Now that 2017 is almost over, lets start a thread for possible and actual orders for CSeries jets for 2018. The following are some of the possibilities:

1) AtlasGlobal from Turkey is possibly ordering Cseries to compliment their airbuses in 2018, according to flightglobal December 13, 2017

2) Luxair announced some time ago that they would most likely order CSeries in 2018

3) Ethiopian has also held a long interest in the CSeries

4) AirBaltic is to make a followup order sometime in the next few months.

5) Aero Mexico may take over some of Delta's orders

6) Lufthansa may firm up some of its CSeries options

Any other more than likely orders for 2018?

Anyone know if Aeromexico is still going to take over some of Delta's orders, or make their own order?

I think the C-Series will gain some traction this year. I would think the IAG group may be looking at the C-Series as well. It’s a fantastic aircraft.

I am hoping for Atlas order and others as well, especially after the tariff fiasco, I am rooting for the underdog:) Its always nice to have a little variety. I am also wondering even if these orders materialize there is still a big issue regarding ramp up of the deliveries, lets hope BBD can fix the supply issues and can get the orders delivered fast.

(Rumor has it) GA is looking to CS100s to replace their CRJ-1000s. Does that count?

Jetsouth wrote:

Anyone know if Aeromexico is still going to take over some of Delta's orders, or make their own order?

Aeromexico wont be taking on any of Delta's orders.

Aeromexico may take over some of the early Delta slots as Delta's order gets deferred but Delta will still end up with at least 75 CS. All of that is still up in the air at the moment.

TranscendZac wrote:

I think the C-Series will gain some traction this year. I would think the IAG group may be looking at the C-Series as well. It’s a fantastic aircraft.

Not sure they will, as they seem to be gravitating towards A320s as the smallest sized aircraft with the exception of BA Cityflyer obviously. Honestly not sure where the C Series would fit in for them.

Well there is that LOI from an undisclosed customer that still needs to be firmed up.

Maybe AtlasGlobal is the LOI customer

Would love to see them in Australia, but QF don’t seem to have any immediate plans to replace their 717 fleet, or their regional partners Fokkers.

VA isn’t in a position to order new aircraft, and is doing some much needed fleet type consolidation, the E90s days are numbered there.

Croatia Airlines has been talking about introducing a 100 seater for sometime now with the CSeries being mentioned as an option. The have wet leased a number of CRJ1000 over the busy summer period which from all accounts worked really well for them. The CSeries would give them a lot of flexibility where they could be used to expand their network in the summer months and use them on their more regular routes during the winter. Croatia Airlines has 4 A319NEO's on order so with the recent agreement between Airbus and Bombardier, it will be interesting to see if Croatia Airlines will look to see if they could change the order from the A319s to the CSeries.

Obzerva wrote:

Would love to see them in Australia, but QF don’t seem to have any immediate plans to replace their 717 fleet, or their regional partners Fokkers.

I'm sure you'll see them eventually, the CSeries is the perfect bird to replace the 717s & Fokkers, it can also be used to start thin Pacific Islands and Trans-Tasman routes, e.g. CBR-NZ, Australia-HLZ.

KiloEchoVictor wrote:

(Rumor has it) GA is looking to CS100s to replace their CRJ-1000s. Does that count?

I do think it counts. I read in the news that according to Garuda's CFO, indeed Garuda is considering to bring in new fleet replacing CRJ-1000s and it has been included in GA business plan. He did not mention it will be CS100s though, but as you mentioned, rumours do say it is going to be CS100s.



I keep my fingers crossed.

@julesdj7

My major concern regarding potential 2018 orders is Bombardier's ability to deliver. It fell quite short of anticipated deliveries for both 2016 and 2017. In 2017, I think total deliveries were only 17, versus 30-35 originally anticipated. Anyone wanting a substantial order of jets may have to wait several years if Bombardier cannot deliver more than 20-30 per year.

