Link/Source: http://www.foxnews.com/travel/2017/07/2 ... rsday.html


"Around two hundred Allegiant Airlines passengers are stranded in Las Vegas. The airline canceled its flight to Oklahoma City and says there won't be another one until Thursday."

"Passengers received an email from the airline saying they'd send them a check for $300 in the next seven to ten business days, and if they choose not to re-book with Allegiant the flight will be refunded."


"No money to eat, no flights, all of the cars are gone, no rental cars, we have no hotel room," passenger Alana Buckner said.
"She and other passengers went to the Allegiant desk for answers, where Buckner says they were turned away.

"They locked the doors, they said, we asked to speak with somebody higher up they said that she is on vacation. We asked for phone numbers for someone corporate anything and they said there's nothing they could do and they were gonna call security, we needed to leave," Buckner said."



Also as per the G4 website, there seems to have been some issues with a lot of their west coast ops:

https://www.allegiantair.com/travel-alerts

Reschedules Flights for July 24, 2017:

Flight 304 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 5304 on July 25, 2017. Flight 5304 will be departing Los Angeles, CA at 1:30 PM, arriving in McAllen, TX at 6:43 PM. 

Flight 305 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 5305 on July 25, 2017. Flight 5305 will be departing McAllen, TX at 7:30 PM, arriving in Los Angeles, CA at 8:44 PM. 

Flight 333 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 5333 on July 25, 2017. Flight 5333 will be departing Little Rock, AR at 1:00 PM, arriving in Los Angeles, CA at 2:37 PM.

Flight 436 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 5436 on July 25, 2017. Flight 5436 will be departing Las Vegas, NV at 9:00 AM, arriving in Peoria, IL at 2:09 PM.

Flight 437 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 5437 on July 25, 2017. Flight 5437 will be departing Peoria, IL at 2:54 PM, arriving in Las Vegas, NV at 4:18 PM.

Flight 456 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 5456 on July 25, 2017. Flight 5456 will be departing Las Vegas, NV at 1:00 PM, arriving in Sioux Falls, SD at 5:38 PM.

Flight 457 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 5457 on July 25, 2017. Flight 5457 will be departing Sioux Falls, SD at 6:23 PM, arriving in Las Vegas, NV at 7:08 PM. 

Flight 500 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 5500 on July 25, 2017. Flight 5500 will be departing Las Vegas, NV at 11:00 AM, arriving in Indianapolis, IN at 5:31 PM.

Flight 501 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 5501 on July 25, 2017. Flight 5501 will be departing Indianapolis, IN at 6:16 PM, arriving in Las Vegas, NV at 7:06 PM. 

Flight 564 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 5564 on July 25, 2017. Flight 5564 will be departing Las Vegas, NV at 7:30 AM, arriving in Eugene, OR at 9:28 AM.

Flight 565 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 5565 on July 25, 2017. Flight 5565 will be departing Eugene, OR at 3:49 PM, arriving in Las Vegas, NV at 5:42 PM.

Flight 566 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 5566 on July 25, 2017. Flight 5566 will be departing Eugene, OR at 10:13 AM, arriving in Los Angeles, CA at 12:19 PM.

Flight 567 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 5567 on July 25, 2017. Flight 5567 will be departing Los Angeles, CA at 1:04 PM, arriving in Eugene, OR at 3:04 PM.

Flight 1147 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 6147 on July 25, 2017. Flight 6147 will be departing Belleville, IL at 12:00 PM, arriving in Myrtle Beach, SC at 2:49 PM. 

Flight 1422 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 1422 on July 25, 2017. Flight 6422 will be departing Pittsburgh, PA at 2:00 PM, arriving in Austin, TX at 04:15 PM.

Flight 1423 originally scheduled to depart on July 24, 2017 will now be operating as Flight 6423 on July 25, 2017. Flight 6423 will be departing Austin, TX at 5:00 PM, arriving in Pittsburgh, PA at 8:55 PM. 

Anyone know what is going on at Allegiant. How many aircraft are under going heavy MX work that are LAX/LAS based.

Couldn't they at least find a spare somewhere in the system to get those people out?

