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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:09 am

EADSYABSOB73857 wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
EADSYABSOB73857 wrote:

Appreciate the ‘Welcome’ Dieuwer and VS4ever!

Now I’ll start hitting with the questions:

We know both DL’s and B6’s stated ambitions for Logan... if we do the math (As VS4ever, you did this a few weeks back for B6), for B6 they should easily be able to hit above their stated 200 daily flights (in terms of Terminal C capacity)... Maybe 230???

As for DL- by September 2019, they will hit approx. 142 flights per day (solely on DL, not including partners)... DL has to have further expansion in the works (as Ed Bastion stated about BOS in a recent speech); with DL’s stated goal of 150 flights per day, as of September 2019 this technically leaves them with very little room (5%) for expansion. So, I would imagine that growth in Terminal A for Delta will exceed 150 flights/day, given that 1) DL has not added important domestic markets like: BWI (the last top 10 market from BOS lacking DL service), CLT, MIA, DAL, HOU, DEN, PHX, SAN; 2) international market expansion (I have no clue and won’t begin to speculate on routes they’ll add, as DL tends to be conservative with their international market additions (adding on top of existing served airport markets that require additional service, or unserved markets that standout due to a lack of service); and 3) an expansion of service on existing routes (of newly served routes, LAS should be a candidate for either larger aircraft or increased service)...

So, for both B6 and DL... we know about the band-aid solutions (handful of additional gates being added in C; reconfig of A and DL getting 20 gates)... but both airlines will run out of space relatively quickly, especially DL. Aside from increasing turns, what are the more mid-term/long-term solutions???


There are really only a few ways you can increase capacity at a space restricted airport (note i am not saying slot controlled).
1. New Gates - kind of hard due to infrastructure especially at BOS - B6 is going to access to 2 new gates (C20A and C43) along with E1 as preference to get to the 30, But unless you change the footprint of the airport, not much more you can do...For DL its worse, first of all they have 10 less gates to work with, A1 is pretty much assigned to WS and the satellite gates somewhat get blocked with bigger aircraft for the international runs, see the answers to my questions above about the A gates and what they can take. But there are no such plans to expand A and the only way you could is basically to remove the South Cargo or relocate it down to the J pad area and remove the Eagle Terminal.
2. Turns/frequency - dangerous game unless you are WN who are masters at it. Where folks do 8, they do 11, just look at DAL for goodness sake, talk about some serious tin pushing. But back to BOS, B6 already have OTP issues (some posters on here would have you believe that it's an insanely large problem), well let's face it, they are most definitely not good, however it does not seem to stop people flying them in ever increasing numbers, so they do have somewhat of a legitimate grip,. So they must be doing something right? B6 have the space to do it, but again, is that a smart move, could the A220's be turned faster to make it work... DL on the other hand have a different issue, The WB's at A13 to A17 take up major space and time, sure they get A18-A22 back, but they are already stacked out at A2 to A11 pretty much, especially at peak times. So is this really an option for them...
3. Bigger Aircraft - THIS.. B6 moving up on 320's to 321's and coming soon the E190's to 220's will definitely increase the seat and potential passenger count, that along with the refit of the 320's from 150 to 162 will also help. For DL, a lot of their flying is regional, so there's a delicate balance there with mainline. With the 757's showing up more frequently, that increases their scope along with the 764's, they have a much higher seat count than anything B6 has, so once DL ramps up to the 150, what's next, how do they change their flying to grow.. that to me is a big unanswered question

As an aside, just to prove how insane the padding is of schedules, I give you DL5927 from PHL to BOS yesterday. Block time, to leave at 8.25am and arrive 10.02am, due to the fact that there were only about 30 ish people aboard our 9E E170, we took off at 8.15am and arrived at the gate at 9.15am... in a first for me in all my years of traveling, I actually arrived home before the time i was originally due to land.. That one will certainly help the OTP for DL, which reminds me, i need to finish those stats for 2018..


1) Thanks for the reply here... I guess I should have positioned my question a little differently: DL has stated a 150 flight goal for terminal A- they are closing in on this VERY fast with the fall flight additions taken into account (DL not including its partners will be at around 142 flights per day by Sept 2019). That leaves them with 8 more flights they could add to reach their stated goal of 150 (I think they’ll try to get to more like 158 or 160)... but, with a large number of significant domestic business markets still missing from their BOS flight portfolio (they need to add these markets in order to: 1) be a force to be reckoned with as a DL focus city, and 2) in order to add feed to int’l flights)... markets such as DAL (not Dallas Love, but Dallas market), HOU (market), DEN, CLT, BAL, MIA, PHX, SAN... how can DL get to additional domestic markets, grow frequencies on existing markets, and add new international markets (which they definitely still have huge potential to do) without approaching severe capacity constraints? What is the absolute max capacity for terminal A? Could they jam in more than 160 flights (180, 190??), could they consider forcing out WS, and as a midterm solution, without expanding the terminal, could they utilize Terminal E as an interim solution to accommodate additional flights as the E to A transfer is relatively simple??? Also once Massport completes the A to B post security connector could we possibly see DL use B for overflow?

