Currently the Lufthansa fleet is composed of:
14 Airbus A380-800
19 Boeing 747-8i
13 Boeing 747-400
13 Airbus A340-600
16 Airbus A340-300
19 Airbus A330-300
8 Airbus A350-900XWB

The A380, A359, B744, B748, A343 have a strong use in the routes where they operate, the A346 operate little routes since they will be replaced by the A350, but what will happen with the replacements of the A343 are already very old and the destinations where Do they need more depanda like Detroit, Atlanta, Philadelphia among many, why not replace the A343 first? and in the future with which models will be replaced I think Lufthansa needs more A350 and return routes like Calgary, Guangzhou, Hyderabad, Kuala Lumpur, Manila, Muscat - Abu Dhabi, Portland, Santiago de Chile, Kolkata

Routes like Guangzhou, Kuala Lumpur, Manila and Santiago can be operated the A346

and from Munich they need to return to destinations such as Sao Paulo, Osaka, Bangkok and add new routes such as Buenos Aires and Johannesburg that can also be operated by the A346 while the new A359 arrives

Use of fleet for this summer 2018:

routes of the Airbus A380-800

FRA-SFO
MUC-LAX
FRA - IAH
FRA-MIA
FRA-JFK
FRA-DEL
FRA-SIN
MUC-HKG
MUC-PEK
FRA-PVG

Routes of the Boeing 747-8i

FRA EZE
FRA GRU
FRA GIG
FRA HND
FRA MEX
FRA LAX
FRA JFK
FRA BOS
FRA ORD
FRA IAD
FRA BLR
FRA JNB

Routes of the Boeing 747-400

FRA MCO
FRA SEA
FRA DEN
FRA YYZ
FRA KIX
FRA BOM
FRA YVR
FRA DXB
FRA IKA
FRA PVG
FRA BOS

Routes of the Airbus A340-300

FRA ATL
FRA BKK
FRA BOG
FRA CPT
FRA CUN
FRA MRU
FRA MLE
FRA MAA
FRA DTW
FRA NBO
FRA NGO
FRA NKG
FRA PTY
FRA PHL
FRA TAO
FRA SAN
FRA SJC
FRA SJO
FRA SHE
FRA TPA
FRA IAD

Routes of the Airbus A350-900XWB

MUC ORD
MUC EWR
MUC DEN
MUC YVR
MUC SIN
MUC BOS
MUC HND
MUC BOM
MUC DEL

Routes of the Airbus A340-600

FRA ICN
FRA HKG
FRA PEK
FRA LAX
MUC MEX
MUC SFO
MUC JFK
MUC EWR
MUC IAD

Routes of the Airbus A330-300

FRA YUL
FRA DFW
EWR DUS
FRA LOS SSG
FRA ABV PHC
FRA LAD
FRA RUH DMM
FRA JED
FRA JED ADD
FRA KWI BAH
FRA ALA
FRA TSE
MUC YYZ
MUC YUL
MUC MIA
MUC CLT
MUC RUH
MUC ORD

Because the operating costs of the A343 are better than the A346. Hopefully 787s will replace them.

The have already ordered tons of A350 plus 777-9. No need for more.

Have they switched FRA-ICN to the A346 already? Flew on it last month and it was a B744. ICN-MUC was a A346.

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

Currently the Lufthansa fleet is composed of:
14 Airbus A380-800
19 Boeing 747-8i
13 Boeing 747-400
13 Airbus A340-600
16 Airbus A340-300
19 Airbus A330-300
8 Airbus A350-900XWB

No wonder LH it´s one of the most loved airlines by aviation enthusiasts
Such a big and diverse fleet of wide bodies, most of which are 4 engined!

Blerg wrote:

Have they switched FRA-ICN to the A346 already? Flew on it last month and it was a B744. ICN-MUC was a A346.

Asiana Airlines will maintain the service of its A380 to Frankfurt throughout the year and not to have overcapacity Lufthansa will use an A346 soon

They can keep using the A340-600, quite a bit more economical than the 747-400.

seahawk wrote:

Because the operating costs of the A343 are better than the A346. Hopefully 787s will replace them.

The A340-600 is also bigger. Regarding the 787, you missed me there. Does LH have 787 on order?

