22 years after the first 777 carried the first passenger many Triple Sevens have reached the end of a useful service life. Most 77"A"-models have been retired, many either permanently withdrawn from use or already scrapped, with numbers growing quickly. 77Es and 773s also face the axe, with pre-2000-build frames have a tough time to find a new operator.
Time to publish a list of those planes which are gone, gone soon or which are having little chance to fly again.

Varig:
772 PP-VRD (first 777 scrapped, after less than 10 years service)

Air India:
772 VT-AIR (scrapped)

British Aw.:
77E G-YMMN (crashed)

Asiana:
77E HL7742 (crashed)

JAL (all for scrap):
772 JA8981 (scrapped)
772 JA8982 (scrapped)
772 JA8983 (permanently wfu 2015, scrapped?)
773 JA8941 (scrapped)
773 JA8942 (scrapped)
773 JA8943 (scrapped)

ANA (all for scrap):
772 JA8197 (permanently wfu 2016)
772 JA8198 (permanently wfu 2017)
772 JA8199 (permanently wfu 2016)
772 JA8968 (permanently wfu 2017)

Air China (most if ot all for scrap):
772 B-2059 (permanently wfu 2016)
772 B-2060 (wfu 2017)
772 B-2061 (permanently wfu 2017)
772 B-2063 (permanently wfu 2016)
772 B-2064 (scrapped)
772 B-2065 (permanently wfu 2017)
772 B-2066 (permanently wfu 2016)

China Southern (all for scrap):
772 B-2052 (permanently wfu 2017)
772 B-2054 (permanently wfu 2017)
77E B-2055 (scrapped)
77E B-2056 (scrapped)
77E B-2057 (scrapped)
77E B-2058 (permanently wfu 2014)

Emirates:
772 A6-EMD (scrapped)
772 A6-EME (scrapped)
772 A6-EMF (scrapped)
77E A6-EMH (stored 2016)
77E A6-EMG (stored 2016)
773 A6-EMM (stored 2017)
773 A6-EMN (stored 2017)
773 A6-EMO (scrapped)
773 A6-EMP (stored 2017)
773 A6-EMW (crashed)

SQ:
77E 9V-SQE (scrapped)
77E 9V-SQF (scrapped)
77E 9V-SQG (scrapped)
77E 9V-SRI (stored 2013)
77E 9V-SVA (stored 2014)
773 9V-SYG (stored 2017)
77E 9V-SVK (stored 2015)
773 9V-SYK (permanently wfu 2015)

Scoot:
77E 9V-OTA (scrapped)
77E 9V-OTB (scrapped)
77E 9V-OTC (permanently wfu 2015)
77E 9V-OTD (permanently wfu 2015)

Malaysia:
77E 9M-MRA (stored 2016)
77E 9M-MRB (scrapped)
77E 9M-MRD (crashed)
77E 9M-MRE (stored 2016)
77E 9M-MRG (scrapped)
77E 9M-MRH (scrapped)
77E 9M-MRI (scrapped)
77E 9M-MRK (scrapped)
77E 9M-MRL (stored 2016)
77E 9M-MRM (stored 2016)
77E 9M-MRN (stored 2016)
77E 9M-MRO (crashed)
77E 9M-MRP (stored, Zimbabwe c/s, ntu?)

Thai (more 772s soon to follow into retirement):
772 HS-TJE (scrapped)
772 HS-TJF (scrapped)

Omni Air:
77E N918AX (scrapped)
77E N927AX (scrapped)

Egyptair (SU-GBS only doing backup flights):
77E SU-GBP (burned, w/o and scrapped)
77E SU-GBR (permanently wfu 2015)

Transaero (all likely for scrap):
772 EI-UNY (scrapped)
772 EI-UNZ (permanently wfu 2015)
77E EI-UNT (stored 2015, permanently wfu?)
77E EI-UNV (stored 2015, permanently wfu?)
77E EI-UNX (stored 2015, permanently wfu?)
77E EI-UNR (stored 2015, permanently wfu?)
77E EI-UNW (permanently wfu 2015)

