SumChristianus wrote:

cvgComair wrote:

SumChristianus wrote:

They seem to be slowly moving up the coast: Florida to SAV to CHS to ....
I wonder if ORF or ACY are next.
What do you think of the potential of HRL or BXI? I think both are served from MSP by DL and/or SY, and could be possible destination cities for G4 as well. Maybe PNS or PBI, but G4 is starting to have to focus on increased frequencies for growth.
BUF maybe as well?

I think ORF is next on the list, with PBI and SAN/OAK being strong contenders. I also think SYR/BUF could be a good possibility considering SYR was added from BNA. IMO, I don't see HRL or PNS (also add in there DAB and MLB) having enough demand, but you never know. BXI seems a little far for an A320 , not sure what IATA code you actually meant.

Sorry meant Gulfport/Biloxi I guess its code is GPT, interesting.
Its funny that F9 is starting CVG-AUS and CVG-SAT only a day apart....

Ah...that makes sense. It might be too close to VPS and MSY, but I bet that could work summer seasonal. With VPS now running at 5x/week, there certainly is demand from CVG to the gulf coast.

AUS should do well with the region growing so quickly, but I am curious to see how SAT does. If it does well and increases the PDEW, that is one route I could see DL trying again. Both routes are timed pretty well for connections in CVG, which should help loads a bit.

cvgComair wrote:

Allegiant has added a 3rd weekly frequency this summer for CVG-CHS, must be doing well for an increase in service already!

I think G4 intended this to be solely a summer/leisure route but with CHS having a very fast growing metro and economy I can easily see this end up being a year round flight. Maybe 2x winter, 3 or 4 the rest of the year. Not surprised this is doing well.

Springs1816 wrote:

cvgComair wrote:

Allegiant has added a 3rd weekly frequency this summer for CVG-CHS, must be doing well for an increase in service already!

I think G4 intended this to be solely a summer/leisure route but with CHS having a very fast growing metro and economy I can easily see this end up being a year round flight. Maybe 2x winter, 3 or 4 the rest of the year. Not surprised this is doing well.

I think there's pretty strong leisure ties to CHS too. I know a lot of families that made the drive growing up...although I am sure that could probably be said for any Midwest town to anywhere with a beach...

CVG-CHS and ORF are candidates for routes that DL should bring back. CHS in particular.

Is there a date for the supposed G4 and F9 adds?

I was randomly looking at flights again, and it looks like CVG-LGA on AA is down to 2x ERJ-140s.

That route started as 2x E175s, and is now down to the minimum. I wonder how much longer AA will stick around. Competing with DL is hard enough, and now with F9 there too, I'm not sure if there's room for AA. It's not like they have much of a hub to feed at LGA these days.

WWads wrote:

I was randomly looking at flights again, and it looks like CVG-LGA on AA is down to 2x ERJ-140s.

That route started as 2x E175s, and is now down to the minimum. I wonder how much longer AA will stick around.

It actually started out at 3x/day before that, so it has been cut down a ton. I think F9 on the route daily has made it a real struggle for AA.

NK is cutting CAK-FLL and -MYR. MCO will be the only route to continue.

DeltaRules wrote:

Is there a date for the supposed G4 and F9 adds?

When I made my OR post, I had heard G4 was updating their summer schedule, which they did late last week. However, no new routes were added during that schedule enhancement (the BNA additions were before the schedule refresh). For CVG, the days of departure for some routes was tweaked and CHS got a 3rd weekly frequency, but nothing new was added. I have not heard anything about follow-up announcements.

As for F9, I have heard that there is another announcement coming, but I don't know what cities or when. The fact that two new destinations are listed on F9.com, with no routes loaded yet, gives some credibility to this claim, but I don't know any sort of timetable for the next announcement.

DeltaRules wrote:

NK is cutting CAK-FLL and -MYR. MCO will be the only route to continue.

Seasonal service to TPA and RSW will return in November.

http://www.cleveland.com/travel/index.s ... outes.html

SumChristianus wrote:

CVG-IAD mainline on UA looks to be semi-permanent, extending into the summer on an A320.
CMH-ORD gets 3x daily mainline, 2x A319, 1x 73G in October.
DAY-ORD sees a lot of Air Wisconsin CR2s however.

