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yeogeo
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Sun Apr 08, 2018 11:26 pm

Gary/Chicago International is approximately 25 miles from downtown. You'll have to pilot or charter your own aircraft into that field as at the moment there are no scheduled carriers operating at GYY, if I'm not mistaken.

Other airports in the area:
Midway, about 10 miles from downtown, is a major station for Southwest and also has domestic service with Delta. Porter and Volaris also operate internationally from MDW, IIRC.
Rockford (RFD), Northwest of Chicago, is served by Allegiant and is approximately 90 miles from downtown.
Finally, Milwaukee (MKE) is often considered to be a Chicago area airport, especially by folks from the northern suburbs. It is served by all major domestic airlines and has Amtrack service to Union Station in Chicago, a ride of about 80 miles.

Other posters will undoubtably have more to add (or correct!)- but that's the basics.

yeo
 
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JackMeahoff
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 2:12 am

When will ORD get a daily Moscow flight again?

Last I remember AA had a daily 777 during the summers. But that ended a few years ago.
 
planespotter20
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 2:43 am

I’m also curious about the ATS. Are the actually trains being upgraded to something new? Or are they still gonna use the blah trains we have now. I’d love to see some futuristic ATS system zipping around the airport. This combined with improved stations is imperative as a lot of traffic will be redirected on the trains now that all the car rental traffic will need to take it
 
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kngkyle
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 2:55 am

JackMeahoff wrote:
When will ORD get a daily Moscow flight again?

Last I remember AA had a daily 777 during the summers. But that ended a few years ago.


Probably not until the political climate calms and business ties start to grow again. Making the visa process easier would also increase the odds. I don't see it happening in the foreseeable future. Maybe 5-10 years if relations normalize.
 
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yeogeo
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 2:56 am

JackMeahoff wrote:
When will ORD get a daily Moscow flight again? Last I remember AA had a daily 777 during the summers. But that ended a few years ago.


Aeroflot was a regular at one time too.


Maybe its just me, but could see many other European/Middle Eastern destinations from O'Hare before Moscow, frankly.

yeo
Last edited by yeogeo on Mon Apr 09, 2018 3:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
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JackMeahoff
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 3:11 am

yeogeo wrote:
JackMeahoff wrote:
When will ORD get a daily Moscow flight again? Last I remember AA had a daily 777 during the summers. But that ended a few years ago.


Aeroflot was a regular at one time too.


Well, that is very interesting... I never noticed Aeroflot at ORD and I have been flying out of here my whole life.

yeogeo wrote:

Maybe its just me, but could see many other European/Middle Eastern Destinations from O'Hare before Moscow, frankly.

yeo


Nobody goes to Moscow for vacation but one would think the large Russian and Ukrainian communities in Chicago, second only to New York, would justify at least one direct flight per day. Maybe AA's decision to withdraw their daily B772 Moscow flights was political rather than economic. Either way I would love to fly direct someday to finally see Russia (during the summer of course!).
 
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yeogeo
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 3:27 am

JackMeahoff wrote:
Well, that is very interesting... I never noticed Aeroflot at ORD and I have been flying out of here my whole life.


Was in the 90's... probably before you were born :old: Was never a daily flight either. I seem to remember twice weekly?
 
chicawgo
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 4:45 am

planespotter20 wrote:
I’m also curious about the ATS. Are the actually trains being upgraded to something new? Or are they still gonna use the blah trains we have now. I’d love to see some futuristic ATS system zipping around the airport. This combined with improved stations is imperative as a lot of traffic will be redirected on the trains now that all the car rental traffic will need to take it


They are going to use the current trains as well as brand new cars which, I assume, are similar since the track is staying the same. There may be some aesthetic upgrades to the stations but I doubt there will be significant change to the infrastructure. I assume they’re upgrading software to make the entire system more efficient, etc.
 
Planeboy17
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 7:33 am

JackMeahoff wrote:
yeogeo wrote:
JackMeahoff wrote:
When will ORD get a daily Moscow flight again? Last I remember AA had a daily 777 during the summers. But that ended a few years ago.


Aeroflot was a regular at one time too.


Well, that is very interesting... I never noticed Aeroflot at ORD and I have been flying out of here my whole life.

yeogeo wrote:

Maybe its just me, but could see many other European/Middle Eastern Destinations from O'Hare before Moscow, frankly.

yeo


Nobody goes to Moscow for vacation but one would think the large Russian and Ukrainian communities in Chicago, second only to New York, would justify at least one direct flight per day. Maybe AA's decision to withdraw their daily B772 Moscow flights was political rather than economic. Either way I would love to fly direct someday to finally see Russia (during the summer of course!).