2) And with all the DL and B6 new routes and frequency increases, plus the huge amount of domestic and international routes/carriers added for 2019, plus upgauging on existing routes, I think we could see 2019 finish out extremely strong, I would anticipate 44.5m-45m pax (that’s about 3.5m-4m pax increase- while robust and lofty, this year will see absolute unprecedented growth, especially given the B6/DL battle). What do others think on the growth prospect? On a side note, in 2018, only Aug hit over 4m pax... I think in 2019 we’ll see 3-4 months hit over 4 million pax.

3) What does everyone anticipate as future routes/carriers being added?? Personally, I think DL hopping on KEF is a no brainer for 2 reasons: 1) WW is gone from the market, 2) DL tends to have a conservative approach to international network expansion, and they like to add markets that are proven and have additional demand for further capacity- KEF has performed exceptionally well- we saw similar results/approach with DL on DUB and now LIS. But, are there other markets we could see DL go after in a preemptive strike to B6’s expansion?? Where do you see potential growth? LH has been performing very well (90%+)- could we see expansion there, but in the form of OS or SN??

4) For 2020 what new markets are larger potentials to be added? CAN on CZ, extra TYO capacity (on NH), AM returning (or DL adding to check B6), increases with CM, return for AV to BOG, AD (Azul), BRU, VIE, YYC on WS...???


Quite a bit to unpack in all of that, so let me see if I can answer everything..

1) a) The theoretical max capacity for A should be around 210, 21 gates at 10 turns, however that's not really possible due to the WB flights blocking gates particularly in the evening. In my previous thoughts on this, i've gone for 20 gates (leave WS alone) 5 turns on the A13 to A17 gates and 10 on the rest (15) = 175, i think that's about as far as they dare go. Obviously if you punt WS to E, that would potentially give you another 10 for 185.
b) I think you are going to see some frequency rationalization and market rationalization based on route performance in the future, if you follow tphuang's yield posts, you will see some of DL's expansion routes have been far from successful profit wise domestically and i believe they are going to need to have a balance on all of that to be ultimately successful in their goals. The markets you state, would certainly appeal to their business contracts, the question is with the healthy competition on most of those options, is it a case of throwing money at old rope? and with their other route options out there, do they need non-stops to all those places or will their clients be ok with connection routings like AA does. I even took one today with AA (BOS-CLT-MCO) because it happened to work for me in this instance.
c) The A to B connector isn't slated for completion by Massport until at least June 2025 and is currently unfunded, so who knows if that's the right time-frame or not, Given B already appears to be overflowing because SY (originally planned to go to B), F9 and HA have all been punted to E, not sure overflow to B, even if they wanted to, would be possible unless AA and UA shrink further, the likely candidate would be AA or AC given their proximity to the low A gates accordingly.
d) could they use E? well for domestic flights early in the day, although as others have said E in the morning is not a great experience right now due to TSA staffing and the like. But for their international departures, not likely, there's no space in the 7-9pm time-frames for them to use to be honest. Plus not quite the same experience for their international travelers at BOS and a long way from the DL Skyclub lounge

2) I tend to work on an overall growth percentage of around 5%, which would get to about 43m, There are some balances to the growth coming, while we have KL, KE, EK (380) , VS 2nd daily, DL, EDI and LIS coming on board as examples for International, we have lost, WW, PF, AV and TA from the mix so that will temper some of the growth, Domestically, AA will drop a bit due to their JFK issues for one thing, but the adds later in the year by DL and B6 should also counteract, so I am going to say 43.5m for this year and 46m for next, assuming the bottom doesn't drop out of the economy like some are predicting. I will be also curious to see how RAM get on with a new market for BOS.

3) New routes, I like the potential idea of KEF for DL, they could use a 757 to match FI somewhat and with no WW, It might work, although WW's pax being super price conscious may not go for it and DL would be left scrapping FI, who have some capacity left to fill bearing in mind their results last year when WW was running against them. LH is an interesting one, there has long been talk about BRU as a destination on SN, but I think LH are enjoying the returns of folks to FRA and MUC following the failed experiments of DUS and CGN by AB and EW respectively, it appeared to really hurt LH on a load basis, so I think they will be fiercely protective of their routes. after being bitten like that and will not want the diluted by OS turning up, who i don't think have a lot of spare planes to go around anyway.
Where do I see potential growth? Asia, CX and JL are doing well, CX are still holding on to decent loads despite going daily, another 3 weekly might make things interesting on that one. JL do well as they have low seat density and I doubt will want to go more than daily , so it would be up to NH to dip their toe in the water, but they aren't exactly doing well. The Middle East has recently been discussed as a potential growth area, but honestly with the capacity limitations in E until the expansion is completed, there aren't exactly plenty of spots to go around to fit much in the way of additional service. When the 4 new (double NB) gates come on stream, then we might see an additional push by massport for increased service to pay for it. If we go back to domestic I will be interested to see how F9 get on with their wading into BOS especially as they are in E at the so called quieter times, they might expand a little if it goes well. B6 will expand a bit more outside of the European service to round out their "new strategy at BOS" announced by Robin Hayes last week, I actually see more growth coming from bigger aircraft than i do on routes and frequencies, because we are getting to saturation point with the gates.

