Flyingsottsman
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Tue Dec 05, 2017 11:52 am

smi0006 wrote:
Qantas16 wrote:
Air Canada's first flight to MEL is on its way!

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ACA37


Great to see! This is the last new carrier to arrive for MEL that’s been announced? UL,JL,LA and Tianjin- busy year. Wonder if we’ll see any new carrier snext year.


Lets hope so, would love to see KE come back, OZ and even HA. But I think MEL might have to look at extending the international terminal again, its at stretching point. Been a great year for MEL this year.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:11 pm

Update on Project Sunrise

Boeing is currently studying tweaks on the 777-8 for QF's requirements

http://australianaviation.com.au/2017/1 ... challenge/

Meanwhile Airbus has puts its case for the A350-900ULR

http://australianaviation.com.au/2017/1 ... t-sunrise/
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:22 pm

Flyingsottsman wrote:
smi0006 wrote:
Qantas16 wrote:
Air Canada's first flight to MEL is on its way!

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ACA37


Great to see! This is the last new carrier to arrive for MEL that’s been announced? UL,JL,LA and Tianjin- busy year. Wonder if we’ll see any new carrier snext year.


Lets hope so, would love to see KE come back, OZ and even HA. But I think MEL might have to look at extending the international terminal again, its at stretching point. Been a great year for MEL this year.


I would love to see KE back in MEL too, MEL has built a strong NE Asia network with 15 destinations in the region with connections to China, Hong Kong, Japan and Taiwan, all that is missing is Korea! Fingers crossed that KE returns, or OZ gives MEL ago if they want to expand their presence in Australia. SYD and BNE are strong markets to Korea, MEL is a growing market with a stable VFR market, growing student market and a growing leisure market, pax numbers have grown YOY without direct flights, maybe its time for KE to give the route another go.

MEL-Japan went from no flights a few years ago to x2 daily flights with QF and JL today, so anything is possible!
it's time to visit Melbourne! ;)
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Tue Dec 05, 2017 1:57 pm

QF to discontinue traditional offering of inflight duty free from 1 January 2018

https://www.ausbt.com.au/qantas-axes-in ... e-shopping
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:04 pm

Virgin will begin a 3 month trial from today ( 6 Dec) offering passengers a grab and go breakfast/snack from its lounges in SYD, MEL & BNE

https://www.ausbt.com.au/virgin-austral ... breakfasts
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Tue Dec 05, 2017 8:39 pm

qf2220 wrote:
I get what you're saying re ICAO, though that hasn't stopped MEL from being essentially the same building (albeit with different processes and no interflow between INT and DOM pax. The second part of your answer seems to indicate an operational reason for BNE that would have added capital cost to the project (ie relocation of cargo) being the reason?


That's pretty much the entirety of it - domestic passengers in Australia undergo security screening to a lesser extent than those departing internationally and so they cannot share common airside areas.

(there's also the matter of Australia performing emigration controls, but this is not unique internationally)

There's nothing to actually stop these segregated areas being in the same building, though, other than those reasons specific to each airport at the time it was being built. Brisbane is an interesting one in particular because of the way it's moved around so much over time, and SYD too, though to a lesser extent. MEL's first three terminals, on the other hand, were all planned and built at the same time.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Tue Dec 05, 2017 11:59 pm

While not disputing in way what RyanairGuru or XAM2175 says about security requirements, the separation of International/Domestic into separate terminals LONG predates even the concept of aviation security. In SYD, at least it goes back to the 1950s, at least, to my personal knowledge, and I suspect to the end of WWII, at least. So this suggests that it was driven by the custom & immigration authorities. At SYD all terminals were at what is now the domestic area, as you came down the road AnsettANA was first on your left, then BAT/Airlines of NSW, then TAA after the first turn & across the end of the loop and the International Terminal after the second turn, followed by a row of QF hangers. This whole area, and more, is the current Terminals 2 & 3.
Perhaps the security requirements are one reason why it is maintained.

Gemuser
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 12:08 am

Flyingsottsman wrote:
smi0006 wrote:
Qantas16 wrote:
Air Canada's first flight to MEL is on its way!

