NZ321 wrote:

I just flew MH business class return KUL-AKL. Lavs were immaculate on both flights throughout the flight, including 25 minutes before touch down.

Other flights I have taken recently on SQ, TG, MH, NH, NZ, LH have all had clean bathrooms when I have needed to use them, in economy or business.

I try to avoid using the toilet on US3 operated planes and some Low Cost airlines for reasons cited above.

Actually, in my understanding flight attendants are primarily there for passenger safety. Anything they do over and above that is up to the airline. But I would have thought that clean toilets is part of passenger safety. So I am miffed as to the multiple experiences of dirty and unusable toilets on these airlines.

See, that's just the corporate line that the US3 use to get out of having any kind of service.

I will say that I had to use the bathroom (more than) several times on LH A350 in Business (but I kept it clean after each of my uses, can't stand mess myself)...

All of the bathrooms were nearly perfect.

The only issue is the vacuum toilets can uhh...leave... "residue" that is kind of nasty

They can even go into reverse I am told. But it is rare and I have not experienced it.

Bottom line is put the lid down before pressing flush to be on the safe side.

So much better that the blue syrup toilets back then. You could actually see what had happened before you and used that very stuff to flush the lav. Ourgh.

cosyr wrote:

I personally try to clean the lav a little when I use it. I wipe down the counter and sink, and I will drop a couple of damp paper towels on the floor and wipe them around with my shoe. I don't really care if some people think it is gross (it drives me crazy that I have coworkers who say dirty dishes make them gag, they just ate the food off the plate that made it dirty) I get to wash my hands at the end, so who really cares?

I don't know whether or not it is in US3 flight attendant's duties to clean the bathroom, but I can speak from experience that many do. I have witnessed them cleaning, and even had to wait for a lav while I waited for one to do a quick refresh. I also have watched US flight attendants clean up vomit and other messes, which is certainly not a job I would want. They do a lot more than I am asked to do in my job.

I have also witnessed quick clean-ups on long-haul united flights once in a while. While perhaps not a requirement, as a customer, I really appreciated those individuals' above and beyond efforts!

FlyHappy wrote:

This has me reflecting on my personal history of travel and I conclude that this is a demonstration of a dichotomy of cultures, hemispheres and attitudes.

Some cultures are much, much, much more squeamish (individually) than others about bio waste/lavs and ironically, this means these shared spaces suffer; which is ironic as other cultures less squeamish than have better maintained shared facilities. Though this is really demonstrated on aircraft, I think this is also partially observed in the Airports, as well.

It is a challenge to deal with employee contracts, and I know that FA's have a hard job, are underpaid and such; I appreciate the FA responses in this thread.
One thing I really, really hate is the blocking of a lav because of a mess - this is the worse possible outcome, reducing the facilities available and accelerating the deterioration of the remaining lavs.

Though I know this will not happen, the one thing the western airlines have some control of are the size of the lavs - they've gotten too small, where the hygiene is negatively impacted. There simply needs to be be more maneuvering space - it would really help. I know - it isn't going to happen, but a guy can vent.

I do wish most western carriers would up their game in this area.

I agree. These new lavs on the 737s are terrible. The sink is so small it is difficult to properly wash your hands and the floor footprint is so small it is difficult to avoid stepping in urine someone may have sprayed on the floor!

IFlyMGN wrote:

I still find it amazing at just how inconsiderate some passengers can be. I've entered lavatories where it almost looks as if the previous user(s) have intentionally attempted to leave it in the most disgusting condition possible. Couple that with the area in and around certain passenger (walking around barefooted, trash and debris stuffed into the seat back pockets or just thrown on the floor, food crumbs and particles on the seats and floor, feet propped up on the bulkhead), it's like these people had absolutely no home training whatsoever. I've seen farm animals with better manners and behavior. While not necessarily attempting to sound elitist, there are some people who shouldn't be allowed at an airport much less on the plane itself.

