Supersarestupid
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2019 2:28 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 27, 2019 9:30 pm

VS4ever wrote:
https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airlineroute/284061/turkish-airlines-s20-long-haul-changes-as-of-25apr19/
TK switching to 789 from 333 for next summer , increase of 11 seats from 289 to 300, 30 business and 270 economy

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... increases/

KE moves to 5 weekly for Dec and January from the previous 4 weekly



Excited about direct aisle access on the TK 789!!
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 27, 2019 9:50 pm

5 routes to East Asia (and probably will be 6-7 in a couple of years) and possibly both routes BOS has had to South America are gone by the end of the year per the GRU-FCO axing thread. Is it just South America economy? Bad luck with the carriers restructuring? Is it geography? Is it CM being the first mover? I didn't find BOS-GRU flights to be particularly cheap since JJ has started.

Ignoring the fact that PVG/PEK are possibly subsidized and/or loss making, what makes Asia that more lucrative? Is J-Class or high yielding Y buoying everything else as I observed anecdotally on BOS-HKG?

I wonder if it works like this:

Boston-Europe J-Class - employers need to pay for J to be competitive or since people are arriving in LON/FRA etc on short notice and need the rest.
Boston-Asia J-Class - employers need to pay for J for their employees to be comfortable.
Boston-S.A. - employers say suck it up and take the cheapest flight - its not much of a time change.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
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Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 27, 2019 10:07 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
Boston-Europe J-Class - employers need to pay for J to be competitive or since people are arriving in LON/FRA etc on short notice and need the rest.
Boston-Asia J-Class - employers need to pay for J for their employees to be comfortable.
Boston-S.A. - employers say suck it up and take the cheapest flight - its not much of a time change.


Maybe large corporations have lucrative (read cheap) contracts with airlines to get their employees to Europe and Asia, while they don't have those contracts in place for South America?
We know for instance that Apple has a large contract with UA to fly their employees to Asia, but there is no indication that such a contract exist for South America. In fact, what business ties are there between the US and South America that warrant large corporate airfare business contracts?
 
B6BOSfan
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 27, 2019 11:02 pm

I work at one of the local TV stations in Boston, and as someone who uses the airport quite often for personal trips (via Logan Express), I've been playing email tag with Massport PR officials.

The #1 goal of Massport is to move people away from using ride-sharing and getting them to use public transportation/Logan Express. There is an extreme push by the agency to DOUBLE the amount of people using the LEX buses to the airport. That would push the amount of people using the service from around 2 million annually to 4 million annually.

They are tweaking their Back Bay bus service starting May 1, moving the stop to the MBTA Orange Line/Commuter Line station.

They will also launch a North Station/Logan Airport Logan Express service in the coming months. They're going to be free from Logan Airport and $3 to the airport.

They have announced they will be increasing the amount of buses serving their Framingham and Braintree stations, from every 30 minutes to every 20 minutes weekdays. Those two locations are the busiest in the system, and parking is already overloaded on busy days. The buses are also overloaded, with passengers having to wait for the next bus at peak times.

I asked them about the parking lot sizes -- since Framingham's brand new garage is already overloaded, and Braintree's lot is near capacity. Massport said they will be adding new levels to the Framingham garage, and expanding parking at Braintree.

They said they are also actively looking at new locations, and that includes spots "inside 128." They are also planning some kind of "check-in" your bags service as you get on the bus, making for more convenient access to the terminal when you arrive.

The significant problem with Logan Express (and honestly, Boston transit in general), is how early things shut down. The last Logan Express bus from the airport is 10PM for Back Bay, and 1:15 am for the suburban lots. Then, the next bus comes at 6:30am (or 7:30 on Sunday). What if that scheduled late night flight gets in late? What about those redeye flights that come in overnight? Transit is not an option, and won't be anytime in the near future.

I've pushed them on adding service during off-peak hours, and right now, they said there are no plans to add overnight service.

The MBTA is no better. As someone who lives in Dedham, I should be able to use mass-transit to get to Logan Airport for a flight before 7am. Right now, I can't, unless I use Logan Express, requiring me to drive 8 miles to Braintree or Framingham.

The situation with ride-share vehicle drop-offs at the airport has become out of control. Massport believes they are a big part of the major traffic jams you see during parts of the day, creating congestion on airport roads AND inside the harbor tunnels leading to the airport.

Logan Airport already uses a kind of centralized pick-up area, and those areas are also overloaded during peak hours.

The Central Parking Garage solution will be on the first floor of the garage, so passengers arriving WILL need to take the elevators to the fourth floor to get to their respective terminals. According to Massport, the plan is to have some kind of Skycap service right inside the dropoff area, to assist passengers with bags.

With the loss of 1,000 parking spaces inside the Central Garage, I also have to wonder if we will see parking price increases again. They will need some kind of incentive to keep personal cars away from the airport, and try and drive more people toward using Logan Express.

I really do think in a few years, if this plan doesn't work, we will be talking about tolls for cars/vans to drop-off people at Logan Airport. With toll-by-plate, you can setup a gantry in entrance spots fairly easily. It won't be popular with anyone, including me.

I think officials also need to look at some kind of HOV lane for getting transit through the Harbor tunnels faster. This is badly needed, since they can sit in traffic for 20 minutes or more at peak times -- providing no incentive to get to the destination faster. The silver line buses use the same road the cars so, probably one of the biggest oversights of the Big Dig project of the early 2000s.
 
BostonBound
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 1:02 am

I travel to South America and Mexico frequently for work. The direct flight options from BOS have been on subpar equipment or at terrible times. I’ve always preferred to connect at MIA, DFW or JFK.
 
tphuang
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 2:16 am

South America seems like something B6 can work on if they can get more connections through their own metal or partners. MEX is a big test imo. If they can get it to show good performance over time, then they can try BOG or other big Latin American markets.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 3:11 am

B6BOSfan wrote:
I work at one of the local TV stations in Boston, and as someone who uses the airport quite often for personal trips (via Logan Express), I've been playing email tag with Massport PR officials.

The #1 goal of Massport is to move people away from using ride-sharing and getting them to use public transportation/Logan Express. There is an extreme push by the agency to DOUBLE the amount of people using the LEX buses to the airport. That would push the amount of people using the service from around 2 million annually to 4 million annually.

They are tweaking their Back Bay bus service starting May 1, moving the stop to the MBTA Orange Line/Commuter Line station.

They will also launch a North Station/Logan Airport Logan Express service in the coming months. They're going to be free from Logan Airport and $3 to the airport.

They have announced they will be increasing the amount of buses serving their Framingham and Braintree stations, from every 30 minutes to every 20 minutes weekdays. Those two locations are the busiest in the system, and parking is already overloaded on busy days. The buses are also overloaded, with passengers having to wait for the next bus at peak times.

I asked them about the parking lot sizes -- since Framingham's brand new garage is already overloaded, and Braintree's lot is near capacity. Massport said they will be adding new levels to the Framingham garage, and expanding parking at Braintree.

They said they are also actively looking at new locations, and that includes spots "inside 128." They are also planning some kind of "check-in" your bags service as you get on the bus, making for more convenient access to the terminal when you arrive.

The significant problem with Logan Express (and honestly, Boston transit in general), is how early things shut down. The last Logan Express bus from the airport is 10PM for Back Bay, and 1:15 am for the suburban lots. Then, the next bus comes at 6:30am (or 7:30 on Sunday). What if that scheduled late night flight gets in late? What about those redeye flights that come in overnight? Transit is not an option, and won't be anytime in the near future.

I've pushed them on adding service during off-peak hours, and right now, they said there are no plans to add overnight service.

The MBTA is no better. As someone who lives in Dedham, I should be able to use mass-transit to get to Logan Airport for a flight before 7am. Right now, I can't, unless I use Logan Express, requiring me to drive 8 miles to Braintree or Framingham.

The situation with ride-share vehicle drop-offs at the airport has become out of control. Massport believes they are a big part of the major traffic jams you see during parts of the day, creating congestion on airport roads AND inside the harbor tunnels leading to the airport.

Logan Airport already uses a kind of centralized pick-up area, and those areas are also overloaded during peak hours.

The Central Parking Garage solution will be on the first floor of the garage, so passengers arriving WILL need to take the elevators to the fourth floor to get to their respective terminals. According to Massport, the plan is to have some kind of Skycap service right inside the dropoff area, to assist passengers with bags.

With the loss of 1,000 parking spaces inside the Central Garage, I also have to wonder if we will see parking price increases again. They will need some kind of incentive to keep personal cars away from the airport, and try and drive more people toward using Logan Express.

I really do think in a few years, if this plan doesn't work, we will be talking about tolls for cars/vans to drop-off people at Logan Airport. With toll-by-plate, you can setup a gantry in entrance spots fairly easily. It won't be popular with anyone, including me.

I think officials also need to look at some kind of HOV lane for getting transit through the Harbor tunnels faster. This is badly needed, since they can sit in traffic for 20 minutes or more at peak times -- providing no incentive to get to the destination faster. The silver line buses use the same road the cars so, probably one of the biggest oversights of the Big Dig project of the early 2000s.


Thanks for all that insight, I think that clearly shows where Massports heads are, it’s alright Pushing and anti TNC agenda, and push with public transportation, but you have to provide the alternatives to do so, they are not, so this becomes an inconvenience to the traveling public and a cash grab in the form of higher fees.
And as I said before, i don’t think this is going to discourage TNC riders, they are just going to pay more ultimately for it and although I am not a traffic planner of any description, I still say the projected growth of BOS is going to be a counterweight to the attempt to reduce the number of trips.
Interestingly they were approved to add more spaces but now it looks like 1000 are going away. Funny that.. budget for FY20 coming soon, got to think July 1st that daily parking rates is going to go up unless they have already confirmed it won’t, but I do not believe that to be the case
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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dvincent
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 4:37 am

B6BOSfan wrote:
I work at one of the local TV stations in Boston, and as someone who uses the airport quite often for personal trips (via Logan Express), I've been playing email tag with Massport PR officials.

