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KGRB
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Wisconsin Aviation Thread - 2018

Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:17 am

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SkyWest is reactivating the former Midwest/Republic hangars at MKE:

https://www.jsonline.com/story/money/bu ... 024580001/

"At 190,000 square feet, the facility in Milwaukee will be SkyWest's largest maintenance facility as measured by square footage. It will run 24 hours a day and has capacity to service up to 12 aircraft at a time."

SkyWest already has a much-smaller hangar on the southwest side of the airfield, so this is a huge expansion for them. Between OO and ZW's existing maintenance base there, MKE will certainly be bustling with RJ MX activity over the coming years.

It's great to see this huge complex being put back to use. Hopefully a buyer for the former Skyway hangar on Layton Ave. will be found soon as well.
Flown on: Air Wisconsin, America West, American, Compass, Delta, Endeavor Air, Envoy, ExpressJet, GoJet, KLM, Mesa, Mesaba, Midwest Express, Northwest, Piedmont, Pinnacle, PSA, Skyway, SkyWest, United, US Airways
 
9w748capt
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Re: Wisconsin Aviation Thread

Sat Jan 13, 2018 4:07 am

I don't have much to add but - cool thread! I have gone memories of living in MKE. Would love to make it back to Door County sometime.
 
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qf789
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Re: Wisconsin Aviation Thread - 2018

Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:00 am

As the previous thread has not been active for a while a new thread has been started, link to previous thread

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=597313&p=20089007#p20089007
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mke717spotter
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Re: Wisconsin Aviation Thread

Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:01 am

KGRB wrote:
"At 190,000 square feet, the facility in Milwaukee will be SkyWest's largest maintenance facility as measured by square footage. It will run 24 hours a day and has capacity to service up to 12 aircraft at a time."

SkyWest already has a much-smaller hangar on the southwest side of the airfield, so this is a huge expansion for them. Between OO and ZW's existing maintenance base there, MKE will certainly be bustling with RJ MX activity over the coming years.

I hope this doesn't mean we're going to lose mainline flights as they try to cycle RJs through here for maintenance.

In other news, DL and AS are both upgrading SEA-MKE to mainline in the coming months.
Will you watch the Cleveland Browns and the Detroit Lions on Sunday? Only if coach Eric Mangini resigned after a loss.
 
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knope2001
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Re: Wisconsin Aviation Thread

Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:02 pm

mke717spotter wrote:
KGRB wrote:
"At 190,000 square feet, the facility in Milwaukee will be SkyWest's largest maintenance facility as measured by square footage. It will run 24 hours a day and has capacity to service up to 12 aircraft at a time."

SkyWest already has a much-smaller hangar on the southwest side of the airfield, so this is a huge expansion for them. Between OO and ZW's existing maintenance base there, MKE will certainly be bustling with RJ MX activity over the coming years.

I hope this doesn't mean we're going to lose mainline flights as they try to cycle RJs through here for maintenance.

In other news, DL and AS are both upgrading SEA-MKE to mainline in the coming months.


Skywest already have a whole lot of aircraft coming through Milwaukee each day but having the base here already likely gives us a few more RJ's than we might otherwise have. In 2016 Milwaukee was the second-busiest Skywest station outside of their hubs:

Average daily departures full year 2016
23.5 Boise
21.8 Milwaukee
21.1 Fresno
19.3 Tucson
17.3 Colorado Springs
16.6 San Diego
16.5 Santa Barbara
16.5 Palm Springs

Not coincidentally all of those cities except SAN and SBA have Skywest maintenance bases.

If you throw in Expressjet (also owned by Skywest) thhe only non-hub city which surpasses MKE's activity is Cleveland, which has the residual hub point-to-point flying.
(Anybody know if Skywest bases routinely do work on ExpressJet aircraft? )

Average daily Skywest+ExpressJet departures full year 2016
30.7 Cleveland
28.7 Milwaukee
23.5 Boise
21.1 Fresno
19.8 Tucson
18.7 Richmond
18.2 Baton Rouge
18.0 Colorado Springs

The picture is changing somewhat since Air Wisconsin ZW s transitioning to United Express. Skywest used to have most (sometimes all) of the Milwaukee-Chicago flying for United and American. Now ZW will have most of the United flying as a way to rotate aircraft to/from their own sizable base in Milwaukee. I've heard that's why we're getting more Skywest E75 to Denver instead of mainline -- Skywest needs to rotate UA aircraft here. The mx base here is way we already have two early-morning Skywest RJ's to Detroit rather than mainline flights -- it's been that way for years.

