California Pacific News and Discussion Thread

DL717 · Thu Dec 13, 2018 1:21 pm

hawaiian717 wrote:
DL717 wrote:
And what would be the benefit of pre-check if the flights are pretty much empty?

Not having to take half of your stuff out of your carry on at the security checkpoint. And while CLD might not be that busy, SJC, SMF, RNO, LAS, and DEN are so not being able to go through the PreCheck lanes there would be an extra disincentive for someone to choose California Pacific over another airline.

SJC, SMF, RNO, LAS and DEN have precheck so I don’t see what the issue is. Besides, this airline is dead. It’s just a matter of running out of money at this point.

hawaiian717 · Thu Dec 13, 2018 4:25 pm

DL717 wrote:
SJC, SMF, RNO, LAS and DEN have precheck so I don’t see what the issue is. Besides, this airline is dead. It’s just a matter of running out of money at this point.

If California Pacific doesn't participate in PreCheck, then their passengers won't be able to use the PreCheck lines, even if the passenger has it and can use it when flying Southwest, United, Alaska, etc.

ridgid727 · Thu Dec 13, 2018 5:20 pm

crj900lr wrote:
Ain't gonna happen people, this operation is on life support already. Give it maybe 2 months and then its over. Don't want to see that but how many have tried and failed? Maybe they can get a contract with a major airline and provide service to these cities on a CPA or FFD.

They still have about 18 months left on the EAS contracts over in Denver. Im sure this operation and their charter business is what is keeping them afloat, albeit Vallas is quite quite wealthy and is principal owner in some very exclusive golf resorts around the world. According to another article they have 2 more 145's coming on property soon, and also said they have an E170 coming on in early 2019.

Im a little surprised they didn't find a charter carrier to contract operate their EAS services for those days when they went in operable.

The pilot shortage is apparently a major problem for them, and then of course no interline agreements.

https://www.osidenews.com/2018/11/28/ca ... nd-denver/

Jetsouth · Thu Dec 13, 2018 5:46 pm

Well, billionaire Vallas could still become a millionaire if he keeps going with this airline...

UPlog · Sat Dec 15, 2018 12:58 am

Had a colleague who was jumpseating at SJC and watched their flight board - said he counted 4 passengers!

wedgetail737 · Sat Dec 15, 2018 2:44 am

[list=][/list]

UPlog wrote:
Had a colleague who was jumpseating at SJC and watched their flight board - said he counted 4 passengers!

Recently? That’s not good.

UPlog · Sat Dec 15, 2018 3:51 am

I flew with him yesterday, so believe it was earlier in the week, or maybe end of last week.

janders · Sat Dec 15, 2018 3:56 am

With high seat mile cost of RJ they need 40+ pax to make money, not 4!

Jamake1 · Sat Dec 15, 2018 5:05 am

I wonder if JetSuiteX could succsessfully make a go of CLD-Bay Area service like they have with their CCR-BUR and CCR-LAS service...

wedgetail737 · Sat Dec 15, 2018 9:33 am

Jamake1 wrote:
I wonder if JetSuiteX could succsessfully make a go of CLD-Bay Area service like they have with their CCR-BUR and CCR-LAS service...

It wouldn’t surprise me if that happens when CA Pacific dissolves.

Polot · Sat Dec 15, 2018 2:30 pm

wedgetail737 wrote:
Jamake1 wrote:
I wonder if JetSuiteX could succsessfully make a go of CLD-Bay Area service like they have with their CCR-BUR and CCR-LAS service...

It wouldn’t surprise me if that happens when CA Pacific dissolves.

JetSuiteX tried from CLD a few years ago. I’m not even sure if flights ever even operated before they were cancelled because of the low bookings.

MO11 · Sat Dec 15, 2018 3:01 pm

Polot wrote:
JetSuiteX tried from CLD a few years ago. I’m not even sure if flights ever even operated before they were cancelled because of the low bookings.

Are you confusing this with BizAir Shuttle, which operated CRQ-LAS/LAX between June and August of 2015?

Polot · Sat Dec 15, 2018 3:05 pm

MO11 wrote:
Polot wrote:
JetSuiteX tried from CLD a few years ago. I’m not even sure if flights ever even operated before they were cancelled because of the low bookings.

Are you confusing this with BizAir Shuttle, which operated CRQ-LAS/LAX between June and August of 2015?

