kabq737 wrote:Wow that's not pretty...
I wonder if Airbus and PW will have bad blood in the future.
They did get burned before with the A340 when PW failed to deliver the Superfan...
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Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
They did get burned before with the A340 when PW failed to deliver the Superfan...
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- polywad6963
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Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
DL is looking at ordering either the MAX or the NEO in the near future, and the CEO saying that "Price isn't the only factor". Could the issues with the engines be part of the decision on this? I know if I was the CEO I would want reliability, even if it costs more to have that.
Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
polywad6963 wrote:DL is looking at ordering either the MAX or the NEO in the near future, and the CEO saying that "Price isn't the only factor". Could the issues with the engines be part of the decision on this? I know if I was the CEO I would want reliability, even if it costs more to have that.
DL can always order A320neo with CFM powerplant.
Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
blrsea wrote:As many as 13 A320 Neo aircraft are on ground due to the Pratt & Whitney-supplied engine issues, forcing the airline to cancel 84 flights today[/b], sources told PTI.
blrsea wrote:Appears to be hit job by some in the media. This was a PTI report, which was picked up by other outlets. Unfortunately, PTI has been in the news for wrong reasons lately, being called out by the govt for multiple false reports. Appears that the real issue is engines stuck at custom while Indigo waits for clarification from the govt on the new GST tax structure.
GST implementation: IndiGo awaits clarification to import engines, denies flight cancellations
Budget passenger airline IndiGo on Friday said it is awaiting certain clarifications regarding GST rates applicable on import of engines which it requires for its grounded A320neo aircraft. The airline also asserted that its pre-scheduled operations are normal and flights are operating “on-time”. “We have 4 neo aircraft grounded due to 4 engines stuck at customs as we are awaiting certain clarifications post the implementation of GST. This has lead to unplanned flight cancellations,” IndiGo said in a statement. “There is no new development pertaining to the grounding of neos. As we have said on our June earnings’ call, there were instances when up to nine neos were grounded due to inadequate spare engines.” The airline added that at present eight of its neos have been grounded due to unavailability of spare engines. “These are already factored in our revised schedule which was finalised in June and there are no additional flight cancellations on account of these neos,” the statement added.
You know, I'm not entirely sure it's really a hit job. Based on the statement you quoted from the company, they claim that 4 neos are grounded due to engines being stuck at Customs while 8 are grounded "due to unavailability of spare engines" It's not clear to me that the four waiting for engines from Customs are included in the eight for which spare engines are unavailable -- so there may actually be 12 grounded at this time.
And yes, the airline revised their schedule to account for the smaller number of available aircraft in the fleet -- but 84 fewer flights to be operated than initially intended is still a significant reduction!
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- dynkrisolo
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Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
I just checked FR24. IndiGo indeed only have 8 neos on the ground, not 13. Regardless, P&W is definitely not doing a good job. Last week when I checked, it appeared they were making an effort as only single digit number of airplanes were ground. But today, I counted 17. They promised the India government that they will have all airplanes back flying by September. Now, I'm starting to doubt that they can achieve that. But September could mean the beginning of the month or the end of the month.
Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
ScottB wrote:You know, I'm not entirely sure it's really a hit job. Based on the statement you quoted from the company, they claim that 4 neos are grounded due to engines being stuck at Customs while 8 are grounded "due to unavailability of spare engines" It's not clear to me that the four waiting for engines from Customs are included in the eight for which spare engines are unavailable -- so there may actually be 12 grounded at this time.
FR24 shows 7 aircraft have not flown in the last week while the rest of the fleet is in service. What the article probably means is that IndiGo had to ground a total of 12 aircraft over a certain period of time, and not 12 aircraft grounded together.
