Ukraine International will introduce B777 in 2018 and expend network

SR380 · Thu Oct 12, 2017 5:13 pm

"Ukraine International Airlines (UIA) has announced plans to start adding Boeing 777 widebodies to its fleet next year. Four such aircraft, equipped with an on-board entertainment system, will replace the Boeing 767s the carrier currently operates, UIA co-owner Aron Mayberg told local publication LIGA.net.

Ukraine’s largest carrier will start phasing out its Boeing 767s in 2019. It has four of the type, each equipped with 261 seats. The 777s can seat more, meaning the airline is obviously aiming to expand its long-haul capacity. Once the new aircraft have entered commercial service, UIA says it will expand its long-haul network, possibly by launching flights to Shanghai and Toronto."

https://www.rusaviainsider.com/ukraine- ... eet-plans/

ikolkyo · Thu Oct 12, 2017 5:28 pm

Interesting, going to be a huge gap between the -900ER and the 77E in their fleet.

SR380 · Thu Oct 12, 2017 5:31 pm

ikolkyo wrote:
Interesting, going to be a huge gap between the -900ER and the 77E in their fleet.

Yeah, but such an improvement from the 767

ahj2000 · Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:22 pm

Will frequencies go down to their current destinations as a result of this?
Even with high capacity 767s that is a huge jump in capaz.

Phosphorus · Fri Oct 13, 2017 7:20 am

ahj2000 wrote:
Will frequencies go down to their current destinations as a result of this?
Even with high capacity 767s that is a huge jump in capaz.

At least in the beginning, 77E will be obviously deployed on the most popular routes.
Anecdotal evidence: KBP-PEK flight is often full to the gills.

MalevTU134 · Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:06 am

I don't have the time right now to look for it, but in another thread a few months ago, it was said that the 767s would stay and the 777s would come in as additional lift, not as a replacement. What happened to that?

cedarjet · Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:15 am

In the latest round of High Density vs You, high density wins again, their 767-300ERs are 2-4-2 seating which is UNBELIEVABLY tight. No prizes for guessing the configuration of the 777s. And yes I fully expect YYZ, Aerosvit used to, half of Canada has Ukrainian ancestry.

As an aside, PS is a pretty bad airline, I love Ukraine and I’m predisposed to be a fan but their website is appalling, almost no functionality, you think it has Manage My Booking and Add Bags because the tabs are there but click through and it’s an exhaustive form (date of travel, ticket number, flight number, first name, last name etc) you have to submit and that’s the end of the matter, you’ll never hear back again. And none of the phone numbers answer, just ring and cut off. From that to the seating, the whole thing reeks of couldn’t care less. Good luck, we’re all counting on you.

Phosphorus · Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:39 am

cedarjet wrote:
In the latest round of High Density vs You, high density wins again, their 767-300ERs are 2-4-2 seating which is UNBELIEVABLY tight. No prizes for guessing the configuration of the 777s. And yes I fully expect YYZ, Aerosvit used to, half of Canada has Ukrainian ancestry.

As an aside, PS is a pretty bad airline, I love Ukraine and I’m predisposed to be a fan but their website is appalling, almost no functionality, you think it has Manage My Booking and Add Bags because the tabs are there but click through and it’s an exhaustive form (date of travel, ticket number, flight number, first name, last name etc) you have to submit and that’s the end of the matter, you’ll never hear back again. And none of the phone numbers answer, just ring and cut off. From that to the seating, the whole thing reeks of couldn’t care less. Good luck, we’re all counting on you.

Have to agree on all points. 10-across is actually already circulating as a confirmed configuration.

PS has come a long way downward from being a Swissair proxy in the East to its current state. It survived in the conditions it exists, sure. But an airline I used to love, and went out of my way to fly, is unfortunately a completely different animal these days.

Egerton · Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:46 am

Looks like another likely candidate to add to my list of those cursed by the 'cheap' 777-300, to join Kenyan and Indonesian.

B747forever · Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:52 am

Now that they will be able to reach the West coast I wonder if they have LAX/SFO in the cards.

FLJ · Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:34 pm

Any idea where the 777s will come from? There are a bunch of second hand 77Es on the market, some aren't even that old.

na · Fri Oct 13, 2017 3:25 pm

FLJ wrote:
Any idea where the 777s will come from? There are a bunch of second hand 77Es on the market, some aren't even that old.

