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Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2018 10:38 am
by aerorobnz
HLZCPH wrote:
Hi. I see NZ6 to LAX (OKN) turned back to AKL on Wednesday night and hasn't flown since. Does anyone know what the problem was?
I saw NZM pop up on the radar briefly yesterday at the AKL maintenance shop. Is it getting close to coming back into service? Must be getting a bit crowded with NZC, NZF, NZJ, NZM parked up!


ZK-NZM had a proving flight today. OKN had a defect that forced it to return, it has been fixed by the following day but hasn't been used since.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2018 11:48 pm
by ZK-NBT
aerorobnz wrote:
HLZCPH wrote:
Hi. I see NZ6 to LAX (OKN) turned back to AKL on Wednesday night and hasn't flown since. Does anyone know what the problem was?
I saw NZM pop up on the radar briefly yesterday at the AKL maintenance shop. Is it getting close to coming back into service? Must be getting a bit crowded with NZC, NZF, NZJ, NZM parked up!


ZK-NZM had a proving flight today. OKN had a defect that forced it to return, it has been fixed by the following day but hasn't been used since.


OKN NZ6 AKL-LAX 7/12
NZM NZ284 AKL-SIN 8/12 first flight in a few months

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 3:47 am
by aerohottie
ZK-NBT wrote:
NZ6 wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1812/S00185/air-new-zealand-to-operate-christchurch-singapore-services.htm

NZ to operate seasonal CHC-SIN With 789.


Didn't see that you had posted this as I hadn't refreshed my page. My apologies.


All good. I can’t say I saw that coming but it will replace the second seasonal SQ service that is 3 weekly, so a 5 weekly 789 is a nice little increase, looks like a code 2? Certainly not where i expected those to go. Good to see however.

Bit disappointed. This was a potential opportunity for Air NZ to operate the 789 on WLG-SIN, and operate double daily WLG-MEL A320 flights, and leave SQ to focus on CHC instead of WLG

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 4:05 am
by zkncj
aerohottie wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
NZ6 wrote:

Didn't see that you had posted this as I hadn't refreshed my page. My apologies.


All good. I can’t say I saw that coming but it will replace the second seasonal SQ service that is 3 weekly, so a 5 weekly 789 is a nice little increase, looks like a code 2? Certainly not where i expected those to go. Good to see however.

Bit disappointed. This was a potential opportunity for Air NZ to operate the 789 on WLG-SIN, and operate double daily WLG-MEL A320 flights, and leave SQ to focus on CHC instead of WLG


Wouldn't the 789 still need an stop ex-WLG? if it was to go to SIN?

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 4:15 am
by ZK-NBT
aerohottie wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
NZ6 wrote:

Didn't see that you had posted this as I hadn't refreshed my page. My apologies.


All good. I can’t say I saw that coming but it will replace the second seasonal SQ service that is 3 weekly, so a 5 weekly 789 is a nice little increase, looks like a code 2? Certainly not where i expected those to go. Good to see however.

Bit disappointed. This was a potential opportunity for Air NZ to operate the 789 on WLG-SIN, and operate double daily WLG-MEL A320 flights, and leave SQ to focus on CHC instead of WLG


Why? The 789 would take a fairly hefty hit ex WLG, NZ/SQ only codeshare WLG-SIN but not WLG-MEL don’t they?

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 4:44 am
by NZ6
aerohottie wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
NZ6 wrote:

Didn't see that you had posted this as I hadn't refreshed my page. My apologies.


All good. I can’t say I saw that coming but it will replace the second seasonal SQ service that is 3 weekly, so a 5 weekly 789 is a nice little increase, looks like a code 2? Certainly not where i expected those to go. Good to see however.

Bit disappointed. This was a potential opportunity for Air NZ to operate the 789 on WLG-SIN, and operate double daily WLG-MEL A320 flights, and leave SQ to focus on CHC instead of WLG


You say your disappointed as there was a 'potential opportunity' but was there any actual potential in this or just wishful creative thinking or personal want?

I'm not being rude, there's a difference between a clear missed opportunity and something wanted.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 5:48 am
by aerorobnz
aerohottie wrote:

Bit disappointed. This was a potential opportunity for Air NZ to operate the 789 on WLG-SIN, and operate double daily WLG-MEL A320 flights, and leave SQ to focus on CHC instead of WLG


I would rather have SQ serve the market. Superior product in just about every way, especially if they send an A350 that way in the future too.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 6:12 am
by ZK-NBT
I saw a comment on another board saying NZ had to do CHC-SIN, I may have misread it or is there some truth to this that NZ have to operate a certain percentage of the NZ-SIN capacity under the Renewed JV? They will operate 2 AKL-SIN services over the NS.

