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klm617 wrote:Detroit deserves more than Delta Airlines..
KarlB737 wrote:klm617 wrote:Detroit deserves more than Delta Airlines..
OK since ORD has two major airlines present at that hub what other airline might set up shop at DTW IF additional concourses were established once the Smith Terminal is removed and replaced with additional concourse and gate capacity. Notice I said IF.
flymco753 wrote:DL needs to give up on this HNL experiment. Add SJO or ANC, maybe even expand PUJ to daily. I feel like those would've been more punctual.
klm617 wrote:So back in 2013 the Boston India traffic was o/d 199 passengers a day and in 2015 the Detroit India traffic was 140 passengers each day . With that being said how does Boston India get 3 ME3 flights a day but yet Detroit can't get a 5 weekly flight from one of the ME3 carriers. Not to mention those numbers have probably grown by now to. I'm telling you guys this airport needs an effective marketing firm to handle getting new options and additional traffic into DTW.
winginit wrote:klm617 wrote:So back in 2013 the Boston India traffic was o/d 199 passengers a day and in 2015 the Detroit India traffic was 140 passengers each day . With that being said how does Boston India get 3 ME3 flights a day but yet Detroit can't get a 5 weekly flight from one of the ME3 carriers. Not to mention those numbers have probably grown by now to. I'm telling you guys this airport needs an effective marketing firm to handle getting new options and additional traffic into DTW.
For the airport to use taxpayer dollars to pay a marketing firm to try and lure the ME3 into serving DTW nonstop would be a waste of public funds.
Again, all the marketing in the world isn't going to convince a carrier to invest in a route if their modeling shows them that there are superior alternatives for that investment.
Dating all the way back to 2012 the DTW Airport Authority was collecting signatures to try and woo Emirates into serving DTW. It didn't work. Also in 2012, Al-Baker said that QR would serve DTW. They didn't. It's clear based on those decisions that the modeling simply didn't imply that the route was the best choice for an add.
Times, economies, and airline leadership all change; and it's still not far-fetched to think that an ME3 carrier might take a stab at Detroit given changing circumstances. What won't change the modeling or its interpretation, however, is a marketing campaign paid for by the taxpayers.
FA9295 wrote:WOW is closing all of their U.S. stations except for 4 of them, and it looks like DTW is safe for now: https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/f ... 573229002/
FA9295 wrote:WOW is closing all of their U.S. stations except for 4 of them, and it looks like DTW is safe for now: https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/f ... 573229002/
klm617 wrote:FA9295 wrote:WOW is closing all of their U.S. stations except for 4 of them, and it looks like DTW is safe for now: https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/f ... 573229002/
I can't even begin to tell you how shocked I am but pleased that Detroit made the cut. So what is it that WOW Air sees in Detroit that all of a.net and commercial aviation doesn't by not even giving Detroit a chance when it comes to adding to their networks. Yet we beat out the likes of ORD and other international heavy weights when it comes to attracting new service. My guess on ORD would be the congestion their and the difficulty of doing one day turns in a timely matter to stay on schedule. I suspect that Ann Arbor and Lansing contribute a lot to the WOW loads.
compensateme wrote:In the article WOW indicates some of the markets it cut performed well last summer, but a reduction in fleet size necessitated the cuts. One can conclude that DTW was likely one of WOW’s top six performing routes (along with YYZ, YUL, EWR, BOS and BWI). That’s good news, and not entirely surprising when you consider that DTW was the largest Atlantic market without low cost competition.
winginit wrote:klm617 wrote:FA9295 wrote:WOW is closing all of their U.S. stations except for 4 of them, and it looks like DTW is safe for now: https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/f ... 573229002/
I can't even begin to tell you how shocked I am but pleased that Detroit made the cut. So what is it that WOW Air sees in Detroit that all of a.net and commercial aviation doesn't by not even giving Detroit a chance when it comes to adding to their networks. Yet we beat out the likes of ORD and other international heavy weights when it comes to attracting new service. My guess on ORD would be the congestion their and the difficulty of doing one day turns in a timely matter to stay on schedule. I suspect that Ann Arbor and Lansing contribute a lot to the WOW loads.compensateme wrote:In the article WOW indicates some of the markets it cut performed well last summer, but a reduction in fleet size necessitated the cuts. One can conclude that DTW was likely one of WOW’s top six performing routes (along with YYZ, YUL, EWR, BOS and BWI). That’s good news, and not entirely surprising when you consider that DTW was the largest Atlantic market without low cost competition.