While we're talking upgauges, it looks like DL's CMH-MSP has a morning 738 beginning sometime in June.

A few DL changes in the schedule for CVG:
CVG-AUS goes daily and CR9 starting in Nov '18 through end of schedule
CVG-DFW/IAH/XNA go daily starting in Jan '19 through end of schedule
CVG-PHX/LAX/MCO/FLL/RSW/TPA/BOS/LGA/LAS/DCA all see A320's scattered through out the winter, it looks like all MD-88/90 service is being eliminated except CVG-DEN

I am sure much of this is not finalized, but the A320's are interesting. I would love to see an A320 base at CVG, kind of sad to see the airport down to one type with the drawdown of the MD's. Especially with nearly 200 A321's on order and the continued upgrading at CVG, I think the A321 would be the best option to grow seats on many of the mainline routes at CVG.

cvgComair wrote:

A few DL changes in the schedule for CVG:
CVG-AUS goes daily and CR9 starting in Nov '18 through end of schedule
CVG-DFW/IAH/XNA go daily starting in Jan '19 through end of schedule
CVG-PHX/LAX/MCO/FLL/RSW/TPA/BOS/LGA/LAS/DCA all see A320's scattered through out the winter, it looks like all MD-88/90 service is being eliminated except CVG-DEN

I am sure much of this is not finalized, but the A320's are interesting. I would love to see an A320 base at CVG, kind of sad to see the airport down to one type with the drawdown of the MD's. Especially with nearly 200 A321's on order and the continued upgrading at CVG, I think the A321 would be the best option to grow seats on many of the mainline routes at CVG.

Wow! Great to see AUS going daily and on a CR9! Super excited to see how this flight does. I booked my ticket on the inaugural flight, so I'm doing my part

Can't believe that XNA is going daily. Given it's a P&G express, how much traffic could it see on the weekend?

Very interesting re: the A320's being scheduled. Seems like it could just be a place holder until equipment is sorted out. Delta continues to hire for the CVG 737 base. They just had 3 new hires in last weeks class assigned to CVG 737. I would like to see another base added, but would prefer the new C-Series if it does happen.

I'd expect the AUS flight to go to a 717 at some point, and perhaps a CS100 down the line.

I don't see a CS100 base at CVG, but I do expect a regular NYC-CVG-TX rotation. I think an all CS100 schedule NYC-CVG is doable if they drop a frequency at LGA.

I'm going to DAY for a work-related tour this Thursday. I'll report back with any fun stuff I find out.

DeltaRules wrote:

I'm going to DAY for a work-related tour this Thursday. I'll report back with any fun stuff I find out.

That place is such a sad ghost town. I have nothing but negative feelings, thanks to the XXX-CVG-DAY routings we were often forced to take.

Not sure if I missed this earlier, but CVG-MYR is going to 4x/wk this summer.

Trinity Logistics moves into Terminal 3 at LCK and retains overflow space in another hangar:

http://campaign.r20.constantcontact.com ... 3c6816334f

Isn't this company the one behind the China Airlines Cargo flights?

What I see for CMH is 2 Europe flights with 1 to Iceland and 1 to Paris on Delta. I see Aeromexico flying to Guadalajara with Columbuses very fast growth Mexico population, I also can see a flight to Asia on All Nippon a few times a week on the sleek new 787-8, Onejet could create a hub here.

fsafsx wrote:

What I see for CMH is 2 Europe flights with 1 to Iceland and 1 to Paris on Delta. I see Aeromexico flying to Guadalajara with Columbuses very fast growth Mexico population, I also can see a flight to Asia on All Nippon a few times a week on the sleek new 787-8, Onejet could create a hub here.

Volaris does have a hub at GDL, and Volaris could add nonstop service to GDL from CMH. Volaris could also possibly add nonstop service to GDL from CVG since Volaris might be able to connect passengers onto Frontier's CVG-LGA, CVG-PHL, and CVG-RDU flights from GDL if Volaris adds GDL-CVG nonstop service.

Japan Airlines also has 787-8 planes in their fleet, and Japan Airlines could also possibly add nonstop service to TYO from CMH.