This is the risk flying airlines like G4. Their type of scheduling and company structure turns difficulties into nightmares for passengers. Since Las Vegas is a major market-a spare aircraft is a must.

11725Flyer wrote:

Couldn't they at least find a spare somewhere in the system to get those people out?

Well with half their MD80's on the ground broken and the others held together by glue and tape, the couple 757's held together by string, and their A319/A320's operating at 110% of their schedules, I'd say no.

Super80Fan wrote:

11725Flyer wrote:

Couldn't they at least find a spare somewhere in the system to get those people out?

Well with half their MD80's on the ground broken and the others held together by glue and tape, the couple 757's held together by string, and their A319/A320's operating at 110% of their schedules, I'd say no.

So what you are saying is that perhaps they've run out of glue, tape and string?

Super80Fan wrote:

11725Flyer wrote:

Couldn't they at least find a spare somewhere in the system to get those people out?

Well with half their MD80's on the ground broken and the others held together by glue and tape, the couple 757's held together by string, and their A319/A320's operating at 110% of their schedules, I'd say no.

Not surprising, thanks.

11725Flyer wrote:

Couldn't they at least find a spare somewhere in the system to get those people out?

I had thought the same thing since the MD fleet is constantly down...I guess another poster answered our question.

And our clients wonder why our agency refuses to sell G4 or NK.

kabq737 wrote:

11725Flyer wrote:

Couldn't they at least find a spare somewhere in the system to get those people out?

I had thought the same thing since the MD fleet is constantly down...I guess another poster answered our question.

Or "heaven forbid" charter a replacement aircraft. It's been decades since this happened and I cannot recall the airline. But, major engine issues and plane went tech in medium size remote location (this is back when it was common for flights to go city to city to several cities between say Chicago and Seattle). The airline literally chartered one of the other major carriers to provide a plane and crew to get people out of their later the same day and complete the route to the end major city. My memory is that the replacement aircraft and crew showed up about 4 hours later; then it took an hour or so to shift baggage and on-load fuel and board passengers. This may also have been when fares were regulated as well. I'm not sure of that. But, it worked like a charm... The "servicing" aircrew was very professional and made sure that to thank us for flying (our original airline) and that they were glad they could help out.

Have a great day,

I kinda chuckle though at the media reporting that nearly 200 pax were screwed by this...when their MD80's seat 166 pax. The higher the number, the bigger the impact, I guess.

A nice EU 261 duty of care standard would have been very helpful. On most nights finding ~150 hotel rooms in Las Vegas should be a piece of cake. Maybe those kind folks heading back to OKC will write their Congress-persons and ask for European-style industry regulation and consumer protection!

Southwest flies non-stop LAS-OKC. Choose wisely.

Why can't they call Omni International or Miami Air or Charter Flights to bring LAS pax to OKC than stranded in LAS?
How stupid it is?

Q

Q wrote:

Why can't they call Omni International or Miami Air or Charter Flights to bring LAS pax to OKC than stranded in LAS?
How stupid it is?

Q

This is Allegiant we're talking about...they (and NK) are the dregs of the industry in the US when it comes to taking care of their customers during irrops.

AWACSooner wrote:

Q wrote:

Why can't they call Omni International or Miami Air or Charter Flights to bring LAS pax to OKC than stranded in LAS?
How stupid it is?

Q

This is Allegiant we're talking about...they (and NK) are the dregs of the industry in the US when it comes to taking care of their customers during irrops.

It must be awfully difficult to be a G4 airport employee when this happens. Any G4 employees out there?

[twoid][/twoid]

Q wrote:

Why can't they call Omni International or Miami Air or Charter Flights to bring LAS pax to OKC than stranded in LAS?
How stupid it is?

Q

Or even Xtra. Swift Air doesn't have capable equipment without a fuel stop, and I'm not sure that Dynamic can spare a plane (they have a 767-300ER on the ground at JFK just out of storage).

Or even Xtra. Swift Air doesn't have capable equipment without a fuel stop, and I'm not sure that Dynamic can spare a plane (they have a 767-300ER on the ground at JFK just out of storage).[/quote]


I am pretty sure Swift can Non-stop LAS to OKC. Road Miles is 1112. They have a 2270 Mile range according to Swifts web site.