Aeroflot first started ORD flights around 1985 or so, with IL-62 aircraft. They would tech stop in SNN. They switched to the 767 around the mid 90s I think and left in 2001. That’s all on my memory so it’s probably way off but I think it’s close.
AAs Moscow flight was a flop. I don’t think it flew for more than 2 years, it may have only been one. The only reason they used the 777 was because of a radar issue with the 767 that Russia wouldn’t allow it to be used. I can’t remember the exact details but I’m sure someone can track down more info.
I agree with the others that Aeroflot won’t likely be landing at ORD anytime soon but Ukraine International has stated publicly they look to serve ORD in the future.
 
ADrum23
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 11:32 am

chicawgo wrote:
planespotter20 wrote:
I’m also curious about the ATS. Are the actually trains being upgraded to something new? Or are they still gonna use the blah trains we have now. I’d love to see some futuristic ATS system zipping around the airport. This combined with improved stations is imperative as a lot of traffic will be redirected on the trains now that all the car rental traffic will need to take it


They are going to use the current trains as well as brand new cars which, I assume, are similar since the track is staying the same. There may be some aesthetic upgrades to the stations but I doubt there will be significant change to the infrastructure. I assume they’re upgrading software to make the entire system more efficient, etc.


I thought I read they were replacing all the existing cars as welll? It wouldn’t make sense to keep the current ones as well as add new ones that have much more advanced technology.
 
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United787
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 7:41 pm

yeogeo wrote:
Market Watch (forgotten all about them- they're still publishing, I guess) has an article on Moody's recent "credit negative" rating. Nothing new, really, but the headline photo made me laugh: a stock photo of O'Hare 20 years ago with UA planes in battleship gray. Nothing like an outdated photograph to say "Marketwatch: we're out of touch".

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/ohare ... 2018-04-06

The author, Rachel Koning Beals also uses a phrase which makes me wonder what she means, exactly:
"O’Hare consistently is listed as one of the world’s best-connected and busiest airports, but those numbers are padded in part by a large number of regional flights. ..."
(She uses the exact same phrase in an earlier article on the ORD expansion:
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/what- ... 2018-02-26)

I don't understand how 50-75 seat jets "pad" numbers? I suppose I'm naively looking for actual well-reasoned writing instead of some barely disguised other-regional chauvinism. Maybe someone here can explain.


Anymore news on this? Is it something that could stop this project?

To everyone that wonders why they don't just tear everything down and build a brand new airport with an ATL layout... this is it. The OMP (O'Hare Modernization Program) runway reconfiguration, has already cost ORD $8 billion dollars. And that project had to happen before we could even consider O'Hare21 the terminal reconfiguration.

I have been concerned that these two major projects could send our fees up so high that it is unsustainable (like KIX). Of course, some of that is probably offset by our relatively low fares and huge volume... but I am sure this is a delicate balance. Don't get me wrong, ORD needs this project but they need to be careful they don't shoot themselves in the foot...
 
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United787
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 7:42 pm

Also, I arrived back at ORD yesterday and flew over the consolidated car rental... it looks almost done from the air. We also taxied past the L Stinger gates and there was no sign of exterior construction, also looking close to being ready!
 
gwrudolph
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 8:02 pm

yeogeo wrote:
jcwr56 wrote:
WS, AY, AZ still need to start and in May F9 moves over to T5. By June, with ET starting, on the aggregate it's about 20 additional daily flights into T5 Summer '18 over Summer '17.


Hopefully T-5 can handle the traffic; its going to be quite the summer.
Aside from those you mentioned, BA's A-380 upguage, AA starting VCE, increased flights with LO (KRK/BUD), UA starting up DUB/EDI, Asiana going 5 to 7 weekly, Copa going from 14 to 18 weekly, Lufthansa going from 7 to 10 weekly from MUC... I may be missing some from this Spring/early summer. :scratchchin:

yeo


Don't forget, some of that traffic is offset by seasonal reductions in UA and AA island and Mexico tourist destination flying. For example, in the winter on Saturdays, United alone probably flies 15 of those flights on Saturdays (7 just to CUN). They are smaller gauge aircraft, but there are a lot of them in the winter months!
 
