kaitak
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Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 1:51 am

Good morning folks and welcome to our September thread!

Here's a link to the last thread - viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1369971&start=150.

Of course, there's one item of fantastic news which pretty much instantly put everything else in the shade. The Cathay route, as another poster pointed out in the last thread, is the biggest coup for DUB since Emirates, a few years back. It's a big confidence booster. Cathay is one of Asia's "big hitters" and HKG is one of the biggest hubs in Asia; having CX market Ireland through its vast network (which also includes its Cathay Dragon subsidiary - the former Dragonair - and its access to China) is of massive value to the Irish economy. All credit to the DAA; given CX's poor financial results recently, the fact that the big ME3 are flying to DUB and the fact that DUB's runway is relatively short, I was very surprised (pleasantly!) at the announcement. Let's hope it grows and grows!

Of course, there have been other news items:
- AY, DY, KL and FR increasing services and/or capacity
- New EI t/a increases
- FR announcing slight delay to EI and DY interlining
- EI experiencing some issues with aircraft damage, which required some t/a lease ins
- MIA service starting today
- QR hoping to add second daily service

So, as we head into September, let's see if we can have some more good news before year end ...

Enjoy!
 
nu
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 3:48 am

Cx best news ever. I love Qatar but the flight is too short for a good night's sleep..I,prefer their business class to QR (marginally) and the new business class trials they are having is a step up again. And of course there is now an excellent premium economy option out of Dublin. It will be interesting where they pitch pricing though.
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 8:34 am

EI - DUO will have the honor of the inaugural MIA route today. J is full but of course as with all these things press/trade and AV Geeks on AVIOS might be a large portion of that. I know a few who are on todays flight and hopefully there will be a good send off for them. :)
 
Eirules
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 8:48 am

I was just thinking following yesterday's CX announcement. A few years ago, oneworld flyers at DUB essentially only had BA to LHR, IB to Madrid and a token seasonal service from AA to ORD. By next summer, we'll have year round AA to PHL & 3 seasonal routes, BA to both LHR & LCY, QR to DOH, CX to HKG, AY more than daily to HEL on top of the IB service. When (if) EI finally rejoin oneworld, that'll be an enormous increase. 7 airlines to more than 100 airports (albeit some seasonally). Excellent work from the DAA
The way you cut your meat reflects the way you live....
 
alancostello
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 9:26 am

Eirules wrote:
I was just thinking following yesterday's CX announcement. A few years ago, oneworld flyers at DUB essentially only had BA to LHR, IB to Madrid and a token seasonal service from AA to ORD. By next summer, we'll have year round AA to PHL & 3 seasonal routes, BA to both LHR & LCY, QR to DOH, CX to HKG, AY more than daily to HEL on top of the IB service. When (if) EI finally rejoin oneworld, that'll be an enormous increase. 7 airlines to more than 100 airports (albeit some seasonally). Excellent work from the DAA


Don't forget the BA seasonal to Ibiza and S7 seasonal to Moscow!
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 9:43 am

Eirules wrote:
I was just thinking following yesterday's CX announcement. A few years ago, oneworld flyers at DUB essentially only had BA to LHR, IB to Madrid and a token seasonal service from AA to ORD. By next summer, we'll have year round AA to PHL & 3 seasonal routes, BA to both LHR & LCY, QR to DOH, CX to HKG, AY more than daily to HEL on top of the IB service. When (if) EI finally rejoin oneworld, that'll be an enormous increase. 7 airlines to more than 100 airports (albeit some seasonally). Excellent work from the DAA


Indeed the tables will have turned in terms of Alliance superiority at DUB. Also myself and a few others who have Emerald OW status have been discussing the need to up the game in terms of lounge offerings at DUB. When you look across to LHR and see the catering that is on offer then it might be time to look at one of the OW carriers opening a lounge shared by other OW members or indeed upgrading the catering at the DAA ones. I doubt we will see changes to EI lounge or opening a second one until well after OW entry.
 
Eirules
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:29 am

OA260 wrote:
Eirules wrote:
I was just thinking following yesterday's CX announcement. A few years ago, oneworld flyers at DUB essentially only had BA to LHR, IB to Madrid and a token seasonal service from AA to ORD. By next summer, we'll have year round AA to PHL & 3 seasonal routes, BA to both LHR & LCY, QR to DOH, CX to HKG, AY more than daily to HEL on top of the IB service. When (if) EI finally rejoin oneworld, that'll be an enormous increase. 7 airlines to more than 100 airports (albeit some seasonally). Excellent work from the DAA


Indeed the tables will have turned in terms of Alliance superiority at DUB. Also myself and a few others who have Emerald OW status have been discussing the need to up the game in terms of lounge offerings at DUB. When you look across to LHR and see the catering that is on offer then it might be time to look at one of the OW carriers opening a lounge shared by other OW members or indeed upgrading the catering at the DAA ones. I doubt we will see changes to EI lounge or opening a second one until well after OW entry.


