PIT Update Discussion Thread - 2018

USPIT10L · Sat Sep 15, 2018 3:33 pm

AA has publicly stated many times they want as little p2p as possible, that's partially why PITBOS is getting cut in December. IINM the only p2p routes left in the AA network are BOSMDT, BOSSYR, and PITRDU, everything else touches a hub.

JamesRenard · Sat Sep 15, 2018 4:33 pm

Transtats released passenger numbers for June 2018 yesterday.

Non-stop domestic destinations operating throughout the last 12 months:
ending Mar '18: 53 destinations
ending Jun '18: 55 destinations (ALB and VPS new)

The number of destinations that saw an increase in passenger numbers went from 41 to 45, and those that saw declines went from 12 to 10.
FKL, PBI, PGD, PHX and SAV went from losing passengers to gaining them. BDL, DEN and MSP went the other way.

These destinations increased the most between Jun '17 and Jun '18 were:

DFW, +55,012 (+36.62%)
MCO, +51,182 (+23.71%)
BOS, +41,113 (+27.53%)
ORD, +33,425 (+11.00%)
LAX, +31,438 (+56.64%)

And these destinations decreased the most:

DEN -13,381 (-7.03%)
ATL, -8,154 (-1.88%)
JFK, -3,859 (-5.70%)
CLT, -3,386 (-1.17%)
RDU, -2,479 (-9.58%)

The F9 cuts to service are taking a toll on passenger numbers to DEN...

USPIT10L wrote:
AA has publicly stated many times they want as little p2p as possible, that's partially why PITBOS is getting cut in December. IINM the only p2p routes left in the AA network are BOSMDT, BOSSYR, and PITRDU, everything else touches a hub.

This, and the sharp drop on the highlighted route, makes me wonder if AA plans on cutting the route in the future.

Runway28L · Sat Sep 15, 2018 4:53 pm

I really don't see the US3 doing anything interesting out of PIT. The following seems clear cut:

- AA will likely cut RDU and focus with their hubs, especially PHL, DFW, and CLT. As well as help fuel the BA flight to LHR. About those passenger numbers, I wonder if DFW connections have been eating into AA's CLT traffic since the merger.

- DL will likely add PIT-RDU and maybe PIT-LAX if the airport decides to go for it. I've really started to lose belief in PIT-SEA for them as they probably think AS already has the market covered.

- UA will probably continue to add mainline capacity once the UA/CO FA fence is lifted next month and acquire more used aircraft. There's already signs of IAH and IAD potentially gaining mainline for good which would be a nice change from the constant 76 seaters here.

IMO if PIT is going to gain any domestic P2P routes, it's likely going to come from the ULCCs.

JamesRenard · Sat Sep 15, 2018 5:05 pm

Does anyone else think that when BA starts LHR-PIT, AA will drop JFK-PIT and leave DL with a monopoly on the route?
Passenger numbers have been dwindling for a past couple of years and AA has been using smaller aircraft. In May '16, they used an E175. In May '17, it was an ERJ-145. This year, it was an ERJ-140. I reckon that once the non-stop flights commence, connecting AA/BA traffic passing through JFK will likely fall.

USPIT10L · Sat Sep 15, 2018 5:19 pm

JFK connects to more than just BA, it's used for NYC O&D too, even though it's only once a day. AA also flies INDJFK and CLEJFK for the same purposes, limited NYC O&D and international connections. If there's any Eagle route in PIT on the future chopping block, it's RDU, especially with Trans States, the operator of the route, leaving the American Eagle system in early 2019.

Also, there are AA connections, like MXP, in particular, that are only available through JFK, although that is the only exclusive JFK-only destination left next summer.

Gsasala · Sat Sep 15, 2018 8:56 pm

Even if they do cut the JFK flight we still have LGA and most flights where I'm going international fly to LGA then you go to JFK. Just look at ORD to JFK AA has one flight

Gsasala · Sat Sep 15, 2018 9:07 pm

Is there any reason why there's a B747 at PIT?

Flaps · Sat Sep 15, 2018 9:38 pm

Gsasala wrote:
Is there any reason why there's a B747 at PIT?

Any idea who it belongs to or where it's parked? Largest plane here right now that I'm aware of is a UA 764. I can't see over to Atlantic from where I am but if it's parked over there it's likely to belong to one of the sheikh's that pass through from time to time.

