A350-1000 Customer Orders and Routes

seat1a · Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:34 am

Just looking at a picture of the Airbus A350-1000 and it looks very impressive!

A PR from Airbus and the Wikipedia page says the Airbus has 169 orders. The list of 169 customers on Wiki breaks out the orders as follows:

Air Caraibes 3
Air Lease Corp 9
Asiana 10
British Airways 18
Cathay Pacific 20
Etihad 22
Iran Air 16
Japan Airlines 13
LATAM 12
Qatar 37
Virgin Atlantic 8
Undisclosed 1

Any folks out there care to guess what routes these airlines will fly (existing/upgauging capacity, new routes?). Thanks!

jfk777 · Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:42 am

Cathay is launching Hong Kong to Washington Dulles in the USA with is A350-1000 this fall. This is Cathay's longest route yet, and CX has some really long routes.

seat1a · Tue Feb 20, 2018 3:17 am

jfk777 wrote:
Cathay is launching Hong Kong to Washington Dulles in the USA with is A350-1000 this fall. This is Cathay's longest route yet, and CX has some really long routes.

Thank you. Can this aircraft perform on short-haul high density missions for Cathay? Say, HKG-Singapore/Tokyo/Manila/Bangkok?

azz767 · Tue Feb 20, 2018 3:20 am

VS are replacing 747’s and LGW and MAN bases + GLA & BFS w patterns. They will be doing the MCO and LAS from both. BGI, and other Caribbean from LGW, and possibly depending on how the A332’s help build the MAN base, on the more established USA routes like ATL SFO and maybe BOS, plus whatever they may add. I say my last point for two reasons, firstly, they may attract more premium pax and secondly, there is as far as I know only one fleet config for the 350’s, unlike the 744’s when they had a couple at LHR and I know the plan was for a couple to do the higher density LHR routes, and due to the standard config will allow for fleet rotation throughout the network.

tullamarine · Tue Feb 20, 2018 3:20 am

Cathay has also indicated that it will replace its sole remaining A333 service to SYD with an A35J. All other remaining A333 routes to AU ports will eventually be replaced by A359s or 77Ws.

FromCDGtoSYD · Tue Feb 20, 2018 3:51 am

Air Caraibes will fly them to FDF and PTP.
Asiana will likely upgauge non A380 start alliance hubs to A35K.

ba319-131 · Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:33 am

seat1a wrote:
jfk777 wrote:
Cathay is launching Hong Kong to Washington Dulles in the USA with is A350-1000 this fall. This is Cathay's longest route yet, and CX has some really long routes.

Thank you. Can this aircraft perform on short-haul high density missions for Cathay? Say, HKG-Singapore/Tokyo/Manila/Bangkok?

- I also found the aircraft on the HKG-BKK in October, so expect to see regional flying too.

81819 · Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:43 am

Qatar - everywhere!

pabloeing · Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:05 am

¿BA to LAX and SFO....maybe SYD?

Richard28 · Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:11 am

seat1a wrote:
Virgin Atlantic 8

VS are taking 12 A350-1000's, 8 will be purchased directly, and 4 leased.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... 0s-427197/

hkcanadaexpat · Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:19 am

Richard28 wrote:
seat1a wrote:
Virgin Atlantic 8

VS are taking 12 A350-1000's, 8 will be purchased directly, and 4 leased.
https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... 0s-427197/

The leased ones are coming from Air Lease so are included in those figures.

EGAD · Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:58 am

azz767 wrote:
VS are replacing 747’s and LGW and MAN bases + GLA & BFS w patterns. They will be doing the MCO and LAS from both. BGI, and other Caribbean from LGW, and possibly depending on how the A332’s help build the MAN base, on the more established USA routes like ATL SFO and maybe BOS, plus whatever they may add. I say my last point for two reasons, firstly, they may attract more premium pax and secondly, there is as far as I know only one fleet config for the 350’s, unlike the 744’s when they had a couple at LHR and I know the plan was for a couple to do the higher density LHR routes, and due to the standard config will allow for fleet rotation throughout the network.

That was the original plan. Now there will be two configs of 350, one for leisure markets from LGW replacing some 747's on the higher capacity routes and another config for the more premium LHR routes. No specific destinations have yet been named by the airline. (But MCO and LAS from LGW are fairly safe bets, as is LAX from LHR.)