The #1 goal of Massport is to move people away from using ride-sharing and getting them to use public transportation/Logan Express. There is an extreme push by the agency to DOUBLE the amount of people using the LEX buses to the airport. That would push the amount of people using the service from around 2 million annually to 4 million annually.

They are tweaking their Back Bay bus service starting May 1, moving the stop to the MBTA Orange Line/Commuter Line station.

They will also launch a North Station/Logan Airport Logan Express service in the coming months. They're going to be free from Logan Airport and $3 to the airport.

They have announced they will be increasing the amount of buses serving their Framingham and Braintree stations, from every 30 minutes to every 20 minutes weekdays. Those two locations are the busiest in the system, and parking is already overloaded on busy days. The buses are also overloaded, with passengers having to wait for the next bus at peak times.

I asked them about the parking lot sizes -- since Framingham's brand new garage is already overloaded, and Braintree's lot is near capacity. Massport said they will be adding new levels to the Framingham garage, and expanding parking at Braintree.

They said they are also actively looking at new locations, and that includes spots "inside 128." They are also planning some kind of "check-in" your bags service as you get on the bus, making for more convenient access to the terminal when you arrive.

The significant problem with Logan Express (and honestly, Boston transit in general), is how early things shut down. The last Logan Express bus from the airport is 10PM for Back Bay, and 1:15 am for the suburban lots. Then, the next bus comes at 6:30am (or 7:30 on Sunday). What if that scheduled late night flight gets in late? What about those redeye flights that come in overnight? Transit is not an option, and won't be anytime in the near future.

I've pushed them on adding service during off-peak hours, and right now, they said there are no plans to add overnight service.

The MBTA is no better. As someone who lives in Dedham, I should be able to use mass-transit to get to Logan Airport for a flight before 7am. Right now, I can't, unless I use Logan Express, requiring me to drive 8 miles to Braintree or Framingham.

The situation with ride-share vehicle drop-offs at the airport has become out of control. Massport believes they are a big part of the major traffic jams you see during parts of the day, creating congestion on airport roads AND inside the harbor tunnels leading to the airport.

Logan Airport already uses a kind of centralized pick-up area, and those areas are also overloaded during peak hours.

The Central Parking Garage solution will be on the first floor of the garage, so passengers arriving WILL need to take the elevators to the fourth floor to get to their respective terminals. According to Massport, the plan is to have some kind of Skycap service right inside the dropoff area, to assist passengers with bags.

With the loss of 1,000 parking spaces inside the Central Garage, I also have to wonder if we will see parking price increases again. They will need some kind of incentive to keep personal cars away from the airport, and try and drive more people toward using Logan Express.

I really do think in a few years, if this plan doesn't work, we will be talking about tolls for cars/vans to drop-off people at Logan Airport. With toll-by-plate, you can setup a gantry in entrance spots fairly easily. It won't be popular with anyone, including me.

I think officials also need to look at some kind of HOV lane for getting transit through the Harbor tunnels faster. This is badly needed, since they can sit in traffic for 20 minutes or more at peak times -- providing no incentive to get to the destination faster. The silver line buses use the same road the cars so, probably one of the biggest oversights of the Big Dig project of the early 2000s.


Thank you so much for your legwork, this is great insight. Your points about LEX and how people choose modes, along with Massport (and MBTA's) shortsightnedness about early/late arrivals are an achilles heel for the LEX system, along with the reduced frequencies on certain days/times. With how popular the Framingham and Braintree locations are, it makes me a bit happy that Woburn is my preferred location. I've never been turned away from a parking spot or a bus.

I've been a victim of the "flight gets delayed and arrive late after LEX stops running." At that point, ironically I had to split a lyft with a flight attendant to get back to Woburn.

HOV lanes on the tunnels would be a smart idea, except the tunnels are already lane-limited (in that there's only two lanes each direction for both the Ted and the Sumner/Callahan tunnels).
From the Mind of Minolta
 
Kno
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 5:50 am

B6BOSfan wrote:
I work at one of the local TV stations in Boston, and as someone who uses the airport quite often for personal trips (via Logan Express), I've been playing email tag with Massport PR officials.

The #1 goal of Massport is to move people away from using ride-sharing and getting them to use public transportation/Logan Express. There is an extreme push by the agency to DOUBLE the amount of people using the LEX buses to the airport. That would push the amount of people using the service from around 2 million annually to 4 million annually.


That’s a shame because the public transportation options are garbage and there doesn’t seem to be a real plan to make that any better.

Everything I’ve heard lately seems like bad news for people who live in towns that border the 95 belt, where we can access the airport in 20-30mins and get there affordably via ride sharing and only have commuter rail access or are on the far ends of the T. I love my home town but when I travel it’s painfully obvious how piss poor and mismanaged our public transportation is relative to other cities.

For an airport that’s one of the most convenient geographically to the city it’s a shame how much of a hassle it is to access conveniently and affordably. For many of us ride sharing was the one salvation in that issue but it sounds like that might be ending soon.

How about some Logan express services to places other than far away towns? There’s an idea. Riverside is a no brainer, it connects to the green line and could serve most
Of Newton and Waltham and Needham... Weston etc. Why does this not exist?
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 11:45 am

adamh8297 wrote:
5 routes to East Asia (and probably will be 6-7 in a couple of years) and possibly both routes BOS has had to South America are gone by the end of the year per the GRU-FCO axing thread. Is it just South America economy? Bad luck with the carriers restructuring? Is it geography? Is it CM being the first mover? I didn't find BOS-GRU flights to be particularly cheap since JJ has started.

Ignoring the fact that PVG/PEK are possibly subsidized and/or loss making, what makes Asia that more lucrative?


What makes Asia that much more lucrative? Volume for starters.
New England's economy has always been much more aligned with Europe and Asia than with Latin America. Our geographic location doesn't help either. A route between Boston and LatAm overflies just about every major north-south hub there is. And socially we don't really have that much immigration from LatAm. The Brazilian immigration here is a little overplayed IMO. By comparison the Italian diaspora is far larger and the leisure market to Italy also large but until this year all we had was 1 measly non-stop to Rome.

B6BOSfan wrote:
The #1 goal of Massport is to move people away from using ride-sharing and getting them to use public transportation/Logan Express.

That right there tells me all I already knew about Massport when it comes to this topic. They are clueless!
This generation doesn't do Taxis. This generation has been around the world and seen what real, efficient public transportation looks like.
Ride sharing is not going to go away and it's only going to increase and if Massport thinks there are too many cars on the road now, just wait for the next step in this evolution which is autonomous vehicles. That is coming faster than people think. What's Massport going to do then? Forbid me from driving my own car to the airport and then send it home so I don't have to pay for parking?
And save for a massive investment in public transportation (we're talking Big Dig kind of investment), that too is never going to be an alternative. Even if Mass/Boston find the money to invest in public transportation it will be a couple of decade until it is available to the public. What public transportation infrastructure has Boston built in the last 50 years? That's the problem.
Absolutely no one if ever going to take the crappy commuter rail to North station to then pay an extra fare to get to the airport while hauling luggage. Its ludicrous that in the year 2019 we still don't have seamless transfers between the commuter rail and subway. And I can't imagine that many people are going to opt to take the slow as molasses and overcrowded Green Line to the Blue Line to the shuttle bus in order to get on a flight. The faster Massport stops fighting progress in this area the faster they'll find a solution. Until then it will be business as usual: The population keeps increasing, the demand keeps increasing, public transit will be ever more miserable and they'll keep wondering why people aren't taking the crappy public transportation and opting for Rideshare instead.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 12:08 pm

B6BOSfan wrote:
The #1 goal of Massport is to move people away from using ride-sharing and getting them to use public transportation/Logan Express.

That right there tells me all I already knew about Massport when it comes to this topic. They are clueless!
This generation doesn't do Taxis. This generation has been around the world and seen what real, efficient public transportation looks like.
Ride sharing is not going to go away and it's only going to increase and if Massport thinks there are too many cars on the road now, just wait for the next step in this evolution which is autonomous vehicles. That is coming faster than people think. What's Massport going to do then? Forbid me from driving my own car to the airport and then send it home so I don't have to pay for parking?
And save for a massive investment in public transportation (we're talking Big Dig kind of investment), that too is never going to be an alternative. Even if Mass/Boston find the money to invest in public transportation it will be a couple of decade until it is available to the public. What public transportation infrastructure has Boston built in the last 50 years? That's the problem.
Absolutely no one if ever going to take the crappy commuter rail to North station to then pay an extra fare to get to the airport while hauling luggage. Its ludicrous that in the year 2019 we still don't have seamless transfers between the commuter rail and subway. And I can't imagine that many people are going to opt to take the slow as molasses and overcrowded Green Line to the Blue Line to the shuttle bus in order to get on a flight. The faster Massport stops fighting progress in this area the faster they'll find a solution. Until then it will be business as usual: The population keeps increasing, the demand keeps increasing, public transit will be ever more miserable and they'll keep wondering why people aren't taking the crappy public transportation and opting for Rideshare instead.[/quote]

I am going to disagree on #1 goal for Massport being the switch to public transport I say that’s #2. #1 goal is money, switching people to LEX is more money in their pocket, charging extra for ride share is more money. You could see it all through the presentations.
I agree with airbazar, Massport are trying to solve a 21st century problem with 20th century thinking and set up. If they think I am going to drive out to Peabody and take LEX in when there is no guarantee I can get back, they have another thing coming
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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dvincent
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 12:33 pm

Kno wrote:
For an airport that’s one of the most convenient geographically to the city it’s a shame how much of a hassle it is to access conveniently and affordably. For many of us ride sharing was the one salvation in that issue but it sounds like that might be ending soon.

