ANA787
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HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321neo

Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:52 pm

Thrilled to see HA resuming PDX-OGG. Way overdue.

Daily from January 18, 2018. A321 operating. Already available for booking.

https://www.hawaiianairlines.com/A321neo
Last edited by ANA787 on Mon Jul 24, 2017 10:02 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
ooslc
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG

Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:55 pm

It's on an A321!! Is there any other A321 routes announced?
    Ironically, I don't work for OO anymore, and I'm not in SLC anymore. PDX based, aviation enthusiast, non-aviation worker.
 
QANTAS747-438
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG

Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:57 pm

OAK-LIH and LAX-KOA also announced, year round.
My posts/replies are strictly my opinion and not that of any company, organization, or Southwest Airlines.
 
jpetekyxmd80
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:59 pm

Interested if we'll see something like Oakland-Hilo. I think that could work really well 3x week or so. It will also be interesting in cases like PDX where some neighbor island flights will be added if eventually the 321 will be used to HNL.
Last edited by jpetekyxmd80 on Mon Jul 24, 2017 10:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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ooslc
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG

Mon Jul 24, 2017 10:00 pm

QANTAS747-438 wrote:
OAK-LIH and LAX-KOA also announced, year round.


Saw the link on the Oregon aviation thread. Also, OAK-OGG it looks like. That'll be the inaugural flight on Jan 8th, 2018.
    Ironically, I don't work for OO anymore, and I'm not in SLC anymore. PDX based, aviation enthusiast, non-aviation worker.
 
ucdtim17
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG

Mon Jul 24, 2017 10:04 pm

Initial A321 flight OAK-OGG Jan 8

    Portland (PDX) and Kahului, Maui (OGG) – flights launch on Jan. 18, 2018
    Oakland (OAK) and Lihue, Kauai (LIH) – seasonal widebody service now offered through Sept. 4, 2017 resumes April 11, 2018 as a daily A321neo flight.
    Los Angeles (LAX) and Kona, Hawaii Island (KOA) – widebody service begins March 11, 2018 before the A321neo flights begin in the summer of 2018.

https://www.hawaiianairlines.com/A321neo
 
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jbpdx
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Mon Jul 24, 2017 10:23 pm

Alaska cuts PDX-OGG from 2 to 1 daily? It would free up a 737-800 for another PDX-??? transcontinental route.
Next: AS PDX-BUR;SNA-PDX
 
wedgetail737
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Mon Jul 24, 2017 11:05 pm

It looks like a significant reduction in available seats to Hawaii our of OAK. Although, the A321 interior looks pretty nice.
 
flyfresno
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Mon Jul 24, 2017 11:08 pm

Interesting...all bring-your-own-device streaming entertainment, even in first.
 
BTVB6Flyer
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Mon Jul 24, 2017 11:11 pm

jbpdx wrote:
Alaska cuts PDX-OGG from 2 to 1 daily? It would free up a 737-800 for another PDX-??? transcontinental route.


TPA? Please
 
ucdtim17
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Mon Jul 24, 2017 11:13 pm

wedgetail737 wrote:
It looks like a significant reduction in available seats to Hawaii our of OAK. Although, the A321 interior looks pretty nice.


You mean to LIH? It's going from seasonal 767 to year round A321. Fewer seats in summer, more seats overall.
 
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SANFan
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Mon Jul 24, 2017 11:34 pm

As has been discussed before, this fleet alteration by HA will, IMO, change the dynamics of West Coast - HI flying for all involved. I can't see anyone pulling out of flying to the Islands but, well, for one, thing, it will reduce the number of wide bodies offered on the routes, while increasing the nonstop offerings to the Outer Islands from the mainland.