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yeogeo
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 8:36 pm

gwrudolph wrote:
Don't forget, some of that [additional summer] traffic is offset by seasonal reductions in UA and AA island and Mexico tourist destination flying. For example, in the winter on Saturdays, United alone probably flies 15 of those flights on Saturdays (7 just to CUN). They are smaller gauge aircraft, but there are a lot of them in the winter months!


Good point, gwrudolph; I hadn't thought of that.
Still expect to see record volumes at T-5 this summer, should be interesting to watch.

yeo
 
ORDfan
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:07 pm

jcwr56 wrote:
in May F9 moves over to T5. By June, with ET starting, on the aggregate it's about 20 additional daily flights into T5 Summer '18 over Summer '17.


What's this about F9 moving to T5? For all their flight ops...? Is there even room for them at T5. Speaking of F9 though, CBJ reports that they are adding ORD-ELP 2x weekly, and daily ORD-ISP.

https://www.bizjournals.com/chicago/new ... ohare.html

Also, AA Chicago-New York shuttle service starts tomorrow. Didn't realize it was going to be so heavily 'branded,' but I guess AA is going all out with curb-side signage and dedicated kiosks and desks. Good for them... it's the top city pair after all.
 
ORDfan
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:13 pm

globalcabotage wrote:
Is it me, or does the new "Global T-2" seem to lack enough international gates? Of course this is just conceptual, but it doesn't look great for 1 and * carriers.


I'm kind of thinking the same thing now. I feel like there should be one more pier on the east-side of the Global terminal, where T3 G concourse is today. Something like T4 at JFK.
 
ADrum23
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:04 pm

ORDfan wrote:
globalcabotage wrote:
Is it me, or does the new "Global T-2" seem to lack enough international gates? Of course this is just conceptual, but it doesn't look great for 1 and * carriers.


I'm kind of thinking the same thing now. I feel like there should be one more pier on the east-side of the Global terminal, where T3 G concourse is today. Something like T4 at JFK.


I think they plan to do just that in "Phase 2", when the existing Terminal 3 is demolished and the current G is reconstructed into a southwest diagonal pier, similar to how the new island concourses will be constructed.

I do think there is enough gates regardless. Remember, the first new island concourse will have customs facilities as well and will be able to handle wide body aircraft.
 
ADrum23
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:21 pm

United787 wrote:
To everyone that wonders why they don't just tear everything down and build a brand new airport with an ATL layout... this is it. The OMP (O'Hare Modernization Program) runway reconfiguration, has already cost ORD $8 billion dollars. And that project had to happen before we could even consider O'Hare21 the terminal reconfiguration.

I have been concerned that these two major projects could send our fees up so high that it is unsustainable (like KIX). Of course, some of that is probably offset by our relatively low fares and huge volume... but I am sure this is a delicate balance. Don't get me wrong, ORD needs this project but they need to be careful they don't shoot themselves in the foot...


Well, this is what happens when you remain stagnant for 20+ years with virtually no investments. When it comes time and you can't wait any longer, you have to do it all at once and spend billions of dollars. They should have been doing incremental improvements as needed over time period rather than waiting to do a massive project all at once (for example, T5 should have been expanded years ago. That project does not require waiting for the reconfiguration of the runways). Also, not unlike the typical Chicago/Illinois fashion, the OMP has taken way too long, thus driving up the cost and delaying any terminal improvements.

Now, to be fair, it was mostly the extremely arbitrary old (UA/AA) lease agreement that prevented anything from happening sooner, and it's the government's fault for not coming in voiding it sooner. Nevertheless, ORD dug itself in a deep hole and is just now slowly climbing out it. I sincerely hope everything works out and the airport doesn't become too expensive. I don't think it will, but this is Chicago after all........
 
hnl-jack
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 11:30 pm

A little off the current topic, but I just heard a rumor that by mid 2019 HNL will likely have HA competing with UA to ORD. This would apparently HA's first mainland expansion with the A-332 as a result of the A-321LR's coming on board. Just interested to see if anyone from the Chicago area has heard anything. Aloha.
 
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yeogeo
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Mon Apr 09, 2018 11:48 pm

ADrum23 wrote:
...this is what happens when you remain stagnant for 20+ years with virtually no investments. When it comes time and you can't wait any longer, you have to do it all at once and spend billions of dollars.


This speaks to one of Moody's criticism of the O'Hare project:
"If, as expected, the city borrows against future landing fees, terminal rents and concession revenues to bankroll the entire project, O’Hare’s debt load will rise to $14.5 billion by 2022. That’s well above the increase at other major airports, Moody’s said."
It is long overdue as you say. It is a major league airport - one of the biggest - what does one expect? The price tag will be massive.

