paysonmt77
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:32 pm

Am I surprised at JetBlue going to seasonal..No, but after Frontier entering the market had some part in their planning. I hated flying jetblue during the winter months, always delayed or cancelled. If they cancelled, I had to drive to Boston. Their bread and butter is spring thru fall, and it was very slow during the winter except Christmas and thanksgiving. JetBlue wants you to fly out of Boston, that's why no expansion to MCO or FLL from BTV or PWM never or was dropped. PWM and BTV lost those flights to BOS. This gives an opportunity for other airlines to fill the void for the Canadians and Mainers who want warm weather. Frontier is going like gang busters at PWM and will continue to expand. Taking over the void that other airliners wont take a chance on. Frontier will announce the next routes in the coming months to FLL.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:47 pm

paysonmt77 wrote:
Am I surprised at JetBlue going to seasonal..No, but after Frontier entering the market had some part in their planning. I hated flying jetblue during the winter months, always delayed or cancelled. If they cancelled, I had to drive to Boston. Their bread and butter is spring thru fall, and it was very slow during the winter except Christmas and thanksgiving. JetBlue wants you to fly out of Boston, that's why no expansion to MCO or FLL from BTV or PWM never or was dropped. PWM and BTV lost those flights to BOS. This gives an opportunity for other airlines to fill the void for the Canadians and Mainers who want warm weather. Frontier is going like gang busters at PWM and will continue to expand. Taking over the void that other airliners wont take a chance on. Frontier will announce the next routes in the coming months to FLL.


BTV is not losing flights to Boston its a totally separate market. PWM maybe. BTV lost its Florida flights because of Plattsburgh, NY has so many, cheaper parking, and the ULCCs. The ULCCs have very low operating expenses because NY is pushing that airport for an economic help to the area. Drive thru the Plattsburgh airport parking lots I'd say easily 2/5 VT plates. 2/5 Quebec plates, 1/5 NY plates (at most). Everyone I know in Burlington whos primary concern is low fares drives to Plattsburgh for Florida, the fares are so low and they offer so much in winter N/S. The legacies number one destination is Florida as per the airport management, but they do one-stops thru their hubs and then fly you to every airport in Florida no just MCO.

Frontier is trying to see if they can steal some of that plattsburgh ULCC market which i think they can as MCO is such a huge runner. Plattsburgh will still be fine Spirit and Allegiant are doing very well over there.
 
Fex180
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:05 pm

paysonmt77 wrote:
Am I surprised at JetBlue going to seasonal..No, but after Frontier entering the market had some part in their planning. I hated flying jetblue during the winter months, always delayed or cancelled. If they cancelled, I had to drive to Boston. Their bread and butter is spring thru fall, and it was very slow during the winter except Christmas and thanksgiving. JetBlue wants you to fly out of Boston, that's why no expansion to MCO or FLL from BTV or PWM never or was dropped. PWM and BTV lost those flights to BOS. This gives an opportunity for other airlines to fill the void for the Canadians and Mainers who want warm weather. Frontier is going like gang busters at PWM and will continue to expand. Taking over the void that other airliners wont take a chance on. Frontier will announce the next routes in the coming months to FLL.


I believe F9 made a slight upward frequency adjustment for PWM-SXF and MCO so that's a good indiction that demand is good. I'll be curious to see what F9 and maybe WN do to fill the void.

I would also say the new B6 adjustments basically rule out any realistic chance of them entering the MHT market
Last edited by Fex180 on Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
mjgbtv
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:17 pm

The loads for BTV-MCO were said to be fine at the time it was dropped. Speculation was that they just wanted the aircraft for something with better yields. It will be interesting to see where things are with Frontier when JetBlue changes over to the A220s. I just can't see a 2x per week schedule meeting all of the demand, so perhaps JetBlue could replace one of the JFK flights with something direct to Florida.

As for PBG, it boggles my mind that even an ULCC can maintain a route with a 2am-5am schedule!
 