Jerry123 wrote:

TranscendZac wrote:

I think the C-Series will gain some traction this year. I would think the IAG group may be looking at the C-Series as well. It’s a fantastic aircraft.

Not sure they will, as they seem to be gravitating towards A320s as the smallest sized aircraft with the exception of BA Cityflyer obviously. Honestly not sure where the C Series would fit in for them.

I believe IAG will be the ‘undisclosed’ order for 31+30 options:

1. BA CityFlyer - London City Airport can currently take a few C-Series at a time at present, but the capacity will increase by 7 additional stands that are to be built over the next 5-6 years or so which will greatly improve C-Series capacity at the airport. In addition, BA CityFlyer is expanding and some of the C-Series aircraft could be based at Edinburgh and other regional airports (Manchester comes to mind). The aircraft would open up some good medium haul routes (Moscow, Dubai, Northern Africa). People always seem to think BA at London City is all about business markets, which for a long time it was, but over recent years it has opened up a growing number of leisure routes very successfully too. I really cannot see BA allowing CityFlyer to fall behind (they are currently the largest airline at LCY and the C-Series is more efficient and comfortable from a pax perspective). Whilst the Scope agreement restricts aircraft up to 100 seats, I believe this will be renegotiated in the near future.

2. The other IAG airlines could easily absorb the additional aircraft in the order, I can easily see the C-Series in the Aer Lingus, Vueling and Iberia Express fleets, not to mention potentially the new Vueling Austria subsidiary. I don’t think we will ever see it in BA mainline as the airline is up gauging to A320/A321 and I believe moving the A319’s to Gatwick.

BAorNoWay wrote:

Jerry123 wrote:

TranscendZac wrote:

I think the C-Series will gain some traction this year. I would think the IAG group may be looking at the C-Series as well. It’s a fantastic aircraft.

Not sure they will, as they seem to be gravitating towards A320s as the smallest sized aircraft with the exception of BA Cityflyer obviously. Honestly not sure where the C Series would fit in for them.

I believe IAG will be the ‘undisclosed’ order for 31+30 options:

1. BA CityFlyer - London City Airport can currently take a few C-Series at a time at present, but the capacity will increase by 7 additional stands that are to be built over the next 5-6 years or so which will greatly improve C-Series capacity at the airport. In addition, BA CityFlyer is expanding and some of the C-Series aircraft could be based at Edinburgh and other regional airports (Manchester comes to mind). The aircraft would open up some good medium haul routes (Moscow, Dubai, Northern Africa). People always seem to think BA at London City is all about business markets, which for a long time it was, but over recent years it has opened up a growing number of leisure routes very successfully too. I really cannot see BA allowing CityFlyer to fall behind (they are currently the largest airline at LCY and the C-Series is more efficient and comfortable from a pax perspective). Whilst the Scope agreement restricts aircraft up to 100 seats, I believe this will be renegotiated in the near future.

2. The other IAG airlines could easily absorb the additional aircraft in the order, I can easily see the C-Series in the Aer Lingus, Vueling and Iberia Express fleets, not to mention potentially the new Vueling Austria subsidiary. I don’t think we will ever see it in BA mainline as the airline is up gauging to A320/A321 and I believe moving the A319’s to Gatwick.

Why would CityFlyer introduce a new type to their fleet? The E jet suits them and if they are going to launch new routes from LCY they'd probably be more leisure based than places like Moscow and Dubai which LHR covers well.
If IAG wanted a smaller aircraft then why not go for the A319 neo, they have the A320 neo on order and it would mean the pilots and crew would be type rated as well.
It would be nice to see them order them but i'm just a bit sceptical that they will.

Any one know if the Letter of Interest from an "European Airline" entered in to for 31 jets plus 30 options in November 2017 will convert to a firm order in 2018? I thought the word was that it would become a firm order in 2017, but it never did. Anyone have any news what is happening?

United will order 100 with a mix of CS100s and 300s.

well, one can dream.

