Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR
ROCDLFAN wrote:At this point, I don't see why not. NK probably won't do it. F9 has a good chance at ROC. I'd even throw it out there and say they could add ELM-MCO/DEN too.With BUF, SYR, and ALB now all either active or announced for F9, any chance we see ROC on the horizon for them?
RL757PVD wrote:including virtually no MIA service from anywhere in the northeast (PVD ISP or TTN is what I checked)
F9LASDEN wrote:It appears that a bunch of DEN flights that have previously been summer seasonal, or were initially announced as summer-seasonal, have been extended to year round, including:
-RDU
-BZN
-CLE
-ELP
-LIT
-FAR
-CID
-BOI
-CHS
-JAX
-FAT
-SBA
-SMF
-MEM
-GRR
-BUF
-YYC
-TYS
-SDF
-PIT
-SAV
-FSD
-GEG
In addition to this, DEN-OKC will be running daily through the winter (random thing I noticed). Also, TPA and RSW will be running daily, and MCO will be running 2x daily. One noticeable missing flight from DEN's winter schedule, however, is DEN-SJD. DEN-PVR is returning though.
LAS appears to have remained quite stable during this extension, with only MIA not returning, both TPA and BNA appear to be extended to year round (TPA assumingly coming at the expense of LAS-MIA), SFO returning for the season, and new additions YYC, SMF, GSP, ORF, JAX, and GEG all staying through the winter. (Contrary to what the LAS wikipedia page says, IAD is staying as well)
At MCO, it looks like ABQ, TUL, AUS, and SAT have been extended to year round. CLT, BUF, and BNA are all running daily this winter. SAN, TYS, MSN, and MSP are back for the winter, but it looks like CID, SFO, and PHX are not returning. It also looks like DSM also will not be running through the winter, but it may return next summer.
I randomly noticed ATL-SFO is returning, but SJC-ATL is being cut.
TPA and MIA were both huge surprises to me in the sense of how many routes aren't returning this winter.
TPA lost GSP (was this route cut before it even began? It won't show up on their website even for the fall), CMH, IND, MCI, and STL, managing to only keep MKE and MSP from last winter. However, DEN is going back to daily and LAS is staying through the winter after having previously been a summer-only flight, and will be daily.
The biggest surprise of this extension, IMO, was the huge cutdown at MIA compared to last winter. LAS, BUF, CVG, CLE, DTW, MKE, PVD, and TTN are all not returning, leaving LGA as the only flight to return from last winter.
RSW fared better than TPA and MIA in regards to cuts, with CMH, MCI, OMA, PVD, and STL not returning from last winter. However, CVG, CLE, DEN, MKE, and PHL will all be running daily this winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
PBI-PHL does not appear to be returning, but TTN-PBI and ISP-PBI both are running daily through the winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
JAX did better than I would have expected in terms of cuts. BUF, CVG, MKE, and SAT won't be running this winter, but DEN, LAS, AUS, ORD, MCI, MSP, PHL, STL, and TTN will all be running through the winter.
AUS did better than I would have expected as well. CVG and PHX were cut, but ATL, CMH, JAX, SNA, MCO, and PHL were extended to year round.
SAT did not fare as well, however. ATL, COS, PHX, SJC, and IAD all appear to be cut, and only CLT, SNA, and MCO were extended to year round.
RDU did exceedingly well, with no year-round flights being cut and DEN, IAH, MCI, MSY, SAT, SAN, SJU, and TTN all being extended to year-round. Also, the schedules were loaded for MBJ, PUJ, CUN, RSW, PBI, and PHX. MBJ, PUJ, and RSW each running 2x weekly, and PHX, CUN, and PBI each running 3x weekly.
A second PHL-SJU and MCO-SJU frequency will both be running on Tu/Th/Su through the winter. In addition, ATL-SJU and RDU-SJU will be running through the winter.
isp2 wrote:F9LASDEN wrote:It appears that a bunch of DEN flights that have previously been summer seasonal, or were initially announced as summer-seasonal, have been extended to year round, including:
-RDU
-BZN
-CLE
-ELP
-LIT
-FAR
-CID
-BOI
-CHS
-JAX
-FAT
-SBA
-SMF
-MEM
-GRR
-BUF
-YYC
-TYS
-SDF
-PIT
-SAV
-FSD
-GEG
In addition to this, DEN-OKC will be running daily through the winter (random thing I noticed). Also, TPA and RSW will be running daily, and MCO will be running 2x daily. One noticeable missing flight from DEN's winter schedule, however, is DEN-SJD. DEN-PVR is returning though.
LAS appears to have remained quite stable during this extension, with only MIA not returning, both TPA and BNA appear to be extended to year round (TPA assumingly coming at the expense of LAS-MIA), SFO returning for the season, and new additions YYC, SMF, GSP, ORF, JAX, and GEG all staying through the winter. (Contrary to what the LAS wikipedia page says, IAD is staying as well)
At MCO, it looks like ABQ, TUL, AUS, and SAT have been extended to year round. CLT, BUF, and BNA are all running daily this winter. SAN, TYS, MSN, and MSP are back for the winter, but it looks like CID, SFO, and PHX are not returning. It also looks like DSM also will not be running through the winter, but it may return next summer.