Orenair/Rossiya:
77E VP-BHB (stored 2016)
77E VQ-BNU (stored 2016)

Nordwind:
77E VP-BJB (stored 2017)

Vim Airlines (50/50 chance at best):
77E VP-BLI (stored 2017)
77E VP-BDX (stored 2017)
77E VP-BIC (stored 2017)
77E VP-BVA (stored 2017)
77E VP-BVX (stored 2017)
77E VP-BMR (stored 2017)
77E VP-BDW (stored 2017)
77E VP-BVY (stored 2017)
77E VP-BDQ (stored 2017)
77E VP-BDR (stored 2017)
773 VP-BIN (stored 2017)
(a single 77W is also stored but will surely return to the skies)

Kuwait (old, very little chance):
77E 9K-AOA (stored 2017)
77E 9K-AOB (stored 2017)

Saudia (mixed chances, few may fly again, most won´t):
77E HZ-AKA (stored 2017)
77E HZ-AKB (stored 2017)
77E HZ-AKC (stored 2016)
77E HZ-AKD (stored 2017)
77E HZ-AKE (stored 2017)
77E HZ-AKF (stored 2017)
77E HZ-AKG (stored 2017)
77E HZ-AKH (stored 2017)
77E HZ-AKI (stored 2017)
77E HZ-AKJ (stored 2017)
77E HZ-AKK (stored 2017)
77E HZ-AKL (stored 2017)
77E HZ-AKO (stored 2017)
77E HZ-AKP (stored 2017)
77E HZ-AKS (stored 2017)
+ 9 more in coming months

Then there are the following which due to their young age should have a good chance to fly again:

Vietnam:
77E VN-A143 (stored 2017)
77E VN-A144 (stored 2017)
77E VN-A145 (stored 2017)
77E VN-A146 (stored 2017)

Kenya:
77E 5Y-KQS (stored 2017)

na wrote:

Time to publish a list of those planes which are gone, gone soon or which are having little chance to fly again.

Sorta odd really. Most such threads on older models, seem to focus on those that are still flying....

LAX772LR wrote:

na wrote:

Time to publish a list of those planes which are gone, gone soon or which are having little chance to fly again.

Sorta odd really. Most such threads on older models, seem to focus on those that are still flying....

Odd? Why? There is a 744 retirement thread out there as well. And thats a type not much older than the early 777-versions.
And as there is a 777 being retired almost every week now, I think such a thread will generate some interest for sure.

Have any of those not scrapped yet any chance to be converted to cargo?

LAX772LR wrote:

na wrote:

Time to publish a list of those planes which are gone, gone soon or which are having little chance to fly again.

Sorta odd really. Most such threads on older models, seem to focus on those that are still flying....

EI-UNY (Transaero) was formerly N767UA, one of the earliest deliveries to United 5/31/95. UA parked it as far back as March 2004, after nine years in the fleet.
VT-AIR (Air India) was the first 777 deliver to US as N766UA 5/24/95. Parked by UA in July 2003 after only 8 years in service.

N777UA was the first ship to UA delivered 5/15/95 and still flies with them as far as I know. It flew the LHR-IAD official inaugural in June 1995, but I believe N766UA flew a schedule DEN-ORD a day or two before, likely for positioning.

These are all 'A' models. Interesting that UA unloaded a couple in the early 2000s. Was traffic down? Did they need some cash? I would be interested to hear details.

thgsr08 wrote:

Have any of those not scrapped yet any chance to be converted to cargo?

The floor structure of the passenger 777s are made from composites and aren't strong enough for cargo operations. To convert a 777 from passenger to cargo config would require all of the floor beams to be replaced with metal ones and is considered uneconomical.

na wrote:

LAX772LR wrote:

na wrote:

Time to publish a list of those planes which are gone, gone soon or which are having little chance to fly again.

Sorta odd really. Most such threads on older models, seem to focus on those that are still flying....

Odd? Why? There is a 744 retirement thread out there as well. And thats a type not much older than the early 777-versions.
And as there is a 777 being retired almost every week now, I think such a thread will generate some interest for sure.

I personally am very interested in retirements.