Kind of answered 4 in #3, so I will leave it at that. What we have here in BOS is a merry dance going on between DL and B6, AA, UA and WN stagnating, AS/SY cutting back, NK/F9 filling in the gaps, the canadian carriers cutting back a bit as their pax numbers have dropped back recently and then Terminal E with it's continued gate issues until such time as the expansion is complete. and then what happens, do EI and TP move back full time? they will take a lot of space in the new section if they do that, but surely that has to be the agreement with B6 long term.

Let's face it, it's going to be fun, however it ultimately plays out and will keep these threads going for a long time to come. and cheers to that.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
jworks158
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:53 pm

I remember something about this previously but I do not believe this was discussed, from the OAG thread
UP BOS-NAS MAY 0>0.3[0]
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
https://my.flightradar24.com/theorangetechie
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 18, 2019 12:06 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
Happy 2019! Lets do predictions and wishlist for routes to be announced (and possibly launched) for this new year!

Predictions

CZ BOS-WUH-CAN


Welp... CZ decided to go with JFK-WUH instead.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
ASA
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 18, 2019 2:22 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
Happy 2019! Lets do predictions and wishlist for routes to be announced (and possibly launched) for this new year!

Predictions

CZ BOS-WUH-CAN


Welp... CZ decided to go with JFK-WUH instead.


Any chance of DY starting BCN or MXP?
Or returning with the CPH and OSL flights?

Wishlist: a direct India flight and perhaps a NH BOS-TYO
Second daily flights on EK BOS-DXB and CX BOS-HKG
More frequencies on LA BOS-GRU and HU BOS-PVG

:mrgreen:
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 18, 2019 4:47 pm

ASA wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
Happy 2019! Lets do predictions and wishlist for routes to be announced (and possibly launched) for this new year!

Predictions

CZ BOS-WUH-CAN


Welp... CZ decided to go with JFK-WUH instead.


Any chance of DY starting BCN or MXP?
Or returning with the CPH and OSL flights?

Wishlist: a direct India flight and perhaps a NH BOS-TYO
Second daily flights on EK BOS-DXB and CX BOS-HKG
More frequencies on LA BOS-GRU and HU BOS-PVG

:mrgreen:


If DY should do anything its BOS-ATH that they dipped their toe in long-haul to Greece.

To increase BOS-PVG they would need to cut SEA-PVG or other PEK-USA frequencies since Tier I frequencies (PEK/PVG/CAN) are all in use by Chinese carriers.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
ASA
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:09 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
To increase BOS-PVG they would need to cut SEA-PVG or other PEK-USA frequencies since Tier I frequencies (PEK/PVG/CAN) are all in use by Chinese carriers.


Good to know, thanks! I didn't realize it is constrained by the frequencies.
So Sichuan's Chengdu-Boston would still work as that would be a Tier II?

If they went ahead finally ... :sarcastic:
 
jworks158
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 18, 2019 9:04 pm

The Logan twitter account just posted a TBT clip of last weeks Korean Air inaugural including the water cannon salute! https://twitter.com/BostonLogan/status/ ... 1182510080
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
https://my.flightradar24.com/theorangetechie
 
rob2507
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 20, 2019 6:17 pm

From @Airlineroute on Twitter: Icelandair schedules double daily 767 service to Boston from 15MAY19, except selected dates

They have 2 767s right? Do they fly both to any other destinations?

https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 6450264064
 
aaflyer777
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 20, 2019 6:30 pm

Duplicate Post
Last edited by aaflyer777 on Sat Apr 20, 2019 6:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
aaflyer777
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 20, 2019 6:32 pm

aaflyer777 wrote:
rob2507 wrote:
From @Airlineroute on Twitter: Icelandair schedules double daily 767 service to Boston from 15MAY19, except selected dates

They have 2 767s right? Do they fly both to any other destinations?

https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 6450264064


They have 4 767s in their fleet and they're leasing 2 from EuroAtlantic this summer to help cover for the grounded MAXs so 6 total. They use them on a several other US routes but I believe BOS is the only one that sees multiple daily 767s.
 
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AviationAddict
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:48 pm

I was on the bus to the economy garage this morning when the automated recording started the Terminal E spiel as soon as we pulled away from the Terminal C curb. We arrived at E, dropped off a couple of passengers and started driving away and the recording was only 3/4s done. We were almost to UPS by the time it finished! A small indication of just how much international growth BOS has had recently.

And before I get flamed, I realize it was early morning on Easter Sunday so ground and passenger traffic was very light so the bus was able to move around faster but I still found it funny.
 
jworks158
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 6:39 pm

From the OAG thread:

WS BOS-YHZ JUN 1.0>0.1[1.0] JUL 1.0>0[1.0] AUG 1.0>0[1.0] SEP 1.0>0[1.0] OCT 1.0>0[1.0] NOV 1.0>0[1.0] DEC 1.0>0[1.0] JAN 1.0>0[1.0]

It appears west jet is dropping the BOS-YHZ route.
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
https://my.flightradar24.com/theorangetechie
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:08 pm

jworks158 wrote:
From the OAG thread:

WS BOS-YHZ JUN 1.0>0.1[1.0] JUL 1.0>0[1.0] AUG 1.0>0[1.0] SEP 1.0>0[1.0] OCT 1.0>0[1.0] NOV 1.0>0[1.0] DEC 1.0>0[1.0] JAN 1.0>0[1.0]

It appears west jet is dropping the BOS-YHZ route.