Portlander
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 09, 2018 7:49 pm

Maybe Delta will pick up the slack to JFK from PWM during the off season with the return of a few mainline flights?
 
paysonmt77
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:09 pm

Remember when JetBlue got started here back in 2006, they started with A320s, cheap airfare, free bags, reliable service, flights to MCO with 98% yield...lets go to 2018...E190s, higher airfare, no free bags, no reliable service, no flights to mco, cancellation or late flight rate of 60%. I looked at a flight in March to MCO from PWM it was over 800.00 with a checked bag. Frontier with all its bells and whistles was half that. BTV was close to 1,000. JetBlue is not the airline I came to love back in 2006. It has priced itself out of the smaller markets and lowered its fare in Boston. They know they can get the fares in the summer from all the NYC people coming to Maine, they don't care, just like all the hotels in the summer in Maine...all overpriced and people will still pay...I feel that the Jetport officials raised the per passenger rates, or renegotiated the lease, plus fuel costs have skyrocketed. Well , there will be an available jetway to use till May...
 
Fex180
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:35 pm

paysonmt77 wrote:
Remember when JetBlue got started here back in 2006, they started with A320s, cheap airfare, free bags, reliable service, flights to MCO with 98% yield...lets go to 2018...E190s, higher airfare, no free bags, no reliable service, no flights to mco, cancellation or late flight rate of 60%. I looked at a flight in March to MCO from PWM it was over 800.00 with a checked bag. Frontier with all its bells and whistles was half that. BTV was close to 1,000. JetBlue is not the airline I came to love back in 2006. It has priced itself out of the smaller markets and lowered its fare in Boston. They know they can get the fares in the summer from all the NYC people coming to Maine, they don't care, just like all the hotels in the summer in Maine...all overpriced and people will still pay...I feel that the Jetport officials raised the per passenger rates, or renegotiated the lease, plus fuel costs have skyrocketed. Well , there will be an available jetway to use till May...


I would agree with this. When JetBlue was young, they were a perfect fit for markets like PWM. Now they've fundamentally changed and Portland just doesn't fit with the Jetblue of 2018. They don't care about Maine as a market, just a destination. Now PWM is much better suited for F9 and WN. But I still think they will lose a lot of loyal customers in Maine.
 
uconn99
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 09, 2018 9:25 pm

Fex180 wrote:
As mentioned in the JetBlue network thread, B6 is adding PVD / BDL - PBI and reducing PWM to a summer-only destination.


B6 already flys BDL-PBI.
 
iyerhari
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 09, 2018 9:40 pm

I am including the non-BOS destinations that B6 flies from various airports in New England:

BDL: FLL, MCO, SJU, TPA, DCA, PBI
PWM (service ends Jan 7), MHT (N/A)
ORH: MCO, JFK, FLL
PVD: FLL, MCO, PBI (starts Jan 2019)
BTV: JFK
HVN: N/A

MHT, PWM, and HVN will be the airports in NE that won't have any B6 service. B6 has a tough competition from a formidable competitor in DL at Logan and will make all efforts to keep their lead here.
 
Fex180
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 09, 2018 9:47 pm

iyerhari wrote:
I am including the non-BOS destinations that B6 flies from various airports in New England:

BDL: FLL, MCO, SJU, TPA, DCA, PBI
PWM (service ends Jan 7), MHT (N/A)
ORH: MCO, JFK, FLL
PVD: FLL, MCO, PBI (starts Jan 2019)
BTV: JFK
HVN: N/A

MHT, PWM, and HVN will be the airports in NE that won't have any B6 service. B6 has a tough competition from a formidable competitor in DL at Logan and will make all efforts to keep their lead here.


As I mentioned earlier, I think these developments are the nail in the coffin for any chance of B6 entering MHT. The suits at MHT should see this as a wake up call that JetBlue isn't coming to save them.
 
CairnterriAIR
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 09, 2018 10:00 pm

JetBlue also offers service to Ft. Myers out of BDL.
 
ajsljet45
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 09, 2018 10:34 pm

uconn99 wrote:
Fex180 wrote:
As mentioned in the JetBlue network thread, B6 is adding PVD / BDL - PBI and reducing PWM to a summer-only destination.


B6 already flys BDL-PBI.


While searching for a booking yesterday, I did notice that BDL-PBI has been upgraded to an A321 from Jan-Feb
 
uconn99
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 09, 2018 11:08 pm

ajsljet45 wrote:
uconn99 wrote:
Fex180 wrote:
As mentioned in the JetBlue network thread, B6 is adding PVD / BDL - PBI and reducing PWM to a summer-only destination.


B6 already flys BDL-PBI.


While searching for a booking yesterday, I did notice that BDL-PBI has been upgraded to an A321 from Jan-Feb


I noticed this as well but only saw it in one direction, PBI-BDL?? If the A321 shows up at BDL, it will be the first scheduled from B6.

RSW is seasonal from BDL on B6.
 