Cannot wait for LH ordering some 351s...

mjoelnir wrote:

seahawk wrote:

Because the operating costs of the A343 are better than the A346. Hopefully 787s will replace them.

The A340-600 is also bigger. Regarding the 787, you missed me there. Does LH have 787 on order?

They need something to replace the A343 in the medium term. A350s are a bit big, especially if you look at the whole group and the other older types.

Noshow wrote:

The have already ordered tons of A350 plus 777-9. No need for more.

the 24 A346 will be replaced by the 25 A350-900 ordered all will operate in Munich, the B777-9 will replace the B744 and add capacity in Munich, now what will happen to the old and deficient A343 ???? obviously they need to be replaced and an order should be made soon

A330 have taken over some duties. Plus there is the A380 on top.
Today Lufthansa moves significant business to subsidiaries like Eurowings as well. (including their A340)

Noshow wrote:

The have already ordered tons of A350 plus 777-9. No need for more.

talk is about more A350 and less 777X.

LH is pretty careful about having the right sizes available to match (variable) demand.

seahawk wrote:

mjoelnir wrote:

seahawk wrote:

Because the operating costs of the A343 are better than the A346. Hopefully 787s will replace them.

The A340-600 is also bigger. Regarding the 787, you missed me there. Does LH have 787 on order?

They need something to replace the A343 in the medium term. A350s are a bit big, especially if you look at the whole group and the other older types.

A339@251t probably a 1:1 fit.

It will be interesting to see what LH do with their fleet in the medium term.

It seems to have a very diverse fleet overall, which is likely going to be more focused around the A350 moving forward. It is at a size that allows it to be quite versatile, with further upside with the -1000 model also on offer.

The 779 will have a role at the higher end of capacity requirements, but there does appear to be scope to reduce the order to fit a more specialised role.

I also see opportunities for the A339, but to just what role it will play, along with how many it will require, that is certainly not clear yet.

seahawk wrote:

mjoelnir wrote:

seahawk wrote:

Because the operating costs of the A343 are better than the A346. Hopefully 787s will replace them.

The A340-600 is also bigger. Regarding the 787, you missed me there. Does LH have 787 on order?

They need something to replace the A343 in the medium term. A350s are a bit big, especially if you look at the whole group and the other older types.

LH has already looked at 787 and decided against it. Not that the door is closed forever, but the range/payload of A359 works better for an airline of LHs caliber.

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

now what will happen to the old and deficient A343 ???? obviously they need to be replaced and an order should be made soon

Why? They work ok for LH as a group. Don't be suprised if they will be ESG'd

Blotto wrote:

Why? They work ok for LH as a group. Don't be surprised if they will be ESG'd

How many hours/cycles have the A343 at LH accumulated on average?
Usually LH loves their planes to death.

seahawk wrote:

mjoelnir wrote:

seahawk wrote:

Because the operating costs of the A343 are better than the A346. Hopefully 787s will replace them.

The A340-600 is also bigger. Regarding the 787, you missed me there. Does LH have 787 on order?

They need something to replace the A343 in the medium term. A350s are a bit big, especially if you look at the whole group and the other older types.

Very nice case for the A330neo. Easy to move pilots and service personal over.

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

Noshow wrote:

The have already ordered tons of A350 plus 777-9. No need for more.

the 24 A346 will be replaced by the 25 A350-900 ordered all will operate in Munich, the B777-9 will replace the B744 and add capacity in Munich, now what will happen to the old and deficient A343 ???? obviously they need to be replaced and an order should be made soon

The 343 is deficient as in equally or even slightly more efficient than the 777-200ER?
I don’t really get the point of the thread, tbh.

Has LH handed all FRA-EWR traffic over to UA?
I didn't see that route in your listing at all and as far as I remember last summer they flew at least one daily B748.

Didn't UA announce they'd be using their new B77Ws on that route?

lugie wrote:

Has LH handed all FRA-EWR traffic over to UA?
I didn't see that route in your listing at all and as far as I remember last summer they flew at least one daily B748.

Didn't UA announce they'd be using their new B77Ws on that route?

