Oregon Aviation Thread - 2018

lhpdx · Wed Jun 27, 2018 4:30 pm

I have a feeling Sun country will add Anchorage to PDX for summer 2019............

FA9295 · Wed Jun 27, 2018 4:31 pm

I've started a separate thread on the news: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1397679

FA9295 · Wed Jun 27, 2018 4:34 pm

lhpdx wrote:
I have a feeling Sun country will add Anchorage to PDX for summer 2019............

Yep. I agree that it's not a matter of if, but when that route will be added.

jbpdx · Wed Jun 27, 2018 4:36 pm

“The airline will begin flying nonstop seasonal service between Portland and Honolulu, Las Vegas, Palm Springs, Phoenix and Reno-Tahoe in Novemeber. All the routes will be offered four times a week, except Palm Springs and Reno, which will be flown just twice weekly.”

Nice to see there is one airline interested in growing at PDX. Hawaiian’s loss of capacity to HNL by switching to A321 is still being picked up by other carriers.

jbpdx · Wed Jun 27, 2018 4:47 pm

It wouldn’t surprise me if Sun Country is looking at PDX-FLL. They’ve already added Sunday to their recently started Tues/Thur PDX-MCO run. They’d be first from Portland to South Florida and would have it all to themselves.

jbpdx · Wed Jun 27, 2018 5:35 pm

This, from another thread about Sun Country. Thought it was worth repeating:

msycajun wrote:
Not surprising to see a move to grow PDX. It has been largely neglected by most carriers despite strong growth.

jbpdx · Wed Jun 27, 2018 5:55 pm

PDX Portland International Airport
May 2018

Total. +5.3% (1.7 million)
Domestic. +5%
International. +14.4%

YTD passengers: 7,457,562

Cathay Pacific Cargo
May +29.6%
YTD +62.9%

msycajun · Wed Jun 27, 2018 6:33 pm

jbpdx wrote:
This, from another thread about Sun Country. Thought it was worth repeating:

msycajun wrote:
Not surprising to see a move to grow PDX. It has been largely neglected by most carriers despite strong growth.

Particularly the ULCCs and WN. I know the west coast is generally a bloodbath right now, but midwest and southeast have a lot of opportunities for PDX. I'm biased but I believe that MSY-PDX would be very successful, especially with our strong months in the fall, winter, and spring complementing PDX's strong summer demand. While it should have been added already, I'd be shocked if no one tries it in 2019.

FA9295 · Wed Jun 27, 2018 9:34 pm

msycajun wrote:
jbpdx wrote:
This, from another thread about Sun Country. Thought it was worth repeating:

msycajun wrote:
Not surprising to see a move to grow PDX. It has been largely neglected by most carriers despite strong growth.

Particularly the ULCCs and WN. I know the west coast is generally a bloodbath right now, but midwest and southeast have a lot of opportunities for PDX. I'm biased but I believe that MSY-PDX would be very successful, especially with our strong months in the fall, winter, and spring complementing PDX's strong summer demand. While it should have been added already, I'd be shocked if no one tries it in 2019.

I'm pretty sure MSY is the second largest unserved market to/from PDX. (#1 is IND and #3 is BNA)

jbpdx · Wed Jun 27, 2018 10:05 pm

FA9295 wrote:
msycajun wrote:
jbpdx wrote:
This, from another thread about Sun Country. Thought it was worth repeating:

Particularly the ULCCs and WN. I know the west coast is generally a bloodbath right now, but midwest and southeast have a lot of opportunities for PDX. I'm biased but I believe that MSY-PDX would be very successful, especially with our strong months in the fall, winter, and spring complementing PDX's strong summer demand. While it should have been added already, I'd be shocked if no one tries it in 2019.

I'm pretty sure MSY is the second largest unserved market to/from PDX. (#1 is IND and #3 is BNA)

Depends on if you’re talking about airport ranking or PDEW. South Florida is by far the largest unserved market/metroplex from PDX. You can get to Iceland in the same time it takes to get to South Florida from Portland. And that’s if you don’t miss your tight connection.

RWA380 · Wed Jun 27, 2018 11:00 pm

lhpdx wrote:
http://www.startribune.com/sun-country-to-start-multiple-routes-to-and-from-portland-ore/486701861/

PDX-HNL/PSP/LAS/PHX/RNO

Freaking out of the blue, Wow! Less than daily, but $318 r/t to HNL from PDX is the best it's been since Dec 2012, when I scored a r/t for $286.50 AS over & HA back.