Nope. https://www.prnewswire.com/news-release ... 35817.html

AirFiero · Sat Dec 15, 2018 4:18 pm

Polot wrote:
MO11 wrote:
Polot wrote:
JetSuiteX tried from CLD a few years ago. I’m not even sure if flights ever even operated before they were cancelled because of the low bookings.

Are you confusing this with BizAir Shuttle, which operated CRQ-LAS/LAX between June and August of 2015?

Nope. https://www.prnewswire.com/news-release ... 35817.html

With only 4 seats, they have to charge a high price per seat. That limits the market quite a bit.

MO11 · Sat Dec 15, 2018 4:52 pm

Polot wrote:
MO11 wrote:
Polot wrote:
JetSuiteX tried from CLD a few years ago. I’m not even sure if flights ever even operated before they were cancelled because of the low bookings.

Are you confusing this with BizAir Shuttle, which operated CRQ-LAS/LAX between June and August of 2015?

Nope. https://www.prnewswire.com/news-release ... 35817.html

You're right. I checked, it didn't operate. In early 2017 it tried to make it work by tagging CRQ to the proposed SJC-SMO flights, but of course that also never got going.

wedgetail737 · Sat Dec 15, 2018 10:18 pm

AirFiero wrote:
Polot wrote:
MO11 wrote:

Are you confusing this with BizAir Shuttle, which operated CRQ-LAS/LAX between June and August of 2015?

Nope. https://www.prnewswire.com/news-release ... 35817.html

With only 4 seats, they have to charge a high price per seat. That limits the market quite a bit.

I don’t see Contour trying CLD either.

janders · Mon Dec 31, 2018 3:39 pm

More bad news

Mayors of Pierre, Watertown, tell feds California Pacific Airlines delinquent on bills, flights
https://www.capjournal.com/news/mayors- ... 60cd5.html

The mayors of Pierre and Watertown, South Dakota, have implored federal aviation officials to step in and engineer quick fixes to the recent poor performances — financially and flyingwise — by California Pacific Airlines, the communities’ newly branded air carrier. Or let them find another airline.

In a letter dated Dec. 21 and revised Dec. 27, Pierre Mayor Steve Harding and Watertown Mayor Sarah Caron told Joel Szabat, deputy assistant secretary of the U.S. Department of Transportation’s office of aviation and international affairs, that CPA is not paying its bills and is missing a big slice of its flights and is late half the time with the ones that do land.

PlanesNTrains · Mon Dec 31, 2018 3:44 pm

....awkward....wish them the best.

UPlog · Mon Dec 31, 2018 5:46 pm

Losing the EAS flying would pretty much kill the airline imo. Its probably the only consistent revenue they earn and used to subsidize their California dreams. While they also run some charters, I doubt that is a business segment that can generate much dependable income.

Jetsouth · Mon Dec 31, 2018 5:59 pm

Face it, California Pacific Airlines is finished: they have cancelled all their California flights for the foreseeable future, their pilots are leaving them, their planes are constantly in maintenance, they constantly had to cancel or delay flights, they cannot pay their bills, and a busy flight for them was one with over 5 people on it, and their customer reviews are terrible. Another airline dream that has fallen apart.

joeblow10 · Mon Dec 31, 2018 6:23 pm

Sounds like with PIR and ATY wanting out it’s only a matter of time now... sounds like the perfect pickup for OO

LHUSA · Mon Dec 31, 2018 6:27 pm

A bit off topic, but if they were to officially shutter, where would California Pacific rank in terms of shortest amount of time from first flight to shutting down? Have any other airlines closed up shop so quickly?

WALmsp · Mon Dec 31, 2018 6:37 pm

Western Airlines 2 lasted 20 days https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Airlines_(2007)

Gulfstream500 · Mon Dec 31, 2018 6:50 pm

Flights suspended. I wonder if they will actually restart, or if it will be a OneJet scenario.

https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/ ... 42271.html

mga707 · Mon Dec 31, 2018 6:57 pm

LHUSA wrote:
A bit off topic, but if they were to officially shutter, where would California Pacific rank in terms of shortest amount of time from first flight to shutting down? Have any other airlines closed up shop so quickly?

McClain and Pride Air would both came close: Each lasted about 3 1/2 months in actual service, PHX-based McClain in 1986-87 and MSY-based Pride in 1985.

sunking737 · Mon Dec 31, 2018 6:57 pm

I think someone feed old Ted V some hard core drugs. He spent millions to get this airline off the ground only to see it fade away faster then it took to get off the ground.

