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TK787
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Turkish Aviation September 2017

Thu Aug 31, 2017 10:17 pm

What???
Already September??
Welcome to our new thread.
You can find last months thread here:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1370019&p=19779751#p19779751

And here is an Atlas Cargo 747. This one is for you Baha :)



We can all agree that things calmed down a bit in Turkey and Turkish Aviation had a lot better summer. Hope better financial results follow better pax numbers.
You can continue from last months issues, there were many;
-About the leased 7 x A333s and their interiors, especially J seats.
-TK’s good numbers with its Cargo ops. We know that TK will get 2 x 77Fs this year. There were talks about maybe 2 more frames
-Welcome news that TK is to open its next lounge at JFK. I wonder where will they fit that in Terminal One. Any chance TK might move terminals?? By the way, I hope that it is a bigger and better than LH’s. I really enjoy that lounge at JFK.
-Any more news, discussions about TK’s 787 lease from Qatar??
-Isn’t it time for TK crews to get a new uniform. I think it has been close to 10 years now with the current style.
-Yakamoz can correct me on this one but most of TK’s planes are in the air now. Let’s see what happens in the coming months.


Please continue with your news, views, photos, rumors and good old sense of humor. No politcs, No personal attacks.
All welcome and Happy Landings to all.

***Here is what it looked like last year this time; Turkish Aviation September 2016 thread:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1341941
 
aldrigsomandre
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 2:23 am

Happy September! I hope everyone has a good month. Start of the Spring season for us here in Australia.

I ran into the bureau chief of TK here in Sydney, had a few dealings with him in the past for a completely unrelated matter, but we do know each other. He said that SYD and MEL flights are not possible at the moment, not without new aircraft. TK is concentrating on funneling passengers trough SG and TG, through Singapore and Bangkok, respectively. He said that Australia continues to be TK's biggest offline market.
 
MalevTU134
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 3:22 am

aldrigsomandre wrote:
Happy September! I hope everyone has a good month. Start of the Spring season for us here in Australia.

I ran into the bureau chief of TK here in Sydney, had a few dealings with him in the past for a completely unrelated matter, but we do know each other. He said that SYD and MEL flights are not possible at the moment, not without new aircraft. TK is concentrating on funneling passengers trough SG and TG, through Singapore and Bangkok, respectively. He said that Australia continues to be TK's biggest offline market.

That means that of they can't make it nonstop from IST, they are not doing it?
Still amazes me how TK does not hesitate to look at markets like SJO (supposedly) and start markets like HAV and CCS, but not SYD, MEL or even PER. Or is it a lack of bilaterals with Australia?
 
aldrigsomandre
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 3:57 am

MalevTU134 wrote:
aldrigsomandre wrote:
Happy September! I hope everyone has a good month. Start of the Spring season for us here in Australia.

I ran into the bureau chief of TK here in Sydney, had a few dealings with him in the past for a completely unrelated matter, but we do know each other. He said that SYD and MEL flights are not possible at the moment, not without new aircraft. TK is concentrating on funneling passengers trough SG and TG, through Singapore and Bangkok, respectively. He said that Australia continues to be TK's biggest offline market.

That means that of they can't make it nonstop from IST, they are not doing it?
Still amazes me how TK does not hesitate to look at markets like SJO (supposedly) and start markets like HAV and CCS, but not SYD, MEL or even PER. Or is it a lack of bilaterals with Australia?


As far as I understand it, with all the one-stop options available from Australia to Europe, TK is unable to launch a competitive offering. On top of that, the current bilateral agreements do not allow daily services from IST to any point in Australia. I think it's 7 weekly flights overall. I may be wrong. Also, the market between Australia and Turkey is not large enough to justify a one-stop option on TK metal.

I don't forsee a TK flight happening unless TK gets ULR aircraft as they would be able to compete with the likes of Emirates, Qatar, Qantas and Singapore by leveraging their wide European, Middle Eastern and North African network.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 4:18 am

Happy September everyone. We should in a week or so start seeing the stats for August. From all indications, it was a very strong month for both Turkish airports and air carriers - maybe even a record setting one.


Regarding Australia - TK has rights to serve the continent via Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore and Thailand.
Last year they studied option of routing via Denpasar which was a new point they wanted launch also (and opened this year). A bit further back Jakarta was preferred stop over point.