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ACA37


Great to see! This is the last new carrier to arrive for MEL that’s been announced? UL,JL,LA and Tianjin- busy year. Wonder if we’ll see any new carrier snext year.


Lets hope so, would love to see KE come back, OZ and even HA. But I think MEL might have to look at extending the international terminal again, its at stretching point. Been a great year for MEL this year.


Very true, would be my top bets also. With long shots of TK, OD and maybe AA to LAX/DFW.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 12:13 am

qf789 wrote:
Virgin will begin a 3 month trial from today ( 6 Dec) offering passengers a grab and go breakfast/snack from its lounges in SYD, MEL & BNE

https://www.ausbt.com.au/virgin-austral ... breakfasts


I think this is an awesome idea. I don’t want to hang around a lounge eating breakfast. I Checkin online so grabbing a snack then straight through premium security will be perfect in MEL!
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 12:14 am

Gemuser wrote:
While not disputing in way what RyanairGuru or XAM2175 says about security requirements, the separation of International/Domestic into separate terminals LONG predates even the concept of aviation security. In SYD, at least it goes back to the 1950s, at least, to my personal knowledge, and I suspect to the end of WWII, at least. So this suggests that it was driven by the custom & immigration authorities. At SYD all terminals were at what is now the domestic area, as you came down the road AnsettANA was first on your left, then BAT/Airlines of NSW, then TAA after the first turn & across the end of the loop and the International Terminal after the second turn, followed by a row of QF hangers. This whole area, and more, is the current Terminals 2 & 3.
Perhaps the security requirements are one reason why it is maintained.

Gemuser


Id say security requirements are a factor in maintaining the status quo yes, but id say capex build new terminals is the main reason. I dont think that security is really the answer though.

In the past, at the time of building, was there much call for transfers from INT to DOM (and v/v) or were INT and DOM trips largely separate and discrete events?
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 1:52 am

It all relates back to the cost of construction and the related disruption to the airport

Nearly twenty years ago I worked on a airport proposal that estimated the cost to redevelop the Sydney airport terminals and runways at three times the cost of a new dual runway A380 compatable airport.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 1:59 am

RyanairGuru wrote:
qf2220 wrote:
A question ive been meaning to ask for a while - what was the policy/strategy reason for building separate international and domestic terminals at Australian airports (eg SYD, BNE, PER etc). Now it is clearly viewed as a second rate solution, with a preference to have operations in one walkable terminal, but at the time this must not have been such a large concern. Id be interested in hearing from people who might know more about this (including those who might have been connected to the industry back then) to know why it was done. Space might have been an issue for some (eg SYD) but for places like BNE and PER i dont understand why the terminals were built separated. Thanks in advance.


At the most fundamental level this is due to Australia (and New Zealand for that matter) opting not to comply with ICAO standards for domestic flights and they must therefore be strictly segregated. Just about anywhere else in the world domestic and international flights are operated to the same security standards, but for various reasons that is not the case here.

As to why the terminals are not co-located that is a matter of history more than anything else. Take BNE, when the “new” Brisbane Airport was built domestic was moved down there whereas international stayed at the old Eagle Farm international terminal. When this facility was eventually replaced the new international terminal was built basically next door to the old terminal. Due to the cargo facilities it wouldn’t have been possible to put international next to the domestic terminal.


This explains how and why at all airports except Adelaide. From what I am aware the gate is in the middle of the terminal and is changed to INT op's as required. Cant be 100% as I have not flown out of Adelaide in years , so how is it handled?
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ADL77W
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 2:17 am

Yep, Adelaide's gates swing. There are glass barriers which are closed off to divide international and domestic. Only downside in ADL is there are almost no amenities after immigration...
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 2:26 am

In the distant days when we talked here about possible mergers and takeovers of Qantas some speculated that Cathay Pacific would make a good fit. Yet it seemed like there were big cultural differences to surmount between the two. I wonder if the so called "Swire Prince" top level management systems were one of the major issues.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-catha ... KKBN1DZ391

Pure speculation on my part.
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 4:28 am

sq256 wrote:
waoz1 wrote:
Its just another reason virgin doesnt do well as it should it just chops and changes too much. There is no clear direction.


Also partly due to having 3 major shareholders for most of their life since they rebranded from DJ to VA. 3 airline groups wanting VA to do different things also didn't help their bottom line.