That only leaves YYZ correct? And more space for DL at A1 as WS usage drops off
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
iyerhari
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:26 pm

VS4ever wrote:
jworks158 wrote:
From the OAG thread:

WS BOS-YHZ JUN 1.0>0.1[1.0] JUL 1.0>0[1.0] AUG 1.0>0[1.0] SEP 1.0>0[1.0] OCT 1.0>0[1.0] NOV 1.0>0[1.0] DEC 1.0>0[1.0] JAN 1.0>0[1.0]

It appears west jet is dropping the BOS-YHZ route.

That only leaves YYZ correct? And more space for DL at A1 as WS usage drops off

Yes; 3 flights each way to and fro. Chance that DL May enter the route?
 
jworks158
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:59 pm

Airline routes just announced:
"Hainan Airlines plans A350-900XWB service on Beijing – Boston route from 12MAY19, replacing 787-9"
https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 9346341889
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
https://my.flightradar24.com/theorangetechie
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 9:18 pm

jworks158 wrote:
Airline routes just announced:
"Hainan Airlines plans A350-900XWB service on Beijing – Boston route from 12MAY19, replacing 787-9"
https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 9346341889


HU has two configurations of the A350: 334 and 339 seats. The 334 seater has three more J seats than 789 and more Y with extra legroom (not clear if that is Y+). The 339 seater has the 30 J seats like 789. It's a capacity increase regardless of which one is used by at least 45 seats.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Apr 21, 2019 9:23 pm

jworks158 wrote:
Airline routes just announced:
"Hainan Airlines plans A350-900XWB service on Beijing – Boston route from 12MAY19, replacing 787-9"
https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 9346341889


Well either they are seeing increased traffic coming
Or they are kind of nuts. They have 288 seats in their 789 but 334 or 339 on their 350’s. I will assume this is going to be seasonal, because it will make little sense in the winter months
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 1:14 pm

VS4ever wrote:
jworks158 wrote:
Airline routes just announced:
"Hainan Airlines plans A350-900XWB service on Beijing – Boston route from 12MAY19, replacing 787-9"
https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 9346341889


Well either they are seeing increased traffic coming
Or they are kind of nuts. They have 288 seats in their 789 but 334 or 339 on their 350’s. I will assume this is going to be seasonal, because it will make little sense in the winter months

Maybe they need the 789 somewhere else? Or maybe they're maxed out on cargo on the 789?
 
acavpics
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 2:42 pm

jworks158 wrote:
The Logan twitter account just posted a TBT clip of last weeks Korean Air inaugural including the water cannon salute! https://twitter.com/BostonLogan/status/ ... 1182510080


I heard rumors that Korean once flew hear back in the late 1990's/early 2000's. Apparently it was a triangular route via IAD (ICN-IAD-BOS) on a 747. But I can't seem to find any proof of this. Can anyone here confirm is true?
 
rob2507
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 3:25 pm

acavpics wrote:
jworks158 wrote:
The Logan twitter account just posted a TBT clip of last weeks Korean Air inaugural including the water cannon salute! https://twitter.com/BostonLogan/status/ ... 1182510080


I heard rumors that Korean once flew hear back in the late 1990's/early 2000's. Apparently it was a triangular route via IAD (ICN-IAD-BOS) on a 747. But I can't seem to find any proof of this. Can anyone here confirm is true?


Here's a thread on the topic: viewtopic.php?t=357361

And a picture, one of several in the database:
 
PacificWest
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 5:05 pm

Wondering if any BOS locals can provide some insight into the (very limited) service to PDX...

Right now there's only one daily n/s between PDX and BOS on Alaska. My coworkers and I take have started taking this flight a lot over the past two months -- and it seems like it's always packed.

I've heard that JetBlue has a seasonal n/s.

Wondering if you see JB making this year round and/or if Delta would ever jump on this route?
 
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Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 5:08 pm

Does anyone know when the KL A330 on BOS-AMS were delivered? I was on one yesterday and it looked super new to me.
 
ConnectAir
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 5:33 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
Does anyone know when the KL A330 on BOS-AMS were delivered? I was on one yesterday and it looked super new to me.

It looks like you had PH-AKA, which according to Planespotters is 7.2 years old and was delivered in February 2012.
WN, LX, AZ, BA, LH, KL, DL, OK, S5, US, UA, VY, IB, AF, LY, F9, CO, YX x2, PD

A319, A320, A321, A332, A333, B712, B733, B737, B738, B753, B744, B764, B772, B789, DH8D, E145, E190,
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 5:37 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
Does anyone know when the KL A330 on BOS-AMS were delivered? I was on one yesterday and it looked super new to me.


