Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR
Jayafe wrote:One more example for Platinum customer support from US3. If this is confirmed, the person who took that decision should not be allowed to fly anything larger than a CessnaFatCat wrote:- unscheduled landing fee, "heavy" plane
- fuel discharge to prevent overweight landing
- compensations for delay to all other passengers, maybe even a paid overnight stay (is this still a thing?)
- out of time slot landing in the destination airport
- repositioning another plane and crew to fly the back route, if needed
will cost a lot much than $ 100.000 to UA...
Am I right?
I hope this never happens to you or a relative, your focus would be different. Airlines cant think that ignoring a sick passenger is worthy as the fine will be cheaper than the operation. If I was judge, I would start in $1M and counting.
FatCat wrote:- unscheduled landing fee, "heavy" plane
- fuel discharge to prevent overweight landing
- compensations for delay to all other passengers, maybe even a paid overnight stay (is this still a thing?)
- out of time slot landing in the destination airport
- repositioning another plane and crew to fly the back route, if needed
will cost a lot much than $ 100.000 to UA...
Am I right?
Newbiepilot wrote:I always wonder what the other side of the story is on these. He was given a business class seat to lay down in. Obviously that means that they did something to help take care of him.
ChrisKen wrote:Such a severe med condition, the chunky monkey manged two transatlantic trips (to Italy & back) before having the self inflicted (gastric bypass) injury removed & rectified.
While the recommendation of an on board doctor holds some weight, it's not the be and end-all of a decision to divert.
ChrisKen wrote:Such a severe med condition, the chunky monkey manged two transatlantic trips (to Italy & back) before having the self inflicted (gastric bypass) injury removed & rectified.
boerje wrote:Newbiepilot wrote:I always wonder what the other side of the story is on these. He was given a business class seat to lay down in. Obviously that means that they did something to help take care of him.
The link on the first post reports the man being curled up in a fetal position due to severe pain. UAL has to have the best business seat if offering the seat and continuing the flight for 7 hours was a better solution than landing the plane in a medical emergency.
FatCat wrote:- unscheduled landing fee, "heavy" plane
- fuel discharge to prevent overweight landing
- compensations for delay to all other passengers, maybe even a paid overnight stay (is this still a thing?)
- out of time slot landing in the destination airport
- repositioning another plane and crew to fly the back route, if needed
will cost a lot much than $ 100.000 to UA...
Am I right?
dmstorm22 wrote:FatCat wrote:- unscheduled landing fee, "heavy" plane
- fuel discharge to prevent overweight landing
- compensations for delay to all other passengers, maybe even a paid overnight stay (is this still a thing?)
- out of time slot landing in the destination airport
- repositioning another plane and crew to fly the back route, if needed
will cost a lot much than $ 100.000 to UA...
Am I right?
$100k seems so low, almost quaint.
dmstorm22 wrote:FatCat wrote:$100k seems so low, almost quaint.
Beechtobus wrote:dmstorm22 wrote:FatCat wrote:$100k seems so low, almost quaint.
I was kind of thinking the same. A wide body, international diversion could easily end up costing more.
FlyHappy wrote:Gentleman traveller suffers acute bout of abdominal pain. Gentleman is/was rather overweight, as evidenced by "gastric bypass", which may or may not have been communicated.
Its noted that the attack occurred shortly after the first meal service, 2 hours into the flight.
FatCat wrote:FlyHappy wrote:Gentleman traveller suffers acute bout of abdominal pain. Gentleman is/was rather overweight, as evidenced by "gastric bypass", which may or may not have been communicated.
Its noted that the attack occurred shortly after the first meal service, 2 hours into the flight.
I've never communicated to the cabin crew that I have a gastric bypass, should I?
FatCat wrote:ChrisKen wrote:Such a severe med condition, the chunky monkey manged two transatlantic trips (to Italy & back) before having the self inflicted (gastric bypass) injury removed & rectified.
While the recommendation of an on board doctor holds some weight, it's not the be and end-all of a decision to divert.
I don't think that you can call a sick person "chunky monkey"...
Revelation wrote:Does it really matter why the pax needed emergency medical attention?
FatCat wrote:- unscheduled landing fee, "heavy" plane
- fuel discharge to prevent overweight landing
- compensations for delay to all other passengers, maybe even a paid overnight stay (is this still a thing?)
- out of time slot landing in the destination airport
- repositioning another plane and crew to fly the back route, if needed
will cost a lot much than $ 100.000 to UA...
Am I right?
RDUDDJI wrote:Revelation wrote:Does it really matter why the pax needed emergency medical attention?
Of course. You wouldn't divert an airplane to take care of a paper cut. All situations are different and best left to the professionals (not the internets) to decide course of action.
Revelation wrote:RDUDDJI wrote:Revelation wrote:Does it really matter why the pax needed emergency medical attention?
Of course. You wouldn't divert an airplane to take care of a paper cut. All situations are different and best left to the professionals (not the internets) to decide course of action.
A paper cut is not an emergency.... This pax was having strong abdominal pain, not a paper cut...
bennett123 wrote:Who decides if it IS an emergency?.
FatCat wrote:FlyHappy wrote:Gentleman traveller suffers acute bout of abdominal pain. Gentleman is/was rather overweight, as evidenced by "gastric bypass", which may or may not have been communicated.
Its noted that the attack occurred shortly after the first meal service, 2 hours into the flight.
I've never communicated to the cabin crew that I have a gastric bypass, should I?
FatCat wrote:- unscheduled landing fee, "heavy" plane
- fuel discharge to prevent overweight landing
- compensations for delay to all other passengers, maybe even a paid overnight stay (is this still a thing?)