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pwm2txlhopper
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:08 pm

B6 pulling out of PWM is crappy news. Even though I don't usually use them, (especially since they permanently lost my checked bag one time at PWM, located it, and lost it again) they helped fares lower significantly out of PWM when they arrived. Now there's only Southwest and Frontier that will be keeping fares In check to destinations served by them or the lagacies out of PWM. Hopefully Southwest stays around, because honestly they've never seen that interested in Expanding PWM since they took over Air Tran. They've never opened a station with SW employees here, and there's no SW cargo available out of PWM, either. Less competition means DL, UA, AA, SW are free to jack up fares.

paysonmt77 wrote:
Remember when JetBlue got started here back in 2006, they started with A320s, cheap airfare, free bags, reliable service, flights to MCO with 98% yield...lets go to 2018...E190s, higher airfare, no free bags, no reliable service, no flights to mco, cancellation or late flight rate of 60%. I looked at a flight in March to MCO from PWM it was over 800.00 with a checked bag. Frontier with all its bells and whistles was half that. BTV was close to 1,000. JetBlue is not the airline I came to love back in 2006. It has priced itself out of the smaller markets and lowered its fare in Boston. They know they can get the fares in the summer from all the NYC people coming to Maine, they don't care, just like all the hotels in the summer in Maine...all overpriced and people will still pay...I feel that the Jetport officials raised the per passenger rates, or renegotiated the lease, plus fuel costs have skyrocketed. Well , there will be an available jetway to use till May...


Actually, JetBlue didn't start PWM-MCO until about 2009 or 2010. Years after they'd arrived in 2006. Not sure if they were ever 98% full on those flights, because they were gone within a year of starting.

I wouldn't say the airfares are particularly high out of PWM with B6 either if you book in advance. Likely it was $800 to MCO because it was spring vacation time and limited seats. Usually most of the airlines at PWM can get you to MCO a for $250 or less these days if you book I advance.
Last edited by pwm2txlhopper on Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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pwm2txlhopper
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:34 pm

Fex180 wrote:
paysonmt77 wrote:
Remember when JetBlue got started here back in 2006, they started with A320s, cheap airfare, free bags, reliable service, flights to MCO with 98% yield...lets go to 2018...E190s, higher airfare, no free bags, no reliable service, no flights to mco, cancellation or late flight rate of 60%. I looked at a flight in March to MCO from PWM it was over 800.00 with a checked bag. Frontier with all its bells and whistles was half that. BTV was close to 1,000. JetBlue is not the airline I came to love back in 2006. It has priced itself out of the smaller markets and lowered its fare in Boston. They know they can get the fares in the summer from all the NYC people coming to Maine, they don't care, just like all the hotels in the summer in Maine...all overpriced and people will still pay...I feel that the Jetport officials raised the per passenger rates, or renegotiated the lease, plus fuel costs have skyrocketed. Well , there will be an available jetway to use till May...


I would agree with this. When JetBlue was young, they were a perfect fit for markets like PWM. Now they've fundamentally changed and Portland just doesn't fit with the Jetblue of 2018. They don't care about Maine as a market, just a destination. Now PWM is much better suited for F9 and WN. But I still think they will lose a lot of loyal customers in Maine.



When JetBlue was young, 1999/2000, PWM was one of the original markets they wanted to serve within five years once they started getting E-190s. And you're right, they don't care about Maine's market, just like any airline doesn't personally care about the well being of any market. It's not personal. They either weren't making money flying here, or they can make more using the aircraft somewhere else. Just business.

Also, I have a feeling most of the people arriving to PWM on B6 are probably coming from somewhere other than NYC area, and only made a connection there. I don't think NYC residents are filling planes in the summer to come to Maine. The ones that do fly, are likely using LGA or EWR unless they live way out by JFK.
 
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chrisnh
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:39 pm

PWM always was a seasonal station from the first day B6 arrived. I also don’t see any equivalencies between Frontier coming and B6 going. They’re two separate things. I do agree, though, with the sentiment that this lessens the likelihood of MHT for B6. The focus ought to be on convincing AA to pick up the pieces from UA at MHT. They’ve got a big presence at ORD as well, and should hop on the MHT-ORD route.
 
