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keesje
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A321 NEO LR LBG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:34 pm

Last edited by SQ22 on Sat Feb 17, 2018 11:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Changed CDG to LBG
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
Newbiepilot
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:40 pm

I guess we know why they used CFM engines instead if PW engines for the first A321LR since PW equipped A321neos have suspeded all test flights.

I wonder who will come out to see the plane land
 
thepinkmachine
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:45 pm

I think WOW Air stole the show by operating non-stop KEF-LAX a couple of weeks ago - a longer flight...
 
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keesje
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:47 pm

Newbiepilot wrote:
I guess we know why they used CFM engines instead if PW engines for the first A321LR since PW equipped A321neos have suspeded all test flights.

I wonder who will come out to see the plane land


Another A321 at JFK but it ain't Jetblue or AA. Exiting stuff .. :yawn:

It reached the UK and is a cruise level / speed for this stage.
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
estorilm
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:52 pm

keesje wrote:

Ohhh what I'd do to trade my work desk for theirs right now :lol: Wonder what's for lunch? Someone in another thread said it was heading to JFK?
 
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KarelXWB
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:03 pm

Newbiepilot wrote:
I guess we know why they used CFM engines instead if PW engines for the first A321LR since PW equipped A321neos have suspeded all test flights.



You can't change engine type on such short notice.

Considering the lead time of the pylon, this was planned a long time ago.

The first LR customers have selected the CFM powerplant, hence this variant will be certified first.
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
CobaltScar
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:34 pm

So I suppose with comfortable flights from Paris to JFK, JetBlue is almost assuredly going to be using this plane. This is going to be a real danger to the Euro based LCCs that are flying trans Atlantic (Norwegian)
 
fcogafa
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:45 pm

That FR24 track seems to show it out of LBG
 
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reidar76
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:49 pm

But this is not really an A321LR, as it only has two additional center tanks onboard. This is the A321 ACF, the first aircraft with both the new engines and the modified fuselage. The third additional center tank will be installed later.
 
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Richard28
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:55 pm

CobaltScar wrote:
This is going to be a real danger to the Euro based LCCs that are flying trans Atlantic (Norwegian)


Although Norwegian also have plenty of A321LR's on order too.
 
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ikolkyo
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 4:03 pm

reidar76 wrote:
But this is not really an A321LR, as it only has two additional center tanks onboard. This is the A321 ACF, the first aircraft with both the new engines and the modified fuselage. The third additional center tank will be installed later.


The aircraft has the 97t MTOW so it is an A321LR, just missing the 3rd ACT.
 
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flee
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 4:41 pm

keesje wrote:

You might want to change the thread title to LBG - JFK.
 
arcticcruiser
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 4:47 pm

And all this is pointless without knowing the payload capability on the sector. You can ferry or fly poor loads (as WOW did) long distances. But that does not bring profits.
 
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ikolkyo
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 4:48 pm

reidar76 wrote:
ikolkyo wrote:
reidar76 wrote:
But this is not really an A321LR, as it only has two additional center tanks onboard. This is the A321 ACF, the first aircraft with both the new engines and the modified fuselage. The third additional center tank will be installed later.


The aircraft has the 97t MTOW so it is an A321LR, just missing the 3rd ACT.


The A321neo ACF is the base for the longer range variant known as the A321LR. As I understand it, there will only be one variant of the A321 going forward, with 0, 1, 2, or 3 additional center tanks onboard. All A321 from 2020 will have a MTOW of 97t (or be paper derated)

There is also a benefit of the increased MTOW to 97t going short haul with high payload. The A321 ACF is also necessary for the increase to a maximum of 240 passengers.

http://www.airbus.com/newsroom/press-re ... o-acf.html


I’m aware of all the changes with the ACF configuration l, you said this aircraft isn’t an A321LR because it’s missing the 3rd ACT and that is false.
 
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reidar76
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 4:48 pm

ikolkyo wrote:
reidar76 wrote:
But this is not really an A321LR, as it only has two additional center tanks onboard. This is the A321 ACF, the first aircraft with both the new engines and the modified fuselage. The third additional center tank will be installed later.


The aircraft has the 97t MTOW so it is an A321LR, just missing the 3rd ACT.


The A321neo ACF is the base for the longer range variant known as the A321LR. As I understand it, there will only be one variant of the A321 going forward, with 0, 1, 2, or 3 additional center tanks onboard. All A321 from 2020 will have a MTOW of 97t (or be paper derated)

There is also a benefit of the increased MTOW to 97t going short haul with high payload. The A321 ACF is also necessary for the increase to a maximum of 240 passengers.

http://www.airbus.com/newsroom/press-re ... o-acf.html
 
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Dutchy
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 5:00 pm

The airspeed is quite a bit slower, around 50-80kn. The 757 seems to have the same speed as the WB.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
AirbusOnly
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 5:31 pm

thepinkmachine wrote:
I think WOW Air stole the show by operating non-stop KEF-LAX a couple of weeks ago - a longer flight...