The tail yesterday was PH-AKA an A333. was delivered 2/29/2012, technically 7 years old or only 1 in leap years..So fairly young in WB years.

https://www.planespotters.net/airframe/ ... es/ZWe5t5g
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 5:39 pm

PacificWest wrote:
Wondering if any BOS locals can provide some insight into the (very limited) service to PDX...

Right now there's only one daily n/s between PDX and BOS on Alaska. My coworkers and I take have started taking this flight a lot over the past two months -- and it seems like it's always packed.

I've heard that JetBlue has a seasonal n/s.

Wondering if you see JB making this year round and/or if Delta would ever jump on this route?


B6 have been reducing their footprint out of PDX as part of their general rationalization, so I don't think they will be making it year round, our trip to PDX last year went via JFK on the way out and LGB of all places on the way back. As Mrs VS. has a close friend in the PDX area, a direct on B6 would be awesome, however this time she is going DL via SEA to make it work. If you want non-stop, then AS is going to be it for a while I think.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
RobertS975
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 8:41 pm

VS4ever wrote:
PacificWest wrote:
Wondering if any BOS locals can provide some insight into the (very limited) service to PDX...

Right now there's only one daily n/s between PDX and BOS on Alaska. My coworkers and I take have started taking this flight a lot over the past two months -- and it seems like it's always packed.

I've heard that JetBlue has a seasonal n/s.

Wondering if you see JB making this year round and/or if Delta would ever jump on this route?


B6 have been reducing their footprint out of PDX as part of their general rationalization, so I don't think they will be making it year round, our trip to PDX last year went via JFK on the way out and LGB of all places on the way back. As Mrs VS. has a close friend in the PDX area, a direct on B6 would be awesome, however this time she is going DL via SEA to make it work. If you want non-stop, then AS is going to be it for a while I think.


Delta once had two B757s a day between BOS and PDX back when they were running all the Asia service out of PDX. It didn't last very long as I recall.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 22, 2019 9:19 pm

RobertS975 wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
PacificWest wrote:
Wondering if any BOS locals can provide some insight into the (very limited) service to PDX...

Right now there's only one daily n/s between PDX and BOS on Alaska. My coworkers and I take have started taking this flight a lot over the past two months -- and it seems like it's always packed.

I've heard that JetBlue has a seasonal n/s.

Wondering if you see JB making this year round and/or if Delta would ever jump on this route?


B6 have been reducing their footprint out of PDX as part of their general rationalization, so I don't think they will be making it year round, our trip to PDX last year went via JFK on the way out and LGB of all places on the way back. As Mrs VS. has a close friend in the PDX area, a direct on B6 would be awesome, however this time she is going DL via SEA to make it work. If you want non-stop, then AS is going to be it for a while I think.


Delta once had two B757s a day between BOS and PDX back when they were running all the Asia service out of PDX. It didn't last very long as I recall.


BOS-PDX is one of the most seasonal routes in USA. Goes from 6x weekly in dead of winter to 4 daily in Summer.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
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N717TW
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:27 am

iyerhari wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
jworks158 wrote:
From the OAG thread:

WS BOS-YHZ JUN 1.0>0.1[1.0] JUL 1.0>0[1.0] AUG 1.0>0[1.0] SEP 1.0>0[1.0] OCT 1.0>0[1.0] NOV 1.0>0[1.0] DEC 1.0>0[1.0] JAN 1.0>0[1.0]

It appears west jet is dropping the BOS-YHZ route.

That only leaves YYZ correct? And more space for DL at A1 as WS usage drops off

Yes; 3 flights each way to and fro. Chance that DL May enter the route?


YHZ is apparently the route that airline planers think makes sense but doesn't seem to pan out. DL has run this route at least twice since the 80s, AA has run this route after it took over BizExp, and Im pretty sure CP (AirAtlantic?) even tried is. Yet it seems only AC can make it work.
 
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 11:26 am

https://www.boston.com/travel/travel/20 ... d-at-logan

April 12th was busiest day ever for TSA at Boston. They screen 77,451 passengers, breaking the previous record set a year earlier on April 13, 2018 where 75,760 passengers were screened.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:15 pm

B752OS wrote:
https://www.boston.com/travel/travel/2019/04/23/record-breaking-travelers-screened-at-logan

April 12th was busiest day ever for TSA at Boston. They screen 77,451 passengers, breaking the previous record set a year earlier on April 13, 2018 where 75,760 passengers were screened.

Friday before school vacation which this year coincided with Passover. I've always wandered whether this date was busier than the day before Thanksgiving. I guess I have my answer.
 
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Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:39 pm

I though the Friday before President's Day was the busiest day? Flying certainly is the most expensive during that period. Just compare flying to the Caribbean during President's Day week to flying to the Caribbean during Passover or Thanksgiving week.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 2:39 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
I though the Friday before President's Day was the busiest day? Flying certainly is the most expensive during that period. Just compare flying to the Caribbean during President's Day week to flying to the Caribbean during Passover or Thanksgiving week.