Runway28L · Sat Sep 15, 2018 10:29 pm

It was an Atlas Air B747-400 (N322SG). It flew LAX-BUF yesterday to drop the LA Chargers off in Buffalo then ferried to PIT empty late last night. No idea why it stopped by.

http://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/N322SG

The Chargers appear to have switched from UA to 5Y recently. They play the Steelers in Pittsburgh on 12/2, so I would expect the B744 to show up at PIT again that week.

Gsasala · Sat Sep 15, 2018 10:35 pm

Runway28L wrote:
It was an Atlas Air B747-400 (N322SG). It flew LAX-BUF yesterday to drop the LA Chargers off in Buffalo then ferried to PIT empty late last night. No idea why it stopped by.

http://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/N322SG

I think they parked it here since I don't think buffalo has room for a 747 to be parked there

ctrabs0114 · Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:52 pm

Flaps wrote:
Gsasala wrote:
Is there any reason why there's a B747 at PIT?

Any idea who it belongs to or where it's parked? Largest plane here right now that I'm aware of is a UA 764. I can't see over to Atlantic from where I am but if it's parked over there it's likely to belong to one of the sheikh's that pass through from time to time.

The 764 is most likely the Chefs charter for their game against the Steelers this afternoon.

maximairways · Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:52 pm

Gsasala wrote:
Runway28L wrote:
It was an Atlas Air B747-400 (N322SG). It flew LAX-BUF yesterday to drop the LA Chargers off in Buffalo then ferried to PIT empty late last night. No idea why it stopped by.

http://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/N322SG

I think they parked it here since I don't think buffalo has room for a 747 to be parked there

Yes it does, AF1 and other charter 747s have parked at BUF.

ctrabs0114 · Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:53 pm

Runway28L wrote:
The Chargers appear to have switched from UA to 5Y recently. They play the Steelers in Pittsburgh on 12/2, so I would expect the B744 to show up at PIT again that week.

The LA Rams use UA, but I thought the Chargers flew on DL last season.

flyPIT · Sun Sep 16, 2018 9:15 pm

Anyone know the aircraft type?
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/IAM3176/history/20180916/0807Z/CYQX/KPIT

Runway28L · Sun Sep 16, 2018 9:31 pm

flyPIT wrote:
Anyone know the aircraft type?
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/IAM3176/history/20180916/0807Z/CYQX/KPIT

Appears to be a Falcon 900EX through a Google search.

Cush · Sun Sep 16, 2018 9:32 pm

Do we have anyone flying nonstop from PIT to the Bahamas? Scheduled or Charter?

flyPIT · Sun Sep 16, 2018 9:45 pm

Cush wrote:
Do we have anyone flying nonstop from PIT to the Bahamas? Scheduled or Charter?

We had FPO by Vacation Express but looks like both FPO and CZM are not returning for 2019 as of now.

https://www.vacationexpress.com/flight-schedule/

Cush · Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:14 am

flyPIT wrote:
Cush wrote:
Do we have anyone flying nonstop from PIT to the Bahamas? Scheduled or Charter?

We had FPO by Vacation Express but looks like both FPO and CZM are not returning for 2019 as of now.

https://www.vacationexpress.com/flight-schedule/

Strange... So we have FIVE airlines flying to CUN, but ZERO flying to Bahamas... Hmm...

Sucks. The wife and I have a free vacation there, but i'm not really trying to connect and turn a 3 hour flight into an 8 hour flight just to go to the Bahamas.

ConcourseZ · Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:28 pm

flyPIT wrote:
Anyone know the aircraft type?
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/IAM3176/history/20180916/0807Z/CYQX/KPIT

I saw two or three what looked like F-5s take off from PIT yesterday.

Runway28L · Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:57 pm

ConcourseZ wrote:
I saw two or three what looked like F-5s take off from PIT yesterday.

Those were T-38s from Whiteman AFB. They did a flyover for the Steelers game yesterday. Saw one depart this morning shortly before 10am.

flightsimer · Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:59 pm

the Seattle flights are doing really well it seems. I flew out on TUE and it had about 10-15 seats open at most. I had family follow me out on Wednesday and they said their flight was full if not just a handful of seats open in the very back but as far as they could see it was completely full.

We all came back today and the flight was almost full. Just a few seats in the rear remained open.

iyerhari · Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:36 pm

flightsimer wrote:
the Seattle flights are doing really well it seems. I flew out on TUE and it had about 10-15 seats open at most. I had family follow me out on Wednesday and they said their flight was full if not just a handful of seats open in the very back but as far as they could see it was completely full.