One of the issues on the kangaroo route is that for any travelers from large feed markets like the UK, a double stop in IST along with a SE Asian point would make the TK service ever less attractive.

Ultimately TK probably needs an aircraft they can serve Australian East Coast nonstop with. Some of you might remember TK was speaking with Air India a few years back about leasing 777LR frames the Indian carrier wanted to dispose of at the time and Australia was the prime market these aircraft would have been used on.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
MalevTU134
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 4:29 am

LAXintl wrote:
One of the issues on the kangaroo route is that for any travelers from large feed markets like the UK, a double stop in IST along with a SE Asian point would make the TK service ever less attractive.

While I perfectly understand that way of reasoning, may I point out that that has not stopped TK in markets like EZE, CPT, BOG, HAV, CCS or PTY. Some of those markets have been around for years, being operated with an intermediate stop, so one thinks they must be successful.
Also, an intermediate stop (with 5th freedom rights, of course) can actually increase yields, not trash them. The best example of that may be NZ's AKL-LAX-LHR route of course, where the airline makes more money off passengers going LHR-LAX and LAX-AKL than those going LHR-AKL. Why would TK get inte the breakneck UK-Australia market primarily, when its strength is all those smaller European markets that the likes of BA, SQ, CX and even QR or EK don't serve.
Last edited by MalevTU134 on Fri Sep 01, 2017 4:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 4:36 am

The competitive landscape of Kangaroo route is very different than Latin America. Also some of the Americas routes are triangle routings, not as negative of a double stop in both directions.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
MalevTU134
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 4:43 am

LAXintl wrote:
The competitive landscape of Kangaroo route is very different than Latin America. Also some of the Americas routes are triangle routings, not as negative of a double stop in both directions.

...which was my point exactly... why get into the classical Kangaroo route (London-Australia) race, when the advantage TK has is that it serves places like BLL, GRZ, BRE, GOT....?
EZE is not triangle, and that is the route I was referring to, of course, as having been around for years.
And Australia, unlike Latin America, doesn't entail backtracking from Europe if flown via IST.
 
MalevTU134
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 4:46 am

And as for nonstop...would PER really be impossible with today's equipment? Look at this:

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=Ist-eze%0D ... ts&RS=best

(Comparison with EZE is made simply to show that it wouldn't even be TK's longest route, albeit EZE is operated with a stop in GRU, of course. )
 
stylo777
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 5:16 am

I can understand Laxintl, but also think that MalevTU134 has a point. In reality, the route length makes it super challenging to remain competitive; however, it was always said in previous threads that TK is not about profit on particular routes. They rather go for network profitability. Well, if so, go for downunder TK! Strong local demand, strong demand from neighbours Greece and the Balkan. Add in people from UK's various places they serve and fill up the rest whatever comes up on the market.

Again, in reality this is said much, much easier than done. Very though call if you have EK, QR and EY around in the region.
 
aldrigsomandre
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 5:32 am

As a frequent traveller between Europe and Australia, a direct service between Sydney and Istanbul would make it the default choice for me as I would be able to go to secondary European cities that I usually go to with a one-stop option. Australia is a huge long haul market, many people I know travel long haul multiple times per year. These people are price-conscious, but also take the trip duration into account when purchasing a ticket. Not to mention, many of the companies in Australia are now price-sensitive when it comes to corporate travel, so TK would be a good option for corporate travel as well.

PER would not be a suitable market for TK as there aren't many Turks in PER and the mining boom has ended so many airlines are downsizing or ending their PER services.
 
Pe@rson
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 5:50 am

aldrigsomandre wrote:
PER would not be a suitable market for TK as there aren't many Turks in PER and the mining boom has ended so many airlines are downsizing or ending their PER services.


Not many Qataris or Emiratis either, yet there's a daily flight to Doha, up to 2x daily to Abu Dhabi, and 2x daily to Dubai.

Of course, it's majorly about connections.

Turkish also has a stronger European network, albeit less coordinated hub than DXB/AUH/DOH.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
MalevTU134
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 5:59 am

Pe@rson wrote:
aldrigsomandre wrote:
PER would not be a suitable market for TK as there aren't many Turks in PER and the mining boom has ended so many airlines are downsizing or ending their PER services.