I randomly noticed ATL-SFO is returning, but SJC-ATL is being cut.
TPA and MIA were both huge surprises to me in the sense of how many routes aren't returning this winter.
TPA lost GSP (was this route cut before it even began? It won't show up on their website even for the fall), CMH, IND, MCI, and STL, managing to only keep MKE and MSP from last winter. However, DEN is going back to daily and LAS is staying through the winter after having previously been a summer-only flight, and will be daily.
The biggest surprise of this extension, IMO, was the huge cutdown at MIA compared to last winter. LAS, BUF, CVG, CLE, DTW, MKE, PVD, and TTN are all not returning, leaving LGA as the only flight to return from last winter.
RSW fared better than TPA and MIA in regards to cuts, with CMH, MCI, OMA, PVD, and STL not returning from last winter. However, CVG, CLE, DEN, MKE, and PHL will all be running daily this winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
PBI-PHL does not appear to be returning, but TTN-PBI and ISP-PBI both are running daily through the winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
JAX did better than I would have expected in terms of cuts. BUF, CVG, MKE, and SAT won't be running this winter, but DEN, LAS, AUS, ORD, MCI, MSP, PHL, STL, and TTN will all be running through the winter.
AUS did better than I would have expected as well. CVG and PHX were cut, but ATL, CMH, JAX, SNA, MCO, and PHL were extended to year round.
SAT did not fare as well, however. ATL, COS, PHX, SJC, and IAD all appear to be cut, and only CLT, SNA, and MCO were extended to year round.
RDU did exceedingly well, with no year-round flights being cut and DEN, IAH, MCI, MSY, SAT, SAN, SJU, and TTN all being extended to year-round. Also, the schedules were loaded for MBJ, PUJ, CUN, RSW, PBI, and PHX. MBJ, PUJ, and RSW each running 2x weekly, and PHX, CUN, and PBI each running 3x weekly.
A second PHL-SJU and MCO-SJU frequency will both be running on Tu/Th/Su through the winter. In addition, ATL-SJU and RDU-SJU will be running through the winter.
MIA-ORD also resumes.
This is not the final winter schedule. More additiona coming in August.
F9LASDEN wrote:The biggest surprise of this extension, IMO, was the huge cutdown at MIA compared to last winter. LAS, BUF, CVG, CLE, DTW, MKE, PVD, and TTN are all not returning, leaving LGA as the only flight to return from last winter.
WNflyer1523 wrote:F9LASDEN wrote:The biggest surprise of this extension, IMO, was the huge cutdown at MIA compared to last winter. LAS, BUF, CVG, CLE, DTW, MKE, PVD, and TTN are all not returning, leaving LGA as the only flight to return from last winter.
Thanks for taking the time to get all of this analysis.
Just wanted to point out ISP-MIA isn’t returning either.
I wonder why they have all of these cuts. Maybe they’re planning to add FLL back? I remember reading in a Newsday article a few months ago that Frontier “intends” to add Miami service from ISP, or another airport in the area. Ruling out PBI as they already serve PBI from ISP.
F9LASDEN wrote:WNflyer1523 wrote:F9LASDEN wrote:The biggest surprise of this extension, IMO, was the huge cutdown at MIA compared to last winter. LAS, BUF, CVG, CLE, DTW, MKE, PVD, and TTN are all not returning, leaving LGA as the only flight to return from last winter.
Thanks for taking the time to get all of this analysis.
Just wanted to point out ISP-MIA isn’t returning either.
I wonder why they have all of these cuts. Maybe they’re planning to add FLL back? I remember reading in a Newsday article a few months ago that Frontier “intends” to add Miami service from ISP, or another airport in the area. Ruling out PBI as they already serve PBI from ISP.
Yes, it appears I forgot to list ISP-MIA was cut. I saw that article too, and was one of the first routes I checked when I saw that the schedule was extended this morning. I suppose it’s possible that the route may be loaded at a later time, but in the interim, at least PBI-ISP is daily.
WNflyer1523 wrote:F9LASDEN wrote:WNflyer1523 wrote:Thanks for taking the time to get all of this analysis.
Just wanted to point out ISP-MIA isn’t returning either.
I wonder why they have all of these cuts. Maybe they’re planning to add FLL back? I remember reading in a Newsday article a few months ago that Frontier “intends” to add Miami service from ISP, or another airport in the area. Ruling out PBI as they already serve PBI from ISP.
Yes, it appears I forgot to list ISP-MIA was cut. I saw that article too, and was one of the first routes I checked when I saw that the schedule was extended this morning. I suppose it’s possible that the route may be loaded at a later time, but in the interim, at least PBI-ISP is daily.
If they were to go in to FLL, I could see pretty much all of those cut MIA routes working out well at FLL. The only thing would be sorta limited gate space, but if most of those flights were less than daily, they could probably make it work with 2 gates, maybe even 1.
Does anyone know what terminal/concourse Frontier operated out of before they left FLL?