And that was „only“ their A 321 neo- no LR - and they are still using it nonstop KEF - SFO too! Flightime more than 8 h - Check TF-SKY
 
TranscendZac
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 5:37 pm

I would rather fly a 321NEO/LR across the pond than a wide body. Less people on board, and the A32X family cabin is plenty spacious, and certainly on most airlines who will be operating longer 321LR flights.
Zac
 
arcticcruiser
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 5:41 pm

Dutchy wrote:
The airspeed is quite a bit slower, around 50-80kn. The 757 seems to have the same speed as the WB.


Yep, even slower than a Norwegian 737. Doing maximum range cruise speed? Winds are bad today going west.
 
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Acey
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 5:47 pm

TranscendZac wrote:
Less people on board

..a ~220 seat 767 with two aisles still wins in the "spaciousness" department as far as I'm concerned, though those are mostly on the way out.
If a man hasn't discovered something that he will die for, he isn't fit to live. -- Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 5:48 pm

arcticcruiser wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
The airspeed is quite a bit slower, around 50-80kn. The 757 seems to have the same speed as the WB.


Yep, even slower than a Norwegian 737. Doing maximum range cruise speed? Winds are bad today going west.


I guess, this will hurt it on long runs.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
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keesje
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:29 pm

Dutchy wrote:
The airspeed is quite a bit slower, around 50-80kn. The 757 seems to have the same speed as the WB.


Yes the AirLingus A330 EI137 will probably overtake it.

:checkeredflag:

https://www.flightradar24.com/EIN13T/106b2fed
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
tomcat
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:35 pm

Dutchy wrote:
arcticcruiser wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
The airspeed is quite a bit slower, around 50-80kn. The 757 seems to have the same speed as the WB.


Yep, even slower than a Norwegian 737. Doing maximum range cruise speed? Winds are bad today going west.


I guess, this will hurt it on long runs.


It's currently 70 kts slower than the closest Norwegian 737 (352 vs 425 knots). It's like if she was flying on one engine! Are these live ground speeds or the last ones recorded at some point during the crossing? Could it be that it's flying this slow because of landing slot issue? The first flight of the day apparently went back to Paris after a few minutes in flight because of an ESTA issue, so they lost their initial landing slot at JFK.

The altitude is a bit odd as well: it has been shown at 34750 ft for a while (so not in transition between two flight levels), while all the other planes fly at "round" altitude levels (34000, 38000,...).
 
N757ST
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:41 pm

I’m sure it’s at long range cruise speeds. It’ll cruise between .78-.79 in normal operations.
 
barney captain
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:42 pm

75kts slower than the MAX8 just south of it? That is very odd.
Southeast Of Disorder
 
CCGPV
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:47 pm

For those of us not using flighradar can we get a flight number or anything?
Stay curious
 
ap305
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:48 pm

The speed is not updated for a long time since its out of receiver range... It was at mach .78 at the last point which is the lrc of the a320 family.
Racing, competing, is in my blood. It's part of me, it's part of my life; I've been doing it all my life. And it stands up before anything else- Ayrton Senna
 
Abeam79
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:49 pm

Paris-JFK....Putting it right in JetBlues backyard which is close to finalizing its fleet review..how convenient!
 
barney captain
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:51 pm

ap305 wrote:
The speed is not updated for a long time since its out of receiver range... It was at mach .78 at the last point which is the lrc of the a320 family.



....except they are being overtaken by everyone around them.
Southeast Of Disorder
 
cledaybuck
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:58 pm

What is the point of this flight? Publicity?
 
MKIAZ
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:02 pm

Richard28 wrote:
CobaltScar wrote:
This is going to be a real danger to the Euro based LCCs that are flying trans Atlantic (Norwegian)


Although Norwegian also have plenty of A321LR's on order too.


Yes, but Norwegian can only fly Europe to north-east.

Jetblue, by way of having it's main hubs at BOS/JFK can provide one stop service between the entire US and most of europe. And the seats are actually more spacious in economy than the US3 or the European LLC's. And in business they'd have lie-flat mint, potentially the whole journey.

For people paying for business it's much nicer than connecting in LHR or flying domestic first to a connecting point.

AC could also capitalize on this with their YUL hub.
 
ap305
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:08 pm

barney captain wrote:
ap305 wrote:
The speed is not updated for a long time since its out of receiver range... It was at mach .78 at the last point which is the lrc of the a320 family.



....except they are being overtaken by everyone around them.


except those are projected by fr24 based on the last recorded ads-b data which was a long time back.
Racing, competing, is in my blood. It's part of me, it's part of my life; I've been doing it all my life. And it stands up before anything else- Ayrton Senna
 
ap305
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:10 pm

The aircraft is also nowhere near its weight limitations given that they went up straight to fl360... This test probably has more to do with seeing how the cabin systems work on a real long haul operation.
Racing, competing, is in my blood. It's part of me, it's part of my life; I've been doing it all my life. And it stands up before anything else- Ayrton Senna
 
barney captain
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:25 pm

ap305 wrote:
The aircraft is also nowhere near its weight limitations given that they went up straight to fl360... This test probably has more to do with seeing how the cabin systems work on a real long haul operation.