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pwm2txlhopper
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 10, 2018 2:12 pm

chrisnh wrote:
PWM always was a seasonal station from the first day B6 arrived. I also don’t see any equivalencies between Frontier coming and B6 going. They’re two separate things. I do agree, though, with the sentiment that this lessens the likelihood of MHT for B6. The focus ought to be on convincing AA to pick up the pieces from UA at MHT. They’ve got a big presence at ORD as well, and should hop on the MHT-ORD route.



Well, they've done almost 13 years of yearly seasonal flights then. More like PWM is a seasonal airport for all airlines? Almost nobody comes here Nov-May.

While I wouldn't say Frontier is the primary cause of JetBlue pulling out, It can't help B6's winter loads to and from PWM, when half the plane to JFK is going somewhere in Florida. Especially now that Frontier is offering 150ish cheap seats, several times per week to MCO, TPA, RSW, and FLL rumored to be coming. Those are all going contribute to even lower yields on the B6 flights that are apparently, already struggling during winter?
 
Fex180
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:24 pm

pwm2txlhopper wrote:
B6 pulling out of PWM is crappy news. Even though I don't usually use them, (especially since they permanently lost my checked bag one time at PWM, located it, and lost it again) they helped fares lower significantly out of PWM when they arrived. Now there's only Southwest and Frontier that will be keeping fares In check to destinations served by them or the lagacies out of PWM. Hopefully Southwest stays around, because honestly they've never seen that interested in Expanding PWM since they took over Air Tran. They've never opened a station with SW employees here, and there's no SW cargo available out of PWM, either. Less competition means DL, UA, AA, SW are free to jack up fares.


Southwest will stick around for the foreseeable future. their numbers have slowly crawled up year after year, and with B6 gone for the winter I think we'll see a big uptick in demand on BWI flights. There are still plenty of Mainers who want to go places other than Florida in the winter (which are the only Frontier routes from PWM until spring)
 
paysonmt77
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:00 pm

I am hearing from the JetBlue folks that this is only the beginning of the reorganization. With DAB, and IAD gone which both only flew to JFK, except Dulles went also to Boston. More is to come. I expect BTV to go seasonal at some point(PWM is usually first, then BTV when cuts or new service starts-going on historical), Bradley to increase routes, Worcester to stay the same due to Massport, only stations that only go to Kennedy are being looked at it seems. PVD does not go to JFK but goes to other destinations is increasing service. (bigger market and only 45 min from BOS). On a note:The E190s are on the way out in the next few years with more A321s being put into service with the combination of higher jet fuel prices. I see the long term plan that with PWM, BTV, and possibly MHT with seasonal May till November to JFK. With all other flights out of BOS(mini hub) year round. The hope is to go to 160 plus flights...on a tid bit, the stock went down 3.5% yesterday on trading..
 
PVD757
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Fri Oct 12, 2018 12:25 am

Regional Sky announced PVD-YHU today. Starts November 5th. Weekdays.

YHU-PVD 0700-0810
PVD-YHU 0930-1040
 
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pwm2txlhopper
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Fri Oct 12, 2018 1:30 am

Fex180 wrote:
pwm2txlhopper wrote:
B6 pulling out of PWM is crappy news. Even though I don't usually use them, (especially since they permanently lost my checked bag one time at PWM, located it, and lost it again) they helped fares lower significantly out of PWM when they arrived. Now there's only Southwest and Frontier that will be keeping fares In check to destinations served by them or the lagacies out of PWM. Hopefully Southwest stays around, because honestly they've never seen that interested in Expanding PWM since they took over Air Tran. They've never opened a station with SW employees here, and there's no SW cargo available out of PWM, either. Less competition means DL, UA, AA, SW are free to jack up fares.


Southwest will stick around for the foreseeable future. their numbers have slowly crawled up year after year, and with B6 gone for the winter I think we'll see a big uptick in demand on BWI flights. There are still plenty of Mainers who want to go places other than Florida in the winter (which are the only Frontier routes from PWM until spring)



With respect, how would you know what Southwest or any other airline at PWMs passenger numbers are? This isn't the first time you've referenced an airline's yields or growth at PWM. The only way to really know that stuff is to work for the airline and have access to their records.
 
Fex180
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Fri Oct 12, 2018 2:11 am

pwm2txlhopper wrote:
Fex180 wrote:
pwm2txlhopper wrote:
B6 pulling out of PWM is crappy news. Even though I don't usually use them, (especially since they permanently lost my checked bag one time at PWM, located it, and lost it again) they helped fares lower significantly out of PWM when they arrived. Now there's only Southwest and Frontier that will be keeping fares In check to destinations served by them or the lagacies out of PWM. Hopefully Southwest stays around, because honestly they've never seen that interested in Expanding PWM since they took over Air Tran. They've never opened a station with SW employees here, and there's no SW cargo available out of PWM, either. Less competition means DL, UA, AA, SW are free to jack up fares.