How about some Logan express services to places other than far away towns? There’s an idea. Riverside is a no brainer, it connects to the green line and could serve most
Of Newton and Waltham and Needham... Weston etc. Why does this not exist?


Currently they'd tell you to go to Framingham, which doesn't make sense for most western 128 towns. I never backtracked to it. When I lived in those towns I drove in and used off-airport parking lots.

They talked about how they wanted to make more 128 LEX stops. Riverside would make sense but the parking lot there already gets strained by the green line.

I say buy out the Watertown mall and turn the parking lot into a LEX lot.
From the Mind of Minolta
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 2:33 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
5 routes to East Asia (and probably will be 6-7 in a couple of years) and possibly both routes BOS has had to South America are gone by the end of the year per the GRU-FCO axing thread. Is it just South America economy?


Not sure if I’m misunderstanding your post - but 5 BOS-E Asia routes and GRU are rumored to be cut by EoY?
 
Kno
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 2:43 pm

airbazar wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
5 routes to East Asia (and probably will be 6-7 in a couple of years) and possibly both routes BOS has had to South America are gone by the end of the year per the GRU-FCO axing thread. Is it just South America economy? Bad luck with the carriers restructuring? Is it geography? Is it CM being the first mover? I didn't find BOS-GRU flights to be particularly cheap since JJ has started.

Ignoring the fact that PVG/PEK are possibly subsidized and/or loss making, what makes Asia that more lucrative?


What makes Asia that much more lucrative? Volume for starters.
New England's economy has always been much more aligned with Europe and Asia than with Latin America. Our geographic location doesn't help either. A route between Boston and LatAm overflies just about every major north-south hub there is. And socially we don't really have that much immigration from LatAm. The Brazilian immigration here is a little overplayed IMO. By comparison the Italian diaspora is far larger and the leisure market to Italy also large but until this year all we had was 1 measly non-stop to Rome.

B6BOSfan wrote:
The #1 goal of Massport is to move people away from using ride-sharing and getting them to use public transportation/Logan Express.

That right there tells me all I already knew about Massport when it comes to this topic. They are clueless!
This generation doesn't do Taxis. This generation has been around the world and seen what real, efficient public transportation looks like.
Ride sharing is not going to go away and it's only going to increase and if Massport thinks there are too many cars on the road now, just wait for the next step in this evolution which is autonomous vehicles. That is coming faster than people think. What's Massport going to do then? Forbid me from driving my own car to the airport and then send it home so I don't have to pay for parking?
And save for a massive investment in public transportation (we're talking Big Dig kind of investment), that too is never going to be an alternative. Even if Mass/Boston find the money to invest in public transportation it will be a couple of decade until it is available to the public. What public transportation infrastructure has Boston built in the last 50 years? That's the problem.
Absolutely no one if ever going to take the crappy commuter rail to North station to then pay an extra fare to get to the airport while hauling luggage. Its ludicrous that in the year 2019 we still don't have seamless transfers between the commuter rail and subway. And I can't imagine that many people are going to opt to take the slow as molasses and overcrowded Green Line to the Blue Line to the shuttle bus in order to get on a flight. The faster Massport stops fighting progress in this area the faster they'll find a solution. Until then it will be business as usual: The population keeps increasing, the demand keeps increasing, public transit will be ever more miserable and they'll keep wondering why people aren't taking the crappy public transportation and opting for Rideshare instead.


Massport really has nothing decent to offer for a vast majority of its communities to access the airport, and most of the taxi companies want half of your airfare to get you one way to the airport in communities that are 20-25mins from the airport while ride share apps are asking for $20.

dvincent wrote:
Kno wrote:
For an airport that’s one of the most convenient geographically to the city it’s a shame how much of a hassle it is to access conveniently and affordably. For many of us ride sharing was the one salvation in that issue but it sounds like that might be ending soon.

How about some Logan express services to places other than far away towns? There’s an idea. Riverside is a no brainer, it connects to the green line and could serve most
Of Newton and Waltham and Needham... Weston etc. Why does this not exist?


Currently they'd tell you to go to Framingham, which doesn't make sense for most western 128 towns. I never backtracked to it. When I lived in those towns I drove in and used off-airport parking lots.

They talked about how they wanted to make more 128 LEX stops. Riverside would make sense but the parking lot there already gets strained by the green line.

I say buy out the Watertown mall and turn the parking lot into a LEX lot.



The problem with the Watertown mall is that buses would have to backtrack 10-15mins to get to the mass pike or drive on crowded residential streets to get to the airport.

Don’t get me wrong Watertown itself could definitely use better service to the airport but having people go from neighboring towns with better highway access to Watertown to get the airport seems very time consuming and inefficient.

To really serve several communities in a sensible way the LEX stop needs to be near the intersection of 95 and the pike. You’re absolutely right about the parking situation there, id say build a parking garage, widen grove st near the entrance to have a turning lane, add an on ramp for direct highway access from the station, and rebuild the bus terminal so it’s not the current dump that it is. Yes it’s a big project but certainly no more so than buying new land and location wise you couldn’t get more convenient for over a dozen highly populated suburbs who hug 95 and are already close to the airport with no good transportation options to access it.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 2:46 pm

clrd4t8koff wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
5 routes to East Asia (and probably will be 6-7 in a couple of years) and possibly both routes BOS has had to South America are gone by the end of the year per the GRU-FCO axing thread. Is it just South America economy?


Not sure if I’m misunderstanding your post - but 5 BOS-E Asia routes and GRU are rumored to be cut by EoY?


No I will clarify - BOS has 5 routes to East Asia but most likely will have lost its only 2 South America links by 2020
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
clrd4t8koff
Posts: 1356
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2005 3:57 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 4:47 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
clrd4t8koff wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
5 routes to East Asia (and probably will be 6-7 in a couple of years) and possibly both routes BOS has had to South America are gone by the end of the year per the GRU-FCO axing thread. Is it just South America economy?


Not sure if I’m misunderstanding your post - but 5 BOS-E Asia routes and GRU are rumored to be cut by EoY?


No I will clarify - BOS has 5 routes to East Asia but most likely will have lost its only 2 South America links by 2020


Yeah it’s tough to say if BOS-S America is the problem or if AV and JJ are just in a bad financial state and BOS (along with other cities) is a casualty of that?
 
User avatar
Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 7:30 pm

VS4ever wrote:
B6BOSfan wrote:
I work at one of the local TV stations in Boston, and as someone who uses the airport quite often for personal trips (via Logan Express), I've been playing email tag with Massport PR officials.

The #1 goal of Massport is to move people away from using ride-sharing and getting them to use public transportation/Logan Express. There is an extreme push by the agency to DOUBLE the amount of people using the LEX buses to the airport. That would push the amount of people using the service from around 2 million annually to 4 million annually.

They are tweaking their Back Bay bus service starting May 1, moving the stop to the MBTA Orange Line/Commuter Line station.

They will also launch a North Station/Logan Airport Logan Express service in the coming months. They're going to be free from Logan Airport and $3 to the airport.

They have announced they will be increasing the amount of buses serving their Framingham and Braintree stations, from every 30 minutes to every 20 minutes weekdays. Those two locations are the busiest in the system, and parking is already overloaded on busy days. The buses are also overloaded, with passengers having to wait for the next bus at peak times.

I asked them about the parking lot sizes -- since Framingham's brand new garage is already overloaded, and Braintree's lot is near capacity. Massport said they will be adding new levels to the Framingham garage, and expanding parking at Braintree.

They said they are also actively looking at new locations, and that includes spots "inside 128." They are also planning some kind of "check-in" your bags service as you get on the bus, making for more convenient access to the terminal when you arrive.

The significant problem with Logan Express (and honestly, Boston transit in general), is how early things shut down. The last Logan Express bus from the airport is 10PM for Back Bay, and 1:15 am for the suburban lots. Then, the next bus comes at 6:30am (or 7:30 on Sunday). What if that scheduled late night flight gets in late? What about those redeye flights that come in overnight? Transit is not an option, and won't be anytime in the near future.

I've pushed them on adding service during off-peak hours, and right now, they said there are no plans to add overnight service.

The MBTA is no better. As someone who lives in Dedham, I should be able to use mass-transit to get to Logan Airport for a flight before 7am. Right now, I can't, unless I use Logan Express, requiring me to drive 8 miles to Braintree or Framingham.

The situation with ride-share vehicle drop-offs at the airport has become out of control. Massport believes they are a big part of the major traffic jams you see during parts of the day, creating congestion on airport roads AND inside the harbor tunnels leading to the airport.

Logan Airport already uses a kind of centralized pick-up area, and those areas are also overloaded during peak hours.

The Central Parking Garage solution will be on the first floor of the garage, so passengers arriving WILL need to take the elevators to the fourth floor to get to their respective terminals. According to Massport, the plan is to have some kind of Skycap service right inside the dropoff area, to assist passengers with bags.

With the loss of 1,000 parking spaces inside the Central Garage, I also have to wonder if we will see parking price increases again. They will need some kind of incentive to keep personal cars away from the airport, and try and drive more people toward using Logan Express.