There are many 77Es parked around the world, though most face or undergo parting-out and scrap. However, among those parked there are more than a dozen frames younger than 15 years which surely have a good chance to serve on somewhere else.
There is a quartet of fairly-used (ca. 12 years old) ex-Vietam 77Es which were retired earlier this year. Those should have a good chance and its exactly the right number. Another likely source: SQ, or some of the youngest frames SV is currently retiring. Kenya Airways is forced to shrink, have already parked a 777 and are another possibility.

na · Fri Oct 13, 2017 3:48 pm

Here is a list of 777s currently offered for lease or sale (including scrap). Please note that it isnt necessarily kept to date as several frames on the list are being dismantled already.
http://www.myairlease.com/available/fleetintel_777

Newbiepilot · Fri Oct 13, 2017 3:52 pm

cedarjet wrote:
In the latest round of High Density vs You, high density wins again, their 767-300ERs are 2-4-2 seating which is UNBELIEVABLY tight. No prizes for guessing the configuration of the 777s. And yes I fully expect YYZ, Aerosvit used to, half of Canada has Ukrainian ancestry.

As an aside, PS is a pretty bad airline, I love Ukraine and I’m predisposed to be a fan but their website is appalling, almost no functionality, you think it has Manage My Booking and Add Bags because the tabs are there but click through and it’s an exhaustive form (date of travel, ticket number, flight number, first name, last name etc) you have to submit and that’s the end of the matter, you’ll never hear back again. And none of the phone numbers answer, just ring and cut off. From that to the seating, the whole thing reeks of couldn’t care less. Good luck, we’re all counting on you.

10 abreast 777s will be an upgrade from the 767s! Their fares for connecting flights to Europe are incredibly cheap even if they involve long connections in Kiev.

Phosphorus · Fri Oct 13, 2017 7:30 pm

na wrote:
Here is a list of 777s currently offered for lease or sale (including scrap). Please note that it isnt necessarily kept to date as several frames on the list are being dismantled already.
http://www.myairlease.com/available/fleetintel_777

Thanks for this resource. However, it does look like the deal (for at least the first few frames) has already been struck, and the frames, destined for PS, might have already disappeared from "available" category.

solracfunk14 · Fri Oct 13, 2017 11:38 pm

They filled the booking system with the Boeing 777 to Beijing and New York JFK

"@Airlineroute
Ukraine International Airlines' Boeing 777 aircraft to serve New York JFK from 25MAR18, Beijing from 01MAY18. Economy Class 3-4-3 layout"

Seat map displaying C21Y319

https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 8239365123

solracfunk14 · Sat Oct 14, 2017 2:56 am

They filled the booking system with the Boeing 777 to Beijing and New York JFK

"@Airlineroute
Ukraine International Airlines' Boeing 777 aircraft to serve New York JFK from 25MAR18, Beijing from 01MAY18. Economy Class 3-4-3 layout"

Seat map displaying C21Y319

https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 8239365123

717atOGG · Sat Oct 14, 2017 3:47 am

solracfunk14 wrote:
They filled the booking system with the Boeing 777 to Beijing and New York JFK

"@Airlineroute
Ukraine International Airlines' Boeing 777 aircraft to serve New York JFK from 25MAR18, Beijing from 01MAY18. Economy Class 3-4-3 layout"

Seat map displaying C21Y319

https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status ... 8239365123

Anyone know if they'll have IFE or lie-flats in J? I saw a trip report on Ukraine International from KBP to JFK and even in J class it's a pathetic hard and soft product, with old recliner seats and the flight map projected on the bulkhead. They do have a monopoly on their routes, though, so I don't know if they have much incentive to upgrade their product. I'm sure their customers will appreciate there not being 2-4-2 in Y anymore.

ba319-131 · Sat Oct 14, 2017 4:15 am

ikolkyo wrote:
Interesting, going to be a huge gap between the -900ER and the 77E in their fleet.

Yeah, but such an improvement from the 767

- where is the improvement?