I do think having a maintenance base tends to get you more aircraft of the type served there. Sometimes that means having an RJ instead of a mainline aircraft on a flight, but on the other hand it can also mean getting (or keeping) a flight which would not otherwise exist. I'd love to see a few Skywest E75's on MKE-ORD and then have Air Wisconsin rotate an aircraft here with a nonstop to Dulles. We shall see.
 
GSPSPOT
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Re: Wisconsin Aviation Thread - 2018

Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:13 pm

Hopefully the current seasonal SAN & SFO flts on WN will run longer or become year-round once more new planes come online.
Great Lakes, great life.
 
kiowa
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Re: Wisconsin Aviation Thread - 2018

Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:48 pm

GSPSPOT wrote:
Hopefully the current seasonal SAN & SFO flts on WN will run longer or become year-round once more new planes come online.



It is a sad comparison between the outstanding airline "Midwest Express" and the low budget airline "Southwest". Milwaukee lost a true gem when Midex went out of business. I now avoid MKE and prefer ORD.
 
UWPAviation
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Re: Wisconsin Aviation Thread - 2018

Sat Jan 13, 2018 4:55 pm

kiowa wrote:
GSPSPOT wrote:
Hopefully the current seasonal SAN & SFO flts on WN will run longer or become year-round once more new planes come online.



It is a sad comparison between the outstanding airline "Midwest Express" and the low budget airline "Southwest". Milwaukee lost a true gem when Midex went out of business. I now avoid MKE and prefer ORD.


It is sad, we do not have any year round Cali service. Besides the Southwest flight to LAX. Which has poor times.

With Alaska moving to mainline service for there Seattle route I would love to see them open up daily SFO flight with the acquisition of Virgin and a daily LAX flight.
 
GSPSPOT
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Re: Wisconsin Aviation Thread - 2018

Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:02 pm

UWPAviation wrote:
kiowa wrote:
GSPSPOT wrote:
Hopefully the current seasonal SAN & SFO flts on WN will run longer or become year-round once more new planes come online.



It is a sad comparison between the outstanding airline "Midwest Express" and the low budget airline "Southwest". Milwaukee lost a true gem when Midex went out of business. I now avoid MKE and prefer ORD.


It is sad, we do not have any year round Cali service. Besides the Southwest flight to LAX. Which has poor times.

With Alaska moving to mainline service for there Seattle route I would love to see them open up daily SFO flight with the acquisition of Virgin and a daily LAX flight.

Agreed that specific situation is sad, but I will continue to use MKE for its much more manageable size and convenience unless fare differences are ridiculous.
Great Lakes, great life.
 
planespotter20
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Re: Wisconsin Aviation Thread - 2018

Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:49 pm

Madison is getting a new nonstop flight from UA... to SFO!!

http://www.nbc15.com/content/news/Dane- ... 31893.html
 
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knope2001
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Re: Wisconsin Aviation Thread - 2018

Mon Jan 15, 2018 3:28 am

planespotter20 wrote:
Madison is getting a new nonstop flight from UA... to SFO!!


UWPAviation wrote:
It is sad, we do not have any year round Cali service. Besides the Southwest flight to LAX. Which has poor times.
With Alaska moving to mainline service for there Seattle route I would love to see them open up daily SFO flight with the acquisition of Virgin and a daily LAX flight.


I’d say odds are better than even at least MKE-SFO returns year-round on Southwest, but competition to California seems painfully overdue. It’s only January, of course, but so far I’m surprised that we don’t (yet) even have something as minimal as a seasonal 3x/week redeye to any California destination on somebody like Frontier, Allegiant. Of course if I had a choice I’d prefer some year-round competition from a big player like Delta, American, United or Alaska, but it seems like there’s an abundance of leisure traveler spill during the warmer half of the year for a peak-chaser to add. The surest way to get United to start MKE-SFO is to have Alaska start it, and ditto for Delta if American were to add MKE-LAX.