Not many Qataris or Emiratis either, yet there's a daily flight to Doha, up to 2x daily to Abu Dhabi, and 2x daily to Dubai.

Of course, it's majorly about connections.

Turkish also has a stronger European network, albeit less coordinated hub than DXB/AUH/DOH.

Exactly!
And as I said, an intermediate stop (talking mainly about SYD and MEL now), if planned, marketed and executed properly, can actually add to the value and yield of the route, as well as reduce costs. I am sure we shall see that not everyone will prefer the 22 hours of nonstop LHR-PER for example. And that other flights with stops on that route will be more profitable than that QF flight.
 
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TK105
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 9:52 am

Thanks for the new thread and greetings from AYT.

Here during peak of holiday season everything is sold out and we had to pay a fortune to arrange a decent hotel room (we are paying 2000 TL/day !!!).

Obviously industry is back to earlier record days and I wonder what will be the results. I used to follow AEA (European Airlines Association) web site to compare legacy carriers of Europe and TK. But AEA stoped publishing this data sometime after TK passed AF and became the 2nd airline of Europe (now AEA itself is history by the way). All other sources only provide consolidated pax numbers of groups (I can not find LH only, but LH+LX+SN+OS+etc is published). Is there a source to follow this? Is TK now the biggest legacy carrier in Europe, or LH still is the biggest legacy airline in Europe?
The future is in the skies.
 
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OA260
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:31 am

Thanks for a new thread. :)


aldrigsomandre wrote:

As far as I understand it, with all the one-stop options available from Australia to Europe, TK is unable to launch a competitive offering. .


Thats my understanding also from conversations I have had with people at TK.
 
Tkfan
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 11:40 am

Thank you TK787 for new Thread and nice summary of last thread.

Also Happy Bayram/Eid-Mubarak for everyone celebrating :)

TK105 wrote:
Thanks for the new thread and greetings from AYT.

Here during peak of holiday season everything is sold out and we had to pay a fortune to arrange a decent hotel room (we are paying 2000 TL/day !!!).

Obviously industry is back to earlier record days and I wonder what will be the results. I used to follow AEA (European Airlines Association) web site to compare legacy carriers of Europe and TK. But AEA stoped publishing this data sometime after TK passed AF and became the 2nd airline of Europe (now AEA itself is history by the way). All other sources only provide consolidated pax numbers of groups (I can not find LH only, but LH+LX+SN+OS+etc is published). Is there a source to follow this? Is TK now the biggest legacy carrier in Europe, or LH still is the biggest legacy airline in Europe?


Funny you mention this. I used to follow the statistics of AEA too and witnessed too, whenever TK was to overtake another big legacy they changed metrics :D

In July Turkish Airlines overtook Lufthansa in PAX numbers. YTD numbers also very close.

Lufthansa July 6.4 million / ytd 37.7m
Turkish Airlines July 7.2million / 37.5m

However Eurowings numbers are not included as they have own AOC.
Anadolujet numbers are included in TKs figure.

https://investor-relations.lufthansagro ... zeuge.html
 
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mafaky
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 2:12 pm

What kind of agencies???


Let me briefly explain in Turkish, for clarification:

These "prolonged holidays" are not official holidays. Those who benefit from these extra days are "idari izinli olarak sayilan devlet memurlari...".
A veteran Electronics & Communications Engineer from Istanbul-Turkey, highly interested in civil and military aviation.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 3:51 pm

Boeing orders summary shows Sun Express having swapped 7 remaining 737-800 orders for 7 737MAX. This brings their pending 737MAX order count to 22.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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Yakamoz
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 7:30 pm

Hello and thanks for new thread, TK787!

Yes, last I checked it on Wednesday evening and there was only 4 birds not flying. But note it is 'bayram'.
 
Tkfan
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 8:17 pm

TK105 wrote:
Thanks for the new thread and greetings from AYT.

Here during peak of holiday season everything is sold out and we had to pay a fortune to arrange a decent hotel room (we are paying 2000 TL/day !!!).
....

Respectable rates!!!
No wonder they are flocking on Greek Islands :lol:

http://www.bodrumageldik.com/mobil/hdet ... sid=105711
Article says Greek Islands also benefited from the extension of Bayram Holidays. Especially the Islands near Turkish Coast.

