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Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Sun May 13, 2018 11:56 pm
by RainerBoeing777
LATAM Brazil has launched new routes in recent years such as Johannesburg, Boston, Las Vegas, Tel Aviv and Rome
But what will be your next route in Europe, and for this summer 2018 JJ has 7 daily flights to the old continent the GRU-FCO route quickly increased to a daily flight, in the past Varig got to have 9 daily flights to Europe, I hope that JJ can incorporate more routes to Europe

2018 Summer Operations of LATAM Brazil

Madrid (MAD) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 777-300ER Daily
Frankfurt (FRA) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 777-300ER Daily
Paris (CDG) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Airbus A350-900 Daily
London (LHR) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 777-300ER Daily
Barcelona (BCN) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Airbus A350-900 Daily
Milan (MXP) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 767-300ER Daily
Rome (FCO) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 767-300ER Daily

I hope that a future the Airbus A350-900 returns to Milan, possibly with the entry of Air Italy to OneWorld group LATAM can increase its operations to Italy considerably

I see a potential in Munich, Brussels, Lisbon and Amsterdam, especially in Munich and Brussels as they do not have non-stop flights to Sao Paulo and both have a considerable demand for passengers

Image

what is your expectation for your next route? 8-)

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Mon May 14, 2018 12:48 am
by ahj2000
Lisbon was announced but due to slot availability, was cancelled before it even started. IF they get slots, I’d imagine they’d end up there first.
After that, I’d look at where the South American business goes.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Tue May 15, 2018 8:49 pm
by Pepper456
ahj2000 wrote:
Lisbon was announced but due to slot availability, was cancelled before it even started. IF they get slots, I’d imagine they’d end up there first.
After that, I’d look at where the South American business goes.

I think Porto needs it because there are only 2 TP flights a week and it is a very potential route, this and GIG.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Tue May 15, 2018 9:22 pm
by thgsr08
RainerBoeing777 wrote:
LATAM Brazil has launched new routes in recent years such as Johannesburg, Boston, Las Vegas, Tel Aviv and Rome
But what will be your next route in Europe, and for this summer 2018 JJ has 7 daily flights to the old continent the GRU-FCO route quickly increased to a daily flight, in the past Varig got to have 9 daily flights to Europe, I hope that JJ can incorporate more routes to Europe

2018 Summer Operations of LATAM Brazil

Madrid (MAD) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 777-300ER Daily
Frankfurt (FRA) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 777-300ER Daily
Paris (CDG) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Airbus A350-900 Daily
London (LHR) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 777-300ER Daily
Barcelona (BCN) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Airbus A350-900 Daily
Milan (MXP) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 767-300ER Daily
Rome (FCO) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 767-300ER Daily

I hope that a future the Airbus A350-900 returns to Milan, possibly with the entry of Air Italy to OneWorld group LATAM can increase its operations to Italy considerably

I see a potential in Munich, Brussels, Lisbon and Amsterdam, especially in Munich and Brussels as they do not have non-stop flights to Sao Paulo and both have a considerable demand for passengers

Image

what is your expectation for your next route? 8-)



Well, I don't see any expansion happening anytime soon, not through Europe.
The last launches to LAS, BOS, TLV, FCO deserve time to see how it works out. I can see FCO migrating to 77W or A350 soon.
I guess they'll get back to CUN and depending on how BOS goes, a new leg to YYZ, instead of JFK-YYZ.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Tue May 15, 2018 9:33 pm
by geoshina
I think BOS-YYZ would be another failed attempt.

If I am not mistaken, JJ is also expecting to have 3 more weekly flights to FRA, but they are still waiting for the the slots they want.
Other than that, I think Portugal would be the next destination for JJ.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Tue May 15, 2018 9:57 pm
by gatibosgru
LIS will definitely be next.