F9LASDEN wrote:It appears that a bunch of DEN flights that have previously been summer seasonal, or were initially announced as summer-seasonal, have been extended to year round, including:
-RDU
-BZN
-CLE
-ELP
-LIT
-FAR
-CID
-BOI
-CHS
-JAX
-FAT
-SBA
-SMF
-MEM
-GRR
-BUF
-YYC
-TYS
-SDF
-PIT
-SAV
-FSD
-GEG
In addition to this, DEN-OKC will be running daily through the winter (random thing I noticed). Also, TPA and RSW will be running daily, and MCO will be running 2x daily. One noticeable missing flight from DEN's winter schedule, however, is DEN-SJD. DEN-PVR is returning though.
LAS appears to have remained quite stable during this extension, with only MIA not returning, both TPA and BNA appear to be extended to year round (TPA assumingly coming at the expense of LAS-MIA), SFO returning for the season, and new additions YYC, SMF, GSP, ORF, JAX, and GEG all staying through the winter. (Contrary to what the LAS wikipedia page says, IAD is staying as well)
At MCO, it looks like ABQ, TUL, AUS, and SAT have been extended to year round. CLT, BUF, and BNA are all running daily this winter. SAN, TYS, MSN, and MSP are back for the winter, but it looks like CID, SFO, and PHX are not returning. It also looks like DSM also will not be running through the winter, but it may return next summer.
I randomly noticed ATL-SFO is returning, but SJC-ATL is being cut.
TPA and MIA were both huge surprises to me in the sense of how many routes aren't returning this winter.
TPA lost GSP (was this route cut before it even began? It won't show up on their website even for the fall), CMH, IND, MCI, and STL, managing to only keep MKE and MSP from last winter. However, DEN is going back to daily and LAS is staying through the winter after having previously been a summer-only flight, and will be daily.
The biggest surprise of this extension, IMO, was the huge cutdown at MIA compared to last winter. LAS, BUF, CVG, CLE, DTW, MKE, PVD, and TTN are all not returning, leaving LGA as the only flight to return from last winter.
RSW fared better than TPA and MIA in regards to cuts, with CMH, MCI, OMA, PVD, and STL not returning from last winter. However, CVG, CLE, DEN, MKE, and PHL will all be running daily this winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
PBI-PHL does not appear to be returning, but TTN-PBI and ISP-PBI both are running daily through the winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
JAX did better than I would have expected in terms of cuts. BUF, CVG, MKE, and SAT won't be running this winter, but DEN, LAS, AUS, ORD, MCI, MSP, PHL, STL, and TTN will all be running through the winter.
AUS did better than I would have expected as well. CVG and PHX were cut, but ATL, CMH, JAX, SNA, MCO, and PHL were extended to year round.
SAT did not fare as well, however. ATL, COS, PHX, SJC, and IAD all appear to be cut, and only CLT, SNA, and MCO were extended to year round.
RDU did exceedingly well, with no year-round flights being cut and DEN, IAH, MCI, MSY, SAT, SAN, SJU, and TTN all being extended to year-round. Also, the schedules were loaded for MBJ, PUJ, CUN, RSW, PBI, and PHX. MBJ, PUJ, and RSW each running 2x weekly, and PHX, CUN, and PBI each running 3x weekly.
A second PHL-SJU and MCO-SJU frequency will both be running on Tu/Th/Su through the winter. In addition, ATL-SJU and RDU-SJU will be running through the winter.
F9LASDEN wrote:It appears that a bunch of DEN flights that have previously been summer seasonal, or were initially announced as summer-seasonal, have been extended to year round, including:
-RDU
-BZN
-CLE
-ELP
-LIT
-FAR
-CID
-BOI
-CHS
-JAX
-FAT
-SBA
-SMF
-MEM
-GRR
-BUF
-YYC
-TYS
-SDF
-PIT
-SAV
-FSD
-GEG
In addition to this, DEN-OKC will be running daily through the winter (random thing I noticed). Also, TPA and RSW will be running daily, and MCO will be running 2x daily. One noticeable missing flight from DEN's winter schedule, however, is DEN-SJD. DEN-PVR is returning though.
LAS appears to have remained quite stable during this extension, with only MIA not returning, both TPA and BNA appear to be extended to year round (TPA assumingly coming at the expense of LAS-MIA), SFO returning for the season, and new additions YYC, SMF, GSP, ORF, JAX, and GEG all staying through the winter. (Contrary to what the LAS wikipedia page says, IAD is staying as well)
At MCO, it looks like ABQ, TUL, AUS, and SAT have been extended to year round. CLT, BUF, and BNA are all running daily this winter. SAN, TYS, MSN, and MSP are back for the winter, but it looks like CID, SFO, and PHX are not returning. It also looks like DSM also will not be running through the winter, but it may return next summer.
I randomly noticed ATL-SFO is returning, but SJC-ATL is being cut.
TPA and MIA were both huge surprises to me in the sense of how many routes aren't returning this winter.
TPA lost GSP (was this route cut before it even began? It won't show up on their website even for the fall), CMH, IND, MCI, and STL, managing to only keep MKE and MSP from last winter. However, DEN is going back to daily and LAS is staying through the winter after having previously been a summer-only flight, and will be daily.