Kadish · Tue Feb 20, 2018 1:38 pm

I see them working for Ib if their performance is ok in hight N hot airports un south América

cv990Coronado · Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:24 pm

If Virgin are going to have an LHR config I would not be surprised to see the A350 on the JNBLHR route. When I flew on their 789 in November it seems to need most of the runway for takeoff and it wasn't full. I would also think the additional capacity would be useful. I know the A359 is a good performer from JNB but I'm not sure how well the A350-1000 would perform? I would also think that LHRHKG would be a good route for it.

ikolkyo · Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:32 pm

cv990Coronado wrote:
If Virgin are going to have an LHR config I would not be surprised to see the A350 on the JNBLHR route. When I flew on their 789 in November it seems to need most of the runway for takeoff and it wasn't full. I would also think the additional capacity would be useful. I know the A359 is a good performer from JNB but I'm not sure how well the A350-1000 would perform? I would also think that LHRHKG would be a good route for it.

The 787-9 won’t always compute maximum performance for takeoff, most of the times if it has runway room available it will use it up to save on engine wear and tear.

EGAD · Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:48 pm

A35K is currently beating forecasted performance at hot and high runways.. I'm not sure how it compares to the 789 though.

http://aviationweek.com/singapore-airsh ... rket-hopes

bgm · Tue Feb 20, 2018 3:06 pm

EGAD wrote:
A35K is currently beating forecasted performance at hot and high runways.. I'm not sure how it compares to the 789 though.

http://aviationweek.com/singapore-airsh ... rket-hopes

That's excellent news. This plane really is going to be a game changer.

mjoelnir · Tue Feb 20, 2018 3:15 pm

cv990Coronado wrote:
If Virgin are going to have an LHR config I would not be surprised to see the A350 on the JNBLHR route. When I flew on their 789 in November it seems to need most of the runway for takeoff and it wasn't full. I would also think the additional capacity would be useful. I know the A359 is a good performer from JNB but I'm not sure how well the A350-1000 would perform? I would also think that LHRHKG would be a good route for it.

You can not judge the possibilities of a frame by how you feel the take off or how much of the runway it uses. If it is not necessary full thrust is not applied, so you use more of the runway than you strictly need to and you conserve the engines. The only thing you can go by are the numbers and that is something the crew knows about.

EddieDude · Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:10 pm

cv990Coronado wrote:
If Virgin are going to have an LHR config

I believe they have announced so. Some of the -1000s will be used on leisure routes as mentioned above (like LAS), while some others will have a more premium configuration and will be based at LHR. Maybe LHR-JFK will be a VS -1000 route? I would really love to fly the inaugural.

Arion640 · Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:28 pm

pabloeing wrote:
¿BA to LAX and SFO....maybe SYD?

Entirely possible. They will have the new club seat so they will probably want that to debut on the JFK route so I expect the A35K's may get rotated into those.

EddieDude · Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:53 pm

seat1a wrote:
Qatar 37

QR has indicated it may convert some A350-900 orders to the A350-1000.

yochai · Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:42 pm

CX switches HKG-TLV to 6xWeekly A35K + 1 A359 from 03OCT18

thgsr08 · Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:09 pm

JJ was supposed to replace their 77W with A35K, however they extended the lease of 6 of them with a small retrofit based on their 787/A350 business seat. We can guess new routes from GRU using both 77W/A35K.
First A35K is due to 2019.

LPSHobby · Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:20 pm

when will the first LATAM ones be delevired?

EPA001 · Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:28 pm

bgm wrote:
That's excellent news. This plane really is going to be a game changer.

I would not call it that. it is just the next step in the evolution of modern airliners. Also the A380 or B787 are no game changers in that sense to me. All new airplanes are changing the market, and thus the game step by step. And that is a good thing imho.

bzcat · Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:47 pm

1 undisclosed? Hemm...

VIP operator perhaps Qatari Govt?

Revelation · Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:49 pm

Leeham suggests that QR will up-guage some of its A359s to A35K:

https://leehamnews.com/2018/02/20/qatar ... -1000-buy/

AAB had lots of good things to say about Bregier on his last day at Airbus.

Bregier, who at times appeared a bit melancholy, said the wave of 777-300ER retirements will begin about 2022, which will boost demand for the slow-selling -1000. There are only 169 orders after a few airlines swapped the -1000 for the smaller -900 model.