I wonder if PRG could work from GRU...
I know there is now a big Brazilian population living in Dublin, that would be my own personal choice if I had any say.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Tue May 15, 2018 11:05 pm
by 2travel2know2
GRU-MAN, GRU-AGP, GRU-VLC?
And if JJ LATAM gets the slots (whatever time of the day those would be), LIS.
GRU-MOW (whichever airport is more convenient) would also be a good addition to GRU non-stop flight destinations.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Wed May 16, 2018 1:58 pm
by ahj2000
2travel2know2 wrote:
GRU-MAN, GRU-AGP, GRU-VLC?
And if JJ LATAM gets the slots (whatever time of the day those would be), LIS.
GRU-MOW (whichever airport is more convenient) would also be a good addition to GRU non-stop flight destinations.

MOW has to be what, 13/14 hours from SÃO? That would be even longer that the TLV they have yet to start. I’d say wait and see how that route does before adding another ULH route, not even looking at the low demand

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Wed May 16, 2018 3:01 pm
by dcajet
gatibosgru wrote:
LIS will definitely be next.

I wonder if PRG could work from GRU...
I know there is now a big Brazilian population living in Dublin, that would be my own personal choice if I had any say.


PRG struggles to maintain year round service to the NYC area... imagine to GRU! Unless LATAM had a death wish...

DUB would be so low yielding... and given that they funnel traffic to DUB at LHR with OW partner BA...

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Wed May 16, 2018 3:10 pm
by 2travel2know2
ahj2000 wrote:
2travel2know2 wrote:
GRU-MAN, GRU-AGP, GRU-VLC?
And if JJ LATAM gets the slots (whatever time of the day those would be), LIS.
GRU-MOW (whichever airport is more convenient) would also be a good addition to GRU non-stop flight destinations.

MOW has to be what, 13/14 hours from SÃO? That would be even longer that the TLV they have yet to start. I’d say wait and see how that route does before adding another ULH route, not even looking at the low demand

GRU-MOW is actually shorter than GRU-DXB (flown by EK, but used as reference) and the most direct GRU-TLV route:
GRU TLV 058° (NE) 079° (E) 5,723 nm
GRU DXB 070° (E) 092° (E) 6,597 nm
GRU MOW 036° (NE) 057° (NE) 6,355 nm
(from www.gcmap.com)
The GRU-TLV might be longer than the one given by gcmap as the aircraft won't be allowed to overfly some Arab countries.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Wed May 16, 2018 4:25 pm
by Neo
LIS will be the next destination, when slots are granted.

All the others mentioned above are unlikely (MUC, MOW, BRU, AMS) or unrealistic (MAN, AGP, VLC, DUB).

The next move will be to increase and consolidate service to current and new destinations. (i.e. FRA,)

OPO due to LIS constraints may become an potential new destination in the future, if LIS doesn't happen.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Wed May 16, 2018 4:35 pm
by C010T3
ZRH is the only other viable alternative after LIS. If they launch MUC, LH will drive them away from the market.
AMS could come in third.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Wed May 16, 2018 6:09 pm
by winGl3t
GRU-DUB could work with IAG JV, but it's low yielding and has little demand outside Brazil, not contribuiting so much for feeding their hub.
GRU-GVA could be another possibility for the next 5 years. No non-stop competition, Decent demand from Brazil, Argentina and Chile, no dominant carrier for swiss point of sale and high yielding.

Both could sustain 3-4 weekly non stop to GRU hub with 763 flight daylight from Europe to Brazil in order to keep high fleet utilization and lower costs.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Wed May 16, 2018 6:21 pm
by DominoxX
A Belgian forum had said that JJ was in talks with Brussels Airport to launch passenger services to BRU, but talks were 'suspended' following the terror attacks.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Wed May 16, 2018 6:45 pm
by JJ777
LIS is a lock as soon as they can get the slots. They should have started flying to LIS 10 years ago. Taking so long to fly to LIS was a huge mistake they certainly regret now.