We all came back today and the flight was almost full. Just a few seats in the rear remained open.

AS is selling seats for a good price - next week Mon travel from PIT to SEA is selling for $560 which is not bad for economy. The timing is not good for a business passenger who needs to be at client site Mon am IMO or for a SEA bound business passenger traveling from SEA to PIT. The entire day goes in commute unless one travels a night early. But if the route is doing good i am sure AS will come up with N addnl flight or change times.

CaptainMidnight · Wed Sep 19, 2018 8:12 pm

I was at Racoon Creek State Park beach for the first time this past weekend and I came to realize it was a good spot for plane spotting! Good mix of departures and arrivals.

Runway28L · Wed Sep 19, 2018 9:52 pm

Noticed that UPS is running a B752 on SJU-PIT this evening with an estimated arrival time of 1955. The flight also operated yesterday according to FR24. Anyone have any info on this?

http://www.flightradar24.com/data/flights/5X5634

flyPIT · Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:58 am

Runway28L wrote:
Noticed that UPS is running a B752 on SJU-PIT this evening with an estimated arrival time of 1955. The flight also operated yesterday according to FR24. Anyone have any info on this?

http://www.flightradar24.com/data/flights/5X5634

This looks to be a new flight as it's in the schedule for the foreseeable future. This coincides with a new PIT-EWR AM departure as well which is also on the schedule.
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/UPS5632/history/20180920/1154Z/KPIT/KEWR
I imagine what is happening is they need the 757 that usually sits in PIT all day so it goes out to EWR in the morning and another one (or same one) comes back in the evening from SJU to do the usual PIT-PHL-PIT flight.

FedEx also operated an extra PIT-MEM flight the other night, and the morning EWR-PIT-BNA flight appears to now be routed EWR-PIT-MDT.

steeler83 · Thu Sep 20, 2018 3:48 pm

What equipment is FedEX using, the A300 still? I know some time back someone said FX never ran DC10/MD11s to/from PIT, but I swear when I was 10 years old and would frequent PIT to look at the various planes coming and going that I saw at least one MD11 over at the FX ramps. I know there were 727s over there as well.

Runway28L · Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:29 am

steeler83 wrote:
What equipment is FedEX using, the A300 still? I know some time back someone said FX never ran DC10/MD11s to/from PIT, but I swear when I was 10 years old and would frequent PIT to look at the various planes coming and going that I saw at least one MD11 over at the FX ramps. I know there were 727s over there as well.

I can't speak for way back then, but FX has been operating the A306 to PIT for like forever it seems. Both MEM and IND are currently all-A306. EWR-PIT-MDT is a B752 while SCE and the occasional CBE flights are Cessna 208s.

FX did briefly run PIT-SJU on an MD-11 last fall sponsored by the Pirates for hurricane relief.

Runway28L · Fri Sep 21, 2018 9:45 pm

Frontier appears to have moved to Concourse D today. Arrivals board shows F91292 from SAN arrived at gate D86 which is one of DL's gates.

Did DL ground handle F9 during their first stint here when they flew to MKE on RP metal?

USPIT10L · Fri Sep 21, 2018 9:47 pm

No, they had their own employees at that time....I was one of them.....DGS didn't pick up F9 business until after the RP 145s were disposed of.

flyPIT · Sat Sep 22, 2018 3:56 am

August numbers are out, total passengers are up 6.3%. Int'l was up 15.8% so that is nice to see after that lull in July.
http://www.flypittsburgh.com/getattachment/Newsroom/Airport-Statistics/August-2018-Short-E-Mail-Report.pdf.aspx?lang=en-US

Nice jump in mail and cargo too.

ctrabs0114 · Sat Sep 22, 2018 10:55 am

So, apparently, the Pitt Panthers football team is the latest to jump on the Miami Air (BSK) bandwagon, as they flew BSK302 to RDU ahead of their game against UNC-Chapel Hill.

Runway28L · Sat Sep 22, 2018 3:28 pm

ctrabs0114 wrote:
So, apparently, the Pitt Panthers football team is the latest to jump on the Miami Air (BSK) bandwagon, as they flew BSK302 to RDU ahead of their game against UNC-Chapel Hill.