That's a good point - it is a test flight. If you look at their GS graph, there is a steady reduction of speed over the course of an hour or so, it could easily be part of a test.
Southeast Of Disorder
 
SteinarN
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:48 pm

Interestingly enough, when facing head winds the optimum true airspeed for max range/lowest fuel consumption per distance does in fact increase. And the reverse when facing tail wind. Say max range cruise speed is mach 0,78 in still air. When facing severe head wind the maximum range true airspeed goes up to say mach 0,8 and when facing strong tail wind the max range cruise speed goes down to say mach 0,75.
Last edited by SteinarN on Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
airbazar
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:00 pm

Dutchy wrote:
arcticcruiser wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
The airspeed is quite a bit slower, around 50-80kn. The 757 seems to have the same speed as the WB.


Yep, even slower than a Norwegian 737. Doing maximum range cruise speed? Winds are bad today going west.


I guess, this will hurt it on long runs.


As if the speed of a test flight where we don't know what exactly is being tested, is relevant and comparable to commercial operations :banghead:
 
PerVG
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:01 pm

Just got back to live tracking and doing about the same speed as all other aircraft on a similar fly path.. ;)
 
Theseus
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:25 pm

PerVG wrote:
Just got back to live tracking and doing about the same speed as all other aircraft on a similar fly path.. ;)


Indeed, and EI137 did not overtake it.
I did not know FR24 was extrapolating (yes, I feel foolish), thanks for the brilliant demonstration. ;)
 
Noise
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:25 pm

CobaltScar wrote:
So I suppose with comfortable flights from Paris to JFK, JetBlue is almost assuredly going to be using this plane. This is going to be a real danger to the Euro based LCCs that are flying trans Atlantic (Norwegian)


Not sure if serving Europe is in JetBlue's medium-term plans.
 
Newbiepilot
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:32 pm

Theseus wrote:
PerVG wrote:
Just got back to live tracking and doing about the same speed as all other aircraft on a similar fly path.. ;)


Indeed, and EI137 did not overtake it.
I did not know FR24 was extrapolating (yes, I feel foolish), thanks for the brilliant demonstration. ;)


A320s along with 737s, 757s and 767s are pretty slow going between Mach .78 and .80 compared to 747s, 787s, A350s and A380s going at 0.85. When Delta and United went head to head on SFO-NRT, the Delta 767 was blocked at 55 minutes longer than the United 747. 737s and A320s are some of the slowest ETOPS birds.
 
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tjwgrr
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:33 pm

CCGPV wrote:
For those of us not using flighradar can we get a flight number or anything?


AIB321 / D-AVZO

Not showing up on Flightaware for some reason.
Direct KNOBS, maintain 2700' until established on the localizer, cleared ILS runway 26 left approach.
 
Bricktop
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:39 pm

Looks like it'll go to 22L, and light's fading fast. Beauty shots look doomed.
 
Abeam79
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:42 pm

Not sure if serving Europe is in JetBlue's medium-term plans.[/quote]
Uhhmm..guess you haven’t heard much or been out of the loop but a cursory google search and you’ll see jetblue planning on converting to the LR for Europe a very serious next step which we should hear soon. Even so I’m sure they will also continue deeper into Latam from Mco/fll focus cities with it.
 
Bricktop
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:49 pm

Now looks like setting up for 13R. Coolest approach to JFK.

Changed to 13R, or I didn't hear initial instructions.
Last edited by Bricktop on Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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gatibosgru
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:54 pm

Is this the first true trans Atlantic NEO crossing?
@DadCelo
 
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GE90man
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:03 pm

It looked as if it was going to land on one of the 22s, but nope. This is extremely unfortunate for me as I happen to live under the path that aircraft take to the 22s, and I was planning on spotting it. :(
 
Bricktop
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:10 pm

GE90man wrote:
It looked as if it was going to land on one of the 22s, but nope. This is extremely unfortunate for me as I happen to live under the path that aircraft take to the 22s, and I was planning on spotting it. :(

Dark and cloudy. I saw it through the clouds for a few seconds, and I was too slow to get any kind of shot.
 
Samrnpage
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:12 pm

Its parked up near the end of 4L by the looks of it - well out of the way
 
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GE90man
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:16 pm

When does it return to LBG, or continue the next leg of its journey?
 
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GSPFlyer
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Re: A321 NEO LR CDG - JFK Flight Tracker

Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:38 pm

Newbiepilot wrote:
Theseus wrote:
PerVG wrote:
Just got back to live tracking and doing about the same speed as all other aircraft on a similar fly path.. ;)


Indeed, and EI137 did not overtake it.
I did not know FR24 was extrapolating (yes, I feel foolish), thanks for the brilliant demonstration. ;)


A320s along with 737s, 757s and 767s are pretty slow going between Mach .78 and .80 compared to 747s, 787s, A350s and A380s going at 0.85. When Delta and United went head to head on SFO-NRT, the Delta 767 was blocked at 55 minutes longer than the United 747. 737s and A320s are some of the slowest ETOPS birds.


When QF was still using both the 744 and A380 between SYD and MEL, wasn't the 380 blocked for longer than the 744?

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