2175301 wrote:

kabq737 wrote:

11725Flyer wrote:

Couldn't they at least find a spare somewhere in the system to get those people out?

I had thought the same thing since the MD fleet is constantly down...I guess another poster answered our question.

Or "heaven forbid" charter a replacement aircraft.

Chartering an aircraft is incredibly expensive. Allegiant doesn't have the margins that allow them to pay for that. That's one of the risks you take when booking a ULCC: less protection in case things go wrong.

11725Flyer wrote:

AWACSooner wrote:

Q wrote:

Why can't they call Omni International or Miami Air or Charter Flights to bring LAS pax to OKC than stranded in LAS?
How stupid it is?

Q

This is Allegiant we're talking about...they (and NK) are the dregs of the industry in the US when it comes to taking care of their customers during irrops.

It must be awfully difficult to be a G4 airport employee when this happens. Any G4 employees out there?

Talking to a G4 auditor recently, she said very few stations have G4 employees. It's really only the stations where there is no other airline presence that does not have a contractor they can sign.

I have seen F9 charter a Miami Air plane on occasion in DEN. Maybe twice in the past year.

rajincajun01 wrote:

I have seen F9 charter a Miami Air plane on occasion in DEN. Maybe twice in the past year.

Typically a charter like that is for a line if flying, covering a specific route for several days because a plane is OTS.

rajincajun01 wrote:

11725Flyer wrote:

AWACSooner wrote:

This is Allegiant we're talking about...they (and NK) are the dregs of the industry in the US when it comes to taking care of their customers during irrops.

It must be awfully difficult to be a G4 airport employee when this happens. Any G4 employees out there?

Talking to a G4 auditor recently, she said very few stations have G4 employees. It's really only the stations where there is no other airline presence that does not have a contractor they can sign.

Other than Vegas, which stations would have G4 employees? (For NK, only at FLL do they have employees; other stations are staffed by contractors.)

11725Flyer wrote:

Couldn't they at least find a spare somewhere in the system to get those people out?

You keep a spare car?

MIflyer12 wrote:

......
.....Southwest flies non-stop LAS-OKC. Choose wisely.

Yup. You get what you pay for. A major airline would have been able to rebook on later flights, or make arrangements on competing carriers.

aemoreira1981 wrote:

rajincajun01 wrote:

11725Flyer wrote:

It must be awfully difficult to be a G4 airport employee when this happens. Any G4 employees out there?

Talking to a G4 auditor recently, she said very few stations have G4 employees. It's really only the stations where there is no other airline presence that does not have a contractor they can sign.

Other than Vegas, which stations would have G4 employees? (For NK, only at FLL do they have employees; other stations are staffed by contractors.)

PIE still does.


Sun Country and Miami Air do subservice flights for G4 from time to time when there aren't enough aircraft. The unfortunate side of these cancellations is that the airline, like any other, isn't obligated to give out vouchers. Airlines can use different codes. Most of these people probably paid anywhere for $45-120 max for their ticket on the airline. Bottom line, you get what you pay for. You don't go to McDonald's expecting a 5 star dinner and service.

deltadudejg wrote:

You don't go to McDonald's expecting a 5 star dinner and service.

No, but you do expect some kind of recourse and customer service when something is wrong with your meal...you don't just let it go and say "meh, I'll just ignore the fact that my $3.50 hamburger was never served to me"

I am a G4 supporter as I understand this marketing niche (growing the aviation pie) but I must admit this is disappointing behavior and it will come back to bite them

aemoreira1981 wrote:

Other than Vegas, which stations would have G4 employees? (For NK, only at FLL do they have employees; other stations are staffed by contractors.)

As far as I know, even LAS is mostly outsourced. I remember it being a big deal when they made the decision to outsource all of their rampers and customer service around 2011. They graciously offered them preferential hiring with the chosen contractor. My understanding at the time was that LAS was their only hub that wasn't outsourced, and that move effectively made it so that their only direct employees were in management, cabin crew, or flight crew. I know they're outsourced at IWA (AZA), where they've generally been the sole operator for their decade of service in Phoenix — there was a brief stint of NKS and FFT, but now it's just Allegiant and WestJet. I know the operation there isn't the size of LAS, but there are still roughly 1.2mmpa on AAY flights. If they have even their largest stations outsourced, to me it shows where their priorities truly lie. It's hard to have an effective and cohesive customer service team when no one actually works for you.

