Indianapolis Aviation Thread - 2018

flymco753 · Sat May 26, 2018 2:05 pm

Probably WW to KEF.

tphuang · Sat May 26, 2018 2:48 pm

fedex1 wrote:
Why will it be hard for Delta to get over 50 daily departures ? RDU has 70?

It costs money to build new focus cities. Sea and bos are very costly moves. Delta already has several projects ongoing. With increasing gas prices, not best time to take on new focus cities.

Indy · Sat May 26, 2018 3:49 pm

So what do we consider to be a focus city? DL already serves MCO, RSW, MIA and RDU in addition to two international destinations (CUN and CDG). They have to be one of the front runners for the Asia service as well.

Midwestindy · Sat May 26, 2018 5:46 pm

Indy wrote:
So what do we consider to be a focus city? DL already serves MCO, RSW, MIA and RDU in addition to two international destinations (CUN and CDG). They have to be one of the front runners for the Asia service as well.

I think if IND gets above 50 departures with some additional p2p flights it will be officially considered a focus city.
1xAUS
1xBDL
1xSAT
2xSLC
2xLAX
1xRSW (Seasonally daily)
1xTPA (Seasonally daily)
1xLAS
Would get close to 50, if you add in well timed feeder flights to MEM, JAX, MSY, and MKE which might have potential as well than you would be over 50.

Cubsrule · Sat May 26, 2018 5:46 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
Indy wrote:
So what do we consider to be a focus city? DL already serves MCO, RSW, MIA and RDU in addition to two international destinations (CUN and CDG). They have to be one of the front runners for the Asia service as well.

I think if IND gets above 50 departures with some additional p2p flights it will be officially considered a focus city.
1xAUS
1xBDL
1xSAT
2xSLC
2xLAX
1xRSW (Seasonally daily)
1xTPA (Seasonally daily)
1xLAS
Would get close to 50, if you add in well timed feeder flights to MEM, JAX, MSY, and MKE which might have potential as well than you would be over 50.

If they can beat WN to the punch, 2x CR9 to BNA might be interesting. It’s not an apples to apples comparison, but DL manages to make that schedule work on BNA-RDU with WN competition. I don’t think BNA-IND has room for two carriers but it probably has room for one.

Midwestindy · Sat May 26, 2018 5:59 pm

Cubsrule wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
Indy wrote:
So what do we consider to be a focus city? DL already serves MCO, RSW, MIA and RDU in addition to two international destinations (CUN and CDG). They have to be one of the front runners for the Asia service as well.

I think if IND gets above 50 departures with some additional p2p flights it will be officially considered a focus city.
1xAUS
1xBDL
1xSAT
2xSLC
2xLAX
1xRSW (Seasonally daily)
1xTPA (Seasonally daily)
1xLAS
Would get close to 50, if you add in well timed feeder flights to MEM, JAX, MSY, and MKE which might have potential as well than you would be over 50.

If they can beat WN to the punch, 2x CR9 to BNA might be interesting. It’s not an apples to apples comparison, but DL manages to make that schedule work on BNA-RDU with WN competition. I don’t think BNA-IND has room for two carriers but it probably has room for one.

IND and BNA have a lot more business ties than meets the eye, and I think that PDEW will skyrocket if nonstop service is ever launched. Nevertheless, I think WN will jump first since they are facing more pressure to open the route.

Indy · Sat May 26, 2018 5:59 pm

In about an hour I will be headed to IND to record the arrival of the CDG flight and hopefully the WN CUN flight. Anyone else going to be there for this?

adam47150 · Sat May 26, 2018 6:38 pm

What are everyone's thoughts on DL running a daily RJ from SDF to IND timed to connect with the CDG departure? Would this make sense, or am I just crazy?

Midwestindy · Sat May 26, 2018 6:46 pm

Indy wrote:
In about an hour I will be headed to IND to record the arrival of the CDG flight and hopefully the WN CUN flight. Anyone else going to be there for this?

I'll be there later tonight

adam47150 wrote:
What are everyone's thoughts on DL running a daily RJ from SDF to IND timed to connect with the CDG departure? Would this make sense, or am I just crazy?