Yeah I completely agree. The DAA lounge isn't great at all and I like it even less after the recent work they've done. That said, the EI lounge in T2 isn't great compared to the BA lounge in LHR T5, especially the food offering. I wouldn't rule out EI putting another lounge in T1 though
The way you cut your meat reflects the way you live....
 
BrianDromey
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 11:15 am

CX to HKG is excellent news. I would have no doubt that CX will increase frequency in the event that the flight is a success. MAN is a relatively recent addition for them, launched at 3-4 weekly (I can't recall exactly) and now daily, with suggestion that this will increase further.

A direct route to Asia is brilliant for the country and more options to overfly the hubs is brilliant. Hopefully it will be good for inbound tourism too. What are the Visa for Chinese nationals wishing to holiday in Ireland?
OA260 wrote:
Eirules wrote:
I was just thinking following yesterday's CX announcement. A few years ago, oneworld flyers at DUB essentially only had BA to LHR, IB to Madrid and a token seasonal service from AA to ORD. By next summer, we'll have year round AA to PHL & 3 seasonal routes, BA to both LHR & LCY, QR to DOH, CX to HKG, AY more than daily to HEL on top of the IB service. When (if) EI finally rejoin oneworld, that'll be an enormous increase. 7 airlines to more than 100 airports (albeit some seasonally). Excellent work from the DAA


Indeed the tables will have turned in terms of Alliance superiority at DUB. Also myself and a few others who have Emerald OW status have been discussing the need to up the game in terms of lounge offerings at DUB. When you look across to LHR and see the catering that is on offer then it might be time to look at one of the OW carriers opening a lounge shared by other OW members or indeed upgrading the catering at the DAA ones. I doubt we will see changes to EI lounge or opening a second one until well after OW entry.


A one world branded lounge doesn't seem impossible, but I would have thought the most likely candidate for a branded lounge would be BA. Is there any room in T1 for one? Whats in the old GC lounge in the B pier?
Next flights: MAN-ILD, BCN-LHR-CPT, CPT-LHR-MAN, MAN-ORK-KEF, KEF-ORK-MAN.
 
worldranger
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 11:22 am

Any performance issues with full load on CX 350 out of DUB on wet runway?
 
BestWestern
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 11:51 am

When I was thinking of a CX comparison to historical route launches, I thought of Continentals EWR launch, which was a major announcement at the time.

Emirates had followed Etihad and Gulf Air into the market, so wasn't as big.

Living in HK, I can't wait for the launch. I've flown QR a lot recently - including to Dublin, and I'm also looking forward to a good nights sleep on what is an excellent J Class on the 350.

I Flew short haul A350 Premium Y on Cathay yesterday - again a great hard product. (Upgraded thanks to a CX gold card)

Hopefully Cathay succeeds in Dublin. Read somewhere earlier (CAPA) that 400k Pax fly From Dublin to HKG annuallly. With 4K paddies in the city and perhaps another 1k in Shenzhen, the route will have a strong following I hope.

Congrats to the DAA route team. No doubt they have met CX on numerous occasions.
Greetings from Hong Kong.... a subsidiary of China Inc.
 
dstc47
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 11:59 am

New head of the DAA announced, with a retail background. So unlikely to be fewer shops then.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/tra ... -1.3205053
 
MapleLeaf789
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 12:51 pm

Hello,

I've been following this site for years but am only getting putting my enthusiasm/thoughts to writing now.

The future is very bright for Dublin. The trinity of IAG, Dublin infrastructure investment and Brexit are all a plus for Dublin (and EI).

I read recently that several major investment banks have chosen Dublin as their European headquarters in anticipation of Brexit (others are going to Frankfurt). This will be a big surge in business/premium product for Dublin.

As well, once IAG seriously invests in EI and Dublin I think we will see Dublin grow to a confident hub competitor in Europe - both for low cost and premium traffic.

I enjoy this site tremendously. Look forward to contributing further :-)
 
Eirules
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 3:02 pm

MapleLeaf789 wrote:
Hello,

I've been following this site for years but am only getting putting my enthusiasm/thoughts to writing now.

The future is very bright for Dublin. The trinity of IAG, Dublin infrastructure investment and Brexit are all a plus for Dublin (and EI).

I read recently that several major investment banks have chosen Dublin as their European headquarters in anticipation of Brexit (others are going to Frankfurt). This will be a big surge in business/premium product for Dublin.

As well, once IAG seriously invests in EI and Dublin I think we will see Dublin grow to a confident hub competitor in Europe - both for low cost and premium traffic.

I enjoy this site tremendously. Look forward to contributing further :-)


Welcome aboard!
The way you cut your meat reflects the way you live....
 
Galwayman
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Fri Sep 01, 2017 3:17 pm

Not sure if it's possible but I wonder if Jetstar might launch European flights from Singapore to feed the Qantas hub there .... possibly Athens , Rome , Berlin etc but also maybe to/ from Dublin in the future ..
 