I routinely follow MD-80 and 747 active fleet sizes on airfleets. I'm very interested in A330 retirements too.

In Boeing's CMO, they predicted aircraft will drop fuel burn 1.4% per year. This is an acceleration of efficiency from the era of under $30/bbl oil. Everyone should remember that is the threshold of cheap oil. Above $30/bbl and airlines have an incentive to buy newer more efficient aircraft. In particular in today's low interest rate environment.

I look at the technology not yet in the fleet and see faster fleet turn over:
GFRP
New aluminum's
CMC materials in the turbine
New higher Mach # compressors
More electrical components (787 has broken through to now have much lower maintenance costs than hydraulic)
Wing underside laminar flow (all wings are focused on limited top side laminar flow).
Folding wingtips (I consider these a game changer as it is easy to add another floor or two to a terminal, but nearly impossible to expand land area if airport).

I see longer intervals between maintenance. To the point aircraft will be scrapped at the end of the first maintenance interval.

So we'll see more airlines follow SQ and EK and scrap wide-bodies early.

Lightsaber

LTCM wrote:

thgsr08 wrote:

Have any of those not scrapped yet any chance to be converted to cargo?

The floor structure of the passenger 777s are made from composites and aren't strong enough for cargo operations. To convert a 777 from passenger to cargo config would require all of the floor beams to be replaced with metal ones and is considered uneconomical.

Nice, I had no idea.
It could be an option, if it was economy viable.
Kinda sad to see all that metal gonna "waste".

lightsaber wrote:

I personally am very interested in retirements.

I routinely follow MD-80 and 747 active fleet sizes on airfleets. I'm very interested in A330 retirements too.

So do I, especially focussing on 747 and A330, plus 777, A340 and 737 Classic servicelife statistics. Interesting observation: 777"Classics" are being retired at a higher rate than A330s. 747s have/had a longer average service life than the average 777, too.

lightsaber wrote:

In Boeing's CAMO, they predicted aircraft will drop fuel burn 1.4% per year. This is an acceleration of efficiency from the era of under $30/bbl oil. Everyone should remember that is the threshold of cheap oil. Above $30/bbl and airlines have an incentive to buy newer more efficient aircraft. In particular in today's low interest rate environment.

I look at the technology not yet in the fleet and see faster fleet turn over:
GFRP
New aluminum's
CMC materials in the turbine
New higher Mach # compressors
More electrical components (787 has broken through to now have much lower maintenance costs than hydraulic)
Wing underside laminar flow (all wings are focused on limited top side laminar flow).
Folding wingtips (I consider these a game changer as it is easy to add another floor or two to a terminal, but nearly impossible to expand land area if airport).

I see longer intervals between maintenance. To the point aircraft will be scrapped at the end of the first maintenance interval.

So we'll see more airlines follow SQ and EK and scrap wide-bodies early.

Lightsaber

I fully agree with you. Therefore, for example, under the current conditions I expect the average service life of a 77W to be 2 or 3 years/10.000 hours shorter than the average 744. This refers to pax planes, Cargo is different and the average retirement age (years&mileage) considerably higher of course.

na wrote:

lightsaber wrote:

I personally am very interested in retirements.

I routinely follow MD-80 and 747 active fleet sizes on airfleets. I'm very interested in A330 retirements too.

So do I, especially focussing on 747 and A330, plus 777, A340 and 737 Classic servicelife statistics. Interesting observation: 777"Classics" are being retired at a higher rate than A330s. 747s have/had a longer average service life than the average 777, too.

lightsaber wrote:

In Boeing's CAMO, they predicted aircraft will drop fuel burn 1.4% per year. This is an acceleration of efficiency from the era of under $30/bbl oil. Everyone should remember that is the threshold of cheap oil. Above $30/bbl and airlines have an incentive to buy newer more efficient aircraft. In particular in today's low interest rate environment.

I look at the technology not yet in the fleet and see faster fleet turn over:
GFRP
New aluminum's
CMC materials in the turbine
New higher Mach # compressors
More electrical components (787 has broken through to now have much lower maintenance costs than hydraulic)
Wing underside laminar flow (all wings are focused on limited top side laminar flow).
Folding wingtips (I consider these a game changer as it is easy to add another floor or two to a terminal, but nearly impossible to expand land area if airport).