Other than LIS, there's no realistic target for LATAM in Europe. When it comes to intercontinental routes, GRU-AKL-SYD seems to be the most realistic possibility. I just flew GRU-SCL and it was full of people connecting to/from Australia.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Wed May 16, 2018 7:39 pm
by Swadian
LATAM doesn't even have LIS or SFO and some are talking about MAN, DUB, VLC, and MOW? If LATAM was run by these people, they'd go out of business immediately.

Before launching too many routes other than LIS I would expect LATAM to focus on fixing the 787 issues and the major setback at GIG.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Wed May 16, 2018 8:26 pm
by thgsr08
LIS was already announced, it woudn't be a guess to a next destination. The issue here is that Portugal government doesn't want to grant them slost, at least not for now, but the annoucement was made and anytime soon it can happen.
DUB would be a good one, I've heard there're more Brazilians than Irish around Dublin area hahaha such as BOS, and it sounds like a cheap gateway from London's high international fees on disembarking/departuring from LHR/LGW.
I saw someone sugesting MUC, does JJ - now LA - and LH still have partnership/codeshare agreement? If it does, LA has a good chance in there too, only if it's yes for the question above.
Otherwise, I can see some more profitable routes going to US and/or Caribbean, such as CUN, SFO, even PHL (that AA gave up after merging with US).
LATAM has 3 great WB that if it's in the right place, can make fortune and remembering that LATAM Chile has taken over long haul flights from GIG, SSA, FOR and BEL, using its own 767s to freeing brazilian's 767s to open up new routes.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Wed May 16, 2018 8:48 pm
by thgsr08
JJ777 wrote:
LIS is a lock as soon as they can get the slots. They should have started flying to LIS 10 years ago. Taking so long to fly to LIS was a huge mistake they certainly regret now.

Other than LIS, there's no realistic target for LATAM in Europe. When it comes to intercontinental routes, GRU-AKL-SYD seems to be the most realistic possibility. I just flew GRU-SCL and it was full of people connecting to/from Australia.


Well, I don't think there'd be enough demand for both SCL/GRU-AKL-SYD. They went daily recently ( by recently I mean ~3 years ago) and with the add of SCL-MEL this demand has lost a good slice (aprox. 15%), and adding another flight from GRU, the slice could rise to up to 40%. Also, we can't forget QF's 3x weekly flights, a good LATAM's partner that could loose a lot with this.

The idea os implementing HUBs all over the continent is great. Flights from GRU go to UE/US/Africa. SCL goes to MAD/FRA, some US cities, Australasia & Pacific, LIM goes to the Caribbean, US and some EU cities as well - MAD & BCN, making possible going to any destination they cover with no more than 1 stop.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Wed May 16, 2018 9:50 pm
by Galwayman
dcajet wrote:
gatibosgru wrote:
LIS will definitely be next.

I won

DUB would be so low yielding... and given that they funnel traffic to DUB at LHR with OW partner BA...


Latam funnels Dublin traffic via Frankfurt not LHR and they’re very uncompetitive . KLM pretty much owns DUB>Brazil for price and timings.American Airlines offers deep discounts for masochists willing to fly via the USA .

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Wed May 16, 2018 9:58 pm
by geoshina
Galwayman wrote:
dcajet wrote:
gatibosgru wrote:
LIS will definitely be next.

I won

DUB would be so low yielding... and given that they funnel traffic to DUB at LHR with OW partner BA...


Latam funnels Dublin traffic via Frankfurt not LHR and they’re very uncompetitive . KLM pretty much owns DUB>Brazil for price and timings.American Airlines offers deep discounts for masochists willing to fly via the USA .



Indeed. But maybe they could do the same as GRU-BCN. Start with 3 weekly in a 767 and see where it goes. The 767 looks like good AC to do this.


About Portugal, JJ could do 3 weekly to LIS and 2 weekly to OPO. Or the other way around.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Thu May 17, 2018 2:50 am
by gatibosgru
How many 763s does LA Brasil have?