It is nice to see HA finally getting their much-sought new aircraft and it will be interesting to see how they're deployed when the initial deliveries are complete.

bb
 
77H
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:07 am

Looks like HA is using the 321N the way many on here expected them to which is to add or increase service from the Neighbor Islands to the Mainland. It will be interesting to see what routes they choose to use the aircraft for out of HNL. I am surprised they are not launching HNL origin flights concurrently. If not, one would expect them to be doing limited inter island flying as well like HNL-LIH-OAK, HNL-KOA-LAX. Will the aircraft be based at OGG or KOA?

HA seems to be putting the pressure on AS right out of the gate. I wonder how the US3 will respond to HA's KOA-LAX going daily as all 3 network carriers operate that route.

Has there been any additional hotel/resorts built recently on the KOA coast? I suspect that the addition of HA's 321N's will ultimately add seats (year-round) to the Mainland-HI market as SANfan suggests. However, visitors need places to stay and the number of hotel rooms available hasn't increased much, at least on the neighbor islands. There are "private" rental options through AirBnB and VRBO but I know there has been some contention over these types of rentals between the state and the condo/home owners.

77H
 
WPvsMW
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 1:32 am

No new hotels on the Kona coast. The Naniloa in Hilo was renovated and reopened in 2015 as the "Grand Naniloa Hotel Hilo - a DoubleTree by Hilton". Nothing since then of note. The Naniloa pool is great, esp. when sharks are offshore.
 
77H
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 1:37 am

WPvsMW wrote:
No new hotels on the Kona coast. The Naniloa in Hilo was renovated and reopened in 2015 as the "Grand Naniloa Hotel Hilo - a DoubleTree by Hilton". Nothing since then of note. The Naniloa pool is great, esp. when sharks are offshore.


Other than a few renovations there seems to be only 1 new hotel open on Maui, West side. Not sure about Kauai. Only island of the big 4 I haven't been to sadly. One of these weekends for sure.

77H
 
MIflyer12
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:06 am

jpetekyxmd80 wrote:
Interested if we'll see something like Oakland-Hilo.


Like others, I'm a little skeptical of more service to Hilo. UA wasn't even running LAX-ITO year-round (until the big expansion 6/17), and not running SFO-ITO at all.
 
jpetekyxmd80
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:18 am

Yeah, for anyone else I agree, but HA could have some unique opportunities at Hilo with their existing infrastructure. I'd love to see some things like a couple flights a week to LA/Bay/Vegas. Could work in small quantities. Clearly not a priority but maybe down the line.
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HALFA
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 3:29 am

jpetekyxmd80 wrote:
Interested if we'll see something like Oakland-Hilo. I think that could work really well 3x week or so. It will also be interesting in cases like PDX where some neighbor island flights will be added if eventually the 321 will be used to HNL.


HA CEO Mark Dunkerley brought up this very subject last week in his company webcast for employees. He said that HA is not looking at ITO mainland flights right now and that it was very low on the priority list. He said that several airlines have tried ITO service in the past and have not been able to make a go of it. I don't think we will see HA ITO to the US Mainland flights any time soon.

Aloha,
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airzona11
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 3:44 am

Looking forward to seeing it in Phoenix.

What is the word on the configuration?
 
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jbpdx
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 3:53 am

airzona11 wrote:
What is the word on the configuration?


From seatguru: "Hawaiian Airlines' A321neo seats 189 passengers in a three class configuration. There are 16 First Class seats, 45 Extra Comfort Class seats and 128 Economy Class seats."
Next: AS PDX-BUR;SNA-PDX
 
airzona11
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 3:56 am

jbpdx wrote:
airzona11 wrote:
What is the word on the configuration?


From seatguru: "Hawaiian Airlines' A321neo seats 189 passengers in a three class configuration. There are 16 First Class seats, 45 Extra Comfort Class seats and 128 Economy Class seats."


Thanks, didnt realize that was posted!