If I'm missing Lufthansa operates with Boeing 747-8i FRA-EWR, and effectively United will operate FRA-EWR with its flagship Boeing 777-300ER

Nicoeddf wrote:

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

Noshow wrote:

The have already ordered tons of A350 plus 777-9. No need for more.

the 24 A346 will be replaced by the 25 A350-900 ordered all will operate in Munich, the B777-9 will replace the B744 and add capacity in Munich, now what will happen to the old and deficient A343 ???? obviously they need to be replaced and an order should be made soon

The 343 is deficient as in equally or even slightly more efficient than the 777-200ER?
I don’t really get the point of the thread, tbh.

WHAT! the boeing 777 completely annihilates the production of the A340! more than 1500 Boeing 777 were built while the A340 only 375, many airlines preferred the Boeing 777 than the A340, by the way the majority of the airlines withdrew their A340 in less than 10 years, the A340 only survive because of the low cost of the fuel

FRA BKK is also an A380 Route.

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

Nicoeddf wrote:

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

the 24 A346 will be replaced by the 25 A350-900 ordered all will operate in Munich, the B777-9 will replace the B744 and add capacity in Munich, now what will happen to the old and deficient A343 ???? obviously they need to be replaced and an order should be made soon

The 343 is deficient as in equally or even slightly more efficient than the 777-200ER?
I don’t really get the point of the thread, tbh.

WHAT! the boeing 777 completely annihilates the production of the A340! more than 1500 Boeing 777 were built while the A340 only 375, many airlines preferred the Boeing 777 than the A340, by the way the majority of the airlines withdrew their A340 in less than 10 years, the A340 only survive because of the low cost of the fuel

I suggest differentiating, lieber Rainer.

The 777-300ER was a significantly superior aircraft to the 340NG series - there is no doubt.
The 777-200ER and the A340-300 are pretty much equal when it comes to operating and ownership cost vs. revenue potential.

Hence your argument, that LH needs to find a quick replacement for the 340-300s is not valid. It is a competitive platform in the same way as the 777-200ER.

But I sense your username might bias you slightly...

Nicoeddf wrote:

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

Nicoeddf wrote:

The 343 is deficient as in equally or even slightly more efficient than the 777-200ER?
I don’t really get the point of the thread, tbh.

WHAT! the boeing 777 completely annihilates the production of the A340! more than 1500 Boeing 777 were built while the A340 only 375, many airlines preferred the Boeing 777 than the A340, by the way the majority of the airlines withdrew their A340 in less than 10 years, the A340 only survive because of the low cost of the fuel

I suggest differentiating, lieber Rainer.

The 777-300ER was a significantly superior aircraft to the 340NG series - there is no doubt.
The 777-200ER and the A340-300 are pretty much equal when it comes to operating and ownership cost vs. revenue potential.

Hence your argument, that LH needs to find a quick replacement for the 340-300s is not valid. It is a competitive platform in the same way as the 777-200ER.

But I sense your username might bias you slightly...

So why did most of the Airbus A340-300 operators look for replacement so fast? Singapore Airlines, Emirates, Virgin Atlantic, Swiss, Iberia, among others, looking for more efficient aircraft? At least Air France has a considerable Boeing 777-200ER fleet and they are still all active after 20 years, while the A340-300 disappeared quickly even as the decade of 2010 was already being replaced, and at the time of the four-engine pass, And I think that the Boeing 777-200ER was almost the same performance as the A343, because they are still doing long-range routes today? In any case the fleet of A343 is very old already and needs to be replaced by two more fuel-efficient twin engines and in range

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

Nicoeddf wrote:

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

WHAT! the boeing 777 completely annihilates the production of the A340! more than 1500 Boeing 777 were built while the A340 only 375, many airlines preferred the Boeing 777 than the A340, by the way the majority of the airlines withdrew their A340 in less than 10 years, the A340 only survive because of the low cost of the fuel

I suggest differentiating, lieber Rainer.

The 777-300ER was a significantly superior aircraft to the 340NG series - there is no doubt.
The 777-200ER and the A340-300 are pretty much equal when it comes to operating and ownership cost vs. revenue potential.

Hence your argument, that LH needs to find a quick replacement for the 340-300s is not valid. It is a competitive platform in the same way as the 777-200ER.