I really do think in a few years, if this plan doesn't work, we will be talking about tolls for cars/vans to drop-off people at Logan Airport. With toll-by-plate, you can setup a gantry in entrance spots fairly easily. It won't be popular with anyone, including me.

I think officials also need to look at some kind of HOV lane for getting transit through the Harbor tunnels faster. This is badly needed, since they can sit in traffic for 20 minutes or more at peak times -- providing no incentive to get to the destination faster. The silver line buses use the same road the cars so, probably one of the biggest oversights of the Big Dig project of the early 2000s.


Thanks for all that insight, I think that clearly shows where Massports heads are, it’s alright Pushing and anti TNC agenda, and push with public transportation, but you have to provide the alternatives to do so, they are not, so this becomes an inconvenience to the traveling public and a cash grab in the form of higher fees.
And as I said before, i don’t think this is going to discourage TNC riders, they are just going to pay more ultimately for it and although I am not a traffic planner of any description, I still say the projected growth of BOS is going to be a counterweight to the attempt to reduce the number of trips.
Interestingly they were approved to add more spaces but now it looks like 1000 are going away. Funny that.. budget for FY20 coming soon, got to think July 1st that daily parking rates is going to go up unless they have already confirmed it won’t, but I do not believe that to be the case


Eventually, people outside 128 need to reevaluate their options and (re-)consider other airports like MHT again. Especially if the time and cost getting to/from Logan outweighs the convenience of flying from BOS. What idiot is going to sit in traffic for hours, pay hundreds of dollars to "be allowed" to enter BOS premises and take off, while that same person could whisk in a ride-share service to MHT for a fraction of the time and cost?
Looks like the success of BOS will be its undoing.
 
airbazar
Posts: 9385
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 7:37 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
Eventually, people outside 128 need to reevaluate their options and (re-)consider other airports like MHT again. Especially if the time and cost getting to/from Logan outweighs the convenience of flying from BOS. What idiot is going to sit in traffic for hours, pay hundreds of dollars to "be allowed" to enter BOS premises and take off, while that same person could whisk in a ride-share service to MHT for a fraction of the time and cost?
Looks like the success of BOS will be its undoing.

In a few years I'll be able to drive my own car to the airport and then instruct it to go home and park itself, and then come pick me up.
There will be no need for parking garages at the airport but if you think traffic is bad now you just wait to see how bad it will be in the future. And all because Massport continues to fight progress and refuses to address the problem with progressive solutions.
TNC companies will always be one step ahead of some pseudo state government agency and they will figure out ways to beat the system. Massport will forever be playing catchup with no real solutions. Massport may be great at running the airport but when it comes to traffic problems they are as competent as the MBTA.
 
PVD757
Posts: 3197
Joined: Sun Aug 24, 2003 8:23 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 7:39 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
B6BOSfan wrote:
I work at one of the local TV stations in Boston, and as someone who uses the airport quite often for personal trips (via Logan Express), I've been playing email tag with Massport PR officials.

The #1 goal of Massport is to move people away from using ride-sharing and getting them to use public transportation/Logan Express. There is an extreme push by the agency to DOUBLE the amount of people using the LEX buses to the airport. That would push the amount of people using the service from around 2 million annually to 4 million annually.

They are tweaking their Back Bay bus service starting May 1, moving the stop to the MBTA Orange Line/Commuter Line station.

They will also launch a North Station/Logan Airport Logan Express service in the coming months. They're going to be free from Logan Airport and $3 to the airport.

They have announced they will be increasing the amount of buses serving their Framingham and Braintree stations, from every 30 minutes to every 20 minutes weekdays. Those two locations are the busiest in the system, and parking is already overloaded on busy days. The buses are also overloaded, with passengers having to wait for the next bus at peak times.

I asked them about the parking lot sizes -- since Framingham's brand new garage is already overloaded, and Braintree's lot is near capacity. Massport said they will be adding new levels to the Framingham garage, and expanding parking at Braintree.

They said they are also actively looking at new locations, and that includes spots "inside 128." They are also planning some kind of "check-in" your bags service as you get on the bus, making for more convenient access to the terminal when you arrive.

The significant problem with Logan Express (and honestly, Boston transit in general), is how early things shut down. The last Logan Express bus from the airport is 10PM for Back Bay, and 1:15 am for the suburban lots. Then, the next bus comes at 6:30am (or 7:30 on Sunday). What if that scheduled late night flight gets in late? What about those redeye flights that come in overnight? Transit is not an option, and won't be anytime in the near future.

I've pushed them on adding service during off-peak hours, and right now, they said there are no plans to add overnight service.

The MBTA is no better. As someone who lives in Dedham, I should be able to use mass-transit to get to Logan Airport for a flight before 7am. Right now, I can't, unless I use Logan Express, requiring me to drive 8 miles to Braintree or Framingham.

The situation with ride-share vehicle drop-offs at the airport has become out of control. Massport believes they are a big part of the major traffic jams you see during parts of the day, creating congestion on airport roads AND inside the harbor tunnels leading to the airport.

Logan Airport already uses a kind of centralized pick-up area, and those areas are also overloaded during peak hours.

The Central Parking Garage solution will be on the first floor of the garage, so passengers arriving WILL need to take the elevators to the fourth floor to get to their respective terminals. According to Massport, the plan is to have some kind of Skycap service right inside the dropoff area, to assist passengers with bags.

With the loss of 1,000 parking spaces inside the Central Garage, I also have to wonder if we will see parking price increases again. They will need some kind of incentive to keep personal cars away from the airport, and try and drive more people toward using Logan Express.

I really do think in a few years, if this plan doesn't work, we will be talking about tolls for cars/vans to drop-off people at Logan Airport. With toll-by-plate, you can setup a gantry in entrance spots fairly easily. It won't be popular with anyone, including me.

I think officials also need to look at some kind of HOV lane for getting transit through the Harbor tunnels faster. This is badly needed, since they can sit in traffic for 20 minutes or more at peak times -- providing no incentive to get to the destination faster. The silver line buses use the same road the cars so, probably one of the biggest oversights of the Big Dig project of the early 2000s.


Thanks for all that insight, I think that clearly shows where Massports heads are, it’s alright Pushing and anti TNC agenda, and push with public transportation, but you have to provide the alternatives to do so, they are not, so this becomes an inconvenience to the traveling public and a cash grab in the form of higher fees.
And as I said before, i don’t think this is going to discourage TNC riders, they are just going to pay more ultimately for it and although I am not a traffic planner of any description, I still say the projected growth of BOS is going to be a counterweight to the attempt to reduce the number of trips.
Interestingly they were approved to add more spaces but now it looks like 1000 are going away. Funny that.. budget for FY20 coming soon, got to think July 1st that daily parking rates is going to go up unless they have already confirmed it won’t, but I do not believe that to be the case


Eventually, people outside 128 need to reevaluate their options and (re-)consider other airports like MHT again. Especially if the time and cost getting to/from Logan outweighs the convenience of flying from BOS. What idiot is going to sit in traffic for hours, pay hundreds of dollars to "be allowed" to enter BOS premises and take off, while that same person could whisk in a ride-share service to MHT for a fraction of the time and cost?
Looks like the success of BOS will be its undoing.


Good point and I agree (bias aside). PVD is up to 30 nonstop destinations, just opened a new Escape Lounge and has plans for complete overhaul of all shops and restaurants. PVD can easily handle a larger percentage of the regions traffic. BOS will always be the primary airport by a huge margin but will not be able to physically handle the share of passengers it has now forever.
 
B752OS
Posts: 1105
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 10:34 pm

https://www.boston.com/travel/travel/20 ... ss-changes

Massport is making the Back Bay Logan Express service even more appealing - cutting the fare cost and also adding a benefit of quicker security once at Logan. I wonder if this is a test and they'll roll it out to other locations?
 
B752OS
Posts: 1105
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 4:05 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 10:36 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
clrd4t8koff wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
5 routes to East Asia (and probably will be 6-7 in a couple of years) and possibly both routes BOS has had to South America are gone by the end of the year per the GRU-FCO axing thread. Is it just South America economy?


Not sure if I’m misunderstanding your post - but 5 BOS-E Asia routes and GRU are rumored to be cut by EoY?


No I will clarify - BOS has 5 routes to East Asia but most likely will have lost its only 2 South America links by 2020


We know BOG-BOS is gone. How reliable do you think the rumor (it was only a single post) is that GRU-BOS will be cut?
 
B752OS
Posts: 1105
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 4:05 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 10:41 pm

PVD757 wrote:
Dieuwer wrote:
VS4ever wrote:

Thanks for all that insight, I think that clearly shows where Massports heads are, it’s alright Pushing and anti TNC agenda, and push with public transportation, but you have to provide the alternatives to do so, they are not, so this becomes an inconvenience to the traveling public and a cash grab in the form of higher fees.
And as I said before, i don’t think this is going to discourage TNC riders, they are just going to pay more ultimately for it and although I am not a traffic planner of any description, I still say the projected growth of BOS is going to be a counterweight to the attempt to reduce the number of trips.
Interestingly they were approved to add more spaces but now it looks like 1000 are going away. Funny that.. budget for FY20 coming soon, got to think July 1st that daily parking rates is going to go up unless they have already confirmed it won’t, but I do not believe that to be the case


Eventually, people outside 128 need to reevaluate their options and (re-)consider other airports like MHT again. Especially if the time and cost getting to/from Logan outweighs the convenience of flying from BOS. What idiot is going to sit in traffic for hours, pay hundreds of dollars to "be allowed" to enter BOS premises and take off, while that same person could whisk in a ride-share service to MHT for a fraction of the time and cost?
Looks like the success of BOS will be its undoing.