It's pretty much just Caribbean/Florida during that time. April vacation is popular for going everywhere: Caribbean, Europe, West Coast, Spring skiing out west still. Lots of school groups travel during April vacation too. And this year because of Passover/Easter, you have some private schools that don't usually have vacation this time of the year, also on vacation.
 
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 2:44 pm

We're talking TSA screenings so not taking arrivals into account. Massachusetts has a strong connection to Thanksgiving so it stands to reason that fewer people are going to be leaving the state (e.g. less TSA screenings) leading up to the holiday; although I'd reason inbound pax numbers would be up. April vacation is obviously at the very end of a long NE winter so it also seems reasonable that more people are looking to get out of town, therefore the high TSA screening numbers.
 
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 7:41 pm

Governor Baker backs Logan plan for Uber-Lyft zones
The governor on Wednesday endorsed the Massachusetts Port Authority’s controversial plan to ban Uber and Lyft from terminal curbs at Logan International Airport, a day before the agency’s governing board is expected to vote on the measure.

The proposal, which has drawn blowback from the ride-hail companies and many of their riders, would direct all airport pickups and drop-offs to the airport’s central parking garage, while also raising the fees on pickups and imposing new fees on drop-offs.
 
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 10:23 pm

RobertS975 wrote:
Governor Baker backs Logan plan for Uber-Lyft zones
The governor on Wednesday endorsed the Massachusetts Port Authority’s controversial plan to ban Uber and Lyft from terminal curbs at Logan International Airport, a day before the agency’s governing board is expected to vote on the measure.

The proposal, which has drawn blowback from the ride-hail companies and many of their riders, would direct all airport pickups and drop-offs to the airport’s central parking garage, while also raising the fees on pickups and imposing new fees on drop-offs.

The taxi business will heave a sigh of relief as most of the local companies have gone bankrupt and wrapped their business. IMO, this will also cause private limo companies increase their fair share. It will be interesting to see what Uber and Lyft have to say.
 
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 10:39 pm

iyerhari wrote:
RobertS975 wrote:
Governor Baker backs Logan plan for Uber-Lyft zones
The governor on Wednesday endorsed the Massachusetts Port Authority’s controversial plan to ban Uber and Lyft from terminal curbs at Logan International Airport, a day before the agency’s governing board is expected to vote on the measure.

The proposal, which has drawn blowback from the ride-hail companies and many of their riders, would direct all airport pickups and drop-offs to the airport’s central parking garage, while also raising the fees on pickups and imposing new fees on drop-offs.

The taxi business will heave a sigh of relief as most of the local companies have gone bankrupt and wrapped their business. IMO, this will also cause private limo companies increase their fair share. It will be interesting to see what Uber and Lyft have to say.


The meteoric rise of the ridesharing in Boston has certainly had a noticeable impact on traffic over the past 24-36 months. On the plus side, I don't seem to have as much trouble finding a parking spot at Logan now though. Four or five years ago it was nearly impossible to get a spot and they had cars parked under every overpass. We might see a return of that scenario now.
 
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Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 10:50 pm

I expect Lyft and Uber to sue Massport over this in 3, 2, 1...
I also expect myself to no longer use rideshare services to Logan unless they are SIGNIFICANTLY cheaper than taxis.
 
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dvincent
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 24, 2019 11:11 pm

The terminal roadways of an airport are a shared resource and need to be managed as such, otherwise we have a tragedy of the commons. I do use Lyft when I'm at airports (but not at BOS), and it puts the stark difference of the design of some airport roadways in focus. People want the convenience of being dropped off at the terminal curb but it's clear that if everyone uses it, then it destroys that convenience. The extreme price of parking at the airport and off-airport parking places have contributed to people making the choice to take Lyft or Uber as well.

Last Thursday was the first time (in recent memory) where I was dropped off at Arrivals level for an "arriving" Logan Express instead of at the departures level. The traffic on the departures level must have been truly awful for that to happen, even on the day before New Year's they went on the departures level (albeit very slowly). I've traveled on pre-April or February vacation weeks before (even when it's overlapped with easter and passover) and the
From the Mind of Minolta
 
Supersarestupid
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 25, 2019 2:45 am

The WOW bird left BOS today. TF-DOG went to LCQ, which also got TF-CAT from EWR.
 
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:57 am

The solution is simple but the politicians don't want to be seen as being against a unionized labor like the taxi drivers even though that is a dying occupation. The simple solution is to treat ride share and taxis exactly the same by creating a FIFO holding area for rideshare cars to wait like they do for taxis. Drop off at the curb then if you want to pickup arriving passengers you go wait in the holding area until someone calls. That's how taxis operate and that's how rideshare should be handles as well.
 
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 25, 2019 1:39 pm

airbazar wrote:
The solution is simple but the politicians don't want to be seen as being against a unionized labor like the taxi drivers even though that is a dying occupation. The simple solution is to treat ride share and taxis exactly the same by creating a FIFO holding area for rideshare cars to wait like they do for taxis. Drop off at the curb then if you want to pickup arriving passengers you go wait in the holding area until someone calls. That's how taxis operate and that's how rideshare should be handles as well.