Midwestindy · Thu Jun 28, 2018 2:44 am

jbpdx wrote:
FA9295 wrote:
msycajun wrote:

Particularly the ULCCs and WN. I know the west coast is generally a bloodbath right now, but midwest and southeast have a lot of opportunities for PDX. I'm biased but I believe that MSY-PDX would be very successful, especially with our strong months in the fall, winter, and spring complementing PDX's strong summer demand. While it should have been added already, I'd be shocked if no one tries it in 2019.

I'm pretty sure MSY is the second largest unserved market to/from PDX. (#1 is IND and #3 is BNA)

Depends on if you’re talking about airport ranking or PDEW. South Florida is by far the largest unserved market/metroplex from PDX. You can get to Iceland in the same time it takes to get to South Florida from Portland. And that’s if you don’t miss your tight connection.

Why would you go by airport ranking, airports should serve the routes that have the most travelers.

FA9295 · Thu Jun 28, 2018 3:39 pm

Southwest is converting it's BWI-SEA service to summer seasonal, so if anyone is to eventually make PDX-BWI service year round, it looks like it'll be Alaska.

pdxswa · Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:27 pm

Rare visitor for here !

FA9295 · Sun Jul 01, 2018 6:04 pm

7/1/2018 OAG:
WN MDW-PDX JAN 1.8>1.2 FEB 1.7>1.0
WN OAK-PDX FEB 5>6
WN PDX-SFO DEC 3>0 JAN 3>0 FEB 3>0
WN PDX-SJC DEC 4>6 JAN 4>7 FEB 4>7

The MDW decrease is disappointing. And the SFO axing was expected. Interesting that SJC frequencies are pretty much doubled in Jan/Feb, though.

jbpdx · Tue Jul 03, 2018 1:16 pm

Cathay Pacific Cargo had three flights from PDX to Hong Kong yesterday, 2 July. I think that’s a record. All were 747-800s.

nmraja · Tue Jul 03, 2018 3:24 pm

I did a PDX-LHR early June for the 1st time. It was a full flight on economy. Meal choice wasn't great but was overall happy with this service. Hope this becomes year round and not just seasonal. I guess this route deserves an year round.

I came back by AMS-PDX. It was a full flight, but probably had a last minute cancellation. So, I got lucky with one free seat in the entire flight.

Meal was slightly better, but still needs to improve the choice a bit more to compete with other airlines.

While I am happy with these available LHR and AMS flights, I am still longing for a CDG flight out of PDX for even more better connections. Hope DL/AF does it soon.

jbpdx · Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:00 pm

nmraja wrote:
I did a PDX-LHR early June for the 1st time. It was a full flight on economy. Meal choice wasn't great but was overall happy with this service. Hope this becomes year round and not just seasonal. I guess this route deserves an year round.

I came back by AMS-PDX. It was a full flight, but probably had a last minute cancellation. So, I got lucky with one free seat in the entire flight.

Meal was slightly better, but still needs to improve the choice a bit more to compete with other airlines.

While I am happy with these available LHR and AMS flights, I am still longing for a CDG flight out of PDX for even more better connections. Hope DL/AF does it soon.

Do you get free alcoholic bevs in Delta main cabin on international?

flyoregon · Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:06 pm

With Sun Country's new flights (although seasonal), does that make PDX a "focus city" of sorts?

nmraja · Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:08 pm

jbpdx wrote:

Do you get free alcoholic bevs in Delta main cabin on international?

I only had fruit juices.

But I did see people getting Wine and Beer for free as normal.

One annoying thing this time was that I felt higher than normal engine noise on the cabin, especially on the A330. I couldn't even hear the audio on movies with full volume.

RWA380 · Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:58 pm

flyoregon wrote:
With Sun Country's new flights (although seasonal), does that make PDX a "focus city" of sorts?

I would say yes, as PDX is being used as a connection point for SY passengers ie ... MSP-PDX-HNL, but as was determined in another thread, it's mostly up to the carrier to provide the title.

flyoregon · Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:08 pm

RWA380 wrote:
flyoregon wrote:
With Sun Country's new flights (although seasonal), does that make PDX a "focus city" of sorts?

I would say yes, as PDX is being used as a connection point for SY passengers ie ... MSP-PDX-HNL, but as was determined in another thread, it's mostly up to the carrier to provide the title.

Right. Not that it really matters a whole lot, but it's fun to see SY do something outside of MSP and DFW to a lesser degree. If SY wants to make a run at Hawaii, connecting people through LAX and PDX give people options. I don't know how many people from the east coast would want to go XXX-MSP-PDX/LAX-HNL, but if it's cheap enough, people do whatever

RWA380 · Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:13 pm

flyoregon wrote:
RWA380 wrote:
flyoregon wrote:
With Sun Country's new flights (although seasonal), does that make PDX a "focus city" of sorts?