It's probably not a coincidence that the four remaining WW routes to the US are the four shortest lengths of haul. As alluded to, these are likely the four routes that allow them to make timely single day turns
compensateme wrote:winginit wrote:klm617 wrote:
I can't even begin to tell you how shocked I am but pleased that Detroit made the cut. So what is it that WOW Air sees in Detroit that all of a.net and commercial aviation doesn't by not even giving Detroit a chance when it comes to adding to their networks. Yet we beat out the likes of ORD and other international heavy weights when it comes to attracting new service. My guess on ORD would be the congestion their and the difficulty of doing one day turns in a timely matter to stay on schedule. I suspect that Ann Arbor and Lansing contribute a lot to the WOW loads.compensateme wrote:In the article WOW indicates some of the markets it cut performed well last summer, but a reduction in fleet size necessitated the cuts. One can conclude that DTW was likely one of WOW’s top six performing routes (along with YYZ, YUL, EWR, BOS and BWI). That’s good news, and not entirely surprising when you consider that DTW was the largest Atlantic market without low cost competition.
It's probably not a coincidence that the four remaining WW routes to the US are the four shortest lengths of haul. As alluded to, these are likely the four routes that allow them to make timely single day turns
Uh, DTW wasn’t blocked less than CVG, CLE, PIT of JFK (there may be others I’m missing). PIT even came with an incentive package WOW relinquished.
Try again.
flymco753 wrote:Using Friday Jun 21 as an example, lets do the outbound RDU flights.
DTW-RDU:
F9 9:10PM-11:02PM 4x weekly (M, W, F, S) A320
NK 10:20AM-12:00PM Daily A319 < (aircraft sits for a while, maybe it'll do BDL)
DL 7:31AM-9:12AM A319
DL 10:15AM-12:04PM 717
DL 3:15PM-5:08PM 717
DL 8:20PM-8:03PM A320
RDU-DTW:
F9 6:00AM-8:01AM 4x weekly (M, W, F, S) A320
NK 6:00am- 7:35AM Daily A319
DL 6:00AM-7:49AM A320
DL 9:52AM-11:40AM A319
DL 12:45PM-2:36PM 717
DL 5:47PM-7:40PM 717
winginit wrote:
winginit wrote:WW US Destination block times from KEF per OAG:
BOS: 365
JFK: 375
EWR: 375
DTW: 385
PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:I had forgotten that DL was operating DTW-FRA with an A350 this week until I walked based the flight boarding at the gate today. The upgauge coincides with the auto show industry/media week when the global industry converges in Detroit.
Also, SkyClub renovations have progressed in the main club since I last stopped in before holidays. They've removed the check-in / agent desks from the top of the escalator and now have them all downstairs. They have added a lot of new furniture throughout the club and added many student-union style tables & chairs where the old check in desk was upstairs.
flymco753 wrote:Delta restarts Bozeman for the summer, itll be Saturday only on the A319. Glad to see that this service was good enough to keep instead of limited time.
klm617 wrote:flymco753 wrote:Delta restarts Bozeman for the summer, itll be Saturday only on the A319. Glad to see that this service was good enough to keep instead of limited time.
It's time for Detroit to get more connected to Canada. Think about this Detroit is the largest US boarder with Canada yet it only has flights to YUL, YYZ and YOW.
The Detroit–Windsor region is not recognized formally as a single metropolitan area by either the U.S. or Canadian government. If it were, the region would be the eighth most populous urban region in North America.
klm617 wrote:Just out of curiosity does anyone have access to the numbers to compare NK capacity at DTW vs SY capacity at MSP ?
FA9295 wrote:klm617 wrote:flymco753 wrote:Delta restarts Bozeman for the summer, itll be Saturday only on the A319. Glad to see that this service was good enough to keep instead of limited time.
It's time for Detroit to get more connected to Canada. Think about this Detroit is the largest US boarder with Canada yet it only has flights to YUL, YYZ and YOW.
The Detroit–Windsor region is not recognized formally as a single metropolitan area by either the U.S. or Canadian government. If it were, the region would be the eighth most populous urban region in North America.
I could see Delta starting DTW-YVR. I think a daily A319 or 737-800 would have sufficient pax loads. And if that's successful, then maybe that would increase the chances of WestJet starting flights at DTW.
master14225 wrote:Isn't there already a seasonal DTW-YVR by DL? I feel that ATL-YVR needs to be year round so that it can compete with WS new YYC-ATL service as YVR is a way bigger market than YYC.FA9295 wrote:klm617 wrote:
It's time for Detroit to get more connected to Canada. Think about this Detroit is the largest US boarder with Canada yet it only has flights to YUL, YYZ and YOW.
The Detroit–Windsor region is not recognized formally as a single metropolitan area by either the U.S. or Canadian government. If it were, the region would be the eighth most populous urban region in North America.
I could see Delta starting DTW-YVR. I think a daily A319 or 737-800 would have sufficient pax loads. And if that's successful, then maybe that would increase the chances of WestJet starting flights at DTW.
NCAD95 wrote:master14225 wrote:Isn't there already a seasonal DTW-YVR by DL? I feel that ATL-YVR needs to be year round so that it can compete with WS new YYC-ATL service as YVR is a way bigger market than YYC.FA9295 wrote:I could see Delta starting DTW-YVR. I think a daily A319 or 737-800 would have sufficient pax loads. And if that's successful, then maybe that would increase the chances of WestJet starting flights at DTW.
