DL widebody updates at SEA

flybynight · Mon Apr 02, 2018 9:07 pm

My apologies if this was recently discussed.

Except for the occasional 777, the wide bodies that serve Europe and Asia are a mix of A333's, 332's and 763ER's.
As the 767's start their sunsetting at DL, do we know if the replacements will consist more of 332's (the most similar in size to the 763), or potentially more 777's.. Strangely enough, some of the 772's are pretty close in age to the outgoing 767's.

Or will the A350 get service from SEA?

My guess would more of a combo of 777's (especially in the summer) and 332's.

Anyone know?

Sightseer · Mon Apr 02, 2018 9:10 pm

Based on DL's current order book, I'd guess A330s are the most likely 767 replacement in SEA. The limited A350 and 777 fleets can be used elsewhere in the network where their range is in greater demand.

FSDan · Mon Apr 02, 2018 9:59 pm

DL's A330-900s will be good candidates to replace 767s on Transpacific flights from SEA when they start arriving. The A350s can't be ruled out either.

hkcanadaexpat · Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:09 pm

Bear in mind that the 76T subfleet (7 of them) based out of SEA and flying TPAC was delivered in 2000-01. They probably have 10-12 years left in them. So DL could keep them there flying TPAC for a long time coming unless/until demand justify upgrading to 339/772/359.

TransWorldOne · Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:33 pm

All SEA TPAC is currently on a 767 save for HKG which is a 777. The 767 will likely be the optimal aircraft for SEA TPAC for years to come as those aircraft still have a few years of life left in them and seem to meet the capacity demand. DL has stated that once the 330-900's begin arriving, the will be used on west coast-Asia so Seattle will likely see the aircraft operating TPAC routes in a few years. DL's transatlantic routes out of SEA seem to be more developed and can support larger aircraft (333's, 777's) and multiple frequencies.

deltal1011man · Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:33 pm

flybynight wrote:
My apologies if this was recently discussed.

Except for the occasional 777, the wide bodies that serve Europe and Asia are a mix of A333's, 332's and 763ER's.
As the 767's start their sunsetting at DL, do we know if the replacements will consist more of 332's (the most similar in size to the 763), or potentially more 777's.. Strangely enough, some of the 772's are pretty close in age to the outgoing 767's.

Or will the A350 get service from SEA?

My guess would more of a combo of 777's (especially in the summer) and 332's.

Anyone know?

It would be fairly hard to find a 777 from 1990-1992...... (or in the case of the Gulf Air birds going away a 777 without FADEC engines)

flybynight · Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:58 pm

deltal1011man wrote:
flybynight wrote:
My apologies if this was recently discussed.

Except for the occasional 777, the wide bodies that serve Europe and Asia are a mix of A333's, 332's and 763ER's.
As the 767's start their sunsetting at DL, do we know if the replacements will consist more of 332's (the most similar in size to the 763), or potentially more 777's.. Strangely enough, some of the 772's are pretty close in age to the outgoing 767's.

Or will the A350 get service from SEA?

My guess would more of a combo of 777's (especially in the summer) and 332's.

Anyone know?

It would be fairly hard to find a 777 from 1990-1992...... (or in the case of the Gulf Air birds going away a 777 without FADEC engines)

Well since the 777 went into operation ( I believe UA was the launch customer) around '95 or '96, there aren't going to be any from 1990!!

deltal1011man · Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:41 pm

flybynight wrote:
deltal1011man wrote:
flybynight wrote:
My apologies if this was recently discussed.

Except for the occasional 777, the wide bodies that serve Europe and Asia are a mix of A333's, 332's and 763ER's.
As the 767's start their sunsetting at DL, do we know if the replacements will consist more of 332's (the most similar in size to the 763), or potentially more 777's.. Strangely enough, some of the 772's are pretty close in age to the outgoing 767's.

Or will the A350 get service from SEA?

My guess would more of a combo of 777's (especially in the summer) and 332's.