SANMAN66 · Mon Dec 31, 2018 9:06 pm

Not again!

debonair · Mon Dec 31, 2018 11:28 pm

mga707 wrote:
McClain and Pride Air would both came close: Each lasted about 3 1/2 months in actual service, PHX-based McClain in 1986-87 and MSY-based Pride in 1985.

Don't forget ROOTS AIR, from March to May 2001. :tombstone:

Gulfstream500 wrote:
Flights suspended. I wonder if they will actually restart, or if it will be a OneJet scenario.

https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/ ... 42271.html

That's NOT true! Regarding their official press release:

We have temporarily suspended our Carlsbad flights and ticket sales due to impact from the nationwide pilot shortage.

So it does only affect Carlsbad in the moment, but NOT the other PSO routes from Denver. So, there is no need for a restart as the airline is still active...

LAXintl · Tue Jan 01, 2019 4:15 am

Operation sounds like being run by clowns.

ADI has being around since 1959 and now in a matter of months since its acquisition is on the verge of collapse.

wedgetail737 · Tue Jan 01, 2019 5:41 am

mga707 wrote:
LHUSA wrote:
A bit off topic, but if they were to officially shutter, where would California Pacific rank in terms of shortest amount of time from first flight to shutting down? Have any other airlines closed up shop so quickly?

McClain and Pride Air would both came close: Each lasted about 3 1/2 months in actual service, PHX-based McClain in 1986-87 and MSY-based Pride in 1985.

What about People Express 2?

hawaiian717 · Tue Jan 01, 2019 6:00 am

wedgetail737 wrote:
What about People Express 2?

June 30 to September 26, 2014, so they made it almost three months.

mtnwest1979 · Tue Jan 01, 2019 6:19 am

Saw their AM arrival at DEN 12/20, and counted near 35 pax getting off. Figured since just prior to Christmas, it should be about full. At least it was operating.
As for short time operator, was an outfit in Florida in mid 80s ( Southern Express or something) that started up and shut down after one day.

KLMatSJC · Tue Jan 01, 2019 6:25 am

wedgetail737 wrote:
UPlog wrote:
Had a colleague who was jumpseating at SJC and watched their flight board - said he counted 4 passengers!

Recently? That’s not good.

I flew 6 flights with them around 2 weeks ago as media flights: SJC-CLD-RNO-CLD-AZA-CLD-SJC. My 6 flights had a combined total of 44 passengers, including me. That's an average LF of 14.7% (12.7% without me). Everyone who was on the flights that I talked to was absolutely raving about how amazing the airline is. However, it is purely an consumer education problem. You are seeing many other secondary airports struggle to maintain expanded service, even though the market can fully afford it. Flyers blindly go to the larger airports because they know about the service there without looking at their smaller, local airports.

usxguy · Tue Jan 01, 2019 6:37 am

Payroll delayed, again.

UPlog · Tue Jan 01, 2019 6:44 pm

LAXintl wrote:
Operation sounds like being run by clowns.

ADI has being around since 1959 and now in a matter of months since its acquisition is on the verge of collapse.

Indeed pretty amazing how the new management and their plans have managed to virtually kill the airline in a matter of weeks!

usxguy · Tue Jan 01, 2019 6:57 pm

You just don't buy an airline and let it be. ADI had a lot of skeletons in the closet, and everyone was aware of them. ADI needed some TLC and cash injection to make the Cal Pac plan to work.

They should have started out like go! did, with shuttle service to some of these markets to compete with WN/UA/AS/AA for the intra-California business. You aren't going to be taken seriously (think Allegiant) by the business traveler if you don't offer something tangible. And the high frequency WN/AS flights SAN/SNA-> SJC, SMF, you just can't compete with 2 flights a day, you need 3 or 4. Even JetSuiteX knows this and offers some good frequency on the peak days.

reality · Tue Jan 01, 2019 7:17 pm

Yes, JetSuiteX seems to be doing a much better job--from the way their planes look and are configured, to their advertising, to their website--gives a much better impression than CA Pacific right off the bat. Maybe they should start flying to Carlsbad now from SJC, OAK, etc.

FlyingElvii · Tue Jan 01, 2019 8:00 pm

mga707 wrote:
LHUSA wrote:
A bit off topic, but if they were to officially shutter, where would California Pacific rank in terms of shortest amount of time from first flight to shutting down? Have any other airlines closed up shop so quickly?