I would say yes, as PDX is being used as a connection point for SY passengers ie ... MSP-PDX-HNL, but as was determined in another thread, it's mostly up to the carrier to provide the title.

Right. Not that it really matters a whole lot, but it's fun to see SY do something outside of MSP and DFW to a lesser degree. If SY wants to make a run at Hawaii, connecting people through LAX and PDX give people options. I don't know how many people from the east coast would want to go XXX-MSP-PDX/LAX-HNL, but if it's cheap enough, people do whatever

SY is discontinuing their connections via LAX, I guess the local demand LAX-HNL was enough to warrant it's own service. SY doesn't offer much in the way of connections in MSP for PDX. IIRC the flight leaves MSP pretty early on it's way to PDX & is, or will be a red-eye on the return, perfect timing for MSP, in fact even though it's a flight number change, I bet it's the same aircraft out of HNL.

pdxswa · Thu Jul 05, 2018 1:40 pm

What a great new life for this aircraft !

FA9295 · Fri Jul 06, 2018 4:57 pm

RWA380 wrote:
flyoregon wrote:
RWA380 wrote:

I would say yes, as PDX is being used as a connection point for SY passengers ie ... MSP-PDX-HNL, but as was determined in another thread, it's mostly up to the carrier to provide the title.

Right. Not that it really matters a whole lot, but it's fun to see SY do something outside of MSP and DFW to a lesser degree. If SY wants to make a run at Hawaii, connecting people through LAX and PDX give people options. I don't know how many people from the east coast would want to go XXX-MSP-PDX/LAX-HNL, but if it's cheap enough, people do whatever

SY is discontinuing their connections via LAX, I guess the local demand LAX-HNL was enough to warrant it's own service. SY doesn't offer much in the way of connections in MSP for PDX. IIRC the flight leaves MSP pretty early on it's way to PDX & is, or will be a red-eye on the return, perfect timing for MSP, in fact even though it's a flight number change, I bet it's the same aircraft out of HNL.

I'm pretty sure that SY has LAX-HNL as summer seasonal and PDX-HNL as winter seasonal, so the LAX flight may return later on...

FA9295 · Fri Jul 06, 2018 5:02 pm

jbpdx wrote:
It wouldn’t surprise me if Sun Country is looking at PDX-FLL. They’ve already added Sunday to their recently started Tues/Thur PDX-MCO run. They’d be first from Portland to South Florida and would have it all to themselves.

I would much rather have Alaska and/or jetBlue add PDX-FLL instead of Sun Country because they would probably only make it a 3x weekly seasonal route, as where Alaska and/or jetBlue would make it a daily route. Knowing Sun Country's business model, they would probably rather launch TPA and/or RSW instead of FLL.

jbpdx · Fri Jul 06, 2018 6:12 pm

I doubt Sun Country will do FLL, but they are aware it’s unserved. JetBlue would be best because of their hub there, but they haven’t seemed interested. There’s still a possibility for AA to MIA (replacement for SLC-MIA?) It will be one or the other. I don’t think TPA will happen any time soon by anyone despite PDX being on their target list.

jbpdx · Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:54 pm

jbpdx wrote:
PDX Portland International Airport
May 2018

Total. +5.3% (1.7 million)
Domestic. +5%
International. +14.4%

YTD passengers: 7,457,562

Cathay Pacific Cargo
May +29.6%
YTD +62.9%

The May traffic statistics report shows Horizon/Alaska has recovered and added flights since last fall:

May 2018. 4,056
December 2017. 2,864
(May 2017. 3,620)
(December 2016. 3,520)

However, SkyWest has seen a sharp cutback over the past year:

May 2018. 994
(December 2017. 1,246)
May 2017. 1,850
(December 2016. 1,442)

That’s almost a 50% cut. I wonder where all the losses/changes occurred? Some Delta Seattle cuts included?

pdxav8r · Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:10 pm

jbpdx wrote:
jbpdx wrote:
PDX Portland International Airport
May 2018

Total. +5.3% (1.7 million)
Domestic. +5%
International. +14.4%

YTD passengers: 7,457,562

Cathay Pacific Cargo
May +29.6%
YTD +62.9%

The May traffic statistics report shows Horizon/Alaska has recovered and added flights since last fall:

May 2018. 4,056
December 2017. 2,864
(May 2017. 3,620)
(December 2016. 3,520)

However, SkyWest has seen a sharp cutback over the past year:

May 2018. 994
(December 2017. 1,246)
May 2017. 1,850
(December 2016. 1,442)

That’s almost a 50% cut. I wonder where all the losses/changes occurred? Some Delta Seattle cuts included?