- out of time slot landing in the destination airport
- repositioning another plane and crew to fly the back route, if needed
will cost a lot much than $ 100.000 to UA...
Am I right?
bennett123 wrote:Who decides if it IS an emergency?.
jayunited wrote:bennett123 wrote:Who decides if it IS an emergency?.
Medlink is the company UA uses and they determine based on the information given by the pilots the seriousness of the situation and will make a recommendation to divert or continue. Just because a doctor on board says divert Medlink would have asked for detailed information I'm wondering what did this passenger tell the doctor on board did he describe his situation as strong abdominal pain or did he go into details that he had had gastric bypass surgery. I read the delay and diversion reports daily and UA has at least 1-2 medical diversions a week for many different reasons. The article conveniently left out pertinent details like how long was he hospitalized in Rome, if he was in such bad shape how was he able to fly back to the U.S.? After his return to the U.S. when did he go to the hospital here to have his gastric bypass and gallbladder removed?
What also is strange is the amount he is suing UA for $100,000 dollars, I don't know what hospitals cost in Rome I've never had to visit one in Rome but I do know what they cost here in the U.S. and this guy is claiming he had surgery to remove both his bypass and gallbladder that surgery and hospital stint would have cost him a lot more than $100,000 dollars.
jayunited wrote:bennett123 wrote:Who decides if it IS an emergency?.
Medlink is the company UA uses and they determine based on the information given by the pilots the seriousness of the situation and will make a recommendation to divert or continue. Just because a doctor on board says divert Medlink would have asked for detailed information I'm wondering what did this passenger tell the doctor on board did he describe his situation as strong abdominal pain or did he go into details that he had had gastric bypass surgery. I read the delay and diversion reports daily and UA has at least 1-2 medical diversions a week for many different reasons. The article conveniently left out pertinent details like how long was he hospitalized in Rome, if he was in such bad shape how was he able to fly back to the U.S.? After his return to the U.S. when did he go to the hospital here to have his gastric bypass and gallbladder removed?
What also is strange is the amount he is suing UA for $100,000 dollars, I don't know what hospitals cost in Rome I've never had to visit one in Rome but I do know what they cost here in the U.S. and this guy is claiming he had surgery to remove both his bypass and gallbladder that surgery and hospital stint would have cost him a lot more than $100,000 dollars.
mjoelnir wrote:Air crew neglecting the advise of a medical practitioner, are amateurs neglecting the advise of a professional.
jetmatt777 wrote:An onboard doctor has the authority to act as the hands, eyes, and ears of the ground based medical staff. The ground based medical staff is fully responsible for recommendations to dispatch and the flight crew on whether to continue or divert.
FlyHappy wrote:Dr. Ramsey, a Dermatologist from Akron, answers the call. He's spent a decade aggressively treating juvenile facial acne and really knows how to operate under pressure.
FlyHappy wrote:The Captain weighs this information. "Is there any sign of a life-threatening condition?"
"Not that I can tell"
bennett123 wrote:Who decides if it IS an emergency?.
beechnut wrote:My wife diagnosed hyperventilation and ordered oxygen (contrary to what you've all seen on Marcus Welby, M.D., you do NOT make an elderly person breathe into a paper bag when hyperventilating, that can cause cardiac arrest).
[snip]
The captain then said "aren't you supposed to make her breathe into a paper bag?". While that used to be the case, that is no longer the standard of care. My wife doesn't take kindly to laymen questioning her professional judgement, so she glared at the captain, and said "you go fly the plane, I'll take care of the patient!".
beechnut wrote:bennett123 wrote:Who decides if it IS an emergency?.
The doctor. This happened to my wife once, she is a family doctor. On a YUL-YVR flight, an elderly lady collapsed and the "is there a doctor on board" call came over the PA. My wife diagnosed hyperventilation and ordered oxygen (contrary to what you've all seen on Marcus Welby, M.D., you do NOT make an elderly person breathe into a paper bag when hyperventilating, that can cause cardiac arrest). The captain came back to see what was going on, and he asked my wife if they needed to land. She explained no, that the patient was stable, the issue was hyperventilating due to anxiety and fatigue (foreign lady, couldn't speak English or French, travelling alone, heavily delayed winter late evening flight), and she said that with some oxygen she would be fine, no need to land.
The captain then said "aren't you supposed to make her breathe into a paper bag?". While that used to be the case, that is no longer the standard of care. My wife doesn't take kindly to laymen questioning her professional judgement, so she glared at the captain, and said "you go fly the plane, I'll take care of the patient!".
True story! We've still got the letter somewhere from Air Canada's Chief Medical Officer thanking her for her help, and she also got a pile of Aeroplan points for her efforts.
Beech
Revelation wrote:FatCat wrote:ChrisKen wrote:Such a severe med condition, the chunky monkey manged two transatlantic trips (to Italy & back) before having the self inflicted (gastric bypass) injury removed & rectified.
While the recommendation of an on board doctor holds some weight, it's not the be and end-all of a decision to divert.
I don't think that you can call a sick person "chunky monkey"...
One of the nice things about the Internet is we can see how quickly others resort to victim shaming and victim blaming.
Does it really matter why the pax needed emergency medical attention?
mjoelnir wrote:
Regarding the 100,000 USD, the cost for surgery and similar can be in the USA the multiple cost of what the same costs in Europe. The USA combines the highest cost of medical service in the western world, with an on average worst results.
RDUDDJI wrote:This incident was two years ago, and this is the first I've heard of it. Looks like by and large other media outlets haven't picked this up yet, and the media loves to trash airlines (esp UA).
I'd like to hear UA's version of events. I highly doubt they wouldn't have consulted their ground medical support for an incident like this.