I’d imagine this will be times similar to NZ’s AKL-SIN to allow a W AKL-SIN-CHC Vv routing, although they could do it through PER aswell. And SQ push their flight back 3hrs to give shorter European connections ex CHC similar to what they did with SQ285/286 ex AKL.

aerorobnz wrote:
aerohottie wrote:

Bit disappointed. This was a potential opportunity for Air NZ to operate the 789 on WLG-SIN, and operate double daily WLG-MEL A320 flights, and leave SQ to focus on CHC instead of WLG


I would rather have SQ serve the market. Superior product in just about every way, especially if they send an A350 that way in the future too.


I’d say SQ would want their own metal in all 3 cities, AKL/WLG/CHC should WLG continue long term. With NZ covering some AKL/CHC flights as they do as there is higher frequency. I doubt SQ would give up WLG for NZ to operate and I personally doubt NZ would want to operate WLG-SIN be it non stop or via OZ.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 8:22 am
by aklrno
Has there been any talk or information about NZ joining the TSA precheck system in the US? With all the expansion into more US airports to attract American tourist dollars it would be nice to improve the travel experience at US airports. I suspect most American tourists coming to New Zealand are experienced travelers so probably are enrolled in Precheck. I for one would like to avoid the main TSA queue at LAX.

Next week I’ll be on NZ metal but a UA ticket. UA has my precheck info but it does me no good on an NZ aircraft.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:04 pm
by PA515
Air NZ A321-271NX ZK-NNC (msn 8573) on delivery XFW-MCT as ANZ6092.

https://www.flightradar24.com/ANZ6092/1ecd5486

PA515

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 7:41 pm
by NZ6
ZK-NBT wrote:
I saw a comment on another board saying NZ had to do CHC-SIN, I may have misread it or is there some truth to this that NZ have to operate a certain percentage of the NZ-SIN capacity under the Renewed JV?
They will operate 2 AKL-SIN services over the NS.


I don't believe it's as black and white as that, from what I understand it's about ensuring you meet the obligations and consumer benefits outlined in the application....to simplify it during the NW SQ is operating a 77W and A380 from AKL, a 772 from WLG and traditionally a 772 from CHC while NZ has 1x 789 from AKL.

As the alliance grows, you need to demonstrate how both airlines working together is beneficial to each other and ultimately the consumer/market.

ZK-NBT wrote:
I’d say SQ would want their own metal in all 3 cities, AKL/WLG/CHC should WLG continue long term. With NZ covering some AKL/CHC flights as they do as there is higher frequency. I doubt SQ would give up WLG for NZ to operate and I personally doubt NZ would want to operate WLG-SIN be it non stop or via OZ.


Why would you want metal in all 3 cities..... under the alliance NZ and SQ are both "in" all 3 already. There's no real benefit for having your own metal there other than for the plane spotter...

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 7:47 pm
by Gasman
NZ6 wrote:
Why would you want metal in all 3 cities..... under the alliance NZ and SQ are both "in" all 3 already. There's no real benefit for having your own metal there other than for the plane spotter...


The benefit is in providing your customers the product they have paid for and are loyal to. Brand image to SQ is huge, and to the SQ customers that subscribe to it, switching from SQ's product to hip-hop safety video would be jarring, to say the least.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 8:02 pm
by ZK-NBT
NZ6 wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
I saw a comment on another board saying NZ had to do CHC-SIN, I may have misread it or is there some truth to this that NZ have to operate a certain percentage of the NZ-SIN capacity under the Renewed JV?
They will operate 2 AKL-SIN services over the NS.


I don't believe it's as black and white as that, from what I understand it's about ensuring you meet the obligations and consumer benefits outlined in the application....to simplify it during the NW SQ is operating a 77W and A380 from AKL, a 772 from WLG and traditionally a 772 from CHC while NZ has 1x 789 from AKL.

As the alliance grows, you need to demonstrate how both airlines working together is beneficial to each other and ultimately the consumer/market.

ZK-NBT wrote:
I’d say SQ would want their own metal in all 3 cities, AKL/WLG/CHC should WLG continue long term. With NZ covering some AKL/CHC flights as they do as there is higher frequency. I doubt SQ would give up WLG for NZ to operate and I personally doubt NZ would want to operate WLG-SIN be it non stop or via OZ.


Why would you want metal in all 3 cities..... under the alliance NZ and SQ are both "in" all 3 already. There's no real benefit for having your own metal there other than for the plane spotter...


Sure it’s not as black and white as that I agree, maybe it comes down to SQ not having enough A359’s to serve CHC more than once daily? I am somewhat surprised by NZ doing it personally.

