Cargojet Airways fleet update

SpaceshipDC10 · Mon Jun 25, 2018 10:52 am

This 757(F) should arrive shortly. Thus, I guess, another 727 bit the dust.

Boeing 757 -223(F) 25730 548 C-GTCJ CargoJet Airways regd 21jun18 prior delivery VQQ ex N688AA (Source: Skyliner)

https://www.planespotters.net/airframe/ ... s/L9l8cbEj

drgmobile · Mon Jun 25, 2018 10:56 am

Whatever plane they buy, could somebody over there please hire somebody with some talent to come up with a new logo and livery. Their planes look like they were painted by a 12 year old.

wjcandee · Mon Jun 25, 2018 10:58 am

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
This 757(F) should arrive shortly. Thus, I guess, another 727 bit the dust.

Boeing 757 -223(F) 25730 548 C-GTCJ CargoJet Airways regd 21jun18 prior delivery VQQ ex N688AA (Source: Skyliner)

https://www.planespotters.net/airframe/ ... s/L9l8cbEj

So this then is a Precision Conversion, given the conversion location?

Bricktop · Mon Jun 25, 2018 11:04 am

drgmobile wrote:
Whatever plane they buy, could somebody over there please hire somebody with some talent to come up with a new logo and livery. Their planes look like they were painted by a 12 year old.

Or not. I love the old-school look. As if a 727 doesn't stand out enough these days, their livery completes the deal. A 757 would look awesome.

longhauler · Mon Jun 25, 2018 1:14 pm

Sad to the see 727s eventually go. I live about 8 kms north of YHM and every now and then I see (hear) one leaving!

drgmobile wrote:
Whatever plane they buy, could somebody over there please hire somebody with some talent to come up with a new logo and livery. Their planes look like they were painted by a 12 year old.

I really don't think cargo cares what the aircraft looks like.

rlwynn · Mon Jun 25, 2018 1:46 pm

drgmobile wrote:
Whatever plane they buy, could somebody over there please hire somebody with some talent to come up with a new logo and livery. Their planes look like they were painted by a 12 year old.

What are you talking about. That is one of the best liveries in the air.

tjwgrr · Mon Jun 25, 2018 2:04 pm

rlwynn wrote:
drgmobile wrote:
Whatever plane they buy, could somebody over there please hire somebody with some talent to come up with a new logo and livery. Their planes look like they were painted by a 12 year old.

What are you talking about. That is one of the best liveries in the air.

Agreed :checkmark:

"like"

Steelhead · Mon Jun 25, 2018 2:09 pm

We are happy about every aircraft not painted all white with some titles - CargoJet is perfect.
They have just sold one of their remaining 727's (C-FCJV) to USA Jet Airlines and I expect them to end B-727-operations
altogether very soon. Sad to see them go, but it's time to move forward with the 757/767-combo.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/steelhead2 ... ateposted/

Steelhead · Mon Jun 25, 2018 2:41 pm

We are happy about every aircraft not painted all white with some titles - CargoJet is perfect.
They have just sold one of their remaining 727's (C-FCJV) to USA Jet Airlines and I expect them to end B-727-operations
altogether very soon. Sad to see them go, but it's time to move forward with the 757/767-combo.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/steelhead2 ... ateposted/

boeing767300 · Mon Jun 25, 2018 4:29 pm

CargoJet colour scheme and general appearance of their aircraft suggests pride of ownership in my opinion. While I am always sad to see another B-727 move on the company has to remain competitive to survive. At the end of the day nostalgia does not pay the bills or make a company profitable.

Dominion301 · Mon Jun 25, 2018 5:34 pm

Steelhead wrote:
We are happy about every aircraft not painted all white with some titles - CargoJet is perfect.
They have just sold one of their remaining 727's (C-FCJV) to USA Jet Airlines and I expect them to end B-727-operations
altogether very soon. Sad to see them go, but it's time to move forward with the 757/767-combo.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/steelhead2 ... ateposted/

Was that one of the active 727s parked or did CargoJet sell one of their parked 727, thereby still leaving 3 active?

I also love CargoJet's livery.

SpaceshipDC10 · Mon Jun 25, 2018 7:38 pm

Bricktop wrote:
As if a 727 doesn't stand out enough these days, their livery completes the deal. A 757 would look awesome.

This is their 7th 757.

Bricktop · Mon Jun 25, 2018 8:22 pm

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
Bricktop wrote:
As if a 727 doesn't stand out enough these days, their livery completes the deal. A 757 would look awesome.

This is their 7th 757.