There is so much potential with CMH and I just think Spirit was the start.

I just noticed on the CMH website (https://flycolumbus.com/at-the-airport/terminal-maps) that it lists both A1 and A7 (as well as B36, and C48). I had heard that B36 and C48 were being reopened, but I hadn't heard anything about A1, and while WN will park a plane in the space that would be A7, there's also no jetway.

Am I missing something?

CMHMarc787 wrote:

I just noticed on the CMH website (https://flycolumbus.com/at-the-airport/terminal-maps) that it lists both A1 and A7 (as well as B36, and C48). I had heard that B36 and C48 were being reopened, but I hadn't heard anything about A1, and while WN will park a plane in the space that would be A7, there's also no jetway.

Am I missing something?

I think they acknowledge the gates are there even if they're not in use. A7 is technically a hold room in the basement which was used for USAir Express in the '90s. I never understood why CO didn't use it when they were there- they just had A5A, which was a staircase to the ramp.

...adding to that previous thought, they must reach a point at which they figure a gate won't be used again. C1A, which would probably be C46A or 47A today, was just a staircase to a parking stand and is unsigned now. It handled DL Connection flights when DL was on the East end of C and is now just a door to the right of where F9 put their logo on the wall when they moved to C.

There was also C5, which was a similar ramp-level gate that was never used until the concourse was extended (the beginning of the extension is the ramp before Johnny Rockets) and it got a jetway. It's C51 today.

Does anyone know how many A320’s G4 has based in CVG at the moment? I thought it was 5, but I wasn’t sure.

It's 4 right now. The 5th will be coming toward the end of May.

It's 4 right now. The 5th will be coming toward the end of May.

cvgComair wrote:

Does anyone know how many A320’s G4 has based in CVG at the moment? I thought it was 5, but I wasn’t sure.

How large can they get, 10 aircraft?
That would be 25-30 flights a day...
Do they have room to grow that much (in terms of demand?

SumChristianus wrote:

cvgComair wrote:

Does anyone know how many A320’s G4 has based in CVG at the moment? I thought it was 5, but I wasn’t sure.

How large can they get, 10 aircraft?
That would be 25-30 flights a day...
Do they have room to grow that much (in terms of demand?

Not really sure how big they could get, but they will be running 15 peak daily flights this summer, so that 5th A320 will be necessary. G4 will soon be the 2nd largest airline at CVG (in terms of passengers carried), with 43% more flights compared to last year. I have to admit that I though they would slow growth this year, but that does not appear to be the case. Unlike other cities, G4 seems reluctant to pull back capacity when routes are not preforming as well (such as CVG-BWI/AZA/SFB/etc), but the majority of their CVG operation is really strong.

cvgComair wrote:

SumChristianus wrote:

cvgComair wrote:

Does anyone know how many A320’s G4 has based in CVG at the moment? I thought it was 5, but I wasn’t sure.

How large can they get, 10 aircraft?
That would be 25-30 flights a day...
Do they have room to grow that much (in terms of demand?

Unlike other cities, G4 seems reluctant to pull back capacity when routes are not preforming as well

That is something that I️ can admire about G4. When they invest in a market, they usually see it through.

Visited DAY yesterday. They, like every other airport, are in the pursuit of new service from both airlines and cities and are beating the bushes with meetings and at trade shows/conferences. There are a couple airlines they're talking to and, when I asked what nonstops are at the top of their list, they declined to share what those might be. Interestingly, they're doing construction near the last couple counter locations on the right side of the lobby and are putting in a lounge which, for other things, would be used as a gathering place in the event of an accident which affected DAY. I don't know how permanent some of the walls around the construction site are but, if left as-is, they're cutting out a couple counter positions which could otherwise be used by new entrants.

They've done a nice job with the refresh of the terminal, with new carpet (I'll miss the Wright Flyer carpet, though) and brighter, attractive-looking signs for gates and general information. I think the most noticeable thing with regard to service I picked up on was Envoy finally did get the E175 flights they thought were coming last year; in fact, all the DFW flights yesterday were on 175s.