But I sense your username might bias you slightly...

So why did most of the Airbus A340-300 operators look for replacement so fast? Singapore Airlines, Emirates, Virgin Atlantic, Swiss, Iberia, among others, looking for more efficient aircraft? At least Air France has a considerable Boeing 777-200ER fleet and they are still all active after 20 years, while the A340-300 disappeared quickly even as the decade of 2010 was already being replaced, and at the time of the four-engine pass, And I think that the Boeing 777-200ER was almost the same performance as the A343, because they are still doing long-range routes today? In any case the fleet of A343 is very old already and needs to be replaced by two more fuel-efficient twin engines and in range

At least for Singapore airlines is an easy answer, Boeing bought the A340-300 of them to sell them the 777-200.
When Emirates got rid of their A340-300 they were 17 to 18 years old. They do not fly a 777 longer either.
At Virgin Atlantic they were wfu 16 to 19 years old.
At Swiss they are still in use.
At Iberia the youngest was sold on 14 years old, the oldest was 20 years old when it was scrapped.

We see similar ages when 777-200 are scraped, what is your point?

I can see LH ordering a few A339s to replace the A343s within a few years, as both would seem to be similar in capacity (obviously depending on configuration).

Or LH could follow a similar route they have with Eurowings and acquire used A333s coming off of leases.

It would depend if LH wants cheaper acquisition costs that would come with used A330s or a younger fleet and better fuel efficiency that would come with the A330neo.

LH has a heart for underdogs:
A346, A380, 748 (and 77X )...

Runway28L wrote:

I can see LH ordering a few A339s to replace the A343s within a few years, as both would seem to be similar in capacity (obviously depending on configuration).

Or LH could follow a similar route they have with Eurowings and acquire used A333s coming off of leases.

It would depend if LH wants cheaper acquisition costs that would come with used A330s or a younger fleet and better fuel efficiency that would come with the A330neo.

In 2014 LH ruled out a A330NEO purchase, but said that the 787 was under consideration, but that a plane of that size was not an urgent decision to be made. But then the real performance of the NEO seems to be better than LH expected at the time.

I contend LH group will do a split order:

About 30 B789/78J for LX and OS.
About 30 A339/A359/A35K for LH mainline.

They will stick with 20 B779 as a 1:1 B744 replacement but don't expect more in the short term until they retire the B748/A388 if there is no NEO for the latter. LH might be a launch customer for the B777-10X should there be no A388neo.

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

Nicoeddf wrote:

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

WHAT! the boeing 777 completely annihilates the production of the A340! more than 1500 Boeing 777 were built while the A340 only 375, many airlines preferred the Boeing 777 than the A340, by the way the majority of the airlines withdrew their A340 in less than 10 years, the A340 only survive because of the low cost of the fuel

I suggest differentiating, lieber Rainer.

The 777-300ER was a significantly superior aircraft to the 340NG series - there is no doubt.
The 777-200ER and the A340-300 are pretty much equal when it comes to operating and ownership cost vs. revenue potential.

Hence your argument, that LH needs to find a quick replacement for the 340-300s is not valid. It is a competitive platform in the same way as the 777-200ER.

But I sense your username might bias you slightly...

So why did most of the Airbus A340-300 operators look for replacement so fast? Singapore Airlines, Emirates, Virgin Atlantic, Swiss, Iberia, among others, looking for more efficient aircraft? At least Air France has a considerable Boeing 777-200ER fleet and they are still all active after 20 years, while the A340-300 disappeared quickly even as the decade of 2010 was already being replaced, and at the time of the four-engine pass, And I think that the Boeing 777-200ER was almost the same performance as the A343, because they are still doing long-range routes today? In any case the fleet of A343 is very old already and needs to be replaced by two more fuel-efficient twin engines and in range

That is because "most" in this circumstance means...uhm, Singapore Airlines.
Seriously dude, don't let your bias blind you for reason. The 343 and 772ER are equal planes. What made the 777 this overwhelming and well deserved success was the 77W.

Yes, the 343s need replacement. In the same timeframe 772 get replaced.
And the 359 will do the job nicely, as would a 339 or 789.

So again, I am not sure what exactly we are discussing?