We live in a world of "it's someone else's problem" attitude. Plus everyone wants the least expensive ticket. This attracts lower class passengers and unfortunately lower salaries and operating costs for the airlines. I am also baffled how people act in a public restroom. Not just on planes, but stadiums, restaurants, theme parks, etc. The average population is amazing.

Experienced the same as posted by several others here.

Flew to Asia in Korean Air & Cathay Pacific - spotless lavs.

Took AA to Australia in February - disgusting.

Several people, including myself, asked the flight attendants to do something about the trash piling up which was at this point, coming out of the can in one of them and had its way onto the counter and then the floor. One lady in the galley grabbed the trash bag left by the snacks and took off to start cleaning the mess up herself before the FA's finally jumped in.

questions wrote:

Years ago BA included after the safety video tips for passengers to maintain a clean bathroom.

Being cynical I wouldn't be surprised they removed them because some people were "outraged" that BA thought they needed to be told the tips in the first place. More likely it was a pre-emptive strike to avoid being accused of such.

Embajador3 wrote:

Ryga wrote:

As crew myself, you most certainly won’t see me cleaning the toilet if it got in that state midflight. Various health and safety issues involved with all of that too.

Exactly!! I had flown plenty of longhaul flight with western airlines such as KL, DL, US, AA, IB... and the toilets were in a decent state. However, I must say that as a FA myself, I can confirm there are cultural differences among passengers, some of which are throwing rubbish on the ground, peeing on the floor, etc and thus leaving the toilet in a very sorry condition. I am afraid, it very much always the same people.

What kind of people are those?

Considering there was recently a passenger who smeared his own sh*t all over the lavatory walls, this doesn’t surprise me one bit.

CobaltScar wrote:

The biggest factor in how clean/dirty a bathroom is , is the route! Some routes are notorious for trashing the plane. I think its ok for a FA to tidy up a little bit, but asking them to scrub toilets and pee/poop soaked floors is too much.

The only factor in play is if the environment is safe for fellow employees and passengers. If it is not safe for employees or passengers, cabin crew are either obligated to lock the lavatory from further use or to clean to make it safe. There is no middle ground.

To knowingly have bathroom in a unsafe state because of an industrial reason is not an acceptable defence in court. Cabin crew and the airline are personally responsible for the safety of the passengers on a flight.

Maybe a few class action law suits are required where US3 cabin crew have to defend their laziness to keep a safe environment for their fellow employees and passengers against those who paid US$20,000 a ticket is warranted.

All I am reading above is some people have no pride in their workplace and are just too lazy to do anything about it.

buzzard302 wrote:

Plus everyone wants the least expensive ticket. This attracts lower class passengers and unfortunately lower salaries and operating costs for the airlines.

I wholeheartedly disagree. The lav states weren't much better in the 70's and 80's when long haul was far more expensive, and only legacies and flag carriers were around. Of course, its relative to the fact that the load factors were typically much lower, and (per my hazy recollection) lavs were a little more spacious. Its not that much about "lower class" or FA salaries.

buzzard302 wrote:

I am also baffled how people act in a public restroom. Not just on planes, but stadiums, restaurants, theme parks, etc. The average population is amazing.

This, I wholeheartedly agree with Large groups of people behave poorly.

I disagree with some of he posts on this thread. On long haul flights I use the same lav as the passengers, I don't want to use a disgusting lav so I will tidy the lav up during the flight. Keep in mind, we aren't provided mops or very many cleaning supplies, but I do the best I can. When I'm finished the lav is clean. Emptying trash is easy and wiping down the sink area doesn't take any effort.

What does gross me out is that people want to "fool around" in there. YUCK

Singapore Airlines bathrooms are always clean and well maintained. Singapore Airlines is like the Four Seasons of air travel. You wouldnt walk into a messy bathroom at the four seasons right? The US3 are like the hampton inn. just saying.

I think I’m this era of ultra long flights exceeding 15 hours and sometimes 18 hours, intra-flight cleaning is a must and the F/A’s need to take turns. No one is above certain tasks.