CVG March stats are out:
Passengers are up 15.5% for 1,859,127
Aircraft movements are up 14.3% for 37,262
Cargo is up 41.3% for 289,835 tons

At the current rate, pax are heading for just above 9 million.

Cargo growth has slowed a little, but that is mostly because Amazon has not added new flights in awhile. There is a lot of slack in their fleet, so I would love to see a 2nd daily sort, but we may still be aways from that coming to fruition.

WN's inaugural CMH-CUN flight is tomorrow and, interestingly enough, DL's flight tomorrow is on an A320 as opposed to the usual MD-88.

Also, the inbound WN flight from CUN is slated to arrive at A4 tomorrow according to FlightAware, which doesn't make sense as DL and the Vacation Express flights have to park at C46 to send their passengers through FIS. Is there any sort of pre-clearance at CUN?

DeltaRules wrote:

Is there any sort of pre-clearance at CUN?

Nope. I flew WN back form Cancun a couple months ago, I had to go through Customs on the US side. Southwest also has it arriving at A4.

DeltaRules wrote:

WN's inaugural CMH-CUN flight is tomorrow and, interestingly enough, DL's flight tomorrow is on an A320 as opposed to the usual MD-88.

MD88s have been taken off all the US-CUN flights I believe

Midwestindy wrote:

DeltaRules wrote:

WN's inaugural CMH-CUN flight is tomorrow and, interestingly enough, DL's flight tomorrow is on an A320 as opposed to the usual MD-88.

MD88s have been taken off all the US-CUN flights I believe

That is the plan, all CUN routes will switch to the A320/B738 by June 9. CMH has two more weekends of the A320, then it is back to MD-80's until June 9.

While we are on the subject of MD88's, the last Delta scheduled passenger flight for the MD88 are tentatively scheduled for June 7 as DL2827 ATL-CVG arriving at 8:26pm and DL2882 BOS-CVG arriving at 8:30pm. The aircraft will be ferried out shortly thereafter, but we will not know those details until the date gets closer. Thereafter, DL will only operate MD90 flights from CVG, and once the A320's arrive, those too will be phased out in Dec/Jan.

It is pretty crazy to think that the MD80 was one of the most used types by DL at CVG only a few years ago. I am sure we will see some more one-off MD88 flights before the 2020 retirement date, but it looks like the era is coming to an end. G4 will also end MD88 flying at CVG this year, probably in mid-August, but they could keep using the aircraft at CVG right up until the Nov 25 retirement date (like they did with the 757). AA looks to be keeping CVG-DFW as one of the last MD82/3 routes, with a retirement from CVG sometime in 2019.

cvgComair wrote:

While we are on the subject of MD88's, the last Delta scheduled passenger flight for the MD88 are tentatively scheduled for June 7 as DL2827 ATL-CVG arriving at 8:26pm and DL2882 BOS-CVG arriving at 8:30pm. The aircraft will be ferried out shortly thereafter, but we will not know those details until the date gets closer. Thereafter, DL will only operate MD90 flights from CVG, and once the A320's arrive, those too will be phased out in Dec/Jan.

It is pretty crazy to think that the MD80 was one of the most used types by DL at CVG only a few years ago. I am sure we will see some more one-off MD88 flights before the 2020 retirement date, but it looks like the era is coming to an end. G4 will also end MD88 flying at CVG this year, probably in mid-August, but they could keep using the aircraft at CVG right up until the Nov 25 retirement date (like they did with the 757). AA looks to be keeping CVG-DFW as one of the last MD82/3 routes, with a retirement from CVG sometime in 2019.

Has it been definitively said that this is the last M88 operation from CVG ever? I can't believe they won't show up on turns from ATL in the future especially with DL's bingo ball aircraft type scheduling.

DeltaRules wrote:

Has it been definitively said that this is the last M88 operation from CVG ever? I can't believe they won't show up on turns from ATL in the future especially with DL's bingo ball aircraft type scheduling.

Did you not see this part of the post?

cvgComair wrote:

I am sure we will see some more one-off MD88 flights before the 2020 retirement date, but it looks like the era is coming to an end.