Detroit has very poor coverage compared to MSP as far as Canada goes. Very little mainline and only flights to YOW, YUL and YYZ. YVR is summer only on Saturday. I think WS needs to come into Detroit and at the very least serve YVR year round and this would not directly compete with YQG-YYC on WS. YVR is at least as big as YYZ and YUL yet DTW is not connected to it while MSP is connected to both YYZ and YUL.
SESGDL wrote:The only reason the YVR route exists is because of cruises. There's a better chance of getting YYC than extending YVR.NCAD95 wrote:master14225 wrote:Isn't there already a seasonal DTW-YVR by DL? I feel that ATL-YVR needs to be year round so that it can compete with WS new YYC-ATL service as YVR is a way bigger market than YYC.
Detroit has very poor coverage compared to MSP as far as Canada goes. Very little mainline and only flights to YOW, YUL and YYZ. YVR is summer only on Saturday. I think WS needs to come into Detroit and at the very least serve YVR year round and this would not directly compete with YQG-YYC on WS. YVR is at least as big as YYZ and YUL yet DTW is not connected to it while MSP is connected to both YYZ and YUL.
YVR is not as big as YUL and no where near as big as YYZ. It’s also considerably further away and can be served over MSP or SEA, both of which are closer and larger markets to YVR.
Jeremy
flymco753 wrote:Quite a few international capacity decreases for S19 including the significant drawdown of the A330. I'll compare.
TATL:
LHR '18: 2x 332 - LHR '19: 1x 76W, 1x 332
CDG '18: 1x 76W, 1x 332, 1x 777 - CDG '19: 2x 76W, 1x 789
AMS '18: 1x 359, 3x 333 - AMS '19: 1x 359, 3x 333
FRA '18: 1x 76W - FRA '19: 1x 76W
MUC '18: 1x 76W - MUC '19: 1x 76W
FCO '18: 1x 333 - FCO '19: 1x 76W
Asia capacity remains the same aside from an increase in NGO frequency, South America service is gone, and no service to Africa, Australia, or the Middle East will ever cross anyone's mind for Delta.
RJ seems to have permanently adjusted AMM to an evening departure and arrival shortly after LH leaves.
Here's a harsh reality, nobody is ever going to consider flying to Africa or Australia from DTW, lets leave those two continents off the table for good. The only remote possibility of additional Middle East service is going to be EK in which they can serve India. We're still talking 5 to 10 years before that could even come in the picture.
DTW is most likely in line for some new Europe flights, KEF traffic has doubled since service began, which has tripled since 2016. DUB should be in the lineup of stuff to see soon. BCN is hard, there's not a lot of premium traffic, I don't expect it or MAD any time soon. The only other remote possibility for a new European city will have to be DUS, even then it'll be very summer seasonal. Lets face the fact that BA isn't coming, LOT has no interest, and the amount of travel between DTW and MAN is considered "laughable" compared to MCO or NYC.
I imagine some Central and South America service could be possible, SJO is a pretty decent vacation destination. Perhaps that can come soon on a 757 seasonally. Expanded MBJ & PUJ service is likely. Would like to see someone get into STT or SXM. As for South America, the only possibility I see is DL starting BOG because they can use a 75W. Anything else is way too small for a 76W or 339 type aircraft. No South American carrier is going to want to touch DTW soil in terms of regularly scheduled flights.
Harsh reality that we as fanboys (like myself) or residents have to deal with, there's not really anywhere else to go. There's a huge cement wall in the way and that makes someones job marketing the airport probably 50x harder than it's supposed to be.
flymco753 wrote:SESGDL wrote:The only reason the YVR route exists is because of cruises. There's a better chance of getting YYC than extending YVR.NCAD95 wrote:
Detroit has very poor coverage compared to MSP as far as Canada goes. Very little mainline and only flights to YOW, YUL and YYZ. YVR is summer only on Saturday. I think WS needs to come into Detroit and at the very least serve YVR year round and this would not directly compete with YQG-YYC on WS. YVR is at least as big as YYZ and YUL yet DTW is not connected to it while MSP is connected to both YYZ and YUL.
YVR is not as big as YUL and no where near as big as YYZ. It’s also considerably further away and can be served over MSP or SEA, both of which are closer and larger markets to YVR.
Jeremy
PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:Cold morning out DTW. Lows were -5 and hear reports of RON aircraft with frozen water lines and door locks.
compensateme wrote:Just for us geeks -
Yesterday’s DTW-ICN cancellation (which wasn’t weather related) forced the cancellation of ICN-ATL. To reset, the 359 was pulled from AMS, and subbed an evening DTW-ATL flight to set-up this evening’s ATL-ICN. Meanwhile, a 77L (operational spare? I didn’t research it) subbed an afternoon ATL-DTW flight and subbed for the 359 to AMS.