The biggest surprise of this extension, IMO, was the huge cutdown at MIA compared to last winter. LAS, BUF, CVG, CLE, DTW, MKE, PVD, and TTN are all not returning, leaving LGA as the only flight to return from last winter.
RSW fared better than TPA and MIA in regards to cuts, with CMH, MCI, OMA, PVD, and STL not returning from last winter. However, CVG, CLE, DEN, MKE, and PHL will all be running daily this winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
PBI-PHL does not appear to be returning, but TTN-PBI and ISP-PBI both are running daily through the winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
JAX did better than I would have expected in terms of cuts. BUF, CVG, MKE, and SAT won't be running this winter, but DEN, LAS, AUS, ORD, MCI, MSP, PHL, STL, and TTN will all be running through the winter.
AUS did better than I would have expected as well. CVG and PHX were cut, but ATL, CMH, JAX, SNA, MCO, and PHL were extended to year round.
SAT did not fare as well, however. ATL, COS, PHX, SJC, and IAD all appear to be cut, and only CLT, SNA, and MCO were extended to year round.
RDU did exceedingly well, with no year-round flights being cut and DEN, IAH, MCI, MSY, SAT, SAN, SJU, and TTN all being extended to year-round. Also, the schedules were loaded for MBJ, PUJ, CUN, RSW, PBI, and PHX. MBJ, PUJ, and RSW each running 2x weekly, and PHX, CUN, and PBI each running 3x weekly.
A second PHL-SJU and MCO-SJU frequency will both be running on Tu/Th/Su through the winter. In addition, ATL-SJU and RDU-SJU will be running through the winter.
AirportRival wrote:F9LASDEN wrote:It appears that a bunch of DEN flights that have previously been summer seasonal, or were initially announced as summer-seasonal, have been extended to year round, including:
-RDU
-BZN
-CLE
-ELP
-LIT
-FAR
-CID
-BOI
-CHS
-JAX
-FAT
-SBA
-SMF
-MEM
-GRR
-BUF
-YYC
-TYS
-SDF
-PIT
-SAV
-FSD
-GEG
In addition to this, DEN-OKC will be running daily through the winter (random thing I noticed). Also, TPA and RSW will be running daily, and MCO will be running 2x daily. One noticeable missing flight from DEN's winter schedule, however, is DEN-SJD. DEN-PVR is returning though.
LAS appears to have remained quite stable during this extension, with only MIA not returning, both TPA and BNA appear to be extended to year round (TPA assumingly coming at the expense of LAS-MIA), SFO returning for the season, and new additions YYC, SMF, GSP, ORF, JAX, and GEG all staying through the winter. (Contrary to what the LAS wikipedia page says, IAD is staying as well)
At MCO, it looks like ABQ, TUL, AUS, and SAT have been extended to year round. CLT, BUF, and BNA are all running daily this winter. SAN, TYS, MSN, and MSP are back for the winter, but it looks like CID, SFO, and PHX are not returning. It also looks like DSM also will not be running through the winter, but it may return next summer.
I randomly noticed ATL-SFO is returning, but SJC-ATL is being cut.
TPA and MIA were both huge surprises to me in the sense of how many routes aren't returning this winter.
TPA lost GSP (was this route cut before it even began? It won't show up on their website even for the fall), CMH, IND, MCI, and STL, managing to only keep MKE and MSP from last winter. However, DEN is going back to daily and LAS is staying through the winter after having previously been a summer-only flight, and will be daily.
The biggest surprise of this extension, IMO, was the huge cutdown at MIA compared to last winter. LAS, BUF, CVG, CLE, DTW, MKE, PVD, and TTN are all not returning, leaving LGA as the only flight to return from last winter.
RSW fared better than TPA and MIA in regards to cuts, with CMH, MCI, OMA, PVD, and STL not returning from last winter. However, CVG, CLE, DEN, MKE, and PHL will all be running daily this winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
PBI-PHL does not appear to be returning, but TTN-PBI and ISP-PBI both are running daily through the winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
JAX did better than I would have expected in terms of cuts. BUF, CVG, MKE, and SAT won't be running this winter, but DEN, LAS, AUS, ORD, MCI, MSP, PHL, STL, and TTN will all be running through the winter.
AUS did better than I would have expected as well. CVG and PHX were cut, but ATL, CMH, JAX, SNA, MCO, and PHL were extended to year round.
SAT did not fare as well, however. ATL, COS, PHX, SJC, and IAD all appear to be cut, and only CLT, SNA, and MCO were extended to year round.
RDU did exceedingly well, with no year-round flights being cut and DEN, IAH, MCI, MSY, SAT, SAN, SJU, and TTN all being extended to year-round. Also, the schedules were loaded for MBJ, PUJ, CUN, RSW, PBI, and PHX. MBJ, PUJ, and RSW each running 2x weekly, and PHX, CUN, and PBI each running 3x weekly.
A second PHL-SJU and MCO-SJU frequency will both be running on Tu/Th/Su through the winter. In addition, ATL-SJU and RDU-SJU will be running through the winter.
Wow! Thank you for compiling this. It's very helpful. On a personal note, I'm disappointed in F9's ability to sustain growth at CVG.