Good point and I agree (bias aside). PVD is up to 30 nonstop destinations, just opened a new Escape Lounge and has plans for complete overhaul of all shops and restaurants. PVD can easily handle a larger percentage of the regions traffic. BOS will always be the primary airport by a huge margin but will not be able to physically handle the share of passengers it has now forever.


PVD already serves the Greater Boston area. I always view an increase in service at PVD a good thing for Eastern MA. The Boston metro area and Providence metro areas are so close that there is a lot of overlap. PVD should (hopefully) see some modest service increases over the coming years to help take some stress off of BOS. Unlike MHT, PVD actually has a local business base in RI to pull from and really compliments BOS.
 
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dvincent
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 28, 2019 11:09 pm

Kno wrote:
The problem with the Watertown mall is that buses would have to backtrack 10-15mins to get to the mass pike or drive on crowded residential streets to get to the airport.

Don’t get me wrong Watertown itself could definitely use better service to the airport but having people go from neighboring towns with better highway access to Watertown to get the airport seems very time consuming and inefficient.

To really serve several communities in a sensible way the LEX stop needs to be near the intersection of 95 and the pike. You’re absolutely right about the parking situation there, id say build a parking garage, widen grove st near the entrance to have a turning lane, add an on ramp for direct highway access from the station, and rebuild the bus terminal so it’s not the current dump that it is. Yes it’s a big project but certainly no more so than buying new land and location wise you couldn’t get more convenient for over a dozen highly populated suburbs who hug 95 and are already close to the airport with no good transportation options to access it.


I was only being semi-serious with the Watertown mall suggestion... mostly because it would have been super convenient to me when I lived ten minutes from there. :)

Riverside, geographically, makes the most sense. I'm not sure how the town of Newton will take to building a giant parking garage there, or how to manage the bus traffic.I can't see them making dedicated ramps, but I can see making access for buses to Riverside from Recreation Road and Park Road easier so they can get on/off the turnpike and to the station without getting on the 128 interchange.

Eventually, people outside 128 need to reevaluate their options and (re-)consider other airports like MHT again. Especially if the time and cost getting to/from Logan outweighs the convenience of flying from BOS. What idiot is going to sit in traffic for hours, pay hundreds of dollars to "be allowed" to enter BOS premises and take off, while that same person could whisk in a ride-share service to MHT for a fraction of the time and cost?


I'd fly out of MHT if B6 had the same frequency/network there (they don't). It's more convenient to me than BOS (generally) and the parking is always cheap. But they're not going to get nonstop MHT-SFO or MHT-SEA any time soon.
From the Mind of Minolta
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:38 am

dvincent wrote:
I'd fly out of MHT if B6 had the same frequency/network there (they don't). It's more convenient to me than BOS (generally) and the parking is always cheap. But they're not going to get nonstop MHT-SFO or MHT-SEA any time soon.

Heck i'd fly out of MHT if i could connect somewhere reliable like DEN or SLC. I avoid connections at Northeast and Midwest airports such as ORD, EWR, PHL like plague.
 
apodino
Posts: 3423
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2005 2:11 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 29, 2019 1:26 am

Very interesting discussion on the LEX topic and the public transit. As someone who grew up in BOS and almost always uses public transit anytime I go back this is near and dear to my heart. One issue with traffic in BOS is a very poor terminal layout, and its almost impossible to do anything about it short of tearing everything down and building everything back up. Ride sharing has been an issue that's been a challenge for many airports other than BOS to solve, but they have had more curbside infrastructure to do so. Terminals A and E don't have issues in this department, Terminal C does but there is room in front of the old terminal D to help. Terminal B has been a huge nightmare for years. The big problem with Terminal B is the parking garage. I don't know how many spots the garage actually adds to the terminal, but I have long said that I don't think tearing it down would be the worst idea. But given the fact that both UA and AA are mainly flying to hubs and don't have the departures that a B6 or a DL does, this actually does make it a bit easier to attract the premium customer. Aside from that, if you cant force the ride sharing into a central location (this is something that is either going to be decided by the courts, or will appear as a ballot question in the future), maybe delegate the ride sharing to the upper level for both pick ups and drop offs. Over the years, when I have actually asked to be picked up, I have my ride pick up on the upper level for this reason. Much less bus traffic and all that jazz to deal with up there.

One interesting thing with the hotel courtesy buses and off airport parking. A lot of airports with multiple terminals have a central location for these pickups. JFK for example uses Federal Circle which is a trip on the airtrain, and then the courtesy vans pick up there. ORD has one central hotel shuttle bus pick up near the old terminal 4 site that serves terminals 1 2 and 3. You wonder if something similar can be done once the people mover system is built.

As for LEX options. Watertown was suggested. I think if Watertown is added, the better location would be the old Watertown Car house near Watertown square. I don't know if the MBTA still uses the shops for anything, and it could be easy enough to convert to a parking facility. Its a quick trip, because from there its about a 2 minute journey to the Mass Pike at the Newton Corner exit. Currently, the best transit way from Watertown is the 71 Bus to Harvard, followed by the Red Line to South Station and then the Silver Line. That is at least an hour journey.

Riverside is a glaring hole that I think would be a cash cow if LEX is added. Again, the issue is parking, and if they expanded this and turned it into an Anderson/RTC type facility, it would be amazing.

As for the North Station shuttle, I have some thoughts on that. For people coming in from the Newburyport or Rockport lines, I think there are two alternatives that Massport should look at instead of making them go all the way into North Station. First would be some sort of service from Lynn. This would grab people coming off those lines, and it could be a way to make some revenue off the underutilized parking garage there as well. That being said, if money is ever found Lynn is likely to see a blue line extension in the future. The second alternative would be a shuttle from the new Chelsea commuter station. This is not as farfetched as it sounds since the BOS employee parking facility is in Chelsea near where the new station is being built. The catchment off the Lowell Line is going to be limited as well since Anderson/RTC is on the Lowell Line already, so what you catch would basically be folks from Winchester. Really the two lines you catch the most off of would be Fitchburg and Haverhill. And the northern end of the Haverhill line is located as such where MHT is also a viable option as much as BOS is.

Lastly, some things that will help BOS are actually out of Massport's hands. Notably the Blue/Red line connection at Charles/MGH. Another thing that would slightly help would be an improvement in the Silver Line routing near the Ted Williams Tunnel. There is a service ramp leading to the tunnel that the Silver Line buses once used during construction, but are not allowed to use now for some reason. And coming from the Airport, they actually pass right next to World Trade Center station on the outside before going into Silver Line Way and back into the underground station. Its an unncesarily long routing and it has not really seen any attempts by agencies to improve it.

Improved Commuter Rail would be another thing that would greatly help. As it is right now, on the weekends you only get one train every 2 hours. That is pathetic. Dedham was mentioned. Dedham would be a lot better if you had both Hourly service on the Franklin and/or Providence lines. Dedham Corp Center and Route 128 stations are only an exit away from each other, but both are in areas that can catch a lot of traffic.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:34 pm

apodino wrote:
Very interesting discussion on the LEX topic and the public transit. As someone who grew up in BOS and almost always uses public transit anytime I go back this is near and dear to my heart. One issue with traffic in BOS is a very poor terminal layout, and its almost impossible to do anything about it short of tearing everything down and building everything back up.

There's a lot they can do short of tearing down terminals but it requires a lot of money, political will, and a long term vision.
The real problem is as VS4ever said above: money.
One solution is to eliminate at least one of the central parking garages (the oldest one closest to C), and turn that space into a central transportation hub for the airport as well as expanded terminal space similar to what Changi airport in Singapore just did with Jewel (minus the shopping mall). But parking is still a major source of revenue so Massport isn't going to do that, yet. But we are definitely moving towards less demand for airport parking which is why they are willing to give up 1000 parking spots right now. Giving up that parking garage makes the most sense in my opinion because that area is closest to the 3 terminals that need the space the most: A, B, and C.

As for your suggestion to connect the Rockport/Newburryport line to the airport, it already exists. The Silver Line terminates at the Chelsea commuter rail stop. I've never done it myself so I wonder what that transfer is like. But the commuter rail itself is a infrequent and unreliable option. I'm not going to risk missing my flight because the commuter rail decides to have one of it's "issues" and I have to wait for the next train. Besides, the non-stop bus from the Newburryport park-and-ride or LEX from Peabody are far more convenient and they drop off and pick up at the terminal.
 
B752OS
Posts: 1105
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 29, 2019 7:02 pm

https://www.massport.com/capitalprogram ... 4-2019.pdf

See page 5. Massport has a large roadway improvement project slated to start construction at the end of this year. Terminal C's canopy is being replaced and expanded and its curbside area is going to be expanded and refined. It will be a tough 2 years during constriction, but when done, it's going to make things a whole lot better.

I doubt we'll see Massport eliminate a parking garage in the short term (5-6 years out). They print money with their parking garages on site.

