Rumour: Southwest to acquire Hawaiian?

asteriskceo · Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:14 pm

Rumors swirling again that Southwest is looking to merge or acquire Hawaiian Airlines as the company has announced internally that they are ceasing all hiring effective immediately.

Rumors on Delta Airline pilot forums that Delta will be securing approx 25 717’s from another carrier.

Thoughts?

FA9295 · Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:17 pm

Do you have a source for this claim? I would be absolutely shocked if this were to ever happen.

WPvsMW · Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:27 pm

And start a new alliance, the Non-Aligned Bloc. All the HNA Group airlines join. [/humour]

sunking737 · Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:30 pm

Oh here I thought WN was going to buy SY. That was last weeks rumor.

flyingclrs727 · Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:33 pm

Has anyone proved that it's possible to operate 737 NG or MAX between the islands with short turnaround times?

mwmav8r01 · Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:49 pm

flyingclrs727 wrote:
Has anyone proved that it's possible to operate 737 NG or MAX between the islands with short turnaround times?

Aloha? They flew 737-700s.

RWA380 · Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:52 pm

mwmav8r01 wrote:
flyingclrs727 wrote:
Has anyone proved that it's possible to operate 737 NG or MAX between the islands with short turnaround times?

Aloha? They flew 737-700s.

To the mainland, not inter island regularly. AQ flew the 737-300 & 737-400 for a short period of time & bought more 737-200's after that & returned the 300 & 400.

NYPECO · Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:53 pm

Southwest will get the most southwestern US state.

NYPECO · Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:56 pm

Also I wonder what would happen to all those Airbuses, especially the brand new A321NEOs.

ACCS300 · Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:57 pm

mwmav8r01 wrote:
flyingclrs727 wrote:
Has anyone proved that it's possible to operate 737 NG or MAX between the islands with short turnaround times?

Aloha? They flew 737-700s.

Almost all inter-island Aloha flights were operated by their ancient 737-200's, the 700's were primarily for mainland - Hawaii ops.

ual763 · Sat Jun 30, 2018 10:09 pm

asteriskceo wrote:
Rumors swirling again that Southwest is looking to merge or acquire Hawaiian Airlines as the company has announced internally that they are ceasing all hiring effective immediately.

Rumors on Delta Airline pilot forums that Delta will be securing approx 25 717’s from another carrier.

Thoughts?

So if Delta would be taking all of the 717s, wth would Southwest operate? The A330/787/767? A snowball’s chance in hell. But seriously, what would the benefit be in this for Southwest other than knocking out some competition? Especially, if they wouldn’t get the aircraft out of the deal?

mfe777 · Sat Jun 30, 2018 10:17 pm

If this did happen, it would be very cool to see a Hawaiian A330 or 787 at Dallas Love Field!

Samrnpage · Sat Jun 30, 2018 10:21 pm

Unless WN plans on keeping HA a separate entity, what benefits would they get from this takeover ?

777PHX · Sat Jun 30, 2018 10:36 pm

I'm not buying it. Hawaiian doesn't have any value to WN and their business model is so completely different than WN's, I don't see it happening. I'd take that 717 rumor with a grain of salt too, front line employees, including pilots, are the last to know anything about anything. And at any rate, if WN was acquiring HA, getting rid of the 717s makes no sense.

wnflyguy · Sat Jun 30, 2018 10:39 pm

WN is NOT going to Buy Hawaiian airlines!

Flyguy

PDX88 · Sat Jun 30, 2018 10:43 pm

777PHX wrote:
And at any rate, if WN was acquiring HA, getting rid of the 717s makes no sense.

Yet that's exactly what happened when they acquired AirTran. Although there are many other reasons why a WN/HA pairing will never ever happen.

ADrum23 · Sat Jun 30, 2018 10:50 pm

Why is this even a thread? HA doesn’t even have 25 717’s and freezing hiring can have many different meanings. Maybe revenue is down because of the April accident?

neomax · Sat Jun 30, 2018 10:56 pm

If HA knew they would be acquired, why are they diving headfirst so aggressively into secondary markets with the A321?

dampfnudel · Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:07 pm

ADrum23 wrote:
Why is this even a thread? HA doesn’t even have 25 717’s and freezing hiring can have many different meanings. Maybe revenue is down because of the April accident?

I would guess that they wouldn’t mention the exact number of 717 frames out of fear of making it too obvious before the announcement. An announcement I highly doubt will occur, but you never know in this changing world.

smokeybandit · Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:19 pm

Why would they cease hiring? It's not like buying a new car and you drive it off the lot that day.