Moody's also said: "Although airlines can pass increases to passengers, we think cost increases that are significantly higher than the increases of rival airports will diminish profitability and increases the risk of losing connecting services in the future.

Who is going to (or who can?) replace the connecting traffic a major connecting hub such as O'Hare? Moody hints here that airlines can ignore it for lesser costs at other airports?

quotes above from: https://chicago.suntimes.com/news/moody ... -negative/

United787 wrote:
I have been concerned that these two major projects could send our fees up so high that it is unsustainable (like KIX). Of course, some of that is probably offset by our relatively low fares and huge volume... but I am sure this is a delicate balance. Don't get me wrong, ORD needs this project but they need to be careful they don't shoot themselves in the foot...


KIX has proven not to be unsustainable - the rumors of its demise are overdone. It does has high fees but the airport cannot be ignored; in the latter it resembles ORD. One big difference there is that the Japanese and local governments have the airport's back (the national government and the Osaka prefectural government own most of the airport corporation).

ORD must maintain it credit on this project only on its operations, at least at the present state of the financing. Perhaps that will change.

yeo
Last edited by yeogeo on Tue Apr 10, 2018 12:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
chidino
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Tue Apr 10, 2018 12:03 am

RE the ATS: Chicago is stuck because the original French builder, Matra, est fini (they were mainly known for cars and missiles). The technology, which they called Véhicule Automatique Léger, is an orphan; they're now a division of EADS and they abandoned the transit thing. Problem is it uses 256-cm width which only O'Hare and the Taipei metro use, so their choice of suppliers is really limited. Thank God Taipei needed replacements and got Bombardier to adapt their popular Innovia series for them. I suspect, even with an order of 36, that getting someone to adapt might have been an issue; thankfully, it's not. (The 200s are used at DFW for AA's train behind security, for example.)

These are faster, better around curves, easier to pair, etc plus the technology (which is proven, thank God) is miles ahead of the 25-year old units. And I like the new paint scheme: very classy. Only question I have left is wonky: are these new -256s based on the -200 or -300 platform, which is Bombardier's latest? We're not in any position except to be grateful that these were off-the-shelf, but it would be nice to future-proof as much as possible.
 
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yeogeo
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Tue Apr 10, 2018 12:08 am

chidino wrote:
...I like the new paint scheme: very classy.

Can you post pix?
 
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yeogeo
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Tue Apr 10, 2018 12:29 am

ORD did well in the latest tally from ACI:

http://www.aci.aero/News/Releases/Most- ... -threaten-

Cargo, especially, posted numbers above most of its peers (bested in percentage only by DOH). This due to expanding air cargo facilities, undoubtably.

"A strengthened economy in the United States (US), together with an increase in global industrial production, and a strong US dollar have boosted inbound air cargo markets in recent years. Key air cargo centers, such as Chicago – O’Hare (ORD), experienced growth of 12.6% for 2017."

Passenger numbers has ORD at number six, with a better percentage gain than the top two, ATL & PEK.
 
ADrum23
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Tue Apr 10, 2018 1:34 am

yeogeo wrote:
ADrum23 wrote:
...this is what happens when you remain stagnant for 20+ years with virtually no investments. When it comes time and you can't wait any longer, you have to do it all at once and spend billions of dollars.


This speaks to one of Moody's criticism of the O'Hare project:
"If, as expected, the city borrows against future landing fees, terminal rents and concession revenues to bankroll the entire project, O’Hare’s debt load will rise to $14.5 billion by 2022. That’s well above the increase at other major airports, Moody’s said."
It is long overdue as you say. It is a major league airport - one of the biggest - what does one expect? The price tag will be massive.

Moody's also said: "Although airlines can pass increases to passengers, we think cost increases that are significantly higher than the increases of rival airports will diminish profitability and increases the risk of losing connecting services in the future.

Who is going to (or who can?) replace the connecting traffic a major connecting hub such as O'Hare? Moody hints here that airlines can ignore it for lesser costs at other airports?

quotes above from: https://chicago.suntimes.com/news/moody ... -negative/


Yeah, Moody's is overexaggrating here. I doubt the costs can get too high to the point where airlines would realistically consider relocating. Where would they go?