SQ have a very strong brand and it’s not like NZ have any plans to serve WLG-SIN either non stop or via OZ afaik. They won’t drop AKL and likely wouldn’t drop CHC, its not like UA or something but they only serve AKL where no one else flies WLG/CHC-US.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 8:55 pm
by Megatop747-412
ZK-NBT wrote:
aerorobnz wrote:
HLZCPH wrote:
Hi. I see NZ6 to LAX (OKN) turned back to AKL on Wednesday night and hasn't flown since. Does anyone know what the problem was?
I saw NZM pop up on the radar briefly yesterday at the AKL maintenance shop. Is it getting close to coming back into service? Must be getting a bit crowded with NZC, NZF, NZJ, NZM parked up!


ZK-NZM had a proving flight today. OKN had a defect that forced it to return, it has been fixed by the following day but hasn't been used since.


OKN NZ6 AKL-LAX 7/12
NZM NZ284 AKL-SIN 8/12 first flight in a few months


Sorry I might have missed any or some part of this earlier, if it was discussed, but I’m just wondering why was NZM out for a couple of months? I noted it’s last (previous) flight was in Sept, until the recent air test and subsequent NZ284/283 AKL-SIN vv flight flight. Was NZM also having the RR enginee issues that have plagued the rest of the 789 fleet?

Thanks in advance.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 8:57 pm
by Birdiey
ZK-NBT wrote:
Sure it’s not as black and white as that I agree, maybe it comes down to SQ not having enough A359’s to serve CHC more than once daily? I am somewhat surprised by NZ doing it personally.

SQ have a very strong brand and it’s not like NZ have any plans to serve WLG-SIN either non stop or via OZ afaik. They won’t drop AKL and likely wouldn’t drop CHC, its not like UA or something but they only serve AKL where no one else flies WLG/CHC-US.


Do you think this new route might indicate a general change in NZs attitude to CHC? Peehaps US flights in future?

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 8:59 pm
by DavidByrne
aerorobnz wrote:
I would rather have SQ serve the market. Superior product in just about every way, especially if they send an A350 that way in the future too.

Umm, SQ does serve the market, daily, all year round. So why the angst about giving customers a choice of carrier in the summer? This sounds like just another example of NZ-bashing. Boring.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 9:01 pm
by NZ6
Gasman wrote:
NZ6 wrote:
Why would you want metal in all 3 cities..... under the alliance NZ and SQ are both "in" all 3 already. There's no real benefit for having your own metal there other than for the plane spotter...


The benefit is in providing your customers the product they have paid for and are loyal to. Brand image to SQ is huge, and to the SQ customers that subscribe to it, switching from SQ's product to hip-hop safety video would be jarring, to say the least.


So, based on this logic why is SQ in the alliance in the first place?

Don't let your own personal view speak for SQ here.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 9:21 pm
by NZ6
ZK-NBT wrote:
[

Sure it’s not as black and white as that I agree, maybe it comes down to SQ not having enough A359’s to serve CHC more than once daily? I am somewhat surprised by NZ doing it personally.

SQ have a very strong brand and it’s not like NZ have any plans to serve WLG-SIN either non stop or via OZ afaik. They won’t drop AKL and likely wouldn’t drop CHC, its not like UA or something but they only serve AKL where no one else flies WLG/CHC-US.


Yes, It could be as simple as NZ wanting to increase the capacity between CHC and SIN within the alliance and SQ preferring to use the equipment elsewhere in their network, this leaving NZ being 'forced' into adding the extra capacity themselves.

As always, there's a lot of speculation around these things... and like always, it's a great way to comment on NZ's 'inferior' product even though they perform as a business amazingly well and, let's not forget SQ being in alliance in the first place suggests they are more than happy to have their customers travel on this product.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 9:58 pm
by Gasman
NZ6 wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
[

As always, there's a lot of speculation around these things... and like always, it's a great way to comment on NZ's 'inferior' product even though they perform as a business amazingly well and, let's not forget SQ being in alliance in the first place suggests they are more than happy to have their customers travel on this product.


It doesn't suggest they are "more than happy" at all. I'd suspect "begrudgingly accepting" would be closer to the mark for most carriers in terms of their feelings towards their alliance partners.

You said "there's no real benefit in using your own metal except for planespotters", and I'm saying particularly for an airline with a brand image like SQ, there is.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:28 pm
by NZ6
Gasman wrote:
NZ6 wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
[

As always, there's a lot of speculation around these things... and like always, it's a great way to comment on NZ's 'inferior' product even though they perform as a business amazingly well and, let's not forget SQ being in alliance in the first place suggests they are more than happy to have their customers travel on this product.


It doesn't suggest they are "more than happy" at all. I'd suspect "begrudgingly accepting" would be closer to the mark for most carriers in terms of their feelings towards their alliance partners.