PIE and BLI are the only bases with direct G4 front-line employees. Every other base is service providers. There are a few outstations with G4 employees, but not many, generally only places where they couldn't get a service provider to take the contract.

When a flight cancels, there is a team within the OCC that provides direction to station employees. Station employees (direct or service provider) follow their direction. You tell the passengers what you can do and give them the options you have available. Anything beyond that you hand them the customer relations card and advise them to write in for special consideration.

Its really difficult to rebook passengers when you have 2 or 3 flight a week to that destination. The only way to get them to thier destination is to charter or come up with a spare airplane. That is the advantage of a legacy. If you look at AA there are over 20 flights that are non stop or make connections into OKC on any given day.

SPREE34 wrote:

MIflyer12 wrote:

......
.....Southwest flies non-stop LAS-OKC. Choose wisely.

Yup. You get what you pay for. A major airline would have been able to rebook on later flights, or make arrangements on competing carriers.

This is mostly true and I am not trying to dispute your statement but it is worth noting that Southwest does not interline with competing carriers.

You insure your home? Yes!

You insure your car? Yes!

If your travel is as important, and you, you choose Allegiant, insure it! Don't buy a bare bottom deal & question later, its on their site, it's everywhere, I have no sympathy.

I don't shop Walmart & question afterwards the lack luster cs or long cashier lines because as the consumer, my decision was to shop Walmart.

Educate or accept, lack of planning on their part doesn't necessitate caring on our part.

Sorry, but truth!

The ULCCs stink when things go wrong, but the legacies are not much better in 2017 they leave plenty of non elite travelers stranded for days too.

I saw last summer AA telling people they couldn't fly out for 3-4 days and people leaving the podum crying, this after they had stood in line for 2 hours to speak with someone. We can all bash the ULCCs because that is what people do on here, but the legacies do this to plenty of non-elite people also. Lets call a spade a spade.

I do feel horrible for these people, and do think Allegiant should have done a better job getting these people hotel rooms at least, their margins are just so low greedy corporate is still tying to make money on these passengers. 2017 flying is really miserable sometimes, the ULCCs are no exception. A very high number of Allegiant passengers purchase travel insurance its one of their revenue generators they push hard so lets hope alot did!

I don't know about LAS, but I do know for a lot of G4 Florida IROPS they will call in Miami Air or Swift Air. I'd say at least once a month a 737 would show up in MLI from SFB or PIE because of a lack of string and tape. Maybe it's not feasible on the west coast to charter a spare.

SY just had a plane and crew flying for them out of PIE over the weekend. SY has "helped" them more then once. I guess the other carriers did not have the extra planes or crews to cover for G4.

A couple of points on this:
1) I was always under the impression that there is some sort of DOT passenger protection, when an airline cancels a flight. Am I living in a time warp? Has Allegiant seriously violated this rule with this incident? I cannot believe these passengers have zero rights and were not entitled to some immediate relief aside from a bottle of water.

2) On any given day, there are many MD-80s and 757s parked on the ramp at LAS. Are there so many un-serviceable airframes, that none of these could be used as back a/c?

Something just does not add up here.

I really don't understand the outrage here. When you pay nothing for your ticket, expect to get nothing if something goes wrong. The problem is, people expect something for nothing in today's world. No, Allegiant is not going to pay to charter an airplane for who knows how many thousands of dollars to fly 166 people to Oklahoma.

Absolutely horrible service. I would love to see OKC terminate G4's contract over this. Stranding passengers and basically telling them "good luck" is unacceptable. I know it didn't happen in OKC but if I were airport management I wouldn't want this kind of airline using my facilities and giving my passengers such deplorable service.