Well, if Bombardier is building a plant costing $300 million in the United States, it is certainly not just building it for the 75 orders from Delta. I think they are expecting other large US orders, most likely from JetBlue and Sprint, both who assisted Bombardier in winning the trade dispute. It would also seem logical for United and American to order as the CS fills the vacuum in the 100-150 seat range...

Jetsouth wrote:

Well, if Bombardier is building a plant costing $300 million in the United States, it is certainly not just building it for the 75 orders from Delta. I think they are expecting other large US orders, most likely from JetBlue and Sprint, both who assisted Bombardier in winning the trade dispute. It would also seem logical for United and American to order as the CS fills the vacuum in the 100-150 seat range...

It will be built to ensure that the DL order can be fulfilled. Moreover, not all Alabama built CSeries have to go to an US airline.

Two months ago I wrote this:

"the below 180 seat markets seemingly being vacated by many airlines. Is this the regional market in the context of geographical European domestic regions? Such as the UK’s domestic Northern Powerhouse, Midlands Engine, the Southwest, Wales and the Scottish Highlands? I feel sure that there are many equivalent domestic regions elsewhere in geographical Europe which would benefit from links to geographic European hub and non-hub airports.

So why not a new pan-European airline without any historic baggage of poor labour practices and old fashioned outlook to fill this growing void across Europe? This airline might be called ‘Regio’. It would initially need a substantial fleet of CSeries, which would be set to lead a busy and long life.

And 1 month ago:

"5. Is IAG the firm in discussion with Bombardier for a large order for CSeries? This on behalf of a new regional airline branded (I guess) ‘Regio’ based outside the UK in a low cost EU nation? Will these smaller aeroplanes partly also serve as IAG’s A319 ‘replacements’ in due course, because there is a big gap below the densified 143/144 seat A319?"

Today 31st January 2018, I still think it is likely to be IAG who are negotiating for C Series. Friday, February 23, 2018 is the date for IAG's full year results. We will know then.

Jetsouth wrote:

Well, if Bombardier is building a plant costing $300 million in the United States, it is certainly not just building it for the 75 orders from Delta. I think they are expecting other large US orders, most likely from JetBlue and Sprint, both who assisted Bombardier in winning the trade dispute. It would also seem logical for United and American to order as the CS fills the vacuum in the 100-150 seat range...

I sense the same thing too.

The urgency tone attached to that Mobile FAL goes beyond what we would expect from current orders. It seems BBD is expecting such an order surge that it will require two FALs anyways. May as well proceed with Mobile right away then.

I would also believe those new orders to be mostly from the US. (Delta's CSeries will have a considerable impact on many markets; competitors must now react via E2s or CSeries).

The only counter argument I see is this artificial gap caused by the scope clauses. You got to amortize those additional mainline crew costs (tripled vs regionals) with more seats. That should make the CS300 more attractive (versus the CS100 or the E2s).

I wouldn’t be surprised at all to see United place an order for the CS100.

Don't forget that the CSeries has considerable range. It would make sense for various US airlines flying to thinly traveled routes to the Caribbean and Central/South America to order the CSeries rather than the larger and more expensive to operate 737/320's. It could also open smaller cities to direct routes to popular Caribbean destinations.

flyguy84 wrote:

I wouldn’t be surprised at all to see United place an order for the CS100.

Definitely possible, due to that "New Small Narrobody" clause in the pilots contract agreement. Procuring some CS100s or E190s would allow UA to use more 76 seaters. (On a ratio of 3 to 1 if I recall).

However, the UA CEO has said he doesn't see any use of a New Small Narrobody in the current UA network.

Otherwise, I see way more CS300 sales (versus CS100) in the US market.

How about Southwest Airlines?