EI121
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sat Sep 02, 2017 8:57 am

Hi all,

Quick question: Is EI expected to open up more routes next year from DUB? It all seems very quiet this year regarding new routes compared to previous years.
 
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shamrock350
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sat Sep 02, 2017 10:16 am

EI121 wrote:
Hi all,

Quick question: Is EI expected to open up more routes next year from DUB? It all seems very quiet this year regarding new routes compared to previous years.

Miami wasn't announced until mid November. Would have expected something for early next summer by now but if they're looking at a September start again there's still plenty of time.
 
TheGeordielad
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sat Sep 02, 2017 10:22 am

Galwayman wrote:
Not sure if it's possible but I wonder if Jetstar might launch European flights from Singapore to feed the Qantas hub there .... possibly Athens , Rome , Berlin etc but also maybe to/ from Dublin in the future ..

Qantas only use Singapore as a stop off for London flights soon and for others flights to Australia However there is a Jetstar Asia airways there however they don't have any plans to fly to Europe yet and the only aircraft they have with the range is the B787-8 which is only with the Australia Jetstar and they seem to have them busy but you never know they might start long haul operations but it's unlikely to Europe.
 
David_itl
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sat Sep 02, 2017 11:50 am

BestWestern wrote:
Hopefully Cathay succeeds in Dublin. Read somewhere earlier (CAPA) that 400k Pax fly From Dublin to HKG annuallly. With 4K paddies in the city and perhaps another 1k in Shenzhen, the route will have a strong following I hope.


Here's some analysis provide by BlueSwanDaily (part of CAPA)
https://blueswandaily.com/cathay-pacific-to-debut-new-hong-kong-connections-to-brussels-copenhagen-and-dublin/

"Currently around 40,000 people per year travel between Hong Kong and both Brussels and Dublin with an estimated 55,000 flying between Hong Kong and Copenhagen, but these numbers will certainly grow with the opening of the new direct service."

I do hope that they've worked out the sums correctly as that's about 3300 passengers per month which is equates to be around 40% to 45% full on a 4 weekly basis?

For good measure, here's the Australian O+D market. https://blueswandaily.com/qantas-looks-at-longer-range-opportunities-for-future-fleet-expansion-and-more-non-stop-links-into-europe/?utm_content=buffer9df77&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

DUB is in 6th place with around 175,000 (?) passengers. That London equals the sum of 2nd through to 8th place is mind boggling! I just can't see any part of the Qantas group looking at anything other than London for the next decade.
 
Skyblue39
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sat Sep 02, 2017 2:09 pm

David_itl wrote:
BestWestern wrote:
Hopefully Cathay succeeds in Dublin. Read somewhere earlier (CAPA) that 400k Pax fly From Dublin to HKG annuallly. With 4K paddies in the city and perhaps another 1k in Shenzhen, the route will have a strong following I hope.


Here's some analysis provide by BlueSwanDaily (part of CAPA)
https://blueswandaily.com/cathay-pacific-to-debut-new-hong-kong-connections-to-brussels-copenhagen-and-dublin/

"Currently around 40,000 people per year travel between Hong Kong and both Brussels and Dublin with an estimated 55,000 flying between Hong Kong and Copenhagen, but these numbers will certainly grow with the opening of the new direct service."

I do hope that they've worked out the sums correctly as that's about 3300 passengers per month which is equates to be around 40% to 45% full on a 4 weekly basis?

For good measure, here's the Australian O+D market. https://blueswandaily.com/qantas-looks-at-longer-range-opportunities-for-future-fleet-expansion-and-more-non-stop-links-into-europe/?utm_content=buffer9df77&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

DUB is in 6th place with around 175,000 (?) passengers. That London equals the sum of 2nd through to 8th place is mind boggling! I just can't see any part of the Qantas group looking at anything other than London for the next decade.


Aren't you basing your LF on strictly on O&D only? I don't understand your 40% calculation....? What about new transfer opportunities at HKG though? If 40% is the estimated LF, then CX have clearly launched 3 doomed & "dead in the water" destinations. Curious to hear hear how you got this figure...
 
David_itl
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sat Sep 02, 2017 5:02 pm

The loads are strictly on what's been said and excludes anyone transferring at HKG onto other service.

To get to 40% to 45% loads its: 52 weeks x 8 trips (4 each way) a week x 280 seats on the A350 = 116,000 seats available per year. (See I've already bumped up LF from the 34% that my sums indicate!).

For comparison, MAN-HKG was cited as 100,000+ passengers a year (Virgin stated only 90,000 in the UK Houses of Parliament) and that got launched at 4 weekly - the loads were over 80% on a 77W with around 130,000 passengers a year.

They must really be hoping for a wave of connections (SYD-HKG-DUB is coming up as around 25 or 26 hours travel) to fill up the aircraft. Flying EK on a DUB-DXB-SYD routing will be around the same time but anything in Asia should be quicker on CX but we need to know rough traffic flows to China, Japan and, South Korea to Ireland
 
Skyblue39
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sat Sep 02, 2017 5:12 pm

David_itl wrote:
The loads are strictly on what's been said and excludes anyone transferring at HKG onto other service.