I see longer intervals between maintenance. To the point aircraft will be scrapped at the end of the first maintenance interval.

So we'll see more airlines follow SQ and EK and scrap wide-bodies early.

Lightsaber

I fully agree with you. Therefore, for example, under the current conditions I expect the average service life of a 77W to be 2 or 3 years/10.000 hours shorter than the average 744. This refers to pax planes, Cargo is different and the average retirement age (years&mileage) considerably higher of course.

Cargo does extend aircraft lives.
1. Greater belly cargo is reducing the need for freighters, until recently... Ironically started by the 77W.
2. The 777 has no economical conversion path from pax to freight.
3. A330 conversions are now starting.

Those CFRP floor beams that helped sell pax 777s are dooming the same aircraft. Cest la vie.

You know... I do not know what the 787 or A350 floor beam configuration is. Does anyone know if there is a similar handicap to conversion?

Lightsaber

To complete/add to your list:

77E 9M-MRP stored in SZB. Readied for Air Zimbabwe but deal not completed.
77E 9M-MRQ stored in SZB. Readied for Air Zimbabwe but deal not completed.

Is the floor load so low that even pallets of parcels are way too heavy? If you think about it, the cardboard containers on the bottom of the pile are bearing the weight of the packages above. That is to say, cardboard is bearing that weight, not aluminum... I still have trouble believing that a 77E conversion can't handle amazon boxes on pallets as well as a 763. Is the floor really that wimpy?

Did BA G-ZZZD and ZZZE get scrapped or transfered elsewhere?

Arion640 wrote:

Did BA G-ZZZD and ZZZE get scrapped or transfered elsewhere?

Both went to Varig, in 02/2004 and 03/2004, respectively.

ZZZE became PP-VRD, indicated scrapped above. Stored 04/2006 and flown to ARG 12/2006 for said scrapping.

ZZZD left Varig as PP-VRC, 08/2006 in one piece, and was last listed as flying the the Gabon Government as of 2012. They had acquired it in 03/2007.

An airliners thread from five years ago has some nice pics. Reasonably up-to-date since not much has apparently happened to the airframes in the intervening five years:
viewtopic.php?t=539619

na wrote:

And as there is a 777 being retired almost every week now, I think such a thread will generate some interest for sure.

There definitely is quite a bit of interest, at least from me - and thank you for taking the time to compile and present this information. This had to have taken quite a bit of time to research. It's appreciated.

I personally am quite surprised at the number of 777s that have been withdrawn by now. I thought the number was much lower - certainly fewer than 20. But, it really shouldn't be a shock or surprise. The 772 and 77E have direct replacements that are much more efficient on the same mission, so unless your capital expenses are low and you aren't burdened with high lease payments and/or high finance charges, it would probably make sense to keep running it as long as fuel remains cheap.

Seeing the number of retired and scrapped frames also puts in context Richard Anderson's comments on a conference call about 2 or 3 years ago, when he boasted about how cheaply he was getting 777s from the open market versus what Boeing wanted to charge for used ones.

Much of it is also driven by the changeover of airlines from an ownership model to one of some form of lease. An aircraft coming off a 20 year lease may be a better tax writeoff to the lessor than trying to maintain it and remarket for a further short lease. Hence the one way flight to Tupelo or wherever.

Islamic finance further distorts the financing model. That's a difficult subject to master but Sharia-compliant financing like Emirates and the rest of the group of airlines from Islamic countries means the asset could be fully depreciated at the end of the contract and can be sold for salvage. They also can have odd-sounding terms such as 13 year leases. I'm no expert on that but EK and EY have mentioned that it's an efficient way of financing their purchasing.

One thing I'm sure many will agree with is that today many aircraft are just more disposable than ever. Those forty year old DC Jets don't have an equivalent any more.