I'd ask Moody's what is the alternative? Keep the airport as it is? That's not an option. ORD has fallen way behind (terminal wise) most other major airports and its time to invest some serious $$$. It's an abomination that it has gone this long without a major terminal expansion/redevelopment project. Frankly, I don't think this plan goes far enough, but I have to remember that it is just Phase 1 and more work will be done as demand rises.
 
chidino
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Tue Apr 10, 2018 2:09 am

@Yeogeo: Thanks to rl12383 at chitransit.org for the link: https://www.rmchin.com/portfolios/ohare ... it-system/ (second photo -- don't panic)
 
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yeogeo
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Tue Apr 10, 2018 2:37 am

chidino wrote:
second photo

Image
Very nice! Look forward to riding in them

yeo
 
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yeogeo
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Wed Apr 11, 2018 4:15 pm

Lewis Lazare in the Chicago Business Journal yesterday published two articles both relevant to Chicago airports:

A close race between Delta, United and American in the OAG on-time arrivals report last month(82.8/82.2/81.5 respectively). Southwest, however did not fair as well (77.8%)- we've all seen the headlines this winter concerning delays for Southwest at Midway so no surprise.

Also, "Southwest’s D:00 stat (flights that depart on or before the scheduled departure time) was far worse [than their on-time arrivals ratio], as 47 percent of Southwest’s flights in March departed on or before their scheduled departure time — less than one out of every two flights."

However, "American Airlines had the worst cancellation stat, with 3.9 percent of flights cancelled. United cancelled 2.9 percent of its flights, while Delta cancelled 2.3 percent. Southwest had the fewest, with 1.8 percent of flights cancelled."

https://www.bizjournals.com/chicago/new ... j=80955591

Lazare also has results for United's March traffic and load factors:

https://www.bizjournals.com/chicago/new ... j=80955591

UA saw very healthy increases in international pax, which buttresses the reports here of big increases in international arrivals at T-5.
 
fsafsx
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Wed Apr 11, 2018 4:16 pm

When will Delta add ORD to LA? Because this is long overdue.
 
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yeogeo
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Wed Apr 11, 2018 4:20 pm

fsafsx wrote:
When will Delta add ORD to LA? Because this is long overdue.


Its the perennial answer: where are the gates? Or what flights are eliminated?
The move to T-5 will be good for Delta at ORD.
 
fsafsx
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Wed Apr 11, 2018 5:03 pm

yeogeo wrote:
fsafsx wrote:
When will Delta add ORD to LA? Because this is long overdue.


Its the perennial answer: where are the gates? Or what flights are eliminated?
The move to T-5 will be good for Delta at ORD.
It'll be good for Delta so they can expand at ORD, I think we can see Florida flights from it like Jacksonville, Tampa, Fort Myers and Fort Lauderdale.
 
jbs2886
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Wed Apr 11, 2018 5:27 pm

fsafsx wrote:
yeogeo wrote:
fsafsx wrote:
When will Delta add ORD to LA? Because this is long overdue.


Its the perennial answer: where are the gates? Or what flights are eliminated?
The move to T-5 will be good for Delta at ORD.
It'll be good for Delta so they can expand at ORD, I think we can see Florida flights from it like Jacksonville, Tampa, Fort Myers and Fort Lauderdale.


I highly doubt you would see FL flights. You will see LAX, BOS and maybe some focus cities (i.e., RDU, AUS, PDX, etc.).
 
ckfred
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Wed Apr 11, 2018 6:17 pm

Planeboy17 wrote:

sircygnus wrote:
Reminder, runway 15/33 will be decommissioned tomorrow. I believe the airport diagram has already been updated. Sad to see this runway go.


Many good memories of taking off on (then) 32L from T in my lifetime!


Once, I saw a departure from the end of 32L. Arrivals were on 27L and 27R, while departures were on 32L and 32R. I saw a BA tail heading out to the end of 32L, while sitting on an AA 738 in the penalty box near the far end of T5. Can't remember if it was a 772 or a 744, but it caught me by surprise to see an aircraft out at the end of 32L and then doing a take-off roll.
 
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yeogeo
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Wed Apr 11, 2018 7:23 pm

ADrum23 wrote:
ORDfan wrote:
globalcabotage wrote:
Is it me, or does the new "Global T-2" seem to lack enough international gates? Of course this is just conceptual, but it doesn't look great for 1 and * carriers.


I'm kind of thinking the same thing now. I feel like there should be one more pier on the east-side of the Global terminal, where T3 G concourse is today. Something like T4 at JFK.