NZ recent exit from VA (and basically becoming frenemies after the much publicised board bust-up), EY rumoured to be exiting VA in favour of investing in the (even bigger) financial basketcase that is Alitialia, and SQ basically coy on their future in VA's shareholding. Their financial sources are basically only the Chinese groups (Hainan & Nanshan) and a minor shareholding from the Virgin UK group.

I would hope VA's direction would be made more clear in the short to medium term for their sakes with SQ/EY stating their intention whether they intend to exit on their shareholding in VA.

The NZ-VA bust-up prior to NZ's exit had pretty much pushed VA closer towards the Skyteam Alliance with their affiliation to DL. Basically positioning VA as a potential future primarily (Domestic/NZ) Skyteam feeder (with their own TransPacific US flying handed to DL) should push come to shove in regards to Borghetti's future.


I don't know why you think VA is closer to SkyTeam than Star Alliance as far as alliances go. I know JB said that he thought SkyTeam would make a good fit years ago but I think that was taken out of context. He said it because everyone else was asking for Star. JB and his personality just wants to say the opposite and he does not need to take responsibility for saying it as VA was not entering either.

I am just surprised he is not fired yet. If anyone thinks HNA Group would be a financial safeguard that's not happening. They have massive debt and the Chinese government has taken a firm grip on their foreign investment activities and they have started exposing of their overseas assets. If VA wants more money, HNA Group may not be so generous like last time. Nanshan is the same.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:40 am

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sq256
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:55 am

xiaotung wrote:
sq256 wrote:
waoz1 wrote:
Its just another reason virgin doesnt do well as it should it just chops and changes too much. There is no clear direction.


Also partly due to having 3 major shareholders for most of their life since they rebranded from DJ to VA. 3 airline groups wanting VA to do different things also didn't help their bottom line.

NZ recent exit from VA (and basically becoming frenemies after the much publicised board bust-up), EY rumoured to be exiting VA in favour of investing in the (even bigger) financial basketcase that is Alitialia, and SQ basically coy on their future in VA's shareholding. Their financial sources are basically only the Chinese groups (Hainan & Nanshan) and a minor shareholding from the Virgin UK group.

I would hope VA's direction would be made more clear in the short to medium term for their sakes with SQ/EY stating their intention whether they intend to exit on their shareholding in VA.

The NZ-VA bust-up prior to NZ's exit had pretty much pushed VA closer towards the Skyteam Alliance with their affiliation to DL. Basically positioning VA as a potential future primarily (Domestic/NZ) Skyteam feeder (with their own TransPacific US flying handed to DL) should push come to shove in regards to Borghetti's future.


I don't know why you think VA is closer to SkyTeam than Star Alliance as far as alliances go. I know JB said that he thought SkyTeam would make a good fit years ago but I think that was taken out of context. He said it because everyone else was asking for Star. JB and his personality just wants to say the opposite and he does not need to take responsibility for saying it as VA was not entering either.

I am just surprised he is not fired yet. If anyone thinks HNA Group would be a financial safeguard that's not happening. They have massive debt and the Chinese government has taken a firm grip on their foreign investment activities and they have started exposing of their overseas assets. If VA wants more money, HNA Group may not be so generous like last time. Nanshan is the same.


VA being kicked out of the Star Alliance lounge (as it's run/managed by NZ) in LAX, along with VA removing status earning/points from Velocity passengers flying the non Tran-Tasman NZ flights in response suggests it was a very messy divorce. Along with the varied lounge arrangement in SYD which involves VA sending the non-Tran-Tasman passengers to the Skyteam lounge at SYD (run by Plaza Premium, iirc).

Also, VA and UA "working together" is just as likely as QF and CX, Virgin and United have been hostile rivals since the V Australia days and the decision by Borghetti's predecessor Godfrey to initially pair up with V America and eventually Delta (which was expanded when Borghetti took over).

