Turkish Aviation October 2018

globetrotter94 · Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:16 pm

cmoltay wrote:
It is in the news today that Ataturk Havalimanı (soon to be former IST) will continue to operate as a general aviation terminal, exhibition grounds for events related to aviation and an academic facility for aviation.

Don't you think this issue would deserve a discussion topic of its own? What can be done with a former hub?

Discard the area containing the 2 parallel runways (and Turkish Technic facilities, once transition is complete) and current terminals and main apron; retain 5/23 and southern apron, for GA for the time being, but with enough space to create a small airport for short-haul flights in the future if the need arises--sort of like Aeroparque Jorge Newbery in Buenos Aires?

What is the plan for the M1A metro, now that one of its termini isn't likely to get anywhere near as many passengers? Cut it short, or extend it to somewhere more populated?

ankaraflyjet · Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:22 pm

The plans started to surface by LH Group, SunExpress will launch daily (effective from end of October when LH suspends flights) ESB MUC (ESB dep at 6 AM daily) and will have LH code on Sun Express flights to connect pax to LH global network. MUC ESB is at different hour every day but usually mid-day or afternoon departure from MUC.

Not bad as LH will continue to capture pax to/from ESB but ESB loses a premium scheduled service that is not good news.

ankaraflyjet wrote:
Thanks for the load factor, very interesting situation indeed. In any case that is a great opportunity for TK and others to step into the market now. Ever since LH bought other airlines they immediately scrapped ESB, this was the case for Swissair as they went bust, Austrian who served daily VIE ESB, SN operated BRU ESB and also went bust, LH bought British Midland they also axed LHR ESB, likewise with SAS that served CPH ESB seasonally, so a very harsh Germany biased consolidation took place over the years leaving ESB to TK and LH only. I do not expect OS, LX, SK etc. to reinstate ESB at the time LH is pulling out so we should look at a wider TK international expansion and/or other LCC's to step in from Europe...Let's see how this is going to play out but TK should definitely include ESB MUC among the recent attempt to add London, Rome and Baku from ESB in my opinion.

This means AC and UA codeshare services to ESB also are going to be terminated so AC and UA should make a new codeshare arrangement with TK to continue to include ESB in their network, I wonder if TK would include ESB CDG or ESB FRA for AC and UA codeshares as they codeshare IST CDG and IST FRA already to AC and UA. TK usually avoids codeshare arrangements except IST in order not to promote secondary hubs form secondary markets but they should well reconsider this policy...

aldrigsomandre wrote:
TK105 wrote:
Wow. End of an era for Ankara and also for Turkey. Everyday I feel more distant to Europe some how. I used this flight many times and will miss the Franziskaner Weissbier I drank at LH Senator Lounge @ MUC.

Just checked the loads for this flight, never below 90 percent.
I don't understand the reasoning for this.

mafaky · Wed Oct 10, 2018 8:36 pm

cmoltay wrote:
It is in the news today that Ataturk Havalimanı (soon to be former IST) will continue to operate as a general aviation terminal, exhibition grounds for events related to aviation and an academic facility for aviation.

Don't you think this issue would deserve a discussion topic of its own? What can be done with a former hub?

Don't take it for granted, as what will turn out at the end, as indicated in Ugur Cebeci's news! Many things are inclined to change, within the next 2-3 years, until when TK may totally lift off from Ataturk Airport. :roll:

HeyTK · Thu Oct 11, 2018 9:31 am

The first flights from and to the New Airport are out. They are planned to operate with B737-8s on a 7 frequency weekly schedule.

Eki stands for october.
Kas for November.
Ara for December.

leftyboarder · Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:03 am

Seems to be a 2 plane base for now, right?

cmoltay · Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:11 pm

I think the issue is ripe for discussion and any input may be of benefit to shaping the future development inline with the city's needs... Cebeci made his input and now the community should continue imagining from this point... I know that journalists are foloowing this forum and I am sure they would be willing to publish if some feasible dream comes out...

mafaky wrote:
cmoltay wrote:
It is in the news today that Ataturk Havalimanı (soon to be former IST) will continue to operate as a general aviation terminal, exhibition grounds for events related to aviation and an academic facility for aviation.