Greek tourism officials expect 1.5 million Turkish Tourists this year. :thumbsup:
Last edited by Tkfan on Fri Sep 01, 2017 8:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
dodgers702
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 8:18 pm

As the year keeps coming to an end I keep wondering if TK will ever be able to start service to MEX as they have longed said that's a destination happening soon. I feel we may not even see it happening this year at all. I'm sure they need to do a technical stop somewhere along the way and just haven't been able to get approval for 5th freedom rights. Or could be that they cannot get the appropriate slots at the congested airport. I gues one day they may give me the surprise. Hopefully we can see it when MEX opens its new airport.
 
Tkfan
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Fri Sep 01, 2017 8:22 pm

dodgers702 wrote:
As the year keeps coming to an end I keep wondering if TK will ever be able to start service to MEX as they have longed said that's a destination happening soon. I feel we may not even see it happening this year at all. I'm sure they need to do a technical stop somewhere along the way and just haven't been able to get approval for 5th freedom rights. Or could be that they cannot get the appropriate slots at the congested airport. I gues one day they may give me the surprise. Hopefully we can see it when MEX opens its new airport.


I recently saw an interview with TKs GM Ilker Ayci, saying next planned destinations are Denpasar and Cancun-Mexico City.
Now if QRs 15 B787 really start to arrive in October, its highly possible.

Unfortunately in Turkish:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=obYtCMWnqCk
 
aldrigsomandre
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Sat Sep 02, 2017 6:19 am

Tkfan wrote:
dodgers702 wrote:
As the year keeps coming to an end I keep wondering if TK will ever be able to start service to MEX as they have longed said that's a destination happening soon. I feel we may not even see it happening this year at all. I'm sure they need to do a technical stop somewhere along the way and just haven't been able to get approval for 5th freedom rights. Or could be that they cannot get the appropriate slots at the congested airport. I gues one day they may give me the surprise. Hopefully we can see it when MEX opens its new airport.


I recently saw an interview with TKs GM Ilker Ayci, saying next planned destinations are Denpasar and Cancun-Mexico City.
Now if QRs 15 B787 really start to arrive in October, its highly possible.

Unfortunately in Turkish:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=obYtCMWnqCk


Was there a 787 with TK colours in that interview?
 
Tkfan
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Sat Sep 02, 2017 10:32 am

aldrigsomandre wrote:
Tkfan wrote:
dodgers702 wrote:
As the year keeps coming to an end I keep wondering if TK will ever be able to start service to MEX as they have longed said that's a destination happening soon. I feel we may not even see it happening this year at all. I'm sure they need to do a technical stop somewhere along the way and just haven't been able to get approval for 5th freedom rights. Or could be that they cannot get the appropriate slots at the congested airport. I gues one day they may give me the surprise. Hopefully we can see it when MEX opens its new airport.


I recently saw an interview with TKs GM Ilker Ayci, saying next planned destinations are Denpasar and Cancun-Mexico City.
Now if QRs 15 B787 really start to arrive in October, its highly possible.

Unfortunately in Turkish:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=obYtCMWnqCk


Was there a 787 with TK colours in that interview?


Unfortunately not.
There was talk of fleet shortly, I dont remember if he said new technology or new frames, only that they are in need and are looking.
 
djxxa
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Sat Sep 02, 2017 1:19 pm

aldrigsomandre wrote:
djxxa wrote:
LJ wrote:
KLM will reduce AMS-IST as of September 4th. Flights will be reduced to 1 daily after this date.

did that last year as well. winter schedule kind of thing?


I don't think it is possible for any European airline to compete with any Turkish airline on price and frequency. It is better to codeshare with a Turkish airline. It makes sense for Air France/KLM Group to codeshare with AtlasGlobal.

I do recall them down sizing frequency, at the time i wondered if it was related to the 'coup', but don't think it was.

Tkfan wrote:
And do you know if they are going to codeshare with Atlasglobal?

Forgot that KL already codeshares with Pegasus thus I doubt Atlasglobal will be codesharing with KL

Makes sense, especially if it is KL1610/1617. They also save costs for crew overnight.
The morning flight was good for US-connections, they can easily be transferred to AF as they keep their morning flight.