Borghetti is stubborn, however NZ exiting had just basically handed potential future Oz-TransPacific market to DL (should VA's fortunes with their international division continue to bleed red, DL are there to pick up VA's LAX operations). This is considering there have been rumours that NZ wanted VA to exit their JV with DL and hand over their own flying to NZ and UA (considering the later are hostile rivals, UA being a distant no #3, and are less reputable than DL and AA in a market where their in-flight service is considered lagging behind their Asian and Middle East counterparts).
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 4:20 pm

Qantas collects $2.4 billion in tax for FY16/17 up 14% on the previous year, however pays no company tax for the year

https://blueswandaily.com/qantas-paysco ... in-period/

Qantas has made final purchase of share buy back scheme

https://blueswandaily.com/qantas-makes- ... ck-scheme/
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 7:13 pm

An767 wrote:
RyanairGuru wrote:
qf2220 wrote:
A question ive been meaning to ask for a while - what was the policy/strategy reason for building separate international and domestic terminals at Australian airports (eg SYD, BNE, PER etc). Now it is clearly viewed as a second rate solution, with a preference to have operations in one walkable terminal, but at the time this must not have been such a large concern. Id be interested in hearing from people who might know more about this (including those who might have been connected to the industry back then) to know why it was done. Space might have been an issue for some (eg SYD) but for places like BNE and PER i dont understand why the terminals were built separated. Thanks in advance.


At the most fundamental level this is due to Australia (and New Zealand for that matter) opting not to comply with ICAO standards for domestic flights and they must therefore be strictly segregated. Just about anywhere else in the world domestic and international flights are operated to the same security standards, but for various reasons that is not the case here.

As to why the terminals are not co-located that is a matter of history more than anything else. Take BNE, when the “new” Brisbane Airport was built domestic was moved down there whereas international stayed at the old Eagle Farm international terminal. When this facility was eventually replaced the new international terminal was built basically next door to the old terminal. Due to the cargo facilities it wouldn’t have been possible to put international next to the domestic terminal.


This explains how and why at all airports except Adelaide. From what I am aware the gate is in the middle of the terminal and is changed to INT op's as required. Cant be 100% as I have not flown out of Adelaide in years , so how is it handled?
AN767


Canberra as well. That’s fine because while the physical stand and airbridge can be used for domestic and international passengers, internally passengers are segregated. Domestic passengers are on one level, international departures above and international arrivals below. Once a passenger has gone through international security and border control there is no chance of them intermingling with domestic passengers even if they are in the same building.
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:52 pm

qf789 wrote:


From an article I read recently, February has the second-lowest air fares of the year departing Australia, behind October. Certainly there are sub-$700 SYD-BKK return specials floating around for February, on TG and EK.

The D7 changes may be seasonal.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:25 pm

Canberra as well. That’s fine because while the physical stand and airbridge can be used for domestic and international passengers, internally passengers are segregated. Domestic passengers are on one level, international departures above and international arrivals below. Once a passenger has gone through international security and border control there is no chance of them intermingling with domestic passengers even if they are in the same building.


I don't want this to sound cruel but it appears that whilst swing gates may work in Australia, it is really only in locations where international operations are more a novelty than a full-blown operation. Whilst it is OK in CBR and ADL with >10 international movements per day, it is hard to see why you'd bother in places such as MEL, SYD, PER and BNE, where int'l ops are basically non-stop and therefore justify their own dedicated area/terminals.

As has been pointed out, AU int'l ops differ significantly from other places such as US where departures are mixed and there are few, if any, int'l departure controls, An Australian mixed terminal would require a duplication of airside functions such as lounges, concessions etc in segregated areas unless you were going to subject domestic departures to the same vetting as international which does have arguments in its favour but would be time-consuming and more expensive.
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:39 pm

tullamarine wrote:
Canberra as well. That’s fine because while the physical stand and airbridge can be used for domestic and international passengers, internally passengers are segregated. Domestic passengers are on one level, international departures above and international arrivals below. Once a passenger has gone through international security and border control there is no chance of them intermingling with domestic passengers even if they are in the same building.


I don't want this to sound cruel but it appears that whilst swing gates may work in Australia, it is really only in locations where international operations are more a novelty than a full-blown operation. Whilst it is OK in CBR and ADL with >10 international movements per day, it is hard to see why you'd bother in places such as MEL, SYD, PER and BNE, where int'l ops are basically non-stop and therefore justify their own dedicated area/terminals.