It should be part of the job description like it is on SQ or other far eastern airlines. The other solution is a cabin attendant.

gwrudolph wrote:

These new lavs on the 737s are terrible. The sink is so small it is difficult to properly wash your hands and the floor footprint is so small

I heard that porta potties are bigger than those new 737 lavs!

FlyHappy wrote:

Which is all to say that yes...... possibly the worst aspect of US3 long haul is the too-often brutal lav state.

Not just long haul. My last trip was on UA, flying BOS-DEN I decided to use the lav and it had a puddle of urine on the floor.
People in this country in general are just not very conscious about cleanliness in public toilets, be it on a plane, a restaurant, or a school.
You just don't see that kind of filth in other parts of the World. In Europe for example there are self cleaning public toilets. I don't think I've ever seen such a thing in this country,

I always wondered about this, thank you for asking. I am shocked if airlines don't have a policy requiring the F/As to clean the bathrooms at some sort of interval for any flights over 3ish hours. They don't need to do a thorough deep cleaning, but emptying the trash, refilling the soap and towels, picking up trash on the floor and maybe wiping everything down. It is a public restroom, expecting everyone to completely pick up after themselves in a public setting is completely unrealistic in every culture. That type of expectation doesn't exist in any other part of public society, why should it exist on an airplane. Walk into many restaurants, cafes, airport restrooms etc. and you can see the cleaning schedule listed behind the door. I too have noticed US3 F/As occasionally doing some level of cleaning on some flights.

ncflyer wrote:

I just took my first flight US to Asia, on a US3 carrier, and by the time we landed I used a bathroom that was absolutely disgusting, would have easily been closed had the plane had a department of health. The garbage was overflowing with beer cans and other non bathroom related garbage, , the floor was soaking wet, there was more garbage in the wash basin. Figure 200 people in coach, 4 bathrooms, each bathroom is used at least 100 times, let alone diaper changes, or the inevitable sick passenger or two when you have that many people. It would be nice if people treated the bathroom respectfully, but people are people. . .

What are airline practices here?

Let it be-- as seemed to be the case on my flight? It will be cleaned at landing.
If flight attendants get to it, great, if not, so be it?
Flight attendants must clean bathroom as part of their job duties?
Cleaning attendant flies on plane for such long hauls?

In the USA Flight Attendants do NOT clean bathrooms mid flight. (might not be the case worldwide as I can ONLY speak for the USA)
There IS no "cleaning attendant" !!
Bathrooms get cleaned during the turn time or the airplane might get taken out of service to get the lavatories flushed and cleaned.
Which during my Aviation career has happened quite a few times to remove Diapers, Scarves. sanitary pads Lotion Bottles and soda cans.
(most Distasteful I can assure you..)

United787 wrote:

I always wondered about this, thank you for asking. I am shocked if airlines don't have a policy requiring the F/As to clean the bathrooms at some sort of interval for any flights over 3ish hours. They don't need to do a thorough deep cleaning, but emptying the trash, refilling the soap and towels, picking up trash on the floor and maybe wiping everything down. It is a public restroom, expecting everyone to completely pick up after themselves in a public setting is completely unrealistic in every culture. That type of expectation doesn't exist in any other part of public society, why should it exist on an airplane. Walk into many restaurants, cafes, airport restrooms etc. and you can see the cleaning schedule listed behind the door. I too have noticed US3 F/As occasionally doing some level of cleaning on some flights.

II think the might tidy up the Galley and collect trash but In 30+ years at a Major airline and hundreds of flights I've never seen them clean the Lavs.
as It might be a health hazard to them. We have people who do that work.

CobaltScar wrote:

...I think its ok for a FA to tidy up a little bit, but asking them to scrub toilets and pee/poop soaked floors is too much.

So passengers should assume and accept that in some long routes toilets will be in a disgusting state, full of crap, urine and worse? Pardon me? What kind of service from a service provider is that? Unacceptable! Don't need to be the FAs, I am happy if pilots clean it as well, but let it "as is" is not an option.