To get to 40% to 45% loads its: 52 weeks x 8 trips (4 each way) a week x 280 seats on the A350 = 116,000 seats available per year. (See I've already bumped up LF from the 34% that my sums indicate!).

For comparison, MAN-HKG was cited as 100,000+ passengers a year (Virgin stated only 90,000 in the UK Houses of Parliament) and that got launched at 4 weekly - the loads were over 80% on a 77W with around 130,000 passengers a year.

They must really be hoping for a wave of connections (SYD-HKG-DUB is coming up as around 25 or 26 hours travel) to fill up the aircraft. Flying EK on a DUB-DXB-SYD routing will be around the same time but anything in Asia should be quicker on CX but we need to know rough traffic flows to China, Japan and, South Korea to Ireland


Clearly then based on this, all 3 new routes are going to fail....if there's going to be less than 40% LF why are they even bothering? Dublin will probably get scrapped before it even starts according to your info.
 
David_itl
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sat Sep 02, 2017 5:42 pm

It may be better for it be non-stop 3 weekly rather than 4 weekly. Or do it on a daily HKG-BHX/GVA-DUB-BHX/GVA-HKG routing as BHX and GVA are around the same level of passenger demand to HKG as DUB per this from Anna Aero http://www.anna.aero/2017/09/01/cathay-pacific-airways-announces-service-brussels-copenhagen-dublin/
 
Galwayman
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sat Sep 02, 2017 6:34 pm

I'd imagine CX will pick up a lot of Bkk and HKT transfer traffic in addition to Syd , Perth etc
 
worldranger
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sat Sep 02, 2017 8:29 pm

David_itl wrote:
BestWestern wrote:
Hopefully Cathay succeeds in Dublin. Read somewhere earlier (CAPA) that 400k Pax fly From Dublin to HKG annuallly. With 4K paddies in the city and perhaps another 1k in Shenzhen, the route will have a strong following I hope.


Here's some analysis provide by BlueSwanDaily (part of CAPA)
https://blueswandaily.com/cathay-pacific-to-debut-new-hong-kong-connections-to-brussels-copenhagen-and-dublin/

"Currently around 40,000 people per year travel between Hong Kong and both Brussels and Dublin with an estimated 55,000 flying between Hong Kong and Copenhagen, but these numbers will certainly grow with the opening of the new direct service."

I do hope that they've worked out the sums correctly as that's about 3300 passengers per month which is equates to be around 40% to 45% full on a 4 weekly basis?

For good measure, here's the Australian O+D market. https://blueswandaily.com/qantas-looks-at-longer-range-opportunities-for-future-fleet-expansion-and-more-non-stop-links-into-europe/?utm_content=buffer9df77&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

DUB is in 6th place with around 175,000 (?) passengers. That London equals the sum of 2nd through to 8th place is mind boggling! I just can't see any part of the Qantas group looking at anything other than London for the next decade.


Flawed analysis. Amongst other things this is a Chinese mainland tourist play in tandem with CX dragon.

20 years ago China had outbound tourism of under 5m, last year 122m, this year 135m. They are growing at an annualized rate of 11%. These numbers are simply extraordinary and surpass anything ever seen. The second most important aspiration for new middle class Chinese after a car - is overseas travel.

Ireland & the others will increasingly be marketed to and visited by - Chinese.
 
Ticketyboo
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sat Sep 02, 2017 9:54 pm

nu wrote:
Cx best news ever. I love Qatar but the flight is too short for a good night's sleep..I,prefer their business class to QR (marginally) and the new business class trials they are having is a step up again. And of course there is now an excellent premium economy option out of Dublin. It will be interesting where they pitch pricing though.


€3100 Business Class return is exceptionally good value when you consider the inferior EI product to the US, or the aged Club World BA product from LHR.
 
nu
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sun Sep 03, 2017 4:28 am

David_itl wrote:

They must really be hoping for a wave of connections (SYD-HKG-DUB is coming up as around 25 or 26 hours travel) to fill up the aircraft. Flying EK on a DUB-DXB-SYD routing will be around the same time but anything in Asia should be quicker on CX but we need to know rough traffic flows to China, Japan and, South Korea to Ireland


Why only those 3 countries? Taiwan? Philippines? Vietnam? Thailand? Malaysia? Singapore? Indonesia? Not to mention ANZ.
Aer Maighdean abu
 
nu
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sun Sep 03, 2017 4:32 am

Ticketyboo wrote:
nu wrote:
Cx best news ever. I love Qatar but the flight is too short for a good night's sleep..I,prefer their business class to QR (marginally) and the new business class trials they are having is a step up again. And of course there is now an excellent premium economy option out of Dublin. It will be interesting where they pitch pricing though.