The A339 is about as good as it gets for an A343 replacement, and with LH already operating the A333 it makes sense for the family to continue.

mjoelnir wrote:

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

Nicoeddf wrote:

I suggest differentiating, lieber Rainer.

The 777-300ER was a significantly superior aircraft to the 340NG series - there is no doubt.
The 777-200ER and the A340-300 are pretty much equal when it comes to operating and ownership cost vs. revenue potential.

Hence your argument, that LH needs to find a quick replacement for the 340-300s is not valid. It is a competitive platform in the same way as the 777-200ER.

But I sense your username might bias you slightly...

So why did most of the Airbus A340-300 operators look for replacement so fast? Singapore Airlines, Emirates, Virgin Atlantic, Swiss, Iberia, among others, looking for more efficient aircraft? At least Air France has a considerable Boeing 777-200ER fleet and they are still all active after 20 years, while the A340-300 disappeared quickly even as the decade of 2010 was already being replaced, and at the time of the four-engine pass, And I think that the Boeing 777-200ER was almost the same performance as the A343, because they are still doing long-range routes today? In any case the fleet of A343 is very old already and needs to be replaced by two more fuel-efficient twin engines and in range

At least for Singapore airlines is an easy answer, Boeing bought the A340-300 of them to sell them the 777-200.
When Emirates got rid of their A340-300 they were 17 to 18 years old. They do not fly a 777 longer either.
At Virgin Atlantic they were wfu 16 to 19 years old.
At Swiss they are still in use.
At Iberia the youngest was sold on 14 years old, the oldest was 20 years old when it was scrapped.

We see similar ages when 777-200 are scraped, what is your point?

Are you claiming that the A343 is a better aircraft than the 772ER? That would be crazy considering that 218 A343's were delivered while Boeing has delivered 510 772's so far. The 777 killed the A340 program completely, there is really no disputing that.

ual747den wrote:

mjoelnir wrote:

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

So why did most of the Airbus A340-300 operators look for replacement so fast? Singapore Airlines, Emirates, Virgin Atlantic, Swiss, Iberia, among others, looking for more efficient aircraft? At least Air France has a considerable Boeing 777-200ER fleet and they are still all active after 20 years, while the A340-300 disappeared quickly even as the decade of 2010 was already being replaced, and at the time of the four-engine pass, And I think that the Boeing 777-200ER was almost the same performance as the A343, because they are still doing long-range routes today? In any case the fleet of A343 is very old already and needs to be replaced by two more fuel-efficient twin engines and in range

At least for Singapore airlines is an easy answer, Boeing bought the A340-300 of them to sell them the 777-200.
When Emirates got rid of their A340-300 they were 17 to 18 years old. They do not fly a 777 longer either.
At Virgin Atlantic they were wfu 16 to 19 years old.
At Swiss they are still in use.
At Iberia the youngest was sold on 14 years old, the oldest was 20 years old when it was scrapped.

We see similar ages when 777-200 are scraped, what is your point?

Are you claiming that the A343 is a better aircraft than the 772ER? That would be crazy considering that 218 A343's were delivered while Boeing has delivered 510 772's so far. The 777 killed the A340 program completely, there is really no disputing that.

The only thing I am saying in that post is, that A340-300 get scraped at about the same age.

To your comment, A340-300 and the A330-300 are the same frame with different engines. Sold together 877.

ual747den wrote:

mjoelnir wrote:

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

So why did most of the Airbus A340-300 operators look for replacement so fast? Singapore Airlines, Emirates, Virgin Atlantic, Swiss, Iberia, among others, looking for more efficient aircraft? At least Air France has a considerable Boeing 777-200ER fleet and they are still all active after 20 years, while the A340-300 disappeared quickly even as the decade of 2010 was already being replaced, and at the time of the four-engine pass, And I think that the Boeing 777-200ER was almost the same performance as the A343, because they are still doing long-range routes today? In any case the fleet of A343 is very old already and needs to be replaced by two more fuel-efficient twin engines and in range

At least for Singapore airlines is an easy answer, Boeing bought the A340-300 of them to sell them the 777-200.
When Emirates got rid of their A340-300 they were 17 to 18 years old. They do not fly a 777 longer either.
At Virgin Atlantic they were wfu 16 to 19 years old.
At Swiss they are still in use.
At Iberia the youngest was sold on 14 years old, the oldest was 20 years old when it was scrapped.