I'm not sure about the co-mingling of taxis and rideshare part but, I do know a lot of major airports around the country use a similar concept to what you're suggesting for the rideshare vehicles. For example, at CLE the passengers wait at a small bus shelter off to the side of the terminal. All rideshare orders are routed to a pool of drivers waiting nearby in a holding lot and only drive up to the pickup area when the passenger arrives at the shelter. I don't see why they couldn't try something similar at BOS. I think one of the major hurdles is that Uber and Lyft have to be onboard and develop the technology to handle the orders; they have to be certain that all calls at BOS are routed to the pool of waiting drivers in the lot and not some random car driving around a nearby neighborhood.
 
iyerhari
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 25, 2019 3:57 pm

Massport vote is out. Uber and Lyft can use terminal drop-offs from 4:00 am till 10:00 am EST at the arrivals zone. No pick-ups after 10:00 am at the terminal and use Central parking designated spot.

https://www2.bostonglobe.com/metro/2019 ... story.html
 
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dvincent
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 25, 2019 4:46 pm

The pickup fee isn't going up, the drop-off fee will match the pickup fee at 3.25 and there's a 1.50 discount for carpooled rideshares. I also think this includes the fix for the recirculation problem that they had by allowing those that just dropped off pax to pick up at the same time without going around again?

Could have been worse for them, tbh. I'm actually curious how the Central Parking pickup scheme will work in practice.
From the Mind of Minolta
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 25, 2019 6:52 pm

dvincent wrote:
The pickup fee isn't going up, the drop-off fee will match the pickup fee at 3.25 and there's a 1.50 discount for carpooled rideshares. I also think this includes the fix for the recirculation problem that they had by allowing those that just dropped off pax to pick up at the same time without going around again?

Could have been worse for them, tbh. I'm actually curious how the Central Parking pickup scheme will work in practice.


Certainly sounds like a bit of a compromise happened here for sure. I hate the whole central parking thing. But Massport somehow believe this is going to solve their traffic issues. Sadly I don’t think it will, the growth in passengers assuming the economy holds will see to it that the trips increase not decrease
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 25, 2019 7:05 pm

dvincent wrote:
I'm actually curious how the Central Parking pickup scheme will work in practice.


Are you going to be the guinea pig? :D
I am going to stick to curbside drop-off/pick-up by whatever means necessary. Really hope people won't get mugged at night in some dark corner of the central parking structure...
 
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dvincent
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:33 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
dvincent wrote:
I'm actually curious how the Central Parking pickup scheme will work in practice.


Are you going to be the guinea pig? :D
I am going to stick to curbside drop-off/pick-up by whatever means necessary. Really hope people won't get mugged at night in some dark corner of the central parking structure...


I take Logan Express when I fly, so I will continue to enjoy the disappearing luxury of being dropped off at the terminal curb (even if it is the arrivals curb sometimes). Lyft is not economical for me as a resident of the Merrimack Valley (and even if I still lived within 128 it'd probably still not be economical as the one way Lyft to my previous residence in Waltham is in the $50 range).

I'm no massport employee, so I have no insider information. But from a dispassionate network analyst POV, the number one goal to keep traffic moving on the terminal roadways is to eliminate as many vehicles (not just cars) as possible. They know this, we know this. The question is how to do this while balancing the overall needs of people using the airport.

Aside from the Globe report, Massport has updated their ground transit plan page with more details which answer some questions.

http://www.massport.com/massport/media/ ... tion-plan/

1. How will they circulate cars in and around central parking for this plan? It looks like they're giving up a floor of central parking to implement this plan. "Massport is giving up 1,000 revenue-generating parking spaces to make this happen." Does this mean a first-floor solution? Or a fourth-floor solution (so people don't have to navigate elevators)? Will they set up a special in-out area for TNC cars that won't interfere with the normal garage in/out gates?

The new, dedicated TNC areas in Central Garage will have:

Baggage check and Sky Caps;
Improved wi-fi;
Better lighting;
Wheelchair assistance;
Increased enforcement of TNC drivers and vehicles;
Can be implemented as early as this fall;
And will be weather-protected and climate-controlled.


2. It's clear that using shared rides is a key part of this plan, as that'll reduce the number of car trips. A 50% discount price is a good way to encourage this. One thing that I've always been curious about is that Logan (and thus the Boston area) has no door-to-door shuttle company like JFK or others that have things like SuperShuttle. I've always wondered why this is the case, if anyone has some insight I would love to hear it. There's black car types that do shared vans but nothing on the level of brand recognition of SuperShuttle or similar services.

Looking at the types of traffic we get at the airport, we can divvy it into the following categories:

1. Private passenger cars.
2. Lyft/Uber not!Taxis.
3. Taxicabs
4. Silver Line
5. Airport Shuttle Buses (for blue line T station, rental cars, and economy parking)
6. Hotel shuttle buses
7. Off-airport parking shuttle buses
8. Logan Express
9. Non-Massport charter buses and long-distance shuttle buses (e.g. New Hampshire Boston Express)

Some terminals have segregations within arrivals/departures of these various modes, some don't. Terminal C has segregation, for example, but the roadway design is awful. Passengers in crosswalks crossing also breaks up this segregation, causing the cars and taxis to pause when they come in. There's also just not enough roadway for all the cars. So, what to do?