You said "there's no real benefit in using your own metal except for planespotters", and I'm saying particularly for an airline with a brand image like SQ, there is.


If SQ didn't like NZ's product and weren't happy would they be in the alliance? is the alliance a must for SQ, or even as remotely close to important it is to say NZ?

The alliance is about putting more seats into the market together and using each other's strengths to sell these seats, From NZ's end, it's their domestic network and local selling power and from SQ, it's using's their hub and European/Indian connections along with their selling power/presence in these markets.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 12:19 am
by aerorobnz
DavidByrne wrote:
aerorobnz wrote:
I would rather have SQ serve the market. Superior product in just about every way, especially if they send an A350 that way in the future too.

Umm, SQ does serve the market, daily, all year round. So why the angst about giving customers a choice of carrier in the summer? This sounds like just another example of NZ-bashing. Boring.


It was raised that someone was a bit disappointed by the fact NZ weren't doing WLG-CHC, hence I was referring to Wellington, not Christchurch. It was not NZ bashing at all. I would rather have one airline serve WLG properly than have bits and pieces schedules with inconsistent products.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 12:23 am
by zkeoj
Does anybody know how I can figure out when any of the three leased 777s are doing trans-Tasman runs? I looked for flights to SYD/BNE/MEL, but had no indication of any of them?

Cheers
micha

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 12:36 am
by aerorobnz
zkeoj wrote:
Does anybody know how I can figure out when any of the three leased 777s are doing trans-Tasman runs? I looked for flights to SYD/BNE/MEL, but had no indication of any of them?

Cheers
micha


your best bet is RAR or PPT for SQ planes, Some days you will strike them to PER and other places. OKT tends to be on NZ6. It doesn't allow for many options for transtasman ops. It has done NAN/MEL (pm) in recent weeks, but often it stays all day in AKL. I can give you some idea on PM if you need specific dates.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 2:23 am
by nomorerjs
Looking at NZ27 ORD-AKL, it seems to be leaving late almost every flight (not that there have been many). NZ26 is arriving early or on-time into ORD.

Any reason for this?
AKL seems to have delays many mornings
ORD weather?
UA connections?
Weight problem?

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 2:38 am
by ZK-NBT
Megatop747-412 wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
aerorobnz wrote:

ZK-NZM had a proving flight today. OKN had a defect that forced it to return, it has been fixed by the following day but hasn't been used since.


OKN NZ6 AKL-LAX 7/12
NZM NZ284 AKL-SIN 8/12 first flight in a few months


Sorry I might have missed any or some part of this earlier, if it was discussed, but I’m just wondering why was NZM out for a couple of months? I noted it’s last (previous) flight was in Sept, until the recent air test and subsequent NZ284/283 AKL-SIN vv flight flight. Was NZM also having the RR enginee issues that have plagued the rest of the 789 fleet?

Thanks in advance.


Can’t remember exactly, it was a different issue to the other aircraft, this one had the updated TEN engines.

Birdiey wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
Sure it’s not as black and white as that I agree, maybe it comes down to SQ not having enough A359’s to serve CHC more than once daily? I am somewhat surprised by NZ doing it personally.

SQ have a very strong brand and it’s not like NZ have any plans to serve WLG-SIN either non stop or via OZ afaik. They won’t drop AKL and likely wouldn’t drop CHC, its not like UA or something but they only serve AKL where no one else flies WLG/CHC-US.


Do you think this new route might indicate a general change in NZs attitude to CHC? Peehaps US flights in future?


I wouldn’t think so personally, but through JV’s I do wonder if you could see a UA operated seasonal to start with CHC-LAX/SFO 788? Or CA CHC-PVG if they are allowed to do that route?

NZ6 wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
[

Sure it’s not as black and white as that I agree, maybe it comes down to SQ not having enough A359’s to serve CHC more than once daily? I am somewhat surprised by NZ doing it personally.

SQ have a very strong brand and it’s not like NZ have any plans to serve WLG-SIN either non stop or via OZ afaik. They won’t drop AKL and likely wouldn’t drop CHC, its not like UA or something but they only serve AKL where no one else flies WLG/CHC-US.


Yes, It could be as simple as NZ wanting to increase the capacity between CHC and SIN within the alliance and SQ preferring to use the equipment elsewhere in their network, this leaving NZ being 'forced' into adding the extra capacity themselves.

As always, there's a lot of speculation around these things... and like always, it's a great way to comment on NZ's 'inferior' product even though they perform as a business amazingly well and, let's not forget SQ being in alliance in the first place suggests they are more than happy to have their customers travel on this product.


