support the Eastern fleet.
As for DL, the ones needing replacement soon are the remainder of ships 171-184, 1402 (the last non-ER in the fleet), and the 6-door examples (N394DL would be an oddball once the ex-GF B763s are finally retired). This is basically the oldest 18 plus N394DL. That said, DL will fly them until they can no longer fly as all of the B763s (and B764s) at DL are owned.
audidudi wrote:An ex-DL B763ER, N1501P, is now on the move after it's retirement from DL's fleet, and will become a freighter. I wonder why it was retired in the first place if it wasn't ready to be scrapped? (info from skyliner-aviation.de).
Boeing 767-3P6 24983 334 N409AZ Cargo Aircraft Management delivery 30 April 2019 SBD-ILN, old N-reg prior freighter conversion ex-N1501P
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N1501P
audidudi wrote:An ex-DL B763ER, N1501P, is now on the move after it's retirement from DL's fleet, and will become a freighter. I wonder why it was retired in the first place if it wasn't ready to be scrapped? (info from skyliner-aviation.de).
Boeing 767-3P6 24983 334 N409AZ Cargo Aircraft Management delivery 30 April 2019 SBD-ILN, old N-reg prior freighter conversion ex-N1501P
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N1501P
Stitch wrote:jagraham wrote:Understood. But there is a new certified flightdeck already. Why didn't UPS and the others adapt it? For that matter, why didn't Boeing offer it on the 763s once they got it done for the KC46?
The design adopted by FedEx and UPS is designed for both the 757 and 767 and uses three displays. The KC-46A is modeled on the 787 and uses four displays. It is possible that the KC-46A cockpit is too complex and/or expensive to retrofit on the 757 and the already-built 767 fleet.
yochai wrote:audidudi wrote:An ex-DL B763ER, N1501P, is now on the move after it's retirement from DL's fleet, and will become a freighter. I wonder why it was retired in the first place if it wasn't ready to be scrapped? (info from skyliner-aviation.de).
Boeing 767-3P6 24983 334 N409AZ Cargo Aircraft Management delivery 30 April 2019 SBD-ILN, old N-reg prior freighter conversion ex-N1501P
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N1501P
Scheduled into TLV for freighter conversion on Friday morning if all goes according to plan.
aemoreira1981 wrote:yochai wrote:audidudi wrote:An ex-DL B763ER, N1501P, is now on the move after it's retirement from DL's fleet, and will become a freighter. I wonder why it was retired in the first place if it wasn't ready to be scrapped? (info from skyliner-aviation.de).
Boeing 767-3P6 24983 334 N409AZ Cargo Aircraft Management delivery 30 April 2019 SBD-ILN, old N-reg prior freighter conversion ex-N1501P
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N1501P
Scheduled into TLV for freighter conversion on Friday morning if all goes according to plan.
Given that N409AZ has less than 40,000 hours left of time, I'm surprised it didn't get scrapped. Then again, this could fly for about 10 years as a freighter before it ends up timing out. I wouldn't be surprised to see some B763s being retired just short of the limit of validity (150,000 hours). N409AZ has more than 110,000 hours on it. This frame will run out of hours before it runs out of cycles.
Spacepope wrote:aemoreira1981 wrote:yochai wrote:
Scheduled into TLV for freighter conversion on Friday morning if all goes according to plan.
Given that N409AZ has less than 40,000 hours left of time, I'm surprised it didn't get scrapped. Then again, this could fly for about 10 years as a freighter before it ends up timing out. I wouldn't be surprised to see some B763s being retired just short of the limit of validity (150,000 hours). N409AZ has more than 110,000 hours on it. This frame will run out of hours before it runs out of cycles.
I'm with you in the camp of being shocked anything with over 100,000 hours is converted. But apparently the demand is there. The airframes getting broken up lately are just the former ANA 300ER birds which are hitting cycle limits, the 767-281Fs from CAM which are hitting cycle limits, and the non-er and RR powered 300s which don't have a conversion program.
Even with heavy use, you'll probably not see much higher than 2000-2500 hours of freighter use per year, so this aircraft has probably closer to 20 years of service after conversion possible. It's just going to have fun aging airframe issues while doing it, but CAM seems to be able to mitigate that just fine for now. I'm sure the accountants have run the numbers.
Elshad wrote:Stitch wrote:jagraham wrote:Understood. But there is a new certified flightdeck already. Why didn't UPS and the others adapt it? For that matter, why didn't Boeing offer it on the 763s once they got it done for the KC46?
The design adopted by FedEx and UPS is designed for both the 757 and 767 and uses three displays. The KC-46A is modeled on the 787 and uses four displays. It is possible that the KC-46A cockpit is too complex and/or expensive to retrofit on the 757 and the already-built 767 fleet.
Retrofitting the four KC-46 / 787 displays would require moving the gear level and various other things etc.
JohnO67 wrote:According to the AWL document, the LOV of a 767-300BCF is 75,000 Flight Cycles and 180,000 Flight Hours
The LOV of a 767-300F is 60,000 Flight Cycles and 180,000 Flight Hours.
So, it a bit closer to 70,000 flight hours left. Quite a bit of life for a freighter.