As has been pointed out, AU int'l ops differ significantly from other places such as US where departures are mixed and there are few, if any, int'l departure controls, An Australian mixed terminal would require a duplication of airside functions such as lounges, concessions etc in segregated areas unless you were going to subject domestic departures to the same vetting as international which does have arguments in its favour but would be time-consuming and more expensive.


Subjecting domestic / Schengen pax to the same security screening etc as international passengers is precisely how pax are permitted to intermingle in the US and Europe. Everyone passes through some kind of passport control, everyone passes through LAGS, etc. Australia and New Zealand have just chosen not to go down that route.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Thu Dec 07, 2017 12:05 am

DeltaB717 wrote:
tullamarine wrote:
Canberra as well. That’s fine because while the physical stand and airbridge can be used for domestic and international passengers, internally passengers are segregated. Domestic passengers are on one level, international departures above and international arrivals below. Once a passenger has gone through international security and border control there is no chance of them intermingling with domestic passengers even if they are in the same building.


I don't want this to sound cruel but it appears that whilst swing gates may work in Australia, it is really only in locations where international operations are more a novelty than a full-blown operation. Whilst it is OK in CBR and ADL with >10 international movements per day, it is hard to see why you'd bother in places such as MEL, SYD, PER and BNE, where int'l ops are basically non-stop and therefore justify their own dedicated area/terminals.

As has been pointed out, AU int'l ops differ significantly from other places such as US where departures are mixed and there are few, if any, int'l departure controls, An Australian mixed terminal would require a duplication of airside functions such as lounges, concessions etc in segregated areas unless you were going to subject domestic departures to the same vetting as international which does have arguments in its favour but would be time-consuming and more expensive.


Subjecting domestic / Schengen pax to the same security screening etc as international passengers is precisely how pax are permitted to intermingle in the US and Europe. Everyone passes through some kind of passport control, everyone passes through LAGS, etc. Australia and New Zealand have just chosen not to go down that route.


I am not sure about the US, but in Europe Schengen and non-Schengen pax typically do not mix. Taking FRA or MUC as an example, the same terminal does handle Domestic (Schengen) and International flights, but both are on segregated levels of the same terminal/pier. Typically you will have international arrivals on the lower level (with immigration and customs), then a combined Schengen Departures/Arrivals level just like Domestic in AU on the mid-level (without immigration and customs), and on top of that another level with International Departures (with immigration and customs). So you segregate pax in the same way as is being done in BNE or SYD, just in much closer proximity. I am not sure why something like this wouldn't be possible here.

I still remember walking through FRA T1 pier A on the Schengen level one day on the way to my gate, and while passing another gate saw a flight boarding for Paderborn (PAD), a small regional airport maybe 300 km north of Frankfurt, and a 744 sitting at the gate. I had to stop and check again because this did not make sense, and it turned out the PAD flight was boarding into a bus waiting underneath the gate down the stairs, while the 744 sitting at the same gate would have been boarding from the Intl level above and probably going to DEL or IAD or somewhere else more interesting than Paderborn.

This would definitely be possible in larger airports such as MEL or SYD, but I agree swing gates only makes sense with limited Intl ops. CHC has a dedicated Intl and Domestic wing and then a small number of gates (3-4) sitting in between that can swing either way. I think this is a clever concept as you still have Duty Free, Lounges, restaurants etc. available post security and immigration, but the number of gates can vary depending upon demand and time of the day.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:48 am

I am not sure about the US, but in Europe Schengen and non-Schengen pax typically do not mix.


This is also the case in AMS with a separate airside security and passport check separating the Schengen & non-Schengen gates
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:18 am

tullamarine wrote:
Whilst it is OK in CBR and ADL with >10 international movements per day, it is hard to see why you'd bother in places such as MEL, SYD, PER and BNE, where int'l ops are basically non-stop and therefore justify their own dedicated area/terminals.


I think it would be quite useful at SYD to be able to swing a few gates to international during the morning peak and then back to domestic for the rest of the day. Far better to have JQ/TT use stairs for a few flights in the morning than A380s and 777s that have come in from around the world.

A few swing gates at an expanded T3 (with a new international pier/satellite) would be useful operationally as well. A QF A330 could come in from SIN and go straight out to PER, for example. Or you could use swing gates to integrate Tasman operations into the domestic side more seamlessly.