Seems like a good config, like the idea of the 45 Y+.
 
jpetekyxmd80
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 3:59 am

Seems very tight. I assume the new lav config?
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WPvsMW
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 4:31 am

77H wrote:
WPvsMW wrote:
No new hotels on the Kona coast. The Naniloa in Hilo was renovated and reopened in 2015 as the "Grand Naniloa Hotel Hilo - a DoubleTree by Hilton". Nothing since then of note. The Naniloa pool is great, esp. when sharks are offshore.


Other than a few renovations there seems to be only 1 new hotel open on Maui, West side. Not sure about Kauai. Only island of the big 4 I haven't been to sadly. One of these weekends for sure.

77H


On Kauai, the Coconut Palms Resort, of Elvis and Blue Hawaii fame (the last 20 minutes of the film were shot at the hotel), near Kapaa is being rebuilt... after sitting Iniki-struck since 1992. Planned opening "in 2017" in the Hilton chain.
 
HALFA
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 4:33 am

jpetekyxmd80 wrote:
Seems very tight. I assume the new lav config?


I believe the newer, tiny lavs were vetoed and we are going with the regular sized lavs. There is one in F Class just forward of the 1L door, two mid cabin just forward of the 3L &R doors, and one in the aft cabin, just forward of 4R. The cabin will also have the new pivoting overhead bins that can fit 5 rollaboards per compartment. We will also have an HA first, trash compactors in our galleys! :D

Aloha,
HALFA
Hawaiian Airlines Since 1929...........
 
panam330
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:56 am

WPvsMW wrote:
On Kauai, the Coconut Palms Resort, of Elvis and Blue Hawaii fame (the last 20 minutes of the film were shot at the hotel), near Kapaa is being rebuilt... after sitting Iniki-struck since 1992. Planned opening "in 2017" in the Hilton chain.

Late 2018, as a Hyatt, but point made.

Congrats to HA on this (IMO) historic shift in their business model. It is very exciting to see unfold, and I wish them all of the luck in the world - they're my favorite American airline by far.
 
BestWestern
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 6:16 am

We are beginning to see the effect of the 321 on medium range flights currently flown by 757 and 767 - in the same way the 787 had for hub bypass.
Greetings from Hong Kong.... a subsidiary of China Inc.
 
rbavfan
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:14 am

jpetekyxmd80 wrote:
Seems very tight. I assume the new lav config?


Not really, fewer than DL & more than VX. Delta has more seats & smaller SpaceFlex lavatories than either HA or VX.

HA: 189 seats: 16F @ 45-46”, 18MCS @ 36-37”, 128E @ 31-32”. 11 carts & 4 Lavs.
DL: 192 seats: 20F @ 36”, 29MCS @ 34”, 143E @ 31”. 10.5 carts & 4 Lavs including Spaceflex.
VX: 185 seats: 8F @ 55”, 18MCS @ 38”, 159E @ 32”. 11 carts & 4 Lavs.
 
Newbiepilot
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:18 am

SANFan wrote:
As has been discussed before, this fleet alteration by HA will, IMO, change the dynamics of West Coast - HI flying for all involved. I can't see anyone pulling out of flying to the Islands but, well, for one, thing, it will reduce the number of wide bodies offered on the routes, while increasing the nonstop offerings to the Outer Islands from the mainland.

It is nice to see HA finally getting their much-sought new aircraft and it will be interesting to see how they're deployed when the initial deliveries are complete.

bb


I think it is time for war between Alaska and Hawaiian. Good news for people who don't want to connect in SFO or LAX. Will the airline representing the 49th or 50th state win?
 
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Hawaiian announces initial A321neo routes

Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:25 am

The press release also lists the initial A321neo routes:

Kahului - Oakland: January 8 (inaugural flight)

Kahului - Portland: January 18 (HA 40/39)
Kona - Los Angeles: March 11 (HA 62/61)
Lihu'e - Oakland: April 11 (HA 68/67)


See https://newsroom.hawaiianairlines.com/r ... eo-flights

First aircraft is due for delivery in Q4 2017 and will undergo ETOPS trails before entering commercial service in 2018.
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:56 pm

Newbiepilot wrote:

I think it is time for war between Alaska and Hawaiian. Good news for people who don't want to connect in SFO or LAX.