Don't you think this issue would deserve a discussion topic of its own? What can be done with a former hub?

Don't take it for granted, as what will turn out at the end, as indicated in Ugur Cebeci's news! Many things are inclined to change, within the next 2-3 years, until when TK may totally lift off from Ataturk Airport.

LAXintl · Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:12 pm

TK statement.

Blerg · Fri Oct 12, 2018 5:56 am

Why was Baku chosen to be one of the first destination? Wouldn't that make Azerbaijan Airlines far more attractive when flying into Istanbul?

mict · Fri Oct 12, 2018 6:20 am

Blerg wrote:
Why was Baku chosen to be one of the first destination? Wouldn't that make Azerbaijan Airlines far more attractive when flying into Istanbul?

This is an extra flight in addition to existing flights to Baku currently flying from IST Ataturk airport, no changes in current operations.

ugurberkin · Fri Oct 12, 2018 6:45 am

As a Turkish Expat living in Baku, I will give a try with this flight.
It will be interesting to see how this will happen.

TK787 · Sat Oct 13, 2018 3:10 pm

On THY website, it is strange to see (Istanbul all 3 airports)

Just looking at midweek, mid day, November; one way fares:
-ISL-AYT $10
-IST-AYT $24
-SAW-AYT $21

ahmetdouas · Sat Oct 13, 2018 9:35 pm

TK787 wrote:
On THY website, it is strange to see (Istanbul all 3 airports)
Just looking at midweek, mid day, November; one way fares:
-ISL-AYT $10
-IST-AYT $24
-SAW-AYT $21

That’s so cheap. If I was in Istanbul I would do it for sure to go to Ankara for a day! Saw an ISL-ESB return for 110 TRY.

HeyTK · Sun Oct 14, 2018 12:21 am

I think I will be doing a Izmir or Antalya return.

mercure1 · Sun Oct 14, 2018 4:19 am

Will be nice to see some trip reports/photos from those that experience the new airport after the initial opening Oct 29th.

THY748i · Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:42 am

Have TK or any other airline ever blocked bookings for the 29th and 30th October for flights to/from IST? Seems like they potentially could‘ve lost a lot of pax over the confusion.

TK787 · Tue Oct 16, 2018 5:55 pm

Latest video promoting the new airport. Also featuring the new TK uniforms. So new IGA spot with TK help
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... dhc6P1jcyw

ugurberkin · Wed Oct 17, 2018 7:47 am

I tried to book GYD-ILA for 7th December and return 9th December.
It is not available on Turkish Airlines web.
Does anyone have any information, when it will be available for booking?

ankaraflyjet · Wed Oct 17, 2018 11:07 pm

THY is reinstating Ankara Rome Ankara non-stop service twice weekly from January 7th, 2019
The schedule is as follows;

Monday, Thursday TK 1289 ESB 20:30 FCO 20:50
Monday, Thursday TK 1290 FCO 21:55 ESB 02:10(+1)

Ankara London and Ankara Baku schedule to be announced next..!!!

ankaraflyjet · Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:17 pm

With LH's suspension of ESB MUC on 27OCT18 SunExpress from late-October 2018 is adding Ankara – Munich service, with first flight scheduled on 28OCT18. Boeing 737-800 aircraft will operate this route on daily basis.

LH will codeshare these flights but LH codes are yet to be announced at a later fate;

XQ716 ESB0600 – 0710MUC 738 D

XQ717 MUC1110 – 1600ESB 738 13
XQ717 MUC1220 – 1710ESB 738 46
XQ717 MUC1610 – 2100ESB 738 257

LAXintl · Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:07 pm

Update from TK Cargo.

As we expected freighter ops will remain at IST until the new cargo warehouse facilities are complete.

mafaky · Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:58 pm

The very latest news is that the € 500 million agreement between UniFree (the German Heinemann Group owned Turkish origin duty-free company) and IGA has been unexpectedly and very recently terminated. UniFree was entitled not only for the "traditional duty-free items" (liquer, tobacco, perfumery & cosmetics, etc.) but they have also sub-leased all non F&B sales outlets on the airside. Well, of course this has got little with the airport operations, but one wonders how a solution will be found to replace and rectify this last minute commercial mishap and make the place look like a real international terminal and real global hub! :mad:

On the other hand, a relatively influential news site (kokpit.aero's) chief editor has recently "recomended" that things should be taken slowly and one at a time, and TK's final establishment at INA should better be prolongued until end May 2019.