CF-CPI wrote:

EI-UNY (Transaero) was formerly N767UA, one of the earliest deliveries to United 5/31/95. UA parked it as far back as March 2004, after nine years in the fleet.
VT-AIR (Air India) was the first 777 deliver to US as N766UA 5/24/95. Parked by UA in July 2003 after only 8 years in service.

N777UA was the first ship to UA delivered 5/15/95 and still flies with them as far as I know. It flew the LHR-IAD official inaugural in June 1995, but I believe N766UA flew a schedule DEN-ORD a day or two before, likely for positioning.

These are all 'A' models. Interesting that UA unloaded a couple in the early 2000s. Was traffic down? Did they need some cash? I would be interested to hear details.

UA went through bankruptcy in the early 2000s and, IIRC, rejected some leases during that period.

Channex757 wrote:

One thing I'm sure many will agree with is that today many aircraft are just more disposable than ever.

20 years ago there were many airlines using secondhand planes, even some reputable ones. Nowadays even airlines from the developing countries only buy new. The market for used planes is just much smaller than it has been around the year 2000.

CF-CPI wrote:

LAX772LR wrote:

na wrote:

Time to publish a list of those planes which are gone, gone soon or which are having little chance to fly again.

Sorta odd really. Most such threads on older models, seem to focus on those that are still flying....

EI-UNY (Transaero) was formerly N767UA, one of the earliest deliveries to United 5/31/95. UA parked it as far back as March 2004, after nine years in the fleet.
VT-AIR (Air India) was the first 777 deliver to US as N766UA 5/24/95. Parked by UA in July 2003 after only 8 years in service.

N777UA was the first ship to UA delivered 5/15/95 and still flies with them as far as I know. It flew the LHR-IAD official inaugural in June 1995, but I believe N766UA flew a schedule DEN-ORD a day or two before, likely for positioning.

These are all 'A' models. Interesting that UA unloaded a couple in the early 2000s. Was traffic down? Did they need some cash? I would be interested to hear details.

They were lease rejections during UA’s bankruptcy. UA and the lessor could not agree to a price.

What is the latest on the Transaero planes? Particularly the ex UAL ones?

To add onto your list:

CZ's remaining two 77As will be retired within the next couple months (my source says 3 months but that could be wrong). Replaced by 788s.

Michael

lightsaber wrote:

na wrote:

LAX772LR wrote:

Sorta odd really. Most such threads on older models, seem to focus on those that are still flying....

Odd? Why? There is a 744 retirement thread out there as well. And thats a type not much older than the early 777-versions.
And as there is a 777 being retired almost every week now, I think such a thread will generate some interest for sure.

I personally am very interested in retirements.

I routinely follow MD-80 and 747 active fleet sizes on airfleets. I'm very interested in A330 retirements too.

In Boeing's CMO, they predicted aircraft will drop fuel burn 1.4% per year. This is an acceleration of efficiency from the era of under $30/bbl oil. Everyone should remember that is the threshold of cheap oil. Above $30/bbl and airlines have an incentive to buy newer more efficient aircraft. In particular in today's low interest rate environment.

I look at the technology not yet in the fleet and see faster fleet turn over:
GFRP
New aluminum's
CMC materials in the turbine
New higher Mach # compressors
More electrical components (787 has broken through to now have much lower maintenance costs than hydraulic)
Wing underside laminar flow (all wings are focused on limited top side laminar flow).
Folding wingtips (I consider these a game changer as it is easy to add another floor or two to a terminal, but nearly impossible to expand land area if airport).

I see longer intervals between maintenance. To the point aircraft will be scrapped at the end of the first maintenance interval.

So we'll see more airlines follow SQ and EK and scrap wide-bodies early.

Lightsaber

It really makes me wonder why Singapore wants to retire there A330s, it's been a while since I looked at their fleet age, but if I can remember they were not that old. Majority of them I believe are 11 years of age, which is not even that old. But I know there most definitely has to be a reason for this.

Also I don't know if Delta is gonna do cabin refreshments on both LR and ER variants or just the LR variant. But I can most likely see their 777-200ER leaving around late 2018 or 2020. Majority of the frames are 28 years of age, and they will hit 30 very soon. They look like they are almost falling apart (Well, some of them).