Thanks! I did not know that, mainly because I haven't seen one. :blush:

Googling images, I am proven right - it is very sweet looking.

drgmobile · Tue Jun 26, 2018 7:17 pm

longhauler wrote:
Sad to the see 727s eventually go. I live about 8 kms north of YHM and every now and then I see (hear) one leaving!

drgmobile wrote:
Whatever plane they buy, could somebody over there please hire somebody with some talent to come up with a new logo and livery. Their planes look like they were painted by a 12 year old.

I really don't think cargo cares what the aircraft looks like.

It's about the image the company presents to the outside world, including its customers, investors, government, etc.. Most companies care about this, regardless of whether they are shipping inanimate objects or human beings.

MO11 · Thu Jun 28, 2018 2:44 pm

N380AN, 767-300, acquired yesterday.

SpaceshipDC10 · Thu Jun 28, 2018 8:31 pm

MO11 wrote:
N380AN, 767-300, acquired yesterday.

Will it be for growth or replacement ?

https://www.planespotters.net/airframe/ ... s/O1ZAUo5L

DiamondFlyer · Thu Jun 28, 2018 8:41 pm

Steelhead wrote:
We are happy about every aircraft not painted all white with some titles - CargoJet is perfect.
They have just sold one of their remaining 727's (C-FCJV) to USA Jet Airlines and I expect them to end B-727-operations
altogether very soon. Sad to see them go, but it's time to move forward with the 757/767-combo.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/steelhead2 ... ateposted/

Speaking of good looking 727's, the first USAJet 727 is a nice looking airplane (N727US)

wjcandee · Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:22 am

MO11 wrote:
N380AN, 767-300, acquired yesterday.

So interesting! So I guess that means that CAM passed on that frame, which I thought CAM had locked up. I was waiting to see it move to ILN.

It would be unusual for Cargojet to manage their conversions themselves; usually they have taken the planes after Guggenheim or AerCap or CAM have converted them, usually on lease. Their last two 767-300s were from CAM, including at least one ex-AA frame.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

robsaw · Fri Jun 29, 2018 5:14 am

drgmobile wrote:

It's about the image the company presents to the outside world, including its customers, investors, government, etc.. Most companies care about this, regardless of whether they are shipping inanimate objects or human beings.

And if I'm looking for a reliable, economical, and efficient cargo carrier I'm not looking for effort wasted on fancy livery but a utilitarian message. So, if I'm Cargojet's customer, they cared correctly. Putting money where it gets the most return is what investors care about and more than a functional livery isn't it; government couldn't care less unless Cargojet is looking for a bailout or other favour and a minister is looking for a photo-op. Livery is vastly over-rated on airliners.net in general.

longhauler · Fri Jun 29, 2018 10:18 pm

drgmobile wrote:
It's about the image the company presents to the outside world, including its customers, investors, government, etc.. Most companies care about this, regardless of whether they are shipping inanimate objects or human beings.

That is why the "image" that the "outside world, customers, investors, government, etc." sees, is carefully controlled. Billboards, advertising, letterhead, everything would reflect that image desired.

But ... what the customer, investor, government, etc, does not see, does not matter. So, does it really matter what is on the side of the aircraft, on the cargo loader, the AOM manual covers, the palletts, the tug, etc?

There is a reason why some very reputable airlines have a separate and far more basic/utilitarian paint scheme for their cargo division. Because, I say again ...

longhauler wrote:
I really don't think cargo cares what the aircraft looks like.

And cargo is the only one that "sees" it.

Canuck600 · Fri Jun 29, 2018 10:49 pm

Cargo customers are concerned with how much can be carried and how cheaply it can be moved safely without damage. They are not going to choose Billy Bob Cargo Carrier if it has a flashier livery. They are definitely not going to choose them if their aircraft is smaller & it takes more trips to move the amount of cargo that needs to be moved. It's why there is still a niche for carriers like Buffalo Airways, old aircraft with lower costs means they can bid low on contracts & still make money. Plus in a lot of cases they are the only company that can do certain jobs.

SpaceshipDC10 · Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:19 am

MO11 wrote:
N380AN, 767-300, acquired yesterday.

Here's a follow up:

Boeing 767 -323 25449 489 C- CargoJet Airways ferried 02-03jul18 ROW-SNN-TLV, N-reg for freighter conversion ex N380AN (source: Skyliner)

stratocruiser · Wed Jul 04, 2018 10:04 am

tjwgrr wrote:
rlwynn wrote:
drgmobile wrote:
Whatever plane they buy, could somebody over there please hire somebody with some talent to come up with a new logo and livery. Their planes look like they were painted by a 12 year old.