SDF is too close of a drive to IND and CVG for that to work, IMO

zackary747 · Sat May 26, 2018 7:44 pm

fedex1 wrote:
Do we ( IND ) really want a low cost WOW air ? Will that hurt the Delta flight?

It's not hurting the CVG flight, so why would it hurt us? It's also not hurting the PIT flight either......

Legacies and low cost carriers attract two different types of travellers anyway. If CVG and PIT can handle it, then IND can easily handle it. Also, IND is the stronger airport compared to CVG now. Times are changing.

Indy · Sat May 26, 2018 7:45 pm

Well I had to abort my trip to IND. I hope someone else is able to get a pic of the two jets at international arrivals.

Cubsrule · Sat May 26, 2018 7:52 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
Cubsrule wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:

I think if IND gets above 50 departures with some additional p2p flights it will be officially considered a focus city.
1xAUS
1xBDL
1xSAT
2xSLC
2xLAX
1xRSW (Seasonally daily)
1xTPA (Seasonally daily)
1xLAS
Would get close to 50, if you add in well timed feeder flights to MEM, JAX, MSY, and MKE which might have potential as well than you would be over 50.

If they can beat WN to the punch, 2x CR9 to BNA might be interesting. It’s not an apples to apples comparison, but DL manages to make that schedule work on BNA-RDU with WN competition. I don’t think BNA-IND has room for two carriers but it probably has room for one.

IND and BNA have a lot more business ties than meets the eye, and I think that PDEW will skyrocket if nonstop service is ever launched. Nevertheless, I think WN will jump first since they are facing more pressure to open the route.

I agree. In my perfect world, though, DL would time an afternoon flight that meets the CDG flight both ways. It would be a great way to prop up both routes and a much better connecting experience experience ex-BNA than the current options.

adam47150 · Sat May 26, 2018 8:18 pm

Midwestindy wrote:

adam47150 wrote:
What are everyone's thoughts on DL running a daily RJ from SDF to IND timed to connect with the CDG departure? Would this make sense, or am I just crazy?

SDF is too close of a drive to IND and CVG for that to work, IMO

Back in the Comair days I flew SDF-CAE with a connection in CVG. I realize CVG was the Comair hub, but if DL could make money on it, I could see a daily CRJ200.

cvgComair · Sat May 26, 2018 8:53 pm

adam47150 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:

adam47150 wrote:
What are everyone's thoughts on DL running a daily RJ from SDF to IND timed to connect with the CDG departure? Would this make sense, or am I just crazy?

SDF is too close of a drive to IND and CVG for that to work, IMO

Back in the Comair days I flew SDF-CAE with a connection in CVG. I realize CVG was the Comair hub, but if DL could make money on it, I could see a daily CRJ200.

Yeah, but there is pretty much 0 PDEW between SDF and IND. For a focus city, the routes need to be mostly supported by local demand, with connections used to top-off loads on the routes. IND-CDG doesn't need connecting traffic, RDU and PIT get along just fine with little and no connecting traffic respectively.

Indy · Sat May 26, 2018 9:13 pm

That might change if/when Asia service comes along.

tphuang · Sat May 26, 2018 9:17 pm

Cubsrule wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
Indy wrote:
So what do we consider to be a focus city? DL already serves MCO, RSW, MIA and RDU in addition to two international destinations (CUN and CDG). They have to be one of the front runners for the Asia service as well.

I think if IND gets above 50 departures with some additional p2p flights it will be officially considered a focus city.
1xAUS
1xBDL
1xSAT
2xSLC
2xLAX
1xRSW (Seasonally daily)
1xTPA (Seasonally daily)
1xLAS
Would get close to 50, if you add in well timed feeder flights to MEM, JAX, MSY, and MKE which might have potential as well than you would be over 50.

If they can beat WN to the punch, 2x CR9 to BNA might be interesting. It’s not an apples to apples comparison, but DL manages to make that schedule work on BNA-RDU with WN competition. I don’t think BNA-IND has room for two carriers but it probably has room for one.