Buddys747 wrote:MDT-RDU/DEN are not extended past November. When they were here last time they kept DEN thru New Years. MCO stays at 3x week.
F9LASDEN wrote:It appears that a bunch of DEN flights that have previously been summer seasonal, or were initially announced as summer-seasonal, have been extended to year round, including:
-RDU
-BZN
-CLE
-ELP
-LIT
-FAR
-CID
-BOI
-CHS
-JAX
-FAT
-SBA
-SMF
-MEM
-GRR
-BUF
-YYC
-TYS
-SDF
-PIT
-SAV
-FSD
-GEG
In addition to this, DEN-OKC will be running daily through the winter (random thing I noticed). Also, TPA and RSW will be running daily, and MCO will be running 2x daily. One noticeable missing flight from DEN's winter schedule, however, is DEN-SJD. DEN-PVR is returning though.
LAS appears to have remained quite stable during this extension, with only MIA not returning, both TPA and BNA appear to be extended to year round (TPA assumingly coming at the expense of LAS-MIA), SFO returning for the season, and new additions YYC, SMF, GSP, ORF, JAX, and GEG all staying through the winter. (Contrary to what the LAS wikipedia page says, IAD is staying as well)
At MCO, it looks like ABQ, TUL, AUS, and SAT have been extended to year round. CLT, BUF, and BNA are all running daily this winter. SAN, TYS, MSN, and MSP are back for the winter, but it looks like CID, SFO, and PHX are not returning. It also looks like DSM also will not be running through the winter, but it may return next summer.
I randomly noticed ATL-SFO is returning, but SJC-ATL is being cut.
TPA and MIA were both huge surprises to me in the sense of how many routes aren't returning this winter.
TPA lost GSP (was this route cut before it even began? It won't show up on their website even for the fall), CMH, IND, MCI, and STL, managing to only keep MKE and MSP from last winter. However, DEN is going back to daily and LAS is staying through the winter after having previously been a summer-only flight, and will be daily.
The biggest surprise of this extension, IMO, was the huge cutdown at MIA compared to last winter. LAS, BUF, CVG, CLE, DTW, MKE, PVD, and TTN are all not returning, leaving LGA as the only flight to return from last winter.
RSW fared better than TPA and MIA in regards to cuts, with CMH, MCI, OMA, PVD, and STL not returning from last winter. However, CVG, CLE, DEN, MKE, and PHL will all be running daily this winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
PBI-PHL does not appear to be returning, but TTN-PBI and ISP-PBI both are running daily through the winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
JAX did better than I would have expected in terms of cuts. BUF, CVG, MKE, and SAT won't be running this winter, but DEN, LAS, AUS, ORD, MCI, MSP, PHL, STL, and TTN will all be running through the winter.
AUS did better than I would have expected as well. CVG and PHX were cut, but ATL, CMH, JAX, SNA, MCO, and PHL were extended to year round.
SAT did not fare as well, however. ATL, COS, PHX, SJC, and IAD all appear to be cut, and only CLT, SNA, and MCO were extended to year round.
RDU did exceedingly well, with no year-round flights being cut and DEN, IAH, MCI, MSY, SAT, SAN, SJU, and TTN all being extended to year-round. Also, the schedules were loaded for MBJ, PUJ, CUN, RSW, PBI, and PHX. MBJ, PUJ, and RSW each running 2x weekly, and PHX, CUN, and PBI each running 3x weekly.
A second PHL-SJU and MCO-SJU frequency will both be running on Tu/Th/Su through the winter. In addition, ATL-SJU and RDU-SJU will be running through the winter.
flymco753 wrote:ROCDLFAN wrote:At this point, I don't see why not. NK probably won't do it. F9 has a good chance at ROC. I'd even throw it out there and say they could add ELM-MCO/DEN too.With BUF, SYR, and ALB now all either active or announced for F9, any chance we see ROC on the horizon for them?
AirFiero wrote:F9LASDEN wrote:It appears that a bunch of DEN flights that have previously been summer seasonal, or were initially announced as summer-seasonal, have been extended to year round, including:
-RDU
-BZN
-CLE
-ELP
-LIT
-FAR
-CID
-BOI
-CHS
-JAX
-FAT
-SBA
-SMF
-MEM
-GRR
-BUF
-YYC
-TYS
-SDF
-PIT
-SAV
-FSD
-GEG
In addition to this, DEN-OKC will be running daily through the winter (random thing I noticed). Also, TPA and RSW will be running daily, and MCO will be running 2x daily. One noticeable missing flight from DEN's winter schedule, however, is DEN-SJD. DEN-PVR is returning though.
LAS appears to have remained quite stable during this extension, with only MIA not returning, both TPA and BNA appear to be extended to year round (TPA assumingly coming at the expense of LAS-MIA), SFO returning for the season, and new additions YYC, SMF, GSP, ORF, JAX, and GEG all staying through the winter. (Contrary to what the LAS wikipedia page says, IAD is staying as well)
At MCO, it looks like ABQ, TUL, AUS, and SAT have been extended to year round. CLT, BUF, and BNA are all running daily this winter. SAN, TYS, MSN, and MSP are back for the winter, but it looks like CID, SFO, and PHX are not returning. It also looks like DSM also will not be running through the winter, but it may return next summer.