1. Get the Lyft/Uber traffic off the terminal roadways. This may help terminal road traffic, but it won't help congestion heading to/from the Ted as well as the Sumner/Callahan tunnels. The only way to do that is...

2. Reduce Uber/Lyft/Private Vehicle traffic as much as possible. This means encouraging use of other modes either through positive or negative forces. Currently, all other modes have problems/flaws that encourage people to prioritize private pickup/dropoff that eventually degrade QoS for all modes. Alternate modes for most pax are:

Blue Line T, Silver Line T, Logan Express, Charter/Non-Massport Express buses

You can't eliminate private cars from the terminal roadways, but people like using them because they're perceived as "Free" for the person going to the airport. However, those private cars aren't free to other users of the airport. So, what do? The tolling plan is a non-starter, there's already tolls on the main throughfares (Ted, Tunnels) to the airport. Put a toll on entrance from Route 1A? You'll get shunpikers on local roads. So how do you discourage private vehicles from picking up/dropping off? I don't have a good answer for that question. People don't like Logan Express because tickets cost money, or the T because it costs money (and can be unreliable), but every private car adds up until the breaking point is hit.

3. Consolidate as much shared use as possible. The people mover will eliminate the fleet of buses that transit people from the rental car lot, economy parking, and the blue line T station, but it won't eliminate the Silver Line. The Silver Line can terminate at one end of the people mover, eliminating it from terminal roadways. If the Red-Blue connector is ever built, it would eliminate a big part of the silver line's existence (connections to South Station), but that can't be banked on. Other airports' public transit generally stops at one location (SFO's BART station is at international terminal G and connects to others via the AirTrain). Making the silver line free to airport pax has helped the use of that mode, but there's enough drag from the silver line mixing in the tunnels that a dedicated rail link will be necessary some day. I just don't see it done until I'm too old to fly cause there's no money for it (and there wasn't 20 years ago either). Downside is that people mover won't be ready for years and will cost money.

Logan Express and non-massport buses will be here to stay, their impact on traffic is in the positive direction and retaining their ability to drop off at the terminal is a key. But redirecting how they drop off passengers is a much. There's only so many curb inches for vehicles at the terminal, and buses take up a lot of them. This can only be solved with roadway construction.

Hotel and parking shuttle buses are a target for consolidation. Have the hotels work together so that they have a multi-hotel loop (e.g. one shuttle bus serves two separate hotels). Not much can be done about off-airport parking. These are already a smaller amount of trips compared to taxis/lyft/private cars, so reductions in trips will be minimal, but every little bit helps.

4. Improve terminal roadways. We already know this is in the works for terminal C, but Terminal B is just as badly in need of optimization and mode segregation. Increase curb inches and find ways to get pax over without interrupting other lanes. Prevent blockages of cars stopping on other lanes away from the curb. Eliminate weaves and try to get exiting traffic away from existing roadway traffic. The current terminal roadways were designed and upgraded around the time of the Big Dig, it's time to rethink them again.

5. Add more options for shared rides that aren't Uber/Lyft. More Logan Express will be added, which is good, but it won't help most people who live inside 128.

6. Offer some kind of perk or incentive for taking non-Rideshare or private cars into the airport. Free Dunkies for all Logan Express riders. I dunno, you tell me.
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gatibosgru
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Apr 26, 2019 12:34 am

I'm flying BOS-MAD on Wednesday and it strangely shows my bird as an A346. I can't find any other dates recently or schedule later that are operated by the A346. Should I assume this is an error? I would love to get a ride on the A346 since my LH ride in Nov was canceled
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33lspotter
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Apr 26, 2019 3:48 am

gatibosgru wrote:
I'm flying BOS-MAD on Wednesday and it strangely shows my bird as an A346. I can't find any other dates recently or schedule later that are operated by the A346. Should I assume this is an error? I would love to get a ride on the A346 since my LH ride in Nov was canceled


While recognizing your point that there don’t seem to be other dates in the schedule, I feel like Iberia’s operating of the A340 into Boston is usually ad hoc. It may well be that your particular flight had a lot of forward bookings or needed more seats than an A330 could provide.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Apr 26, 2019 10:08 am

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-25apr19/
TK switching to 789 from 333 for next summer , increase of 11 seats from 289 to 300, 30 business and 270 economy

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... increases/

KE moves to 5 weekly for Dec and January from the previous 4 weekly
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Apr 26, 2019 12:34 pm

dvincent wrote:
One thing that I've always been curious about is that Logan (and thus the Boston area) has no door-to-door shuttle company like JFK or others that have things like SuperShuttle. I've always wondered why this is the case, if anyone has some insight I would love to hear it.

We do
https://www.flightlineinc.com/
But they are expensive and therefore are quickly being replaced by TNC service. I used to see their vans all the time. I can't remember the last time I saw one.
They emerged as an alternative to taxis, and like taxis they never adapted to the competition from TNC companies.

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