Anyone know?

It would be fairly hard to find a 777 from 1990-1992...... (or in the case of the Gulf Air birds going away a 777 without FADEC engines)

Well since the 777 went into operation ( I believe UA was the launch customer) around '95 or '96, there aren't going to be any from 1990!!

thats my point.

the 767s leaving are older than the 777 fleet. No 767 of similar age is currently planned to be parked.

PlanesNTrains · Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:45 pm

flybynight wrote:
deltal1011man wrote:
flybynight wrote:
My apologies if this was recently discussed.

Except for the occasional 777, the wide bodies that serve Europe and Asia are a mix of A333's, 332's and 763ER's.
As the 767's start their sunsetting at DL, do we know if the replacements will consist more of 332's (the most similar in size to the 763), or potentially more 777's.. Strangely enough, some of the 772's are pretty close in age to the outgoing 767's.

Or will the A350 get service from SEA?

My guess would more of a combo of 777's (especially in the summer) and 332's.

Anyone know?

It would be fairly hard to find a 777 from 1990-1992...... (or in the case of the Gulf Air birds going away a 777 without FADEC engines)

Well since the 777 went into operation ( I believe UA was the launch customer) around '95 or '96, there aren't going to be any from 1990!!

I'm guessing that he is saying that the outgoing 767s are 1990-1992 vintage.

SEAxSANxBOS · Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:58 pm

HKG and CDG are moving to 777s. Most Asian routs are staying 767s with AMS being a mix of both 76 and 330.

questions · Tue Apr 03, 2018 12:45 am

Is DL flying more or less TPAC, including intra-Asia, passengers today than at the time of the DL/NW merger (combined)?

Cointrin330 · Tue Apr 03, 2018 12:50 am

flybynight wrote:
My apologies if this was recently discussed.

Except for the occasional 777, the wide bodies that serve Europe and Asia are a mix of A333's, 332's and 763ER's.
As the 767's start their sunsetting at DL, do we know if the replacements will consist more of 332's (the most similar in size to the 763), or potentially more 777's.. Strangely enough, some of the 772's are pretty close in age to the outgoing 767's.

Or will the A350 get service from SEA?

My guess would more of a combo of 777's (especially in the summer) and 332's.

Anyone know?

The 777 went into passenger service in June 1995, with the first flight operated by United, the launch customer, from LHR to IAD. There are no 777's flying since the early 1990s and Delta got their first batch of -200s, and not that many of them, due to a pilot dispute issue, until later, I am not sure exactly but I think 1996 to 1997.

G500Captain · Tue Apr 03, 2018 1:09 am

I believe if DL wants to upgauge some markets, or at least everything current sans HKG, then the A332’s will be making a return to Seattle before the A339’s have a sizable presence. The A332 has the range, is the next step up in size, and I just don’t see DL wanting to throw that many more seats into the Seattle market. The A332 also ruled the roost for the initial build up the TPac hub. If they do bring the A339 to Seattle early then expect NRT and ICN to be the initial markets.

MIflyer12 · Tue Apr 03, 2018 1:32 am

questions wrote:
Is DL flying more or less TPAC, including intra-Asia, passengers today than at the time of the DL/NW merger (combined)?

I don't know passenger counts but the respective annual reports show Pacific passenger revenue of $2,366 million in 2017 and $678 million in 2008. No, I don't think fares are up 250%.

questions · Tue Apr 03, 2018 1:34 am

MIflyer12 wrote:
questions wrote:
Is DL flying more or less TPAC, including intra-Asia, passengers today than at the time of the DL/NW merger (combined)?

I don't know passenger counts but the respective annual reports show Pacific passenger revenue of $2,366 million in 2017 and $678 million in 2008. No, I don't think fares are up 250%.

Wow! Is $678M DL or DL/NW at time of merger?

MSPNWA · Tue Apr 03, 2018 1:41 am

questions wrote:
Is DL flying more or less TPAC, including intra-Asia, passengers today than at the time of the DL/NW merger (combined)?