You also have to remember that just because DL is on a route, doesn't mean they are not loosing money on it. They are a high cost carrier, so have to earn quite a premium over WN to get the same profit margins. They will add and maintain routes to RDU because it has officially become a focus city. It's a strategic decision for a carrier like DL to build up to a certain market share in a new city in order to get premium over WN. If they make the decision that IND is important enough to take the initial losses to get to a certain market share, then you will see it become a real focus city.

I see a lot of people ask if DL will make their city a new focus city. It's not going to be as easy for them as say WN due to the costs involved. And they are already in the middle of building up SEA, BOS and RDU. At least the first 2, they are loosing money on a lot of new routes.

Midwestindy · Sat May 26, 2018 10:26 pm

cvgComair wrote:
adam47150 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:

SDF is too close of a drive to IND and CVG for that to work, IMO

Back in the Comair days I flew SDF-CAE with a connection in CVG. I realize CVG was the Comair hub, but if DL could make money on it, I could see a daily CRJ200.

Yeah, but there is pretty much 0 PDEW between SDF and IND. For a focus city, the routes need to be mostly supported by local demand, with connections used to top-off loads on the routes. IND-CDG doesn't need connecting traffic, RDU and PIT get along just fine with little and no connecting traffic respectively.

Yeah but DL wants to send connections through IND for the CDG flight.

COSPN · Sat May 26, 2018 10:42 pm

You are crasy it’s a 1 hour drvw SDF to IND ...eat more drink less

Midwestindy · Sat May 26, 2018 10:55 pm

tphuang wrote:
Cubsrule wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:

I think if IND gets above 50 departures with some additional p2p flights it will be officially considered a focus city.
1xAUS
1xBDL
1xSAT
2xSLC
2xLAX
1xRSW (Seasonally daily)
1xTPA (Seasonally daily)
1xLAS
Would get close to 50, if you add in well timed feeder flights to MEM, JAX, MSY, and MKE which might have potential as well than you would be over 50.

If they can beat WN to the punch, 2x CR9 to BNA might be interesting. It’s not an apples to apples comparison, but DL manages to make that schedule work on BNA-RDU with WN competition. I don’t think BNA-IND has room for two carriers but it probably has room for one.

You also have to remember that just because DL is on a route, doesn't mean they are not loosing money on it. They are a high cost carrier, so have to earn quite a premium over WN to get the same profit margins. They will add and maintain routes to RDU because it has officially become a focus city. It's a strategic decision for a carrier like DL to build up to a certain market share in a new city in order to get premium over WN. If they make the decision that IND is important enough to take the initial losses to get to a certain market share, then you will see it become a real focus city.

I see a lot of people ask if DL will make their city a new focus city. It's not going to be as easy for them as say WN due to the costs involved. And they are already in the middle of building up SEA, BOS and RDU. At least the first 2, they are loosing money on a lot of new routes.

DL discussed this already either during their investor day or during one of quarterly earnings calls last year. They said some of their focus will shift to gaining market share in some of their larger non-hub markets.

boeing808 · Sat May 26, 2018 11:03 pm

COSPN wrote:
You are crasy it’s a 1 hour drvw SDF to IND ...eat more drink less

It’s actually more than that. I live in Seymour and it’s 1.25 hours to IND (if lucky) and 1 hour to SDF.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

zackary747 · Sat May 26, 2018 11:52 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
zackary747 wrote:
My friend and I met Mario Rodriguez today. Really nice, down to earth type of guy. I did ask him two questions and I shall relay those answers.

Question 1: Are we going to get a low cost trans-Atlantic carrier?

Response: "We are, stay tuned"

Question 2: Are we getting JetBlue?

Response: "We've been talking to them, we are, stay tuned."

Definitely encouraging although I wish he would have given some sort of timeline

I'm pretty sure he's not allowed to give out specifics as that might break a non-disclosure agreement. At least we know the airport is actively pursuing B6 and one of the low cost TATLs.

cvgComair · Sun May 27, 2018 12:06 am

Midwestindy wrote:
cvgComair wrote:
adam47150 wrote:
Back in the Comair days I flew SDF-CAE with a connection in CVG. I realize CVG was the Comair hub, but if DL could make money on it, I could see a daily CRJ200.