It's been on for a while - and AS has been winning. Look at the fraction of AS' total seats or seat-miles to Hawaii and how it's grown over the last 5-6 years. It's been in the investor presentations repeatedly. Now we'll see how HA fragments West Coast - non-HNL demand, right on top of UA's big Hawaii service commitment.
 
dlflynhayn
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:38 pm

WPvsMW wrote:
No new hotels on the Kona coast. The Naniloa in Hilo was renovated and reopened in 2015 as the "Grand Naniloa Hotel Hilo - a DoubleTree by Hilton". Nothing since then of note. The Naniloa pool is great, esp. when sharks are offshore.

Not quite true in downtown Kona a Holiday inn express opened up in the last year and the old King Kamehameha hotel is now a Marriott Courtyard and they renovated it.Lots of big hotels down in the Waikoloa area i don't think hotels will be a problem..Looks like by next year the big 3 all go double daily on LAX-KOA-LAX looks like they are not backing down, they have been in this market surprisingly a lot longer than HA.
 
JAAlbert
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321neo

Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:52 pm

I expect we'll see the HA 321neo flying out of SAN to neighboring islands at some point.
 
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Polot
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 3:00 pm

BestWestern wrote:
We are beginning to see the effect of the 321 on medium range flights currently flown by 757 and 767 - in the same way the 787 had for hub bypass.

Not really, 737s have been flying between the west coast and Hawaii for years now (and more recently A321s), including the dreaded 737-900ER, with no problems. Most of the routes announced in this thread are already operated by UA and/or AS with 737s (or already operated by HA). We are just beginning to see HA finally embracing its peers and abandoning its widebody-only-funnel-everyone-through-HNL strategy for mainland flights.
 
77H
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:37 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
Newbiepilot wrote:

I think it is time for war between Alaska and Hawaiian. Good news for people who don't want to connect in SFO or LAX.


It's been on for a while - and AS has been winning. Look at the fraction of AS' total seats or seat-miles to Hawaii and how it's grown over the last 5-6 years. It's been in the investor presentations repeatedly. Now we'll see how HA fragments West Coast - non-HNL demand, right on top of UA's big Hawaii service commitment.


I don't believe HA will have as big an impact on UA as it will on AS. If you look at the announcement that started this thread 2 of the routes are served by AS and AS alone. The 3rd route is operated by 4 carriers. The US3 and VX (an AS company).

HA and AS are West Coast to Hawaii airlines and will compete more heavily whereas the US3 offer flights further into the interior where they all have a monopoly on nonstop services.

77H
 
WPvsMW
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 6:13 pm

dlflynhayn wrote:
WPvsMW wrote:
No new hotels on the Kona coast....

Not quite true in downtown Kona a Holiday inn express opened up in the last year ...


Yes, the Holiday Inn Express opened...
https://www.ihg.com/holidayinnexpress/h ... oteldetail
but it's not quite what folks think of in terms of "Kona Coast hotel."
 
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SANFan
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321neo

Tue Jul 25, 2017 6:37 pm

Wondering if HA or AS will be the first (current) U.S. carrier to fly Hawaii-YVR. Seems to me it's about time the Canadian cx get a bit of competition from the U.S..

JAAlbert wrote:
I expect we'll see the HA 321neo flying out of SAN to neighboring islands at some point.