These pathetic snowflakes could have walked right over to the WN counter. WN flies the route for $420 on Tuesday and Wednesday, and has space available. $420 equals the $300 Allegiant is offering them plus the refund of their fare that Allegiant is offering them, with maybe even a little left over. No need for hotels. No real need for meals. This whole thing is silly. ONE flight gets cancelled and it's national news? (I notice that they are have some operational issues, but this story is about ONE flight.)

And the fact is that Allegiant routinely calls in subservice when they can plan to do so. Falcon flew for them out of South Florida when they were having pilot issues, which they now don't have. Miami Air and Sun Country routinely are called when needed, as are others.

I completely agree that one takes the risk of delays and cancellations when flying Allegiant, as one does with other airlines, and that one is less-coddled when things go sideways. But most of the time, they don't, and one can get a real bargain. Same thing on Spirit.

kabq737 wrote:

SPREE34 wrote:

MIflyer12 wrote:

......
.....Southwest flies non-stop LAS-OKC. Choose wisely.

Yup. You get what you pay for. A major airline would have been able to rebook on later flights, or make arrangements on competing carriers.

This is mostly true and I am not trying to dispute your statement but it is worth noting that Southwest does not interline with competing carriers.

They do, however, have plenty of options to get people between LAS and OKC. Perhaps not directly, but with a connection.

Unreal. As others have mentioned, charter a plane if you don't have a spare! It blows my mind that an airline as profitable as G4 is, would ever operate this way. I disagree with those who think a cheap fare shouldn't be protected for a seat that is paid for. 4 days is an insult. How many of those 160 passengers have a job to return home to? Or how many of those 160 passengers had a pet or loved one at home they needed to get to? Or even a possible funeral? Just another reason why I will not fly on G4.

travaz wrote:

If you look at AA there are over 20 flights that are non stop or make connections into OKC on any given day.

Note sure which APU's greasy exhaust you pulled that number from, mate.

Currently stationed in OKC. There are 18 max AA flights total (both mainline and Envoy combined.) on "any given day". That's also including the 2-3 AA flights that come in from CLT that one would have to track back all the way from Vegas to NC just to get to OK.

Now you have to consider that G4's LAS-OKC flight that cancelled was on a Sunday when flight frequencies drop. And the prices increase nationwide.
Compound that with G4's flight being in the late afternoon (scheduled dep: 16:03) at that point there's just few options you can turn to without crossing into Monday. And the last-minute fares are gonna be well north of $420 too ($300 voucher + ~$120 [what it costs on avg to fly G4 LAS-OKC]).

wjcandee wrote:

These pathetic snowflakes could have walked right over to the WN counter. WN flies the route for $420 on Tuesday and Wednesday, and has space available. $420 equals the $300 Allegiant is offering them plus the refund of their fare that Allegiant is offering them, with maybe even a little left over. No need for hotels. No real need for meals. This whole thing is silly. ONE flight gets cancelled and it's national news? (I notice that they are have some operational issues, but this story is about ONE flight.)

FoxNews did not mention that but the cancelled flight was on 23rd (Sunday). So flying out on Tuesday and Wed would still mean getting a hotel.
ONE flight gets cancelled and it made national news because people are made to wait 4 days on a very short notice.

tmoney: Nobody was "made to wait" 4 days. WN had affordable availability on Monday as well, and some room on Sunday. True that some might need hotel rooms for the night, which are plentiful and cheap in Vegas. There is also travel insurance, which can help to offset the risk of flying G4 if one doesn't want to take that risk. It's pretty-affordable. Sunday is a crappy day to have a cancellation, of course, though. And any cancellation is of course an inconvenience. Like the cancellations and significant delays I have experienced in years of flying. They all sucked, and some involved waiting until the next day. And sometimes I incurred an extra expense not to take the option given to me on the airline, which was usually DL. And at no time did I consider my experience to be national-newsworthy. And while there is no question that the average G4 flier is perhaps less able to endure the financial burden of the alternative than would be I, it's the lack of compensation that makes the experience affordable to many of these folks in the first place. There is nothing the majors would love more than regulations that burden the ULCCs with additional expenses and thus bring their costs up so that they can no longer offer those low-low unbundled fares. Buh-bye ULCC-like fares on the majors. Buh-bye price competition. Provided that one can fly safely on a low-price carrier, I'm all in favor of them being able to offer the option, provided travelers are advised what they are getting, which they are. And it's my and their financial risk to take.