Yes, a partnership would be good imo. I'm on that AF morning flight soon :D no TK this time
 
Flightsimboy
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Sat Sep 02, 2017 1:35 pm

While all my You Tube Turkish Airlinea videos have the old Turkish Airlines boarding and landing music, I do love the new Turkish Airlines boarding music. Those night scenes in the video are awesome too. Looks like I need to fly again just to make videos with the new music :)

https://youtu.be/V7gOpNLG5HE
 
bahadir
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Sat Sep 02, 2017 5:12 pm

Turkey has made quite a big advancements in aviation in past two decades but for the love of God / Allah / Jesus and whatever else is holly, their ATC radios suck. They need to fix this , because everyone and their mother is overflying Turkey these days. Especially Ankara control has radios so bad that the controller sounds like he is talking through a tin can.
Earthbound misfit I
 
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TK787
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Sun Sep 03, 2017 4:20 pm

Really ?? How??? Bilaterals changed?? TK getting more slots??
This article suggests Onur Air is going to serve 4 Chinese cities in 2018:
http://www.kokpit.aero/cin-turkiye-turizm-yili (In Turkish only)
 
MeCe
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:35 am

Hello all and happy bayram for everyone.

Some update about QR 787. My source told me it is shelved now. But we are talking about TK anything can be happen anytime. Most probably IST can not handle anymore widebodies, this slowed down the deal.

TC-LNE grounded at BOS because of swissport tow truck hit the engine. Intake section severely damaged, inspection in progress. May be be engine change ? Too early to tell, but possible.
 
aldrigsomandre
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Mon Sep 04, 2017 3:15 am

TK787 wrote:
Really ?? How??? Bilaterals changed?? TK getting more slots??
This article suggests Onur Air is going to serve 4 Chinese cities in 2018:
http://www.kokpit.aero/cin-turkiye-turizm-yili (In Turkish only)


As far as I know, China allocates route rights not in weekly frequencies, but in seat capacity. (At least for Australia and New Zealand.) It may be that TK is not using all the seat capacity due to only operating 777's to China.

I just checked the CAAC website, no new bilaterals have been signed.
 
Tkfan
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:59 am

TK787 wrote:
Really ?? How??? Bilaterals changed?? TK getting more slots??
This article suggests Onur Air is going to serve 4 Chinese cities in 2018:
http://www.kokpit.aero/cin-turkiye-turizm-yili (In Turkish only)

Not really :?
At first sight I also thought its 4 new destinations, but reading again it says 4 weekly frequencies. So if ever, Onurair will start flights 4/w to Changchun starting January....

On the other side, sad to hear B787-project shelved. Hope its negotiation tactics by AAB :lol: and it will be realised
 
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TK787
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Mon Sep 04, 2017 12:36 pm

And now the latest; August European Aviation numbers and as expected good numbers for TK and Turkish airports:
http://www.routesonline.com/news/29/bre ... -and-data/
-Data provided by OAG: (OAG is an air travel intelligence company based in United Kingdom. It provides digital information and applications to the world's airlines, airports, government agencies and travel-related service companies. OAG is best known for its airline schedules database which holds future and historical flight details for more than 900 airlines and over 4,000 airports.)
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Mon Sep 04, 2017 5:57 pm

In stock market filing on August 25th, I notice TK filed updated 2017 forecast.





Traffic Development
-Total number of passengers carried is targeted to reach 69 million including 31 million on domestic routes, 38 million on international routes.
-Passenger load factor is expected to be 77%-78%. Total Available Seat Kilometers (ASK) will reach to 175 billion with an increase of 2% compared to 2016.
-In 2017, cargo/mail carried will increase by 23% reaching 1,100 thousand tonnes.

Financial Development
-In 2017, jet fuel consumption is expected to increase by 2% compared to 2016.
-Average jet fuel (including fuel hedge) is expected to be 570$/ton.
-Revenue is expected to be 10,3-10,5 Billion USD.
-Targeted CASK decrease is between 4%-6%.
-Targeted EBITDAR margin is between 21%-23%.



Amazing 21-23% EBITDAR :eek:
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
stylo777
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Mon Sep 04, 2017 6:12 pm

MeCe wrote:

TC-LNE grounded at BOS because of swissport tow truck hit the engine. Intake section severely damaged, inspection in progress. May be be engine change ? Too early to tell, but possible.