Southwest will stick around for the foreseeable future. their numbers have slowly crawled up year after year, and with B6 gone for the winter I think we'll see a big uptick in demand on BWI flights. There are still plenty of Mainers who want to go places other than Florida in the winter (which are the only Frontier routes from PWM until spring)



With respect, how would you know what Southwest or any other airline at PWMs passenger numbers are? This isn't the first time you've referenced an airline's yields or growth at PWM. The only way to really know that stuff is to work for the airline and have access to their records.


Publicly available information from the Bureau of Transportation Statistics?
 
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NickolayAv
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Fri Oct 12, 2018 2:31 am

PVD757 wrote:
Regional Sky announced PVD-YHU today. Starts November 5th. Weekdays.

YHU-PVD 0700-0810
PVD-YHU 0930-1040

Will be operated by a Beech 1900C with 19 seats.
Interesting route. Does YHU have a CBP or pre-clearance facility?
Also, I wonder if Air Canada add a flight to YUL after seeing this?
"If you want to be a millionaire, start with a billion dollars and launch a new airline"-Richard Branson
 
PVD757
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Fri Oct 12, 2018 9:49 am

NickolayAv wrote:
PVD757 wrote:
Regional Sky announced PVD-YHU today. Starts November 5th. Weekdays.

YHU-PVD 0700-0810
PVD-YHU 0930-1040

Will be operated by a Beech 1900C with 19 seats.
Interesting route. Does YHU have a CBP or pre-clearance facility?
Also, I wonder if Air Canada add a flight to YUL after seeing this?


Passengers will clear US customs in PVD’s FIS.
 
33lspotter
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Fri Oct 12, 2018 4:36 pm

Fex180 wrote:
PWM-SXF


That would be quite the flight, particularly on an F9 A321! ;)
 
MO11
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Fri Oct 12, 2018 8:14 pm

PVD757 wrote:
NickolayAv wrote:
PVD757 wrote:
Regional Sky announced PVD-YHU today. Starts November 5th. Weekdays.

YHU-PVD 0700-0810
PVD-YHU 0930-1040

Will be operated by a Beech 1900C with 19 seats.
Interesting route. Does YHU have a CBP or pre-clearance facility?
Also, I wonder if Air Canada add a flight to YUL after seeing this?


Passengers will clear US customs in PVD’s FIS.



Looks like this will also avoid TSA. YHU is using the FBO, and PVD check-in/gate is on the first level.
 
PVD757
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Sat Oct 13, 2018 12:26 am

MO11 wrote:
PVD757 wrote:
NickolayAv wrote:
Will be operated by a Beech 1900C with 19 seats.
Interesting route. Does YHU have a CBP or pre-clearance facility?
Also, I wonder if Air Canada add a flight to YUL after seeing this?


Passengers will clear US customs in PVD’s FIS.



Looks like this will also avoid TSA. YHU is using the FBO, and PVD check-in/gate is on the first level.


Yes, the flights will be an FBO experience with the amenities and services of a terminal.
 
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bdlflyer
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Mon Oct 15, 2018 1:34 pm

BDL ranks in Top 10 Best Airports according to a Conde Nast Traveler Magazine Survey.
http://www.courant.com/real-estate/prop ... story.html
Bradley International Airport (BDL) | Gateway to New England | ❤️ Love The Journey | New England's second largest airport
 
Portlander
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Mon Oct 15, 2018 3:28 pm

It's interesting to me that BDL has always been considered Hartford's airport. Springfield never gets any love, it's larger than Hartford in population (154K to 124K) and the airport is located in between both cities even though it's actually a little closer to Hartford. Must be because of the CT address and that greater Hartford is much larger than greater Springfield. I wonder if there was ever an effort to name it Hartford/Springfield International?
 
cheapgreek
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:00 pm

Portlander wrote:
It's interesting to me that BDL has always been considered Hartford's airport. Springfield never gets any love, it's larger than Hartford in population (154K to 124K) and the airport is located in between both cities even though it's actually a little closer to Hartford. Must be because of the CT address and that greater Hartford is much larger than greater Springfield. I wonder if there was ever an effort to name it Hartford/Springfield International?