OA940 · Sat Oct 14, 2017 7:57 am

It better have IFE and A BUSINESS CLASS INSTEAD OF PREMIUM ECONOMY

yochai · Sat Oct 14, 2017 10:36 am

TLV will also be a 777 destination effective 25MAR18, daily on the late evening PS777/8 service

aemoreira1981 · Sat Oct 14, 2017 10:56 am

yochai wrote:
TLV will also be a 777 destination effective 25MAR18, daily on the late evening PS777/8 service

Given that this is often a cheap one-stop journey to TLV from JFK over the nonstops from the area, this should be marketed as a same-plane service from JFK. The Y class is often full, hence why the need for more capacity.

LA704 · Sun Oct 15, 2017 10:23 am

ba319-131 wrote:
ikolkyo wrote:
Interesting, going to be a huge gap between the -900ER and the 77E in their fleet.

Yeah, but such an improvement from the 767

- where is the improvement?

Improvement in CASM, more capacity, much lower cabin noise, 3-4-3 in a 777 is more comfy than 2-4-2 in a 767, mainetnance cost....

na · Sun Oct 15, 2017 10:56 am

Phosphorus wrote:
na wrote:
Here is a list of 777s currently offered for lease or sale (including scrap). Please note that it isnt necessarily kept to date as several frames on the list are being dismantled already.
http://www.myairlease.com/available/fleetintel_777

Thanks for this resource. However, it does look like the deal (for at least the first few frames) has already been struck, and the frames, destined for PS, might have already disappeared from "available" category.

As I said, this list isnt 100% accurate as there are also planes on it which are in the process of scrapping. So the planes for Ukraine might still be on it.
Btw, russian carrier Vim Air is retiring two 77Es these days after just operating them 6 months.

na · Sun Oct 15, 2017 10:57 am

na wrote:
Phosphorus wrote:
na wrote:
Here is a list of 777s currently offered for lease or sale (including scrap). Please note that it isnt necessarily kept to date as several frames on the list are being dismantled already.
http://www.myairlease.com/available/fleetintel_777

Thanks for this resource. However, it does look like the deal (for at least the first few frames) has already been struck, and the frames, destined for PS, might have already disappeared from "available" category.

As I said, this list isnt 100% accurate as there are also planes on it which are in the process of scrapping. So the planes for Ukraine might still be on it.
Btw, russian carrier Vim Air is retiring three 77Es these days after just operating them 6 months.

JAAlbert · Sun Oct 15, 2017 2:48 pm

LA704 wrote:

Improvement in CASM, more capacity, much lower cabin noise, 3-4-3 in a 777 is more comfy than 2-4-2 in a 767, mainetnance cost....

The 777 has lower cabin noise than the 767? I've never considered this, but my recollection is that the 777 has a noisy cabin, especially behind the wings.

ikolkyo · Sun Oct 15, 2017 3:10 pm

JAAlbert wrote:
LA704 wrote:

Improvement in CASM, more capacity, much lower cabin noise, 3-4-3 in a 777 is more comfy than 2-4-2 in a 767, mainetnance cost....

The 777 has lower cabin noise than the 767? I've never considered this, but my recollection is that the 777 has a noisy cabin, especially behind the wings.

Behind the wing is fine for me, I didn’t have an issue on the 2 flights I had about a month ago

Zachbt · Sun Oct 15, 2017 6:58 pm

Apparently the aircraft are coming from air India, the link below is in Dutch but google can translate.

https://www.aviationinfo.nl/nieuws/11-l ... -air-india

MAH4546 · Sun Oct 15, 2017 7:18 pm

B747forever wrote:
Now that they will be able to reach the West coast I wonder if they have LAX/SFO in the cards.

That will be an absolute disaster.

Toronto is a no brainer to expand in North America and maybe a weekly or two to South Florida, but I don’t see anything else. Long-haul expansion will undoubtedly be focused on Asia.

Marik154 · Sun Oct 22, 2017 2:10 pm

Just read on one of Ukrainian aviation forums about the 777 arriving to PS. They are due to come on 15th of January 2018, x4 frames: x1 2002 built UR-GOA, x3 2005 built UR-GOB/C/D.

Regards,
Marko

Slash787 · Sun Oct 22, 2017 4:40 pm

Din't they have some 787's on orders?

Slash787 · Sun Oct 22, 2017 4:46 pm

Zachbt wrote:
Apparently the aircraft are coming from air India, the link below is in Dutch but google can translate.

https://www.aviationinfo.nl/nieuws/11-l ... -air-india

Air India retired them in 2011 and sold or leased them to Omni Air

Marik154 · Sun Oct 22, 2017 5:07 pm

Slash787 wrote:
Din't they have some 787's on orders?