I randomly noticed ATL-SFO is returning, but SJC-ATL is being cut.
TPA and MIA were both huge surprises to me in the sense of how many routes aren't returning this winter.
TPA lost GSP (was this route cut before it even began? It won't show up on their website even for the fall), CMH, IND, MCI, and STL, managing to only keep MKE and MSP from last winter. However, DEN is going back to daily and LAS is staying through the winter after having previously been a summer-only flight, and will be daily.
The biggest surprise of this extension, IMO, was the huge cutdown at MIA compared to last winter. LAS, BUF, CVG, CLE, DTW, MKE, PVD, and TTN are all not returning, leaving LGA as the only flight to return from last winter.
RSW fared better than TPA and MIA in regards to cuts, with CMH, MCI, OMA, PVD, and STL not returning from last winter. However, CVG, CLE, DEN, MKE, and PHL will all be running daily this winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
PBI-PHL does not appear to be returning, but TTN-PBI and ISP-PBI both are running daily through the winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
JAX did better than I would have expected in terms of cuts. BUF, CVG, MKE, and SAT won't be running this winter, but DEN, LAS, AUS, ORD, MCI, MSP, PHL, STL, and TTN will all be running through the winter.
AUS did better than I would have expected as well. CVG and PHX were cut, but ATL, CMH, JAX, SNA, MCO, and PHL were extended to year round.
SAT did not fare as well, however. ATL, COS, PHX, SJC, and IAD all appear to be cut, and only CLT, SNA, and MCO were extended to year round.
RDU did exceedingly well, with no year-round flights being cut and DEN, IAH, MCI, MSY, SAT, SAN, SJU, and TTN all being extended to year-round. Also, the schedules were loaded for MBJ, PUJ, CUN, RSW, PBI, and PHX. MBJ, PUJ, and RSW each running 2x weekly, and PHX, CUN, and PBI each running 3x weekly.
A second PHL-SJU and MCO-SJU frequency will both be running on Tu/Th/Su through the winter. In addition, ATL-SJU and RDU-SJU will be running through the winter.
Where did you get the data?
Any more cuts at SJC?
WeatherPilot wrote:SYR-DEN/RDU/ORD all gone after November in the schedule update. They just started SYR-DEN/RDU and they haven't even started SYR-ORD and they've already been discontinued.
F9LASDEN wrote:AirFiero wrote:F9LASDEN wrote:It appears that a bunch of DEN flights that have previously been summer seasonal, or were initially announced as summer-seasonal, have been extended to year round, including:
-RDU
-BZN
-CLE
-ELP
-LIT
-FAR
-CID
-BOI
-CHS
-JAX
-FAT
-SBA
-SMF
-MEM
-GRR
-BUF
-YYC
-TYS
-SDF
-PIT
-SAV
-FSD
-GEG
In addition to this, DEN-OKC will be running daily through the winter (random thing I noticed). Also, TPA and RSW will be running daily, and MCO will be running 2x daily. One noticeable missing flight from DEN's winter schedule, however, is DEN-SJD. DEN-PVR is returning though.
LAS appears to have remained quite stable during this extension, with only MIA not returning, both TPA and BNA appear to be extended to year round (TPA assumingly coming at the expense of LAS-MIA), SFO returning for the season, and new additions YYC, SMF, GSP, ORF, JAX, and GEG all staying through the winter. (Contrary to what the LAS wikipedia page says, IAD is staying as well)
At MCO, it looks like ABQ, TUL, AUS, and SAT have been extended to year round. CLT, BUF, and BNA are all running daily this winter. SAN, TYS, MSN, and MSP are back for the winter, but it looks like CID, SFO, and PHX are not returning. It also looks like DSM also will not be running through the winter, but it may return next summer.
I randomly noticed ATL-SFO is returning, but SJC-ATL is being cut.
TPA and MIA were both huge surprises to me in the sense of how many routes aren't returning this winter.
TPA lost GSP (was this route cut before it even began? It won't show up on their website even for the fall), CMH, IND, MCI, and STL, managing to only keep MKE and MSP from last winter. However, DEN is going back to daily and LAS is staying through the winter after having previously been a summer-only flight, and will be daily.
The biggest surprise of this extension, IMO, was the huge cutdown at MIA compared to last winter. LAS, BUF, CVG, CLE, DTW, MKE, PVD, and TTN are all not returning, leaving LGA as the only flight to return from last winter.
RSW fared better than TPA and MIA in regards to cuts, with CMH, MCI, OMA, PVD, and STL not returning from last winter. However, CVG, CLE, DEN, MKE, and PHL will all be running daily this winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
PBI-PHL does not appear to be returning, but TTN-PBI and ISP-PBI both are running daily through the winter, and RDU is beginning in November.
JAX did better than I would have expected in terms of cuts. BUF, CVG, MKE, and SAT won't be running this winter, but DEN, LAS, AUS, ORD, MCI, MSP, PHL, STL, and TTN will all be running through the winter.