Who did Pitt previously use for their charter flights?

ctrabs0114 · Sun Sep 23, 2018 8:32 am

Runway28L wrote:
ctrabs0114 wrote:
So, apparently, the Pitt Panthers football team is the latest to jump on the Miami Air (BSK) bandwagon, as they flew BSK302 to RDU ahead of their game against UNC-Chapel Hill.

Who did Pitt previously use for their charter flights?

I think AA had those flights until this season, usually with an A321, but I'm not 100 percent positive.

CaptainMidnight · Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:10 pm

ctrabs0114 wrote:
So, apparently, the Pitt Panthers football team is the latest to jump on the Miami Air (BSK) bandwagon, as they flew BSK302 to RDU ahead of their game against UNC-Chapel Hill.

Looks like the Steelers too: http://flightaware.com/live/flight/id/B ... 39-4-1-159

kavok · Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:47 pm

Runway28L wrote:
I really don't see the US3 doing anything interesting out of PIT. The following seems clear cut:

- AA will likely cut RDU and focus with their hubs, especially PHL, DFW, and CLT. As well as help fuel the BA flight to LHR. About those passenger numbers, I wonder if DFW connections have been eating into AA's CLT traffic since the merger.

- DL will likely add PIT-RDU and maybe PIT-LAX if the airport decides to go for it. I've really started to lose belief in PIT-SEA for them as they probably think AS already has the market covered.

- UA will probably continue to add mainline capacity once the UA/CO FA fence is lifted next month and acquire more used aircraft. There's already signs of IAH and IAD potentially gaining mainline for good which would be a nice change from the constant 76 seaters here.

IMO if PIT is going to gain any domestic P2P routes, it's likely going to come from the ULCCs.

I think the big issue preventkng DL from operating PIT-SEA is the limited gate space DL currently experiences at SEA. I am sure there are several additional locations DL would like to operate from SEA (PIT included) that they are simply not able to because of SEA’s congestion.

Adding PIT would effectively force DL to drop another location/frequency from SEA, and I don’t believe DL is willing to do that.

flyPIT · Mon Sep 24, 2018 11:16 pm

United will be operating PIT-LAS flights for the Consumer Electronics Show (CES) in January:
https://www.bizjournals.com/losangeles/news/2018/09/24/united-airlines-boosting-service-to-ces.html

dabpit · Tue Sep 25, 2018 2:04 pm

flyPIT wrote:
United will be operating PIT-LAS flights for the Consumer Electronics Show (CES) in January:
https://www.bizjournals.com/losangeles/news/2018/09/24/united-airlines-boosting-service-to-ces.html

Appears to be a good strategy on United's part. Hopefully, it is successful for them.

ctrabs0114 · Tue Sep 25, 2018 8:45 pm

CaptainMidnight wrote:
ctrabs0114 wrote:
So, apparently, the Pitt Panthers football team is the latest to jump on the Miami Air (BSK) bandwagon, as they flew BSK302 to RDU ahead of their game against UNC-Chapel Hill.

Looks like the Steelers too: http://flightaware.com/live/flight/id/B ... 39-4-1-159

This is the second year of the Steelers using BSK after using US/AA for so many years.

flyPIT · Tue Sep 25, 2018 11:54 pm

Regarding United and PIT-LAS, there will be one round trip operated by an A319. Departs PIT Jan 7 and returns Jan 11. Pittsburgh's emerging tech industry is cited as the reason; other cities getting UA flights to LAS include tech hotspots such as RDU, BOS, AUS, SEA, SJC.
http://www.post-gazette.com/business/development/2018/09/24/United-to-add-flight-to-Las-Vegas-for-a-day-consumer-electronics-show-CES-pittsburgh/stories/201809240137?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1537871934

AaronPGH · Wed Sep 26, 2018 12:11 am

Even though it's just one round trip, it's good to see that UA is watching the PGH economy this closely.

ConcourseZ · Wed Sep 26, 2018 7:48 pm

I meant to add this after the EI new routes announcement. An article on WESA quoted Christina, and I paraphrase here, that the ACAA was not interested in additional TATL carriers at this time. They want to get BA up and running, and successful.

PITexpress · Thu Sep 27, 2018 2:00 pm

Here's the link to that article. Surprised how many articles WESA's site has on the airport. http://www.wesa.fm/post/immigrants-make ... ution-adds

...Dublin could be next, but "we'd love to get London secured, started, successful before we bring in another European service," she says.

kavok · Thu Sep 27, 2018 2:12 pm

With all of the new planes EI is taking on next year, late spring/summer 2020 seems like a more logical time for EI to start DUB-PIT. It also would give BA a year under their belt to work out any bugs on their new LHR-PIT service.