€3100 Business Class return is exceptionally good value when you consider the inferior EI product to the US, or the aged Club World BA product from LHR.


With Finnair consistently in the low 2000s, QR in the mid 2000s and even BA in the late 2000s for Asian destinations they seem to be pitching it at the upper end
Aer Maighdean abu
 
David_itl
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sun Sep 03, 2017 5:57 am

nu wrote:
David_itl wrote:

They must really be hoping for a wave of connections (SYD-HKG-DUB is coming up as around 25 or 26 hours travel) to fill up the aircraft. Flying EK on a DUB-DXB-SYD routing will be around the same time but anything in Asia should be quicker on CX but we need to know rough traffic flows to China, Japan and, South Korea to Ireland


Why only those 3 countries? Taiwan? Philippines? Vietnam? Thailand? Malaysia? Singapore? Indonesia? Not to mention ANZ.


Lookng at SIN = these are the great circrle distances
DUB-HKG-SIN = 7708 miles
DUB-AUH-SIN = 7354 miles
DUB-DXB-SIN = 7315 miles
DUB-CDG-SIN = 7156 miles
DUB-FRA-SIN = 7066 niles
DUB-LHR-SIN = 7045 miles
DUB-AMS-SIN = 7003 miles
DUB-MAN-SIN = 6975 miles

Up to 800 miles more distance to fly so call that roughly 2 hours extra travel - which may need to them pitching fares at a llower level to attract passengers who are time-sensitive travellers,.
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sun Sep 03, 2017 6:40 am

OA260 wrote:
Indeed the tables will have turned in terms of Alliance superiority at DUB. Also myself and a few others who have Emerald OW status have been discussing the need to up the game in terms of lounge offerings at DUB. When you look across to LHR and see the catering that is on offer then it might be time to look at one of the OW carriers opening a lounge shared by other OW members or indeed upgrading the catering at the DAA ones. I doubt we will see changes to EI lounge or opening a second one until well after OW entry.


I completely agree, the lounge for oneworld frequent flyers in Dublin is really poor. It is a crying shame BA didn't take over the old BMI lounge, but I hazard a guess they didn't expect Dublin to be such a big route for them.

Is there any room in T1 for another lounge though? One operated by BA is sorely needed for just their own flights. You would think with AA, IB, QR and CX that there would be a case for it financially.

Eirules wrote:
Yeah I completely agree. The DAA lounge isn't great at all and I like it even less after the recent work they've done. That said, the EI lounge in T2 isn't great compared to the BA lounge in LHR T5, especially the food offering. I wouldn't rule out EI putting another lounge in T1 though


The mind boggles that the DAA lounge in T1 was renovated and is actually worse than before. It is a disgrace. A friend of mine flew Business Class for the first time ever on BA routing DUB-LHR-HEL and even he said the lounge in Dublin was crap. He really liked the BA Galleries at LHR which is far superior. I hate the DAA lounge. The EI lounge is also pretty poor - it's too small and the food offering is a bit of a joke.

I'm delighted that CX are flying to Dublin. It means I can fly DUB-HKG-SYD on Cathay which is a lovely alternative to DUB-DOH-SYD - both airlines are excellent for going to Asia Pacific. I think I'd prefer HKG though as the city is a great destination to visit in its own right. Hopefully the route is a huge success! With the oneworld frequent flyers in Ireland, it has everything going for it.
I do enjoy a spot of flying, especially when it's not in economy!
 
nu
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sun Sep 03, 2017 11:29 am

David_itl wrote:
nu wrote:
David_itl wrote:

They must really be hoping for a wave of connections (SYD-HKG-DUB is coming up as around 25 or 26 hours travel) to fill up the aircraft. Flying EK on a DUB-DXB-SYD routing will be around the same time but anything in Asia should be quicker on CX but we need to know rough traffic flows to China, Japan and, South Korea to Ireland


Why only those 3 countries? Taiwan? Philippines? Vietnam? Thailand? Malaysia? Singapore? Indonesia? Not to mention ANZ.


Lookng at SIN = these are the great circrle distances
DUB-HKG-SIN = 7708 miles
DUB-AUH-SIN = 7354 miles
DUB-DXB-SIN = 7315 miles
DUB-CDG-SIN = 7156 miles
DUB-FRA-SIN = 7066 niles
DUB-LHR-SIN = 7045 miles
DUB-AMS-SIN = 7003 miles
DUB-MAN-SIN = 6975 miles

Up to 800 miles more distance to fly so call that roughly 2 hours extra travel - which may need to them pitching fares at a llower level to attract passengers who are time-sensitive travellers,.


Exactly but as I posted in the post before yours, the initial price point does not support this logic
Aer Maighdean abu
 
EI564
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sun Sep 03, 2017 3:41 pm

So yes, it isn't the optimum route to some destinations. But it will be the fastest route to some destinations. One of the key ones from Ireland being Australia (at least the eastern side) and NZ. I'm sure that market was a big factor in the Cathay decision. And it does very well for the Philippines and a few other countries also. But not so well for the Singapore/Thailand corner etc.