Bobloblaw · Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:23 pm

The OP is drawing a wild conclusion from two separate stories. The first WN is freezing hiring because of planned capapcity cuts not a buyout of HA. Rising oil and falling RASM will do that. The second is a baseles rumor that Delta is getting 25 more 717s. So the OP put both unrelated stories together and wildly came up with WN buying HA.

asteriskceo · Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:28 pm

Bobloblaw wrote:
The OP is drawing a wild conclusion from two separate stories. The first WN is freezing hiring because of planned capapcity cuts not a buyout of HA. Rising oil and falling RASM will do that. The second is a baseles rumor that Delta is getting 25 more 717s. So the OP put both unrelated stories together and wildly came up with WN buying HA.

To correct you: I am not drawing the conclusion. Just repeating what others have been saying.

strfyr51 · Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:36 pm

I would sure need a concrete statement to buy that, HA has B787's on order and A321's coming. I think that would be TOO much diversity for WN.
Hell !! Look how Long it took them to confirm they were going to the Hawaiian Islands. The WN supporters nearly had a heart attack when they did announce it. I do not think WN could even manage a diverse fleet like that. I could be wrong? But I doubt it.

dampfnudel · Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:37 pm

Can you imagine the 787-9 in WN colors? If this were to happen and that’s a big ‘if’, I can see WN eventually getting rid of the Airbus fleet and ordering more 787-9s. It’s also possible they would retain the Hawaiian branding for marketing purposes so we probably wouldn’t see the 787-9 in WN colors.

flyingclrs727 · Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:40 pm

PDX88 wrote:
777PHX wrote:
And at any rate, if WN was acquiring HA, getting rid of the 717s makes no sense.

Yet that's exactly what happened when they acquired AirTran. Although there are many other reasons why a WN/HA pairing will never ever happen.

Air Tran never operated 717's on such short flights with quick turnarounds either. There's a reason HA bought 717's and no other planes to operate inter island hops.

EvanWSFO · Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:43 pm

If the OP can't name a source, the only place the rumor exists is in their head. So many useless conversations started just for the purpose of starting debates.

QXAS · Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:47 pm

asteriskceo wrote:
To correct you: I am not drawing the conclusion. Just repeating what others have been saying.

Define others. What are your sources? Call me skeptical but until I see an article or some other person substantiating this claim, it seems completely unlikely. In addition, DL has a bunch of CS100s about to come in. If they needed more capacity, they could easily buy more.

Acey559 · Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:57 pm

Interesting because I just received an email on Tuesday stating the WN app window is open again until early July.

WNCrew · Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:58 pm

ADMINS: Can we please change the title to "Rumor: WN to acquire HA" or something similar?

asteriskceo · Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:02 am

EvanWSFO wrote:
If the OP can't name a source, the only place the rumor exists is in their head. So many useless conversations started just for the purpose of starting debates.

I actually don’t think it is very likely. And I’m just repeating what everyone is talking about at Southwest today. If you don’t like a post on here, you are more than welcome to scroll on by without being rude.

asteriskceo · Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:07 am

Acey559 wrote:
Interesting because I just received an email on Tuesday stating the WN app window is open again until early July.

Bricktop · Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:14 am

I hope not. We would be losing one of the GREAT liveries of the world.

WPvsMW · Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:19 am

flyingclrs727 wrote:
Has anyone proved that it's possible to operate 737 NG or MAX between the islands with short turnaround times?

No. Talked to a HA 712 Capt. yesterday. The BR7x5 engine is unique among current PPs WRT repeated hot turns.
A more plausible theory (not even a rumor) is that HA will buy all of DL's 712s after DL replaces them with CSeries. DL does not need the hot turn capability.

777PHX · Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:42 am

PDX88 wrote:
777PHX wrote:
And at any rate, if WN was acquiring HA, getting rid of the 717s makes no sense.

Yet that's exactly what happened when they acquired AirTran. Although there are many other reasons why a WN/HA pairing will never ever happen.

The difference is, HA uses them for a very specific capability that AT didn't.

PDX88 · Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:49 am

777PHX wrote:
PDX88 wrote:
777PHX wrote:
And at any rate, if WN was acquiring HA, getting rid of the 717s makes no sense.

Yet that's exactly what happened when they acquired AirTran. Although there are many other reasons why a WN/HA pairing will never ever happen.

The difference is, HA uses them for a very specific capability that AT didn't.

The 737 is incapable of doing what the 717 does in Hawaii?

Serious question, I'm not sure what makes the 717 so special for those routes.

asteriskceo · Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:50 am

PDX88 wrote:
777PHX wrote:
PDX88 wrote:

Yet that's exactly what happened when they acquired AirTran. Although there are many other reasons why a WN/HA pairing will never ever happen.

The difference is, HA uses them for a very specific capability that AT didn't.

The 737 is incapable of doing what the 717 does in Hawaii?

Serious question, I'm not sure what makes the 717 so special for those routes.

The engines

ltbewr · Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:54 am

Perhaps they might work together in an alliance and code share to feed each other's pax.