Years back there was talk of Westover airport adding commercial airline service for the Springfield area, but nothing ever became of it. Would be good for ULCC carrier like Allegiant, Spirit or Frontier and maybe AA with flights to PHL like ORH has.
 
Fex180
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:05 pm

July data from Bureau of Transportation Statistics shows F9 had a 92.8% load factor at PWM.

Quite a strong start, I would say.
 
uconn99
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:34 pm

cheapgreek wrote:
Portlander wrote:
It's interesting to me that BDL has always been considered Hartford's airport. Springfield never gets any love, it's larger than Hartford in population (154K to 124K) and the airport is located in between both cities even though it's actually a little closer to Hartford. Must be because of the CT address and that greater Hartford is much larger than greater Springfield. I wonder if there was ever an effort to name it Hartford/Springfield International?


Years back there was talk of Westover airport adding commercial airline service for the Springfield area, but nothing ever became of it. Would be good for ULCC carrier like Allegiant, Spirit or Frontier and maybe AA with flights to PHL like ORH has.


Westover will never get scheduled passenger service at least in the next 20-30 years. There simply is no need for an additional airport to serve Western Mass when BDL is 30 minutes down the road. Skybus Airlines tried and failed.

Also, a lot of airlines call BDL Hartford/Springfield however with the Hartford metro area being double the size of Springfield and Hartford has a much larger corporate presence than Springfield it is always going to be considered Hartford's airport. Don't forget the airport is owned by the State of Connecticut and I believe gets ZERO funding from Massachusetts.
 
Portlander
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:43 pm

Thanks uconn, did not know that BDL was owned by the State of Connecticut.
 
uconn99
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:47 pm

Portlander wrote:
Thanks uconn, did not know that BDL was owned by the State of Connecticut.


It is technically owned and operated by the "Connecticut Airport Authority" which is a state agency.
 
cheapgreek
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Tue Oct 16, 2018 2:25 am

uconn99 wrote:
cheapgreek wrote:
Portlander wrote:
It's interesting to me that BDL has always been considered Hartford's airport. Springfield never gets any love, it's larger than Hartford in population (154K to 124K) and the airport is located in between both cities even though it's actually a little closer to Hartford. Must be because of the CT address and that greater Hartford is much larger than greater Springfield. I wonder if there was ever an effort to name it Hartford/Springfield International?


Years back there was talk of Westover airport adding commercial airline service for the Springfield area, but nothing ever became of it. Would be good for ULCC carrier like Allegiant, Spirit or Frontier and maybe AA with flights to PHL like ORH has.


Westover will never get scheduled passenger service at least in the next 20-30 years. There simply is no need for an additional airport to serve Western Mass when BDL is 30 minutes down the road. Skybus Airlines tried and failed.

Also, a lot of airlines call BDL Hartford/Springfield however with the Hartford metro area being double the size of Springfield and Hartford has a much larger corporate presence than Springfield it is always going to be considered Hartford's airport. Don't forget the airport is owned by the State of Connecticut and I believe gets ZERO funding from Massachusetts.


Allegiant serves many smaller airports with less than daily service like PGB, BLV, HGR, PSM, etc. Skybus failure was system wide, not a reflection on Westover. I could see 3-4 weekly flights by Allegiant or Frontier out of Westover to Florida. Chicopee, Holyoke and other surrounding towns could make those flights work. The runways are more than ample to handle any type of plane and ULCC are always looking for new routes and airports that are currently not served.
 
btvhopper
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 17, 2018 8:25 pm

Circling back to the B6 news and maintaining service at BTV it's interesting when looking at PAX numbers through September B6 has been flat and slightly down YTD vs last year while the legacies are experiencing incredible growth (or rather, making up for all the post-2009 hemorrhaging of passengers).

https://www.boarddocs.com/vt/burlington ... 101718.pdf

The legacy carriers are all up double digit percentages (FYTD Delta is up +30% YOY), mainly because of upgrading to larger planes (DL flying more of A319s, UA exchanging a319s for A320s on their 4x daily to ORD; 737-900s to EWR). I'm glad B6 is maintaining the same level of presence but I'm not sure they'll make it through the next round unless they can better ride the same wave the legacies are on.