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Thu May 17, 2018 3:13 am
by thgsr08
gatibosgru wrote:
How many 763s does LA Brasil have?


14 with Brazilian Rego and 6 chileans flying for JJ.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Thu May 17, 2018 3:15 am
by SJOtoLIR
gatibosgru wrote:
How many 763s does LA Brasil have?

767-316ER.....PT-MOG
767-316ER.....PT-MOB
767-316ER.....PT-MSV
767-316ER.....PT-MOD
767-316ER.....PT-MOC
767-316ER.....PT-MSO
767-316ER.....PT-MSS
767-316ER.....PT-MSX
767-316ER.....PT-MSZ
767-316ER.....PT-MOA
767-316ER.....PT-MOE
767-316ER.....PT-MOF
767-316ER.....PT-MSW
767-316ER.....PT-MSY

Regards.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Thu May 17, 2018 3:47 am
by SJOtoLIR
Neo wrote:
LIS will be the next destination, when slots are granted.

TP GRU-LIS is 14x weekly at this time and it demostrates by itself the huge demand of passengers between these points, which is being attended by Star Alliance grouping.
The possible participation of LA GRU-LIS would give the oportunity to OneWorld by exploting this juicy route as well, given the commercial and cultural ties between Portugal and Brazil.
Furthermore, GRU is not necesarily the only Brazilian airport that should link LIS on LATAM, as pointing out above.

Regards.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Thu May 17, 2018 7:14 am
by hynithuchi
Given the historical ties Brazil and Portugal have, I'm really surprised they don't fly to LIS yet, but I'm sure it's next very shortlisted as their next European destination. There has been unfounded rumours about GVA about 3 years ago and I think it could stand a reasonable chance as their is a good demand to Brasil and South America in general from GVA. As I said, it proved unfounded at the time but as the saying goes, there's no smoke without fire.Could be the one airline serving the South American continent from GVA the way ET will do for sub-saharian Africa as from next month.

Re: Possible new routes of LATAM Brazil in Europe

Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 10:34 pm
by RainerBoeing777
thgsr08 wrote:
RainerBoeing777 wrote:
LATAM Brazil has launched new routes in recent years such as Johannesburg, Boston, Las Vegas, Tel Aviv and Rome
But what will be your next route in Europe, and for this summer 2018 JJ has 7 daily flights to the old continent the GRU-FCO route quickly increased to a daily flight, in the past Varig got to have 9 daily flights to Europe, I hope that JJ can incorporate more routes to Europe

2018 Summer Operations of LATAM Brazil

Madrid (MAD) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 777-300ER Daily
Frankfurt (FRA) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 777-300ER Daily
Paris (CDG) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Airbus A350-900 Daily
London (LHR) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 777-300ER Daily
Barcelona (BCN) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Airbus A350-900 Daily
Milan (MXP) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 767-300ER Daily
Rome (FCO) - Sao Paulo (GRU) Boeing 767-300ER Daily

I hope that a future the Airbus A350-900 returns to Milan, possibly with the entry of Air Italy to OneWorld group LATAM can increase its operations to Italy considerably

I see a potential in Munich, Brussels, Lisbon and Amsterdam, especially in Munich and Brussels as they do not have non-stop flights to Sao Paulo and both have a considerable demand for passengers

Image

what is your expectation for your next route? 8-)



Well, I don't see any expansion happening anytime soon, not through Europe.
The last launches to LAS, BOS, TLV, FCO deserve time to see how it works out. I can see FCO migrating to 77W or A350 soon.
I guess they'll get back to CUN and depending on how BOS goes, a new leg to YYZ, instead of JFK-YYZ.


Already LATAM Brazil announces GRU-LIS for September 2018 with 5 weekly frequencies with Boeing 767, and for the first quarter of 2019 they will launch Munich! GRU is the most important financial center in Latin America and Brazil is recovering its economy it's time to expand, Latam Brazil is on fire