I wasn’t in any way intending to bash NZ’s product.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 3:11 am
by DavidByrne
aerorobnz wrote:
It was raised that someone was a bit disappointed by the fact NZ weren't doing WLG-CHC, hence I was referring to Wellington, not Christchurch. It was not NZ bashing at all. I would rather have one airline serve WLG properly than have bits and pieces schedules with inconsistent products.

Apologies - I misunderstood.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 3:11 am
by NYKiwi
Re NZ26
Noticed the same and wondering if it has to do with deicing delays out of ORD maybe gate delays into AKL.is the only other thing comes to mind

I have noticed the interesting route back it takes......the other night it went west and hit the California coast way north of San Fran before turning south west I always expected a track over northern Mexico.dunno what drives these tracks

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 6:22 am
by a7ala
Gasman wrote:
NZ6 wrote:
Why would you want metal in all 3 cities..... under the alliance NZ and SQ are both "in" all 3 already. There's no real benefit for having your own metal there other than for the plane spotter...


The benefit is in providing your customers the product they have paid for and are loyal to. Brand image to SQ is huge, and to the SQ customers that subscribe to it, switching from SQ's product to hip-hop safety video would be jarring, to say the least.


As the NZ/VA alliance has shown these arrangements don't always stick around for ever. I'm sure SQ has that in mind by flying their metal in to all 3 cities.

Its hard to re-establish yourself if you remove your metal and hand over your marketing and sales to the other airline, as VA are now finding.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 7:03 am
by PA515
Air NZ A321-271NX ZK-NNC (msn 8573) delivery flight resumes MCT-KUL as ANZ6092.

https://www.flightradar24.com/ANZ6092/1ecf8277

PA515

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 7:22 am
by 777ER
PA515 wrote:
Air NZ A321-271NX ZK-NNC (msn 8573) delivery flight resumes MCT-KUL as ANZ6092.

https://www.flightradar24.com/ANZ6092/1ecf8277

PA515

So with this delivery, is there shortly an additional 3x A320s on domestic or hasn't the additional A320s been transferred yet?

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 7:41 am
by NZ6
a7ala wrote:
Gasman wrote:
NZ6 wrote:
Why would you want metal in all 3 cities..... under the alliance NZ and SQ are both "in" all 3 already. There's no real benefit for having your own metal there other than for the plane spotter...


The benefit is in providing your customers the product they have paid for and are loyal to. Brand image to SQ is huge, and to the SQ customers that subscribe to it, switching from SQ's product to hip-hop safety video would be jarring, to say the least.


As the NZ/VA alliance has shown these arrangements don't always stick around for ever. I'm sure SQ has that in mind by flying their metal in to all 3 cities.

Its hard to re-establish yourself if you remove your metal and hand over your marketing and sales to the other airline, as VA are now finding.


A very valid point, both just renewed to 2024 (by memory). Not sure if that offers any more reassurance or not.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 8:03 am
by Megatop747-412
ZK-NBT wrote:
Megatop747-412 wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:

OKN NZ6 AKL-LAX 7/12
NZM NZ284 AKL-SIN 8/12 first flight in a few months


Sorry I might have missed any or some part of this earlier, if it was discussed, but I’m just wondering why was NZM out for a couple of months? I noted it’s last (previous) flight was in Sept, until the recent air test and subsequent NZ284/283 AKL-SIN vv flight flight. Was NZM also having the RR enginee issues that have plagued the rest of the 789 fleet?

Thanks in advance.


Can’t remember exactly, it was a different issue to the other aircraft, this one had the updated TEN engines.



Thanks Sir. I too thought that NZL onwards hav the updated TEN engines and hence weren’t affected by the RR engine issues. Thanks in any case.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 8:15 am
by Megatop747-412
NZ6 wrote:
a7ala wrote:
Gasman wrote:

The benefit is in providing your customers the product they have paid for and are loyal to. Brand image to SQ is huge, and to the SQ customers that subscribe to it, switching from SQ's product to hip-hop safety video would be jarring, to say the least.


As the NZ/VA alliance has shown these arrangements don't always stick around for ever. I'm sure SQ has that in mind by flying their metal in to all 3 cities.

Its hard to re-establish yourself if you remove your metal and hand over your marketing and sales to the other airline, as VA are now finding.


A very valid point, both just renewed to 2024 (by memory). Not sure if that offers any more reassurance or not.


I have a slightly different take on perhaps why NZ will “take over” the additional season SIN-CHC flights from next year (NW19) onwards, and that’s perhaps SQ might not have enough long haul configured A350s come that time to service the route... With their daily SQ297/298 going A350 in Jan 2019, my guess is that they would want to offer a consistent product on SIN-CHC, even on th4 seasonal flights, but come Jan 2019 IST will remain their only long haul destination served by long haul B772ERs. If SQ were to receive anymore new long haul A359s in 2019 I believe IST would get it ahead of the additional SIN-CHC flights. Besides, with SQ starting SIN-SEA non stop next year using regular long haul A359 and not the ULRs, they would be a further “shortage”... Hence the NZ starting SIN-CHC may be a strategic thing - this in itself could be a good example of SQ/NZ working together in this alliance...?