I do think there is enough gates regardless. Remember, the first new island concourse will have customs facilities as well and will be able to handle wide body aircraft.


Exactly! Its presented that way in the video produced for the O'Hare 21 website, seen here:
http://www.flychicago.com/sites/ohare21 ... fault.aspx
-clicking on "About" brings you to a page with video. The first few minutes show the various improvements by highlighting them in animation.
 
Planeboy17
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Wed Apr 11, 2018 7:35 pm

ckfred wrote:
Planeboy17 wrote:

sircygnus wrote:
Reminder, runway 15/33 will be decommissioned tomorrow. I believe the airport diagram has already been updated. Sad to see this runway go.


Many good memories of taking off on (then) 32L from T in my lifetime!


Once, I saw a departure from the end of 32L. Arrivals were on 27L and 27R, while departures were on 32L and 32R. I saw a BA tail heading out to the end of 32L, while sitting on an AA 738 in the penalty box near the far end of T5. Can't remember if it was a 772 or a 744, but it caught me by surprise to see an aircraft out at the end of 32L and then doing a take-off roll.


Was probably too heavy for 32R. A lot of the Asian flights used 32R. Sometimes they’d have to wait quite a while before departing.
 
Planeboy17
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Wed Apr 11, 2018 7:36 pm

Used 32L I meant to write.
 
ORDfan
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Wed Apr 11, 2018 7:52 pm

Didn't realize AA was building a giant new hanger facility and support offices until I saw it off I-90 this morning. It's really hard to miss now: the structure is noticeably taller than the existing hanger next door. The contractor's page notes that it can hold six 737's, but it is also looks certainly tall enough to accommodate some of the big birds too.

Image

http://www.weoneil.com/portfolio/americ ... -hangar-2/
 
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United787
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Wed Apr 11, 2018 7:59 pm

ORDfan wrote:
Didn't realize AA was building a giant new hanger facility and support offices until I saw it off I-90 this morning. It's really hard to miss now: the structure is noticeably taller than the existing hanger next door. The contractor's page notes that it can hold six 737's, but it is also looks certainly tall enough to accommodate some of the big birds too.


I believe they had to build a new one to make room for runway 9C/27C.
 
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yeogeo
Posts: 817
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Wed Apr 11, 2018 10:35 pm

American Airlines Flight Makes Emergency Landing at O’Hare

https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/A ... 41203.html
 
jcwr56
Posts: 813
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 11:36 am

Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Wed Apr 11, 2018 11:25 pm

hnl-jack wrote:
A little off the current topic, but I just heard a rumor that by mid 2019 HNL will likely have HA competing with UA to ORD. This would apparently HA's first mainland expansion with the A-332 as a result of the A-321LR's coming on board. Just interested to see if anyone from the Chicago area has heard anything. Aloha.


Aloha,

Where's Global to post this? :wave: He seems to be in the know.

The question is, do the numbers work to make HNL a viable route for HA out of Chicago.
 
HNL
Posts: 469
Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2004 1:51 am

Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Thu Apr 12, 2018 12:15 am

beeweel15 wrote:
What about Chicago/Gary Airport in Gary, Indiana. How far is it from downtown Chicago and is it worth it to fly there to get to Chicago. What other alternate airports are there to serve the city


MDW is the closest alternative.

MKE for the north suburbs.

GYY lacks any airline with regularly scheduled daily air service to serve the biz travelers. It does/used to get Allegient but they left when GYY under went runway rebuilding.
HNL - There's no place like it!
 
ADrum23
Posts: 1633
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Thu Apr 12, 2018 1:25 am

jcwr56 wrote:
hnl-jack wrote:
A little off the current topic, but I just heard a rumor that by mid 2019 HNL will likely have HA competing with UA to ORD. This would apparently HA's first mainland expansion with the A-332 as a result of the A-321LR's coming on board. Just interested to see if anyone from the Chicago area has heard anything. Aloha.


Aloha,

Where's Global to post this? :wave: He seems to be in the know.

The question is, do the numbers work to make HNL a viable route for HA out of Chicago.


I think the numbers could work, at least seasonally. I don't know the exact PDEW between ORD and HNL, but I'll bet there is enough demand in the winter for more than one HNL flight (I believe the UA flight there is the only HNL flight ORD has right now). I'd like to see AA bring back ORD-HNL, but I doubt it will happen. Perhaps though AA could use their codeshare with HA to funnel traffic through ORD for a flight to work.
 