We see similar ages when 777-200 are scraped, what is your point?

Are you claiming that the A343 is a better aircraft than the 772ER? That would be crazy considering that 218 A343's were delivered while Boeing has delivered 510 772's so far. The 777 killed the A340 program completely, there is really no disputing that.

So, where I went to school, none of what mjoelnir said leads remotely to the conclusion, that the 343 was a better plane.
Ans discounting the 330 in the picture, makes the whole thing even more absurd.
But if it makes you sleep better...yeaaaaaah, the 777 rocked the industry and game changed it. Like the 787

rheinwaldner wrote:

LH has a heart for underdogs:
A346, A380, 748 (and 77X )...

LH was/is the ultimate fortress of the 4 holer.

With the advent of the A350/777X, the fortress is crumbling.

ual747den wrote:

mjoelnir wrote:

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

So why did most of the Airbus A340-300 operators look for replacement so fast? Singapore Airlines, Emirates, Virgin Atlantic, Swiss, Iberia, among others, looking for more efficient aircraft? At least Air France has a considerable Boeing 777-200ER fleet and they are still all active after 20 years, while the A340-300 disappeared quickly even as the decade of 2010 was already being replaced, and at the time of the four-engine pass, And I think that the Boeing 777-200ER was almost the same performance as the A343, because they are still doing long-range routes today? In any case the fleet of A343 is very old already and needs to be replaced by two more fuel-efficient twin engines and in range

At least for Singapore airlines is an easy answer, Boeing bought the A340-300 of them to sell them the 777-200.
When Emirates got rid of their A340-300 they were 17 to 18 years old. They do not fly a 777 longer either.
At Virgin Atlantic they were wfu 16 to 19 years old.
At Swiss they are still in use.
At Iberia the youngest was sold on 14 years old, the oldest was 20 years old when it was scrapped.

We see similar ages when 777-200 are scraped, what is your point?

Are you claiming that the A343 is a better aircraft than the 772ER? That would be crazy considering that 218 A343's were delivered while Boeing has delivered 510 772's so far. The 777 killed the A340 program completely, there is really no disputing that.

It is not about buying a new plane, it is about operating old planes. And depending on the engine choice on your 777-200ER the A343 is competitive or just slightly worse in fuel burn, but overhauling the CFMs is dirt cheap, spare parts are dirt cheap too. So if you have the A343 and still find use for it in your network, it makes as much sense to keep it flying, as keeping a 777-200ER flying. More so, if you transport cargo to hot and high destinations.

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

Currently the Lufthansa fleet is composed of:
14 Airbus A380-800
19 Boeing 747-8i
13 Boeing 747-400
13 Airbus A340-600
16 Airbus A340-300
19 Airbus A330-300
8 Airbus A350-900XWB

The A380, A359, B744, B748, A343 have a strong use in the routes where they operate, the A346 operate little routes since they will be replaced by the A350, but what will happen with the replacements of the A343 are already very old and the destinations where Do they need more depanda like Detroit, Atlanta, Philadelphia among many, why not replace the A343 first? and in the future with which models will be replaced I think Lufthansa needs more A350 and return routes like Calgary, Guangzhou, Hyderabad, Kuala Lumpur, Manila, Muscat - Abu Dhabi, Portland, Santiago de Chile, Kolkata

Routes like Guangzhou, Kuala Lumpur, Manila and Santiago can be operated the A346

and from Munich they need to return to destinations such as Sao Paulo, Osaka, Bangkok and add new routes such as Buenos Aires and Johannesburg that can also be operated by the A346 while the new A359 arrives