See: http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/opinio ... ber-137997

Galwayman · Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:28 pm

mercure1 wrote:
gokmengs wrote:
The infamous "presidential" 748 is out of paint hangar.
http://www.airporthaber.com/havacilik-h ... cikti.html

What a gorgeous plane.

Yes stunning aircraft, looks brilliant

aldrigsomandre · Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:00 am

mafaky wrote:

On the other hand, a relatively influential news site (kokpit.aero's) chief editor has recently "recomended" that things should be taken slowly and one at a time, and TK's final establishment at INA should better be prolongued until end May 2019.

See: http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/opinio ... ber-137997

Obviously, Mr. Cebeci makes sense.
But we all know that the EGO of one man will prevail in the end.

ugurberkin · Mon Oct 22, 2018 6:52 am

ugurberkin wrote:
I tried to book GYD-ILA for 7th December and return 9th December.
It is not available on Turkish Airlines web.
Does anyone have any information, when it will be available for booking?

Now it is added to system.
Available for booking...

ARNbased · Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:38 pm

Just wanted to say that I recently returned from ARN-IST-DXB-IST-ARN in business class (and will be traveling in TK C ARN-IST-IAH-IST-ARN starting this Thursday). Got a new A330 three legs and a pretty worn-down A321 but with nice recliner seats on the last.

A couple of comments:
- TK business continues to be a delight! I've travelled to Dubai before with QR C/F via Doha, and that was a bit nicer, but TK C isn't far behind. Comfortable seats, good IFE and nice food.
- TK remains the only good choice for short haul travel within Europe. I really go out of my way to travel with TK whenever possible in order to avoid the dreadful slimline eco-seats (with a blocked middle seat) all others offer nowadays.
- I last travelled through IST this summer, and I've heard a couple of negative comments about the appearance of the CIP Lounge since then ("it's a dump now that they're concentrating on the final stages of the new airport"). I did try the showers upstairs now and they're pretty worn, but other than that I continue to appreciate the lounge. Had a really good dinner and a really good lunch this time. No issues what so ever. I'm kind of sad to leave IST for ISL (presumably) shortly since I've grown to love the over-crowded mess that it is

- Had a 8h layover on the way out so cleared immigration and took a cab to Taksim for some shopping and Hafiz Mustafa. Went really smoothly, as usual. Cheap, even more so than usual. Will be missed in the future considering the distance between downtown Istanbul and ISL...
- Grumpier crew than usual but still overall good service and very good meals. And, for once, I managed to only get one (out of four) bus gates

I also had the misfortune of travel in AA's B737 Max in "first class". They use the same seats as TK has installed in biz in their new narrow-bodies, albeit with no IFE and significantly less pitch, but those seats are really awful. Rock-hard, very little recline and nothing much in terms of comfort. The old TK short haul recliners in C will be missed...

TK787 · Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:06 pm

According to airporthaber.com, TK 343s; TC-JDM (22.7 yrs old) and TC-JDN(21.2 yrs old) stored and could be retired.
http://www.airporthaber.com/thy-haberle ... dirdi.html (Turkish Only)

TK787 · Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:15 pm

ARNbased wrote:
Just wanted to say that I recently returned from ARN-IST-DXB-IST-ARN in business class (and will be traveling in TK C ARN-IST-IAH-IST-ARN starting this Thursday). Got a new A330 three legs and a pretty worn-down A321 but with nice recliner seats on the last.