Yeah, but there is pretty much 0 PDEW between SDF and IND. For a focus city, the routes need to be mostly supported by local demand, with connections used to top-off loads on the routes. IND-CDG doesn't need connecting traffic, RDU and PIT get along just fine with little and no connecting traffic respectively.

Yeah but DL wants to send connections through IND for the CDG flight.

I know they will send connections through to the CDG flight. I was trying to point out that flights will not be added with a main purpose to feed the CDG flight. The amount of connecting passengers is not going to be very large, especially if the feed is coming from cities like AUS/other hubs.

Midwestindy · Sun May 27, 2018 2:20 am

cvgComair wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
cvgComair wrote:
Yeah, but there is pretty much 0 PDEW between SDF and IND. For a focus city, the routes need to be mostly supported by local demand, with connections used to top-off loads on the routes. IND-CDG doesn't need connecting traffic, RDU and PIT get along just fine with little and no connecting traffic respectively.

Yeah but DL wants to send connections through IND for the CDG flight.

I know they will send connections through to the CDG flight. I was trying to point out that flights will not be added with a main purpose to feed the CDG flight. The amount of connecting passengers is not going to be very large, especially if the feed is coming from cities like AUS/other hubs.

I think it is a bit too early to say that considering that
1. The Exec Director gave an interview in late December of last year in which he said that the IND-CDG flight was the start in making IND (and this is a direct quote) "a real, real, connecting point for Delta." He then talked more about potential connecting traffic later in the interview
2. The Delta employees already seemed informed about what DL's strategy is here: https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delt ... g-7er.html

fedex1 · Sun May 27, 2018 8:08 pm

So what are you guys saying? Barely adding routes to IND with Delta? Or you think decent size expansion? ( decent meaning? ) or what ?!

Midwestindy · Mon May 28, 2018 5:23 pm

https://highalpha.com/speakerseries/may ... ign=buffer
Interview with the Exec Director:
-IND has fastest airport Wifi in the nation
-Airport is being retrofitted with nicer furniture and carpeting
-Will be rolling out new sound system trailered to the customers and conventioneers
-"huge aviation related" announcement coming on Thursday (31st) related to an airline and pilots, think it may be G4 or J1 related.

ibthebigd · Mon May 28, 2018 5:34 pm

Southwest has a schedule release the 31st

Midwestindy wrote:
https://highalpha.com/speakerseries/may-speaker-series/?utm_content=buffer47125&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer
Interview with the Exec Director:
-IND has fastest airport Wifi in the nation
-Airport is being retrofitted with nicer furniture and carpeting
-Will be rolling out new sound system trailered to the customers and conventioneers
-"huge aviation related" announcement coming on Thursday (31st) related to an airline and pilots, think it may be G4 or J1 related.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Midwestindy · Mon May 28, 2018 5:55 pm

ibthebigd wrote:
Southwest has a schedule release the 31st
Midwestindy wrote:
https://highalpha.com/speakerseries/may-speaker-series/?utm_content=buffer47125&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer
Interview with the Exec Director:
-IND has fastest airport Wifi in the nation
-Airport is being retrofitted with nicer furniture and carpeting
-Will be rolling out new sound system trailered to the customers and conventioneers
-"huge aviation related" announcement coming on Thursday (31st) related to an airline and pilots, think it may be G4 or J1 related.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

It didn't sound WN schedule extension related

cvgComair · Mon May 28, 2018 6:46 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
https://highalpha.com/speakerseries/may-speaker-series/?utm_content=buffer47125&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer
Interview with the Exec Director:
-IND has fastest airport Wifi in the nation
-Airport is being retrofitted with nicer furniture and carpeting
-Will be rolling out new sound system trailered to the customers and conventioneers
-"huge aviation related" announcement coming on Thursday (31st) related to an airline and pilots, think it may be G4 or J1 related.

Given the timing at the end of May, J1 seems like a good choice. However, Ultimate has hired some new crews recently and are still looking for more, though they are requesting that they live in Cincinnati, Chicago, Charlotte, or Morristown. Also, I have only seen openings for CFM 135/145 pilots in Pittsburgh, Buffalo, Oakland, Phoenix, and Manassas (VA). I see no indication that they are wanting crew in IND, so perhaps this is G4?