IMHO, NZ will be looking at the CSeries closely - particularly because there is a big gap in its fleet between the ATR72 (68 seats) and the A320 (171 seats):

1. Domestic
On domestic routes, NZ is up-gauging - the Q300s have totally replaced the 1900D routes, while the ATR72s have almost replaced all of the Q300 routes. However, the A320s are too big to replace many of the ATR72 routes on the capacity front (at HLZ and elsewhere), and would also struggle due to runway length at places like NPE and NSN.

2. International
Internationally, the CSeries would be a powerful weapon for NZ to penetrate secondary Australia with (in light of the NZ - VA JV coming to an end this year), and boost its Americas connections through the AKL hub - routes like CBR / HBA / NTL - AKL are all too small to support A320 flights. It may also open up the Pacific Islands, like AIT and SUV.

NZ will make a long-haul order soon, likely for the A350 (replacing 777s) - with Airbus' Bombardier tie-up, a deal could be done to add CSeries to the order.

Cheers,

C.

If LX likes them, I could see the LH Group taking on more, whether that means exercising their options or buying even more. I’m personally of the opinion that the plane’s operating economics could open up a lot of possibilities for SN or OS.

planemanofnz wrote:

IMHO, NZ will be looking at the CSeries closely - particularly because there is a big gap in its fleet between the ATR72 (68 seats) and the A320 (171 seats):

1. Domestic
On domestic routes, NZ is up-gauging - the Q300s have totally replaced the 1900D routes, while the ATR72s have almost replaced all of the Q300 routes. However, the A320s are too big to replace many of the ATR72 routes on the capacity front (at HLZ and elsewhere), and would also struggle due to runway length at places like NPE and NSN.

2. International
Internationally, the CSeries would be a powerful weapon for NZ to penetrate secondary Australia with (in light of the NZ - VA JV coming to an end this year), and boost its Americas connections through the AKL hub - routes like CBR / HBA / NTL - AKL are all too small to support A320 flights. It may also open up the Pacific Islands, like AIT and SUV.

NZ will make a long-haul order soon, likely for the A350 (replacing 777s) - with Airbus' Bombardier tie-up, a deal could be done to add CSeries to the order.

Cheers,

C.

I've always thought ANZ was a perfect candidate. Loads of places you could serve in Oz direct to compete with Qantas connecting through SYD. 3,000nm range from Auckland gets you as far as Perth & Darwin, all of the Pacific islands ex Hawaii...

wrongwayup wrote:

I've always thought ANZ was a perfect candidate

+1

I could see the following:

1. Feed AKL hub with more secondary Australian and Pacific Island destinations:



2. Improve economics and frequencies of low-frequency short-haul routes:



3. Explore international opportunities from secondary New Zealand destinations:



4. Expand on domestic routes where the ATR72 is too small, but the A320 is too big:



Cheers,

C.

ShinyAndChrome wrote:

If LX likes them, I could see the LH Group taking on more, whether that means exercising their options or buying even more. I’m personally of the opinion that the plane’s operating economics could open up a lot of possibilities for SN or OS.

The Cs would Be amazing for SN. A319 replacements, growth, right-sizing, you name it.
OS ive never thought about. Perfect for easterly expansion, adding routes or adding capacity to existing routes. However, they have some new E-Jets that really be serve similar purposes, although with less range.

planemanofnz wrote:

IMHO, NZ will be looking at the CSeries closely - particularly because there is a big gap in its fleet between the ATR72 (68 seats) and the A320 (171 seats):

1. Domestic
On domestic routes, NZ is up-gauging - the Q300s have totally replaced the 1900D routes, while the ATR72s have almost replaced all of the Q300 routes. However, the A320s are too big to replace many of the ATR72 routes on the capacity front (at HLZ and elsewhere), and would also struggle due to runway length at places like NPE and NSN.

2. International
Internationally, the CSeries would be a powerful weapon for NZ to penetrate secondary Australia with (in light of the NZ - VA JV coming to an end this year), and boost its Americas connections through the AKL hub - routes like CBR / HBA / NTL - AKL are all too small to support A320 flights. It may also open up the Pacific Islands, like AIT and SUV.