What are you talking about. That is one of the best liveries in the air.

Agreed "like"

They say “beauty is in the eye of the beholder” but I absolutely agree - great livery!!

Flaps · Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:21 pm

drgmobile wrote:
Whatever plane they buy, could somebody over there please hire somebody with some talent to come up with a new logo and livery. Their planes look like they were painted by a 12 year old.

If I were running a cargo carrier the planes wouldn't have a scheme at all. The boxes don't care and neither do their shippers.

Bingo1 · Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:21 pm

rlwynn wrote:
drgmobile wrote:
Whatever plane they buy, could somebody over there please hire somebody with some talent to come up with a new logo and livery. Their planes look like they were painted by a 12 year old.

What are you talking about. That is one of the best liveries in the air.

Is that the old Winnport Logistics color scheme?

wjcandee · Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:45 pm

DiamondFlyer wrote:
Speaking of good looking 727's, the first USAJet 727 is a nice looking airplane

I love that this is their "new" aircraft. Ex-Cappy, SN 22470. Looks amazing. Given that their DC9-15s are literally 50 years old, this baby really is sorta "new".

SpaceshipDC10 · Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:11 pm

MO11 wrote:
N380AN, 767-300, acquired yesterday.

And N369AN sometimes since apparently.

https://flic.kr/p/Qpb78C

https://flic.kr/p/NZ8a4z

SpaceshipDC10 · Sun Nov 25, 2018 11:05 am

This is former N377AN

Boeing 767 ‑323(F) 25446 453 C-GAJG CargoJet Airways regd 23nov18, delivery 24nov18 CVG-YHM ex N366CM

So far this year, CJT have added a pair of 752(F)s and a pair of 763(F)s. Another of the latter is to be delivered later.

https://www.planespotters.net/airline/C ... ys?sort=dd

SpaceshipDC10 · Wed Jan 02, 2019 11:28 am

Boeing 767 ‑323(F) 25449 489 C- CargoJet Airways delivery 30-31dec18 TLV-SNN-CHS-BQK, N-reg after freighter conversion ex N380AN

BQK is here: https://www.google.fr/maps/place/Brunsw ... 81.4914894

BDABOY · Wed Jan 02, 2019 11:58 am

For a few weeks this fall the daily service to BDA was operated by a mix of the 727/757. So wish I had managed to get a photo of the last 727 flight here. Having that roar overhead on it’s evening departure was a perfect end to the day!!

Vio · Wed Jan 02, 2019 12:43 pm

longhauler wrote:
Sad to the see 727s eventually go. I live about 8 kms north of YHM and every now and then I see (hear) one leaving!

drgmobile wrote:
Whatever plane they buy, could somebody over there please hire somebody with some talent to come up with a new logo and livery. Their planes look like they were painted by a 12 year old.

I really don't think cargo cares what the aircraft looks like.

They are a nice looking aircraft, but it needs to go. I don't know what's up with Canadian aviation and its "willingness" to fly old aircraft. Even the 757/767 are getting up there. I'd love to see Air Canada buy new 747-800s or 777F. That would be quite the site. I know it'll never happen, but one can dream.

Skywatcher · Wed Jan 02, 2019 3:20 pm

Vio wrote:
longhauler wrote:
Sad to the see 727s eventually go. I live about 8 kms north of YHM and every now and then I see (hear) one leaving!

drgmobile wrote:
Whatever plane they buy, could somebody over there please hire somebody with some talent to come up with a new logo and livery. Their planes look like they were painted by a 12 year old.

I really don't think cargo cares what the aircraft looks like.

They are a nice looking aircraft, but it needs to go. I don't know what's up with Canadian aviation and its "willingness" to fly old aircraft. Even the 757/767 are getting up there. I'd love to see Air Canada buy new 747-800s or 777F. That would be quite the site. I know it'll never happen, but one can dream.

Every country has "old" aircraft. What a strange comment.

Dominion301 · Wed Jan 02, 2019 3:22 pm

Vio wrote:
longhauler wrote:
Sad to the see 727s eventually go. I live about 8 kms north of YHM and every now and then I see (hear) one leaving!

drgmobile wrote:
Whatever plane they buy, could somebody over there please hire somebody with some talent to come up with a new logo and livery. Their planes look like they were painted by a 12 year old.

I really don't think cargo cares what the aircraft looks like.

They are a nice looking aircraft, but it needs to go. I don't know what's up with Canadian aviation and its "willingness" to fly old aircraft. Even the 757/767 are getting up there. I'd love to see Air Canada buy new 747-800s or 777F. That would be quite the site. I know it'll never happen, but one can dream.