Runway28L · Thu Sep 27, 2018 5:53 pm

PITexpress wrote:
Here's the link to that article. Surprised how many articles WESA's site has on the airport. http://www.wesa.fm/post/immigrants-make ... ution-adds

...Dublin could be next, but "we'd love to get London secured, started, successful before we bring in another European service," she says.

So the airport is taking their time with service to Europe, which is exactly what they should be doing. I really think it’s evident now that DL yanking CDG right after BA’s announcement was a wake up call for the ACAA. So good on them for taking this path.

Clipper2Heavy · Thu Sep 27, 2018 6:08 pm

Runway28L wrote:
PITexpress wrote:
Here's the link to that article. Surprised how many articles WESA's site has on the airport. http://www.wesa.fm/post/immigrants-make ... ution-adds

...Dublin could be next, but "we'd love to get London secured, started, successful before we bring in another European service," she says.

So the airport is taking their time with service to Europe, which is exactly what they should be doing. I really think it’s evident now that DL yanking CDG right after BA’s announcement was a wake up call for the ACAA. So good on them for taking this path.

Agree 1000%. Let the TATL market mature, and we'll go from there. We have the right geography and frequency for Europe right now. It'd be nice to see Condor go full year next -> A boy can hope!

iyerhari · Thu Sep 27, 2018 6:45 pm

USPIT10L wrote:
AA has publicly stated many times they want as little p2p as possible, that's partially why PITBOS is getting cut in December. IINM the only p2p routes left in the AA network are BOSMDT, BOSSYR, and PITRDU, everything else touches a hub.

BOSROC and RDULHR. I believe the AA strategy is simple - they will hold on these 5 or 6 p2p routes as long as there is no competition on that route. They will try to hold on to the route for few months after any competition comes, and if they see competition is getting tough, they will potentially retrench the route. Case in example: BOSRDU, BOSBUF and BOSPIT.

USPIT10L · Thu Sep 27, 2018 7:06 pm

Thanks. Forgot about BOSROC. LHR is considered a hub, though....

PITexpress · Thu Sep 27, 2018 7:53 pm

On the subject of DL, I just got a call from a representative of theirs responding to an email I sent weeks ago expressing my dismay at PIT-CDG being cancelled. My message will be passed on to 'network planning.' Sounds cool, but doubt it will do any good.

Regardless, I agree that the ACAA should be focusing on existing service for the time being. Year round Condor would be great, BA at a slightly earlier time would be nice too, in order to help with connections in LRH.

flyPIT · Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:18 pm

Trans-Atlantic loads for Feb and Mar:

Feb
PIT-KEF 70%
KEF-PIT 67%

Mar
PIT-KEF 83%
KEF-PIT 83%

I agree on Condor, we do not want to lose that one because LH sure isn't gonna come in here with an A333. Unfortunately Condor's current schedule for next summer appears to look less and less like only a placeholder, and more set in stone as time goes on. The ACAA route map confirms the date Condor resumes next summer, which is only for a very short season like the first year.

That can always change though, especially if aircraft availability increases with the potential elimination of AUS (LH announced AUS today). MSY appears to be gone as of now too.

Edit: BTW, Condor's reduced schedule for next summer was posted before BA announced PIT-LHR.

Runway28L · Fri Sep 28, 2018 1:20 am

flyPIT wrote:
Trans-Atlantic loads for Feb and Mar:

Feb
PIT-KEF 70%
KEF-PIT 67%

Mar
PIT-KEF 83%
KEF-PIT 83%

I agree on Condor, we do not want to lose that one because LH sure isn't gonna come in here with an A333. Unfortunately Condor's current schedule for next summer appears to look less and less like only a placeholder, and more set in stone as time goes on. The ACAA route map confirms the date Condor resumes next summer, which is only for a very short season like the first year.

That can always change though, especially if aircraft availability increases with the potential elimination of AUS (LH announced AUS today). MSY appears to be gone as of now too.

Edit: BTW, Condor's reduced schedule for next summer was posted before BA announced PIT-LHR.

When did DE update their schedule last year? I remember they announced that they would add a third weekly frequency for 2018 shortly before the 2017 season ended but did the schedule immediately update when they made that announcement? Or did it take a few more weeks/months for that third flight to show up in the booking engine?

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