Not sure on passengers, but currently ASMs are slightly down on a combined basis since the end of 2007. Pacific ASMs peaked a few years into the combined company. Considering the NRT hub used to be more volume-based instead of distance, my guess would be that passengers are down more than ASMs.

Tomsixty2 · Tue Apr 03, 2018 1:47 am

My wife and I are booked SEA to AMS on May 1. It had been a A 330-300 but on May 1 it changes to a 777 ER. The return trip is stll a 767-300 ER

deltalaw · Tue Apr 03, 2018 1:48 am

Cointrin330 wrote:
flybynight wrote:
My apologies if this was recently discussed.

Except for the occasional 777, the wide bodies that serve Europe and Asia are a mix of A333's, 332's and 763ER's.
As the 767's start their sunsetting at DL, do we know if the replacements will consist more of 332's (the most similar in size to the 763), or potentially more 777's.. Strangely enough, some of the 772's are pretty close in age to the outgoing 767's.

Or will the A350 get service from SEA?

My guess would more of a combo of 777's (especially in the summer) and 332's.

Anyone know?

The 777 went into passenger service in June 1995, with the first flight operated by United, the launch customer, from LHR to IAD. There are no 777's flying since the early 1990s and Delta got their first batch of -200s, and not that many of them, due to a pilot dispute issue, until later, I am not sure exactly but I think 1996 to 1997.

I believe it was actually 1999. I flew LGW-ATL on 7002 in June ‘99 back when they only had 2 frames.

KMCOFlyer · Tue Apr 03, 2018 2:10 am

DL stated in their presser for the 339 order that they would be used for West Coast to Asia. I assume some will be based in SEA. For those saying that the 76Ts are young and should continue to do TPAC runs out of SEA, DL has many older 767s that need to be retired and the 76Ts will likely replace those routes and the 339 will take over all TPAC runs.

MIflyer12 · Tue Apr 03, 2018 2:51 am

questions wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
questions wrote:
Is DL flying more or less TPAC, including intra-Asia, passengers today than at the time of the DL/NW merger (combined)?

I don't know passenger counts but the respective annual reports show Pacific passenger revenue of $2,366 million in 2017 and $678 million in 2008. No, I don't think fares are up 250%.

Wow! Is $678M DL or DL/NW at time of merger?

That's the full year 2008 figure, including NW from merger date to year end.

NateGreat · Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:50 am

I thought the A339s are supposed to replace the 763s, which primarily do TATL. Are you saying the A339s will primarily be TPAC planes (like the A350), or are you saying that only SOME (less than half) of the A339 routes will be TPAC?

questions · Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:03 am

I’d A339s on TPAC what will replace 763s on TATL?

When are the A339s expected to be delivered?

hkcanadaexpat · Tue Apr 03, 2018 6:19 am

questions wrote:
When are the A339s expected to be delivered?

Latest schedule shows the first (4) in 2020.

factsonly · Tue Apr 03, 2018 6:47 am

Tomsixty2 wrote:
My wife and I are booked SEA to AMS on May 1. It had been a A 330-300 but on May 1 it changes to a 777 ER. The return trip is stll a 767-300 ER

Must be a one-off exchange of B772 and A333 aircraft between SEA and ATL, as on May 1st DL142 SEA-AMS and DL75 AMS-ATL is B772, while a A333 flies in the opposite direction.

From May 1st, ATL-AMS-ATL will see a 1x B772 out of 3x daily DL services.

jumbojet · Tue Apr 03, 2018 1:00 pm

hkcanadaexpat wrote:
questions wrote:
When are the A339s expected to be delivered?

Latest schedule shows the first (4) in 2020.

what schedule are you referring to? The only thing I've seen printed for the A330-900's is from the Delta Newsroom where it says 2019.