NZ will make a long-haul order soon, likely for the A350 (replacing 777s) - with Airbus' Bombardier tie-up, a deal could be done to add CSeries to the order.

Cheers,

C.

Is the NZ/VA joint venture definitely ceasing this year? It's been speculated heavily on both the Australian and New Zealand forums due to NZ selling out of VA shares and the agreement having a current fixed term ending this year, however there has also been contrary talk of it being extended. I think everyone in Australia and New Zealand is feeding on each other's discussions and sees it ending as a done deal, but the publicly known information is yet to support this.

According to Fliegerfaust, JetBlue is in Montreal visiting the Bombardier facilities today, February 26th. There have been rumors for a long time that JetBlue may order the CSeries, perhaps to replace the 190's. Could an order be forthcoming?

Jetsouth wrote:

According to Fliegerfaust, JetBlue is in Montreal visiting the Bombardier facilities today, February 26th. There have been rumors for a long time that JetBlue may order the CSeries, perhaps to replace the 190's. Could an order be forthcoming?

JetBlue said that they're not going to decide between the E2 and CSeries until the end of 2018, or early 2019.

[twoid][/twoid]

Jetsouth wrote:

According to Fliegerfaust, JetBlue is in Montreal visiting the Bombardier facilities today, February 26th. There have been rumors for a long time that JetBlue may order the CSeries, perhaps to replace the 190's. Could an order be forthcoming?

That guy has been shooting blanks like it’s his job. Useless.

Jetsouth wrote:

According to Fliegerfaust, JetBlue is in Montreal visiting the Bombardier facilities today, February 26th. There have been rumors for a long time that JetBlue may order the CSeries, perhaps to replace the 190's. Could an order be forthcoming?

Fliegerfaust has predicted 20 of the last 3 C Series orders. Would it surprise you to know that executives from United, American, Southwest, Spirit, JetBlue, Westjet, etc etc, have all been through the Mirabel plant at one time or another?

Although CM's management said back in 2016 that they are happy with the E190s, they are still planning on starting to return them in 2019 and have all of them out of the fleet in 2020 replacing them with the B737 MAX. Recently there's been rumours that they have been looking to replace the E190s as they are essential for many routes of Copa and Copa Colombia. Reality is that CM has not been impressed by the E190s, so Embraer presented the E2 and Bombardier the CSeries, and they have been more inclined for the CSeries for Copa, Copa Colombia and Wingo. Haven't heard anything after Boeing's new deal with Embraer which that might affect CM's decisions.

wrongwayup wrote:

Jetsouth wrote:

According to Fliegerfaust, JetBlue is in Montreal visiting the Bombardier facilities today, February 26th. There have been rumors for a long time that JetBlue may order the CSeries, perhaps to replace the 190's. Could an order be forthcoming?

Fliegerfaust has predicted 20 of the last 3 C Series orders. Would it surprise you to know that executives from United, American, Southwest, Spirit, JetBlue, Westjet, etc etc, have all been through the Mirabel plant at one time or another?

Fliegerfaust definitely has good source(s?) in the FAL as he is usually the first and sometime only one to report on specific production/testing details. E.g. Korean 3rd CS300 acceptance flight that went up in smoke - literally. Air Baltic latest CS300 that was ferried to YUL for a while. Which MSN has its interior completed by a 3rd party. etc.