I'm sure what Tourism Ireland are excited about is the China market though. Ireland doesn't factor very strongly right now. But if done right, it could deliver a lot.
 
JAmie2k9
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sun Sep 03, 2017 6:22 pm

TBH I think people are getting to bogged down about CX and if they can make it work. They have spent quiet some time considering DUB and personally I think they will make a success of it because it has the right backing.
 
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shamrock604
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sun Sep 03, 2017 7:56 pm

JAmie2k9 wrote:
TBH I think people are getting to bogged down about CX and if they can make it work. They have spent quiet some time considering DUB and personally I think they will make a success of it because it has the right backing.


Pretty obvious what quarters are trying to pour cold water on it. They were wrong every time before!
 
BrianDromey
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:02 pm

JAmie2k9 wrote:
TBH I think people are getting to bogged down about CX and if they can make it work. They have spent quiet some time considering DUB and personally I think they will make a success of it because it has the right backing.


I hope and anticipate that the CX route will be a great success. CX have long had a presence in the Irish market - despite never serving Ireland directly before. When EI left oneworld they kept relationships with BA, CX and QF. I think that says a lot about CX, HKG and the Irish market. We spend a lot of time on here obsessing with the transatlantic market, but the reality is that growth is in Asia. I was in KUL and SIN earlier this year and totally blown away by the ambition, their vision for the future and plans for growth in Kuala Lumpur, in particular. A combination of aircraft like the A350 and the 787 and outbound growth FROM Asia will drive huge growth in the next decade.

Honestly, you need to go to appreciate the growth potential Asia is unlocking as we sleep. Its inspiring.
Next flights: MAN-ILD, BCN-LHR-CPT, CPT-LHR-MAN, MAN-ORK-KEF, KEF-ORK-MAN.
 
EIDAA
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Mon Sep 04, 2017 4:14 am

Great to see the CX announcement! It really has been an impressive few years for growth at Dublin and nice to see, even from a distance.

Although from a selfish perspective, I do wish it had been SQ opening the first real long-haul route to the East. Being based here in Singapore, the HKG connection does not make sense for us unfortunately, as others mentioned above. Who knows, maybe SQ or TR will follow and make the trip home a little easier in the future...
Most Flown:- G-BUVA (20 Flights), EI-DEB (12 Flights), EI-JFK (11 Flights)
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Mon Sep 04, 2017 8:58 am

I have no doubt that the CX HKG route will do well. There are many who take the ME3 flights due to their one stop option to avoid Euro hubs. HKG will be more attractive to many taking various things into account.
 
factsonly
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:31 am

Don't know whether this was posted in the August thread, but KLM has increased its S17 schedule yet again (for a 2nd time), this time from 5x daily to 6x daily on Mon, Wed, Thu, Fri. starting 4 September.

The route started last winter 2x daily and was supposed to be 4x daily in S17.

- AMS 07:40 - DUB 08:20 KL0933 E175 daily
- AMS 09:40 - DUB 10:20 KL0945 ARJ daily
- AMS 12:05 - DUB 12:45 KL0935 E190 daily
- AMS 14:25 - DUB 15:05 KL0951 ARJ Mon = NEW
- AMS 15:05 - DUB 15:45 KL0951 ARJ Wed = NEW
- AMS 16:05 - DUB 16:45 KL0937 E190 daily
- AMS 18:55 - DUB 19:40 KL1035 E190 Fri = NEW
- AMS 19:00 - DUB 19:40 KL1035 E190 Thu = NEW
- AMS 21:20 - DUB 22:00 KL0939 E190 daily

It is interesting to see that a traditional EI monopoly route (was 5x daily), can be stimulated to 14x daily in a short period of time by competition from FR (4x daily) and KL (6x daily).
 
BrianDromey
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:47 am

factsonly wrote:
It is interesting to see that a traditional EI monopoly route (was 5x daily), can be stimulated to 14x daily in a short period of time by competition from FR (4x daily) and KL (6x daily).


It is very interesting. EI clearly had a good thing going to AMS. I would say the current schedules are more reflective of what UK airports have had to AMS for many years. MAN, for example has 6x KLM, 4x easyJet and 4x flyBe to AMS today. I wonder whats happened to yields FR looking pretty cheap at €45 return next weekend!

The growth of routes like AMS, FRA, MUC, etc may also demonstrate a slight change in travel patterns. While there is significant, unprecedented challenges over the next 2 to 5 years there is also enormous opportunity in new markets. Trade across the Irish sea has always been an obvious and relatively easy growth market for many Irish businesses, with barrier free trade, a common language and easy access for people and goods to the UK. Now that certainty isn't there Irish businesses have to be more imaginative, braver.
Next flights: MAN-ILD, BCN-LHR-CPT, CPT-LHR-MAN, MAN-ORK-KEF, KEF-ORK-MAN.
 