Narfish641 wrote:

It really makes me wonder why Singapore wants to retire there A330s, it's been a while since I looked at their fleet age, but if I can remember they were not that old. Majority of them I believe are 11 years of age, which is not even that old. But I know there most definitely has to be a reason for this.

If I remember correctly it's down to the way the tax system works in Singapore, they get to depreciate the assets quicker so there is a sweet spot to get rid of (not so) old aircraft.

jetwet1 wrote:

Narfish641 wrote:

It really makes me wonder why Singapore wants to retire there A330s, it's been a while since I looked at their fleet age, but if I can remember they were not that old. Majority of them I believe are 11 years of age, which is not even that old. But I know there most definitely has to be a reason for this.

If I remember correctly it's down to the way the tax system works in Singapore, they get to depreciate the assets quicker so there is a sweet spot to get rid of (not so) old aircraft.

Wow crazy. I hope they sell some or convert them at least. (Don't want to be too off topic in the thread).

So sad PP-VRD was the first one to go. Varig was such an icon at its heydays.

Still remember the first flight back in 1994.

Crazy that nowadays 787s and A350s have hundreds of deliveries already.

Narfish641 wrote:

Also I don't know if Delta is gonna do cabin refreshments on both LR and ER variants or just the LR variant. But I can most likely see their 777-200ER leaving around late 2018 or 2020. Majority of the frames are 28 years of age, and they will hit 30 very soon. They look like they are almost falling apart (Well, some of them).

Where did you get any of your info? Yes they are converting them to DL One. No they are not 28 years old. The oldest 777 is 22 years old. DLs fleet age is less than 13 years for the 777.

Narfish641 wrote:

lightsaber wrote:

na wrote:

Odd? Why? There is a 744 retirement thread out there as well. And thats a type not much older than the early 777-versions.
And as there is a 777 being retired almost every week now, I think such a thread will generate some interest for sure.

I personally am very interested in retirements.

I routinely follow MD-80 and 747 active fleet sizes on airfleets. I'm very interested in A330 retirements too.

In Boeing's CMO, they predicted aircraft will drop fuel burn 1.4% per year. This is an acceleration of efficiency from the era of under $30/bbl oil. Everyone should remember that is the threshold of cheap oil. Above $30/bbl and airlines have an incentive to buy newer more efficient aircraft. In particular in today's low interest rate environment.

I look at the technology not yet in the fleet and see faster fleet turn over:
GFRP
New aluminum's
CMC materials in the turbine
New higher Mach # compressors
More electrical components (787 has broken through to now have much lower maintenance costs than hydraulic)
Wing underside laminar flow (all wings are focused on limited top side laminar flow).
Folding wingtips (I consider these a game changer as it is easy to add another floor or two to a terminal, but nearly impossible to expand land area if airport).

I see longer intervals between maintenance. To the point aircraft will be scrapped at the end of the first maintenance interval.

So we'll see more airlines follow SQ and EK and scrap wide-bodies early.

Lightsaber

It really makes me wonder why Singapore wants to retire there A330s, it's been a while since I looked at their fleet age, but if I can remember they were not that old. Majority of them I believe are 11 years of age, which is not even that old. But I know there most definitely has to be a reason for this.

SQ A330’s are leased, I think they got a good deal because of the A380 delays so took A330’s as interim lift which allowed some 777’s to be retired. They liked the A330 as they got 19 then another 15 most on I believe 6-8 year leases. Some of the older 777’s are owned and have recently had or having cabin refreshes.

airzona11 wrote:

Still remember the first flight back in 1994.

Crazy that nowadays 787s and A350s have hundreds of deliveries already.

Narfish641 wrote:

Also I don't know if Delta is gonna do cabin refreshments on both LR and ER variants or just the LR variant. But I can most likely see their 777-200ER leaving around late 2018 or 2020. Majority of the frames are 28 years of age, and they will hit 30 very soon. They look like they are almost falling apart (Well, some of them).

Where did you get any of your info? Yes they are converting them to DL One. No they are not 28 years old. The oldest 777 is 22 years old. DLs fleet age is less than 13 years for the 777.