I'd like to say you're right JA', but HA has never been known for being proactive, aggressive or even competitive here at SAN. We, IMO, have never been any sort of priority for the airline. Eventually, when there are few, if any, HA wide bodies flying to the west coast from HI, SAN may see at least one 321N (to HNL...) Beyond that, perhaps a Maui flight at some point in the future, but I would be really surprised to see that, or anything else here.

bb
 
aviationjunky
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321neo

Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:25 pm

I thought in a previous post on here that someone said HA was going to start LAS-OGG Summer 2018, but I can't seem to find it anywhere. Does anyone know if that is still a thing?
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jbpdx
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321neo

Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:08 pm

It's LAX-KOA starting A321neo in summer 2018.
Next: AS PDX-BUR;SNA-PDX
 
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NeBaNi
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:23 pm

rbavfan wrote:
Not really, fewer than DL & more than VX. Delta has more seats & smaller SpaceFlex lavatories than either HA or VX.

HA: 189 seats: 16F @ 45-46”, 18MCS @ 36-37”, 128E @ 31-32”. 11 carts & 4 Lavs.
DL: 192 seats: 20F @ 36”, 29MCS @ 34”, 143E @ 31”. 10.5 carts & 4 Lavs including Spaceflex.
VX: 185 seats: 8F @ 55”, 18MCS @ 38”, 159E @ 32”. 11 carts & 4 Lavs.

The HA configuration does not add up to 189 seats :scratchchin:
 
HALFA
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:31 pm

NeBaNi wrote:
rbavfan wrote:
Not really, fewer than DL & more than VX. Delta has more seats & smaller SpaceFlex lavatories than either HA or VX.

HA: 189 seats: 16F @ 45-46”, 18MCS @ 36-37”, 128E @ 31-32”. 11 carts & 4 Lavs.
DL: 192 seats: 20F @ 36”, 29MCS @ 34”, 143E @ 31”. 10.5 carts & 4 Lavs including Spaceflex.
VX: 185 seats: 8F @ 55”, 18MCS @ 38”, 159E @ 32”. 11 carts & 4 Lavs.

The HA configuration does not add up to 189 seats :scratchchin:


HA's configuration is
16 First Class
45 Extra Comfort
128 Economy

189 Total Seats

Aloha,
HALFA
Hawaiian Airlines Since 1929...........
 
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ikolkyo
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:32 pm

NeBaNi wrote:
rbavfan wrote:
Not really, fewer than DL & more than VX. Delta has more seats & smaller SpaceFlex lavatories than either HA or VX.

HA: 189 seats: 16F @ 45-46”, 18MCS @ 36-37”, 128E @ 31-32”. 11 carts & 4 Lavs.
DL: 192 seats: 20F @ 36”, 29MCS @ 34”, 143E @ 31”. 10.5 carts & 4 Lavs including Spaceflex.
VX: 185 seats: 8F @ 55”, 18MCS @ 38”, 159E @ 32”. 11 carts & 4 Lavs.

The HA configuration does not add up to 189 seats :scratchchin:



Should be 45 MCS not 18.
 
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redzeppelin
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321neo

Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:37 pm

Regarding the hotel discussion:
You don't need new hotels if people are making shorter visits. I'd be curious to see numbers on the average length of Hawaiian vacations over the years. The increased frequency of flights to the islands will certainly result in people adding or removing a hotel night as the available flights align with their personal schedules. Also, the greater capacity and accessibility of the islands may be opening opportunities for lower-budget travelers who prefer a shorter trip. Lots of dynamics at play.
 
PlanesNTrains
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:05 pm

WPvsMW wrote:
77H wrote:
WPvsMW wrote:
No new hotels on the Kona coast. The Naniloa in Hilo was renovated and reopened in 2015 as the "Grand Naniloa Hotel Hilo - a DoubleTree by Hilton". Nothing since then of note. The Naniloa pool is great, esp. when sharks are offshore.


Other than a few renovations there seems to be only 1 new hotel open on Maui, West side. Not sure about Kauai. Only island of the big 4 I haven't been to sadly. One of these weekends for sure.

77H


On Kauai, the Coconut Palms Resort, of Elvis and Blue Hawaii fame (the last 20 minutes of the film were shot at the hotel), near Kapaa is being rebuilt... after sitting Iniki-struck since 1992. Planned opening "in 2017" in the Hilton chain.