I'd imagine that you will see them, but very infrequently. With as few mainline flights as there are, I'd imagine DL's preference is to route aircraft supporting the pilot base and that are capable of operating the transcon flights as well.

jbmitt wrote:

DeltaRules wrote:

Has it been definitively said that this is the last M88 operation from CVG ever? I can't believe they won't show up on turns from ATL in the future especially with DL's bingo ball aircraft type scheduling.

I'd imagine that you will see them, but very infrequently. With as few mainline flights as there are, I'd imagine DL's preference is to route aircraft supporting the pilot base and that are capable of operating the transcon flights as well.

This is the tentative plan, but it remains to be seen if DL sticks to it. Routes like CVG-ATL will be going all 738 in support of the pilot base, but there are still going to be some subs. Similar to stations such as LGA, DL's preference is to use the 737's and 320's going forward. For CVG, this mostly has to do with the desire to upgrade to larger aircraft and supporting the pilot base.

DL is sending diversions from MSP which is closed because of snow. They have also slashed flights out of DTW, but it looks like an AF B789 and DL A359 are still enroute, I am hoping they decide to divert to CVG . Since they cancelled everything ahead of time, there are only a few diversions as of now:
DL A330-330 from AMS: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL163
DL B767-300 from LHR: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL11
DL B717-200 from JFK: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL463

Sad that the MD88s are going. I could always tell when one was taking off. They caused the windows at my house to rattle slightly.

cvgComair wrote:

jbmitt wrote:

DeltaRules wrote:

Has it been definitively said that this is the last M88 operation from CVG ever? I can't believe they won't show up on turns from ATL in the future especially with DL's bingo ball aircraft type scheduling.

I'd imagine that you will see them, but very infrequently. With as few mainline flights as there are, I'd imagine DL's preference is to route aircraft supporting the pilot base and that are capable of operating the transcon flights as well.

This is the tentative plan, but it remains to be seen if DL sticks to it. Routes like CVG-ATL will be going all 738 in support of the pilot base, but there are still going to be some subs. Similar to stations such as LGA, DL's preference is to use the 737's and 320's going forward. For CVG, this mostly has to do with the desire to upgrade to larger aircraft and supporting the pilot base.

Thanks, I didn't know if it'd been stated that the M88s were going away from even CVG as they had with most other hubs. I figured that might have been the case.

cvgComair wrote:

DL is sending diversions from MSP which is closed because of snow. They have also slashed flights out of DTW, but it looks like an AF B789 and DL A359 are still enroute, I am hoping they decide to divert to CVG . Since they cancelled everything ahead of time, there are only a few diversions as of now:
DL A330-330 from AMS: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL163
DL B767-300 from LHR: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL11
DL B717-200 from JFK: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL463

Just curious as to what happens in situations such as these. Do the passengers go through customs at CVG? Do they get reaccommodated from CVG to their end destination? If the diverted flight was going to MSP but your final destination is MCI would DL just rebook on the CVG-MCI flight the next day instead of sending that person to MSP and then on? Just curious on these long haul flights how they would handle this.

Also is there anyway to know what the PDEW numbers are for international destinations for CVG?

cvgComair wrote:

DL is sending diversions from MSP which is closed because of snow. They have also slashed flights out of DTW, but it looks like an AF B789 and DL A359 are still enroute, I am hoping they decide to divert to CVG . Since they cancelled everything ahead of time, there are only a few diversions as of now:
DL A330-330 from AMS: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL163
DL B767-300 from LHR: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL11
DL B717-200 from JFK: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL463

DTW handled FAR, HND, AMS, and CDG on top of the regular WB schedule. DTW was slammed today during that time. All pax were processed at DTW and distributed from there.

Springs1816 wrote:

cvgComair wrote:

DL is sending diversions from MSP which is closed because of snow. They have also slashed flights out of DTW, but it looks like an AF B789 and DL A359 are still enroute, I am hoping they decide to divert to CVG . Since they cancelled everything ahead of time, there are only a few diversions as of now:
DL A330-330 from AMS: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL163
DL B767-300 from LHR: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL11
DL B717-200 from JFK: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL463

Just curious as to what happens in situations such as these. Do the passengers go through customs at CVG? Do they get reaccommodated from CVG to their end destination? If the diverted flight was going to MSP but your final destination is MCI would DL just rebook on the CVG-MCI flight the next day instead of sending that person to MSP and then on? Just curious on these long haul flights how they would handle this.