There are lots of opportunities to use swing gates to improve efficiency rather than just to provide capacity like at ADL or CBR.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:59 am

qf002 wrote:
tullamarine wrote:
Whilst it is OK in CBR and ADL with >10 international movements per day, it is hard to see why you'd bother in places such as MEL, SYD, PER and BNE, where int'l ops are basically non-stop and therefore justify their own dedicated area/terminals.


I think it would be quite useful at SYD to be able to swing a few gates to international during the morning peak and then back to domestic for the rest of the day. Far better to have JQ/TT use stairs for a few flights in the morning than A380s and 777s that have come in from around the world.

A few swing gates at an expanded T3 (with a new international pier/satellite) would be useful operationally as well. A QF A330 could come in from SIN and go straight out to PER, for example. Or you could use swing gates to integrate Tasman operations into the domestic side more seamlessly.

There are lots of opportunities to use swing gates to improve efficiency rather than just to provide capacity like at ADL or CBR.


Problem with that is that you then would need to fit Immigration and Border Control somewhere in the terminal and there just isn't the space to do that at present. It maybe viable if we had a single market policy, like what was going to be introduced years ago, but even then, there would still be issues with transfers to and from international flights, etc.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:04 am

tullamarine wrote:
I am not sure about the US, but in Europe Schengen and non-Schengen pax typically do not mix.


This is also the case in AMS with a separate airside security and passport check separating the Schengen & non-Schengen gates

Also true in Zurich where non-schengen pax are in Terminal E.

Gemuser
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:14 am

tullamarine wrote:
As has been pointed out, AU int'l ops differ significantly from other places such as US where departures are mixed and there are few, if any, int'l departure controls, An Australian mixed terminal would require a duplication of airside functions such as lounges, concessions etc in segregated areas unless you were going to subject domestic departures to the same vetting as international which does have arguments in its favour but would be time-consuming and more expensive.

I don't see much of a difference in terms of Au's Intl ops from most of the world, well most of them that I've visited. The USA is a special case (along with the UK IIRC) that they don't have a departure immigration control; but most of the other countries do have a departure control (and maybe together with quarantine guys) thus it's basically the same system as Australia's one.

Michael
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:59 am

NZ has reportedly had to ground 4 787's due to engine issues

Affected flights over the coming days include

Today 7/12
NZ175 AKL-PER cancelled

Tomorrow 8/12
NZ178 PER-AKL cancelled
NZ175 AKL-PER delayed 3hrs30mins
NZ162 PER-CHC delayed 7hrs35mins
NZ61 AKL-RAR-SYD delayed 1hr30mins

Saturday 9/12
NZ161 CHC-PER delayed 4hrs50mins

More delays/cancellations are likely

https://www.airnewzealand.co.nz/travel- ... 2vslMFiJL7
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qf002
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Thu Dec 07, 2017 11:28 am

jupiter2 wrote:
Problem with that is that you then would need to fit Immigration and Border Control somewhere in the terminal and there just isn't the space to do that at present. It maybe viable if we had a single market policy, like what was going to be introduced years ago, but even then, there would still be issues with transfers to and from international flights, etc.


Agree it wouldn't fit in the current footprint but I am thinking in the context of a larger redevelopment.
 
qantas747
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:45 pm

qf002 wrote:
jupiter2 wrote:
Problem with that is that you then would need to fit Immigration and Border Control somewhere in the terminal and there just isn't the space to do that at present. It maybe viable if we had a single market policy, like what was going to be introduced years ago, but even then, there would still be issues with transfers to and from international flights, etc.


Agree it wouldn't fit in the current footprint but I am thinking in the context of a larger redevelopment.