The growth at BTV is simply economics and everything to do with MHT's struggles. It's become a virtuous cycle as people living midway between MHT and BTV increasingly choosing BTV as fairs are lower and options better, so the legacies are willing to bring in larger planes, which further depresses fares, leading to more market share gained from MHT.
 
paysonmt77
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 17, 2018 8:32 pm

I see that BGR is losing its flights to JFK at the end of November which leaves Delta and AA only to LGA and UA to EWR, which now MHT is dropping EWR for IAD which leaves no service to the NYC metro area. I would hate to be a business located in Manchester that has business in NYC...now they have to go to PWM or BOS, and Worcester
 
tomaheath
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 17, 2018 8:46 pm

Delta fly to LGA from Manchester.
 
Fex180
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 17, 2018 9:01 pm

paysonmt77 wrote:
I see that BGR is losing its flights to JFK at the end of November which leaves Delta and AA only to LGA and UA to EWR, which now MHT is dropping EWR for IAD which leaves no service to the NYC metro area. I would hate to be a business located in Manchester that has business in NYC...now they have to go to PWM or BOS, and Worcester


I believe DL flies 2-3x daily to LGA , but I agree that is a very low level of service.

Noticed that as of July PWM has overtaken MHT for enplanements for 2018. 531,000 year-to-date at MHT vs 550,000 at PWM.
 
tomaheath
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 17, 2018 9:21 pm

Fex180 wrote:
paysonmt77 wrote:
I see that BGR is losing its flights to JFK at the end of November which leaves Delta and AA only to LGA and UA to EWR, which now MHT is dropping EWR for IAD which leaves no service to the NYC metro area. I would hate to be a business located in Manchester that has business in NYC...now they have to go to PWM or BOS, and Worcester


I believe DL flies 2-3x daily to LGA , but I agree that is a very low level of service.

Noticed that as of July PWM has overtaken MHT for enplanements for 2018. 531,000 year-to-date at MHT vs 550,000 at PWM.

Maybe it’s time for B6 to start Manchester to FLL MCO and JFK? Doesn’t really surprise me that Portland is over taking Manchester in pax numbers.
 
Fex180
Posts: 127
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 17, 2018 9:33 pm

tomaheath wrote:
Fex180 wrote:
paysonmt77 wrote:
I see that BGR is losing its flights to JFK at the end of November which leaves Delta and AA only to LGA and UA to EWR, which now MHT is dropping EWR for IAD which leaves no service to the NYC metro area. I would hate to be a business located in Manchester that has business in NYC...now they have to go to PWM or BOS, and Worcester


I believe DL flies 2-3x daily to LGA , but I agree that is a very low level of service.

Noticed that as of July PWM has overtaken MHT for enplanements for 2018. 531,000 year-to-date at MHT vs 550,000 at PWM.

Maybe it’s time for B6 to start Manchester to FLL MCO and JFK? Doesn’t really surprise me that Portland is over taking Manchester in pax numbers.


Given the recent changes to B6's network, I would say the chances of them starting at MHT are almost 0%. WN still provides decent Florida service from MHT to MCO, TPA and FLL. I would say Spirit or Allegiant might be MHT's best hope...and neither of those are particularly likely scenarios.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:02 pm

Fex180 wrote:
tomaheath wrote:
Fex180 wrote:

I believe DL flies 2-3x daily to LGA , but I agree that is a very low level of service.

Noticed that as of July PWM has overtaken MHT for enplanements for 2018. 531,000 year-to-date at MHT vs 550,000 at PWM.

Maybe it’s time for B6 to start Manchester to FLL MCO and JFK? Doesn’t really surprise me that Portland is over taking Manchester in pax numbers.


Given the recent changes to B6's network, I would say the chances of them starting at MHT are almost 0%. WN still provides decent Florida service from MHT to MCO, TPA and FLL. I would say Spirit or Allegiant might be MHT's best hope...and neither of those are particularly likely scenarios.


As much as I would like to see MHT reverse it’s trend, I agree with you. B6 is retrenching a little and focusing it’s efforts elsewhere. Not sure we are going to see any new US stations until the 220’s appear and even then I don’t think too
Much as they are essentially the E190 replacements
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
airbazar
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Wed Oct 17, 2018 11:59 pm

paysonmt77 wrote:
I would hate to be a business located in Manchester that has business in NYC...now they have to go to PWM or BOS, and Worcester

They were/are already doing that which is why UA is moving the EWR flight to IAD, and dropped ORD, and DL is down to only 2 southbound flights (1x LGA and 1x ATL).
MHT has been losing passengers year over year and one of the reasons is because it can't attract business fliers. Business flies pay for the flight. Leisure fliers fill the seats. No business fliers => no flight => fewer passengers.
 