Wow - we drove by that hotel in 1993. I can't believe it's still not open.

Anyhow, looking forward to seeing these rolled out in the HA fleet. I think they'll be a great complement to the A330s.
-Dave
 
DTWorld
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321neo

Wed Jul 26, 2017 1:50 am

Any likelihood these 321neos will be deployed to places like Pago Pago and potentially make those places daily?
 
77H
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321neo

Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:14 am

DTWorld wrote:
Any likelihood these 321neos will be deployed to places like Pago Pago and potentially make those places daily?


Seems like an interesting concept. It appears that HA expects the 321N to allow them to operate from Non-HNL to Mainland flights daily, year-round profitably. I believe the PPG and PPT flights are only once or twice a week. Using the 321N to the South Pacific could allow them to increase frequency on those routes. I have a friend who just got back from PPT a few weeks ago. She the plane was packed both ways and her economy cabin ticket price was extremely expensive.

77H
 
alasizon
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:12 am

HALFA wrote:
I believe the newer, tiny lavs were vetoed and we are going with the regular sized lavs. There is one in F Class just forward of the 1L door, two mid cabin just forward of the 3L &R doors, and one in the aft cabin, just forward of 4R. The cabin will also have the new pivoting overhead bins that can fit 5 rollaboards per compartment. We will also have an HA first, trash compactors in our galleys! :D

Aloha,
HALFA


Will HA be the only US carrier with trash compactors in the galleys? I'm not aware of any other carriers that have trash compactors in the galleys.
Manager on Duty & Tower Planner
 
DTWorld
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321neo

Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:56 am

77H wrote:
DTWorld wrote:
Any likelihood these 321neos will be deployed to places like Pago Pago and potentially make those places daily?


Seems like an interesting concept. It appears that HA expects the 321N to allow them to operate from Non-HNL to Mainland flights daily, year-round profitably. I believe the PPG and PPT flights are only once or twice a week. Using the 321N to the South Pacific could allow them to increase frequency on those routes. I have a friend who just got back from PPT a few weeks ago. She said the plane was packed both ways and her economy cabin ticket price was extremely expensive.

77H


Admittedly HA has bigger fish to fry as you previously mentioned, but it could enable them to upgauge the frequency to perhaps 4-5x weekly.

Either way, this is probably the only 321neo I'm genuinely looking forward to seeing.
 
SurfandSnow
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321neo

Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:35 am

Great to see HA resuming PDX-OGG. I remember flying this route years ago on a spring break trip to Maui - yet the 767 still wasn't full. My parents had opted for this flight because it was the cheapest way to get there. Hopefully they'll have more success this time around. Maybe they could give SAN-OGG another go too!
Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!
 
azjubilee
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Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Fri Jul 28, 2017 5:21 pm

77H wrote:
Looks like HA is using the 321N the way many on here expected them to which is to add or increase service from the Neighbor Islands to the Mainland. It will be interesting to see what routes they choose to use the aircraft for out of HNL. I am surprised they are not launching HNL origin flights concurrently. If not, one would expect them to be doing limited inter island flying as well like HNL-LIH-OAK, HNL-KOA-LAX. Will the aircraft be based at OGG or KOA? 77H


HA has never been shy of what the goals of the 321N were. They've always said they'd be used to add frequency, continue connecting the neighbor islands to the west coast, right size certain markets, replace the remaining 767's and open new markets.

I think you'll see the bulk of the planes flying out of the neighbor islands, at least initially. This is where most of the gaps are, not to mention the severe lack of space in HNL at the moment. Not to mention, the size of the HNL hub and the traffic to HNL justify the widebody operation. In other words, the 321N's are needed more on the neighbor islands than HNL. All HA aircraft are based in HNL and with with the exception of the small LAX FA base, so are all the crews. As they do today, crews will likely deadhead to position for the new flights or operate an neighbor island segment to position the plane/crew.