Use of fleet for this summer 2018:

routes of the Airbus A380-800

FRA-SFO
MUC-LAX
FRA - IAH
FRA-MIA
FRA-JFK
FRA-DEL
FRA-SIN
MUC-HKG
MUC-PEK
FRA-PVG

Routes of the Boeing 747-8i

FRA EZE
FRA GRU
FRA GIG
FRA HND
FRA MEX
FRA LAX
FRA JFK
FRA BOS
FRA ORD
FRA IAD
FRA BLR
FRA JNB

Routes of the Boeing 747-400

FRA MCO
FRA SEA
FRA DEN
FRA YYZ
FRA KIX
FRA BOM
FRA YVR
FRA DXB
FRA IKA
FRA PVG
FRA BOS

Routes of the Airbus A340-300

FRA ATL
FRA BKK
FRA BOG
FRA CPT
FRA CUN
FRA MRU
FRA MLE
FRA MAA
FRA DTW
FRA NBO
FRA NGO
FRA NKG
FRA PTY
FRA PHL
FRA TAO
FRA SAN
FRA SJC
FRA SJO
FRA SHE
FRA TPA
FRA IAD

Routes of the Airbus A350-900XWB

MUC ORD
MUC EWR
MUC DEN
MUC YVR
MUC SIN
MUC BOS
MUC HND
MUC BOM
MUC DEL

Routes of the Airbus A340-600

FRA ICN
FRA HKG
FRA PEK
FRA LAX
MUC MEX
MUC SFO
MUC JFK
MUC EWR
MUC IAD

Routes of the Airbus A330-300

FRA YUL
FRA DFW
EWR DUS
FRA LOS SSG
FRA ABV PHC
FRA LAD
FRA RUH DMM
FRA JED
FRA JED ADD
FRA KWI BAH
FRA ALA
FRA TSE
MUC YYZ
MUC YUL
MUC MIA
MUC CLT
MUC RUH
MUC ORD

Boeing 747-8i
FRA-EWR

Airbus A330-300
TXL-JFK

ual747den wrote:

Are you claiming that the A343 is a better aircraft than the 772ER? That would be crazy considering that 218 A343's were delivered while Boeing has delivered 510 772's so far. The 777 killed the A340 program completely, there is really no disputing that.

Lots of side channel competing from Boeing's side.
TWIN good QUAD bad, doing the Airbus thing: low balling on price and a one up by taking the competing product off the hands of the customers ...

I have changed the title and may I remind you that we do not need another useless B vs. A discussion, thanks.

InnsbruckFlyer wrote:

FRA BKK is also an A380 Route.

They are only used in the winter season

SQ22 wrote:

I have changed the title and may I remind you that we do not need another useless B vs. A discussion, thanks.

I'm so pleased that you did as it was a very weird title especially using the word ''flotation''!

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

WHAT! the boeing 777 completely annihilates the production of the A340! more than 1500 Boeing 777 were built while the A340 only 375, many airlines preferred the Boeing 777 than the A340, by the way the majority of the airlines withdrew their A340 in less than 10 years, the A340 only survive because of the low cost of the fuel

ual747den wrote:

Are you claiming that the A343 is a better aircraft than the 772ER? That would be crazy considering that 218 A343's were delivered while Boeing has delivered 510 772's so far. The 777 killed the A340 program completely, there is really no disputing that.

It is slightly misleading to only look at total numbers built. The A340-300 actually won more sales campaigns than the 777-200/200ER did. More airlines decided that the A340-300 was a better fit than the 777-200/200ER. The 777-200/200ER managed to win a bunch of major airlines who went on to order 50-ish aircraft, which is why it sold better overall. The 3 biggest 772 operators, UA, BA and AA, account for 167 aircraft alone, which is over 75% of the A340-300 production run.

If Airbus were to launch the stretched A35K, I'd rather have LH buy that instead of the 779, mainly for commonality reasons.

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

So why did most of the Airbus A340-300 operators look for replacement so fast? Singapore Airlines, Emirates, Virgin Atlantic, Swiss, Iberia, among others, looking for more efficient aircraft? At least Air France has a considerable Boeing 777-200ER fleet and they are still all active after 20 years, while the A340-300 disappeared quickly even as the decade of 2010 was already being replaced, and at the time of the four-engine pass, And I think that the Boeing 777-200ER was almost the same performance as the A343, because they are still doing long-range routes today? In any case the fleet of A343 is very old already and needs to be replaced by two more fuel-efficient twin engines and in range