I've always found AC to be very good about having clean facilities on the long haul equipment. The Rapidair planes on the other hand....it's....dodgy.

Mainly because the turns are so fast with the YYZ/YOW/YUL flights, the plane seems to get a quick run through and then it's back up in the air.

From an LCC perspective, I have found WestJet to be the worst for cleanliness and easyJet to be the best....but I think a lot of it comes down to:

1. Airline Policy
2. Amount of time on the ground for aircraft grooming
3. Type of passengers being flown

airbazar wrote:

FlyHappy wrote:

Which is all to say that yes...... possibly the worst aspect of US3 long haul is the too-often brutal lav state.

Not just long haul. My last trip was on UA, flying BOS-DEN I decided to use the lav and it had a puddle of urine on the floor.
People in this country in general are just not very conscious about cleanliness in public toilets, be it on a plane, a restaurant, or a school.
You just don't see that kind of filth in other parts of the World. In Europe for example there are self cleaning public toilets. I don't think I've ever seen such a thing in this country,

c'mon now.
we all agree it'd be nice if US carriers could perform a little better in this area, but lets not get carried away.
The "other parts of the Word" are not fundamentally cleaner or more conscientious about public hygiene... crowds of people are the same everywhere. If you have not seen "filth" elsewhere, then I can safely conclude that you are restricting yourself to some very nice and sheltered parts of the world.

Aircraft cleanliness is obviously about management and labor, and what emphasis the carrier puts on this aspect of its product. Its hardly a statement about societies cleanliness at large.

Jayafe wrote:

CobaltScar wrote:

...I think its ok for a FA to tidy up a little bit, but asking them to scrub toilets and pee/poop soaked floors is too much.

So passengers should assume and accept that in some long routes toilets will be in a disgusting state, full of crap, urine and worse? Pardon me? What kind of service from a service provider is that? Unacceptable! Don't need to be the FAs, I am happy if pilots clean it as well, but let it "as is" is not an option.

No!! They should NOT assume that NOR Expect that ! Lavatory operation can limit the passenger load and the range on an aircraft. If the FAA EVER found out you dispatched an airplane with Inop Lavs and sold out the airplane when you KNEW it up Front?? You might not be operating very long..

The FAA taked a dim view of just about EVERYTHING and Inop Lavs is just one thing! I don't know HOW you'd talk your way out of that scenario.
Hell! I've ferried airplanes out of service from Asia to the USA JUST to get the lav's fixed!
I wouldn't want to be in the Vicinity of anybody trying to make an EXCUSE to the FAA for putting passengers on a known Broken toilet system airplane!
Their Head exploding might injure me when they told a lie like that!!

dfwjim1 wrote:

Exactly!! I had flown plenty of longhaul flight with western airlines such as KL, DL, US, AA, IB... and the toilets were in a decent state. However, I must say that as a FA myself, I can confirm there are cultural differences among passengers, some of which are throwing rubbish on the ground, peeing on the floor, etc and thus leaving the toilet in a very sorry condition. I am afraid, it very much always the same people.

Maybe more aircraft should be outfitted with these signs?



Saw it in a plane once, but forgot where.

AA737-823 wrote:

Add this data point to our useless pool of internet statistics, but I flew Delta ICN-SEA last month and the F/A's DID indeed clean the lavs in economy.

I can second this experience for both TPAC and TATL routes on Delta.

strfyr51 wrote:

II think the might tidy up the Galley and collect trash but In 30+ years at a Major airline and hundreds of flights I've never seen them clean the Lavs.
as It might be a health hazard to them. We have people who do that work.

Cleaning lavs in flight is not a health hazard, hundreds of airlines do it, you are just saying at your major airline the cabin crew are too lazy to do it. It is very easy in flight for crew to don disposable gloves and aprons and to use tongs. They don’t physically come in contact with anything.

If they let them get to an unsafe state, they are obligated to lock them out of further use or clean them, there is no middle ground.

They cannot leave the workplace knowingly in an unsafe condition for fellow employees and customers.