I think in a lot of cases it’s “necessity “ as opposed to “willingness”. Not much can replace a 732 gravel equipped combi.

It’ll be a sad day when the last 727 is retired from Canadian skies, which will probably be sometime later this year.

tjcab · Wed Jan 02, 2019 4:00 pm

stratocruiser wrote:
tjwgrr wrote:
rlwynn wrote:

What are you talking about. That is one of the best liveries in the air.

Agreed "like"

They say “beauty is in the eye of the beholder” but I absolutely agree - great livery!!

Not me. Not everything old is good. IMO hideous with no creativity that should have remained in the 80's.

longhauler · Wed Jan 02, 2019 11:45 pm

Vio wrote:
I don't know what's up with Canadian aviation and its "willingness" to fly old aircraft. Even the 757/767 are getting up there. I'd love to see Air Canada buy new 747-800s or 777F. That would be quite the sight. I know it'll never happen, but one can dream.

An airline uses what is best for its purpose. "Old" is quite common in a freight environment. With low utilisation, quite common with freight airlines, a "new" more efficient, but more expensive aircraft doesn't make any sense. Who cares if it burns 20% less fuel, it's only flying 3 hours a day ... having a $200M aircraft sitting around for 20 hours a day is very expensive.

It looks like Cargojet is ending up with a very efficient (for a freight airline) fleet of 767s and 757s.

Air Canada, like 99% of the airlines on the earth have avoided the 747-8. (There's a reason for that). With regard to the 777F, Air Canada did order it, but looked at the economics of a dedicated freight fleet vice the huge cargo capacity of a passenger 777 and 787 and made the more profitable choice. Air Canada has had dedicated freighters in the past (Bristol 170, DC-3, DC-4M, Vanguard, DC-8, DC-9, 727 and 747-200/400 Combis, did I miss any?), I am guessing they know if there is need for another dedicated freighter.

RichardWelling · Thu Jan 03, 2019 12:39 am

AC had a BSA agreement with CargoJet and terminated it not too long ago.

2175301 · Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:10 am

Vio wrote:
They are a nice looking aircraft, but it needs to go. I don't know what's up with Canadian aviation and its "willingness" to fly old aircraft. Even the 757/767 are getting up there. I'd love to see Air Canada buy new 747-800s or 777F. That would be quite the site. I know it'll never happen, but one can dream.

There is vastly more market space for a 757/767 sized cargo aircraft than there is for 777/747 sized cargo aircraft.

The reason Cargojet buys 757/767 is that its the right size for their market. If they were sure they could routinely use the 767 constantly for years they may even buy a new 767 as has some other freight carriers. But, that requires long term high usage to justify over a used 767.

Have a great day,

dr1980 · Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:52 am

Interesting, I wasn’t aware that Air Canada flew dedicated cargo DC-9’s and 727’s.

Dominion301 · Fri Jan 04, 2019 3:50 am

dr1980 wrote:
Interesting, I wasn’t aware that Air Canada flew dedicated cargo DC-9’s and 727’s.

I remember AC had a couple of 727-100 freighters in the late 70s, but was this DC-9-15RC operated in freighter config?: https://www.flickr.com/photos/157839500@N04/43133614284 it also had an N registration.

I think AC had a single DC9-15F CF-TOP and a single -32F CF-TMN.

hkcanadaexpat · Fri Jan 04, 2019 4:10 am

Anyone know what the reg will be for the new 763 delivered last week to BQK?

Retired57 · Fri Jan 04, 2019 11:40 am

So far,ex N380AN , has not gotten a new registration .Ex N369AA now C-GXAJ was delivered Nov/2018

longhauler · Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:01 pm

Dominion301 wrote:
I think AC had a single DC9-15F CF-TOP and a single -32F CF-TMN.

All of the DC-9-15s were RCs. It was an Air Canada internal designation to call it an F when the seats were removed. It got a little confusing if looking at pictures during the era they were used. FINs 761-768, one would have to look at records to see if/when they ever flew as freighters, but ... you are right, the only picture I can find with a -15RC with it's cargo door open is FIN 763 /CF-TOP.

FIN 771, CF-TMN (version two, as the original - TMN, FIN 739, went to Air Jamaica) was always a DC-9-32F and only ever flew for AC as a freighter.

Both of these subfleets were bought at the same time, in the early 1970s to replace the freight uplift when the Vanguards left the fleet.

The picture you cite, with the American registration looks like it was on its way to Air Florida. While having a long career after, Air Florida was the original destination after Air Canada, when it was decided to sell the -15RCs.