Nope, PS never had any 787 on order.

The link also previously mentioned that one of the frames will be VP-BHB ex-Orenair stored currently at AMS.

TheLion · Sun Oct 22, 2017 6:39 pm

Look forward to seeing the 772 in PS colours. In fact, it may even be a new livery, as was alluded to on here a while back in a quote from one of their execs...

CHI2DFW · Sun Oct 22, 2017 8:12 pm

T7 is a lot of plane for KBP to the US. A 788 would be good for LAX, MIA, and ORD. JFK possibly a 789.

Don’t see any other US cities that could support KBP flights, but I’m sure the local fan clubs will chime in!

anrec80 · Sun Oct 22, 2017 10:01 pm

yochai wrote:
TLV will also be a 777 destination effective 25MAR18, daily on the late evening PS777/8 service

I think they should have a proper W on their routes, but full J - there is simply no paying demand in Ukrainian market for that. Most of it lowest yield VFR traffic. For this same reason DL stopped KBP in 2008-2009 - no J demand. But 3-4-3 77E is a nice upgrade to their 2-4-2 763. Never imagined saying this.

B747forever · Sun Oct 22, 2017 10:34 pm

Anyone know how UIA is doing financially?

jubguy3 · Sun Oct 22, 2017 10:57 pm

Egerton wrote:
Looks like another likely candidate to add to my list of those cursed by the 'cheap' 777-300, to join Kenyan and Indonesian.

What do you mean by this?

bmibaby737 · Mon Oct 23, 2017 2:46 pm

Zachbt wrote:
Apparently the aircraft are coming from air India, the link below is in Dutch but google can translate.

https://www.aviationinfo.nl/nieuws/11-l ... -air-india

Cannot be true since Air India don't have any 777-200ER available. Anyways, the first aircraft has been painted in Ukraine livery and is ex-Asiana:

https://www.planespotters.net/airframe/ ... s/aWKbhY2n

SonOfABeech · Mon Oct 23, 2017 3:07 pm

CHI2DFW wrote:
T7 is a lot of plane for KBP to the US. A 788 would be good for LAX, MIA, and ORD. JFK possibly a 789.

Don’t see any other US cities that could support KBP flights, but I’m sure the local fan clubs will chime in!

Guess they prefer the lower capital commitment of second-hand 77Es.

continental004 · Mon Oct 23, 2017 3:29 pm

KBP-LAX isn’t that far fetched. Large population of Ukrainians here in SoCal and SU already runs 777s to LAX

UAPS · Mon Oct 23, 2017 4:16 pm

So s pochinom (lets start)
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... =3&theater
very first photo of PS B777 with a new livery
LAX/HKG pls wait for UIA

BREECH · Mon Oct 23, 2017 4:32 pm

SR380 wrote:
"Ukraine International Airlines (UIA) has announced plans to start adding Boeing 777 widebodies to its fleet next year. Four such aircraft, equipped with an on-board entertainment system, will replace the Boeing 767s the carrier currently operates, UIA co-owner Aron Mayberg told local publication LIGA.net.

Ukraine’s largest carrier will start phasing out its Boeing 767s in 2019. It has four of the type, each equipped with 261 seats. The 777s can seat more, meaning the airline is obviously aiming to expand its long-haul capacity. Once the new aircraft have entered commercial service, UIA says it will expand its long-haul network, possibly by launching flights to Shanghai and Toronto."

https://www.rusaviainsider.com/ukraine- ... eet-plans/

Okay, let's see.

One, the link doesn't open. If it "announced it", why not do it on their own website instead of some "insider".

Two, I seriously doubt UIA has any chance of expanding their operations. Yes, Canada is rich in Ukraine blood but those people don't have relatives back home to go visit. Once one member immigrates, the whole family follows.

Three, the company belongs to some local oligarch who was a huge collateral damage in the recent political events. He had all his assets taken away from him, so I doubt he has money to buy new airliners.

Four, on the Boeing website, there is nothing on UIA page.
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/custom ... -airlines/

Five, going to Shanghai would require going over most of Russia. Swiss Air now flies around Russia because they can't prolong the overfly contract. Think it'll be easier for Ukraine considering their enormous love for each other?