Really tough luck on TK side!
They are challenged with their own handler TGS at homebase with accidents like this, but now also abroad.
Do you also believe that they don't have a proper ground surveillance system in place?
 
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TK787
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Mon Sep 04, 2017 6:23 pm

This picture tells it all. See how big of a construction site Istanbul's new airport is.
It is that light colored spot on the Northern shores of Istanbul's Black Sea Coast:
Image
By comparison, you can barely make IST and SAW in the same frame.
 
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TK787
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:24 pm

To follow up on the Turkey Tourism ad in New York Times from last week; nothing from Turkish Tourism this week inside the paper. So, it is not a repeating ad. I will keep you guys posted.
In contrast, inside New York Times there was a 66 page, full color free travel/culture/art magazine about Columbia (titled "Medellin on my mind").
 
Tkfan
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:01 pm

TK787 wrote:
To follow up on the Turkey Tourism ad in New York Times from last week; nothing from Turkish Tourism this week inside the paper. So, it is not a repeating ad. I will keep you guys posted.
In contrast, inside New York Times there was a 66 page, full color free travel/culture/art magazine about Columbia (titled "Medellin on my mind").


If TK could capture US-Colombia market?? :lol:

Recently I read a nice article about Peru in Hurriyet. The Columnist was invited by Peruvian PromPeru Agency. Maybe this is a hint of TKs next LatAm destination :)
http://mobil.hurriyet.com.tr/yazarlar/g ... a-40566871
 
Tkfan
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:15 pm

TK787 wrote:
This picture tells it all. See how big of a construction site Istanbul's new airport is.
It is that light colored spot on the Northern shores of Istanbul's Black Sea Coast:
Image
By comparison, you can barely make IST and SAW in the same frame.


Great picture!! Nice to see its scale from that distance :o
The more the construction progress, the more it shows its magnitude :thumbsup:

Same with the Terminal building. Now that raw-construction is almost finished, one can see its giant size
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iOvJadfNuL4
 
NichCage
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Mon Sep 04, 2017 11:18 pm

A question I want to ask is about how IST is doing when it comes to passenger numbers.

At some point I believe IST was handling more passengers than both AMS and FRA, but as a result of the terrorists attacks and security issues passengers numbers at IST dropped. Otherwise, it seems like IST has recovered, and TK is also doing well financially it seems. Both AMS and FRA are handling more passengers than IST, but would it be possible in the future to see IST overtake AMS, FRA, or even CDG?
 
Tkfan
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Mon Sep 04, 2017 11:37 pm

LAXintl wrote:
In stock market filing on August 25th, I notice TK filed updated 2017 forecast.
......

Amazing 21-23% EBITDAR :eek:


They have already in 1H17 an EBITDAR of 20.1% 8-)
And usually 3rd and 4th quaters are strong. Should be doable :smile:

NichCage wrote:
A question I want to ask is about how IST is doing when it comes to passenger numbers.

At some point I believe IST was handling more passengers than both AMS and FRA, but as a result of the terrorists attacks and security issues passengers numbers at IST dropped. Otherwise, it seems like IST has recovered, and TK is also doing well financially it seems. Both AMS and FRA are handling more passengers than IST, but would it be possible in the future to see IST overtake AMS, FRA, or even CDG?


Seems IST has recovered very well. I am expecting >5% growth this year, that would be >63.5 million.
But I am not sure if this will be enough to catch AMS and FRA again. Both growing also very healthy. AMS could even overtake CDG with >68million.
 
MalevTU134
Posts: 988
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Tue Sep 05, 2017 2:08 am

TK787 wrote:
To follow up on the Turkey Tourism ad in New York Times from last week; nothing from Turkish Tourism this week inside the paper. So, it is not a repeating ad. I will keep you guys posted.
In contrast, inside New York Times there was a 66 page, full color free travel/culture/art magazine about Columbia (titled "Medellin on my mind").

Put your flame suit on before you go over to the Colombia thread with that spelling of the name of the country... ;)

And Medellín is THE trendy city in this hemisphere, no doubt. And with all its right. Just finishing my dinner in the El Poblado district of the city...
 
THY748i
Posts: 69
Joined: Mon Dec 26, 2016 12:01 pm

Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:00 am

NichCage wrote:
A question I want to ask is about how IST is doing when it comes to passenger numbers.