Happy days to come for the A35K, but unfortunately for Bregier, he won't be in the CEO's chair to reap the rewards.

mcogator · Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:05 pm

azz767 wrote:
VS are replacing 747’s and LGW and MAN bases + GLA & BFS w patterns. They will be doing the MCO and LAS from both. BGI, and other Caribbean from LGW, and possibly depending on how the A332’s help build the MAN base, on the more established USA routes like ATL SFO and maybe BOS, plus whatever they may add. I say my last point for two reasons, firstly, they may attract more premium pax and secondly, there is as far as I know only one fleet config for the 350’s, unlike the 744’s when they had a couple at LHR and I know the plan was for a couple to do the higher density LHR routes, and due to the standard config will allow for fleet rotation throughout the network.

Will this MCO sight turn into all A35K? Or will they mix it with the A332?

https://www.instagram.com/p/Be_oCgnlLQZ/

TedToToe · Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:28 pm

Arion640 wrote:
They will have the new club seat so they will probably want that to debut on the JFK route so I expect the A35K's may get rotated into those.

I'm not so sure we will see BA use the A35K on the JFK route. First, they will want to use it on longer routes in order to maximise the return in terms of fuel savings. Second, I would expect the configuration to be premium heavy (J and W) but with fewer F seats than, say, their 744s or 77Ws; JFK has got the Super Hi-J 744 which is made to measure for that route. My guess would be that the A35K will displace the 77W on routes like HND, PVG, SIN and HKG and the 77W then replacing 744s on routes like PHX, SAN, LAS or SEA.

Arion640 · Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:48 pm

TedToToe wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
They will have the new club seat so they will probably want that to debut on the JFK route so I expect the A35K's may get rotated into those.

I'm not so sure we will see BA use the A35K on the JFK route. First, they will want to use it on longer routes in order to maximise the return in terms of fuel savings. Second, I would expect the configuration to be premium heavy (J and W) but with fewer F seats than, say, their 744s or 77Ws; JFK has got the Super Hi-J 744 which is made to measure for that route. My guess would be that the A35K will displace the 77W on routes like HND, PVG, SIN and HKG and the 77W then replacing 744s on routes like PHX, SAN, LAS or SEA.

Personally I think they wouldn't want to debut their new club seat on anything but the JFK route. This has been asked for by Frequent flyers for years and years. Not all JFK services are operated by super high J 747's, you occasionally see the Mid J 747, (or the 77W sometimes) and a gurantee of 1 to 2 77E's per day. This is where the A350 will probably be sloted in.

I think it's hard for us to predict currently as we don't know what configuration it will be in and how many seats will be lost if the rumors of it being the same seat as the Emirates A380 turn out to be true.

BA are scalling F down anyway and I think all future aircraft deliveries will have a smaller F cabins, similar to the size of what is on the -9 now.

thgsr08 · Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:56 pm

LPSHobby wrote:
when will the first LATAM ones be delevired?

MSN390. All A359 will be delivered and then the 1st A35K. Probably 2020.

TedToToe · Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:13 pm

Arion640 wrote:
Personally I think they wouldn't want to debut their new club seat on anything but the JFK route. This has been asked for by Frequent flyers for years and years. Not all JFK services are operated by super high J 747's, you occasionally see the Mid J 747, (or the 77W sometimes) and a gurantee of 1 to 2 77E's per day. This is where the A350 will probably be sloted in.

Bear in mind, BA also has the 78X coming. Now, that is made to measure for them on US East coast services!

AAvgeek744 · Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:32 pm

ATW Online stated this afternoon LHR gets the first QR route, followed by an unspecified U.S. east coast city.

azz767 · Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:47 pm

mcogator wrote:
azz767 wrote:
VS are replacing 747’s and LGW and MAN bases + GLA & BFS w patterns. They will be doing the MCO and LAS from both. BGI, and other Caribbean from LGW, and possibly depending on how the A332’s help build the MAN base, on the more established USA routes like ATL SFO and maybe BOS, plus whatever they may add. I say my last point for two reasons, firstly, they may attract more premium pax and secondly, there is as far as I know only one fleet config for the 350’s, unlike the 744’s when they had a couple at LHR and I know the plan was for a couple to do the higher density LHR routes, and due to the standard config will allow for fleet rotation throughout the network.

Will this MCO sight turn into all A35K? Or will they mix it with the A332?

https://www.instagram.com/p/Be_oCgnlLQZ/

I’d take an educated guess at all A350 just because of the capacity. The A332’s are being used on the USA city routes and will be ideal in testing new routes. MAN and LGW from March to September will comfortably fill 2 MCO daily flights from each, all on 744’s so it would be a real downgauge to go to A332. One further point is that the majority of the VS 744 fleet is around 16/17 years old so still have a lot of life in them yet and have had a major cabin upgrade in the last few years. You might see a mix of 744 and 35K maybe one each from daily from either base.