A couple of comments:
- TK business continues to be a delight! I've travelled to Dubai before with QR C/F via Doha, and that was a bit nicer, but TK C isn't far behind. Comfortable seats, good IFE and nice food.
- TK remains the only good choice for short haul travel within Europe. I really go out of my way to travel with TK whenever possible in order to avoid the dreadful slimline eco-seats (with a blocked middle seat) all others offer nowadays.
- I last travelled through IST this summer, and I've heard a couple of negative comments about the appearance of the CIP Lounge since then ("it's a dump now that they're concentrating on the final stages of the new airport"). I did try the showers upstairs now and they're pretty worn, but other than that I continue to appreciate the lounge. Had a really good dinner and a really good lunch this time. No issues what so ever. I'm kind of sad to leave IST for ISL (presumably) shortly since I've grown to love the over-crowded mess that it is
- Had a 8h layover on the way out so cleared immigration and took a cab to Taksim for some shopping and Hafiz Mustafa. Went really smoothly, as usual. Cheap, even more so than usual. Will be missed in the future considering the distance between downtown Istanbul and ISL...
- Grumpier crew than usual but still overall good service and very good meals. And, for once, I managed to only get one (out of four) bus gates

I also had the misfortune of travel in AA's B737 Max in "first class". They use the same seats as TK has installed in biz in their new narrow-bodies, albeit with no IFE and significantly less pitch, but those seats are really awful. Rock-hard, very little recline and nothing much in terms of comfort. The old TK short haul recliners in C will be missed...

Thanks for all the info. I agree with almost everything.
I also have a DXB-IST-JFK in J, coming up next month and looking forward to it. It is very big plus to have TK flying 8:30am out of DXB, compared to most leaving 2am ish.
Sorry to hear about the new business class seats on the MAX. I hope, fingers crossed, TK's subsidiary that makes seats, will have a better Business Class seats shortly. I think they are 1-2 years away from getting one certified.

bevan7 · Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:21 pm

Have Turkish released Lounge details for the new airport. I love their lounge in IST. Hopefully their new lounge is just as good

stylo777 · Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:44 pm

bevan7 wrote:
Have Turkish released Lounge details for the new airport. I love their lounge in IST. Hopefully their new lounge is just as good

the question rather is: did they even start the constructions for the new lounge?

TK787 · Mon Oct 22, 2018 4:59 pm

bevan7 wrote:
Have Turkish released Lounge details for the new airport. I love their lounge in IST. Hopefully their new lounge is just as good

"mafaky" will have a more detailed answer I am sure but AFAIK; the new International lounge will be double the size and there will be a seperate lounge just for Domestic flights.

ugurberkin · Tue Oct 23, 2018 6:00 am

TK787 wrote:
bevan7 wrote:
Have Turkish released Lounge details for the new airport. I love their lounge in IST. Hopefully their new lounge is just as good

"mafaky" will have a more detailed answer I am sure but AFAIK; the new International lounge will be double the size and there will be a seperate lounge just for Domestic flights.

If I am not wrong, it was mentioned there will be separate lounge for Elite Plus & Business Class passengers, another one for Elite Passengers.
Similar to current IST Domestic CIP Lounge.

mafaky · Tue Oct 23, 2018 7:18 am

Well, honestly I don't have the exact information. In my previous days knowledge there would be a big, again two storey business/CIP Lounge (in the middle part of the main terminal body, that would be equidistant to the four International piers (PB4-PB3-B% & PB1) and a large (larger than the one at current IST) domestic lounge in the premises of PB2 (the G-Gates area), the only Domestic wing. These two would add up to 10.000 m2, or maybe the International one 10.000 m2 alone; the Domestic one would be 3.000-3.500 m2; my memory doesn't serve me right. And they were also planning for a smaller International Arrivals CIP Lounge.

However, they may have changed these plans to include a secondary CIP Lounge for the Elite pax with reduced facilities and service; makes sense! It may even be these two may be positioned back to back in some way so that they can share the kitchen and the staff facilities.