Just my 2 cents of thought...

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 8:22 am
by ZK-NBT
Megatop747-412 wrote:
NZ6 wrote:
a7ala wrote:

As the NZ/VA alliance has shown these arrangements don't always stick around for ever. I'm sure SQ has that in mind by flying their metal in to all 3 cities.

Its hard to re-establish yourself if you remove your metal and hand over your marketing and sales to the other airline, as VA are now finding.


A very valid point, both just renewed to 2024 (by memory). Not sure if that offers any more reassurance or not.


I have a slightly different take on perhaps why NZ will “take over” the additional season SIN-CHC flights from next year (NW19) onwards, and that’s perhaps SQ might not have enough long haul configured A350s come that time to service the route... With their daily SQ297/298 going A350 in Jan 2019, my guess is that they would want to offer a consistent product on SIN-CHC, even on th4 seasonal flights, but come Jan 2019 IST will remain their only long haul destination served by long haul B772ERs. If SQ were to receive anymore new long haul A359s in 2019 I believe IST would get it ahead of the additional SIN-CHC flights. Besides, with SQ starting SIN-SEA non stop next year using regular long haul A359 and not the ULRs, they would be a further “shortage”... Hence the NZ starting SIN-CHC may be a strategic thing - this in itself could be a good example of SQ/NZ working together in this alliance...?

Just my 2 cents of thought...


I agree, I think BNE loses all 3 long haul A350’s, it didn’t get any long haul configured aircraft before the A350’s were on the route, it’s also been getting a long haul 772 on the 4th flight, that’s where they are freeing up aircraft from for now atleast. I’ve no idea if there are anymore long haul A359’s planned. BNE and ADL are first to get the regional ones however.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 9:18 am
by Megatop747-412
ZK-NBT wrote:
Megatop747-412 wrote:
NZ6 wrote:

A very valid point, both just renewed to 2024 (by memory). Not sure if that offers any more reassurance or not.


I have a slightly different take on perhaps why NZ will “take over” the additional season SIN-CHC flights from next year (NW19) onwards, and that’s perhaps SQ might not have enough long haul configured A350s come that time to service the route... With their daily SQ297/298 going A350 in Jan 2019, my guess is that they would want to offer a consistent product on SIN-CHC, even on th4 seasonal flights, but come Jan 2019 IST will remain their only long haul destination served by long haul B772ERs. If SQ were to receive anymore new long haul A359s in 2019 I believe IST would get it ahead of the additional SIN-CHC flights. Besides, with SQ starting SIN-SEA non stop next year using regular long haul A359 and not the ULRs, they would be a further “shortage”... Hence the NZ starting SIN-CHC may be a strategic thing - this in itself could be a good example of SQ/NZ working together in this alliance...?

Just my 2 cents of thought...


I agree, I think BNE loses all 3 long haul A350’s, it didn’t get any long haul configured aircraft before the A350’s were on the route, it’s also been getting a long haul 772 on the 4th flight, that’s where they are freeing up aircraft from for now atleast. I’ve no idea if there are anymore long haul A359’s planned. BNE and ADL are first to get the regional ones however.


I believe there will be more long haul configured A350/ to come, after the initial regional configured ones gets delivered. They do need more to start SEA, which is a confirmed route, and maybe IST. And I believe CPH May switch from 77WR to A350 too, so they definitely needs more.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 9:18 am
by Megatop747-412
ZK-NBT wrote:
Megatop747-412 wrote:
NZ6 wrote:

A very valid point, both just renewed to 2024 (by memory). Not sure if that offers any more reassurance or not.


I have a slightly different take on perhaps why NZ will “take over” the additional season SIN-CHC flights from next year (NW19) onwards, and that’s perhaps SQ might not have enough long haul configured A350s come that time to service the route... With their daily SQ297/298 going A350 in Jan 2019, my guess is that they would want to offer a consistent product on SIN-CHC, even on th4 seasonal flights, but come Jan 2019 IST will remain their only long haul destination served by long haul B772ERs. If SQ were to receive anymore new long haul A359s in 2019 I believe IST would get it ahead of the additional SIN-CHC flights. Besides, with SQ starting SIN-SEA non stop next year using regular long haul A359 and not the ULRs, they would be a further “shortage”... Hence the NZ starting SIN-CHC may be a strategic thing - this in itself could be a good example of SQ/NZ working together in this alliance...?

