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na wrote:Emirates has retired its first 777-300ER. Its going to be leased to VIM Avia:
http://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb.m ... av4&page=3
MO11 wrote:na wrote:Emirates has retired its first 777-300ER. Its going to be leased to VIM Avia:
http://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb.m ... av4&page=3
Twelve years old. Right on schedule.
MO11 wrote:
na wrote:
Emirates has retired its first 777-300ER. Its going to be leased to VIM Avia:
http://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb.m ... av4&page=3
Twelve years old. Right on schedule.
And let AerCap handle the heavy check. This seems to be a favorite strategy for Ryanair as well, sell to Avolon (formerly CIT Aerospace) at first D check and place the cost on the new owner.
tullamarine wrote:MO11 wrote:
na wrote:
Emirates has retired its first 777-300ER. Its going to be leased to VIM Avia:
http://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb.m ... av4&page=3
Twelve years old. Right on schedule.
And let AerCap handle the heavy check. This seems to be a favorite strategy for Ryanair as well, sell to Avolon (formerly CIT Aerospace) at first D check and place the cost on the new owner.
Effectively EK will have paid for the D check in their lease costs. The lease rate is not just a simple time charge. It is a combination of time, hours and cycles. The original lease fee will have been set to a maximum number of cycles and hours. Returning an aircraft in excess of these will trigger a penalty. This potential penalty will play a part in determining the order airlines return their aircraft to the lessor.
itisi wrote:They don't always go in alphabetical order... maybe different leading companies.
I don't think the first CX 77W to go will be the oldest.
itisi wrote:They don't always go in alphabetical order... maybe different leading companies.
I don't think the first CX 77W to go will be the oldest.
Channex757 wrote:itisi wrote:They don't always go in alphabetical order... maybe different leading companies.
I don't think the first CX 77W to go will be the oldest.
EK have different configurations too; midhaul and longhaul subfleets with lower and higher density layouts in those fleets.
Without going digging into fleet lists I expect EBD is one that did more midhaul flying and has more cycles because of that. The longhaul ones have enhanced crew rest and other features. Some of the aircraft also have low density cabins including First; others are fitted out with low-J type cabins and are people huggers that pound away on their undercarriage.
What I'm getting at (probably badly) is that at EK it's a complicated fleet and pretty unpredictable to us outsiders which might be first up for a heavy visit and lessor return.
dcajet wrote:Channex757 wrote:itisi wrote:They don't always go in alphabetical order... maybe different leading companies.
I don't think the first CX 77W to go will be the oldest.
EK have different configurations too; midhaul and longhaul subfleets with lower and higher density layouts in those fleets.
Without going digging into fleet lists I expect EBD is one that did more midhaul flying and has more cycles because of that. The longhaul ones have enhanced crew rest and other features. Some of the aircraft also have low density cabins including First; others are fitted out with low-J type cabins and are people huggers that pound away on their undercarriage.
What I'm getting at (probably badly) is that at EK it's a complicated fleet and pretty unpredictable to us outsiders which might be first up for a heavy visit and lessor return.
You are correct, this one had a 2 class configuration, 42C/386Y and it mostly flew midhaul to Europe and Asia.
lightsaber wrote:Anti-climatic. Oh, I know I'm being cynical, but it seems like we've been waiting for this a *long* time.
If this is mid-haul, than it is one beat up airframe. Oh, it still has life, better than at some airlines.
But what will the impact be on resale values of 77Ws after say a dozen ex-EK 77Ws hit the market? In my opinion, there has been a shortage of 2nd hand 77Ws. But when the largest operator goes into selling mode, that must impact the market. As well as the market for any competing airframes (e.g., A330s). This will take time, but eventually we'll see a trend.
Lightsaber
lightsaber wrote:But what will the impact be on resale values of 77Ws after say a dozen ex-EK 77Ws hit the market? In my opinion, there has been a shortage of 2nd hand 77Ws. But when the largest operator goes into selling mode, that must impact the market. As well as the market for any competing airframes (e.g., A330s). This will take time, but eventually we'll see a trend.
Lightsaber
The777Man wrote:Emirates still have 20+ 77Ws to be delivered......
The777Man
tullamarine wrote:MO11 wrote:
na wrote:
Emirates has retired its first 777-300ER. Its going to be leased to VIM Avia:
http://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb.m ... av4&page=3
Twelve years old. Right on schedule.
And let AerCap handle the heavy check. This seems to be a favorite strategy for Ryanair as well, sell to Avolon (formerly CIT Aerospace) at first D check and place the cost on the new owner.
Effectively EK will have paid for the D check in their lease costs. The lease rate is not just a simple time charge. It is a combination of time, hours and cycles. The original lease fee will have been set to a maximum number of cycles and hours. Returning an aircraft in excess of these will trigger a penalty. This potential penalty will play a part in determining the order airlines return their aircraft to the lessor.
juliuswong wrote:dcajet wrote:Channex757 wrote:EK have different configurations too; midhaul and longhaul subfleets with lower and higher density layouts in those fleets.