SkyWest cutbacks are primarily due to AS/Horizon taking delivery of more E175’s, thus replacing the need for leased Skywest planes. If DL also runs SkyWest planes, that again is a reflection of more mainline flights from LAX and SEA, replacing ERJ’s and CRJ’s.

jbpdx · Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:42 pm

Checking PDX-HNL in December/January, DL will operate holiday schedule (although they’re ending it earlier than usual?) so there’ll be four carriers on that route briefly. I also notice a Qantas flight (#3712) from 27 Nov-15 Dec. I know FlightView makes mistakes but I don’t get this.

FA9295 · Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:45 pm

jbpdx wrote:
Checking PDX-HNL in December/January, DL will operate holiday schedule (although they’re ending it earlier than usual?) so there’ll be four carriers on that route briefly. I also notice a Qantas flight (#3712) from 27 Nov-15 Dec. I know FlightView makes mistakes but I don’t get this.

Flightview lists codeshare routes alongside regular routes as well. QF3712 still operates today as AS833. See: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/QFA3712

FA9295 · Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:54 pm

jbpdx wrote:
FA9295 wrote:
jbpdx wrote:
Checking PDX-HNL in December/January, DL will operate holiday schedule (although they’re ending it earlier than usual?) so there’ll be four carriers on that route briefly. I also notice a Qantas flight (#3712) from 27 Nov-15 Dec. I know FlightView makes mistakes but I don’t get this.

Flightview lists codeshare routes alongside regular routes as well. QF3712 still operates today as AS833. See: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/QFA3712

So it’s just an extra AS flight.

Exactly. China Airlines has a codeshare agreement on Hawaiian's PDX-HNL route (HA25) as CI9205. See: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/CAL9205

jbpdx · Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:57 pm

FA9295 wrote:
jbpdx wrote:
Checking PDX-HNL in December/January, DL will operate holiday schedule (although they’re ending it earlier than usual?) so there’ll be four carriers on that route briefly. I also notice a Qantas flight (#3712) from 27 Nov-15 Dec. I know FlightView makes mistakes but I don’t get this.

Flightview lists codeshare routes alongside regular routes as well. QF3712 still operates today as AS833. See: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/QFA3712

So it’s just an extra AS flight.

jbpdx · Sat Jul 07, 2018 7:16 pm

I understand codeshares but why doesn’t FlightView just list it as an additional Alaska flight? AS833 departs at 9:10, the QF3712 departs at 9:46.

jbpdx · Sun Jul 08, 2018 6:03 pm

Alaska is starting PDX-PVR and PDX-SJD earlier this fall, 4 Nov instead of mid-December. Schedule also shows the routes continuing into June next summer instead of ending in April. That’s as far as the schedule goes so maybe it will run longer.

lhpdx · Sun Jul 08, 2018 7:12 pm

AS PDX-BOS DEC 2>1.5 JAN 2>1.2 FEB 2>1.0
*AS PDX-DTW MAR 0.7>0
AS PDX-OAK DEC 3>2
AS PDX-PSP DEC 1.3>2
*AS PDX-PVR NOV 0>0.4 DEC 0.3>0.4
*AS PDX-SJD NOV 0>0.5 DEC 0.3>0.6

lhpdx · Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:23 pm

How many cities AS has dropped from its PDX hub? I counted DTW, OMA, BLI, PSC, DEN, and FAI.....

flymco753 · Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:32 pm

Dtw isn’t dropped, it’s a very seasonal route. I have no doubts it’ll be April-August.

jplatts · Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:41 pm

jbpdx wrote:
I doubt Sun Country will do FLL, but they are aware it’s unserved. JetBlue would be best because of their hub there, but they haven’t seemed interested. There’s still a possibility for AA to MIA (replacement for SLC-MIA?) It will be one or the other. I don’t think TPA will happen any time soon by anyone despite PDX being on their target list.

NK might be possibly willing to add PDX-FLL nonstop service on at least a seasonal basis since NK currently does operate SEA-FLL nonstop service on a seasonal basis, since PDX is slightly closer to FLL than SEA is, and since NK is willing to operate nonstop routes that are as long or longer than PDX-FLL.

PDX is located in the 3rd largest market (after LAX and SEA) that has never had any nonstop service to Florida on WN, and I could see WN possibly adding nonstop service to Florida destinations from PDX in the future.