PlanesNTrains · Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:57 am

ltbewr wrote:
Perhaps they might work together in an alliance and code share to feed each other's pax.

Well that’d be an easy way to poke AS in the eye.

0newair0 · Sun Jul 01, 2018 2:06 am

WPvsMW wrote:
flyingclrs727 wrote:
Has anyone proved that it's possible to operate 737 NG or MAX between the islands with short turnaround times?

No. Talked to a HA 712 Capt. yesterday. The BR7x5 engine is unique among current PPs WRT repeated hot turns.
A more plausible theory (not even a rumor) is that HA will buy all of DL's 712s after DL replaces them with CSeries. DL does not need the hot turn capability.

Delta is currently planning on keeping the 717s around for 7-10 years. By then there will be no useful life left in them. They will not end up at Hawaiian.

airtrantpa · Sun Jul 01, 2018 2:48 am

flyingclrs727 wrote:
PDX88 wrote:
777PHX wrote:
And at any rate, if WN was acquiring HA, getting rid of the 717s makes no sense.

Yet that's exactly what happened when they acquired AirTran. Although there are many other reasons why a WN/HA pairing will never ever happen.

Air Tran never operated 717's on such short flights with quick turnarounds either. There's a reason HA bought 717's and no other planes to operate inter island hops.

We flew tpa-eyw on the 717, with out avg 25 minute turn

LovePrunesAnet · Sun Jul 01, 2018 2:48 am

asteriskceo wrote:
Rumors swirling again that Southwest is looking to merge or acquire Hawaiian Airlines as the company has announced internally that they are ceasing all hiring effective immediately.

Rumors on Delta Airline pilot forums that Delta will be securing approx 25 717’s from another carrier.

Thoughts?

No.....just, (sigh), no :shakehead:

wnflyguy · Sun Jul 01, 2018 2:58 am

So I Don't think WN is buying anybody.
But Strong Rumors have them cutting Growth to 2% until 2020. Now start retirements of older 7377 in 4th quarter 2018. Only growth will be Hawaii,LGB slots and PAE in 2019. Sources say softer than normal bookings after accident and fuel prices have tripled.

Flyguy

ikolkyo · Sun Jul 01, 2018 3:03 am

Sounds like a lot of hot air, time to move onto the next “story”.

IPFreely · Sun Jul 01, 2018 3:14 am

asteriskceo wrote:
To correct you: I am not drawing the conclusion. Just repeating what others have been saying.

Who are these "others"?

Regardless of whether you fabricated this whole thing or not -- which it appears you did -- it's a somewhat refreshing break from the weekly "fill in the blank airline is acquiring JetBlue" threads. So thank you for that.

n7371f · Sun Jul 01, 2018 3:16 am

Delta is buying Turkmenistan's Boeing 717 fleet FOR PARTS.

Continental767 · Sun Jul 01, 2018 3:51 am

This makes no sense. The closest they will ever get is maybe a tight partnership. That’s it. They’re just two completely different airlines.

flyingclrs727 · Sun Jul 01, 2018 3:52 am

wnflyguy wrote:
So I Don't think WN is buying anybody.
But Strong Rumors have them cutting Growth to 2% until 2020. Now start retirements of older 7377 in 4th quarter 2018. Only growth will be Hawaii,LGB slots and PAE in 2019. Sources say softer than normal bookings after accident and fuel prices have tripled.

Flyguy

Well their prices for tickets a week before flights take off don't reflect softening demand. They're rather high.

777PHX · Sun Jul 01, 2018 3:55 am

PDX88 wrote:
777PHX wrote:
PDX88 wrote:

Yet that's exactly what happened when they acquired AirTran. Although there are many other reasons why a WN/HA pairing will never ever happen.

The difference is, HA uses them for a very specific capability that AT didn't.

The 737 is incapable of doing what the 717 does in Hawaii?

Serious question, I'm not sure what makes the 717 so special for those routes.

The story goes that the 717 and its engines are the only engines capable of dissipating enough heat during the infamously short turnarounds HA is known for. No other jet aircraft can do it because the short turnarounds drastically decrease engine life.

vulindlela744 · Sun Jul 01, 2018 4:45 am

I work for WN and their is no “freeze” on hiring. Secondly, just received an email 2-3 days ago that we will be hiring more flight attendants. Stop this nonsense please. Facts please, not rumors.

DocLightning · Sun Jul 01, 2018 4:53 am

Doesn't pass the sniff test. WN wants to acquire AS? Believable. WN wants to acquire and airline that:
*Has no Boeing 737s
*Flies widebodies on transpacific routes
*Operates interisland short hops that would ruin a 737NG or MAX
*Has 787s on order
*Has a strong identity with a specific state and a corporate culture and business model completely different from WN's.

Uh...probably not.

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