SANFan wrote:
I'd like to say you're right JA', but HA has never been known for being proactive, aggressive or even competitive here at SAN. We, IMO, have never been any sort of priority for the airline. Eventually, when there are few, if any, HA wide bodies flying to the west coast from HI, SAN may see at least one 321N (to HNL...) Beyond that, perhaps a Maui flight at some point in the future, but I would be really surprised to see that, or anything else here.


The 321N's are not going to replace all the west coast 330 flying. There will be selective replacement, where the market justifies a smaller gage, but not a 1 for 1 like many here assume. As for SAN, it's not that SAN "isn't a priority" or that HAL isn't "aggressive or competitive" it's just painfully obvious that with one kind of fleet and one in limited supply, there's only so much HA can do. OGG-SAN was flown in the past, but shelved for various reasons. I suspect we'll see a return of the route with a better sized a/c. SAN could be an interesting market for HAL where it can take the 330 off HNL and redeploy 321N's to multiple islands, eventually bringing more seats to SAN.
 
77H
Posts: 676
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2016 11:27 pm

Re: HA adds PDX-OGG, on A321

Fri Jul 28, 2017 6:55 pm

azjubilee wrote:
77H wrote:
Looks like HA is using the 321N the way many on here expected them to which is to add or increase service from the Neighbor Islands to the Mainland. It will be interesting to see what routes they choose to use the aircraft for out of HNL. I am surprised they are not launching HNL origin flights concurrently. If not, one would expect them to be doing limited inter island flying as well like HNL-LIH-OAK, HNL-KOA-LAX. Will the aircraft be based at OGG or KOA? 77H


HA has never been shy of what the goals of the 321N were. They've always said they'd be used to add frequency, continue connecting the neighbor islands to the west coast, right size certain markets, replace the remaining 767's and open new markets.

I think you'll see the bulk of the planes flying out of the neighbor islands, at least initially. This is where most of the gaps are, not to mention the severe lack of space in HNL at the moment. Not to mention, the size of the HNL hub and the traffic to HNL justify the widebody operation. In other words, the 321N's are needed more on the neighbor islands than HNL. All HA aircraft are based in HNL and with with the exception of the small LAX FA base, so are all the crews. As they do today, crews will likely deadhead to position for the new flights or operate an neighbor island segment to position the plane/crew.

SANFan wrote:
I'd like to say you're right JA', but HA has never been known for being proactive, aggressive or even competitive here at SAN. We, IMO, have never been any sort of priority for the airline. Eventually, when there are few, if any, HA wide bodies flying to the west coast from HI, SAN may see at least one 321N (to HNL...) Beyond that, perhaps a Maui flight at some point in the future, but I would be really surprised to see that, or anything else here.


The 321N's are not going to replace all the west coast 330 flying. There will be selective replacement, where the market justifies a smaller gage, but not a 1 for 1 like many here assume. As for SAN, it's not that SAN "isn't a priority" or that HAL isn't "aggressive or competitive" it's just painfully obvious that with one kind of fleet and one in limited supply, there's only so much HA can do. OGG-SAN was flown in the past, but shelved for various reasons. I suspect we'll see a return of the route with a better sized a/c. SAN could be an interesting market for HAL where it can take the 330 off HNL and redeploy 321N's to multiple islands, eventually bringing more seats to SAN.


I understand and that HNL has the demand (both passengers and cargo) to justify most of its routes remaining 332's.

The reason I brought up HNL and the 321N was because it seems to me, that without HNL service the planes will have to fly interisland to operate their intended flights much like the 767's are and have done. There was speculation about the 321's going interisland and was speaking to that probability given the routes HA announced. I doubt they'll be doing interisland turns like the 717 but it looks like we can catch a ride interisland on a 321 nonetheless. Looking forward to it.

77H

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