Chugach · Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:04 pm

lhpdx wrote:
How many cities AS has dropped from its PDX hub? I counted DTW, OMA, BLI, PSC, DEN, and FAI.....

PDX-FAI was dropped 4+ years ago, and PDX-DEN hasn’t been flown by AS in close to a decade.

FA9295 · Mon Jul 09, 2018 11:57 pm

flymco753 wrote:
Dtw isn’t dropped, it’s a very seasonal route. I have no doubts it’ll be April-August.

The route was scheduled to resume mid-March, and now it's not showing up at all as far out as the schedule goes to. However, the second BOS flight will return in mid-March.

I think Alaska is doing this not necessarily because these flights have had low load factors, but because they believe that they can use the 737s elsewhere to make more money.

FA9295 · Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:00 am

lhpdx wrote:
How many cities AS has dropped from its PDX hub? I counted DTW, OMA, BLI, PSC, DEN, and FAI.....

And STL.

FA9295 · Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:04 am

jplatts wrote:
jbpdx wrote:
I doubt Sun Country will do FLL, but they are aware it’s unserved. JetBlue would be best because of their hub there, but they haven’t seemed interested. There’s still a possibility for AA to MIA (replacement for SLC-MIA?) It will be one or the other. I don’t think TPA will happen any time soon by anyone despite PDX being on their target list.

NK might be possibly willing to add PDX-FLL nonstop service on at least a seasonal basis since NK currently does operate SEA-FLL nonstop service on a seasonal basis, since PDX is slightly closer to FLL than SEA is, and since NK is willing to operate nonstop routes that are as long or longer than PDX-FLL.

PDX is located in the 3rd largest market (after LAX and SEA) that has never had any nonstop service to Florida on WN, and I could see WN possibly adding nonstop service to Florida destinations from PDX in the future.

I wouldn't count on Spirit to do that. They've pretty much failed at PDX. If they can't run DFW, LAX or DTW, there's no way that FLL will come from them; especially since Spirit is dropping SEA-FLL in early September.

jplatts · Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:29 am

FA9295 wrote:
I wouldn't count on Spirit to do that. They've pretty much failed at PDX. If they can't run DFW, LAX or DTW, there's no way that FLL will come from them; especially since Spirit is dropping SEA-FLL in early September.

NK had already said that its SEA-FLL nonstop route would only be operated on a seasonal basis when it was announced last November.

BoeingGuy · Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:01 am

Chugach wrote:
lhpdx wrote:
How many cities AS has dropped from its PDX hub? I counted DTW, OMA, BLI, PSC, DEN, and FAI.....

PDX-FAI was dropped 4+ years ago, and PDX-DEN hasn’t been flown by AS in close to a decade.

I believe PDX-FAI only operated one season. It was short lived.

Another PDX drop is LGB. RNO was dropped at one time too, but I believe it came back.

RWA380 · Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:39 am

BoeingGuy wrote:
Chugach wrote:
lhpdx wrote:
How many cities AS has dropped from its PDX hub? I counted DTW, OMA, BLI, PSC, DEN, and FAI.....

PDX-FAI was dropped 4+ years ago, and PDX-DEN hasn’t been flown by AS in close to a decade.

I believe PDX-FAI only operated one season. It was short lived.

Another PDX drop is LGB. RNO was dropped at one time too, but I believe it came back.

Yeah I think it may have been the same summer AS flew ANC-GEG & RNO has been added back, AS mainline flew it & it came back as QX.

If we are going back in time, then RDD, ACV, LMT, PDT, OTH were all operated by AS/QX & have been dropped from PDX. ATL was dropped & then brought back seasonally.

pdxav8r · Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:13 am

pdxswa wrote:
Rare visitor for here !

Hey Bill, absolutely love your work, and this site confirms that with the views you recieve. Any chance you get a daytime shot of the Saturday Volaris plane? Being that every other day is a red eye, and the Saturday flight is an afternoon flight? Would love to see that added to the PDX database.

jbpdx · Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:37 am

Here’s a one-minute clip of Volaris landing at PDX.

https://youtu.be/lATgbO4kFxU

pdxav8r · Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:43 am

jbpdx wrote:
Here’s a one-minute clip of Volaris landing at PDX.

https://youtu.be/lATgbO4kFxU

Thanks JB!

seb146 · Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:13 am

The majority of posts I have seen on this thread are about PDX, so I thought I would put this here

UA flies once a day OTH-SFO with CRJ and twice a week OTH-DEN with E175

87th time is a charm. I had some trouble uploading this pic. I am not good with images....

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