But anything outside the FAL is just pure speculation on his part. My advice: do not believe anything he writes in regards to orders, corporate, strategic, etc. until you see it reported by another independent/reliable source such as Les Ailes du Quebec that is much more accurate and precises. André Allard is a real pro and good journalist, he will not make up fake stories just to fit its agenda. Unfortunately his website is on in french. http://www.lesailesduquebec.com/?p=6152

Dash9 wrote:

André Allard is a real pro and good journalist, he will not make up fake stories just to fit its agenda. Unfortunately his website is on in french. http://www.lesailesduquebec.com/?p=6152

Totally agree with your post. (But I still enjoy reading Fliegerfaust, part of it for its Mirabel FAL connections, and part of it for entertainment purposes )

sixtyseven wrote:

[twoid][/twoid]

Jetsouth wrote:

According to Fliegerfaust, JetBlue is in Montreal visiting the Bombardier facilities today, February 26th. There have been rumors for a long time that JetBlue may order the CSeries, perhaps to replace the 190's. Could an order be forthcoming?

That guy has been shooting blanks like it’s his job. Useless.

I think he has nothing better to do . According to his bio online, he owned a company, sold it, and it seems like he's in early retirement or something.

Jetsouth wrote:

According to Fliegerfaust, JetBlue is in Montreal visiting the Bombardier facilities today, February 26th. There have been rumors for a long time that JetBlue may order the CSeries, perhaps to replace the 190's. Could an order be forthcoming?

sixtyseven wrote:

That guy has been shooting blanks like it’s his job. Useless.

Fliegerfaust was not "shooting blanks" here after all. JetBlue did indeed visit Bombardier. (They will also visit Embraer).

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-jetb ... sinessNews

I feel like the C-Series has been staying afloat for a couple years now. There was hope when Air Canada and Delta signed on, but those orders were at huge discounted rates. Then there was the trade dispute, but now that that is over does anyone else feel like the C-Series just needs one more large order to really catapult it to what it was meant to be? A true game changer in this industry? Maybe if a jet blue or a spirit signed on? Or maybe american to replace their e190?

It could certainly use one more big order, perhaps the rumored European one?

A fairly large order would certainly boost Bombardier - the C series is a great aircraft, but is currently lacking momentum...

There are many folks who would say it needs many big orders. I wish AS would take a look at it for A319/73G replacement but I’d imagine AS is going to make the A320/738 size bracket its smallest mainline size going forward one the A319s lease out and the 73G fleet ages into the next decade. Anyone with A319s and 73Gs should look long and hard at the Cseries.

I think the C-series could really do with one, but I imagine slow production rates and engine issues are a put off for many airlines atm - I think we should see a considerable number once there is more in service data and steady production rates, with engine issues ironed out

QXAS wrote:

There are many folks who would say it needs many big orders. I wish AS would take a look at it for A319/73G replacement but I’d imagine AS is going to make the A320/738 size bracket its smallest mainline size going forward one the A319s lease out and the 73G fleet ages into the next decade. Anyone with A319s and 73Gs should look long and hard at the Cseries.

It needs many large orders. In particular with two FALs...

Lightsaber

Yes, I would agree, most airlines will hold back on ordering the CSeries until Bombardier can get their production in order. There apparently is no longer delay issue relating to engine deliveries, Bombardier seems to be having other production issues. For instance, they forecast 40 deliveries this year, and so far this year, after two months only 1 frame has been delivered. Therefore, an airline ordering 50-100 planes has to wonder when their frames are going to be delivered, especially since they would have to wait for most of Delta's 75 frame order to be delivered and then the order for Air Canada. And at the rate Bombardier is going, who knows how many years it would take just to fill these two orders, plus completing the AirBaltic, SWISS and Korean orders.

[threeid][/threeid]

lightsaber wrote:

QXAS wrote:

There are many folks who would say it needs many big orders. I wish AS would take a look at it for A319/73G replacement but I’d imagine AS is going to make the A320/738 size bracket its smallest mainline size going forward one the A319s lease out and the 73G fleet ages into the next decade. Anyone with A319s and 73Gs should look long and hard at the Cseries.

It needs many large orders. In particular with two FALs...

Lightsaber

I am in the camp that says it needs many large orders. Any idea with 2 FALs producing at a decent rate, how many years of production they have?

According to Flightglobal, United is "very seriously" looking at both the C's and the E2's as a main line jet.