Dealing with sick passengers, vomit etc exposes cabin crew to far more than the bathroom does.

I normally fly ANA when I fly to Japan; they are constantly cleaning and restocking the bathrooms. They even make sure to fold the toilet paper end into a triangle. That doesn't mean they're never dirty, because you can always be unlucky enough to get in there after a particularly messy passenger and before it's been cleaned, but the FA's seem to clean them about once an hour. I mean it's a lot - I often have been directed to another toilet by one FA because another is cleaning, and it's not like I'm getting up every five minutes. So for me to have had that experience more than once means they must be cleaning pretty often.

I flew Delta on that route last month and while I didn't notice anyone cleaning, I also didn't think the bathrooms were very dirty. So it wasn't a problem regardless.

I think the only time I've had a problem with dirty toilets is flying domestic in the US.

Jayafe wrote:

CobaltScar wrote:

...I think its ok for a FA to tidy up a little bit, but asking them to scrub toilets and pee/poop soaked floors is too much.

So passengers should assume and accept that in some long routes toilets will be in a disgusting state, full of crap, urine and worse? Pardon me? What kind of service from a service provider is that? Unacceptable! Don't need to be the FAs, I am happy if pilots clean it as well, but let it "as is" is not an option.

So you are fine with the same FA serving food right after cleaning a messy lav without any reasonable cleaning supplies? I am not.

Every plane carries more human waste than food toward the end of that flight. ULH flights even more. One of the reasons I avoid ULH flights.

Blocking one-half of available toilets for some duration of the flight may be better option to keep at least some clean lavs towards the end.

I would prefer Dine and Fly TATL flights, serve the main course in the terminal, let everyone use restrooms prior to boarding, just to sleep and serve pre-arrival snack. Fewer galley carts and less weight. Environmental friendly option.

dtw2hyd wrote:

Every plane carries more human waste than food toward the end of that flight. ULH flights even more. One of the reasons I avoid ULH flights.

This may be the oddest reason to avoid ULH I've personally ever heard! But hey - to each, his or her own.

dtw2hyd wrote:

I would prefer Dine and Fly TATL flights, serve the main course in the terminal, let everyone use restrooms prior to boarding, just to sleep and serve pre-arrival snack. Fewer galley carts and less weight. Environmental friendly option.

There's nothing stopping you from doing so on your own.... is this what you do to avoid the aircraft restroom?

strfyr51 wrote:

No!! They should NOT assume that NOR Expect that ! Lavatory operation can limit the passenger load and the range on an aircraft. If the FAA EVER found out you dispatched an airplane with Inop Lavs and sold out the airplane when you KNEW it up Front?? You might not be operating very long..

It is perfectly legal to dispatch with a full load without all the lavs working with some locked out. Locking lavs out is required if some of the safety equipment in them is inoperable (ie makes them unsafe) or the toilet itself is not working, eg 38-30-1 in this 777 MMEL.

We normally use a ratio of a minimum of 1 lav per 60 pax must be working at dispatch, on a 777 that could mean half of them are locked out.

dtw2hyd wrote:

FlyHappy wrote:

...

There's nothing stopping you from doing so on your own.... is this what you do to avoid the aircraft restroom?

Very seldom I eat the main course. AVML usually is borderline edible (I have to admit it was good on last two DL flights). Generally, I drink one cup of Tomato/Orange juice and sleep. Get up for pre-arrival snack. Use a clean lav at the destination.

If there is a sick person onboard no amount of sincere light cleaning is not going help.

haha, thanks for humouring me.
Personally, I've never seen lavs wrecked because of sick people/vomit. My experiences have been that they've vomited at their seat, which is an utter disaster for a good portion of the plane. Its the "other end" that has always been the downer with respect to the lavs.

FlyHappy wrote:

...

There's nothing stopping you from doing so on your own.... is this what you do to avoid the aircraft restroom?