Dominion301 · Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:32 pm

longhauler wrote:
Dominion301 wrote:
I think AC had a single DC9-15F CF-TOP and a single -32F CF-TMN.

All of the DC-9-15s were RCs. It was an Air Canada internal designation to call it an F when the seats were removed. It got a little confusing if looking at pictures during the era they were used. FINs 761-768, one would have to look at records to see if/when they ever flew as freighters, but ... you are right, the only picture I can find with a -15RC with it's cargo door open is FIN 763 /CF-TOP.

FIN 771, CF-TMN (version two, as the original - TMN, FIN 739, went to Air Jamaica) was always a DC-9-32F and only ever flew for AC as a freighter.

Both of these subfleets were bought at the same time, in the early 1970s to replace the freight uplift when the Vanguards left the fleet.

The picture you cite, with the American registration looks like it was on its way to Air Florida. While having a long career after, Air Florida was the original destination after Air Canada, when it was decided to sell the -15RCs.

Thumbs up button for this...if airliners.net had one!

The DC-9 and 727 freighters were before my time (or at least before I my earliest childhood memories, lol). Even the pre-freighter DC-8s, I only have a vague recollection of seeing a pair of pax 8s at YOW one day I'm thinking spring of 1983, which would have been in their final months of service.

Finding out info about the DC-9 and 727 freighters is tough as on AC's historic fleet page, no reference is made to either of these: https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/hom ... fleet.html ...there's a few other errors on the page, like the Bae 146s being listed as operating with AC from 2001-2006 only...unless that refers to the period when all the ex-Air BC and ex-Air Nova 146s were with Jazz, which at the time was a wholly-owned AC subsidiary?

SpaceshipDC10 · Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:34 pm

longhauler wrote:
The picture you cite, with the American registration looks like it was on its way to Air Florida. While having a long career after, Air Florida was the original destination after Air Canada, when it was decided to sell the -15RCs.

It seems this one was leased to QH several times.

N65AF 15F (RC) 47152/170 65 CF-TOU 01/79 02/79 LF AC; also LF AC 03/79-03/79 & 03/80-08/80; RR N66AF

http://www.aeromoe.com/fleets/airflor.html

The three former UA 727-100C were registered C-GAGX, Y & Z.

SpaceshipDC10 · Fri Jan 04, 2019 9:49 pm

Earlier this morning, CJT has returned its last 762. Now they are operating only 763F and 752F.

Boeing 767 ‑223(F) 22319 112 C-FGAJ CargoJet Airways ferried 04jan19 YHM-PHX-GYR on return to lessor? ex N317AA

hkcanadaexpat · Fri Jan 04, 2019 10:10 pm

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
Earlier this morning, CJT has returned its last 762. Now they are operating only 763F and 752F.

I do believe this is temporary as CJT purchased 3x passenger 762s last year, two of which will be converted to cargo in 2019/20 and the other one used for parts.

Dominion301 · Fri Jan 04, 2019 10:18 pm

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
Earlier this morning, CJT has returned its last 762. Now they are operating only 763F and 752F.

Boeing 767 ‑223(F) 22319 112 C-FGAJ CargoJet Airways ferried 04jan19 YHM-PHX-GYR on return to lessor? ex N317AA

I think that's the ex-First Air bird.

wjcandee · Fri Jan 04, 2019 10:40 pm

Dominion301 wrote:
SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
Earlier this morning, CJT has returned its last 762. Now they are operating only 763F and 752F.

Boeing 767 ‑223(F) 22319 112 C-FGAJ CargoJet Airways ferried 04jan19 YHM-PHX-GYR on return to lessor? ex N317AA

I think that's the ex-First Air bird.

Ex-AA. Planespotters doesn't show it as having been operated by First Air. Converted by June 5, 2008, registered to CJT in August 2008.

wjcandee · Fri Jan 04, 2019 10:42 pm

hkcanadaexpat wrote:
SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
Earlier this morning, CJT has returned its last 762. Now they are operating only 763F and 752F.

I do believe this is temporary as CJT purchased 3x passenger 762s last year, two of which will be converted to cargo in 2019/20 and the other one used for parts.

Fascinating anyone would convert a 767-200 these days. I'm sure they have their reasons, but still very interesting.

Spacepope · Fri Jan 04, 2019 11:01 pm

hkcanadaexpat wrote:
SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
Earlier this morning, CJT has returned its last 762. Now they are operating only 763F and 752F.

I do believe this is temporary as CJT purchased 3x passenger 762s last year, two of which will be converted to cargo in 2019/20 and the other one used for parts.

Do you have any record of the serials that are going to be converted? That sounds really strange to me.

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