Portlander
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Thu Oct 18, 2018 12:36 am

So it looks like PWM will probably surpass 1 million enplanements this year, up from 926,000 in CY 2017.
 
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Revelation
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Thu Oct 18, 2018 12:59 am

airbazar wrote:
paysonmt77 wrote:
I would hate to be a business located in Manchester that has business in NYC...now they have to go to PWM or BOS, and Worcester

They were/are already doing that which is why UA is moving the EWR flight to IAD, and dropped ORD, and DL is down to only 2 southbound flights (1x LGA and 1x ATL).
MHT has been losing passengers year over year and one of the reasons is because it can't attract business fliers. Business flies pay for the flight. Leisure fliers fill the seats. No business fliers => no flight => fewer passengers.

And of course no flight => No business fliers => fewer passengers too.

Hub to small outstation flights are easy to cancel when the plane is more valuable elsewhere.

Small outstation flights are vulnerable to mechanical cancellations since there are few resources at the outstations.

Business travelers have been burned enough times to make it sensible to avoid small outstations.

Then the death spiral takes over.
Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world
The heart has it's beaches, it's homeland and thoughts of it's own
Wake now, discover that you are the song that the morning brings
The heart has it's seasons, it's evenings and songs of it's own
 
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chrisnh
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:39 am

DL and B6 both want to fortify BOS, which means minimal service from DL and zero for B6 at MHT. it’s too bad for a nice airport. But AA is a carrier that has no such affinity for BOS, and does have good service at MHT. I said at the time UA pulled its MHT-ORD route that AA was probably in the best position to resume it.
 
mjgbtv
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Thu Oct 18, 2018 2:09 am

btvhopper wrote:
Circling back to the B6 news and maintaining service at BTV it's interesting when looking at PAX numbers through September B6 has been flat and slightly down YTD vs last year while the legacies are experiencing incredible growth (or rather, making up for all the post-2009 hemorrhaging of passengers).

https://www.boarddocs.com/vt/burlington ... 101718.pdf

The legacy carriers are all up double digit percentages (FYTD Delta is up +30% YOY), mainly because of upgrading to larger planes (DL flying more of A319s, UA exchanging a319s for A320s on their 4x daily to ORD; 737-900s to EWR). I'm glad B6 is maintaining the same level of presence but I'm not sure they'll make it through the next round unless they can better ride the same wave the legacies are on.

The growth at BTV is simply economics and everything to do with MHT's struggles. It's become a virtuous cycle as people living midway between MHT and BTV increasingly choosing BTV as fairs are lower and options better, so the legacies are willing to bring in larger planes, which further depresses fares, leading to more market share gained from MHT.


One saving grace for BTV with B6 might be that it's all E190s. Finding a better use for them is probably not so easy.

On the plus side if they do pull out, there has probably never been a better time with the legacies upping their game and F9 coming in.
 
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spinkid
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:48 am

ajsljet45 wrote:
uconn99 wrote:
Fex180 wrote:
As mentioned in the JetBlue network thread, B6 is adding PVD / BDL - PBI and reducing PWM to a summer-only destination.


B6 already flys BDL-PBI.


While searching for a booking yesterday, I did notice that BDL-PBI has been upgraded to an A321 from Jan-Feb


Just over the border from CT in White Plains.
jetBlue will fly 5 daily this winter HPN-PBI

I wonder why Silver has never gone into HVN, especially since they work so closely with jetBlue.
 
airbazar
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Thu Oct 18, 2018 12:05 pm

mjgbtv wrote:
One saving grace for BTV with B6 might be that it's all E190s. Finding a better use for them is probably not so easy.

But the 190's are being replaced by 220's which have more seats. So unless the 190's have been flying full, that could be a problem.
 
mjgbtv
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN) - 2018

Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:14 pm

airbazar wrote:
mjgbtv wrote:
One saving grace for BTV with B6 might be that it's all E190s. Finding a better use for them is probably not so easy.

But the 190's are being replaced by 220's which have more seats. So unless the 190's have been flying full, that could be a problem.


The current frequency is 3x/4x per day, so if they are still at BTV when the E190s are gone it seems like 2x/3x would be a good fit for the A220. That might even work better with peoples' schedules. I suspect that they could put more people on the RON flight now if they had the space.

In any case, though, the A220s don't come online in force for at least 5 years so the picture may well have changed by then for better or worse.

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