McClain and Pride Air would both came close: Each lasted about 3 1/2 months in actual service, PHX-based McClain in 1986-87 and MSY-based Pride in 1985.

McClain...
I have not heard that name in a LONG time.

blooc350 · Tue Jan 01, 2019 8:46 pm

reality wrote:
Yes, JetSuiteX seems to be doing a much better job--from the way their planes look and are configured, to their advertising, to their website--gives a much better impression than CA Pacific right off the bat. Maybe they should start flying to Carlsbad now from SJC, OAK, etc.

Correct me if I'm wrong but i dont think JetSuiteX flies out of SJC. For the longest time they had their own private terminal at Atlantic Aviation (FBO) but I havent seen any of their planes their for months...........

Gulfstream500 · Tue Jan 01, 2019 9:25 pm

They had a perfectly good airline - but they messed it up by growing too fast. That's probably the biggest mistake that airlines make (People Express II, OneJet, SkyBus)

AirFiero · Tue Jan 01, 2019 11:07 pm

blooc350 wrote:
reality wrote:
Yes, JetSuiteX seems to be doing a much better job--from the way their planes look and are configured, to their advertising, to their website--gives a much better impression than CA Pacific right off the bat. Maybe they should start flying to Carlsbad now from SJC, OAK, etc.

Correct me if I'm wrong but i dont think JetSuiteX flies out of SJC. For the longest time they had their own private terminal at Atlantic Aviation (FBO) but I havent seen any of their planes their for months...........

Aren't they flying SJC-BUR?

Nope, just checked their website. I thought someone is doing SJC to the LA area.

Chemist · Wed Jan 02, 2019 1:17 am

JetSuiteX I believe did BUR-SJC a year or two ago. I flew BURSJC frequenly on WN and would see their posters for the same route. Never tried them.

wedgetail737 · Wed Jan 02, 2019 2:47 am

hawaiian717 wrote:
wedgetail737 wrote:
What about People Express 2?

June 30 to September 26, 2014, so they made it almost three months.

Longer than I thought.

32andBelow · Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:32 am

KLMatSJC wrote:
wedgetail737 wrote:
UPlog wrote:
Had a colleague who was jumpseating at SJC and watched their flight board - said he counted 4 passengers!

Recently? That’s not good.

I flew 6 flights with them around 2 weeks ago as media flights: SJC-CLD-RNO-CLD-AZA-CLD-SJC. My 6 flights had a combined total of 44 passengers, including me. That's an average LF of 14.7% (12.7% without me). Everyone who was on the flights that I talked to was absolutely raving about how amazing the airline is. However, it is purely an consumer education problem. You are seeing many other secondary airports struggle to maintain expanded service, even though the market can fully afford it. Flyers blindly go to the larger airports because they know about the service there without looking at their smaller, local airports.

unless you are fulling integrated codeshare partner operersting as XX major then you have no chance these days.

knope2001 · Wed Jan 02, 2019 12:45 pm

mtnwest1979 wrote:
Saw their AM arrival at DEN 12/20, and counted near 35 pax getting off. Figured since just prior to Christmas, it should be about full.

Actually that EAS route from Watertown and Pierre have done well...they've averaged about 73% full in and out of Denver, with Watertown performing particularly well. I fear that the recent operational problems will send people back to the highways even if they stay afloat.

N766UA · Wed Jan 02, 2019 2:43 pm

usxguy wrote:
Payroll delayed, again.

No no, it’s a *pilot shortage.*

slider · Wed Jan 02, 2019 4:24 pm

Adios...

Gosh, if only someone would have warned them...oh wait, I did. Time for this dopey scheme to go away. Vallas is a little lighter in the pocketbook for his hubris.

Planeboy17 · Wed Jan 02, 2019 5:23 pm

slider wrote:
Adios...

Gosh, if only someone would have warned them...oh wait, I did. Time for this dopey scheme to go away. Vallas is a little lighter in the pocketbook for his hubris.

No hubris in your statement either. :boggled:

amcnd · Wed Jan 02, 2019 5:46 pm

They can’t offer pay/flow through to the majors like the regionals are right now. They will struggle big time with pilot recruiting/retention..

Slug71 · Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:37 pm

The first problem is in the name.
California is not business friendly at all. It was a recipe for disaster from the beginning.

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