There was some talk back of a domestic/international terminal for QF taking over parts of the jetbase. Removing QF from T1 would open up significant space in T1 and justify additional customs/immigration space.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:52 pm

Qantas pilots are not happy that Jetconnect pilots will still do trans tasman flights once the remaining 737's are transferred back to the Australian register

http://www.smh.com.au/business/aviation ... 4yxh6.html
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An767
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Thu Dec 07, 2017 11:15 pm

John Travolta is bringing his 707 back home, and donating to Hars , no doubt to be parked next to the 744 that QF gave them last year
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Fri Dec 08, 2017 1:30 am

qf789 wrote:
Qantas pilots are not happy that Jetconnect pilots will still do trans tasman flights once the remaining 737's are transferred back to the Australian register

http://www.smh.com.au/business/aviation ... 4yxh6.html


At face value this seems quite petty as the Jetconnect pilots will still only fly on Tasman routes, but I can understand why they are concerned about a slippery slope given that the Jetconnect flight attendants (and the Jetstar Asian basis) are used across the system.
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Qantas16
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Fri Dec 08, 2017 2:08 am

RyanairGuru wrote:
qf789 wrote:
Qantas pilots are not happy that Jetconnect pilots will still do trans tasman flights once the remaining 737's are transferred back to the Australian register

http://www.smh.com.au/business/aviation ... 4yxh6.html


At face value this seems quite petty as the Jetconnect pilots will still only fly on Tasman routes, but I can understand why they are concerned about a slippery slope given that the Jetconnect flight attendants (and the Jetstar Asian basis) are used across the system.


Had it previously been announced that all QF aircraft would be back on the Australian register and, in effect, Jetconnect would be dissolved as an airline? That's what this article suggests but I had not heard it previously.
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Fri Dec 08, 2017 6:16 am

Silkair has moved forward 737MAX flights

DRW will see 737MAX8 from 7 Jan 18
CNS will see 737MAX8 from 8 Jan 18

https://www.ausbt.com.au/silkair-brings ... rns-darwin
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Qantas16
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Fri Dec 08, 2017 6:35 am

Storms in BNE earlier this afternoon led to some diversions to MCY and ROK.

MCY
QF1546 CBR-BNE - 717
QF1779 ROK-BNE - 717
QF2513 MKY-BNE - Q400
QF2405 EMD-BNE - Q400
QF1791 TSV-BNE - 717

ROK
VA1217 CBR-BNE - 738
QF528 SYD-BNE - 738

There may have been more but that is all I've found. I'm presuming the MCY ramp was full and could not accept any more flights and that led to the 2 flights diverting to ROK - quite a diversion of over 500km. Not an uncommon diversion point though.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Fri Dec 08, 2017 12:33 pm

The ACBC (Australia Chinese Business Council) predicts Chinese arrivals will increase from 1 million this year to 3.3 million in 2025

https://blueswandaily.com/acbc-forecast ... n-by-2025/

Jetstar started 2 weekly services to Zhengzhou on Thursday

https://blueswandaily.com/jetstar-comme ... u-service/
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:33 pm

QF 789 VH-ZNC has rolled out of final assembly over the past 24 hours
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:37 pm

Qantas16 wrote:
RyanairGuru wrote:
qf789 wrote:
Qantas pilots are not happy that Jetconnect pilots will still do trans tasman flights once the remaining 737's are transferred back to the Australian register

http://www.smh.com.au/business/aviation ... 4yxh6.html


At face value this seems quite petty as the Jetconnect pilots will still only fly on Tasman routes, but I can understand why they are concerned about a slippery slope given that the Jetconnect flight attendants (and the Jetstar Asian basis) are used across the system.


Had it previously been announced that all QF aircraft would be back on the Australian register and, in effect, Jetconnect would be dissolved as an airline? That's what this article suggests but I had not heard it previously.


I don't remember anything being announced. I had thought we would see another one or 2 transferred back to the Australian register once more A330 flights take over next year but the whole lot. Thinking about it now with the increased A330 flying it allows for more flexibility if the aircraft are back on the Australian register
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Sat Dec 09, 2017 12:27 am

NZ flights affected by engine issues over the coming days

Today
NZ161 CHC-PER delayed 4hrs50mins
NZ175 AKL-PER delayed 3hrs20mins
NZ101/102 AKL-SYD equipment changed to 772

Tomorrow
NZ107/108 AKL-SYD equipment change to 772
NZ191/192 AKL-ADL equipment changed to A320

Monday
NZ175/175 AKL-PER cancelled

https://www.airnewzealand.com.au/travel-alerts
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Sat Dec 09, 2017 1:26 am