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- Planesmart
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Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
KarelXWB wrote:ScottB wrote:You know, I'm not entirely sure it's really a hit job. Based on the statement you quoted from the company, they claim that 4 neos are grounded due to engines being stuck at Customs while 8 are grounded "due to unavailability of spare engines" It's not clear to me that the four waiting for engines from Customs are included in the eight for which spare engines are unavailable -- so there may actually be 12 grounded at this time.
FR24 shows 7 aircraft have not flown in the last week while the rest of the fleet is in service. What the article probably means is that IndiGo had to ground a total of 12 aircraft over a certain period of time, and not 12 aircraft grounded together.
Likely the eight grounded now require both engines replacing, as the swapping of good gathers pace. Must be engineers with more engine change experience than they would wish, through repetition, breaking time records.
Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
anshabhi wrote:Did QR did the right thing by cancelling their orders, rather than living this life of uncertainty?
Can you imagine the noise coming from QR if they were caught up in this?
Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
Both IndiGo and GoAir lose market share, in July. IndiGo by 1.3% and GoAir by 0.7%.
http://dgca.nic.in/reports/Traffic_repo ... ep0717.pdf
http://dgca.nic.in/reports/Traffic_repo ... ep0717.pdf
Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
anshabhi wrote:Do you know 6E completely owns all the NEOs it operates...?
They have signed all the deals directly with PW and Airbus, and have every reason to worry.
And 6E should change its MX practices...? What's that?
Whoever owns the engines own the MX responsibility. PW cannot swap 6E engines forever even with ultimate support plans. They need new builds for new NEO deliveries and other customers. At some point, PW will start replacing just broken parts.
Without current 6-year SLB/PBH model, 6E wouldn't be able to afford top of the line support model.
anshabhi wrote:Both IndiGo and GoAir lose market share, in July. IndiGo by 1.3% and GoAir by 0.7%.
http://dgca.nic.in/reports/Traffic_repo ... ep0717.pdf
What is market share decline got to do with this thread? Are you implying GTF issues are the reason? 6E can add capacity by other means or improve load factor. SG has PLFs above 90%.
Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
https://twitter.com/torbjorngk/status/8 ... 7456779264
Randomly spotted some slideshows about numbers related to HK Express' GTF A320neo fleet
Randomly spotted some slideshows about numbers related to HK Express' GTF A320neo fleet
Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
c933103 wrote:https://twitter.com/torbjorngk/status/837268777456779264
Randomly spotted some slideshows about numbers related to HK Express' GTF A320neo fleet
These were posted awhile ago, tweet date is from March
Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
dtw2hyd wrote:anshabhi wrote:Do you know 6E completely owns all the NEOs it operates...?
They have signed all the deals directly with PW and Airbus, and have every reason to worry.
And 6E should change its MX practices...? What's that?
Whoever owns the engines own the MX responsibility. PW cannot swap 6E engines forever even with ultimate support plans. They need new builds for new NEO deliveries and other customers. At some point, PW will start replacing just broken parts.
Without current 6-year SLB/PBH model, 6E wouldn't be able to afford top of the line support model.anshabhi wrote:Both IndiGo and GoAir lose market share, in July. IndiGo by 1.3% and GoAir by 0.7%.
http://dgca.nic.in/reports/Traffic_repo ... ep0717.pdf
What is market share decline got to do with this thread? Are you implying GTF issues are the reason? 6E can add capacity by other means or improve load factor. SG has PLFs above 90%.
was that actually supposed to be the joke that it is??Obviously those parts can't be replaced and that's why PW started supplying new engines. Oh wait, are other airlines around the globe replacing these "faulty" parts...?
And, I repeat. Please don't think anyone amongst us knows more about IndiGo than Aditya Ghosh and Co-- who made it what it is today.
And yes. SG was able to add new planes, and get maximum performance out of its existing fleet and that's why they gained in market share..
Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
anshabhi wrote:Obviously those parts can't be replaced and that's why PW started supplying new engines.
Before we go any further, Do you know how engines are born?
anshabhi wrote:Oh wait, are other airlines around the globe replacing these "faulty" parts...?