Airbus A330neo (A330-900)
The widebody A330-900neo, an enhancement of Airbus' successful A330 family featuring greater aerodynamic and economic efficiency, will be deployed on medium-haul trans-Atlantic markets as well as select routes connecting the U.S. West Coast and Asia. The aircraft are scheduled to enter the Delta fleet in 2019 and will deliver a 20 percent operating cost savings per seat over the Boeing 767-300ER aircraft it will replace.

Raises another question, will they come delivered with the DL suites? I am sure they will....

hiflyeras · Tue Apr 03, 2018 2:53 pm

TransWorldOne wrote:
DL's transatlantic routes out of SEA seem to be more developed and can support larger aircraft (333's, 777's) and multiple frequencies.

I believe they've handed all of their SEA-TATL routes off to their 'joint venture' partners except AMS.

factsonly · Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:03 pm

hiflyeras wrote:
TransWorldOne wrote:
DL's transatlantic routes out of SEA seem to be more developed and can support larger aircraft (333's, 777's) and multiple frequencies.

I believe they've handed all of their SEA-TATL routes off to their 'joint venture' partners except AMS.

There is also:

- SEA 1:20pm - CDG 08:10am DL34 B772 daily

Sightseer · Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:03 pm

hiflyeras wrote:
TransWorldOne wrote:
DL's transatlantic routes out of SEA seem to be more developed and can support larger aircraft (333's, 777's) and multiple frequencies.

I believe they've handed all of their SEA-TATL routes off to their 'joint venture' partners except AMS.

If by "all" you mean "one" (SEA-LHR), then yes.

PlanesNTrains · Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:04 pm

Interesting. I thought AF replaced DL on SEACDG but they both operate. Cool.

timf · Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:23 pm

jumbojet wrote:
hkcanadaexpat wrote:
questions wrote:
When are the A339s expected to be delivered?

Latest schedule shows the first (4) in 2020.

what schedule are you referring to? The only thing I've seen printed for the A330-900's is from the Delta Newsroom where it says 2019.

Airbus A330neo (A330-900)
The widebody A330-900neo, an enhancement of Airbus' successful A330 family featuring greater aerodynamic and economic efficiency, will be deployed on medium-haul trans-Atlantic markets as well as select routes connecting the U.S. West Coast and Asia. The aircraft are scheduled to enter the Delta fleet in 2019 and will deliver a 20 percent operating cost savings per seat over the Boeing 767-300ER aircraft it will replace.

Raises another question, will they come delivered with the DL suites? I am sure they will....

It's in their Annual Report from Feb. 23, 2018, page 21 (PDF page 27).

https://ir.delta.com/stock-and-financia ... d=12574815

Aircraft Purchase Commitments | Delivery in Calendar Year Ending
A330-900neo | 2018: - | 2019: - | 2020: 4 | After 2020: 21 | Total: 25

hiflyeras · Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:25 pm

They originally had three TATL from SEA...LHR, AMS and CDG. The only one left operated by DL is AMS.

PlanesNTrains · Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:33 pm

hiflyeras wrote:
They originally had three TATL from SEA...LHR, AMS and CDG. The only one left operated by DL is AMS.

Well I just did a random flight search for SEACDG and AF and DL both showed nonstops and they departed 3 hours apart.

questions · Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:39 pm

timf wrote:
It's in their Annual Report from Feb. 23, 2018, page 21 (PDF page 27).

https://ir.delta.com/stock-and-financia ... d=12574815

Aircraft Purchase Commitments | Delivery in Calendar Year Ending
A330-900neo | 2018: - | 2019: - | 2020: 4 | After 2020: 21 | Total: 25

Thanks.

While the 767s still have some flying left in them they will eventually need to be replaced. There is a gap between current number of 767s and A330/A350 commitments.

1) Do the orders run past what is published in the annual report, i.e., 2020?

2) Is there an anticipated widebody order to close the gap?

FSDan · Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:59 pm

hiflyeras wrote:
They originally had three TATL from SEA...LHR, AMS and CDG. The only one left operated by DL is AMS.