Very seldom I eat the main course. AVML usually is borderline edible (I have to admit it was good on last two DL flights). Generally, I drink one cup of Tomato/Orange juice and sleep. Get up for pre-arrival snack. Use a clean lav at the destination.

If there is a sick person onboard no amount of sincere light cleaning is not going help.

dtw2hyd wrote:

So you are fine with the same FA serving food right after cleaning a messy lav without any reasonable cleaning supplies? I am not.

I am fine with them working in the galley either after using the bathroom for their own needs or cleaning them. Cabin crew are trained on safe food handling techniques, our crew never actuallly touch passenger meals directly, meals are kept covered until ready for service.

Hundreds of airlines around the world have cabin crew cleaning lavs in flight, and you don’t see see and statistics with higher food related sickness rates on those carriers.

zeke wrote:

dtw2hyd wrote:

So you are fine with the same FA serving food right after cleaning a messy lav without any reasonable cleaning supplies? I am not.

I am fine with them working in the galley either after using the bathroom for their own needs or cleaning them. Cabin crew are trained on safe food handling techniques, our crew never actuallly touch passenger meals directly, meals are kept covered until ready for service.

Hundreds of airlines around the world have cabin crew cleaning lavs in flight, and you don’t see see and statistics with higher food related sickness rates on those carriers.

I am not questioning crew training or sincerity. I just don't believe public toilets can be cleaned without a strong dose of Clorox. Hence I reduce food/drink consumption so I can live without using the lav for 9 hours. Nothing against aircraft lavs, never set foot on a cruise. Not a big fan of norovirus.

DDR wrote:

What does gross me out is that people want to "fool around" in there. YUCK

Well if the crew isn't going to share the crew rest, where else are passengers supposed to fool around??

I just returned from a trip to and around Asia. Flew on both Japan Airlines and Garuda Indonesia. The bathrooms were spotless throughout the whole trip on all my flights. Unfortunately I have a low expectation level when flying on US based carriers. The phrase “that’s not my department” or “it’s not in my contract” seems to come to mind. That’s straight up lazy. The quality of service along with the professionalism and eye for detail of the cabin crew is why I always choose well respected foreign carriers when flying internationally.

dtw2hyd wrote:

let everyone use restrooms prior to boarding,

Not that many airports have restrooms at the gates, even nearby.

Some airports do not even have enough lavs at the connection route. And sometimes you should be prepared for at least 30 min wait after arrival before reaching a restroom.

Would it save airliners' money if they can make pax to piss at the ground?

AirlineBrat wrote:

I just returned from a trip to and around Asia. Flew on both Japan Airlines and Garuda Indonesia. The bathrooms were spotless throughout the whole trip on all my flights. Unfortunately I have a low expectation level when flying on US based carriers. The phrase “that’s not my department” or “it’s not in my contract” seems to come to mind. That’s straight up lazy. The quality of service along with the professionalism and eye for detail of the cabin crew is why I always choose well respected foreign carriers when flying internationally.

I would add also that japanese people are extremely tidy people, something that can't be said about some of the others...

FlyHappy wrote:

airbazar wrote:

FlyHappy wrote:

Which is all to say that yes...... possibly the worst aspect of US3 long haul is the too-often brutal lav state.

Not just long haul. My last trip was on UA, flying BOS-DEN I decided to use the lav and it had a puddle of urine on the floor.
People in this country in general are just not very conscious about cleanliness in public toilets, be it on a plane, a restaurant, or a school.
You just don't see that kind of filth in other parts of the World. In Europe for example there are self cleaning public toilets. I don't think I've ever seen such a thing in this country,

c'mon now.
we all agree it'd be nice if US carriers could perform a little better in this area, but lets not get carried away.
The "other parts of the Word" are not fundamentally cleaner or more conscientious about public hygiene... crowds of people are the same everywhere. If you have not seen "filth" elsewhere, then I can safely conclude that you are restricting yourself to some very nice and sheltered parts of the world.

Aircraft cleanliness is obviously about management and labor, and what emphasis the carrier puts on this aspect of its product. Its hardly a statement about societies cleanliness at large.