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yeogeo
Posts: 817
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Thu Apr 12, 2018 1:48 am

ADrum23 wrote:
jcwr56 wrote:
Do the numbers work to make HNL a viable route for HA out of Chicago.


I think the numbers could work, at least seasonally. I don't know the exact PDEW between ORD and HNL, but I'll bet there is enough demand in the winter for more than one HNL flight (I believe the UA flight there is the only HNL flight ORD has right now). I'd like to see AA bring back ORD-HNL, but I doubt it will happen. Perhaps though AA could use their codeshare with HA to funnel traffic through ORD for a flight to work.


Assuming that they give it a try, where could Hawaiian find a gate? T-5? T-3??
 
ADrum23
Posts: 1633
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Thu Apr 12, 2018 1:54 am

yeogeo wrote:
ADrum23 wrote:
jcwr56 wrote:
Do the numbers work to make HNL a viable route for HA out of Chicago.


I think the numbers could work, at least seasonally. I don't know the exact PDEW between ORD and HNL, but I'll bet there is enough demand in the winter for more than one HNL flight (I believe the UA flight there is the only HNL flight ORD has right now). I'd like to see AA bring back ORD-HNL, but I doubt it will happen. Perhaps though AA could use their codeshare with HA to funnel traffic through ORD for a flight to work.


Assuming that they give it a try, where could Hawaiian find a gate? T-5? T-3??


That's a good point. I'm not sure.

This is all the more reason they need to get going on the gate expansion. When will the Terminal 5 gate expansion break ground?
 
HNL
Posts: 469
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Thu Apr 12, 2018 1:56 am

yeogeo wrote:
ADrum23 wrote:
jcwr56 wrote:
Do the numbers work to make HNL a viable route for HA out of Chicago.


I think the numbers could work, at least seasonally. I don't know the exact PDEW between ORD and HNL, but I'll bet there is enough demand in the winter for more than one HNL flight (I believe the UA flight there is the only HNL flight ORD has right now). I'd like to see AA bring back ORD-HNL, but I doubt it will happen. Perhaps though AA could use their codeshare with HA to funnel traffic through ORD for a flight to work.


Assuming that they give it a try, where could Hawaiian find a gate? T-5? T-3??


Get buddy buddy with AA in T3. T5 would depend on the arrival or departure time. There is space early morning, but starts to fill up as the day goes on.
HNL - There's no place like it!
 
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SumChristianus
Posts: 492
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:00 am

Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Thu Apr 12, 2018 1:56 am

ADrum23 wrote:
jcwr56 wrote:
hnl-jack wrote:
A little off the current topic, but I just heard a rumor that by mid 2019 HNL will likely have HA competing with UA to ORD. This would apparently HA's first mainland expansion with the A-332 as a result of the A-321LR's coming on board. Just interested to see if anyone from the Chicago area has heard anything. Aloha.


Aloha,

Where's Global to post this? :wave: He seems to be in the know.

The question is, do the numbers work to make HNL a viable route for HA out of Chicago.


I think the numbers could work, at least seasonally. I don't know the exact PDEW between ORD and HNL, but I'll bet there is enough demand in the winter for more than one HNL flight (I believe the UA flight there is the only HNL flight ORD has right now). I'd like to see AA bring back ORD-HNL, but I doubt it will happen. Perhaps though AA could use their codeshare with HA to funnel traffic through ORD for a flight to work.


HNL-ORD
191.2 PDEW, $544.94 (one way fare), $0.13 yield and a route length of 4,293 miles.

I think its definitely too long for an A321, but its pretty good sized as long-haul markets go, about as long in distance as Chicago-London.
A Traddie wannaby---UA DL LH NW AA --- Next IND-DEN UA CR7
"Born in Wonder, Brought to Wisdom"
 
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yeogeo
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Thu Apr 12, 2018 2:15 pm

 
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jetblastdubai
Posts: 1776
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Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Thu Apr 12, 2018 9:07 pm

Planeboy17 wrote:

Was probably too heavy for 32R. A lot of the Asian flights used 32L. Sometimes they’d have to wait quite a while before departing.


For ATC, 32L full-length departures were almost always a pain to coordinate and execute efficiently while still within the bounds of a handful of separation standards. If arrivals were landing on 27L (old configuration) you could depart 32L full length with only a slightly bigger gap in the 27L arrival stream. You couldn't roll 32L until the 27L arrival was committed to exit either prior to 32L or had rolled thru the intersection. It was roughly 3,000' from the threshold of 32L to the 27L intersection and the 32L departure had to be thru the intersection before the next 27L arrival crossed the threshold. That was the easy configuration.