Qantas 789 VH-ZNB to be moved from flightline to Everett Delivery Center overnight

Image

https://twitter.com/mattcawby/status/939301650186956800
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Sat Dec 09, 2017 1:15 pm

qf789 wrote:
Qantas 789 VH-ZNB to be moved from flightline to Everett Delivery Center overnight

Image

https://twitter.com/mattcawby/status/939301650186956800


Appears -ZNB will operate 2 domestic sectors QF0414 MEL-SYD and QF0427 SYD-MEL ahead of the MEL-LAX services commencing on the 15th of Dec 17.
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Sun Dec 10, 2017 1:19 am

Qantas 789 VH-ZNB has been delivered, QF6026 PAE-MEL due to get into MEL around 2130 tonight. VH-ZNB has been named Waltzing Matilda

Image

https://twitter.com/royalscottking/stat ... 5658916864

Image

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/939598034270281728
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Sun Dec 10, 2017 4:36 am

Latest NZ changes

For Monday
As previously reported NZ175/176 AKL-PER is cancelled
NZ103/104 AKL-SYD 772 operates instead of 789

Tuesday
NZ103/104 AKL-SYD 772 operates instead of 789

Wednesday
NZ175/176 AKL-PER is cancelled

https://www.airnewzealand.com.au/travel-alerts
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qantas747
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Sun Dec 10, 2017 5:14 am

So with the coming opening of T2 at ICN. Do you think there may be a significant increase in flights to Australia? I still find it hard to believe there is only 3 daily flights (2 for SYD and 1 or BNE) nothing to MEL

Nothing with QF either, except that long existing codeshare. I would have thought that they could sustain at least a daily flight ex SYD. Although having said that QF still dont have flights to other capitals like TPE, KUL and limited flights outside of SIN/HKG
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Sun Dec 10, 2017 9:13 am

qantas747 wrote:
So with the coming opening of T2 at ICN. Do you think there may be a significant increase in flights to Australia? I still find it hard to believe there is only 3 daily flights (2 for SYD and 1 or BNE) nothing to MEL

Nothing with QF either, except that long existing codeshare. I would have thought that they could sustain at least a daily flight ex SYD. Although having said that QF still dont have flights to other capitals like TPE, KUL and limited flights outside of SIN/HKG


The Korean population is disproportionately centered in Sydney and Brisbane, with other cities such as Melbourne and Perth having relatively small Korean populations. Moreover KE especially, and OZ as well, sell a lot of connections over ICN. I don’t think the market is really there for Qantas who would rely almost exclusively on Australia-Korea O&D
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qantas747
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Sun Dec 10, 2017 11:28 am

RyanairGuru wrote:
qantas747 wrote:
So with the coming opening of T2 at ICN. Do you think there may be a significant increase in flights to Australia? I still find it hard to believe there is only 3 daily flights (2 for SYD and 1 or BNE) nothing to MEL

Nothing with QF either, except that long existing codeshare. I would have thought that they could sustain at least a daily flight ex SYD. Although having said that QF still dont have flights to other capitals like TPE, KUL and limited flights outside of SIN/HKG


The Korean population is disproportionately centered in Sydney and Brisbane, with other cities such as Melbourne and Perth having relatively small Korean populations. Moreover KE especially, and OZ as well, sell a lot of connections over ICN. I don’t think the market is really there for Qantas who would rely almost exclusively on Australia-Korea O&D


Sure the Korean population would form a basis for O/D service, however KE has a very strong connection market to North America; as well as Korea becoming a more desirable travel destination.
-The main bank of flights to the US leave ICN 10-11am, which would require an overnight stop for most Australian flights.

If they were to resume MEL, they could operate it overnight to SEL, and daytime flight back to connect with their main bank of flights and be able to provide further choice for customers while reopening an old market.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:06 am

Air New Zealand is leasing 1 A340 and 1 A330 from Hifly due to the 787 engine problems to cover routes such as AKL-PER and AKL-SYD

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news ... d=11957358
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Qantas16
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2017

Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:26 am

Malaysian Airlines will increase ADL from 4 to 5x weekly between 1st of July to 30th of September 2018. Good news for ADL and shows confidence in their Australian operations (finally!)

Source: https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-08dec17/

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