The PDF lays out all of the big projects Massport has in the works.
 
iyerhari
Posts: 907
Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:25 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 29, 2019 8:38 pm

apodino wrote:
Very interesting discussion on the LEX topic and the public transit. As someone who grew up in BOS and almost always uses public transit anytime I go back this is near and dear to my heart. One issue with traffic in BOS is a very poor terminal layout, and its almost impossible to do anything about it short of tearing everything down and building everything back up. Ride sharing has been an issue that's been a challenge for many airports other than BOS to solve, but they have had more curbside infrastructure to do so. Terminals A and E don't have issues in this department, Terminal C does but there is room in front of the old terminal D to help. Terminal B has been a huge nightmare for years. The big problem with Terminal B is the parking garage. I don't know how many spots the garage actually adds to the terminal, but I have long said that I don't think tearing it down would be the worst idea. But given the fact that both UA and AA are mainly flying to hubs and don't have the departures that a B6 or a DL does, this actually does make it a bit easier to attract the premium customer. Aside from that, if you cant force the ride sharing into a central location (this is something that is either going to be decided by the courts, or will appear as a ballot question in the future), maybe delegate the ride sharing to the upper level for both pick ups and drop offs. Over the years, when I have actually asked to be picked up, I have my ride pick up on the upper level for this reason. Much less bus traffic and all that jazz to deal with up there.

As for LEX options. Watertown was suggested. I think if Watertown is added, the better location would be the old Watertown Car house near Watertown square. I don't know if the MBTA still uses the shops for anything, and it could be easy enough to convert to a parking facility. Its a quick trip, because from there its about a 2 minute journey to the Mass Pike at the Newton Corner exit. Currently, the best transit way from Watertown is the 71 Bus to Harvard, followed by the Red Line to South Station and then the Silver Line. That is at least an hour journey.


I use BOS every week and take the 6:50 am flight to ORD from B. IMO, A and E are the best in terms of passenger pickups and drop-offs. B is a hit and miss. There are great days and sometimes a nightmare. The biggest holdup typically always happens to C. C and E incidentally also share the same rideshare zone. The drop-off structure at C plus the fact that passengers are crossing the street adds to the stress and long lines. C also happens to home for B6 and is a very busy terminal. I think that Massport does a pretty good job at handling and managing the passenger traffic but there is only so much infra they have to expand. The other issue IMO is also that many rideshare drivers hop in and around E Boston. I once checked with one such driver and he told me it's easy and faster.

This is not the issue only with BOS. At ORD peak hours on a Monday am, it takes anywhere sometimes to an hour to get a rideshare. The taxi charges in Chicago are ridiculous as they charge 1.5 times the normal fare outside of downtown.

FYI, I live in Watertown and it is impossible to use public transportation early am or late night. I once took Silver Line -> South -> Harvard -> 71 and i had it enough. I never took the path as it took me solid 1 hour and 20 mins. With luggage and if i had to travel with my kid, there is no way I am going to explore that option. It is way too much. I believe we are just used to the convenience of terminal drop-offs. I simply believe if rideshare becomes a challenge, business travelers will just end up using private limo service if the client is paying for it. I personally also feel thanks to rideshare, parking has become more accessible. If you look at the parking ticker board, there was a time when Terminal B garage used to get filled by 6:00 am EST on a Monday. Nowadays I remember seeing open spots even at 7:00 am EST. I do not know if that's good because I have not taken a very late flight in a longtime.

Someone mentioned using the Watertown mall, that's the same place which houses Best Buy, Target and RMV. There are other small shops there but these are the anchor stores. I doubt if they are going to move. There is a massive redevelopment planned at Arsenal Yards thanks to athenahealth. There is also two hotels - i believe Hampton Inn planned in another vacant lot that is going to through construction. It is supposed to open sometime Fall-2019. God save us from the massive traffic. By the time if anyone will find a spot, it will take another solid 1 hour added to your traffic load.

airbazar wrote:

Heck i'd fly out of MHT if i could connect somewhere reliable like DEN or SLC. I avoid connections at Northeast and Midwest airports such as ORD, EWR, PHL like plague.

I see the same set of folks on my flight to ORD and most happen to be from PVD or New Hampshire. They simply taken Logan - the reason being options and most importantly if there is a delay, there are better re-routing options. Oh Boy, connections are bad.
 
ScottB
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:07 pm

airbazar wrote:
As for your suggestion to connect the Rockport/Newburryport line to the airport, it already exists. The Silver Line terminates at the Chelsea commuter rail stop. I've never done it myself so I wonder what that transfer is like. But the commuter rail itself is a infrequent and unreliable option. I'm not going to risk missing my flight because the commuter rail decides to have one of it's "issues" and I have to wait for the next train. Besides, the non-stop bus from the Newburryport park-and-ride or LEX from Peabody are far more convenient and they drop off and pick up at the terminal.


It's not a good option because the routing would be commuter rail to Chelsea, Silver Line SL3 to Airport station, and then Massport shuttle bus to the terminals. And there's a HUGE gotcha in that SL3 segment: it crosses the Chelsea St bridge which is a lift bridge, so if you're unlucky, the SL3 is waiting ~20 minutes until the the bridge is back down. Not great if you've got a plane or a train to catch.
 
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Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:45 pm

iyerhari wrote:
I use BOS every week and take the 6:50 am flight to ORD from B. IMO, A and E are the best in terms of passenger pickups and drop-offs. B is a hit and miss. There are great days and sometimes a nightmare. The biggest holdup typically always happens to C. C and E incidentally also share the same rideshare zone. The drop-off structure at C plus the fact that passengers are crossing the street adds to the stress and long lines. C also happens to home for B6 and is a very busy terminal. I think that Massport does a pretty good job at handling and managing the passenger traffic but there is only so much infra they have to expand. The other issue IMO is also that many rideshare drivers hop in and around E Boston. I once checked with one such driver and he told me it's easy and faste

FYI, I live in Watertown and it is impossible to use public transportation early am or late night. I once took Silver Line -> South -> Harvard -> 71 and i had it enough. I never took the path as it took me solid 1 hour and 20 mins. With luggage and if i had to travel with my kid, there is no way I am going to explore that option. It is way too much. I believe we are just used to the convenience of terminal drop-offs. I simply believe if rideshare becomes a challenge, business travelers will just end up using private limo service if the client is paying for it. I personally also feel thanks to rideshare, parking has become more accessible. If you look at the parking ticker board, there was a time when Terminal B garage used to get filled by 6:00 am EST on a Monday. Nowadays I remember seeing open spots even at 7:00 am EST. I do not know if that's good because I have not taken a very late flight in a longtime.

Someone mentioned using the Watertown mall, that's the same place which houses Best Buy, Target and RMV. There are other small shops there but these are the anchor stores. I doubt if they are going to move. There is a massive redevelopment planned at Arsenal Yards thanks to athenahealth. There is also two hotels - i believe Hampton Inn planned in another vacant lot that is going to through construction. It is supposed to open sometime Fall-2019. God save us from the massive traffic. By the time if anyone will find a spot, it will take another solid 1 hour added to your traffic load.


Watertown could use a direct bus from Watertown Square to Logan.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:54 pm

At BOS for a trip to MCO and interesting announcement of a gate change for EI134 to Shannon from C18, I guess that gate can also take a big NB without issue because C17 is being used by TAP
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
B6BOSfan
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 29, 2019 11:12 pm

Wow, I love how much discussion this has sparked! Great conversation!

B752OS wrote:
https://www.massport.com/capitalprogramsattachments/A406/A406%20Strategic%20Projects%20P%20Management%20Briefing%201-24-2019.pdf

See page 5. Massport has a large roadway improvement project slated to start construction at the end of this year. Terminal C's canopy is being replaced and expanded and its curbside area is going to be expanded and refined. It will be a tough 2 years during constriction, but when done, it's going to make things a whole lot better.


Massport has mentioned this Terminal C project as a big reason why they feel the need to act on ride-share traffic STAT. The area is a complete mess on a good day, and I can't imagine what it's going to look like once construction begins. Massport seems to know their plan isn't "the best solution," but also know they need to do everything possible to alleviate traffic around the terminals. In this respect, moving all the rideshares to the Central Parking Garage does make a ton of sense.

apodino wrote:
Riverside is a glaring hole that I think would be a cash cow if LEX is added. Again, the issue is parking, and if they expanded this and turned it into an Anderson/RTC type facility, it would be amazing.


I completely agree with Riverside. The space is already used as a pick-up/drop-off point for some buses, but turning that area into a major transportation hub would make excellent sense. Here's the challenges: the parking lot there is already full from weekday Green Line commuters. The MBTA recently raised the parking fee from $6/day to $9/day weekdays. Massport/Logan Express would need a large garage with at least 5 or 6 levels I think -- and then how do you stop the Green Line commuters from parking there? What's the setup at Anderson/RTC? I've never been up there. I also suspect the neighborhood would put up a tremendous fight against any kind of project like that.

I'd also look at the area between Concord, Arlington and Burlington on 128 as a ripe spot for additional park & ride to Logan service. You have two major feeder roads in Route 2 and Route 3 that merge with 128 in the area, and really no commuter rail options that make sense. Anyone else remember when they wanted to extend the Red Line to 128 in Arlington?

Some specific stats for you from Massport:
The LEX stations in Braintree and Framingham are the most popular with over 740,000 and nearly 580,000 riders annually. Under the new plan, Braintree will increase service from two to three trips to Logan per hour starting in May. Parking capacity at both Framingham and Braintree locations will also be increased.

Massport is adding the increased service to Braintree come May 1. On weekdays, LEX buses will run every 20 minutes from 2AM through 11PM. Here's the surprise I wasn't expecting: return trips from Logan will now begin at 5am and run every 20 minutes through midnight, with one more bus at 1:15am. The earlier return trip start time is a pleasant surprise, and needed, considering how many airport workers use this service. If they can manage to add another return trip around 2:30 or 3 a.m., you can legitimately advertise 24 hour service.
 