AUS did better than I would have expected as well. CVG and PHX were cut, but ATL, CMH, JAX, SNA, MCO, and PHL were extended to year round.
SAT did not fare as well, however. ATL, COS, PHX, SJC, and IAD all appear to be cut, and only CLT, SNA, and MCO were extended to year round.
RDU did exceedingly well, with no year-round flights being cut and DEN, IAH, MCI, MSY, SAT, SAN, SJU, and TTN all being extended to year-round. Also, the schedules were loaded for MBJ, PUJ, CUN, RSW, PBI, and PHX. MBJ, PUJ, and RSW each running 2x weekly, and PHX, CUN, and PBI each running 3x weekly.
A second PHL-SJU and MCO-SJU frequency will both be running on Tu/Th/Su through the winter. In addition, ATL-SJU and RDU-SJU will be running through the winter.
Where did you get the data?
Any more cuts at SJC?
I used the “airlines and destinations” section of the Wikipedia page for each airport, and punched each route in F9’s website to see what was bookable and what wasn’t. For reference, I typically used dates in early January, but poked around on different days to make sure I wasn’t missing any nonstop flights on days other than the ones I was checking. It’s not a perfect method, and one that is prone to mistakes (as other users have noticed and pointed out), so if you notice any other errors, definitely bring them up.
In addition, to ATL (which is moving to SFO) and SAT mentioned above, it looks like TUL is cut, and CVG is not running for the winter (though this route was initially announced as a seasonal route, so it may return next spring/summer). Of the routes that are left at SJC, DEN is going from daily to 3x weekly, LAS is going from 4x weekly to 3x weekly, (though F9 is running LAS-SFO 4x weekly on the days SJC isn’t running), and AUS is going from 3x weekly to 2x weekly. To me, these frequency reductions make sense for the slow winter season, and I’d look for them to increase back to what they’re at now next summer.
AirFiero wrote:F9LASDEN wrote:AirFiero wrote:
Where did you get the data?
Any more cuts at SJC?
I used the “airlines and destinations” section of the Wikipedia page for each airport, and punched each route in F9’s website to see what was bookable and what wasn’t. For reference, I typically used dates in early January, but poked around on different days to make sure I wasn’t missing any nonstop flights on days other than the ones I was checking. It’s not a perfect method, and one that is prone to mistakes (as other users have noticed and pointed out), so if you notice any other errors, definitely bring them up.
In addition, to ATL (which is moving to SFO) and SAT mentioned above, it looks like TUL is cut, and CVG is not running for the winter (though this route was initially announced as a seasonal route, so it may return next spring/summer). Of the routes that are left at SJC, DEN is going from daily to 3x weekly, LAS is going from 4x weekly to 3x weekly, (though F9 is running LAS-SFO 4x weekly on the days SJC isn’t running), and AUS is going from 3x weekly to 2x weekly. To me, these frequency reductions make sense for the slow winter season, and I’d look for them to increase back to what they’re at now next summer.
Thank you for the information.
So we should assume that the routes that were cut were seasonal from the beginning?
F9LASDEN wrote:AirFiero wrote:F9LASDEN wrote:
I used the “airlines and destinations” section of the Wikipedia page for each airport, and punched each route in F9’s website to see what was bookable and what wasn’t. For reference, I typically used dates in early January, but poked around on different days to make sure I wasn’t missing any nonstop flights on days other than the ones I was checking. It’s not a perfect method, and one that is prone to mistakes (as other users have noticed and pointed out), so if you notice any other errors, definitely bring them up.
In addition, to ATL (which is moving to SFO) and SAT mentioned above, it looks like TUL is cut, and CVG is not running for the winter (though this route was initially announced as a seasonal route, so it may return next spring/summer). Of the routes that are left at SJC, DEN is going from daily to 3x weekly, LAS is going from 4x weekly to 3x weekly, (though F9 is running LAS-SFO 4x weekly on the days SJC isn’t running), and AUS is going from 3x weekly to 2x weekly. To me, these frequency reductions make sense for the slow winter season, and I’d look for them to increase back to what they’re at now next summer.
Thank you for the information.
So we should assume that the routes that were cut were seasonal from the beginning?
The SJC-TUL and SJC-SAT routes seem like seasonal routes to me, and I wouldn’t be surprised if they came back next summer (though I’d be more surprised if SJC-TUL returned than if SJC-SAT returned).
In general, cuts in cities like AUS, JAX, and SAT all seemed like routes that were geared more towards the summer season so a lot of them may just be seasonal suspensions.
AirFiero wrote:F9LASDEN wrote:AirFiero wrote:
Thank you for the information.
So we should assume that the routes that were cut were seasonal from the beginning?
The SJC-TUL and SJC-SAT routes seem like seasonal routes to me, and I wouldn’t be surprised if they came back next summer (though I’d be more surprised if SJC-TUL returned than if SJC-SAT returned).
In general, cuts in cities like AUS, JAX, and SAT all seemed like routes that were geared more towards the summer season so a lot of them may just be seasonal suspensions.
I’d guess that SJC-TUL was just cheap access to the Bay Area at large.
