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slider
Posts: 7791
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 11:42 pm

Re: Fines for Bag-Carriers in Emergency Evacuations?

Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:06 pm

kalvado wrote:
qf002 wrote:
yeogeo wrote:
On this subject, what struck me when watching the video (in post 8) was the mishaps on the slides- people bumping into each other, turning backwards, falling over every which way, that and the fact that there are many people on the slide simultaneously was shocking (naive, I know)... and then to bring a roller bag into the mix! Ouch - that has to hurt! No wonder they are so many injuries in evacuations.


I'm wondering what impact this could (or should) have on the way evacuation capacity is measured/tested. It's all well and good proving that 500 people can get off in under 90 seconds but what about 500 people plus 500 large suitcases?

And what is so special about 90 seconds anyway?
Sounds like more or less random number. 90 seconds is pretty fast; but why not aim at 60 or 120, why 90 was chosen? Something may explode 30 seconds after evacuation started, or it may take 5 minutes for things to go north. Or problem can be contained without actually endangering anyone in the cabin to begin with...


Years ago, the standard was set that a full cabin needed to be evacuated in 90 seconds, in the dark, with half the exits blocked, in order to achieve certification.

At the time, research suggested that 90 seconds would be a reasonable limit in terms of a burning aircraft approaching flashover point. Moreover, back then, seat cushions actually had TONS of toxic materials and so inhalation and so even if crash impact was deemed survivable, fatalities occurred because of fire, toxic inhalation, etc.

So the materials and construction have improved, but the standard should never be relaxed. Other crashes have informed evac discipline too--such as aisle path lighting, which was an NTSB recommendation and finally became universally adopted.
 
indcwby
Posts: 336
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2010 7:32 pm

Re: Fines for Bag-Carriers in Emergency Evacuations?

Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:30 pm

zkojq wrote:
I support fines for bringing big bags/luggage off during an evacuation. If for no other reason, the first time this happens the media will be plastered with stories of some poor "innocent" nobody getting fined $2,000 for bringing their massive roller bag down the slide. The media coverage will hopefully raise awareness of why bringing out massive bags during an evacuation is unsafe. After a few years worth of accidents, people will start to get the message.

Also, when someone takes a big roller bag down the slide and it hits someone else at the bottom, there should be a set schedule of compensation for the victim who gets injured. Maybe all related healthcare expenses + $1,000 for every kilogram that the rollerbag weighs?

indcwby wrote:
One would think. But then if you ask any IT Security Professional, an encrypted laptop can still hacked if it's not shutdown completely.
Direct memory access attacks:
Malicious devices can be used to manipulate or read your computer’s RAM, aka random access memory storage.


Why wouldn't the laptop be shutdown for landing? Cabin crew tell you to put them away for takeoff/landing, so shutting them down is the logical extension of that.


Closing the lid and stowing your laptop in your bag does not always mean the passenger has shut down the laptop. Most of the time means that it's been put to sleep/hibernate.
 
Clydenairways
Posts: 1786
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:27 am

Re: Fines for Bag-Carriers in Emergency Evacuations?

Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:13 pm

HeeseokKoo wrote:
ltbewr wrote:
First of all, your passport, wallet, ticket info, phone, critical drugs, maybe a UBS storage for critical laptop/tablet info, should be on your person in your pocket or a belt/neck pouch or a small purse/bag so if during your flight an emergency or crash landing occurs, you won't need your main carry on bag at all and not interfere with your and other's safe evacuation. As to employer and government owned computers and papers, there should be a defined exemption if not with you if an emergency or evacuation event.

Pocket, which may not even exist for women's clothes, or seat pocket would work but small purse/bag won't be allowed for those sitting at bulkhead or exit rows if an incident occurs during take off or landing. Regardless, I support the fines/jail/penalty idea.


In the event of an accident, passengers are more likely to be geting compensation. All this talk of Jail and fines is totally unrealistic.
Baggage fees are the biggest reason we have this problem, even if a particular airline doesn’t charge, people are now conditioned to take as much as possible into the cabin. Like queuing at gates, it becomes normal behavior, even with assigned seating. Why, because the overheads will fill up if I don’t queue up early.
There is way too much stuff crammed in cabins these days, get it back into the hold where it belongs.
 
ltbewr
Posts: 16758
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 pm

Re: Fines for Bag-Carriers in Emergency Evacuations?

Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:46 am

Perhaps there needs to be realistic testing of evacuation, including using fake smoke, certain exits closed, a variable percentages of pax taking bags, on a variety of aircraft. Perhaps that would be useful it determining how to reduce the risks of evacuating pax and bringing the carry ons with them during them.
 
CairnterriAIR
Posts: 930
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 1:52 am

Re: Fines for Bag-Carriers in Emergency Evacuations?

Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:48 am

What if you have a small dog in a pet carry on bag under the seat?
 
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Goodyear
Posts: 183
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2017 1:25 am

Re: Fines for Bag-Carriers in Emergency Evacuations?

Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:48 am

I have a better idea: give immunity to passengers who "encourage" passengers to leave their personal belongings behind.
Last edited by Goodyear on Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
User avatar
Goodyear
Posts: 183
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2017 1:25 am

Re: Fines for Bag-Carriers in Emergency Evacuations?

Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:49 am

CairnterriAIR wrote:
What if you have a small dog in a pet carry on bag under the seat?

Your chihuahua's life is no more important than mine. In fact it's significantly less valuable.
 
KentB27
Posts: 476
Joined: Fri Oct 02, 2015 2:20 pm

Re: Fines for Bag-Carriers in Emergency Evacuations?

Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:01 am

I don't disagree with this, however this seems like something that would be incredibly difficult to enforce consistently.

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