EI321
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Mon Sep 04, 2017 11:31 am

Does anyone know why Norwegian seems to currently be the only operator that parks its aircraft in front of the cargo terminal at DUB? They have a 737-Max sitting there most days. They also had a 737 parked over on the old runway yesterday.
 
iRISH251
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:21 pm

EI321 wrote:
Does anyone know why Norwegian seems to currently be the only operator that parks its aircraft in front of the cargo terminal at DUB? They have a 737-Max sitting there most days. They also had a 737 parked over on the old runway yesterday.


Long layovers between their transatlantic services. Aer Lingus also does this with its 757s but just uses different remote stands.
 
Ticketyboo
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Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2016 10:04 pm

Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Mon Sep 04, 2017 3:59 pm

nu wrote:
Ticketyboo wrote:
nu wrote:
Cx best news ever. I love Qatar but the flight is too short for a good night's sleep..I,prefer their business class to QR (marginally) and the new business class trials they are having is a step up again. And of course there is now an excellent premium economy option out of Dublin. It will be interesting where they pitch pricing though.


€3100 Business Class return is exceptionally good value when you consider the inferior EI product to the US, or the aged Club World BA product from LHR.


With Finnair consistently in the low 2000s, QR in the mid 2000s and even BA in the late 2000s for Asian destinations they seem to be pitching it at the upper end


Yes but neither Finnair nor BA have a product remotely close to CX in terms of product and although QR is very good all entail a time consuming layover or the 'joy' that is connecting in LHR, so when you look at the value proposition CX win it hands-down IMHO.
 
Ticketyboo
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Mon Sep 04, 2017 4:06 pm

ClassicLover wrote:
OA260 wrote:
Indeed the tables will have turned in terms of Alliance superiority at DUB. Also myself and a few others who have Emerald OW status have been discussing the need to up the game in terms of lounge offerings at DUB. When you look across to LHR and see the catering that is on offer then it might be time to look at one of the OW carriers opening a lounge shared by other OW members or indeed upgrading the catering at the DAA ones. I doubt we will see changes to EI lounge or opening a second one until well after OW entry.


I completely agree, the lounge for oneworld frequent flyers in Dublin is really poor. It is a crying shame BA didn't take over the old BMI lounge, but I hazard a guess they didn't expect Dublin to be such a big route for them.

Is there any room in T1 for another lounge though? One operated by BA is sorely needed for just their own flights. You would think with AA, IB, QR and CX that there would be a case for it financially.

Eirules wrote:
Yeah I completely agree. The DAA lounge isn't great at all and I like it even less after the recent work they've done. That said, the EI lounge in T2 isn't great compared to the BA lounge in LHR T5, especially the food offering. I wouldn't rule out EI putting another lounge in T1 though


The mind boggles that the DAA lounge in T1 was renovated and is actually worse than before. It is a disgrace. A friend of mine flew Business Class for the first time ever on BA routing DUB-LHR-HEL and even he said the lounge in Dublin was crap. He really liked the BA Galleries at LHR which is far superior. I hate the DAA lounge. The EI lounge is also pretty poor - it's too small and the food offering is a bit of a joke.

I'm delighted that CX are flying to Dublin. It means I can fly DUB-HKG-SYD on Cathay which is a lovely alternative to DUB-DOH-SYD - both airlines are excellent for going to Asia Pacific. I think I'd prefer HKG though as the city is a great destination to visit in its own right. Hopefully the route is a huge success! With the oneworld frequent flyers in Ireland, it has everything going for it.



You are soooo right re: Dublin Lounge, I asked them if they'd paid for the refurb or was a prize in a primary schools competition (no offence to little ones) and when I visited last week I asked "is this actually the finished state?" the flooring alone, uncomfortable seats etc, just makes it a complete joke. Travelling long haul in a few weeks and EK use the DAA Lounge which is just embarrassing, so I'm taking a punt on Platinum Services to see how that pans out.
 
Skyblue39
Posts: 35
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Mon Sep 04, 2017 4:50 pm

Cobalt confirmed year round on Dublin-Larnaca.
Saw this on their Facebook page today.

To all our friends waiting for our Dublin flights - we have some great news.

We've managed to get better times on these flights for you - we're going to be flying all winter from Larnaca to Dublin on Wednesdays and Saturdays, at 0835, arriving in Dublin at 1205. Then we're leaving Dublin at 1255, arriving in Larnaca at 2010.

These seats are going to be on sale from tomorrow, with fares starting at €88 one way. We're sure they are going to sell fast, so the earlier you book, the better your price!
 
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ClassicLover
Posts: 4135
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:22 pm

Ticketyboo wrote:
You are soooo right re: Dublin Lounge, I asked them if they'd paid for the refurb or was a prize in a primary schools competition (no offence to little ones) and when I visited last week I asked "is this actually the finished state?" the flooring alone, uncomfortable seats etc, just makes it a complete joke. Travelling long haul in a few weeks and EK use the DAA Lounge which is just embarrassing, so I'm taking a punt on Platinum Services to see how that pans out.