Indy · Mon May 28, 2018 7:58 pm

He practically gave it away. His comments were all about the demand for pilots. Sounds to me like a pilot training center/flight school.

ibthebigd · Mon May 28, 2018 8:07 pm

A partnership with Vincennes or Purdue and Republic?

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Indy · Mon May 28, 2018 8:12 pm

ibthebigd wrote:
A partnership with Vincennes or Purdue and Republic?

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

I'm not really sure I'd call that huge. If this is going to be a pilot training center then two things come to mind. An Airbus training center for G4 pilots for a C-Series training center for DL pilots. Those would be huge. He said that it is a "development coming" so this is going to something being built. It would go beyond partnerships or anything like that.

Midwestindy · Mon May 28, 2018 8:14 pm

ibthebigd wrote:
A partnership with Vincennes or Purdue and Republic?

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Vincennes has a partnership with Republic already: http://www.insideindianabusiness.com/st ... artnership
as does Purdue: https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/ ... Innovative

Midwestindy · Mon May 28, 2018 8:29 pm

Indy wrote:
ibthebigd wrote:
A partnership with Vincennes or Purdue and Republic?

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

I'm not really sure I'd call that huge. If this is going to be a pilot training center then two things come to mind. An Airbus training center for G4 pilots for a C-Series training center for DL pilots. Those would be huge. He said that it is a "development coming" so this is going to something being built. It would go beyond partnerships or anything like that.

I would be shocked if it was DL, Republic, Onejet, and maybe G4 seem like the most likely options. Republic is probably who he was referring to...it would make sense for them to build a training center at IND.

Indy · Mon May 28, 2018 8:42 pm

I cannot imagine it being Onejet. They are such a small airline but I guess it is possible. G4 would have been my #1 choice. OH... what about Frontier? The airline in reference has to be one that is going to need a lot of pilots.

Midwestindy · Mon May 28, 2018 8:50 pm

Indy wrote:
I cannot imagine it being Onejet. They are such a small airline but I guess it is possible. G4 would have been my #1 choice. OH... what about Frontier? The airline in reference has to be one that is going to need a lot of pilots.

Wouldn't Republic make sense because the regionals are the ones most affected by the pilot shortage

Indy · Mon May 28, 2018 9:15 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
Indy wrote:
I cannot imagine it being Onejet. They are such a small airline but I guess it is possible. G4 would have been my #1 choice. OH... what about Frontier? The airline in reference has to be one that is going to need a lot of pilots.

Wouldn't Republic make sense because the regionals are the ones most affected by the pilot shortage

If it were Republic I think it would be a bit of a disappointment. Their shortage is self inflicted in my opinion. It goes back to what they pay and what their working conditions are. The best way to end a labor shortage is to offer a competitive wage. But you also have to offer good working conditions. The best pay isn't going to keep people around if working conditions are poor. And you aren't even going to get people in the door to discover your horrible working conditions if your pay isn't good.

ibthebigd · Mon May 28, 2018 9:16 pm

I'm sure G4 keeps people because your home almost every night.

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zackary747 · Mon May 28, 2018 9:52 pm

How are people not mentioning FEDEX.

https://about.van.fedex.com/newsroom/fe ... s-program/

You know, this could be G4 or J1, but my money is on FX as their second largest hub is here. If anyone is losing pilots due to retirement FX is that airline.

Midwestindy · Mon May 28, 2018 10:09 pm

zackary747 wrote:
How are people not mentioning FEDEX.

https://about.van.fedex.com/newsroom/fe ... s-program/

You know, this could be G4 or J1, but my money is on FX as their second largest hub is here. If anyone is losing pilots due to retirement FX is that airline.

It could possibly be a part of FedEx’s 1.5 billon dollar expansion. However in the interview he didn’t seem to frame it as being related to a cargo airline.

zackary747 · Mon May 28, 2018 10:11 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
zackary747 wrote:
How are people not mentioning FEDEX.

https://about.van.fedex.com/newsroom/fe ... s-program/

You know, this could be G4 or J1, but my money is on FX as their second largest hub is here. If anyone is losing pilots due to retirement FX is that airline.