If you own the engine, the manufacturer just gives the replacement part. It is up to the operator and its MX/MRO contractors to replace the part.
What do you think happens to removed engines? They will be rebuilt and used for next swap. The issue is the scarcity of particular component of the engine. That impact production line as well as after-sales support.
ANA B787s. RR is replacing turbine blades on all 100 Trent 1000 engines. They will rotate engines as they rebuild.
If you have a weird contract like AI does, AI Engineering has to disassemble the engine, test and prove the part is broken, file a warranty claim, get the replacement part and assemble the engine to re-enter service. All the while plane will be AOG unless you have your own spare engines.
anshabhi wrote:And, I repeat. Please don't think anyone amongst us knows more about IndiGo than Aditya Ghosh and Co-- who made it what it is today.
Is there a statement by Mr.Ghosh that 6E lost market share because of GTFs???
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- WIederling
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Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
Astronage wrote:kabq737 wrote:Wow that's not pretty...
I wonder if Airbus and PW will have bad blood in the future.
They did get burned before with the A340 when PW failed to deliver the Superfan...
Initial performance misses on the PW-6000 family engines for the A318 come to mind.
Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
The GTF will be positive considered in the market if the GTF let say 2022 start to be much more efficient then the LEAP of course in combination that PW by then has made the GTF into a product that the users can rely on.
Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
So what's the current status of the CFM International LEAP-1A engine production? I know there was an issue with a small number of LEAP-1B engines but so few 737 MAX 8's are in service that they did an engine swap with no effect on scheduling.
I have this feeling that once CFM International ramps up LEAP-1A production, the vast majority of A320neo Family planes will use the LEAP-1A engine until P&W finally resolves the PW1100G issues.
I have this feeling that once CFM International ramps up LEAP-1A production, the vast majority of A320neo Family planes will use the LEAP-1A engine until P&W finally resolves the PW1100G issues.
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- Newbiepilot
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Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
RayChuang wrote:So what's the current status of the CFM International LEAP-1A engine production? I know there was an issue with a small number of LEAP-1B engines but so few 737 MAX 8's are in service that they did an engine swap with no effect on scheduling.
I have this feeling that once CFM International ramps up LEAP-1A production, the vast majority of A320neo Family planes will use the LEAP-1A engine until P&W finally resolves the PW1100G issues.
So far A320NEO cancellations have resulted mostly in more sales of the V2500 in the form of A320ceo orders so CFM hasn't really received the full benefit yet, although some customers may have switched to LeapX from PW1100Gs on upcoming deliveries. Qatar ordering the 737MAX obviously helped CFM. I don't really know what the impact is. Perhaps someone else has detailed figures about orders for the LeapX and if they have proportionally increased recently.
This is how GE (who obviously is biased) views the Leap
“The LEAP engine entry into service is the most successful in our history and has been exceptional by any measure,” said Gaël Méheust, president and CEO of CFM International. “Our customers are thrilled with the fuel efficiency the engine is providing, as well as the world-class utilization level they are achieving with this very important asset. Aircraft powered by the LEAP engine are flying more than 95 percent of available days. This is simply unprecedented for a new engine.”
http://www.aviationpros.com/press_relea ... l-aviation
Last edited by Newbiepilot on Sun Aug 20, 2017 2:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Re: 16 out of 55 PW A320neo grounded
RayChuang wrote:So what's the current status of the CFM International LEAP-1A engine production? I know there was an issue with a small number of LEAP-1B engines but so few 737 MAX 8's are in service that they did an engine swap with no effect on scheduling.
I have this feeling that once CFM International ramps up LEAP-1A production, the vast majority of A320neo Family planes will use the LEAP-1A engine until P&W finally resolves the PW1100G issues.
The production of LEAP-1A is actually slower than PW1100, so switching to LEAPs for the A320NEO only delays delivery.
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