In spite of seasonally losing those flights last fall 2017 has been pretty good at MKE. Milwaukee has thirteen new nonstop destinations from 3/17 through 3/17, giving Milwaukee 50.

Columbus
Guadalajara
Houston Hobby
Los Cabos
Miami
Nashville
Omaha
Orlando Sanford
Phoenix Mesa
Portland
Punta Gorda
Salt Lake City
St Petersburg

On top of that list we are likely to have at least a few more added in 2018 given OneJet’s focus city expansion plans, It's also possible Allegiant could add a few new markets such as Myrtle Beach or Austin this summer as their service continues to mature here -- it's only a few months old. What we can really use in 2018 is some expansion in some of our routes – longer seasons or year-round for some seasonal routes, more frequent flights on some less frequent (or less than daily) routes. For example Guadalajara posted great numbers in this its first summer – over 92% full in July with about 165/178 seat occupied, so maybe we can see added frequency during busier months. Getting year-round to SFO and hopefully SAN as well are high on the wish list, of course, but I’m hopeful those are in Southwest’s plans even if the routes don’t see new competitors. It would be good to see Portland's season run longer, and perhaps it will at some point, but with so many nonstop Seattle seats there may be pressure to serve Portland via a Seattle connection versus running the nonstop longer.

Madison’s SFO service is on E175 regional jets which are (apparently) already pushing useful range to go that far. The additional 75 or so miles to MKE is likely too far or perhaps Milwaukee would already have United or Alaska to SFO with the E75. It’s quite a coup for Madison to get a west coast nonstop – I’m guessing it’s among the smallest airports in the central US to have nonstops to both coasts.
 
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knope2001
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Re: Wisconsin Aviation Thread - 2018

Tue Jan 16, 2018 7:58 pm

Since this is a Wisconsin thread and not only Milwaukee here is how 2017 traffic is looking through October for out-state airports:

Through October:
Madison
1,404,717 + 4.1%
Green Bay
420,166 -3.4%
Appleton
412,314 +2.3%
Wausau/Central Wisconsin
174,551 -1.7
La Crosse
138,852 -3.2%
Rhinelander
35,180 +13.2%
Eau Claire
35,051 +11.2%

Madison is posting solid growth and will continue to do so with more attention in 2018. Appleton surpasses Green Bay in some months and I suspect they may pull ahead, but in essence they’ve been pretty much on par for several years.

I find it interesting that the EAS markets of Rhinelander and Eau Claire have grown so much, something several EAS markets in the north have done . If you throw in the UP (excluding Sault Ste Marie which is not really in Wisconsin’s orbit) passenger traffic is up about 13% overall, or around 30k passengers, with Iron Mountain leading the way with over 13k more passengers than last year. I wonder how much of the decrease seen in Green Bay and Wausau comes from people using IMT and RHI instead of driving down to GRB or CWA.

Milwaukee’s stats are available through November, which itself posted a nice 7.4% year-over year increase but only brought the 11-months YOY increase up to 2.2%. Three big things going on:

--Large decrease in connection passengers
Connections are down 36.7% through November, which is all about Southwest. The flipside of this is that it means local traffic over last year is actually up about 4.6%, not 2.2%. Connecting traffic can flow most anyplace, but the local traffic is really what airlines look to serve.

--West coast cuts hit passenger counts
Sadly it’s likely MKE will just miss the 7.0m passenger count for 2017 by a few tens of thousands. Through November MKE has 6,383,726 total passengers. The dropped Southwest nonstops to the west coast carried more than 80k passengers last fall. Some of those people found their way onto other flights but many were undoubtedly lost to O’Hare. After posting a 7.3% year-over-year increase in August, airport traffic was off, -4.8% in September and -2.7% in October. Southwest’s drop was the big factor.

--Big Florida increases
Primarily driven by major expansion by Frontier and the entrance of Allegiant, capacity to Florida is up over 20% this winter and spring break season. That’s how November posted the 7.4% gains in spite of the lost west coast service which killed the September and October numbers.

The big Florida increase should give Milwaukee good numbers through Easter or so. We'll see how the spring and summer shape up for a better take on all of 2018.

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