At some point I believe IST was handling more passengers than both AMS and FRA, but as a result of the terrorists attacks and security issues passengers numbers at IST dropped. Otherwise, it seems like IST has recovered, and TK is also doing well financially it seems. Both AMS and FRA are handling more passengers than IST, but would it be possible in the future to see IST overtake AMS, FRA, or even CDG?


Here you can find the passenger numbers for all airports of Turkey:
http://www.dhmi.gov.tr/istatistik.aspx

Passenger numbers are in the collumn saying "Yolcu".
They don't compare the months separately YOY but the whole period of the year. So "Temmuz" (July) is Jan-Jul '16 / Jan-Jul '17. "Ağostos" (August) should be out any day now.
On the left half of the documemt you find the numbers for the period in 2016 and on the right half the ones for 2017 plus the percentage changes.
İç Hat tranlates to domestic, Dış Hat to international and Toplam to total. Türkiye geneli are the added up numbers for all of Turkey and Türkiye geneli direkt transit dahil includes direct transit, not sure though what direct transit is compared to simply transit.

Will be interesting to see how IST will be ending its final year (assuming most operations will switch to the new airport in October 2018). The new airport will be a different animal altogether and will give turkish carriers the opportunity to just swamp Europe and the Middle East with capacity even more with the hundreds of A320/1 NEOs and 737 MAXs on order which ,on a downside, might make Istanbul even less attractive for non turkish carriers.
 
aldrigsomandre
Posts: 60
Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:30 am

Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Wed Sep 06, 2017 7:12 am

Read this, my Turkish is worse off than I thought it was.
Another piece of TK and 747 news.

http://www.kokpit.aero/thy-boeing-747-8-icin-masada
 
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TK787
Topic Author
Posts: 3496
Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2006 3:43 am

Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Wed Sep 06, 2017 12:35 pm

aldrigsomandre wrote:
Read this, my Turkish is worse off than I thought it was.
Another piece of TK and 747 news.

http://www.kokpit.aero/thy-boeing-747-8-icin-masada

My Turkish is in great shape :) I still don't get it.
Why would TK get 748 and replace frequency with capacity. I love that TK flies 3 x daily JFK-IST.
Why would TK go to 4 engines on long haul?
It must have been a quiet aviation news day for Ugur Cebeci.
I hope that TK will get 350/77X/787 combination one day, not the 748/380.
 
aldrigsomandre
Posts: 60
Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:30 am

Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:07 pm

TK787 wrote:
aldrigsomandre wrote:
Read this, my Turkish is worse off than I thought it was.
Another piece of TK and 747 news.

http://www.kokpit.aero/thy-boeing-747-8-icin-masada

My Turkish is in great shape :) I still don't get it.
Why would TK get 748 and replace frequency with capacity. I love that TK flies 3 x daily JFK-IST.
Why would TK go to 4 engines on long haul?
It must have been a quiet aviation news day for Ugur Cebeci.
I hope that TK will get 350/77X/787 combination one day, not the 748/380.


Wouldn't the 747 make more sense if used to add capacity to slot constrained airports?

I had learned Turkish when I lived in Turkey, but one forgets when not using it daily.
 
ist2014
Posts: 285
Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2014 9:43 am

Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:21 pm

I think name of the game should be frequency for TK
788 is the best fit for TK. 30 is a good number
 
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TK787
Topic Author
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Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:29 pm

aldrigsomandre wrote:

Wouldn't the 747 make more sense if used to add capacity to slot constrained airports?

777-9 will carry similar number of pax (if not more) with only 2 engines.
 
ist2014
Posts: 285
Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2014 9:43 am

Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Wed Sep 06, 2017 2:12 pm

Price and delivery time are important factors
 
leftyboarder
Posts: 822
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 3:38 pm

Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Wed Sep 06, 2017 2:30 pm

Makes no sense. The only airport where there are 3 flights a day is JFK. Only a handful others have 2. Which destinations is he even talking about??
 
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TK105
Posts: 485
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2013 4:40 pm

Re: Turkish Aviation September 2017

Wed Sep 06, 2017 4:58 pm

My logic says that TK is negotiating for 789 and 77x but Boeing is pushing for 748. I think Kokpit.aero is used as a tool by Boeing for PR.
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