Just my 2 cents of thought...


I agree, I think BNE loses all 3 long haul A350’s, it didn’t get any long haul configured aircraft before the A350’s were on the route, it’s also been getting a long haul 772 on the 4th flight, that’s where they are freeing up aircraft from for now atleast. I’ve no idea if there are anymore long haul A359’s planned. BNE and ADL are first to get the regional ones however.


I believe there will be more long haul configured A350/ to come, after the initial regional configured ones gets delivered. They do need more to start SEA, which is a confirmed route, and maybe IST. And I believe CPH May switch from 77WR to A350 too, so they definitely needs more.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 1:58 pm
by NZ321
Have I missed something? Since when did NZ announce CHC-SIN? Not be reported on Airlineroute AFAIK.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 6:19 pm
by Megatop747-412
NZ321 wrote:
Have I missed something? Since when did NZ announce CHC-SIN? Not be reported on Airlineroute AFAIK.


I was picked up and reported by Scoop - http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1812/S ... rvices.htm

That appears to be the only place (so far) with the news. It hasn’t been picked up by Airlineroute and neither have NZ or SQ announced it in their respective press release web sites.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 6:20 pm
by Megatop747-412
Megatop747-412 wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
Megatop747-412 wrote:

I have a slightly different take on perhaps why NZ will “take over” the additional season SIN-CHC flights from next year (NW19) onwards, and that’s perhaps SQ might not have enough long haul configured A350s come that time to service the route... With their daily SQ297/298 going A350 in Jan 2019, my guess is that they would want to offer a consistent product on SIN-CHC, even on th4 seasonal flights, but come Jan 2019 IST will remain their only long haul destination served by long haul B772ERs. If SQ were to receive anymore new long haul A359s in 2019 I believe IST would get it ahead of the additional SIN-CHC flights. Besides, with SQ starting SIN-SEA non stop next year using regular long haul A359 and not the ULRs, they would be a further “shortage”... Hence the NZ starting SIN-CHC may be a strategic thing - this in itself could be a good example of SQ/NZ working together in this alliance...?

Just my 2 cents of thought...


I agree, I think BNE loses all 3 long haul A350’s, it didn’t get any long haul configured aircraft before the A350’s were on the route, it’s also been getting a long haul 772 on the 4th flight, that’s where they are freeing up aircraft from for now atleast. I’ve no idea if there are anymore long haul A359’s planned. BNE and ADL are first to get the regional ones however.


I believe there will be more long haul configured A350/ to come, after the initial regional configured ones gets delivered. They do need more to start SEA, which is a confirmed route, and maybe IST. And I believe CPH May switch from 77WR to A350 too, so they definitely needs more.



Oops apologies for the double posting...

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 8:00 pm
by NZ6
NZ321 wrote:
Have I missed something? Since when did NZ announce CHC-SIN? Not be reported on Airlineroute AFAIK.


It's the plan for next year so not in schedules yet or officially announced by the airline.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 8:09 pm
by smartplane
Megatop747-412 wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
Megatop747-412 wrote:

Sorry I might have missed any or some part of this earlier, if it was discussed, but I’m just wondering why was NZM out for a couple of months? I noted it’s last (previous) flight was in Sept, until the recent air test and subsequent NZ284/283 AKL-SIN vv flight flight. Was NZM also having the RR enginee issues that have plagued the rest of the 789 fleet?

Thanks in advance.


Can’t remember exactly, it was a different issue to the other aircraft, this one had the updated TEN engines.



Thanks Sir. I too thought that NZL onwards hav the updated TEN engines and hence weren’t affected by the RR engine issues. Thanks in any case.

Is this the air frame with a warranty issue? In which case the engines were probably switched to others in the fleet, while remedial work was completed.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 6:16 am
by ZK-NBT
https://www.airnewzealand.co.nz/press-r ... e-services

Literally Exactly the same schedule as AKL-SIN so a seamless swap of aircraft.

Will be interesting to see if ORD does well and increases, the aircraft will come from somewhere else, I presumed (wrongly) the extra code 2 789 would be used to increase ORD to 5-6 weekly, maybe with CHC-SIN at 5 weekly they will be able to squeeze 1 more ORD frequency in? Or maybe they have no plans to increase yet.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 7:30 am
by DavidByrne
ZK-NBT wrote:
https://www.airnewzealand.co.nz/press-release-2018-air-new-zealand-to-operate-christchurch-singapore-services

Literally Exactly the same schedule as AKL-SIN so a seamless swap of aircraft.