F9LASDEN wrote:AirFiero wrote:F9LASDEN wrote:
The SJC-TUL and SJC-SAT routes seem like seasonal routes to me, and I wouldn’t be surprised if they came back next summer (though I’d be more surprised if SJC-TUL returned than if SJC-SAT returned).
In general, cuts in cities like AUS, JAX, and SAT all seemed like routes that were geared more towards the summer season so a lot of them may just be seasonal suspensions.
I’d guess that SJC-TUL was just cheap access to the Bay Area at large.
Another interesting thing about SJC-TUL is that operated as a SJC-TUL-IAD same plane, same flight number service, which makes wonder if F9 was using it, at least in part, to guage the feasibility of an SJC-IAD nonstop flight. If this route is successful this summer (if a lot of people stayed on in TUL and continued to IAD), I'd think it may be at least somewhat possible that F9 could be looking into launching an SJC-IAD nonstop flight next spring/summer. If not that, it at least likely gave the Washington metro area, in addition to the TUL area, cheap access to the Bay Area
jeepyjeep wrote:Buddys747 wrote:MDT-RDU/DEN are not extended past November. When they were here last time they kept DEN thru New Years. MCO stays at 3x week.
I’m a bit disappointed with the MDT service this time around, though I hope it’s doing well in terms of sales so far and will eventually be expanded. Was hoping for Tuesday/Thursday/Sunday, or at least one more frequency on DEN-MDT.
Frontier14 wrote:For all practical purposes, it is probably prudent to consider ALL NEW FRONTIER ROUTE ANNOUNCEMENTS as "seasonal". Even though they (F9) may indicate the city pairings are to be flown daily, do not count on it. It has been validated a number of times over, should the post announcement bookings be soft the route may not even start. Should the route fair okay initially, once a competitor enters the market and minimizes the route potential, F9 will often abandon it. Should the route not meet the revenue and operational requirements that are projected, it will not come back. Frontier does not allow for a lot of time, dollars or patience to be given for a route to develop which is one of the ULCC mantras.
Looking at the early winter extensions and cuts, I am not surprised. Frontier will fly where the $$$$ are, hence the reductions. Come next summer with the addition of a number of new planes, many of these routes will have a chance at coming back. F9 is going to fly them where they have had some success, along with probably a slew of new city pairs on a less than daily basis.
Frontier 14
WeatherPilot wrote:I've noticed in Syracuse F9 uses a set of stairs to board passengers from the rear of the plane as well. Is this a normal thing for F9? Do they do this in other cities? It'll be interesting come winter with the lake effect this area gets if they continue to board this way when the snow flies.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BlfsgXsnpFX ... 761e7307tg
TucsonDave wrote:WeatherPilot wrote:I've noticed in Syracuse F9 uses a set of stairs to board passengers from the rear of the plane as well. Is this a normal thing for F9? Do they do this in other cities? It'll be interesting come winter with the lake effect this area gets if they continue to board this way when the snow flies.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BlfsgXsnpFX ... 761e7307tg
I've wondered the same thing. If they're boarding only the rear of the plane through the stairs and the front portion through the jetway, my guess is the DEN flights are doing quite well.
Jshank83 wrote:^has anyone beside CLE announced any of these. It seems weird that most airports and F9 hasn't said anything yet.
mtnwest1979 wrote:I see on their route map they added a bunch of Volaris codeshares I guess. Also, Lafayette,LA was never shown on map, but listed as coming soon route. But now that is gone as well. Haven't looked if bookable, but not a good sign either way.
mtnwest1979 wrote:I see on their route map they added a bunch of Volaris codeshares I guess. Also, Lafayette,LA was never shown on map, but listed as coming soon route. But now that is gone as well. Haven't looked if bookable, but not a good sign either way.
Frontier14 wrote:So what do they do with all of their planes in the off season?
ROCDLFAN wrote:With BUF, SYR, and ALB now all either active or announced for F9, any chance we see ROC on the horizon for them?
WNflyer1523 wrote:I was just thinking, I find it kinda funny/ironic that 2 of Frontier's biggest northeast/mid atlantic stations (TTN and ISP) are the only ones in the northeast/mid atlantic that don't have a DEN nonstop
WNflyer1523 wrote:I was just thinking, I find it kinda funny/ironic that 2 of Frontier's biggest northeast/mid atlantic stations (TTN and ISP) are the only ones in the northeast/mid atlantic that don't have a DEN nonstop
dbman1 wrote:I think an ISP-DEN route would do exceptional. ISP used to have nonstop service to LAS via WN but was cancelled due to frequent flier mileage or something to that effect, and were losing money on that route. Many people can connect in DEN for service to LAS and LAX and I think that these routes would be very profitable. Many people from LI go to these destinations and would give them an incentive to try F9.
WNflyer1523 wrote:dbman1 wrote:I think an ISP-DEN route would do exceptional. ISP used to have nonstop service to LAS via WN but was cancelled due to frequent flier mileage or something to that effect, and were losing money on that route. Many people can connect in DEN for service to LAS and LAX and I think that these routes would be very profitable. Many people from LI go to these destinations and would give them an incentive to try F9.
At one point, WN's ISP-LAS was even at 2x daily. I think it was cancelled during the 08 recession or something like that.