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dvincent
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 12:24 am

I completely agree with Riverside. The space is already used as a pick-up/drop-off point for some buses, but turning that area into a major transportation hub would make excellent sense. Here's the challenges: the parking lot there is already full from weekday Green Line commuters. The MBTA recently raised the parking fee from $6/day to $9/day weekdays. Massport/Logan Express would need a large garage with at least 5 or 6 levels I think -- and then how do you stop the Green Line commuters from parking there? What's the setup at Anderson/RTC? I've never been up there. I also suspect the neighborhood would put up a tremendous fight against any kind of project like that.


Anderson RTC has two separate parking lots. Long term parking (generally for Logan express though it's also for Amtrak and commuter rail riders who need overnight parking) and short-term commuter rail parking. The CR lot is daily only, and is cheaper ($4 instead of $7 for a day period) and you pay for it when entering the lot. However, you cannot park overnight in it without getting ticketed or towed (dunno if they have been towing people or not). I have used the long-term lot when I wasn't sure if I would get back in time after a late Bruins game.

The long term parking lot is ticket based and you have to pay the attendant inside the station before exiting. Daily/CR commuters avoid it because it costs more money and you have to deal with the attendant to exit. Riverside could go to the same arrangement (garage is $7/day, daily parking at $4/day). Riverside does allow overnight parking, but I've never done it. I remember when they had the envelopes.

I'd also look at the area between Concord, Arlington and Burlington on 128 as a ripe spot for additional park & ride to Logan service. You have two major feeder roads in Route 2 and Route 3 that merge with 128 in the area, and really no commuter rail options that make sense. Anyone else remember when they wanted to extend the Red Line to 128 in Arlington?


Yes, and we have the Minuteman Bikeway instead because NIMBYs thought the red line would bring undesirables.. The only downside to Burlington/Lexington is that there's no good access to the airport for buses. Storrow and Memorial Drive are pax cars only. Alewife intersection is awful for traffic. Fresh Pond parkway has lots of traffic and it's the only feasible way to cut over to the turnpike (via Western Ave). I work in Bedford and a closer LEX would be wonderful, but I'm wondering if the effective time will be similar to driving to Woburn.
From the Mind of Minolta
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 12:36 am

ScottB wrote:
airbazar wrote:
As for your suggestion to connect the Rockport/Newburryport line to the airport, it already exists. The Silver Line terminates at the Chelsea commuter rail stop. I've never done it myself so I wonder what that transfer is like. But the commuter rail itself is a infrequent and unreliable option. I'm not going to risk missing my flight because the commuter rail decides to have one of it's "issues" and I have to wait for the next train. Besides, the non-stop bus from the Newburryport park-and-ride or LEX from Peabody are far more convenient and they drop off and pick up at the terminal.


It's not a good option because the routing would be commuter rail to Chelsea, Silver Line SL3 to Airport station, and then Massport shuttle bus to the terminals. And there's a HUGE gotcha in that SL3 segment: it crosses the Chelsea St bridge which is a lift bridge, so if you're unlucky, the SL3 is waiting ~20 minutes until the the bridge is back down. Not great if you've got a plane or a train to catch.


https://mbta.com/schedules/CR-Newburypo ... ction_id=1

Here's the timetable for tomorrow, earliest train to Chelsea from Beverly gets there at 5.59 (assuming it's on time)

https://mbta.com/schedules/743/schedule ... lace-chels

Next SL3 leaves at 6.08 and is supposed to take 6 minutes (yeah right)...so arrives at the Blue Line Airport at 6.14, then you have to wait say another 5-10 minutes for a shuttle bus, then the trip to the terminals. so let's say you luck out and make it around 6.35, if you have pre-check and a prevailing wind, you could get there for a 7am departure, but that's cutting it REALLY fine. Basically it makes it totally useless

last SL3 that you can realistically take to catch a commuter rail home is 12.05, which means you can probably pull up to the gate no later than 11.15 to have a shot at it...

and that's without the pain and suffering of luggage... nope, not worth the risk.

I know i might be a bit of a luddite here, but honestly I have no inclination to uber over to Peabody for LEX, it would cost be over $30 to do that and deal with the traffic further up 1. While the bus schedule is better than the train, you are beholden to their hourly schedule. PLUS see below...

Schedule
Logan Express stops at all terminals. Scheduled times for departing Logan are shown for Terminal A. Departure from other terminals is a few minutes later. Travel time is approximately 30-45 minutes. Be sure to allow extra time during rush hour periods.

So if I time it wrong because of my arrival time , I would have to wait say 45 minutes for a bus, 30 minutes min to get to LEX and then wait for a lyft for a 20 minute ride home. so that's a minimum of 95 minutes. When by picking up a lyft from the airport, I can be home in 30. Sure it costs me closer to $50, but that $20 is worth my while, especially on the company dime. Sure cost saving folks will see that it works, but the logic just doesn't work for me.
That's why I essentially see this as a cash grab from Massport, I am afraid. They have lofty spending aspirations, including hundreds of millions of yet unfunded projects that they need to figure out, and the TNC's are the growth market, think of it this way.

1. Push all TNC's together hike the fees, make it less convenient for the consumer, supposedly less trips (nope, but I digress)
2. build 2,000 spaces, but then lose 1,000 for the TNC space. oh look, limited supply, price hikes on the parking spaces (interesting points about autonomous cars earlier though!)
3. Promote use of LEX, wow, they own that.. more money in the pocket.

If anyone doesn't see this other than a way to extract an extra pound (or dollar) of flesh from the customer, I think they are mistaken. just my humble opinion.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 1:27 am

Everyone who needs to commute daily to/from Logan and take a flight better move and go live on top of the airport building, cause you will spend more time and money sitting in traffic than spending on airfare.
 
UkiAir
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 3:06 am

VS4ever wrote:
At BOS for a trip to MCO and interesting announcement of a gate change for EI134 to Shannon from C18, I guess that gate can also take a big NB without issue because C17 is being used by TAP

Aer Lingus uses 752 for SNN service, and B6 uses all gates at lower Pier B for A321 with no issues (almost) daily, so I don't think its a big issue for 752. A330, on the other side, can definitely not fit in there.
 
dtremit
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 3:12 am

acavpics wrote:
I heard rumors that Korean once flew hear back in the late 1990's/early 2000's. Apparently it was a triangular route via IAD (ICN-IAD-BOS) on a 747. But I can't seem to find any proof of this. Can anyone here confirm is true?


At least as of 1998, the inbound continued from JFK.

Sadly I know this because, after a flight cancellation, an AA agent in DTW tried to reroute me to BOS via a long connection at JFK -- she saw seats open on the JFK-BOS leg of the KE flight, and didn't realize that passengers arriving in BOS needed to clear customs.

So I arrived at JFK (on TW -- my only time through the Saarinen terminal, which probably made the whole thing worth it), and after waiting an hour or so for the KE check-in desk to be staffed, found a very confused agent who had to explain that even if she could let me on the plane, I wouldn't be able to get off of it in Boston without a passport.

AA ended up putting me in a taxi to LGA where I caught the last DL shuttle to BOS, but my suitcase (including my sleeping bag!) was lost in the KE hold room for two weeks. And oddly DL was liable, as my last carrier.
 
dtremit
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 3:42 am

B6BOSfan wrote:
The #1 goal of Massport is to move people away from using ride-sharing and getting them to use public transportation/Logan Express. There is an extreme push by the agency to DOUBLE the amount of people using the LEX buses to the airport. That would push the amount of people using the service from around 2 million annually to 4 million annually.


This is, frankly, delusional. Massport's own reports note that the airport has the highest share of passengers using HOV modes (including transit and LEX) of any airport in the US, beating out SFO by a hair. And they're proposing no meaningful new services to achieve this goal, particularly for people coming from nearby.

I can literally see the tower at Logan from my living room, and I live less than half a mile from Lechmere. Barring really exceptional traffic, the ride in a Lyft is 15-30 minutes. The shortest theoretical transit trip from my front door to Logan is over an hour, with two transfers and almost a mile of walking. There is, frankly, almost no price that would make that worthwhile, and I suspect the same is true for nearly anyone who isn't taking the T today.

B6BOSfan wrote:
They said they are also actively looking at new locations, and that includes spots "inside 128."


I saw Kendall Square mentioned in one of the Massport reports, but I doubt I could find it again. Not sure that would really help much, though.

B6BOSfan wrote:
I think officials also need to look at some kind of HOV lane for getting transit through the Harbor tunnels faster. This is badly needed, since they can sit in traffic for 20 minutes or more at peak times -- providing no incentive to get to the destination faster. The silver line buses use the same road the cars so, probably one of the biggest oversights of the Big Dig project of the early 2000s.


They don't seem to have any serious investment in improving the SL, either -- see the State Police ramp nonsense for evidence of that.

If the SL was actually reliable in the tunnels, it could serve as a real solution to ride share traffic -- set up pickup / dropoff zones where people could hop onto the SL for the last leg to the terminals. But no one in their right mind is going to take that chance heading to Logan just to save $5. And passengers doing it one direction makes the deadhead problem worse.
 
NYCDM
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 3:55 am

B752OS wrote:
https://www.massport.com/capitalprogramsattachments/A406/A406%20Strategic%20Projects%20P%20Management%20Briefing%201-24-2019.pdf

See page 5. Massport has a large roadway improvement project slated to start construction at the end of this year. Terminal C's canopy is being replaced and expanded and its curbside area is going to be expanded and refined. It will be a tough 2 years during constriction, but when done, it's going to make things a whole lot better.

I doubt we'll see Massport eliminate a parking garage in the short term (5-6 years out). They print money with their parking garages on site.

