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william
Posts: 2763
Joined: Thu Jun 10, 1999 1:31 pm

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:01 am

arcticcruiser wrote:
william wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:
Bingo. 15 kt xwind limitation on many types. Also limited with runway contamination.


Why land to the south with a tail wind when they can land toward the north and still not interfere with LGA?


You don't get the wind, do you? 190/18G24...


Simple answer,no. I see on FlightRadar24 planes landing to the south, yet I see a post about a crosswind on 22R, then a post about a tailwind. Planes landing to the south, reporting tailwind in my laymen mind tells me the wind is out of the north, it is winter. But a crosswind on 22R leads me to believe its a NW wind. Again, why not land to the north then?

So no, myself and the hundreds of other lurkers who will read thread do not know what 190/18G4 means? I am pretty sure its something to do with wind direction but do know from what direction.
 
BobbyPSP
Posts: 227
Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 12:29 pm

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:52 am

I'm by far an expert but 190/18G24 means wind out of 190 degrees, steady at 18 gusting to 24
 
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TK787
Posts: 3684
Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2006 3:43 am

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:59 am

190/18G4.
Winds from 190 degrees, pretty much South. 18knots, gusting to40.
Latest METAR says, winds from 180, 15 knots, gusting 23 knots.
Hey, I was the same way when I first started visiting this site 10+ years ago. Still learning.
This place explains some of the terms:
https://www.wunderground.com/metarFAQ.asp
 
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william
Posts: 2763
Joined: Thu Jun 10, 1999 1:31 pm

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:08 am

Thank you for the answers, explains why everyone is landing into the wind heading south.

Just went over to weather.com and I see the reason for the windshears, lines of storms going over the area.

It's a inconvenience to the pax, the go arounds, but lets be thankful we have the technology to know when and where the wind shears are. Especially since a Eastern 727 was lost at JFK, back in the 70s due to windshear.
 
IPFreely
Posts: 1973
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2006 8:26 am

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:15 am

richierich wrote:
If you are flying Delta mainline today from JFK, the great news is that your flight will very likely be operating. If you are flying on a DL regional today, please know that your flight was likely sacrificed to make said mainline flight operate and/or show optimal metrics. Please contact DL to rebook as, at best, your flight will be cancelled, but at worst you will be severely delayed and forced to spend hours of your time stuck inside the hell that is Terminal 2, or for the lucky few, crammed into a CRJ on the ramp.


Congrats to Delta for only 4 cancellations and only 1,032 delayed flights so far today. Truly the "on-time machine" that is "cancelling cancellations". I suspect those four cancelled flights will be completed in the next few days, resulting in no cancellations.

For passengers booked with Delta Connection carriers Endeavor, Sykwest, Compass, Expressjet, GoJet, and Republic, tough luck if you were on any of their combined 468 cancelled flights. Better luck next time.
 
Adispatcher
Posts: 155
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2016 11:52 pm

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 4:36 am

jfklganyc wrote:
Bingo. 15 kt xwind limitation on many types. Also limited with runway contamination.


Yep. Crosswind, contamination, and reported braking action don't play well together.

Happy to be off today.

And if anyone wants a public real-time RVR monitor:

http://rvr.fly.faa.gov/cgi-bin/rvr-status.pl
 
rbavfan
Posts: 2369
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:53 am

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 6:08 am

capitalflyer wrote:
In addition, Virgin 3N is leaking fuel on approach.



Virgin America or Virgin Atlantic?
 
727LOVER
Posts: 7883
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 12:22 am

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:08 pm

william wrote:
It's a inconvenience to the pax, the go arounds, but lets be thankful we have the technology to know when and where the wind shears are. Especially since a Eastern 727 was lost at JFK, back in the 70s due to windshear.


THAT is the first thing that came to my mind upon seeing this thread.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_A ... _Flight_66

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/jet ... -1.2262925
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
GalaxyFlyer
Posts: 864
Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:44 am

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:14 pm

EA 66 was lost in a downburst associated with a strong thunderstorm, neither of which was present yesterday. While wind shear combined with a low level jet stream are hazardous, it doesn’t approach a strong convective down burst. If you have doubts about this, look at the number of accidents near thunderstorms (many) versus accidents attributed to winter wind shears (near zero). There are winter hazards, but wind shear is less of one. I wouldn’t be surprised of the presence of strong low level jet of 50 knots at 2,000’ to 3,000’, easily recognized, but a challenge to continuing the approach especially at frontal passage.