Obviously there are other parts of the world that are a lot worse but among the Industrialized world, what we typically call the "1st world", the U.S. society is the least conscious about cleanliness in my experience. Try visiting a supermarket or restaurant kitchen next time you're in Germany or Japan. Heck, just look at their homes even in poor neighborhoods you don't see piles of trash in the front yard. And Austrian board of health inspector would close half of the restaurants in the U.S. When you go to a restaurant here, the first thing that happens is someone wipes your table with a filthy brown rag that has been re-used 100 times and left to stew in germs all day long. We make kids go to school in filthy schools every day and they become desensitized to it and grow up thinking that's normal. In some European and Asian schools they make everyone take their shoes off at school and typically don't wear shoes in the house. Not here in the U.S. It's a cultural thing. Cleanliness is not a strong characteristic of US society so it's not surprising that our FA's don't feel the need to maintain the toilets clean.

airbazar wrote:

FlyHappy wrote:

airbazar wrote:

Not just long haul. My last trip was on UA, flying BOS-DEN I decided to use the lav and it had a puddle of urine on the floor.
People in this country in general are just not very conscious about cleanliness in public toilets, be it on a plane, a restaurant, or a school.
You just don't see that kind of filth in other parts of the World. In Europe for example there are self cleaning public toilets. I don't think I've ever seen such a thing in this country,

c'mon now.
we all agree it'd be nice if US carriers could perform a little better in this area, but lets not get carried away.
The "other parts of the Word" are not fundamentally cleaner or more conscientious about public hygiene... crowds of people are the same everywhere. If you have not seen "filth" elsewhere, then I can safely conclude that you are restricting yourself to some very nice and sheltered parts of the world.

Aircraft cleanliness is obviously about management and labor, and what emphasis the carrier puts on this aspect of its product. Its hardly a statement about societies cleanliness at large.

Obviously there are other parts of the world that are a lot worse but among the Industrialized world, what we typically call the "1st world", the U.S. society is the least conscious about cleanliness in my experience. Try visiting a supermarket or restaurant kitchen next time you're in Germany or Japan. Heck, just look at their homes even in poor neighborhoods you don't see piles of trash in the front yard. And Austrian board of health inspector would close half of the restaurants in the U.S. When you go to a restaurant here, the first thing that happens is someone wipes your table with a filthy brown rag that has been re-used 100 times and left to stew in germs all day long. We make kids go to school in filthy schools every day and they become desensitized to it and grow up thinking that's normal. In some European and Asian schools they make everyone take their shoes off at school and typically don't wear shoes in the house. Not here in the U.S. It's a cultural thing. Cleanliness is not a strong characteristic of US society so it's not surprising that our FA's don't feel the need to maintain the toilets clean.

That's a fine diatribe
But what you originally said was "You just don't see that kind of filth in other parts of the World", without any references to 1st or industrialized world, which represents a pretty small fraction of the world.

And still, there's little reason to believe there is direct correlation between societal cleanliness and the practices of Airline carriers. I really don't want to cite specific countries or cultures, because this is a public, global forum, and that can only incite argument and hard feelings; but just taking posts from this at face value, you'd see that that there plenty of carriers cited as having "spotless lavs" that originate from societies not thought of as particularly "clean" by your stated 1st world standards (putting aside the reality that much of the worlds airlines are not from the "1st world").

I'm not trying to debate what countries are "clean" or "unclean", because that's not what is in dispute, nor is it germane.
I'm saying that you've over-complicated your cause-effect theory as to why US aircraft lavs are (sometimes) substandard, and introduced a fair bit of unrelated trivia.