The PDF lays out all of the big projects Massport has in the works.


The PDF shows a new connector between Terminals A & B, in addition to the larger connector between B & C.

Does anyone have info on whether or not the A to B connector will be pre/post security?
 
tjerome
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:27 am

dtremit wrote:
I can literally see the tower at Logan from my living room, and I live less than half a mile from Lechmere. Barring really exceptional traffic, the ride in a Lyft is 15-30 minutes. The shortest theoretical transit trip from my front door to Logan is over an hour, with two transfers and almost a mile of walking. There is, frankly, almost no price that would make that worthwhile, and I suspect the same is true for nearly anyone who isn't taking the T today.


I live in Chelsea, I could walk to Broadway, hop on the bus to Maverick, take the blue line northbound (backtracking technically) to the airport, then hop on the bus to the terminal. MBTA says it would take 39 minutes to get to the termial and that is leaving at 5:20am.. An Uber takes 10 minutes at most. It just doesn't make any sense to waste a half hour more time than necessary and have to overshoot my destination, none the less it would be necessary to take an Uber if it was for an early departure or late arrival.
 
iyerhari
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 10:42 am

NYCDM wrote:
The PDF shows a new connector between Terminals A & B, in addition to the larger connector between B & C.

Does anyone have info on whether or not the A to B connector will be pre/post security?

My understanding is all terminals will be connected without necessitating to go through security as per Massport's vision. As an example, Massport project to connect AC gates B1-3 is getting connected through the main Terminal B.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 11:26 am

iyerhari wrote:
NYCDM wrote:
The PDF shows a new connector between Terminals A & B, in addition to the larger connector between B & C.

Does anyone have info on whether or not the A to B connector will be pre/post security?

My understanding is all terminals will be connected without necessitating to go through security as per Massport's vision. As an example, Massport project to connect AC gates B1-3 is getting connected through the main Terminal B.


A pre and post connector between terminals A and B is slated to potentially cost $40m and is in the plan for FY20 (July 20 to June 2021) however it is currently in the unfunded bucket of projects that Massport has for Logan

Page 30 of the file: project L1313 http://www.massport.com/media/3120/boar ... rogram.pdf
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 12:08 pm

ScottB wrote:
It's not a good option because the routing would be commuter rail to Chelsea, Silver Line SL3 to Airport station, and then Massport shuttle bus to the terminals. And there's a HUGE gotcha in that SL3 segment: it crosses the Chelsea St bridge which is a lift bridge, so if you're unlucky, the SL3 is waiting ~20 minutes until the the bridge is back down. Not great if you've got a plane or a train to catch.

Well any public transit option short of the Silver Line from S.Station will require a transfer at the airport stop for the bus. Tha's true of everyone that takes the T to the airport and a lot of people do. That's not really the issue. The real problem in my opinion is how slow and unreliable the commuter rail is and the fact that I have my doubts that the SL coordinates with the train. It's even worse for the return because your flights arrival time is outside of your control.
I was stuck waiting for the bridge recently (after arriving on a red-eye from LAX, sigh), because I always use the PreFlight parking facility when I park at the airport. It didn't feel that long. I think they remodeled the bridge recently to speed up the process. Still, that process should be banned at rush hour. Bridge raising should be limited to middle of the night or middle of the day only.

dvincent wrote:
Anderson RTC has two separate parking lots. Long term parking (generally for Logan express though it's also for Amtrak and commuter rail riders who need overnight parking) and short-term commuter rail parking. The CR lot is daily only, and is cheaper ($4 instead of $7 for a day period) and you pay for it when entering the lot. However, you cannot park overnight in it without getting ticketed or towed (dunno if they have been towing people or not). I have used the long-term lot when I wasn't sure if I would get back in time after a late Bruins game.

You'll be fine leaving the car there late. When I worked in Boston I'd park my car there some times and then go out after work and come back really late. The entrance/exit would be blocked with some cones and I'd just moved them to get out. I don't think you'll get a ticket unless the car is still there when the parking attendant gets there in the morning.

UkiAir wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
At BOS for a trip to MCO and interesting announcement of a gate change for EI134 to Shannon from C18, I guess that gate can also take a big NB without issue because C17 is being used by TAP

Aer Lingus uses 752 for SNN service, and B6 uses all gates at lower Pier B for A321 with no issues (almost) daily, so I don't think its a big issue for 752. A330, on the other side, can definitely not fit in there.

C17 is a corner parking spot so it has a lot of space. EK used to park their 77W at gate C17. I once saw an EK 77W at C17 and a S4 A310 at C16.
IIRC DL used to fly 767's and L1011's from gate C18 back in the day so it shouldn't be a problem.
 
Kno
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 12:10 pm

VS4ever wrote:
At BOS for a trip to MCO and interesting announcement of a gate change for EI134 to Shannon from C18, I guess that gate can also take a big NB without issue because C17 is being used by TAP


C17 and C21 are corner gates and they take widebodies without blocking anything. Keep in mind before b6 took over C widebody ops were the norm at C on both piers.

Fun fact DL had c20 and c21 for a brief period before A opened and they had a 767-200 leaving for SLC at c20 while our 767-400 to ATL was at c21.
 
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tlecam
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 12:28 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
iyerhari wrote:
I use BOS every week and take the 6:50 am flight to ORD from B. IMO, A and E are the best in terms of passenger pickups and drop-offs. B is a hit and miss. There are great days and sometimes a nightmare. The biggest holdup typically always happens to C. C and E incidentally also share the same rideshare zone. The drop-off structure at C plus the fact that passengers are crossing the street adds to the stress and long lines. C also happens to home for B6 and is a very busy terminal. I think that Massport does a pretty good job at handling and managing the passenger traffic but there is only so much infra they have to expand. The other issue IMO is also that many rideshare drivers hop in and around E Boston. I once checked with one such driver and he told me it's easy and faste

FYI, I live in Watertown and it is impossible to use public transportation early am or late night. I once took Silver Line -> South -> Harvard -> 71 and i had it enough. I never took the path as it took me solid 1 hour and 20 mins. With luggage and if i had to travel with my kid, there is no way I am going to explore that option. It is way too much. I believe we are just used to the convenience of terminal drop-offs. I simply believe if rideshare becomes a challenge, business travelers will just end up using private limo service if the client is paying for it. I personally also feel thanks to rideshare, parking has become more accessible. If you look at the parking ticker board, there was a time when Terminal B garage used to get filled by 6:00 am EST on a Monday. Nowadays I remember seeing open spots even at 7:00 am EST. I do not know if that's good because I have not taken a very late flight in a longtime.

Someone mentioned using the Watertown mall, that's the same place which houses Best Buy, Target and RMV. There are other small shops there but these are the anchor stores. I doubt if they are going to move. There is a massive redevelopment planned at Arsenal Yards thanks to athenahealth. There is also two hotels - i believe Hampton Inn planned in another vacant lot that is going to through construction. It is supposed to open sometime Fall-2019. God save us from the massive traffic. By the time if anyone will find a spot, it will take another solid 1 hour added to your traffic load.


Watertown could use a direct bus from Watertown Square to Logan.


Watertown could use the restoration of the old A line, although stat still wouldn’t help get to Logan. ;-)
BOS-LGA-JFK | A:319/20/21, 332/3, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 762, 763, 764, 787, 772, 744 || MD80, MD90
 
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Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 12:45 pm

Perhaps the underlying reason for all the problems is that the US is a 3rd world country masquerading as a first world country.
If those in charge would do a really good job, then every large infrastructure program would be holistically approached instead of everyone having their own little kingdom (e.g. Massport, MBTA, State Police, etc.).
Being originally from The Netherlands, I often think back at how Schiphol was organized. It is not an airport where access is an afterthought. No. Access by road and rail was integrated in the airport concept from the beginning. Or during renewals/renovations. Whereas in the US, people just do something (like getting more air service to Logan) without thinking of the consequences regarding airport access.
 
johhn14
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 12:59 pm

VS4ever wrote:
At BOS for a trip to MCO and interesting announcement of a gate change for EI134 to Shannon from C18, I guess that gate can also take a big NB without issue because C17 is being used by TAP

I've taken this flight multiple times and each time the 757 has departed from C20 so there's another 757-size gate.
 
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tlecam
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 1:33 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
Perhaps the underlying reason for all the problems is that the US is a 3rd world country masquerading as a first world country.
If those in charge would do a really good job, then every large infrastructure program would be holistically approached instead of everyone having their own little kingdom (e.g. Massport, MBTA, State Police, etc.).
Being originally from The Netherlands, I often think back at how Schiphol was organized. It is not an airport where access is an afterthought. No. Access by road and rail was integrated in the airport concept from the beginning. Or during renewals/renovations. Whereas in the US, people just do something (like getting more air service to Logan) without thinking of the consequences regarding airport access.



You mean they wouldn't rebuild an entire neighborhood, like the Seaport, without make sure that there's sufficient mass transit available?
Or build a casino less than 5 miles from downtown that primarily caters to car access?

I'm shocked!
BOS-LGA-JFK | A:319/20/21, 332/3, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 762, 763, 764, 787, 772, 744 || MD80, MD90
 
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tlecam
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 1:34 pm

Back when United was in C, the San Francisco bound 757/767s often used C17.
BOS-LGA-JFK | A:319/20/21, 332/3, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 762, 763, 764, 787, 772, 744 || MD80, MD90
 
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deltacto
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 30, 2019 2:46 pm

tlecam wrote:
Back when United was in C, the San Francisco bound 757/767s often used C17.


Yes !!
And before that TWA L10's and 747's !

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