With easterly winds and arrivals on 4R and 9R it was easier yet as the intersection was relatively close to the 9R arrival threshold and the arrival would always scoot thru the 32L intersection rather quickly.

As luck would have it, the Asia rush was in the 1100-1300 time period and this was also a busy arrival period where, weather permitting, ORD would be landing on 3 runways...4R, 9R and 9L. To depart 32L full length, the tower had to coordinate with approach for very large gap on the 9L arrivals so 32L could depart with legal runway separation in addition to wake turbulence separation with the successive 9L arrival.

In rare instances when the winds were rather strong out of the east, ORD would land 4R, 9R and 9L and the heavy departures would require 14R. For this magic show a gap had to created on 9L, 9R and 4R simultaneously with 9R and 4R being runway separation PLUS wake turbulence gaps as well.

There is no place like O'Hare.
Every zoo is a petting zoo......if you're a man!
 
chidino
Posts: 60
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2018 12:36 pm

Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Thu Apr 12, 2018 11:04 pm

yeogeo wrote:
ADrum23 wrote:
ORDfan wrote:

I'm kind of thinking the same thing now. I feel like there should be one more pier on the east-side of the Global terminal, where T3 G concourse is today. Something like T4 at JFK.


I do think there is enough gates regardless. Remember, the first new island concourse will have customs facilities as well and will be able to handle wide body aircraft.


Exactly! Its presented that way in the video produced for the O'Hare 21 website, seen here:
http://www.flychicago.com/sites/ohare21 ... fault.aspx
-clicking on "About" brings you to a page with video. The first few minutes show the various improvements by highlighting them in animation.


Reading over the plan, Satellite 1 Concourse (as it's referred to) includes 1 Class VI gate and "sterile vertical circulation from each aircraft gate position to a sterile corridor network... for international arriving flights, APC kiosks..." (pg. 7 of appendix L) so right off the bat the first new concourse will handle int'l. The mezzanine will only have about 153,200 sq ft as opposed to departures (281,000) because of all the sterile facilities.
 
chidino
Posts: 60
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2018 12:36 pm

Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:11 am

chidino wrote:
yeogeo wrote:
ADrum23 wrote:

I do think there is enough gates regardless. Remember, the first new island concourse will have customs facilities as well and will be able to handle wide body aircraft.


Exactly! Its presented that way in the video produced for the O'Hare 21 website, seen here:
http://www.flychicago.com/sites/ohare21 ... fault.aspx
-clicking on "About" brings you to a page with video. The first few minutes show the various improvements by highlighting them in animation.


Reading over the plan, Satellite 1 Concourse (as it's referred to) includes 1 Class VI gate and "sterile vertical circulation from each aircraft gate position to a sterile corridor network... for international arriving flights, APC kiosks..." (pg. 7 of appendix L) so right off the bat the first new concourse will handle int'l. The mezzanine will only have about 153,200 sq ft as opposed to departures (281,000) because of all the sterile facilities.


And then I read forward to page 9: (I wish I could post it, but it's one huge xeroxed file) Intl pax will ascend to a third-floor corridor network that includes APC kiosks that lead to escalators that descend down to a sterile tunnel that leads to escalators that connect to the OGT (global terminal) CPB arrivals hall. There's no allocation for anything other than APC kiosks, no inspection area; obviously there's going to have to be some temp facility in place while we wait for OGT/new T2.
 
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yeogeo
Posts: 817
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 2:47 pm

Re: Chicago aviation news - 2018

Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:18 am

chidino wrote:
Reading over the plan, Satellite 1 Concourse (as it's referred to) includes 1 Class VI gate and "sterile vertical circulation from each aircraft gate position to a sterile corridor network... for international arriving flights, APC kiosks..." (pg. 7 of appendix L) so right off the bat the first new concourse will handle int'l. The mezzanine will only have about 153,200 sq ft as opposed to departures (281,000) because of all the sterile facilities.


Interesting details, chidino. Here's the illustration from O'Hare 21:
Image

The terminal furthest to the west (left-hand side) is Satellite 2, a domestic United terminal (I assume the replacement for the current T-2 operations). Moving east is Satellite 1 referred to above, which is attached to current T-1, C gates (domestic United) and in the site of the current T-2 is shown the O'Hare Global Terminal and Concourse, which combined with Sat. 1 will handle international flights for Oneworld and Star.
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