You are incorrect. DL operates SEA-CDG 1x daily and SEA-AMS 2x daily. They did previously operate SEA-LHR 1x daily, which has been handed over to VS. AF is adding SEA-CDG on top of DL's daily flight, not replacing it.

Freshside3 · Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:08 pm

Lots of complaints about the 767s used on SEA-NRT needing refurbishing, from some of the people who fly this route frequently.

hiflyeras · Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:36 pm

FSDan wrote:
hiflyeras wrote:
They originally had three TATL from SEA...LHR, AMS and CDG. The only one left operated by DL is AMS.

You are incorrect. DL operates SEA-CDG 1x daily and SEA-AMS 2x daily. They did previously operate SEA-LHR 1x daily, which has been handed over to VS. AF is adding SEA-CDG on top of DL's daily flight, not replacing it.

Thanks for clarifying....I didn't realize they'd both be still flying SEA-CDG. AF has gone big in local advertising...you'd think they had the route to themselves!

TransWorldOne · Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:42 pm

Freshside3 wrote:
Lots of complaints about the 767s used on SEA-NRT needing refurbishing, from some of the people who fly this route frequently.

Interesting as the 767's were completely refurbished
nose to tail a few years ago.

tlecam · Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:49 pm

Yes, very. I generally find that the 763 and the 330s are in good shape but that the 764 and the 772s are in need of a refurb.

Of course, mileage varies from plane to plane.

SESGDL · Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:50 pm

Freshside3 wrote:
Lots of complaints about the 767s used on SEA-NRT needing refurbishing, from some of the people who fly this route frequently.

And who are you that you get to field all of these complaints, or is this simply anecdotal? No one would ever know that the 767s are old, their interiors are immaculate.

Jeremy

wedgetail737 · Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:54 pm

FSDan wrote:
hiflyeras wrote:
They originally had three TATL from SEA...LHR, AMS and CDG. The only one left operated by DL is AMS.

You are incorrect. DL operates SEA-CDG 1x daily and SEA-AMS 2x daily. They did previously operate SEA-LHR 1x daily, which has been handed over to VS. AF is adding SEA-CDG on top of DL's daily flight, not replacing it.

AF has already started SEA-CDG with 777-200ER's back on March 18th. DL also uses the 777-200ER on the route as well, which just started recently as well. I only expect the 777's on the route during the peak season here.

panamair · Tue Apr 03, 2018 5:09 pm

SESGDL wrote:
Freshside3 wrote:
Lots of complaints about the 767s used on SEA-NRT needing refurbishing, from some of the people who fly this route frequently.

And who are you that you get to field all of these complaints, or is this simply anecdotal? No one would ever know that the 767s are old, their interiors are immaculate.

Jeremy

The only issue I can think of with the 763ERs out of SEA is the 76Ts that are now dedicated to the SEA TPAC operation. The 76Ts were the first ones to get the mods back in 2011 whereas all the other 763ERs got their mods done in 2012-2013; the main difference between the 'T's and the rest is that the PTVs in Y are the older version (i.e., the older smaller screens from the 'Song' days - same as the ones on the 764, 75H and domestic 763s - whereas the non-76T ERs got the newer larger Panasonic ones that are now standard on all 76L/76Z/A330).

In general, I fly the 76Ls and 76Zs almost weekly and they are in pretty good shape; I haven't been on a 76T in a few years though.

Sightseer · Tue Apr 03, 2018 5:15 pm

wedgetail737 wrote:
AF has already started SEA-CDG with 777-200ER's back on March 18th. DL also uses the 777-200ER on the route as well, which just started recently as well. I only expect the 777's on the route during the peak season here.

DL also is now using the 777 on SEA-HKG, with CDG serving as the bridge to get the plane to SEA. So if, or when, HKG sees an equipment change, CDG probably will too.