.

Oops thats my mistake!

Saudia planned to retire all 77Es by year end. However, as of now, 8 or 9 are still active.

Did united retire there first 777-200 (ua777)

Narfish641 wrote:

jetwet1 wrote:

Narfish641 wrote:

It really makes me wonder why Singapore wants to retire there A330s, it's been a while since I looked at their fleet age, but if I can remember they were not that old. Majority of them I believe are 11 years of age, which is not even that old. But I know there most definitely has to be a reason for this.

If I remember correctly it's down to the way the tax system works in Singapore, they get to depreciate the assets quicker so there is a sweet spot to get rid of (not so) old aircraft.

Wow crazy. I hope they sell some or convert them at least. (Don't want to be too off topic in the thread).

The ex-Singapore A330-300s have been quite popular. TAP, Brussels Airlines, TransAsia, WOW and Hong Kong Airlines have taken all of them so far. It also helps that a cargo conversion program exists for the A330-300, it seems to have created a resale market for even the oldest A330-300s in existence.

Narfish641 wrote:

Also I don't know if Delta is gonna do cabin refreshments on both LR and ER variants or just the LR variant. But I can most likely see their 777-200ER leaving around late 2018 or 2020. Majority of the frames are 28 years of age, and they will hit 30 very soon. They look like they are almost falling apart (Well, some of them).

WRONG Delta’s 777 fleet is relatively young. The last one delivered 2009. I think the avg age is 13 and Delta flys the wings off their jets. The 777 will be around at least 10 years

LTCM wrote:

thgsr08 wrote:

Have any of those not scrapped yet any chance to be converted to cargo?

The floor structure of the passenger 777s are made from composites and aren't strong enough for cargo operations. To convert a 777 from passenger to cargo config would require all of the floor beams to be replaced with metal ones and is considered uneconomical.

Not true, IAI Bedek has been testing a possible conversion on an ex MH 772 at TLV (9M-MRI now N105GT) and found it viable. Rumors around is the OZ will be the launch customer of the 777 P2F program (not confirmed yet)

yochai wrote:

LTCM wrote:

thgsr08 wrote:

Have any of those not scrapped yet any chance to be converted to cargo?

The floor structure of the passenger 777s are made from composites and aren't strong enough for cargo operations. To convert a 777 from passenger to cargo config would require all of the floor beams to be replaced with metal ones and is considered uneconomical.

Not true, IAI Bedek has been testing a possible conversion on an ex MH 772 at TLV (9M-MRI now N105GT) and found it viable. Rumors around is the OZ will be the launch customer of the 777 P2F program (not confirmed yet)

That aircraft is listed as scrapped. Surely they would not have scrapped it if a conversion was viable.

IranianMan123 wrote:

yochai wrote:

LTCM wrote:

The floor structure of the passenger 777s are made from composites and aren't strong enough for cargo operations. To convert a 777 from passenger to cargo config would require all of the floor beams to be replaced with metal ones and is considered uneconomical.

Not true, IAI Bedek has been testing a possible conversion on an ex MH 772 at TLV (9M-MRI now N105GT) and found it viable. Rumors around is the OZ will be the launch customer of the 777 P2F program (not confirmed yet)

That aircraft is listed as scrapped. Surely they would not have scrapped it if a conversion was viable.

Aircraft is indeed scrapped, as it was used for spare parts (the body is still intact with wings and tail but missing many many parts) after all their testings have been completed

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... nv-436572/

And it was just a few years ago that Richard Anderson said that 777 prices on the second hand market were falling rapidly and Boeing poo-pooed him....

eamondzhang wrote:

To add onto your list:

CZ's remaining two 77As will be retired within the next couple months (my source says 3 months but that could be wrong). Replaced by 788s.

Michael

There is some information comes from Chinese self-media,said that CZ's two 777 would be retired in JAN 2017 and MAR 2017.They would fly back to CAN and finish their final check in GAMECO.

gatibosgru wrote:

So sad PP-VRD was the first one to go. Varig was such an icon at its heydays.