I also have very little knowledge (almost nil) about the other International lounges. Surely OneWorld and EK will have their own. Can't tell more details unless I can dig out something more up-to-date.

ugurberkin · Tue Oct 23, 2018 9:30 am

Another rumor for name of IGA.
Mevlana... (known as Rumi)

Source (in Turkish): http://www.kokpit.aero/yeni-havalimanin ... OUjVSCaL-0

For those who doesn't have any idea about Mevlana:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rumi

Blerg · Tue Oct 23, 2018 12:14 pm

ugurberkin wrote:
Another rumor for name of IGA.
Mevlana... (known as Rumi)

Source (in Turkish): http://www.kokpit.aero/yeni-havalimanin ... OUjVSCaL-0

For those who doesn't have any idea about Mevlana:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rumi

Why would they name the country's main airport after a Persian poet?

aldrigsomandre · Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:25 pm

Blerg wrote:
ugurberkin wrote:
Another rumor for name of IGA.
Mevlana... (known as Rumi)

Source (in Turkish): http://www.kokpit.aero/yeni-havalimanin ... OUjVSCaL-0

For those who doesn't have any idea about Mevlana:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rumi

Why would they name the country's main airport after a Persian poet?

I'm still for the name being Istanbul Intercontinental.

Zaf · Tue Oct 23, 2018 5:03 pm

How about "Rumeli" ? If we go Osmanic way.

LAXintl · Wed Oct 24, 2018 4:24 pm

TK CEO says in the first week of sales, TK sold 17,600 tickets for the 5-destinations it will fly from the new airport starting Oct 29th.

Also for the period of Oct 29-Dec 31st, the bus service from the city to the airport will be 50% off, and parking at the airport will be free.

mafaky · Wed Oct 24, 2018 6:54 pm

LAXintl wrote:
TK CEO says in the first week of sales, TK sold 17,600 tickets for the 5-destinations it will fly from the new airport starting Oct 29th.

Also for the period of Oct 29-Dec 31st, the bus service from the city to the airport will be 50% off, and parking at the airport will be free.

The bus routes will be limited to only 5 during these initial 2 months' period. 20 busses will be utilised with 10 trips per day, both ways.

Also, Terminal's parking facility will be free of charge, for the same period.

(as already mentioned) But I doubt that not all of the parking lot will be operational.

Initially only 2 piers (out of five) will be operational: PB2 (the G Gates area) which will be exclusively serving for domestic flights and PB1 (the F Gates area) for the international flights.

ankaraflyjet · Wed Oct 24, 2018 8:41 pm

Rumors around that TK threatened LH for no slots at new Istanbul Airport unless they pull out of ESB, logical actually why would LH axe ESB with an average 90% load factor, a destination they serve daily since 1970...Well done TK, bingo, if that was the intention, there is no European premium airline left at ESB finally, this is a first in ESB's history since it was opened in 1955...IST also is the busiest airport in Europe with the least number of foreign airlines...This resembles St Louis and TWA to me, TWA went bust and the city wiped out from the map, I hope we will not see that happening along the line...

Zaf · Wed Oct 24, 2018 9:38 pm

ankaraflyjet wrote:
Rumors around that TK threatened LH for no slots at new Istanbul Airport unless they pull out of ESB

I don't believe those rumors. Weak Lira, low yields and profit more likely.

mercure1 · Wed Oct 24, 2018 9:44 pm

ankaraflyjet wrote:
Rumors around that TK threatened LH for no slots at new Istanbul Airport unless they pull out of ESB, logical actually why would LH axe ESB with an average 90% load factor, a destination they serve daily since 1970...

Sounds like non-sense especially since the fact that TK does not manage slots, and it would create significant bilateral issues if such was even the case.

Anyhow, LH is not exiting ESB entirely. They are simply replacing service from mainline LH with Sun Express which as you know is half owned by LH Group.

TK787 · Wed Oct 24, 2018 10:26 pm

Now, that is a sharp looking airplane; TC-LJO latest TK 77F

stylo777 · Wed Oct 24, 2018 10:38 pm

ankaraflyjet wrote:
Rumors around that TK threatened LH for no slots at new Istanbul Airport unless they pull out of ESB, logical actually why would LH axe ESB with an average 90% load factor, a destination they serve daily since 1970...Well done TK, bingo, if that was the intention, there is no European premium airline left at ESB finally, this is a first in ESB's history since it was opened in 1955...IST also is the busiest airport in Europe with the least number of foreign airlines...This resembles St Louis and TWA to me, TWA went bust and the city wiped out from the map, I hope we will not see that happening along the line...

Totally non-sense and I'm surprised that you as our forums' ankara representative even believe this.
It's all about revenue, costs, utilization and overall contribution.