MSPNWA · Tue Apr 03, 2018 6:17 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
I don't know passenger counts but the respective annual reports show Pacific passenger revenue of $2,366 million in 2017 and $678 million in 2008. No, I don't think fares are up 250%.

In 2Q 2008 alone NW reported $576m in Pacific revenue. That would imply that NW's revenue alone in 2008 was about the same to possibly slightly higher than the combined airline today.

TransWorldOne wrote:
Interesting as the 767's were completely refurbished
nose to tail a few years ago.

It's now been 4-6+ years for the 767 fleet. Even the 76Zs are showing their age. They aren't new anymore, and the product itself is also outdated.

SESGDL wrote:
And who are you that you get to field all of these complaints, or is this simply anecdotal? No one would ever know that the 767s are old, their interiors are immaculate.

Does it matter? It's not a secret that the 767 interiors are not in the best of shape. They're showing their age, and the product is on the low end too. An upgrade would be highly welcome to the SEA TPAC network.

flybynight · Tue Apr 03, 2018 6:32 pm

deltal1011man wrote:
flybynight wrote:
deltal1011man wrote:
It would be fairly hard to find a 777 from 1990-1992...... (or in the case of the Gulf Air birds going away a 777 without FADEC engines)

Well since the 777 went into operation ( I believe UA was the launch customer) around '95 or '96, there aren't going to be any from 1990!!

thats my point.

the 767s leaving are older than the 777 fleet. No 767 of similar age is currently planned to be parked.

OK, I understand what you were saying now.

Yeah, the 767's from SEA are a mix in age. Some are mid 90's vintage and a few are late 90's to about 2001.
So definitely some miles left in those birds.

flybynight · Tue Apr 03, 2018 6:34 pm

SESGDL wrote:
Freshside3 wrote:
Lots of complaints about the 767s used on SEA-NRT needing refurbishing, from some of the people who fly this route frequently.

And who are you that you get to field all of these complaints, or is this simply anecdotal? No one would ever know that the 767s are old, their interiors are immaculate.

Jeremy

The last DL 763ER I was on from DL seemed perfectly fine with a decent interior. I still find the 767 interior layout one of the best with 2x3x2 seating. I wish this was more common.
Maybe the 797 will eventually have this as well if it remains a wide body configuration .

TransWorldOne · Tue Apr 03, 2018 7:33 pm

I often wonder how DL does on its TPAC out of SEA. The fact that no routes have been upgauged in the years since they've been launched (save for HKG which was badly needed due to the operational issues the A332 had on the route), leads me to believe that demand has remained pretty stagnant. All other airlines offering TPAC flights out of SEA utilize larger aircraft and some, like Eva Air, even operate multiple frequencies. Perhaps DL just needs to let these routes mature. Either way, I hope their SEA hub is successful long term. It's great to have a Global US carrier operating a hub at Sea-tac.

wedgetail737 · Tue Apr 03, 2018 8:29 pm

TransWorldOne wrote:
I often wonder how DL does on its TPAC out of SEA. The fact that no routes have been upgauged in the years since they've been launched (save for HKG which was badly needed due to the operational issues the A332 had on the route), leads me to believe that demand has remained pretty stagnant. All other airlines offering TPAC flights out of SEA utilize larger aircraft and some, like Eva Air, even operate multiple frequencies. Perhaps DL just needs to let these routes mature. Either way, I hope their SEA hub is successful long term. It's great to have a Global US carrier operating a hub at Sea-tac.

SEA-NRT has been served by other types like the A330 and 744. So DL's SEA-NRT service had been downgauged over time. SEA-HKG just started with the 77E, but I think it will go back to a 332 after September or October.