Without going digging into fleet lists I expect EBD is one that did more midhaul flying and has more cycles because of that. The longhaul ones have enhanced crew rest and other features. Some of the aircraft also have low density cabins including First; others are fitted out with low-J type cabins and are people huggers that pound away on their undercarriage.
What I'm getting at (probably badly) is that at EK it's a complicated fleet and pretty unpredictable to us outsiders which might be first up for a heavy visit and lessor return.
You are correct, this one had a 2 class configuration, 42C/386Y and it mostly flew midhaul to Europe and Asia.
For the benefit of others, Emirates has four different configurations for B77W:
B777-300ER
C42Y386
F8C42Y306
F8C42Y304
F8C42Y310
For comparison:
B777-300A
F12C42Y310
Someone83 wrote:This will be very interesting to watch. Not only how the resale (and leasing) prices will develop, but also where all these aircraft will end up. As the volumes increases, there must be other customers than the Russian leisure carriers
Someone83 wrote:lightsaber wrote:But what will the impact be on resale values of 77Ws after say a dozen ex-EK 77Ws hit the market? In my opinion, there has been a shortage of 2nd hand 77Ws. But when the largest operator goes into selling mode, that must impact the market. As well as the market for any competing airframes (e.g., A330s). This will take time, but eventually we'll see a trend.
Lightsaber
This will be very interesting to watch. Not only how the resale (and leasing) prices will develop, but also where all these aircraft will end up. As the volumes increases, there must be other customers than the Russian leisure carriers
aemoreira1981 wrote:And let AerCap handle the heavy check. This seems to be a favorite strategy for Ryanair as well, sell to Avolon (formerly CIT Aerospace) at first D check and place the cost on the new owner.
migair54 wrote:juliuswong wrote:dcajet wrote:
You are correct, this one had a 2 class configuration, 42C/386Y and it mostly flew midhaul to Europe and Asia.
For the benefit of others, Emirates has four different configurations for B77W:
B777-300ER
C42Y386
F8C42Y306
F8C42Y304
F8C42Y310
For comparison:
B777-300A
F12C42Y310
And soon another configuration will be out there, new First class will feature only 6 seats, the planes with new business class seats still have same configuration with 8/42.Someone83 wrote:This will be very interesting to watch. Not only how the resale (and leasing) prices will develop, but also where all these aircraft will end up. As the volumes increases, there must be other customers than the Russian leisure carriers
it is very interesting indeed, because not that many airlines out there have the volume of pax to operate this big bird, in a 2 class configuration they can easily have 400 in economy and 30-35 in business.
I think the obvious candidates are some airlines operating B747, but I can't remember now many of them. In Spain Wamos was an option but I think they will go for more A332, in the future if the new airline, Plus Ultra, do good, then the B77W could be an excellent option for them to replace the A343.
Is Boeing working in a B77W conversion to cargo?? I know they are offering the B77F but not many airlines can afford to get brand new planes, specially such an expensive plane.
dtw2hyd wrote:We don't know why lease cost went up by 30% last year, if lessors are demanding more on new leases because of higher purchase price (compared to current FMV), low residual value and low resale potential, one-to-one replacement is not a good idea.
gsg013 wrote:What is the typical lease rate for a 777W with similar specs/hours/ cycles/ checks as what EK is retiring?
eddy67 wrote:gsg013 wrote:What is the typical lease rate for a 777W with similar specs/hours/ cycles/ checks as what EK is retiring?
I would be interested to know this as well, or at least an estimate ?
TheGeordielad wrote:eddy67 wrote:gsg013 wrote:What is the typical lease rate for a 777W with similar specs/hours/ cycles/ checks as what EK is retiring?
I would be interested to know this as well, or at least an estimate ?
There was a thread about it. I'll try and find it for you.
Planesmart wrote:Two more likely reasons. The ratio of leased to owned aircraft has increased in favour of leased. Also, as aircraft come off lease, the final balloon payment is usually categorised as a lease payment. In calendar year 2016, 36 new aircraft were delivered, and 29 left the fleet.
ojjunior wrote:As many others miss a picture in some threads, here's my help, on behalf of many viewers that love to see which plane we're talking about:
The777Man wrote:Emirates still have 20+ 77Ws to be delivered......
The777Man
QF744ER wrote:A6-EBD was offered to PIA last year when they issued a RFP/tender for long-range aircraft. From memory 2 TAM B77W's were also offered.
It's been know for a while that -EBD was the first 77W coming off-lease.
The first B77W leaving the CX fleet isn't B-KPA either as some might of thought.
KarelXWB wrote:It could go to Nordwind Airlines as they have leased two Boeing 777-300ER's from Eva Air and they could also use this one for expansion too.As VIM Airlines is on the verge of collapse, what will happen to this aircraft?
VP-BIN VIM Airlines Boeing 777-31H(ER) by Игорь Кондаков, on Flickr