Six, FAKE NEWS. (c) The Donald

UAPS · Mon Oct 23, 2017 4:46 pm

photo of PS 777 is already in FB - is it still fake news?
ok, as an insider would like to confirm that its real photo and real news
and also -pvg willnt happend during 2018

Cunard · Tue Oct 24, 2017 3:57 am

Let's see what the poster BREECH has to say over the photo which clearly shows a Boeing 772 in full Ukraine International colours, his post is weird to say the least and I get so much satisfaction when someone gets proven wrong when photo evidence proves otherwise.

SR380 · Tue Oct 24, 2017 9:15 am

BREECH wrote:
SR380 wrote:
"Ukraine International Airlines (UIA) has announced plans to start adding Boeing 777 widebodies to its fleet next year. Four such aircraft, equipped with an on-board entertainment system, will replace the Boeing 767s the carrier currently operates, UIA co-owner Aron Mayberg told local publication LIGA.net.

Ukraine’s largest carrier will start phasing out its Boeing 767s in 2019. It has four of the type, each equipped with 261 seats. The 777s can seat more, meaning the airline is obviously aiming to expand its long-haul capacity. Once the new aircraft have entered commercial service, UIA says it will expand its long-haul network, possibly by launching flights to Shanghai and Toronto."

https://www.rusaviainsider.com/ukraine- ... eet-plans/

Okay, let's see.

One, the link doesn't open. If it "announced it", why not do it on their own website instead of some "insider".

Two, I seriously doubt UIA has any chance of expanding their operations. Yes, Canada is rich in Ukraine blood but those people don't have relatives back home to go visit. Once one member immigrates, the whole family follows.

Three, the company belongs to some local oligarch who was a huge collateral damage in the recent political events. He had all his assets taken away from him, so I doubt he has money to buy new airliners.

Four, on the Boeing website, there is nothing on UIA page.
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/custom ... -airlines/

Five, going to Shanghai would require going over most of Russia. Swiss Air now flies around Russia because they can't prolong the overfly contract. Think it'll be easier for Ukraine considering their enormous love for each other?

Six, FAKE NEWS. (c) The Donald

Sorry Donald but Swiss flights do overfly Russia, aka today’s flight from Tokyo (and all the others by the way).

I won’t comment on the financial situation of PS as I don’t have any info, but how can you say that Ukrainian of blood are not flying back home? Do you claim that on alternatives facts?

Without to mention te previous picture posted thanks anyway! ;-)

eamondzhang · Tue Oct 24, 2017 10:33 pm

Looks like the first PS 777 will come from OZ....

Per Skyliner:
Boeing 777 -28E 28681 322 UR-GOA Ukraine International at TPE 23oct17 in full cs, HL-reg prior delivery ex HL7596

Michael

Cunard · Wed Oct 25, 2017 5:49 am

eamondzhang wrote:
Looks like the first PS 777 will come from OZ....

Per Skyliner:
Boeing 777 -28E 28681 322 UR-GOA Ukraine International at TPE 23oct17 in full cs, HL-reg prior delivery ex HL7596

Michael

Michael you should always read previous posts so your up to date before posting yourself as this information has already been discussed and a photo already uploaded of the first of the former OZ Boeing 777 in full Ukraine International colours.

Freshside3 · Wed Oct 25, 2017 10:18 am

continental004 wrote:
KBP-LAX isn’t that far fetched. Large population of Ukrainians here in SoCal and SU already runs 777s to LAX

SFO is not that far-fetched, either. Especially with lots of people th

PlymSpotter · Wed Oct 25, 2017 11:05 am

Capacity jump will be 79 seats, based on the 340 pax configuration which has been mentioned in this thread. They'll have little issue filling the rear seats, the real challenge will be the jump from 14 to 21 premium seats.

CHI2DFW wrote:
T7 is a lot of plane for KBP to the US. A 788 would be good for LAX, MIA, and ORD. JFK possibly a 789.

Don’t see any other US cities that could support KBP flights, but I’m sure the local fan clubs will chime in!

The lease rates will more than compensate here for any perceived overcapacity. PS carries significant transfer traffic onto Central Asia and Israel, they'll have no issue tapping this market.

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