I was wondering whether they might use the other two days a week (Mon and Wed) for AKL-PER services, simplifying the scheduling for the AKL-PER services (and also potentially being more efficient). We will see, I guess.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 7:50 am
by ZK-NBT
[twoid][/twoid]
DavidByrne wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
https://www.airnewzealand.co.nz/press-release-2018-air-new-zealand-to-operate-christchurch-singapore-services

Literally Exactly the same schedule as AKL-SIN so a seamless swap of aircraft.

I was wondering whether they might use the other two days a week (Mon and Wed) for AKL-PER services, simplifying the scheduling for the AKL-PER services (and also potentially being more efficient). We will see, I guess.


What do you mean simplifying? Extra evening services? There is a daily 1045 and 3 weekly 1950 ex AKL.

Or do Wednesday, Friday CHC-PER with the inbound SIN aircraft it’s back for the following day CHC-SIN.

There was a recent mention of potentially more PER services, maybe AKL goes 12 weekly or something plus 2 CHC?

The Tuesday arrival ORD-AKL could do AKL-ORD Tuesday evening arrive back Thursday as there is no Wednesday CHC-SIN that would work.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 9:33 am
by bevan7
Any update as to whether the strike is still going ahead?

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 10:10 am
by NZ321
Interesting the timing of the CHC-SIN Air NZ flight is so close to the SQ flight. Not optimal in terms of wider choice for passengers - SQ could have done an A380 instead given this schedule lol :)

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 5:26 pm
by ZK-NBT
NZ321 wrote:
Interesting the timing of the CHC-SIN Air NZ flight is so close to the SQ flight. Not optimal in terms of wider choice for passengers - SQ could have done an A380 instead given this schedule lol :)


I wouldn’t be surprised if the SQ flight is retimed 2-4 hrs later atleast during this period personally.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 8:24 pm
by NZ6
ZK-NBT wrote:
https://www.airnewzealand.co.nz/press-release-2018-air-new-zealand-to-operate-christchurch-singapore-services

Literally Exactly the same schedule as AKL-SIN so a seamless swap of aircraft.

Will be interesting to see if ORD does well and increases, the aircraft will come from somewhere else, I presumed (wrongly) the extra code 2 789 would be used to increase ORD to 5-6 weekly, maybe with CHC-SIN at 5 weekly they will be able to squeeze 1 more ORD frequency in? Or maybe they have no plans to increase yet.


God how did I miss this, I even checked the public website to see if it was announced via a media update and couldn't see it.

The extra capacity will help keep fares down. This is good for the consumer.

Yes although for now, it's not offering a wide range of options with regard to time. Will we see an SQ or NZ schedule change before next year. Perhaps this is still being worked through and placing capacity into the market now is a strategic move. :wink2: :shhh:

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 8:49 pm
by SCFlyer
ZK-NBT wrote:
Megatop747-412 wrote:
NZ6 wrote:

A very valid point, both just renewed to 2024 (by memory). Not sure if that offers any more reassurance or not.


I have a slightly different take on perhaps why NZ will “take over” the additional season SIN-CHC flights from next year (NW19) onwards, and that’s perhaps SQ might not have enough long haul configured A350s come that time to service the route... With their daily SQ297/298 going A350 in Jan 2019, my guess is that they would want to offer a consistent product on SIN-CHC, even on th4 seasonal flights, but come Jan 2019 IST will remain their only long haul destination served by long haul B772ERs. If SQ were to receive anymore new long haul A359s in 2019 I believe IST would get it ahead of the additional SIN-CHC flights. Besides, with SQ starting SIN-SEA non stop next year using regular long haul A359 and not the ULRs, they would be a further “shortage”... Hence the NZ starting SIN-CHC may be a strategic thing - this in itself could be a good example of SQ/NZ working together in this alliance...?

Just my 2 cents of thought...


I agree, I think BNE loses all 3 long haul A350’s, it didn’t get any long haul configured aircraft before the A350’s were on the route, it’s also been getting a long haul 772 on the 4th flight, that’s where they are freeing up aircraft from for now atleast. I’ve no idea if there are anymore long haul A359’s planned. BNE and ADL are first to get the regional ones however.


The BNE 772 (SQ265/SQ266) is actually the 2-class (regional) config in recent months, and is scheduled to be replaced with the A330 on some of the SQ265/SQ266 flights over the summer. It's been confirmed at AUSBT that BNE will get a mix of 2-class and 3-class A350s.

The current rumours is that SQ245/SQ246 will be the sole BNE pair that will remain with the 3-class A350. That pair is the BNE-SIN redeye (daytime SIN-BNE) which connects to/from the daytime SIN-LHR-SIN flights.

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread - December 2018

Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 10:19 pm
by DavidByrne
Another possibility with the extra CHC-SIN services is that NZ and SQ had planned this all along, since the start of the JV, but that NZ taking on the summer seasonals had to await the delivery of sufficient aircraft. We just don't know . . .