With the approaching front and its passage, the surface may be dramatically different in velocity (speed and direction) than even 1,000’ above the surface. I’ve seen near calm surface winds and 50 knots at 1,500’ 60 degrees off runway heading. Makes the PAR interesting.

GF
 
Bricktop
Posts: 835
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:04 am

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:17 pm

rbavfan wrote:
capitalflyer wrote:
In addition, Virgin 3N is leaking fuel on approach.



Virgin America or Virgin Atlantic?

Who is Virgin America? (Too soon? :D)

Virgin in this case is VS, Virgin Atlantic.
 
Boreale
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2016 5:59 am

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:25 pm

AA 2116 BOS-DCA last night left BOS 3.5 hours late (at 11:54pm), ended up diverting to RIC (other flights continued to land fine at DCA, but I understand there are a multitude of factors at play). Rather than continue on that night (I assume the crew timed out), they scheduled the flight to leave RIC at 9:15 this morning but ended up leaving more than an hour late. A real mess. A less than 2 hour flight ended up getting to DCA over 14 hour late.

My brother was on the flight and AA at 3am actually decided to just pay for passengers to take taxis from RIC to DCA (over 2 hour drive) in the middle of the night if they wanted. Which I guess was kind of them, but also completely absurd.

Is this what the whole east coast was like yesterday?
 
GalaxyFlyer
Posts: 864
Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:44 am

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:14 pm

It happens sometimes. BOS-DCA, by car, in Google maps is 7+15 with a few delays; possibly 8 hours yesterday. Time to spare, go by air; more time yer, go by jet.

GF
 
User avatar
bluefltspecial
Posts: 420
Joined: Fri Sep 20, 2013 6:27 pm

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:22 pm

TOGA10 wrote:
danj555 wrote:
Will the a380s have any trouble?

Why would an A380 be any different from the T7's, 747s, A320s etc etc?


I believe he's implying that the larger surface area of the A380 allows the wind to "push" the aircraft more. While that does apply, any skilled pilot, trained on their aircraft type should be familiar with crosswind and trained for it. If it is not safe, or the pilot feels it unsafe, then they go around or divert.
Save a horse, ride a Fly-boy....
 
User avatar
william
Posts: 2763
Joined: Thu Jun 10, 1999 1:31 pm

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:59 pm

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
EA 66 was lost in a downburst associated with a strong thunderstorm, neither of which was present yesterday. While wind shear combined with a low level jet stream are hazardous, it doesn’t approach a strong convective down burst. If you have doubts about this, look at the number of accidents near thunderstorms (many) versus accidents attributed to winter wind shears (near zero). There are winter hazards, but wind shear is less of one. I wouldn’t be surprised of the presence of strong low level jet of 50 knots at 2,000’ to 3,000’, easily recognized, but a challenge to continuing the approach especially at frontal passage.

With the approaching front and its passage, the surface may be dramatically different in velocity (speed and direction) than even 1,000’ above the surface. I’ve seen near calm surface winds and 50 knots at 1,500’ 60 degrees off runway heading. Makes the PAR interesting.

GF


Interesting, thank you.
 
DaufuskieGuy
Posts: 396
Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2008 6:35 pm

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:56 pm

[photoid][/photoid]
GalaxyFlyer wrote:
It happens sometimes. BOS-DCA, by car, in Google maps is 7+15 with a few delays; possibly 8 hours yesterday. Time to spare, go by air; more time yer, go by jet.

GF


it's perhaps the most highly variable duration by car in the country, you can easily bump up several hours in the NYC area with bad traffic. but if you leave BOS at midnight you could probably do it in 6.5 hours
 
GalaxyFlyer
Posts: 864
Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:44 am

Re: JFK Diverting Flights due to shear

Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:30 am

True, that. I’ve driven dozens of times. Fairfield and Westchester County in particular, then Baltimore. I usually cut across 301 to Annapolis and 50 into DC.

GF

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