FSDan · Tue Apr 03, 2018 8:41 pm

wedgetail737 wrote:
TransWorldOne wrote:
I often wonder how DL does on its TPAC out of SEA. The fact that no routes have been upgauged in the years since they've been launched (save for HKG which was badly needed due to the operational issues the A332 had on the route), leads me to believe that demand has remained pretty stagnant. All other airlines offering TPAC flights out of SEA utilize larger aircraft and some, like Eva Air, even operate multiple frequencies. Perhaps DL just needs to let these routes mature. Either way, I hope their SEA hub is successful long term. It's great to have a Global US carrier operating a hub at Sea-tac.

SEA-NRT has been served by other types like the A330 and 744. So DL's SEA-NRT service had been downgauged over time.

As DL has trimmed destinations from NRT over the years, it makes sense that SEA-NRT would be reduced to mostly O&D, while connections to mainland Asia have been shifted to the various nonstop options and perhaps some over KE's ICN hub.

SEA's TPAC service is pretty impressive compared to what it used to be. Here's a summary for a Monday this coming June (6/18):

DL SEA-NRT 763
NH SEA-NRT 789
DL SEA-ICN 763
KE SEA-ICN 77W
OZ SEA-ICN 772
DL SEA-PEK 763
HU SEA-PEK 333
DL SEA-PVG 763
HU SEA-PVG 789
BR SEA-TPE 77W
MF SEA-SZX-XMN 788
DL SEA-HKG 772

In contrast to SFO and LAX, almost all TPAC flights from SEA leave between late morning and late afternoon. The only night flight is BR to TPE. LAX and SFO have dozens of flights to Asia leaving in the wee hours of the morning.

deltal1011man · Tue Apr 03, 2018 8:56 pm

TransWorldOne wrote:
I often wonder how DL does on its TPAC out of SEA. The fact that no routes have been upgauged in the years since they've been launched (save for HKG which was badly needed due to the operational issues the A332 had on the route), leads me to believe that demand has remained pretty stagnant. All other airlines offering TPAC flights out of SEA utilize larger aircraft and some, like Eva Air, even operate multiple frequencies. Perhaps DL just needs to let these routes mature. Either way, I hope their SEA hub is successful long term. It's great to have a Global US carrier operating a hub at Sea-tac.

Two things
1) Delta has made it clear they aren't doing any adding till the new FIS is done. Right now at peak hours it is a s**tshow to say the least.
2) Delta is using the highest J to Y ratio aircraft they can out of SEA. Any other fleet types will take J seats out of the market.

My money is on the 339 taking over PEK/PVG/ICN and possibly NRT when they come online which will be about the same time as the new FIS opens.

I'd also bet the 76T fleet then gets converted to 76Zs.

TransWorldOne · Tue Apr 03, 2018 9:12 pm

deltal1011man wrote:
TransWorldOne wrote:
I often wonder how DL does on its TPAC out of SEA. The fact that no routes have been upgauged in the years since they've been launched (save for HKG which was badly needed due to the operational issues the A332 had on the route), leads me to believe that demand has remained pretty stagnant. All other airlines offering TPAC flights out of SEA utilize larger aircraft and some, like Eva Air, even operate multiple frequencies. Perhaps DL just needs to let these routes mature. Either way, I hope their SEA hub is successful long term. It's great to have a Global US carrier operating a hub at Sea-tac.

Two things
1) Delta has made it clear they aren't doing any adding till the new FIS is done. Right now at peak hours it is a s**tshow to say the least.
2) Delta is using the highest J to Y ratio aircraft they can out of SEA. Any other fleet types will take J seats out of the market.

My money is on the 339 taking over PEK/PVG/ICN and possibly NRT when they come online which will be about the same time as the new FIS opens.

I'd also bet the 76T fleet then gets converted to 76Zs.

Do you really think the crowded FIS facility at SEA is really whats keeping DL from upgauging or adding more flights? It certainly hasn't stopped other airlines from adding flights. I think that if Delta saw the opportunity to make more money they would add or upgauge, regardless of the conditions of the FIS facility. There seem to be a lot of ppl around here that think that DL is holding off on a slew of new SEA-Asia routes until the new facility is complete and I really just don't think that that is the case at all.

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