Arion640 · Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:59 pm

TedToToe wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
Personally I think they wouldn't want to debut their new club seat on anything but the JFK route. This has been asked for by Frequent flyers for years and years. Not all JFK services are operated by super high J 747's, you occasionally see the Mid J 747, (or the 77W sometimes) and a gurantee of 1 to 2 77E's per day. This is where the A350 will probably be sloted in.

Bear in mind, BA also has the 78X coming. Now, that is made to measure for them on US East coast services!

That's also very true. I think it's hard to speculate currently as a lot depends on the new club seat and pontential configurations.

JamesCousins · Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:21 am

azz767 wrote:
VS are replacing 747’s and LGW and MAN bases + GLA & BFS w patterns. They will be doing the MCO and LAS from both. BGI, and other Caribbean from LGW, and possibly depending on how the A332’s help build the MAN base, on the more established USA routes like ATL SFO and maybe BOS, plus whatever they may add. I say my last point for two reasons, firstly, they may attract more premium pax and secondly, there is as far as I know only one fleet config for the 350’s, unlike the 744’s when they had a couple at LHR and I know the plan was for a couple to do the higher density LHR routes, and due to the standard config will allow for fleet rotation throughout the network.

Wait really? Do you have a source for this, because I know they fill every seat of the dense 747's during high season and a premium heavy config would mean a loss in Economy capacity, that is unless we see greater frequencies...

JamesCousins · Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:23 am

azz767 wrote:
mcogator wrote:
azz767 wrote:
VS are replacing 747’s and LGW and MAN bases + GLA & BFS w patterns. They will be doing the MCO and LAS from both. BGI, and other Caribbean from LGW, and possibly depending on how the A332’s help build the MAN base, on the more established USA routes like ATL SFO and maybe BOS, plus whatever they may add. I say my last point for two reasons, firstly, they may attract more premium pax and secondly, there is as far as I know only one fleet config for the 350’s, unlike the 744’s when they had a couple at LHR and I know the plan was for a couple to do the higher density LHR routes, and due to the standard config will allow for fleet rotation throughout the network.

Will this MCO sight turn into all A35K? Or will they mix it with the A332?

https://www.instagram.com/p/Be_oCgnlLQZ/

I’d take an educated guess at all A350 just because of the capacity. The A332’s are being used on the USA city routes and will be ideal in testing new routes. MAN and LGW from March to September will comfortably fill 2 MCO daily flights from each, all on 744’s so it would be a real downgauge to go to A332. One further point is that the majority of the VS 744 fleet is around 16/17 years old so still have a lot of life in them yet and have had a major cabin upgrade in the last few years. You might see a mix of 744 and 35K maybe one each from daily from either base.

AFAIK though once all of the A350s are delivered the 747's and A340's should go for good, it should be a 1:1 delivery and retirement plan AFAIK. Most of the 744's & A340's are also leased, so the age argument perhaps isn't as valid as with BA where the planes have been paid off...

JamesCousins · Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:27 am

EGAD wrote:
azz767 wrote:
VS are replacing 747’s and LGW and MAN bases + GLA & BFS w patterns. They will be doing the MCO and LAS from both. BGI, and other Caribbean from LGW, and possibly depending on how the A332’s help build the MAN base, on the more established USA routes like ATL SFO and maybe BOS, plus whatever they may add. I say my last point for two reasons, firstly, they may attract more premium pax and secondly, there is as far as I know only one fleet config for the 350’s, unlike the 744’s when they had a couple at LHR and I know the plan was for a couple to do the higher density LHR routes, and due to the standard config will allow for fleet rotation throughout the network.

That was the original plan. Now there will be two configs of 350, one for leisure markets from LGW replacing some 747's on the higher capacity routes and another config for the more premium LHR routes. No specific destinations have yet been named by the airline. (But MCO and LAS from LGW are fairly safe bets, as is LAX from LHR.)

I'd also place bets on CUN from LGW and JFK from LHR, there's quite a lot of very premium-heavy A340s on the JFK route

TedToToe · Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:37 am

seat1a wrote:
Air Caraibes 3
Air Lease Corp 9
Asiana 10
British Airways 18
Cathay Pacific 20
Etihad 22
Iran Air 16
Japan Airlines 13
LATAM 12
Qatar 37
Virgin Atlantic 8
Undisclosed 1

Anybody else on here thinking Etihad aren't going to need all those 779s alongside A35Ks?

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