LAXintl · Wed Oct 24, 2018 10:46 pm

All held slots at IST will automatically transfer to the new airport. This was published in the Turkey AIP by DHMI almost a year ago.
In additional airlines have the opportunity to apply for about 10% more slots being made available at new airport from the start. So in other words, LH could actually increase its Istanbul services by applying for the newly made available slots as well.

Regarding ESB, any changes LH made (including using XQ instead) was obviously made based on its own financial and strategic reasons.

LAXintl · Thu Oct 25, 2018 12:12 am

Couple pieces of news:

o TK has agreed to a 15-year contract extension with Do&Co. Guess Do&Co agreed to invest the require few hundred million Euros to build and establish operations at the new airport.

o TK and Azul signed an agreement between their loyalty programs. Members can not earn and redeem points on each airline. This builds on the codeshare signed back in December.

aldrigsomandre · Thu Oct 25, 2018 2:31 am

LAXintl wrote:
Couple pieces of news:

o TK and Azul signed an agreement between their loyalty programs. Members can not earn and redeem points on each airline. This builds on the codeshare signed back in December.

This is rather important, due to the unrelenting popularity of Turkish TV series in South America, everyone is either going to or planning to go to Turkey in 2019. Whenever I turn on the TV here in Uruguay, I see a Turkish series. I expect a huge capacity increase and new destinations for TK and LATAM in South America to Istanbul.

Edit: I should add that LATAM is planning to add services to Istanbul from multiple cities within the next couple of years. Right now, they're funneling passengers through Madrid and London.

aldrigsomandre · Thu Oct 25, 2018 2:37 am

aldrigsomandre wrote:
LAXintl wrote:
o TK and Azul signed an agreement between their loyalty programs. Members can not earn and redeem points on each airline. This builds on the codeshare signed back in December.

This is rather important, due to the unrelenting popularity of Turkish TV series in South America, everyone is either going to or planning to go to Turkey in 2019. Whenever I turn on the TV here in Uruguay, I see a Turkish series. I expect a huge capacity increase and new destinations for TK and LATAM in South America to Istanbul.

Edit: I should add that LATAM is planning to add services to Istanbul from multiple cities within the next couple of years. Right now, they're funneling passengers through Madrid and London.

aldrigsomandre · Thu Oct 25, 2018 2:37 am

LAXintl wrote:
o TK and Azul signed an agreement between their loyalty programs. Members can not earn and redeem points on each airline. This builds on the codeshare signed back in December.

[/quote][/quote]

This is rather important, due to the unrelenting popularity of Turkish TV series in South America, everyone is either going to or planning to go to Turkey in 2019. Whenever I turn on the TV here in Uruguay, I see a Turkish series. I expect a huge capacity increase and new destinations for TK and LATAM in South America to Istanbul.

Edit: I should add that LATAM is planning to add services to Istanbul from multiple cities within the next couple of years. Right now, they're funneling passengers through Madrid and London.

ankaraflyjet · Thu Oct 25, 2018 9:14 am

I am not a representative of Ankara, I live in Canada and UK, just trying to make sure that this thread continues to be a Turkish Aviation forum than Istanbul Aviation Forum...Appreciate the comments though

stylo777 wrote:
ankaraflyjet wrote:
Rumors around that TK threatened LH for no slots at new Istanbul Airport unless they pull out of ESB, logical actually why would LH axe ESB with an average 90% load factor, a destination they serve daily since 1970...Well done TK, bingo, if that was the intention, there is no European premium airline left at ESB finally, this is a first in ESB's history since it was opened in 1955...IST also is the busiest airport in Europe with the least number of foreign airlines...This resembles St Louis and TWA to me, TWA went bust and the city wiped out from the map, I hope we will not see that happening along the line...

Totally non-sense and I'm surprised that you as our forums' ankara representative even believe this.
It's all about revenue, costs, utilization and overall contribution.

sand26391 · Thu Oct 25, 2018 10:03 am

Not sure if posted here before, Turkish Cargo will start a weekly flight on IST-CMB-BLR-IST sector from OCT31 using Airbus A33F aircraft.

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