An airplane is a place were food is served. So filthy toilets should be absolutely unacceptable. An airline that does not clean its toilets on a long haul flight, should be closed down by a health inspector, like any place serving food in an unclean environment.
The responsibility regarding clean toilets lays with the airline. It should be in the work description off the F/A and they should be paid for that work or nobody can expect an F/A to do this work. Cleaning equipment and protective equipment like gloves and perhaps an single use overall should than available to the F/A.

mjoelnir wrote:

An airplane is a place were food is served. So filthy toilets should be absolutely unacceptable. An airline that does not clean its toilets on a long haul flight, should be closed down by a health inspector, like any place serving food in an unclean environment.
The responsibility regarding clean toilets lays with the airline. It should be in the work description off the F/A and they should be paid for that work or nobody can expect an F/A to do this work. Cleaning equipment and protective equipment like gloves and perhaps an single use overall should than available to the F/A.

Very eloquent! I agree entirely

zeke wrote:

strfyr51 wrote:

No!! They should NOT assume that NOR Expect that ! Lavatory operation can limit the passenger load and the range on an aircraft. If the FAA EVER found out you dispatched an airplane with Inop Lavs and sold out the airplane when you KNEW it up Front?? You might not be operating very long..

It is perfectly legal to dispatch with a full load without all the lavs working with some locked out. Locking lavs out is required if some of the safety equipment in them is inoperable (ie makes them unsafe) or the toilet itself is not working, eg 38-30-1 in this 777 MMEL.

We normally use a ratio of a minimum of 1 lav per 60 pax must be working at dispatch, on a 777 that could mean half of them are locked out.

I agree but there is a ratio of passengers to operating Lavs and I believe the MEL or CDL denotes the Ratio.
Years ago we dispatched a B777 where the lavs went inop on 3 consecutive legs (Due to a blown duct)
Operations wanted to keep using the airplane, Maintenance killed it and the fight was ON.
When we got the airplane to the hangar? We found the duct split right in front of the Vacum Generator and particulate matter sprayed all over the aftLH fuselage. Aft of the pit. The airplane was out of service for 3 days while we cleaned the aft utilitu area around the lav tank replaced the ducting ,the insulation blankets and 2 aft floor boards under the aft lav and aft galley. The FAA saw all the work we were doing and saw the cause of it. A full can of Pepsi we suspect was flushed from the mid lav around door 3. It went thru the duct were the was a 90 degree bend going to the tank. It missed the Vacum Generator by 2 inches. for a time we actually quit giving passengers full cans of coke because of this.
We had to get ITT to do the Hazmat cleanup at the cost of $55,000 before we could make the repairs. (I wouldn't do that work for ANY amount of Money!)
(they were worth EVERY Penny of it!) (And? it was only 4 guys and a foreman.) (They also disposed of the insulation and the floor boards we took out .

zeke wrote:

A lot of rubbish in this thread, pun intended.

It is the airlines responsibility to provide a clean and safe environment for everyone on the aircraft, crew and passengers.

Urine is not full of germs, it is cleaner than most door handles anyone ever encounters. Most of the water in the floor is not urine, it is from the sink.

It is very easy for an airline to provide disposable gloves and aprons.

Dealing with sick passengers, puke, food trays, rubbish, galleys, and toilets is part of the cabin crews job. The less glamours parts, but it is their role.

While I agree that the airline should provide a clean cabin environment for passengers and crew let’s not forget that lavs don’t get dirty all on their own. I’m left dumbfounded by passenger behavior aboard aircraft far too often. I’d hate to see their houses. Even if you’re a messy/dirty person and don’t mind being in squalor have some decency and respect for fellow passengers.

Personally, I will often tidy up the lav I’m using regardless of whether or not the mess is mine. It’s called manners. Unfortunately, manners, like personal responsibility are fast dying traits in the modern world. Why blame inconsiderate, careless passengers when you can blame someone else like the airline or the crew?

If you’re looking to get your blood pressure up and have social media check out the account: passengershaming. They have an Instagram account and I believe Facebook.

77H

Delta has some cleaning kits for their long haul routes. Not sure if they have been fully rolled out to all markets yet though.

In the airline I work for, worst are flights to/from Bangladesh. India is very close behind.
I never knew such a mess could be done in such a short time. Great respect for our cabin crew having to clean this shit.