Its heydays? You mean the time after, on Varig's behest, Panair do Brasil was butchered by the junta -- with assets and routes given to Varig? But before Varig spent all of that loot and eventually ran out of money?
Fascinating story, btw, for those who don't know:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1112732/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1A9W_9xSts
There is a video version with English subtitles online somewhere, but I don't seem to find it.

Rometh wrote:

Did united retire there first 777-200 (ua777)

I believe it is still on hand, however I haven't seen it lately, but it does rotate through Denver quite often

lightsaber wrote:

Those CFRP floor beams that helped sell pax 777s are dooming the same aircraft. Cest la vie.
You know... I do not know what the 787 or A350 floor beam configuration is. Does anyone know if there is a similar handicap to conversion?

There is a video around on what gets changed out on the A330 P2F conversions in EFW:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmj6_ui49tM
That already goes far beyond "rip out seating and carpets, plug windows, hacksaw a freight door."
My guess would be that an A350 does need comparable effort for P2F conversion.

DL757NYC wrote:

Narfish641 wrote:

Also I don't know if Delta is gonna do cabin refreshments on both LR and ER variants or just the LR variant. But I can most likely see their 777-200ER leaving around late 2018 or 2020. Majority of the frames are 28 years of age, and they will hit 30 very soon. They look like they are almost falling apart (Well, some of them).

WRONG Delta’s 777 fleet is relatively young. The last one delivered 2009. I think the avg age is 13 and Delta flys the wings off their jets. The 777 will be around at least 10 years

Yes this was my mistake there. Been a while since I researched on the 777-200ER. I do know United 777-200/200ER variants are around their early 20s, so I suspect them to retire theirs in the next few years.

SteelChair wrote:

And it was just a few years ago that Richard Anderson said that 777 prices on the second hand market were falling rapidly and Boeing poo-pooed him....

...and then Delta ran out and actually brought a used 777 as a part donor for much less than even Delta claimed in the first place. Brilliant move by Boeing, wiping out its own stock gains!

DL757NYC wrote:

Narfish641 wrote:

Also I don't know if Delta is gonna do cabin refreshments on both LR and ER variants or just the LR variant. But I can most likely see their 777-200ER leaving around late 2018 or 2020. Majority of the frames are 28 years of age, and they will hit 30 very soon. They look like they are almost falling apart (Well, some of them).

WRONG Delta’s 777 fleet is relatively young. The last one delivered 2009. I think the avg age is 13 and Delta flys the wings off their jets. The 777 will be around at least 10 years

Pretty misleading to say that Delta's 777 fleet is 13 years on average in this context. Half the fleet is very new, but the other half of the fleet is rapidly approaching 20 years. A low average age isn't going to help Delta keep it's 8 oldest 777s flying.

DL757NYC wrote:

Narfish641 wrote:

Also I don't know if Delta is gonna do cabin refreshments on both LR and ER variants or just the LR variant. But I can most likely see their 777-200ER leaving around late 2018 or 2020. Majority of the frames are 28 years of age, and they will hit 30 very soon. They look like they are almost falling apart (Well, some of them).

WRONG Delta’s 777 fleet is relatively young. The last one delivered 2009. I think the avg age is 13 and Delta flys the wings off their jets. The 777 will be around at least 10 years

Yes this was my mistake there. Been a while since I researched on the 777-200ER. I do know United 777-200/200ER variants are around their early 20s, so I suspect them to retire theirs in the next few years.

BA G-YMMM was the one that crashed at Heathrow. Not MMN. MMN is still operational.

gwrudolph wrote:

When you talk about 1994, you must be talking about certification and/or testing because the first one didn't go into service until June 15, 1995 with United (IAD-LHR).

Correct, talking about watching the actual first flight. My first 777 flight was DL CVG-LGW in July 2000

Nobody has mentioned CX’s venerable 777 fleet. They are still operating the first 777, B-HNL, which they bought from Boeing after the test programme was complete

ba9216c wrote:

BA G-YMMM was the one that crashed at Heathrow. Not MMN. MMN is still operational.

Oh, yes, thanks for the correction.