It could possibly be a part of FedEx’s 1.5 billon dollar expansion. However in the interview he didn’t seem to frame it as being related to a cargo airline.

Well, he didn't frame anything to be honest. He said a flight training facility by AN AIRLINE. That could be cargo or passenger. He didn't say specifics so that leaves everything wide open.

Midwestindy · Mon May 28, 2018 11:30 pm

zackary747 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
zackary747 wrote:
How are people not mentioning FEDEX.

https://about.van.fedex.com/newsroom/fe ... s-program/

You know, this could be G4 or J1, but my money is on FX as their second largest hub is here. If anyone is losing pilots due to retirement FX is that airline.

It could possibly be a part of FedEx’s 1.5 billon dollar expansion. However in the interview he didn’t seem to frame it as being related to a cargo airline.

Well, he didn't frame anything to be honest. He said a flight training facility by AN AIRLINE. That could be cargo or passenger. He didn't say specifics so that leaves everything wide open.

If it is FX hopefully that will lead a carrier to pick up the IND-MEM route again

ibthebigd · Tue May 29, 2018 12:00 am

Could WN and FedEx work together and WN start IND-MEM?

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Midwestindy · Tue May 29, 2018 12:03 am

ibthebigd wrote:
Could WN and FedEx work together and WN start IND-MEM?

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If anyone would do it, it would most likely be J1 (they already have a partnership with FedEx)

ibthebigd · Tue May 29, 2018 12:06 am

I just threw WN out for the larger plans for cargo and they could do say MEM-IND-BOS. MEM doesn't have a flight to BOS.

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fedex1 · Tue May 29, 2018 1:55 am

What airline is J1

cvgComair · Tue May 29, 2018 1:58 am

fedex1 wrote:
What airline is J1

OneJet

adam47150 · Tue May 29, 2018 4:02 pm

How well did Customs handle both DL501 and the WN flight from Cancun on Saturday?

floridaflyboy · Tue May 29, 2018 5:06 pm

Indy wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
Indy wrote:
I cannot imagine it being Onejet. They are such a small airline but I guess it is possible. G4 would have been my #1 choice. OH... what about Frontier? The airline in reference has to be one that is going to need a lot of pilots.

Wouldn't Republic make sense because the regionals are the ones most affected by the pilot shortage

If it were Republic I think it would be a bit of a disappointment. Their shortage is self inflicted in my opinion. It goes back to what they pay and what their working conditions are. The best way to end a labor shortage is to offer a competitive wage. But you also have to offer good working conditions. The best pay isn't going to keep people around if working conditions are poor. And you aren't even going to get people in the door to discover your horrible working conditions if your pay isn't good.

You might want to do a little research on that. Republic's pilots are at the top of the regional industry in pay and work rules. They're trying to get out ahead of the pilot shortage rather than chasing it. I would not be surprised at all if this is a Republic-related announcement.

Midwestindy · Tue May 29, 2018 5:13 pm

adam47150 wrote:
How well did Customs handle both DL501 and the WN flight from Cancun on Saturday?

No idea, but the gate area around A3-A5 does not have enough seating especially now that they upgraded the seating area there. I was there when DL and F9 were both departing simultaneously which was around 400 people, in a condensed area that has seating for probably around 100 people.

The whole Customs and International section of the airport could have been designed better, it doesn't make much sense to put the international gates in the narrowest part of the concourse considering int'l flights usually utilize the largest aircraft through an airport.

Indy · Tue May 29, 2018 6:30 pm

floridaflyboy wrote:
You might want to do a little research on that. Republic's pilots are at the top of the regional industry in pay and work rules. They're trying to get out ahead of the pilot shortage rather than chasing it. I would not be surprised at all if this is a Republic-related announcement.

I did and honestly I don't care where Republic ranks compared to other regional carriers. I never said they were better or worse than other regions. Being the best of the worst is nothing to be proud of. The point is that regional pilot pay stinks and working conditions across the board are bad. It is why the shortage is limited to regional carriers. The starting pay for pilots with the regional carriers is a joke. Regional carriers have a long way to go and cleaning up the reputation as being a bad place to work is going to take time. Again, this is a self created shortage.

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