Sooner787 wrote:

And our clients wonder why our agency refuses to sell G4 or NK.

When I was booking corporate travel, WN was not to be used or offered. Now I am sure most companies won't send employees on NK or G4 at all & definitely there is no need to. With less than daily service in many markets & sub par on-time performance issues, I'm surprised anyone flies them.

RWA380 wrote:

When I was booking corporate travel, WN was not to be used or offered. Now I am sure most companies won't send employees on NK or G4 at all

I used to fly AZA-SGF on G4 booked by corporate travel department at a former employer. To be fair they hadn't used G4 for a few years though when I left.

crownvic wrote:

A couple of points on this:
1) I was always under the impression that there is some sort of DOT passenger protection, when an airline cancels a flight. Am I living in a time warp? Has Allegiant seriously violated this rule with this incident? I cannot believe these passengers have zero rights and were not entitled to some immediate relief aside from a bottle of water.

You may get pretzels and water if stuck on the plane for hours but there are no Federal regs on duty of care for cancelled flights.

Each airline has its own policies about what it will do for delayed passengers waiting at the airport; there are no federal requirements. If you are delayed, ask the airline staff if it will pay for meals or a phone call. Some airlines, often those charging very low fares, do not provide any amenities to stranded passengers. Others may not offer amenities if the delay is caused by bad weather or something else beyond the airline's control. Contrary to popular belief, for domestic itineraries airlines are not required to compensate passengers whose flights are delayed or canceled.

https://www.transportation.gov/airconsu ... ed-Flights

Mir wrote:

kabq737 wrote:

SPREE34 wrote:

Yup. You get what you pay for. A major airline would have been able to rebook on later flights, or make arrangements on competing carriers.

This is mostly true and I am not trying to dispute your statement but it is worth noting that Southwest does not interline with competing carriers.

They do, however, have plenty of options to get people between LAS and OKC. Perhaps not directly, but with a connection.

Yes absolutely. I wasn't trying to detract from the statement I just thought it was worth noting.

SPREE34 wrote:

11725Flyer wrote:

Couldn't they at least find a spare somewhere in the system to get those people out?

You keep a spare car?

That makes ZERO sense. As individuals, we are not running a business that the primary objective is to move paying passengers from one place to another. G4 IS. They are an airline and people expect to go from point A to point B and then back to point A in a timely manner as contracted.

SPREE34 wrote:

11725Flyer wrote:

Couldn't they at least find a spare somewhere in the system to get those people out?

You keep a spare car?

If I sold travel in my car, I would keep funds aside to cover the cost of a rental or other means of transport if I could not provide the service I sold.

I use G4 to get from New England to FLL for cheap. I've flown them four times in the last two years. Haven't had any problems, and no complaints. For the price I pay, I'd even sit on a pallet in the back of a C-130 for four hours with no complaints.

However, I always plan for the unexpected when I'm booked on G4. It's kind of like taking a gamble, where the odds are in your favor, but you could also easily lose. I usually have a backup plan, and I'm careful about not absolutely needing to be somewhere on the day of my flight. I give myself some buffer room and prepare for things like an unexpected extra night at a hotel or, a rental car/long Uber ride to the closest major airport to where G4 might strand me.

Usually all goes well, but one of these days....

RWA380 wrote:

When I was booking corporate travel, WN was not to be used or offered.

Why weren't you allowed to use Southwest for corporate travel at your company? Southwest does multiple daily nonstops from its home base at Dallas Love Field to 31 destinations, with 26 of these 31 destinations having at least 3 daily nonstops from DAL on weekdays and with 22 of these 31 destinations having at least 4 daily nonstops from DAL on weekdays. Southwest Airlines does offer more flexibility on non-refundable fare tickets than the big 3 legacy carriers or any of Southwest's low-cost competitors, and Southwest Airlines is also the only airline still in operation that does not charge fees for the 1st and 2nd checked bags on domestic flights within the contiguous U.S.