Because a suitable and economically feasible replacements are being offered and both Airbus and Boeing are pushing these replacement models.
- A340-500/600 fleets are almost entirely replaced except in cases where their performance is unmatched (Iberia comes to mind, fairly new frames, best for network) but eventually will be succeeded by A350-900/1000 or 777-8/9 once entry into service.
- 777-200ER's together with A340-300 are currently actively replaced due to A350-900 and 787-9 being significantly better
- 777-300ER is still strong as it is the golden standard still in under-VLA twin category, eventually will be replaced by A350-900/1000 and 777-8/9, even 787-10

https://centreforaviation.com/news/a340 ... bus-289676

And I'm sorry to break your bubble but A340-300, especially later models (313 f/e) are more economic (4-10% if memory serves me right) vis-à-vis 777-200ER between configurations/engines/OEW options + significantly lower maintenance costs on 4 engine A340-300 vs 777-200s 2 engine.

...

simfanatic wrote:

If Airbus were to launch the stretched A35K, I'd rather have LH buy that instead of the 779, mainly for commonality reasons.

Makes me wonder if Boeing thought that too and gave LH a deal they couldn't refuse on the 779.

People forget that fleet commonality is not that paramount at LH, as LH Technik provides services for nearly every type flying any way. They already have a full life cycle maintenance and support program in place for the 787 today. https://www.lufthansa-technik.com/de/787-services

So the only limitation for them is to have a subfleet big enough to warrant a pool of crews for the type, but apart from that they can operate nearly every type with very little additional cost.

ual747den wrote:

mjoelnir wrote:

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

So why did most of the Airbus A340-300 operators look for replacement so fast? Singapore Airlines, Emirates, Virgin Atlantic, Swiss, Iberia, among others, looking for more efficient aircraft? At least Air France has a considerable Boeing 777-200ER fleet and they are still all active after 20 years, while the A340-300 disappeared quickly even as the decade of 2010 was already being replaced, and at the time of the four-engine pass, And I think that the Boeing 777-200ER was almost the same performance as the A343, because they are still doing long-range routes today? In any case the fleet of A343 is very old already and needs to be replaced by two more fuel-efficient twin engines and in range

At least for Singapore airlines is an easy answer, Boeing bought the A340-300 of them to sell them the 777-200.
When Emirates got rid of their A340-300 they were 17 to 18 years old. They do not fly a 777 longer either.
At Virgin Atlantic they were wfu 16 to 19 years old.
At Swiss they are still in use.
At Iberia the youngest was sold on 14 years old, the oldest was 20 years old when it was scrapped.

We see similar ages when 777-200 are scraped, what is your point?

Are you claiming that the A343 is a better aircraft than the 772ER? That would be crazy considering that 218 A343's were delivered while Boeing has delivered 510 772's so far. The 777 killed the A340 program completely, there is really no disputing that.

Sorry, opinions are not facts despite what Trump thinks.

I think what killed the A340 was ETOPS, both the 777 and the A330 did very well from that.

Geoff

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

Nicoeddf wrote:

RainerBoeing777 wrote:

the 24 A346 will be replaced by the 25 A350-900 ordered all will operate in Munich, the B777-9 will replace the B744 and add capacity in Munich, now what will happen to the old and deficient A343 ???? obviously they need to be replaced and an order should be made soon

The 343 is deficient as in equally or even slightly more efficient than the 777-200ER?
I don’t really get the point of the thread, tbh.

WHAT! the boeing 777 completely annihilates the production of the A340! more than 1500 Boeing 777 were built while the A340 only 375, many airlines preferred the Boeing 777 than the A340, by the way the majority of the airlines withdrew their A340 in less than 10 years, the A340 only survive because of the low cost of the fuel

Airbus designed the A340/330-200/300 as one frame two possibilities, four engine and two engines. Same fuselage in two length, same wing designed for either two or four engines.That sold up to now 1,953 frames, no other wide body tops that.
When the A340/330 was designed ETOPS topped out at 120 minutes, ETOPS 180 came later, ETOPS 180 out of the box came with 777. You needed a three or four engine frame for longer distances over water or uninhibited land. There is still one authority that does not accept twins for those long flights.

Yes, the A340-500/600 was a failure, got only 131 orders. IMO because it came out heavily overweight, rather than being a quad.