Hahaha! I think the primary school kids could do a better job if you ask me. Make sure you come back and let us know what Platinum Services is like. I'd be interested to hear what you think of that.

Skyblue39 wrote:
Cobalt confirmed year round on Dublin-Larnaca.
Saw this on their Facebook page today.

To all our friends waiting for our Dublin flights - we have some great news.

We've managed to get better times on these flights for you - we're going to be flying all winter from Larnaca to Dublin on Wednesdays and Saturdays, at 0835, arriving in Dublin at 1205. Then we're leaving Dublin at 1255, arriving in Larnaca at 2010.

These seats are going to be on sale from tomorrow, with fares starting at €88 one way. We're sure they are going to sell fast, so the earlier you book, the better your price!


I had to look up who Cobalt are, you know. Interesting to see they are one of the new airlines of Cyprus. They must be doing okay out of Dublin if they are continuing year round. Anyone flown with them yet?
I do enjoy a spot of flying, especially when it's not in economy!
 
NichCage
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Mon Sep 04, 2017 11:13 pm

Nice to hear about CX flying to DUB. The longest runway at DUB is under 9,000 feet, so would there be any weight limits?

Otherwise, DUB seems to look like a mess. T2 cannot handle all EI flights, and not all jet bridges can be used at one time. T1 also seems to be pretty busy. Add Ryanair to the mix and the airport is even messier.

Will there ever be a Terminal 1 or a Terminal 2 expansion in the future?
 
alancostello
Posts: 23
Joined: Tue Mar 07, 2017 4:31 pm

Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Tue Sep 05, 2017 12:00 am

NichCage wrote:
Nice to hear about CX flying to DUB. The longest runway at DUB is under 9,000 feet, so would there be any weight limits?

Otherwise, DUB seems to look like a mess. T2 cannot handle all EI flights, and not all jet bridges can be used at one time. T1 also seems to be pretty busy. Add Ryanair to the mix and the airport is even messier.

Will there ever be a Terminal 1 or a Terminal 2 expansion in the future?


Pier F is still on the master plan(basically a shorter clone of the gates of T2 over where EI Cargo currently is), and the expansion of the 100 gates is on there too so remains an option if it’s ever necessary. I remember seeing a plan from years ago that builds out a long set of gates from the 300 gates too. I’d imagine some parts of it will come with the second runway and increased operations.
 
LH982
Posts: 10
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2017 3:28 pm

Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:37 am

It's pretty much at capacity for the morning rush at 6am. EI already using all the cargo centre stands with bussing from T2.

B gates also used but mainly in a left and right configuration which means you can fit 2 A320s on one stand. It also means boarding by stairs. CX arriving next summer potentially means EI have to find somewhere imaginative to park 2 A320s, or start the morning flights at 5am.
 
Dardania
Posts: 87
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2016 11:05 am

Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:25 am

No harm starting the flights at 5 - means a more useful time to get into Europe with time diff?
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:12 am

ClassicLover wrote:

I had to look up who Cobalt are, you know. Interesting to see they are one of the new airlines of Cyprus. They must be doing okay out of Dublin if they are continuing year round. Anyone flown with them yet?


I know a few who flew them. For one it was a great experience but for a few others it was 9-10 hour delays. Cobalt were quick to pay up the Compo though which was surprising. I would want to see them on how they perform for another 12 months before I make my mind up of their long term future. Great news for year round though and the PFO FR route. Cyprus fell off the radar for a number of years compared to what it once was. Nice to see it back.

---

5am flights from DUB seem a great idea. Also being recently discussed elsewhere about Christmas Day opening of Dublin Airport. As DUB expands and so many international flights to various parts of the world it becomes more realistic.


---



Cork Airport is Ireland's fastest growing airport
By Alan Healy

Cork Airport saw the biggest jump in traffic last month of all Irish airports.

Passenger numbers for August increased 7.2% over the same period in 2016.

This growth surpassed that at Dublin Airport which experienced growth of 6% in the month.

The addition of year-round transatlantic flights with Norwegian to Boston Providence coupled with four other new UK and European routes have contributed to strong growth at Ireland’s second busiest.

Cork Airport said their summer season has been particularly strong since new routes commenced last May and will continue through to the end of October when the winter schedule starts.

Year to date passenger numbers have grown by 47,500 to 1.6 million compared to the same period last year and will result in further growth of 4% this year building of the 8% achieved in 2016.

http://www.eveningecho.ie/corknews/Cork ... ec3f399-ds
 
veron
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed May 24, 2017 7:47 pm

Re: Irish 9/17 - Hong Kong hootenanny!

Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:15 pm

Very much enjoying this thread! I'm off to NYC tomorrow, EI105 in the morning. My friend is meeting me there. He's going BFS to SWF with Norweigan for pretty much half the price. I'll post up some thoughts on both services on my return!

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