Also is there anyway to know what the PDEW numbers are for international destinations for CVG?

The passengers go through customs at CVG and they try to find as many passengers as possible connecting itineraries out of CVG. So a pax heading to MCI would get rebooked in CVG-MCI that evening or the next day. The remaining passengers will board the original flight back to the intended destination or another hub.

Unfortunately these stats are not available publicly. This is the rankings of international PDEW by country from CVG in 2016, it probably isn't all that helpful though:
Top European PDEW countries from CVG from :
1. UK
2. Germany
3. Italy
4. France
5. Spain

Top Latin America PDEW countries from CVG:
1. Mexico
2. Dominican Republic
3. Jamaica
4. Costa Rica
5. Brazil

Top Asia PDEW countries from CVG:
1. China
2. Japan
3. South Korea

DeltaRules wrote:

cvgComair wrote:

jbmitt wrote:

I'd imagine that you will see them, but very infrequently. With as few mainline flights as there are, I'd imagine DL's preference is to route aircraft supporting the pilot base and that are capable of operating the transcon flights as well.

This is the tentative plan, but it remains to be seen if DL sticks to it. Routes like CVG-ATL will be going all 738 in support of the pilot base, but there are still going to be some subs. Similar to stations such as LGA, DL's preference is to use the 737's and 320's going forward. For CVG, this mostly has to do with the desire to upgrade to larger aircraft and supporting the pilot base.

Thanks, I didn't know if it'd been stated that the M88s were going away from even CVG as they had with most other hubs. I figured that might have been the case.

I have flown on DL MD-88's almost 2 years ago, and I was flying from LGA to DAL through ATL on DL when I last flew on DL's MD-88's. The interior of both of the DL MD-88's that I was on almost 2 years ago were in good condition. The interior of the 2nd DL MD-88 that I was on from ATL to DFW was still in excellent condition 2 years ago, despite that plane being over 25 years old.

While I have been on DL MD-88 planes, I don't have an opportunity to fly on DL MD-88's out of CVG since DL does not fly MD-88's on its CVG-DFW nonstop flights. I have enjoyed flying on DL's MD-88 planes, and I will miss flying on DL's MD-88 planes. However, I can understand DL retiring its MD-88 planes, even though some of DL's MD-88 planes are still in good condition.

The interiors were all refreshed several years ago, but there's some FAA-mandated upgrades looming that don't make financial sense. Also it's getting more difficult for DL to source replacement parts, since they basically have to scavenge them from parked airframes. No one is making MD80 parts anymore, obviously. It might be easier to get parts once AA parks their fleet, but the end is clearly near.

If oil spikes significantly at around the time that the bulk of the CS100s arrive, I wouldn't be surprised to see a mass migration to AZ.

As a DC flyer, my I can still get MD88s from IAD, BWI, and RIC. They're long-gone from DCA (to the relief of Arlington residents I'm sure).

Interesting article about passenger bleed coming to CVG being mostly from SDF/LEX rather than IND/DAY/CMH. It does make sense since LEX/SDF are only 1-1.5 hrs from Cincinnati, but I would have figured DAY would have topped the list. Though, SDF/LEX really don't have any close alternatives, whereas DAY is probably split between CMH/IND/CVG. https://www.wcpo.com/news/insider/flyin ... ups?page=2

cvgComair wrote:

Interesting article about passenger bleed coming to CVG being mostly from SDF/LEX rather than IND/DAY/CMH. It does make sense since LEX/SDF are only 1-1.5 hrs from Cincinnati, but I would have figured DAY would have topped the list. Though, SDF/LEX really don't have any close alternatives, whereas DAY is probably split between CMH/IND/CVG. https://www.wcpo.com/news/insider/flyin ... ups?page=2

One thing pointed out in our visit to DAY last week was that the airport, though there's been bleed to CVG, still draws well from as far down as the Mason area. Having to drive through Downtown Cincinnati, especially at rush hour, is a deterrent working against CVG.